[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > How do you know? All those people who bought them might be running > around in heaven right now, having wild parties and boozing it up. > > Sal > Could be, but I wouldn't bet money on it :-) JohnY > > On Apr 7, 2006, at 7:53 PM, jyouells2000 wrote: > > > > I love the idea of indulgences. It quanitifies the field of karma > > > and like things with a price on them. > > > > > > > It may seem to quantify karma, but it doesn't work. > To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jyouells2000" > wrote: > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shempmcgurk" > [...] > > > I love the idea of indulgences. It quanitifies the field of karma > > > and like things with a price on them. > > > > > > > It may seem to quantify karma, but it doesn't work. > > The Midieval Roman Church would disagree. > And they laughed all the way to (what became the future BOA) the bank JohnY To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
How do you know? All those people who bought them might be running around in heaven right now, having wild parties and boozing it up. Sal On Apr 7, 2006, at 7:53 PM, jyouells2000 wrote: > I love the idea of indulgences. It quanitifies the field of karma > and like things with a price on them. > It may seem to quantify karma, but it doesn't work.
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jyouells2000" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shempmcgurk" [...] > > I love the idea of indulgences. It quanitifies the field of karma > > and like things with a price on them. > > > > It may seem to quantify karma, but it doesn't work. The Midieval Roman Church would disagree. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, bob_brigante <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Marek Reavis" > wrote: > Queen Elizabeth of > > England and all her courtiers and the "Royal" family all look just as > > silly (to my eyes) as the current crop of TMO rajahs. > > > > Yes, but the Brits don't get to enjoy it: > > "Great Britain is one of the world's foremost guilt-driven societies, > says David Holmes, a psychologist who studies the phenomenon at > Manchester Metropolitan University in Manchester, England. If people > there seem too happy, he says, "it's like an admission of guilt. When > you're smiling, people think you've done something wrong." > > http://tinyurl.com/oov8l Wall Street Journal 6Apr2006, page D1 > Is this David S. Holmes? He once published a study on meditation that proved that meditation of any type doesn't work. I wrote an English paper that trashed his study but never got it published. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > The TM-org lacks compassion. Had it been a little compassionate and treated it's members like family, it would not be having so many enemies today. > > ShempMcGurk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Date: Fri, 07 Apr 2006 18:43:06 -0000 > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp] > > > From day one, I always got the impression that the rank and file were treated like shit in the TMO. > I often think that as well. However, there's a fine line between treating someone like family, and forcing your own beliefs about what is best for your brother onto your brother (speaking from ongoing personal experience). Perhaps the TMO goes too far in "cutting the strings" for the family, but if they went too far in the other direction, they'd be open to even MORE criticism. I *do* think that retirement plans should be available for people. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shempmcgurk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" wrote: > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > > > > > > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though > I > > don't > > > > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is > still > > > > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to > > people > > > > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing > > since > > > > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > > > > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much > on > > money > > > > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and > file. > > > > > > > > > It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck > me > > > that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's > > just > > > that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the > buying > > of > > > titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually > > involves > > > is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule > a > > > country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay > enough > > > money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be > > able > > > to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. > And > > > every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. > > > > > > It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to > > enter > > > some religious order. > > > > > > It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, > holding > > > fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're > actually > > > royalty. > > > > > > It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I > > always > > > knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. > > > > > > > In the case of the Rajahs, its more than that. The Millionaires > > Course could be seen that way to a certain extent, but the Rajahs > are > > expected to actually *administrate* which is a big difference, > IMHO. > > > > Spare Egg, you should have been around at the time of Stalin. > > You could have been his Minister of Justification. > Really? The Millionaires Course was for millionaires who wanted face time (more or less) with MMY. The Rajas are expected to work FOR the TM organization and they paid good money for that privledge. While you can make a case that they are so gung-ho in their beliefs that they are willing to pay money to be allowed to wear a TMO crown, there are certainly cheaper and easier ways to win accolades from underlings than paying big bucks to work for the TMO at executive level. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jyouells2000" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shempmcgurk" > wrote: > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jyouells2000" > > wrote: > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > > > > > > > > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though > > I don't > > > > > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is > > still > > > > > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to > > people > > > > > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing > > since > > > > > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > > > > > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much > > on money > > > > > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and > > file. > > > > > > > > > > > > It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck > > me > > > > that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's > > just > > > > that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the > > buying of > > > > titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually > > involves > > > > is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule > > a > > > > country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay > > enough > > > > money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be > > able > > > > to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. > > And > > > > every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. > > > > > > > > It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to > > enter > > > > some religious order. > > > > > > > > It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, > > holding > > > > fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're > > actually > > > > royalty. > > > > > > > > It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I > > always > > > > knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. > > > > > > > > > > It's all been done before - think buying Indulgences. Was that > > before > > > or after the Inquisition? > > > > > > JohnY > > > > > > > I love the idea of indulgences. It quanitifies the field of karma > > and like things with a price on them. > > > > It may seem to quantify karma, but it doesn't work. ...but it's nice to be da King... > > JohnY > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shempmcgurk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jyouells2000" > wrote: > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > > > > > > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though > I don't > > > > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is > still > > > > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to > people > > > > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing > since > > > > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > > > > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much > on money > > > > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and > file. > > > > > > > > > It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck > me > > > that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's > just > > > that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the > buying of > > > titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually > involves > > > is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule > a > > > country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay > enough > > > money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be > able > > > to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. > And > > > every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. > > > > > > It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to > enter > > > some religious order. > > > > > > It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, > holding > > > fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're > actually > > > royalty. > > > > > > It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I > always > > > knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. > > > > > > > It's all been done before - think buying Indulgences. Was that > before > > or after the Inquisition? > > > > JohnY > > > > I love the idea of indulgences. It quanitifies the field of karma > and like things with a price on them. > IIRC, Tibetan monks believe that writing out scripture is a religious activity. Some believe that *photocopying* scripture is a religious activity, and hence good karma. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shempmcgurk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jyouells2000" > wrote: > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > > > > > > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though > I don't > > > > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is > still > > > > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to > people > > > > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing > since > > > > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > > > > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much > on money > > > > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and > file. > > > > > > > > > It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck > me > > > that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's > just > > > that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the > buying of > > > titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually > involves > > > is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule > a > > > country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay > enough > > > money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be > able > > > to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. > And > > > every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. > > > > > > It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to > enter > > > some religious order. > > > > > > It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, > holding > > > fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're > actually > > > royalty. > > > > > > It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I > always > > > knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. > > > > > > > It's all been done before - think buying Indulgences. Was that > before > > or after the Inquisition? > > > > JohnY > > > > I love the idea of indulgences. It quanitifies the field of karma > and like things with a price on them. > It may seem to quantify karma, but it doesn't work. JohnY To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Marek Reavis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Queen Elizabeth of > England and all her courtiers and the "Royal" family all look just as > silly (to my eyes) as the current crop of TMO rajahs. Yes, but the Brits don't get to enjoy it: "Great Britain is one of the world's foremost guilt-driven societies, says David Holmes, a psychologist who studies the phenomenon at Manchester Metropolitan University in Manchester, England. If people there seem too happy, he says, "it's like an admission of guilt. When you're smiling, people think you've done something wrong." http://tinyurl.com/oov8l Wall Street Journal 6Apr2006, page D1 Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
