[Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[andy pugh]

I was having trouble sleeping last night, I was obsessing about CNC
machine wiring.
In an attempt to break the cycle I went on eBay and bought
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291551363807

In the cold light of day I think I made a mistake.

I wanted to control the two clutches and the brake on my lathe
gearbox. These have a single wire to a brush (24V) and return via the
machine frame.

I don't think that this device can be wired to operate them unless I
create a separate -24V supply by wiring the +24 of a PSU to the
machine frame.
I also don't think that it is particularly well suited to being driven
by the 7i84 outputs.

-- 
atp
If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Erik Christiansen]

On 22.01.16 10:08, andy pugh wrote:
> I was having trouble sleeping last night, I was obsessing about CNC
> machine wiring.
> In an attempt to break the cycle I went on eBay and bought
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291551363807
> 
> In the cold light of day I think I made a mistake.

Creative synthesis of a problem solution by the subconscious at night =
good. Making reasoned choices in the same time frame = rubbish. ( Don't
ask how I've reached that conclusion.)

> I wanted to control the two clutches and the brake on my lathe
> gearbox. These have a single wire to a brush (24V) and return via the
> machine frame.

s/These have/These each have/?

> I don't think that this device can be wired to operate them unless I
> create a separate -24V supply by wiring the +24 of a PSU to the
> machine frame.

Yes, that was my first reaction to seeing the negative common on the DC
SSR. If it's implemented with optocouplers + N-channel FETs, then that's
expected.

There is a way to use low-side switches. Burrow into each solenoid
device to isolate the frame return, and switch that. (I figure you've
already briefly considered that.)

Three individual DC SSRs could operate as high-side switches.
(An optocoupler, two resistors, a zener, and a power MOSFET, should
suffice to DIY, if the opto's transistor is used to hold the FET off.
Hmmm, loss of signal would then turn them all on - maybe not good?)

> I also don't think that it is particularly well suited to being driven
> by the 7i84 outputs.

If the 7i84 won't take 24v, then a transistor and two resistors, per
output, fixes that.

Erik

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[andy pugh]

On 22 January 2016 at 11:51, Erik Christiansen  wrote:

>> I wanted to control the two clutches and the brake on my lathe
>> gearbox. These have a single wire to a brush (24V) and return via the
>> machine frame.
>
> s/These have/These each have/?

Yes.

> There is a way to use low-side switches. Burrow into each solenoid
> device to isolate the frame return, and switch that. (I figure you've
> already briefly considered that.)

No, not even for a moment, as they are encapsulated lumps of steel,
and only have one brush.

>> I also don't think that it is particularly well suited to being driven
>> by the 7i84 outputs.
>
> If the 7i84 won't take 24v, then a transistor and two resistors, per
> output, fixes that.

The 7i84 outputs are 5 to 28V sourcing drivers, it isn't the voltage
that is the problem, it's the common positive on the control side of
that relay module.

-- 
atp
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http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Erik Christiansen]

On 22.01.16 12:22, andy pugh wrote:
> On 22 January 2016 at 11:51, Erik Christiansen  
> wrote:
> >> I also don't think that it is particularly well suited to being driven
> >> by the 7i84 outputs.
> >
> > If the 7i84 won't take 24v, then a transistor and two resistors, per
> > output, fixes that.
> 
> The 7i84 outputs are 5 to 28V sourcing drivers, it isn't the voltage
> that is the problem, it's the common positive on the control side of
> that relay module.

Ah, the SSR is upside-down both ways. OK, if you have no pull-down
outputs on any I/O board, then it's simple to make some from the
sourcing drivers:
  --##--- To an SSR input
 /1K
   |/
 10K   |
 24V sourcing driver --##--| NPN
   |   |<
   # \
   # |
 4K7   # |
   # |
   | |
GND 

The 1K will drive the SSR with round about 22 mA @ 24v.
The 10K will drive the transistor with a bit less than 2.4 mA @ 24v.
The 4K7 will help turn it off.
It would be hard to find a transistor without the current gain to
saturate (as desired) here. Something like a BC337 will handle 45v
and 800 mA of collector current, even though it's in the common TO92
package.

That'll still require the upside-down power supply on the SSR output.
How expensive are three discrete DC SSRs, compared to the extra PS?

Erik

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[John Kasunich]

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016, at 05:08 AM, andy pugh wrote:
> I was having trouble sleeping last night, I was obsessing about CNC
> machine wiring.
> In an attempt to break the cycle I went on eBay and bought
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291551363807
> 
> In the cold light of day I think I made a mistake.

