Looks great. good decisions on everything, a thought for an alternative for strings would be putting '<--at start' 'and end '
this assumes that space is the fill. a unique colour for text is good for '123' I'm not completely sure why J doesn't do that already, but if the goal is to not have extra ascii characters in the display, and I am guessing clipboard to text/log files, so perhaps some graphical bookends to a string would let it be copied easily while taking less space? A simpler style for strings would be to just change the backcolor, so trailing spaces would be visible, and no clipboard issues. ----- Original Message ----- From: robert therriault <bobtherria...@mac.com> To: Programming forum <programm...@jsoftware.com> Cc: Sent: Friday, February 14, 2014 2:36:59 AM Subject: Re: [Jprogramming] problem matching boxed string Just to finish the job, here is a link to a video screencast of the display style for the skinnier look. http://wp.me/p1rSg-8x Cheers, bob On Feb 12, 2014, at 6:04 PM, robert therriault <bobtherria...@mac.com> wrote: > Well, I am not sure I would call it a nice example, but I am glad to hear > that it does work. > > I also added a second script that has a 'skinnier' look. Haven't had time to > finish a video on that one yet. > > http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/http:/www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/BobTherriault/Visualize?action=AttachFile&do=view⌖=vlitejwiki.ijs > > Cheers, bob > > On Feb 12, 2014, at 4:44 PM, Joe Bogner <joebog...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> bob, thanks again for sharing. It works really well and is also a nice JHS >> example. >> >> >> On Tue, Feb 11, 2014 at 9:08 PM, robert therriault >> <bobtherria...@mac.com>wrote: >> >>> Thanks Pascal, >>> >>> Believe it or not I did simplify this quite a bit from where I originally >>> was, based on you previous comments. I'll play around some more to see if I >>> can slim it down further and still have it intuitive (which is actually one >>> of the targets that I am aiming for in addition to the 'different things >>> should display differently') >>> >>> I have attached the script of the simple test page to the wiki at >>> >>> http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/http%3A/www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/BobTherriault/Visualize?action=AttachFile >>> >>> If you want to play. >>> >>> Cheers, bob >>> >>> On Feb 11, 2014, at 9:53 AM, Pascal Jasmin <godspiral2...@yahoo.ca> wrote: >>> >>>> I like it. >>>> >>>> I'll restate my preference for simpler css. Using colour only if boxes >>> aren't completely necessary (datatype). >>>> >>>> I understand the desire to deal with leading 0 shapes, but I think >>> leading 1 shapes are what byte people/beginers the most. For instance >>> assuming that }. and {: produce identical results with 2 elements. >>>> >>>> So, if there was a way to only box-decorate items when there is a >>> leading 1 or 0 dimension, I think it would be very helpful without being as >>> noisy. >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: robert therriault <bobtherria...@mac.com> >>>> To: Programming forum <programm...@jsoftware.com> >>>> Cc: >>>> Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2014 12:14:14 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [Jprogramming] problem matching boxed string >>>> >>>> Thanks Raul, >>>> >>>> I am currently working on the boxing display and you are right, it does >>> present some different challenges. My plan is to have the script on the >>> wiki for general amusement later this afternoon. I have put this together >>> as a way to see the results of the language in a way that I found more >>> useful and it involves a mix of html, css and J, so as far as coding I >>> think of myself as a hobbyist rather than a pro. >>>> >>>> It should not be hard to change the size of the empty spots and I think >>> that is a really good idea. The nice thing about CSS is that you can change >>> appearance across classes, although the complexity can avalanche when you >>> start to decide how classes will display based on the context of other >>> classes. >>>> >>>> Anyway, I will post when I have the script up on the jwiki. >>>> >>>> Cheers, bob >>>> >>>> On Feb 11, 2014, at 8:51 AM, Raul Miller <rauldmil...