The TM-org lacks compassion. Had it been a little compassionate and treated it's members like family, it would not be having so many enemies today.ShempMcGurk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Date: Fri, 07 Apr 2006 18:43:06 -0000Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp] From day one, I always got the impression that the rank and file were treated like shit in the TMO. Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "FairfieldLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj wrote: > > > > > > On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > > > > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though I > don't > > > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is still > > > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to > people > > > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing > since > > > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > > > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much on > money > > > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and file. > > > > > > It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck me > > that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's > just > > that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the buying > of > > titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually > involves > > is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule a > > country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay enough > > money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be > able > > to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. And > > every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. > > > > It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to > enter > > some religious order. > > > > It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, holding > > fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're actually > > royalty. > > > > It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I > always > > knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. > > > > In the case of the Rajahs, its more than that. The Millionaires > Course could be seen that way to a certain extent, but the Rajahs are > expected to actually *administrate* which is a big difference, IMHO. > Spare Egg, you should have been around at the time of Stalin. You could have been his Minister of Justification. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jyouells2000" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj wrote: > > > > > > On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > > > > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though I don't > > > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is still > > > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to people > > > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing since > > > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > > > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much on money > > > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and file. > > > > > > It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck me > > that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's just > > that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the buying of > > titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually involves > > is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule a > > country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay enough > > money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be able > > to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. And > > every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. > > > > It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to enter > > some religious order. > > > > It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, holding > > fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're actually > > royalty. > > > > It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I always > > knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. > > > > It's all been done before - think buying Indulgences. Was that before > or after the Inquisition? > > JohnY > I love the idea of indulgences. It quanitifies the field of karma and like things with a price on them. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "markmeredith2002" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" wrote: > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB wrote: > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > First, What is your definition of insanity.?? > > > > > > It would be complex, because insanity is a complex > > > subject, but I'm pretty sure that one aspect of it > > > would include defining as insane people who give > > > themselves the titles of kings and expect others to > > > honor those titles. > > > > Who expects anyone to honor the rajah titles, even within the TMO? > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though I don't > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is still > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to people > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing since > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much on money > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and file. >From day one, I always got the impression that the rank and file were treated like shit in the TMO. > > > It would also include those > > > stupid enough *to* honor these self-given titles. :-) > > > > > > Who DOES honor those titles outside the ceremonies of the club that > > they belong to? > > You're right, no-one ... but MMY has expressed genuine disappointment > that Hagelin was not elected president and at other rather bizarre > notions, so it seems he and others in the inner circle might take > these titles very seriously. > > > > > Second, it may not be sane, but you cannot ignore > > > > the teachings completely. That would be like throwing > > > > the baby along with the bathwater. > > > > > > Some babies deserve to be thrown out. I'm with Shemp > > > on this one -- the *only* teaching I think was *ever* > > > of worth in the TM movement was how to do basic TM. > > > > > I think that's a good start for almost anyone, and > > > thus potentially valuable. I think that everything > > > else, including the siddhis and the diet advice and > > > all the "Vedic" bullshit, is better thrown out. > > > > The Sidhis aren't of value? Amrit kalash isn't? Ayurveda isn't > > sweeping the country in popularity? > > Ayurved is popular in new agey and wholistic circles, but not sweeping > the nation IMO, and sweeping mainly in Chopra and Weil circles. Amrit > kalash is sweeping the emerging diabetics section of the country. The > issue for me isn't whether these alternative programs have potential > value, but how the tmo has managed them - the enlightenment centers in > malls plan is a joke and sweeping towards bankrupcy, but no-one dares > contradicts or gives reality checks to raja wynne or MMY. > > > > > Third, A little bit of Snake-Oil might be > > > > necessary