Goblok, gua bukan Bukan Pedanda. From: safin _blanc <pandan.wangi...@gmail.com> >To: proletar@yahoogroups.com >Sent: Tuesday, February 7, 2012 12:12 AM >Subject: Re: [proletar] Re: Women Expose (safin _blanc yang berotak babi...) > >..wah gw telat balas tulisan item yg belepotan taik salman rusdi ini... >.. bukan kgak mau balas, soalnya gw lagi melancong ... capeknya masih >terasa.. > >gini tem.. > >gw kgak silau oleh tulisan pakar organisasi dunia yg didominasi amrik sama >konco2nya yg ngejelekin islam supaya mrk punya legitimasi ngebantai orang >islam ...... apalagi tulisan yg ngaco seperti yg lu percaya itu..... apa >perempuan disunat lalu kgak bisa beranak? bahkan bisa mati segala?... >tulisan pakar organisasi dunia yg ngawur, sama sekali kgak kredibel..... >kgak perlu ada studi ilmiah utk bilang tulisan mereka ngawur.. kenyataan di >dunia nyata sdh jelas bhw statement mereka ngawur.. > >dan lu percaya sama tulisan mereka? tentu saja lu percaya karena lu memang >bagian dari orang yg mau melibas islam dan orang islam.. dimilis ini .. and >beyond.. > >setiap ada tulisan yg seperti ini lu telen bulat seperti lu telen taik >salman rusdi.... dan lu kgak punya malu sebarin tulisan konyol penuh >fitnah.. sama artinya dengan lu tukang fitnah juga...... jelas? > >.. ihh... > > > > > > > > >On Sat, Feb 4, 2012 at 10:41 AM, Bukan Pedanda <bukan.peda...@yahoo.com>wrote: > >> ** >> >> >> >> >> safin _blanc ini jelas berotak babi.. >> >> Tanpa argumen ilmiah dia bilang kesimpulan pakar organisasi dunia itu >> "fitnah yg dilakukan orang2 yg mau ngelibas islam " >> >> Edan. >> >> >> >> --- In proletar@yahoogroups.com, safin _blanc <pandan.wangi558@...> wrote: >> > >> > .. apa gw bilang? titit lo memang sontoloyo.. >> > .. bantah tuh kalo lu bisa bantah... >> > .. disertai bukti.. >> > >> > .. kalo kgak, orang di milis ini akan ketawain lu.. >> > .. >> > >> > Female genital mutilation or cutting (FGM/C) is the partial or total >> > removal of the external genitalia – undertaken for cultural or other >> > non-medical reasons – often causing severe pain and sometimes resulting >> in >> > prolonged bleeding, infection, infertility and even death. >> > .. ini fitnah yg dilakukan orang2 yg mau ngelibas islam, sehingga orang >> yg >> > bayar ongkos perang percaya bhw islam memang perlu dibasmi.... >> > .. gw kgak pernah dengar ada cw yg mengalami seperti yg lu jadikan >> > referensi ini.. kecuali tentu saja rasa sakit. infeksi bisa terjadi kalo >> > caranya kgak hygenis, tapi infertility? kematian?.. hah.. kgak tahu malu >> > nyebar pitnah.... >> > >> > .. sunat juga sakit, apa lu kgak sunat? >> > .. >> > >> > >> > >> > On Sat, Feb 4, 2012 at 4:22 AM, Bukan Pedanda <bukan.pedanda@...>wrote: >> > >> > > ** >> >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > safin _blanc yang berotak babi dan berpengetahuan dangkal... >> > > >> > > http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?Cr1=health&NewsID=37478&Cr=women >> > > >> > > --- In proletar@yahoogroups.com, safin _blanc <pandan.wangi558@> >> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > ..ngapain ngurus yg ginian, apa kgak ada kerjaan lain? gw kgak pernah >> > > > denger cw sekeliling gw yg complain soal ini.. termasuk bini gw,.. >> > > > ..cw juga kgak usil ngurusin laki2 yg sunat... >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > tp buat lu yg memang mau melibas islam dan orang islam di milis ini, >> > > urusan >> > > > begini aja jadi besar.. >> > > > ato barangkali bini lu kgak puas? klo dia kgak puas berarti titit lu >> yg >> > > > sontoloyo.... >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > On Thu, Feb 2, 2012 at 9:03 AM, item abu <itemabu@> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > > ** >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > Hehehe... jadi lu sama sekali ga peduli dgn cewek2 yg dipotong >> itilnya >> > > > > itu, nurut lu, itu urusan mereka, bukan urusan lu. >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > From: safin _blanc <pandan.wangi558@> >> > > > > >To: proletar@yahoogroups.com >> > > > > >Sent: Wednesday, February 1, 2012 7:24 AM >> > > > > >> > > > > >Subject: Re: [proletar] Women Expose Secret Genital Cutting Rite >> > > > > > >> > > > > >lu usil kgak ada kerjaan ngurus itil cw. >> > > > > >itu urusan sesama perempuan.. >> > > > > > >> > > > > >lu memang tukang fitnah. >> > > > > > >> > > > > >gw bilang kenyataan bhw banyak, banyak sekali muslimah yg >> bahagia.. >> > > > > >lu yg penuh fitnah dalam ngelibas islam dan orang islam di milis >> > > ini,... >> > > > > >yang..gw yakin kgak bahagia.. >> > > > > > >> > > > > >kasihaaaannn... >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >On Wed, Feb 1, 2012 at 5:29 AM, item abu <itemabu@> wrote: >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> ** >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> > > > > >> Jadi lu suka ngeliat dan ngedenger cewek tetangga lu ketawa2, >> > > berarti lu >> > > > > >> ga ngikutin ajaran Islam yg nindas cewek. Tetangga lu itu udah >> > > disunat >> > > > > >> belum itilnya? >> > > > > >> >> > > > > >> Hehehe.... spt yg gua bilang sebelumnya, orang Islam plus plus >> itu >> > > ga >> > > > > >> peduli sama sekali dgn nasib cewek yg ditindas di negara syariat >> > > iblis, >> > > > > spt >> > > > > >> cewek yg diperkosa di waktu msh anak2, cewek yg disunat itilnya, >> > > cewek >> > > > > yg >> > > > > >> disiksa di rumahnya oleh lakinya dsb. >> > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> > > > > >> From: safin _blanc <pandan.wangi558@> >> > > > > >> >To: proletar@yahoogroups.com >> > > > > >> >Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 9:19 AM >> > > > > >> >Subject: Re: [proletar] Women Expose Secret Genital Cutting >> Rite >> > > > > >> >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> >tetangga gw 8 bersaudara, perempuan semua... udah pada kawin, >> dan >> > > > > >> >berbahagia.. kalo ngumpul ketawa mereka lepas sampai kita >> > > tetangganya >> > > > > >> >merasakan kegembiraan mrk. >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> >gw pernah ikut latihan chen-qi di china... suhu kita bilang,.. >> > > ngesek >> > > > > itu >> > > > > >> >perlu, tp orgasm merupakan pemborosan energi yg besar.. >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> >supaya ingat, si item sinting ini adalah orang yg mau melibas >> > > islam dan >> > > > > >> >orang islam di milis ini... >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> >On Tue, Jan 31, 2012 at 6:11 AM, item abu <itemabu@> wrote: >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> >> ** >> > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Islam itu emang laknatan lil alamin >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> PAKISTAN-INDIA >> > > > > >> >> Women Expose Secret Genital Cutting Rite >> > > > > >> >> By Zofeen Ebrahim >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> KARACHI, Jan 30, 2012 (IPS) - "It was a dark and dingy room, >> > > where an >> > > > > >> >> elderly woman asked me to take off my panties, made me sit >> on a >> > > low >> > > > > >> wooden >> > > > > >> >> stool with my legs parted and then did something…I screamed >> out >> > > in >> > > > > >> pain," >> > > > > >> >> recalls Alefia Mustansir, 40, of her childhood experience. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Her friend, Sakina Haider, remembers "putting up a good >> fight" >> > > before >> > > > > >> she >> > > > > >> >> succumbed. "I was told by my grandmother that I was being >> taken >> > > to >> > > > > the >> > > > > >> >> doctor to address burning in the genital area when soap went >> > > there >> > > > > while >> > > > > >> >> bathing!" >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Both Haider and Mustansir have refused to have their >> daughters >> > > > > undergo >> > > > > >> >> circumcision or female genital mutilation/cutting (FGM/C), >> the >> > > > > Dawoodi >> > > > > >> >> Bohras' best-kept secret until young women from the community >> > > first >> > > > > >> began >> > > > > >> >> to speak up against it a few years ago. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Bohras, a sub-sect of Ismaili Shia Muslims, are a tight-knit >> > > > > community, >> > > > > >> >> with a majority residing in India and Pakistan, and >> estimated to >> > > > > number >> > > > > >> two >> > > > > >> >> million the world over. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> An article in the Dec. 12 issue of the popular Indian weekly >> > > > > `Outlook' >> > > > > >> >> says: "Khatna (circumcision) is a tradition the Bohras trace >> > > back to >> > > > > >> their >> > > > > >> >> origins in (north) Africa, one they continue with because >> they >> > > see >> > > > > this >> > > > > >> as >> > > > > >> >> an attempt to stay true to their faith." >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> The Outlook article goes on to say that "most Bohra women >> and men >> > > > > even >> > > > > >> >> today would rather keep this practice a secret rather than >> > > question a >> > > > > >> >> custom that is now universally seen as a gross violation of a >> > > woman's >> > > > > >> >> body." >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> The World Health Organisation defines FGM/C as a procedure >> that >> > > > > >> >> "intentionally alters or injures female genital organs for >> > > > > non-medical >> > > > > >> >> reasons." FGM/C, as practiced in some African countries, may >> > > involve >> > > > > >> >> removal of the entire clitoris and labia. