Zeb, That's PRESIDENT Obama you mean, not sure who this Hussein Obama fellow is.
On Jun 30, 9:53 pm, Zebnick <[email protected]> wrote: > > In fact if you were ever a Muslim, you are considered an apostate if you > > ever leave the faith and should be killed. > > Hmmmmmmm........wouldn't that be Hussein Obama???? > > On Jun 30, 12:23 am, dick thompson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > Islam does the same. In fact if you were ever a Muslim, you are > > considered an apostate if you ever leave the faith and should be > > killed. The Christian believers don't do that. > > > Frederick The Moderate wrote: > > > Keith you're a very unusal man and a very unusual Christian. > > > I think you would have to agree that most Western Christians are of > > > the opinion that their beliefs are the only "correct" ones and > > > everyone else is screwed. Virtually all Western Christian churches > > > (with the exception of UCC and Unity) teach this in absolute terms. > > > > On Jun 29, 4:46 pm, Keith In Tampa <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> Fred, > > > >> Hmmmmmm.......Good question.....Sort of...... > > > >> I don't know that "judge" is the correct adjective, or at least the > > >> adjective that I would utilize. Because I disagree with political > > >> ideologies, or lifestyles does not necessarily mean that I have "judged" > > >> them in one sense, but in another sense, I guess that could be correct. > > > >> I believe in the Holy Trinity. This is the foundation of my > > >> Christianity, > > >> and so in essence, my belief in Jesus Christ as my saviour is not totally > > >> the key to eternal salvation. > > > >> I don't so much subscribe to "my God" being superior than "their God"; > > >> or > > >> that my Saviour is more superior than "their Prophet". I do have some > > >> issues with Islam, which I have delved into numerous times, and believe > > >> that > > >> Islam must reform as a whole; (and as Judaism and Christianity have > > >> reformed > > >> on numerous occasions) before it can be taken as a legitimate religion > > >> in > > >> Western Culture. > > > >> On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 6:54 PM, Frederick The Moderate < > > > >> [email protected]> wrote: > > > >>> Keith: "One of our core beliefs is, "Judge Not, Lest Ye Be > > >>> Judged"....." > > > >>> So based on your statement above, Keith, you do not judge liberals? > > >>> Gays? Muslims? > > >>> You do not think that Christians will go to a better place than > > >>> Muslims after dying? > > >>> You do not believe that ONLY accepting Jesus as your lord and Saviour > > >>> will get you into heaven? > > >>> If all of the above are correct, you would be an unusual Christian (in > > >>> the West, anyway). > > > >>> I was going to attend Methodist Seminary (among the least "fire & > > >>> brimstone" of the Christian Churches) after gaining my bachelors. The > > >>> old saying is "No one ever comes out of seminary with the same beliefs > > >>> they went in with". With me, that happened before I even got there. So > > >>> instead, I went into business. > > > >>> Rabbit, I served in the Office of Naval Intelligence during the > > >>> presidency of the greatest Republican President of my lifetime - > > >>> Ronald Reagan. > > > >>> On Jun 29, 8:58 am, Keith In Tampa <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >>>> On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 10:56 AM, Frederick The Moderate < > > > >>> > [email protected]> wrote: > > > >>>> - Nowadays, this means that 99.9% of everything God creates, will be > > > >>> kept > > > >>>> alive forever, for the purpose of crueltym because they are not just > > > >>> like > > > >>>> "Christians". > > > >>>> - Jesus did not want this new brand of Judiasm rammed down people's > > >>>> throats but rather, growth similar to that of Buddhism - based > > >>>> solely > > > >>> on > > > >>>> attraction. > > > >>>> - There is much more about Western Christian churches with which I > > >>>> dissent. I respect people right to believe as they wish so I won't > > >>>> try > > > >>> to > > > >>>> tell you or anyone else that you're following the "wrong path" > > >>>> because > > > >>> it is > > > >>>> simply not for me to judge. Which is another difference between me > > >>>> and > > >>>> traditional Christians. > > > >>>> ============ > > > >>>> Obviously, the seminary that you attended must not have been founded in > > >>>> Catholicism, nor could it have been based on any of the numerous > > > >>> Protestant > > > >>>> denominations. Your post also makes me wonder when the last time it > > >>>> was, > > >>>> that you might have strolled into a Catholic or Protestant Church? > > >>>> One > > > >>> of > > > >>>> our core beliefs is, "Judge Not, Lest Ye Be Judged"..... > > > >>>>> On Jun 29, 5:45 am, "Mrs. Rabbit" <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >>>>>> Ok, I know I'll be sorry, but please do tell what Jesus *really* > > >>>>>> thought. :D > > > >>>>>> Seminary? Really now? > > > >>>>> At one time, I thought about becoming a pastor. So I got my degree in > > >>>>> theology (you need a Masters