On Sun, Aug 18, 2002 at 09:00:25PM +0300, Zeev Suraski wrote:
> At 20:54 18/08/2002, Thies C. Arntzen wrote:
> > BTW: the code we're talking about is neither magic nor very
> > complex. andi, sorry i you felt me stepping on your feet;-)
>
> And yet you took it from ZE2 a couple of months after it was written, as
> opposed to two years ago when ZE1 was already out? Come on, Thies,
> sometimes knowing which algorithm to use and where to put the two lines of
> code is the complexity, as it is in this case.
i am working on a zend-extension that needs to know the real
current backtrace. you wrote the ze-extension interface, and
you should know that it's *very*, *very* hard to find the
real callstack from within an extension (all extensions i'm
aware of have do it wrong).
after fiddling with it for a while i looked at the stuff andi
did and found that it can be apllied mostly (there _is_ one
difference) to ZE1, what's wrong with that? do i want credits
for it? NO. do i think this feature will help me and others?
YES.
>
> > zeev, this discussion should be pure technical, any political
> > or personal things should be left off!
>
> I have two reasons, one technical (stability) and one which you may call
> political (ZE2). I don't see anything wrong with taking 'political'
> reasons into account. PHP is a big thing today, we can't treat it in the
> same way that we treated it five years ago.
you told me that you didn't even look into the patch. so -no-
you have no technical reason except if you think i'm stupid.
"your" political reason has no standing in my opinion.
>
> Replying to Rasmus' concern - of course we're not afraid that this tiny
> patch will 'eliminate' the motivation of people to move. It's the state of
> mind of php-dev that I'm afraid of. Much like your perception is that
> we're more than a year away from a usable version, and Thies's perception
> that we have no roadmap for ZE2 - you can only imagine what other, less
> core developers have in mind. We need to get going with ZE2, and yes,
> holding on and keeping goodies for the new version are a way of doing
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ you can do that in
closed-source, commercial software. trying to do that in
opensource will drive people away from you...
> it. I did that in lots of features in PHP 4, and frankly, I think it's
> very lucky that I did, as the transition from PHP 3 to 4 was VERY
> successful. Imagine if we still had to fix PHP 3 bugs on a daily basis.
i do remember countless hours that i put into the transition
from PHP 3 to PHP 4 during that time i became a member of the
"PHP Group" - but what has that to do with debug_backtrace()?
tc
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