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> The practice persists in 28 African countries, as well as in >> some >> > > > > Middle >> > > > > >> >> Eastern countries with varying degrees of cutting or >> mutilation. >> > > > > African >> > > > > >> >> countries that have banned it include Burkina Faso, Central >> > > African >> > > > > >> >> Republic, Djibouti, Eritrea, Ethiopia, Togo, Uganda, Kenya >> and >> > > Egypt. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Bohras insist that their practice is not harmful since it is >> done >> > > > > with >> > > > > >> >> care and moderation. Many justify it as a means to curb a >> woman's >> > > > > sexual >> > > > > >> >> drive and keep her chaste. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Haider finds that argument "highly problematic" and sees it >> as a >> > > way >> > > > > of >> > > > > >> >> controlling women. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Dr. Nighat Shah, former president of the Society of >> > > Obstetricians and >> > > > > >> >> Gynaecologists in Pakistan, finds it hard to believe that a >> > > > > community as >> > > > > >> >> "progressive and educated" as the Bohras carries out this >> > > practice. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> "Medically speaking," she explained, "a little snip or clip >> (of >> > > the >> > > > > >> >> clitoris) may not affect childbirth, but it may rob the >> woman of >> > > > > sexual >> > > > > >> >> pleasure. It is a very sensitive tissue." >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Another gynaecologist and obstetrician, Dr. Shershah Syed, >> finds >> > > no >> > > > > >> >> medical benefit to support female circumcision. "I am no >> > > religious >> > > > > >> scholar, >> > > > > >> >> so if a community believes it is an Islamic injunction, I'd >> > > suggest >> > > > > the >> > > > > >> >> girls should at least be old enough to understand the reason >> so >> > > that >> > > > > >> they >> > > > > >> >> can make an informed decision." >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> "Why do women's sexual drives have to be curbed?" Haider >> asks. >> > > "Women >> > > > > >> who >> > > > > >> >> are not circumcised are not necessarily promiscuous!" she >> says. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> A young Indian girl belonging to this Muslim sect, who goes >> by >> > > the >> > > > > name >> > > > > >> of >> > > > > >> >> Tasleem, has now found the courage to initiate an online >> petition >> > > > > asking >> > > > > >> >> the community's high priest, Dr. Syedna Mohammad >> Burhanuddin, to >> > > have >> > > > > >> this >> > > > > >> >> "cruel, inhuman and undemocratic ritual" stopped. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> The petition addressed to the 96-year-old prelate, who is >> based >> > > in >> > > > > the >> > > > > >> >> western Indian city of Mumbai, states: "Such a barbaric >> ritual >> > > has no >> > > > > >> place >> > > > > >> >> in a progressive community like the Bohras. So we pray to His >> > > > > Holiness >> > > > > >> to >> > > > > >> >> stop this misogynist ritual." Mustansir and Haider are in a >> > > minority >> > > > > >> among >> > > > > >> >> Bohra women who refuse to accept the practice. Most still get >> > > their >> > > > > >> >> daughters circumcised because it is an order from the >> community's >> > > > > high >> > > > > >> >> priest. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> "I have blind faith in my leader. I believe there must be >> some >> > > > > goodness >> > > > > >> in >> > > > > >> >> this that there is so much insistence," said Zahabia >> Mohammad, >> > > 38, >> > > > > >> mother >> > > > > >> >> of three circumcised daughters. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Mohammad conceded that her own experience was "gross" and >> > > "barbaric", >> > > > > >> but >> > > > > >> >> justifies its continuation because "it is done in a very safe >> > > manner >> > > > > >> today >> > > > > >> >> by doctors." >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> She was present for all of her daughters' circumcisions. "It >> > > takes >> > > > > less >> > > > > >> >> than five minutes and the procedure is done under local >> > > anaesthesia. >> > > > > >> Just a >> > > > > >> >> very minute bit of the clitoris is clipped off," she said. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> She acknowledged she had little information on the rite >> except >> > > what >> > > > > was >> > > > > >> >> told her by an aunt "that the foreskin of the clitoris is >> > > unclean and >> > > > > >> >> circumcision is for the benefit of the women." >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> She also concedes that today, with a deluge of information >> > > > > circulating >> > > > > >> >> against this practice, it is imperative to equip the >> community >> > > with >> > > > > >> >> information to enable them to make informed decisions. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> "Not everyone will accept this blindly, not the next >> generation. >> > > They >> > > > > >> will >> > > > > >> >> question and prod, so it is important to prepare them," she >> says >> > > of a >> > > > > >> rite >> > > > > >> >> that is kept secret from male members of the sect. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Tasleem told Outlook that genital cutting happens in all >> strata >> > > of >> > > > > Bohra >> > > > > >> >> society. "I'd say 90 percent practise it." >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Arwa Mohammad, who is in her 20s, signed the petition because >> > > "it's >> > > > > >> >> archaic and nonsensical." She was circumcised when she was >> seven >> > > by >> > > > > her >> > > > > >> >> grandmother's doctor friend. "Just goes to show how this >> ritual >> > > > > >> perpetuates >> > > > > >> >> without anyone questioning!" >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> Married a year back, Mohammad was "not traumatised" for life >> for >> > > > > getting >> > > > > >> >> circumcised, but cannot comprehend the reason still. "I have >> > > friends >> > > > > who >> > > > > >> >> have been circumcised like me but have a high sex drive. On >> the >> > > other >> > > > > >> hand, >> > > > > >> >> she admits to "frigidity" in bed. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> "The thought of snipping off a bit of a young child's >> clitoris >> > > gives >> > > > > me >> > > > > >> >> the goosebumps," said 37-year-old uncircumcised Amena Ali. >> She >> > > > > refuses >> > > > > >> to >> > > > > >> >> put her two daughters, aged six and eight - considered the >> right >> > > age >> > > > > >> band >> > > > > >> >> for circumcision - under the blade. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> The petition, put up last October, has opened an animated >> forum >> > > for >> > > > > >> >> discussion on both sides of the border, perhaps for the very >> > > first >> > > > > time, >> > > > > >> >> within the community on a subject that was taboo. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> "Initially, only the non-Bohras were signing, but once the >> media >> > > got >> > > > > >> into >> > > > > >> >> the act, many women from the community openly began talking >> about >> > > > > their >> > > > > >> >> painful experience," Tasleem told IPS in an email exchange >> from >> > > > > India. >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> So far, Tasleem has been able to collect 1,059 signatures. "I >> > > will >> > > > > keep >> > > > > >> >> this going till Dr. Syedna bans it. Raising awareness is the >> > > first >> > > > > step >> > > > > >> >> towards solving the problem." >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> "Whether the ritual will be abolished by this petition, only >> time >> > > > > will >> > > > > >> >> tell," says Zainab Hussain, 49, but she feels the petition >> will >> > > make >> > > > > a >> > > > > >> >> difference. "They (community leaders) may eventually break >> their >> > > > > silence >> > > > > >> >> and give a plausible answer." >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> (END) >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> >------------------------------------ >> > > > > >> >> > > > > >> > >> > > > > >> >Post message: prole...@egroups.com >> > > > > >> >Subscribe : proletar-subscr...@egroups.com >> > > > > >> >Unsubscribe : proletar-unsubscr...@egroups.com >> > > > > >> >List owner : proletar-ow...@egroups.com >> > > > > >> >Homepage : http://proletar.8m.com/Yahoo! 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