Too late to return it?

> I wanted to control the two clutches and the brake on my lathe
> gearbox. These have a single wire to a brush (24V) and return via the
> machine frame.

Why not individual SSRs?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/181975200040

(Full disclosure - I'm selling those, as well as many other types, input
and output, AC and DC.  But there are many other sellers, and I'm
sure some are in the UK.)



-- 
  John Kasunich
  jmkasun...@fastmail.fm

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[andy pugh]

On 22 January 2016 at 13:26, Erik Christiansen  wrote:
> How expensive are three discrete DC SSRs, compared to the extra PS?

Well, that's basically the question. I think I will end up putting the
neat but useless device in the Box Of Potentially Useful Things and
look for something that will actually do the job instead.


-- 
atp
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http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[andy pugh]

On 22 January 2016 at 14:06, John Kasunich  wrote:
> Why not individual SSRs?
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/181975200040

I was wanting something with terminals that clips to DIN rail. Also, I
like the individual telltale LEDs.
There are many, many options. However many fail to state if they will
switch DC.


-- 
atp
If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[John Thornton]

Do you need some kind of special base for the OPTO-22's?

JT

On 1/22/2016 8:06 AM, John Kasunich wrote:
>
> On Fri, Jan 22, 2016, at 05:08 AM, andy pugh wrote:
>> I was having trouble sleeping last night, I was obsessing about CNC
>> machine wiring.
>> In an attempt to break the cycle I went on eBay and bought
>> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291551363807
>>
>> In the cold light of day I think I made a mistake.
> Too late to return it?
>
>> I wanted to control the two clutches and the brake on my lathe
>> gearbox. These have a single wire to a brush (24V) and return via the
>> machine frame.
> Why not individual SSRs?
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/181975200040
>
> (Full disclosure - I'm selling those, as well as many other types, input
> and output, AC and DC.  But there are many other sellers, and I'm
> sure some are in the UK.)
>
>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Ralph Stirling]

I like using DR-ODC24 and DR-ODC5 optos.  I use the
ODC5 for output and the ODC24 for input.  The DR types
have din rail mount and screw terminals on the top, plus a
little fuse for the output side.  Prices vary wildly on ebay for
them, but there are lots of suppliers.

-- Ralph

From: John Thornton [j...@gnipsel.com]
Sent: Friday, January 22, 2016 6:25 AM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

Do you need some kind of special base for the OPTO-22's?

JT

On 1/22/2016 8:06 AM, John Kasunich wrote:
>
> On Fri, Jan 22, 2016, at 05:08 AM, andy pugh wrote:
>> I was having trouble sleeping last night, I was obsessing about CNC
>> machine wiring.
>> In an attempt to break the cycle I went on eBay and bought
>> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291551363807
>>
>> In the cold light of day I think I made a mistake.
> Too late to return it?
>
>> I wanted to control the two clutches and the brake on my lathe
>> gearbox. These have a single wire to a brush (24V) and return via the
>> machine frame.
> Why not individual SSRs?
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/181975200040
>
> (Full disclosure - I'm selling those, as well as many other types, input
> and output, AC and DC.  But there are many other sellers, and I'm
> sure some are in the UK.)
>
>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[andy pugh]

On 22 January 2016 at 14:25, John Thornton  wrote:
> Do you need some kind of special base for the OPTO-22's?

I don't particularly want to be soldering wires to the legs and
fastening them to the contol board with double-sided tape, no.

I think that one of these will do the trick:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231742556113

-- 
atp
If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[John Kasunich]

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016, at 09:25 AM, John Thornton wrote:
> Do you need some kind of special base for the OPTO-22's?
> 
> JT

"Need" depends on how nice you want it to be.  There are boards
that you can plug the modules into, which provide terminal blocks
for the field wiring and various connectors for the PC side.  Or you
can stick them on perf-board and solder to the pins.

