Again be careful. MRSA deaths are an old people & nursing home problem, after significant hospital stays and treatment. I expect germs and antibotic are each 100X the typical occurence. Regards, Bob S.
On Fri, Sep 11, 2009 at 7:11 AM, eckinator <eckina...@gmail.com> wrote: > Glad you go into so much detail =) > > What I was trying to do was to point out the bigger picture in > somewhat simpler terms. > > Yes, there is natural occurrence of ABs but synthetic ones are clearly > traceable and we cannot ignore their impact in terms of promoting > resistance. MRSA was an illustration of what multiresistance can lead > to. 19.000 documented deaths in the US in 2005, in fact more lives > than AIDS claimed in the same year. I totally agree about excessive > (mis)use of ABs by doctors and patients alike. Similar effects are > observable with Malaria BTW. > > What we shouldn't underestimate is the enormous AB abuse in livestock. > In many places, ABs are added to food in much the same way as vitamins > and minerals and there is at least in the EU no legislation banning > ABs for any time outside the last six weeks before slaughtering. If > you then look at the genetic similarities between humans/primates and > other land mammals (IIRC from biology class pigs share 97% DNA with > humans) it becomes quite clear that there is or will be an impact, now > or at some point. And yes about the huge favor we'd be doing nature. > > I guess I am oversensitive though because I have the feeling that most > people around me just don't give a flying fuck about these things with > the sorry excuse that nothing they can do will change or save a thing. > I guess many of us have to think that way unless they want to question > their lifestyle. > > Rant mode off and sorry for wasting everyone's time. > > Cheers > Ecke > > 2009/9/11 AlunFoto <alunf...@gmail.com>: >> Be careful about overdramatising antibiotics occurence in nature. >> Antibiotics occur naturally in any habitat suitable for fungal growth. >> >> I think it is a mistake to put multi-resistant bacterias in hospitals >> into this mix. It has very little to do with use of pesticides in >> agriculture, or antibiotics in livestock. It has all the more to do >> with the sloppy practice of GPs in prescribing antibiotics for >> situations where they are not needed or not effective (ie viral >> infections), and with general incompetence in the public about using >> antibiotics. It is very common that patients quits the antibiotics >> treatment when they start to feel better, rather than finishing the >> cure. In addition, they save the leftovers for later occasion, taking >> them as they would aspirin. This practice promotes resistance in >> _human_ pathogens directly, and is a much larger problem than use of >> antibiotics in livestock. I wish this could receive even half as much >> attention as all this stuff about "clean" food. It would do both us >> and nature a huge favour. >> >> Jostein >> >> 2009/9/11 eckinator <eckina...@gmail.com>: >>> The principal difference to me is that organic fruit and vegetables >>> reduce the amount of fertilizers and persticides polluting our water >>> and that organic meat even more importantly reduces the amount of >>> antibiotics released into the environment. Antibiotics are in fact >>> traceable in almost all liquid water (except freshly molten glacier >>> water etc) and affect the food chain and nature's system as a whole by >>> either reducing bacterail growth or forcing the development by >>> mutation of singly or multiply resistant bacteria. Anyone ever heard >>> of the death toll of MRSA in hospitals? Well worth reading... it is >>> not about your health, it is about the damage you do mainly. There are >>> enough toxic substances in the environment to easily offset the >>> benefits of organic food as it is... >>> Cheers >>> Ecke >>> >>> 2009/9/11 AlunFoto <alunf...@gmail.com>: >>>> 2009/9/8 John Sessoms <jsessoms...@nc.rr.com>: >>>>> >>>>> What exactly *IS* organic? How does a product qualify to have that label? >>>>> >>>>> It's like things labeled "natural". It doesn't mean anything. >>>> >>>> What I do know is that unless you _are_ a vegetable, there's no such >>>> thing as inorganic food. :-) >>>> >>>> What defined as organic is defined in legislation in Europe. However I >>>> feel that the health effect of organic (or "ecological" as it is >>>> labelled in Norway) is overrated for many products. Scary stories like >>>> the peppers from Germany of course reinforces the good vs. bad >>>> dichotomy, but for most products I don't think the difference is that >>>> dramatic. >>>> >>>> On another note, high quality (and high price) non-organic food is >>>> competing directly with its organic counterparts. The cheap stuff is >>>> bad whether it's organic or not. >>>> >>>> Jostein >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ >>>> http://alunfoto.blogspot.com >>>> >>>> -- >>>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>>> PDML@pdml.net >>>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >>>> follow the directions. >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>> PDML@pdml.net >>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >>> follow the directions. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ >> http://alunfoto.blogspot.com >> >> -- >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> PDML@pdml.net >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >> follow the directions. >> > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
