Only to a BDS victim... You think this should be all about Bush... It is NOT, nor never was... It is about Radical Islamic, in Iran's case Shia, and how it effects geopolitics in the ME, and the world... And of course you insist Iran did not give money, arms, and training to the insurgents in Iraq... You MUST do that to justify your BDS... Even your language calling Sadr's and AQ thugs "Freedom Fighters" drips of your ideological bias... The problem is of course, it is the Iraq people who rejected AQ and Sadr BECAUSE they were thugs...
One only has to look to Lebanon to see Iranian MO... But you refuse to consider geo-political reality, instead you think it is and was all about bashing Bush... On Nov 18, 4:03 pm, "mike [move on] 532" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > the key point is bush lied about Iran's arming the Iraqi freedom > fighters ! > they also lied about the IED's which they later had to admit were > being made in Iraq by the freedom fighters . > On Nov 18, 9:18 am, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > >>> "We have every reason to doubt the reports that Iran is providing mass > > >>> amounts of weapons to Iraqi insugents. This is based on our actual > > > records and on the ground experince with the weapons being seized from > > insurgents. > > > The key word here is "mass"... That is ARE providing weapons in a > > non massive way, as IEDs IS the problem... Further there are several > > layers of providing arms (or money and traINING WHICH IS not BEING > > DISCUSSED OR CONSIDERED HERE) between "Mass" and "Few", the later > > being the claim by Mike... Mike's spin is saying > > > 1) "Not massive" means "Few" > > > 2) Only actual arms (excluding funding, and training and maintaining a > > supply line) is the criteria of interference by Iran in Iraq > > > 3) And after has falsification of meaning and distort of actual facts, > > Mike purposely ignores the events of the recent past in Lebanon. Iraq, > > Syria and the like > > > BTW AQ and Iran (Sunni and Shia) have provided "foreign fighters" to > > "invade Iraq", yet I have have heard zip from Mike about this... > > > On Nov 17, 5:17 pm, CFTMEDITOR <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Okay, then maybe you'll believe what I was told by one of the press > > > spokesmen of a 4th Infantry Division Combat Team assigned to MNFI > > > earlier this year. > > > > He also told the same thing to Fox news and has been quoted in an > > > official MNFI press release. > > > > Maj. Dave Olson, 1st BCT Spokesman, 4th Inf. Div., MND-B. > > > > October 5th, 2008. > > > (I can't find the actual link, there are thousands of press releases > > > and I am trying to find the one I excerpted this from.) > > > > "We have every reason to doubt the reports that Iran is providing mass > > > amounts of weapons to Iraqi insugents. This is based on our actual > > > records and on the ground experince with the weapons being seized from > > > insurgents. We see the daily reports and are aware of the fact that > > > only about 5% of all weapons discovered or confiscated are of Iranian > > > origin or were provided by Iranian sources." > > > > So I guess that pretty much speaks for itself. > > > > I would assume you just don't want to hear the truth because you have > > > swallowed the whole Bushit administration hype and think Iran is the > > > next evil empire that needs to be invaded. > > > > Stop watching Fox News and stop letting Bill O'Reilly and Hannity do > > > your thinking. > > > > On Nov 17, 4:51 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > I have many times, you just ignore them... But you use highly > > > > selected facts for an tin foil outcome... > > > > > On Nov 17, 3:59 pm, "mike [move on] 532" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > aw poor baby did i rain on your parade again ? hey if you can show > > > > > any of the facts in this article are wrong please do so . > > > > > > On Nov 17, 12:27 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > Mike desperate to exploit "Hate BUSH ALL the time" fanatics, posted > > > > > > another lie by half or less truth... By selectively choosing facts > > > > > > that fit the assumption Mike has once again proved that any thesis > > > > > > can > > > > > > be proven true if your side controls which facts are permissible... > > > > > > > It is rumored that Mike's new book will conclusively prove the Moon > > > > > > is > > > > > > made of green cheese and that Wisconsin dairy farmer lobbyists have > > > > > > paid off governmental watch dogs in order to inflate the price of > > > > > > green cheese.. This vast RW conspiracy according to Mike is just > > > > > > another example of the neo-cons seeking to control the world... > > > > > > > Sources tell this reporter that Mike is said to have claim ed > > > > > > "Hitler > > > > > > and Stalin were geniuses at half truth lies, so I follow their > > > > > > expert > > > > > > advise"... Mike refused to comment about how he learned his spin > > > > > > craft... > > > > > > >http://www.mikesfoghorn.com > > > > > > > On Nov 17, 6:44 am, "mike [move on] 532" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > US Task Force Found Few Iranian Arms in Iraq > > > > > > > http://www.truthout.org/111608C > > > > > > > Washington - Last April, top George W. Bush administration > > > > > > > officials, > > > > > > > desperate to exploit any possible crack in the close relationship > > > > > > > between the Nouri al-Maliki government and Iran, launched a new > > > > > > > round > > > > > > > of charges that Iran had stepped up covert arms assistance to > > > > > > > Shi'a > > > > > > > militias. > > > > > > > > Secretary of Defence Robert M. Gates suggested that there was > > > > > > > "some sense of an increased