8 and 16 channels with an edge card connector (cheap but not wiring friendly):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/191600515192
http://www.ebay.com/itm/360808923888

4 channels, screw terminals both sides (could work for Andy):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/191600515192
http://www.ebay.com/itm/301423583767
http://www.ebay.com/itm/221984073559

16 channels, ribbon cable connector:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/161900394204
http://www.ebay.com/itm/361457510181
http://www.ebay.com/itm/361457510183
http://www.ebay.com/itm/161900394204
http://www.ebay.com/itm/361457510189

24 channels, edge card connector
http://www.ebay.com/itm/281648368461
http://www.ebay.com/itm/18089730

Note that the 50-pin I/O cables on the Mesa cards uses a pinout
that was defined by Opto-22.  99% sure you can plug one of
those cables directly into a 16 or 24 channel board and control
any mix of modules, input or output, AC or DC.  I'm less sure 
that the pinout on the 24 channel boards with an edge connector
is the same as on boards with a 50 pin header, but I think it is.

The Mazak that we retrofitted at the CNC workshop years ago
had three 24-channel boards that handled all the I/O - toolchanger,
hydraulics, interlocks, limit and home switches, etc.  It is a very 
nice way to manage I/O.


-- 
  John Kasunich
  jmkasun...@fastmail.fm

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[John Kasunich]

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016, at 09:57 AM, John Kasunich wrote:

> 
> The Mazak that we retrofitted at the CNC workshop years ago
> had three 24-channel boards that handled all the I/O - toolchanger,
> hydraulics, interlocks, limit and home switches, etc.  It is a very 
> nice way to manage I/O.

I knew this photo was out there somewhere, thanks google:
http://fenn.freeshell.org/retrofest/dcp_0366.jpg

You can see the I/O boards on both sides of Dave Engvall's head.


-- 
  John Kasunich
  jmkasun...@fastmail.fm

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Rick Lair]

How bout these, I know that they aren't solid state, but I use them 
every where.

http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Relays_-z-_Timers/Electro-Mechanical_Relays/Slim_-z-_Card_Relays,_5A_(RS_Series)/RS4N-DE

Rick

On 1/22/2016 9:37 AM, andy pugh wrote:
> On 22 January 2016 at 14:25, John Thornton  wrote:
>> Do you need some kind of special base for the OPTO-22's?
> I don't particularly want to be soldering wires to the legs and
> fastening them to the contol board with double-sided tape, no.
>
> I think that one of these will do the trick:
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231742556113
>

-- 

Thanks


Rick Lair
Superior Roll & Turning LLC
399 East Center Street
Petersburg MI, 49270
PH: 734-279-1831
FAX: 734-279-1166
www.superiorroll.com


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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Gene Heskett]

On Friday 22 January 2016 05:08:32 andy pugh wrote:

> I was having trouble sleeping last night, I was obsessing about CNC
> machine wiring.
> In an attempt to break the cycle I went on eBay and bought
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291551363807
>
> In the cold light of day I think I made a mistake.
>
> I wanted to control the two clutches and the brake on my lathe
> gearbox. These have a single wire to a brush (24V) and return via the
> machine frame.

Ugg return by machine frame doesn't fit with that w/o the -24 supply.  
OTOH most of the switchers don't care which output is grounded, so some 
cheapy thing with enough current could sneak into a corner someplace.

But I have an allergy to low side switches, too much stuff is hot and 
subject to accidental grounds enabling something you THINK is off.

Was there not a high side switch like it available?
>
> I don't think that this device can be wired to operate them unless I
> create a separate -24V supply by wiring the +24 of a PSU to the
> machine frame.
> I also don't think that it is particularly well suited to being driven
> by the 7i84 outputs.

It doesn't say what the activation current is.  Major lack of data so 
you'll have to test it at 5 or 3.3 volts on arrival. If it works on the 
logic level input, and you do have something that can be controlled by a 
low side switch, it might be usable.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[John Thornton]

That's a lot of I/O.

On 1/22/2016 9:03 AM, John Kasunich wrote:
>
> On Fri, Jan 22, 2016, at 09:57 AM, John Kasunich wrote:
>
>> The Mazak that we retrofitted at the CNC workshop years ago
>> had three 24-channel boards that handled all the I/O - toolchanger,
>> hydraulics, interlocks, limit and home switches, etc.  It is a very
>> nice way to manage I/O.
> I knew this photo was out there somewhere, thanks google:
> http://fenn.freeshell.org/retrofest/dcp_0366.jpg
>
> You can see the I/O boards on both sides of Dave Engvall's head.
>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[John Thornton]

Can you mix and match the modules on the OPTO22 board?