to grease the wheels of a big movement. > > > > > > Who said a big movement was necessary? That's the > > > question that True Believers never seem to ask them- > > > selves. Many spiritual organizations (for example, > > > Vipassana) have entirely volunteer organizations that > > > teach for free and end up teaching ten to twenty times > > > the number of people worldwide to meditate that the > > > TM organization does. > > > > Vipassana has taught 3 million in this country? > > This is a really interesting pt. There has to be some middle ground > between being a effective (corporate-like) marketing org. (which is > necessary to actually reach people today) and being obsessed with > marketing driven by greed or culty evangelical zeal (which ultimately > undermines your original mission). I think the tmo balanced it pretty > well in the 70s. > > > In my opinion, the TMO has turned > > > into an entity primarily concerned with perpetuating > > > itself, not with helping others. The goals of the > > > organization are long forgotten; all that matters now > > > is perpetuating the organization. > > > > At this point in time, you may be correct. OTOH, the upcoming seminar > > on TM and its effect on education and ADHD is expected to have over > > 100 people. True, the invited guests don't have to pay for their > > lunch atthe Tucson Hilton, but even so, it's a good start. > > Certainly lots of potential for marketing TM via specific areas like > high blood pressure, ADHD and others, but doesn't seem to be the > desire of the central org. who whole heartedly believe MMY and the TMO > are the only hope for world salvation right now and who want billions > to achieve it. For 2 decades now these good little projects have > withered away for this reason. > > > > > Fourth, Take what is good in all the masters and > > > > leave out the irrelevant and the unnecessary. > > > > > > IMO, there have never been any "m
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:51 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: While I agree, I might point out that the SCA (Society for Creative Anachronism) is a real bargain if what you want is a fancy title. All you do is make up your own, make sure that the name could have existed during the time period and geographical location your persona lived in but didn't actually exist (in other words, you can't use the names of real historical characters), and voila, you're Lord Whatever of Wherever. And you don't even have to pay a million. They're big here in the US, I've come across a number of people involved with it in my weaving forays. You can choose your own costume, too. Most of the crowns one sees in SCA gatherings are *much* nicer and more tasteful than the TMO Burger King crowns. And all in all, this is just good fantasy fun, more so because at the end of the weekend or whatever, you just go home and resume your real life don't have to pretend any more. Unlike the rajas, who are stuck with pretending that their version of fancy titles and dressup *are* real life. :-) I'd like to see one of them try and get on a plane wearing those get-ups... Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jyouells2000" > wrote: > > > > It's all been done before - think buying Indulgences. Was > > that before or after the Inquisition? > > The practice of 'buying indulgences' was long before > the Inquisition. The Cathars formed their sect in > reaction to the selling of indulgences and the other > corruption in the Roman Church. The Inquisition was > then formed to deal with the Cathars. > We haven't quite made it to the 'Cathars' stage yet? Ingegred, look out... :-) JohnY To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj wrote: > > On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > > > > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though I > don't > > > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is still > > > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to > people > > > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing > since > > > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > > > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much on > money > > > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and > file. > > > > > > It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck > me > > that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's > just > > that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the buying > of > > titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually > involves > > is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule a > > country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay > enough > > money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be > able > > to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. > And > > every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. > > > > It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to > enter > > some religious order. > > > > It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, holding > > fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're actually > > royalty. > > > > It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I > always > > knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. > > While I agree, I might point out that the SCA > (Society for Creative Anachronism) is a real > bargain if what you want is a fancy title. All > you do is make up your own, make sure that the > name could have existed during the time period > and geographical location your persona lived in > but didn't actually exist (in other words, you > can't use the names of real historical characters), > and voila, you're Lord Whatever of Wherever. > > You can choose your own costume, too. Most > of the crowns one sees in SCA gatherings are > *much* nicer and more tasteful than the TMO > Burger King crowns. > > And all in all, this is just good fantasy fun, > more so because at the end of the weekend or > whatever, you just go home and resume your real > life don't have to pretend any more. Unlike the > rajas, who are stuck with pretending that their > version of fancy titles and dressup *are* real > life. :-) > Er, it takes a LOT of work to get a title past "M'Lord" or "M'Lady" in the SCA. In theory, one must show that one would be able to make a living as a musician to be awarded a title for being a musician, as a blacksmith for being blacksmith, as an artisan for being an artisan, etc., and you must present your talents in a period-appropriate manner by performing period music or dance, or creating period instruments, or manufacturing reasonably period armor, etc. of the required quality. For the fighting titles, you must beat all the other young bucks (or buckettes -there are have been a few fighting baronesses and princesses in the SCA, and I believe one "Queen in Her own