in Divinity to be ordained by most > > >>>>> churches). The focus of my studies was ancient Hebrew & Aramaic > > >>>>> customs and idioms. > > > >>>>> So what Jesus really taught? Just my opinion but there is MUCH to back > > >>>>> it up. And it wasn't everything I believe, just a few points that were > > >>>>> in direct contrast with most (Western) Christian churches that seem to > > >>>>> ignore well, a LOT. > > >>>>> 1. Jesus did not come to start a new religion. He came to open the > > >>>>> Jewish belief in only one God, up to everyone else. > > >>>>> 2. The Jews had forgotten God's message and turned religion into > > >>>>> exactly what Travis and Richard talk about it being nowadays: a venue > > >>>>> of exclusivity, arrogance and politics. Jesus' message was for the > > >>>>> Jews to quit being "holier than thou", stop judging others and just do > > >>>>> their best to live their own lives as spiritually as possible. > > >>>>> Nowadays, this means that 99.9% of everything God creates, will be > > >>>>> kept alive forever, for the purpose of crueltym because they are not > > >>>>> just like "Christians". Swell. Wrong though. > > >>>>> 3. Jesus did his best to make it clear: Whomever you would be quickest > > >>>>> to judge (Samaritans, women, gays, Muslims etc) should be the person > > >>>>> you make it your quest to learn to appreciate and if possible, even > > >>>>> love. Later that came to mean Hate & Judge eveyone who isn't part of > > >>>>> the Jesus Club. > > >>>>> 4. Modern Christians are exactly like the Sadduccess and Pharisees > > >>>>> (the good ol' folks who crucified him) of Jesus' day. Very political > > >>>>> and self-righteous. Self-appointed to determine which parts of the > > >>>>> Bible should be taken literally, which should be interpreted and how, > > >>>>> and why you are going straight to hell if you disagree with them on > > >>>>> any of this. > > >>>>> 5. There is no Satan or Hell. > > >>>>> 6. Revelation was just another piece of coded Apocrypha describing the > > >>>>> current events of the times just after the crucifixion. > > >>>>> 7. Jesus did not want this new brand of Judiasm rammed down people's > > >>>>> throats but rather, growth similar to that of Buddhism - based solely > > >>>>> on attraction. > > > >>>>> There is much more about Western Christian churches with which I > > >>>>> dissent. I respect people right to believe as they wish so I won't try > > >>>>> to tell you or anyone else that you're following the "wrong path" > > >>>>> because it is simply not for me to judge. Which is another difference > > >>>>> between me and traditional Christians. They want to tell others all > > >>>>> about their brand of religion without ever listening with an open mind > > >>>>> or respecting somenone else's. > > >>>>> All that being said, The Bible and especially the teachings of Jesus > > >>>>> are my spiritual guide and way. > > > >>>>>> On Jun 29, 1:00 am, Frederick The Moderate > > > >>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >>>>>>> I was almost banned from seminary for my radical beliefs about > > >>>>>>> Christianity and what Jesus really taught. Didn't matter. By the > > > >>> time > > > >>>>>>> I got my bachelor's, I'd decided that I loved learning the origins > > > >>> and > > > >>>>>>> histories of various religions but no longer subscribed to the > > >>>>>>> exclusivity most believed in. > > >>>>>>> I have a poster from my (soon to be published!) book, I made which > > >>>>>>> kinda parodies those types of beliefs. I'll send it to the group > > > >>> with > > > >>>>>>> the hopes it doesn't offend as many people at "The Right to bear > > > >>> Arms" > > > >>>>>>> did. > > > >>>>>>> On Jun 28, 9:49 pm, Perplexed <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>> I agree completely Richard. I'm one of those "spiritual but not > > >>>>>>>> religious" folks, closer to Buddhism than Christianity in my > > > >>> beliefs. > > > >>>>>>>> But I detest what organized religion has done to religion. > > > >>>>>>>> On Jun 28, 8:50 pm, RichardForbes <[email protected]> > > >>>>>>>> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>> I am not agnostic, but I sure am agnostic about attending > > > >>> church. > > > >>>>> I > > > >>>>>>>>> learned the necessary lessons lon ago and have no use for being > > >>>>>>>>> preached to or sold a bill of goods. Most religious leaders > > > >>> are on > > > >>>>> a > > > >>>>>>>>> level with used car salesmen and politicians. > > > >>>>>>>>> On Jun 28, 2:55 pm, studio <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>> On Jun 28, 12:53 am, Frederick The Moderate > > > >>>>>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >>>>>>>>>>> Someone posted that there is some pretty extreme prejudice > > > >>> and > > > >>>>> hatred > > > >>>>>>>>>>> here. True? Not True? What are your > > > ... > > > read more »- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum * Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/ * It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. * Read the latest breaking news, and more. -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