JT

On 1/22/2016 8:57 AM, John Kasunich wrote:
>
> On Fri, Jan 22, 2016, at 09:25 AM, John Thornton wrote:
>> Do you need some kind of special base for the OPTO-22's?
>>
>> JT
> "Need" depends on how nice you want it to be.  There are boards
> that you can plug the modules into, which provide terminal blocks
> for the field wiring and various connectors for the PC side.  Or you
> can stick them on perf-board and solder to the pins.
>
> 8 and 16 channels with an edge card connector (cheap but not wiring friendly):
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/191600515192
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/360808923888
>
> 4 channels, screw terminals both sides (could work for Andy):
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/191600515192
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/301423583767
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/221984073559
>
> 16 channels, ribbon cable connector:
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/161900394204
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/361457510181
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/361457510183
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/161900394204
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/361457510189
>
> 24 channels, edge card connector
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/281648368461
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/18089730
>
> Note that the 50-pin I/O cables on the Mesa cards uses a pinout
> that was defined by Opto-22.  99% sure you can plug one of
> those cables directly into a 16 or 24 channel board and control
> any mix of modules, input or output, AC or DC.  I'm less sure
> that the pinout on the 24 channel boards with an edge connector
> is the same as on boards with a 50 pin header, but I think it is.
>
> The Mazak that we retrofitted at the CNC workshop years ago
> had three 24-channel boards that handled all the I/O - toolchanger,
> hydraulics, interlocks, limit and home switches, etc.  It is a very
> nice way to manage I/O.
>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[John Kasunich]

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016, at 10:28 AM, John Thornton wrote:
> Can you mix and match the modules on the OPTO22 board?
> 

Yep.  DC input, DC output, AC input, AC output.  Configurable 
on a channel-by-channel basis.

The Mazak had a LOT of I/O.  For example the spindle gearbox 
had two solenoid valves to control the shift, and two proximity
switches to tell the control which gear it was in.  Tool clamp/unclamp
was one solenoid valve controlling the cylinder that pushes on the
drawbar spring stack in the spindle, and two proximity switches to
indicate clamped and unclamped.  Toolchanger count is something
like:  forward and reverse valves for the turret, one prox switch
to indicate that a turret slot is aligned with the changer, five prox
switches (binary encoded) to tell which slot.  Two valves and two
prox switches for the transfer arm, three to five valves for the main
toolchanger arm (extend, retract, and two different rotation angles),
a similar number of prox switches for that arm.  Contactors for
coolant, lube, and hydraulic pumps.  Pressure switches for lube
oil and hydraulic.  And many more that I don't remember, including
some that we never even figured out what they do.


  John Kasunich
  jmkasun...@fastmail.fm

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Chris Radek]

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 10:03:55AM -0500, John Kasunich wrote:
> 
> I knew this photo was out there somewhere, thanks google:
> http://fenn.freeshell.org/retrofest/dcp_0366.jpg
> 
> You can see the I/O boards on both sides of Dave Engvall's head.

I used similar in my vmc:

http://timeguy.com/cradek-files/emc/2011-07-14_21-39-26_272.jpg

Yes they just plug in to the mesa board.  I love that there is an
LED on each one, and I just wrote with pencil on the top to say what
it does.  If it won't come out of estop, I can open the door and
look at the lights and see LUBE LOW is lit, or AIR PRESSURE is not,
or whatever.


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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[andy pugh]

On 22 January 2016 at 15:18, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> Was there not a high side switch like it available?

I have not been able to find one.
Which is a pity, as it's a neat, compact unit.

Thanks for the other options, but I am in the UK so really need to
source from the EU or China (and only the latter because China Post
are up to something and it appears that vendors in China can ship to
here for less than it costs to ship from here to here)

-- 
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http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Gene Heskett]

On Friday 22 January 2016 09:37:43 andy pugh wrote:

> On 22 January 2016 at 14:25, John Thornton  wrote:
> > Do you need some kind of special base for the OPTO-22's?
>
> I don't particularly want to be soldering wires to the legs and
> fastening them to the contol board with double-sided tape, no.
>
> I think that one of these will do the trick:
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231742556113

Yup. But no post to US or I'd buy 2 on spec.  Last thing I bought from 
the UK, a small set of lathe threading tools, were very well made, but 
the freight was about $40 USD for less than a pound.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Chris Radek]

On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 09:28:12AM -0600, John Thornton wrote:
> Can you mix and match the modules on the OPTO22 board?

Yes, however you want.