level of [Iranian] supply of weapons > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > support to these groups." And Washington Post reporter Karen > > > > > > > DeYoung > > > > > > > was told by military officials that the "plentiful, high quality > > > > > > > weaponry" the militia was then using in Basra was "recently > > > > > > > manufactured in Iran". > > > > > > > > But a U.S. military task force had been passing on data to the > > > > > > > Multi-National Force Iraq (MNFI) command that told a very > > > > > > > different > > > > > > > story. The data collected by the task force in the previous six > > > > > > > weeks > > > > > > > showed that relatively few of the weapons found in Shi'a militia > > > > > > > caches were manufactured in Iran. > > > > > > > > According to the data compiled by the task force, and made > > > > > > > available to an academic research project last July, only 70 > > > > > > > weapons > > > > > > > believed to have been manufactured in Iran had been found in post- > > > > > > > invasion weapons caches between mid-February and the second week > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > April. And those weapons represented only 17 percent of the > > > > > > > weapons > > > > > > > found in caches that had any Iranian weapons in them during that > > > > > > > period. > > > > > > > > The actual proportion of Iranian-made weapons to total weapons > > > > > > > found, however, was significantly lower than that, because the > > > > > > > task > > > > > > > force was finding many more weapons caches in Shi'a areas that did > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > have any Iranian weapons in them. > > > > > > > > The task force database identified 98 caches over the > > > > > > > five-month > > > > > > > period with at least one Iranian weapon, excluding caches > > > > > > > believed to > > > > > > > have been hidden prior to the 2003 U.S. invasion. > > > > > > > > But according to an e-mail from the MNFI press desk this week, > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > task force found and analysed a total of roughly 4,600 weapons > > > > > > > caches > > > > > > > during that same period. > > > > > > > > The caches that included Iranian weapons thus represented > > > > > > > just 2 > > > > > > > percent of all caches found. That means Iranian-made weapons were > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > fraction of one percent of the total weapons found in Shi'a > > > > > > > militia > > > > > > > caches during that period. > > > > > > > > The extremely small proportion of Iranian arms in Shi'a > > > > > > > militia > > > > > > > weapons caches further suggests that Shi'a militia fighters in > > > > > > > Iraq > > > > > > > had been getting weapons from local and international arms markets > > > > > > > rather than from an official Iranian-sponsored smuggling network. > > > > > > > > The database was compiled by MNFI's Task Force Troy, which was > > > > > > > directed to examine all weapons caches found in Iraq beginning in > > > > > > > early January 2008 to identify Iranian-made weapons. The database > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > released by MNFI last July to the Empirical Studies of Conflict > > > > > > > project, co-sponsored by the U.S. Military Academy and Princeton > > > > > > > University, and was published for the first time by West Point's > > > > > > > Counter-Terrorism Centre last month as an appendix to a paper on > > > > > > > Iranian strategy in Iraq by Joseph Felter and Brian Fishman. > > > > > > > > In late April, the U.S. presented the Maliki government with a > > > > > > > document that apparently listed various Iranian arms found in Iraq > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > highlighted alleged Iranian arms found in Basra. But the U.S. > > > > > > > campaign > > > > > > > to convince Iraqi officials collapsed when Task Force Troy > > > > > > > analysed a > > > > > > > series of large weapons caches uncovered in Basra and Karbala in > > > > > > > April > > > > > > > and May. > > > > > > > > Caches of arms found in Karbala late last April and May > > > > > > > totaled > > > > > > > more than 2,500 weapons, and caches in Basra included at least > > > > > > > 3,700 > > > > > > > weapons, according to official MNFI statements. That brought the > > > > > > > total > > > > > > > number of weapons found in those former Mahdi Army strongholds to > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > than 6,200 weapons. > > > > > > > > But the task force found that none of those weapons were > > > > > > > Iranian- > > > > > > > made. The database lists three caches found Apr. 19, but provides > > > > > > > no > > > > > > > data on any of them. It lists no other caches for the region > > > > > > > coinciding with that period, confirming that no weapons had been > > > > > > > found > > > > > > > to be of Iranian origin. > > > > > > > > In announcing the weapons totals discovered in Basra to > > > > > > > reporters > > > > > > > on May 7, Maj. Gen. Kevin Bergner said nothing about the > > > > > > > provenance > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > the weapons, implicitly admitting that they were not Iranian-made. > > > > > > > > Only two months before the new high-level propaganda push on > > > > > > > alleged Iranian weapons supply to Shi'a militias, the U.S. command > > > > > > > had > > > > > > > put out a story suggesting that large numbers of Iranian-supplied > > > > > > > arms > > > > > > > had been buried all over the country. On Feb. 17, 2008, U.S. > > > > > > > military > > > > > > > spokesman Rear Admiral > > ... > > read more ยป --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more. -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