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> This looks promising. >>>>> >>>>> I currently have two quibbles which you might want to reject: >>>>> >>>>> First, the additional markup seems to get in the way for some typical >>>>> cases. I can see the need for leading 1 dimensions and embedded zero >>>>> dimensions. I understand the idea of consistent display of information, >>> but >>>>> there's so much going on when arrays have no zeros or ones in their >>> shape >>>>> and I can't help but wonder if a reduced complexity presentation might >>> be >>>>> nice, at least as a later option? >>>>> >>>>> Second, when there are zeros in the shape, the placeholders are the same >>>>> size and "shape" (ha ha, get it? shape... eh... maybe you had to be >>> there) >>>>> as when data is present. Maybe you could shrink the cell size for empty >>>>> cells? >>>>> >>>>> I should also probably watch it again for how you display boxed data. >>> One >>>>> of my worries is that with so much decoration on "flat" arrays that >>> boxing >>>>> will get lost in the noise. >>>>> >>>>> That said, from a user point of view, I can totally imagine wanting to >>> be >>>>> able to customize this, and I can also imagine not wanting to touch it >>> and >>>>> wanting it to lead me off to some other page that shows me how to reason >>>>> about it, and I can also imagine wanting to take the data and wanting to >>>>> play with it and render it in other ways. So I guess also there are >>> plenty >>>>> of opportunities for the future. >>>>> >>>>> If I were a manager, though, I might want you to ship it right now, the >>> way >>>>> it is. >>>>> >>>>> Fortunately, you don't have to please me. I do not know what I would >>> want >>>>> if I were just starting. We need more beginners, and maybe that is >>>>> something we can do something about, over the next few weeks and months. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Raul >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, Feb 11, 2014 at 10:21 AM, robert therriault >>>>> <bobtherria...@mac.com>wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Just an update on the visualization of J results. >>>>>> >>>>>> I have done a second video/blog post on using CSS and HTML to display >>>>>> results on JHS. It provides examples of a system that allows you to >>>>>> distinguish between 1 $ 1 , 1 1 $1 , and 1 as well as displaying >>> arrays >>>>>> with zeros in the shape such as 0 1 $ 1 and 1 0 $ 1. >>>>>> >>>>>> Blog post is here: >>>>>> >>> http://bobtherriault.wordpress.com/2014/02/11/using-css-and-html-to-display-the-shapes-of-arrays-on-the-jhs-platform/?relatedposts_exclude=513 >>>>>> >>>>>> Cheers, bob >>>>>> >>>>>> On Feb 4, 2014, at 8:25 AM, robert therriault <bobtherria...@mac.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Feb 4, 2014, at 5:29 AM, Raul Miller <rauldmil...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Of course you will also get an error if you try to combine one of >>>>>>>> those with another array of the wrong shape. Error conditions are one >>>>>>>> of the cases where I like getting the shapes of arrays. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sometimes the zeros can affect the result even though they can't be >>> seen >>>>>> in the display >>>>>>> >>>>>>> $ ( 0 2 3 $ 4), 5 7 $5 >>>>>>> 1 5 7 >>>>>>> $ (0 0 2 3 $ 4), 5 7 $5 >>>>>>> 1 1 5 7 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I am looking for ways to give the programmer some 'leverage' into >>> these >>>>>> situations by the ways that shapes are displayed >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> One of my favorite tricks, if I am getting an error from an >>> expression >>>>>>>> that seems to be due to of a lack of shapeliness (like a length >>> error) >>>>>>>> is to replace the last verb with $ (or a variation like ;&$ or $&.> >>> or >>>>>>>> ;&($ L:0) or whatever else). >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> And that brings up another issue related to finding the shapes of >>>>>>>> things: the shape inside a box will typically be different from the >>>>>>>> shape outside the box (these shapes are "independent" of each other). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Yep, I am working on boxes at the moment and it is a challenge for >>>>>> display while retaining the independent shape of contents. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Also, the shape of transitory arrays (intermediate results) can also >>>>>>>> matter. So familiarity with debugging tools and techniques can be >>>>>>>> crucial - sometimes even more important for coding than familiarity >>>>>>>> with shape and rank issues. (These are not, properly speaking, a part >>>>>>>> of the language itself so much as they are a part of the environment. >>>>>>>> But that's something of a technicality.) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> No doubt. Display can't replace knowing how rank and shape work. I am >>>>>> hoping that a little better way of displaying results will make it >>> easier >>>>>> to see the differences and may emphasize the importance of >>> understanding >>>>>> the concepts to those learning the language - that would be me! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers, bob >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> For information about J forums see >>> http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>>>>> >>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>>> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>>> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm >>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