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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[sam sokolik]

I have used a combination of cards...

http://electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/All_i-o.JPG

http://electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/DSCF1184.JPG



On 1/22/2016 9:43 AM, Chris Radek wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 22, 2016 at 09:28:12AM -0600, John Thornton wrote:
>> Can you mix and match the modules on the OPTO22 board?
> Yes, however you want.
>
>
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>


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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[andy pugh]

On 22 January 2016 at 15:42, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>> I think that one of these will do the trick:
>> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231742556113
>
> Yup. But no post to US or I'd buy 2 on spec.

You could try the .com option:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/231742556113

The actual things are in Hong Kong.

-- 
atp
If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[andy pugh]

On 22 January 2016 at 15:42, Chris Radek  wrote:
> http://timeguy.com/cradek-files/emc/2011-07-14_21-39-26_272.jpg
>
> Yes they just plug in to the mesa board.  I love that there is an
> LED on each one, and I just wrote with pencil on the top to say what
> it does.

While we seem to be listing IO boards, someone should probably mention
that this isn't a Mesa-only shop:
https://pico-systems.com/dio.html

Also, as an alternative to the Opto22 etc, the Mesa 7i64 has a lot of
moderate-voltage moderate-current IO. (48V 2.5A)
http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=110

Put 24 of those on a 5i24 or similar and you have > 1100 IO points.

-- 
atp
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http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Dave Cole]

It may not be the most economical solution, but this is why I oftentimes 
include a PLC in the CNC control cabinet.
I can mix and match I/O and drive it via Modbus RTU or TCP and be done 
with it.  If you want to use the logic in the PLC you can. If not just use
it as a dumb I/O brick/block with your choice of I/O.  A lot of PLCs are 
floating around on Ebay for dirt cheap prices.By the time you buy an 
opto 22 block, mounting strip, and individual blocks you can buy an 
entire PLC.   The Automation Direct PLCs over here have Modbus RTU ports 
even on the new $69 units and now they have a PLC with Ethernet built in 
for a little more.

Dave


On 1/22/2016 9:35 AM, Ralph Stirling wrote:
> I like using DR-ODC24 and DR-ODC5 optos.  I use the
> ODC5 for output and the ODC24 for input.  The DR types
> have din rail mount and screw terminals on the top, plus a
> little fuse for the output side.  Prices vary wildly on ebay for
> them, but there are lots of suppliers.
>
> -- Ralph
> 
> From: John Thornton [j...@gnipsel.com]
> Sent: Friday, January 22, 2016 6:25 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought
>
> Do you need some kind of special base for the OPTO-22's?
>
> JT
>
> On 1/22/2016 8:06 AM, John Kasunich wrote:
>> On Fri, Jan 22, 2016, at 05:08 AM, andy pugh wrote:
>>> I was having trouble sleeping last night, I was obsessing about CNC
>>> machine wiring.
>>> In an attempt to break the cycle I went on eBay and bought
>>> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291551363807
>>>
>>> In the cold light of day I think I made a mistake.
>> Too late to return it?
>>
>>> I wanted to control the two clutches and the brake on my lathe
>>> gearbox. These have a single wire to a brush (24V) and return via the
>>> machine frame.
>> Why not individual SSRs?
>>
>> http://www.ebay.com/itm/181975200040
>>
>> (Full disclosure - I'm selling those, as well as many other types, input
>> and output, AC and DC.  But there are many other sellers, and I'm
>> sure some are in the UK.)
>>
>>
>>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Dave Cole]

Hey, I was there!  :-)

I was not a EMC2 convert at the time  but I talked to a bunch of you 
guys as you were working on the machine.
It was sort of running at the time.I think I was there the second 
year you guys were working on it.

Dave

On 1/22/2016 10:03 AM, John Kasunich wrote:
>
> On Fri, Jan 22, 2016, at 09:57 AM, John Kasunich wrote:
>
>> The Mazak that we retrofitted at the CNC workshop years ago
>> had three 24-channel boards that handled all the I/O - toolchanger,
>> hydraulics, interlocks, limit and home switches, etc.  It is a very
>> nice way to manage I/O.
> I knew this photo was out there somewhere, thanks google:
> http://fenn.freeshell.org/retrofest/dcp_0366.jpg
>
> You can see the I/O boards on both sides of Dave Engvall's head.
>
>

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[sam sokolik]

We use these and they plug an play right into mesa 50 pin plugs..

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Opto22-G4PB24-G4-digital-24-channel-I-O-Module-Rack-used-in-Tech-Lab-only-/221797137044?hash=item33a423ba94:g:dNAAAOSweW5Vdxtc

sam

On 1/22/2016 9:03 AM, John Kasunich wrote:
>
> On Fri, Jan 22, 2016, at 09:57 AM, John Kasunich wrote:
>
>> The Mazak that we retrofitted at the CNC workshop years ago
>> had three 24-channel boards that handled all the I/O - toolchanger,
>> hydraulics, interlocks, limit and home switches, etc.  It is a very
>> nice way to manage I/O.
> I knew this photo was out there somewhere, thanks google:
> http://fenn.freeshell.org/retrofest/dcp_0366.jpg
>
> You can see the I/O boards on both sides of Dave Engvall's head.
>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Gene Heskett]

On Friday 22 January 2016 10:52:35 andy pugh wrote:

> On 22 January 2016 at 15:42, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> >> I think that one of these will do the trick:
> >> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231742556113
> >
> > Yup. But no post to US or I'd buy 2 on spec.
>
> You could try the .com option:
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/231742556113
>
> The actual things are in Hong Kong.

I figured they were, but ATM I have solved most of the problems those 
might.  With even bigger mechanical relays for the most part.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Gene Heskett]

On Friday 22 January 2016 10:52:35 andy pugh wrote:

> On 22 January 2016 at 15:42, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> >> I think that one of these will do the trick:
> >> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231742556113
> >
> > Yup. But no post to US or I'd buy 2 on spec.
>
> You could try the .com option:
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/231742556113
>
And its topped in bright red, does not ship to the US, & still priced in 
GBP.

But I found it, for $14.change, $1.59 shipping from Hong Kong.

Bookmarked.

> The actual things are in Hong Kong.

Thanks Andy.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Viesturs Lācis]

2016-01-22 17:30 GMT+02:00 sam sokolik :
> We use these and they plug an play right into mesa 50 pin plugs..
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Opto22-G4PB24-G4-digital-24-channel-I-O-Module-Rack-used-in-Tech-Lab-only-/221797137044?hash=item33a423ba94:g:dNAAAOSweW5Vdxtc
>

What do you use on these boards? Some relays, transistors, optoisolators?

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[Jon Elson]

On 01/22/2016 04:08 AM, andy pugh wrote:
> I was having trouble sleeping last night, I was obsessing about CNC
> machine wiring.
> In an attempt to break the cycle I went on eBay and bought
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291551363807
That's an amazing device, at that price!  Thanks!


>
> In the cold light of day I think I made a mistake.
>
> I wanted to control the two clutches and the brake on my lathe
> gearbox. These have a single wire to a brush (24V) and return via the
> machine frame.
>
> I don't think that this device can be wired to operate them unless I
> create a separate -24V supply by wiring the +24 of a PSU to the
> machine frame.
Wire +24 to all clutch and brake coils.  Wire -24 to the 
common terminal on the relay.
Wire other ends of all coils to the individual relay 
terminals. This could require some slight rewiring in the 
machine.  But, most likely, the coils don't care about 
magnetic polarity, so you can wire them up either way.  Just 
watch out for freewheel diodes, which will care.

If your 24 V PSU powers OTHER stuff in the machine, then you 
have to figure out if going to positive ground will affect 
any of that.

> I also don't think that it is particularly well suited to being driven
> by the 7i84 outputs.
>
Common + on the control inputs, so you need a sinking output 
on the Mesa boards.  And, it needs to be set up to go high 
or open-circuit on E-stop so it doesn't engage the clutch 
AND brake at the same time.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Not as useful as I thought

[andy pugh]

On 22 January 2016 at 20:13, Jon Elson  wrote:

> Wire +24 to all clutch and brake coils.  Wire -24 to the
> common terminal on the relay.
> Wire other ends of all coils to the individual relay
> terminals. This could require some slight rewiring in the
> machine.  But, most likely, the coils don't care about
> magnetic polarity, so you can wire them up either way.

The problem is that I only have access to one end of each coil, the
other end is the gearbox shafts/case.

Through an eBay accident I do have two of the 24V supplies, so a -24V
supply for the clutches and a +24V for the GPIO is an option.

> Common + on the control inputs, so you need a sinking output
> on the Mesa boards.  And, it needs to be set up to go high
> or open-circuit on E-stop so it doesn't engage the clutch
> AND brake at the same time.

Engaging everything at the same time might not be too bad. It will
certainly stop the machine...

-- 
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http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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