right") at your level of the SCA, and for the title of "king" you must not only defeat all comers at the Kingdom level, but must commit to presiding over a certain number of SCA functions over the next year, many of which require a LOT of travel time, or expensive plane tickets, since a Kingdom usually covers several states and you gotta be willing to visit most of your Realm over the period of your reign. BTW, your average Baron or King *does* live the SCA most of the time, outside of work. Not only do they have to attend those out-of-town royal functions, but in order to become king, one must become a master of broadsword, ax, mace, etc., by putting in just as many hours of practice as any karate blackbelt does to prepair for a tournement match. And those damn rattan swords HURT, even through the padded armor. --Sparrow the Incorrigible, Anno Societatis 8 To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jyouells2000" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > It's all been done before - think buying Indulgences. Was > that before or after the Inquisition? The practice of 'buying indulgences' was long before the Inquisition. The Cathars formed their sect in reaction to the selling of indulgences and the other corruption in the Roman Church. The Inquisition was then formed to deal with the Cathars. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though I don't > > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is still > > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to people > > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing since > > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much on money > > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and file. > > > It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck me > that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's just > that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the buying of > titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually involves > is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule a > country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay enough > money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be able > to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. And > every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. > > It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to enter > some religious order. > > It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, holding > fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're actually > royalty. > > It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I always > knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. > In the case of the Rajahs, its more than that. The Millionaires Course could be seen that way to a certain extent, but the Rajahs are expected to actually *administrate* which is a big difference, IMHO. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though I don't > > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is still > > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to people > > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing since > > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much on money > > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and file. > > > It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck me > that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's just > that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the buying of > titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually involves > is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule a > country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay enough > money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be able > to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. And > every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. > > It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to enter > some religious order. > > It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, holding > fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're actually > royalty. > > It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I always > knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. > It's all been done before - think buying Indulgences. Was that before or after the Inquisition? JohnY To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "markmeredith2002" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" wrote: > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB wrote: > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > First, What is your definition of insanity.?? > > > > > > It would be complex, because insanity is a complex > > > subject, but I'm pretty sure that one aspect of it > > > would include defining as insane people who give > > > themselves the titles of kings and expect others to > > > honor those titles. > > > > Who expects anyone to honor the rajah titles, even within the TMO? > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though I don't > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is still > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to people > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing since > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much on money > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and file. How much money did Chopra or Bevan or Hagelin contribute? > > > It would also include those > > > stupid enough *to* honor these self-given titles. :-) > > > > > > Who DOES honor those titles outside the ceremonies of the club that > > they belong to? > > You're right, no-one ... but MMY has expressed genuine disappointment > that Hagelin was not elected president and at other rather bizarre > notions, so it seems he and others in the inner circle might take > these titles very seriously. Given a choice (leaving aside the political connection issues) between Hagelin and Bush, I think Hagelin would have been no worse than Bush. > > > > > Second, it may not be sane, but you cannot ignore > > > > the teachings completely. That would be like throwing > > > > the baby along with the bathwater. > > > > > > Some babies deserve to be thrown out. I'm with Shemp > > > on this one -- the *only* teaching I think was *ever* > > > of worth in the TM movement was how to do basic TM. > > > > > I think that's a good start for almost anyone, and > > > thus potentially valuable. I think that everything > > > else, including the siddhis and the diet advice and > > > all the "Vedic" bullshit, is better thrown out. > > > > The Sidhis aren't of value? Amrit kalash isn't? Ayurveda isn't > > sweeping the country in popularity? > > Ayurved is popular in new agey and wholistic circles, but not sweeping > the nation IMO, and sweeping mainly in Chopra and Weil circles. But Chopra is an offshoot of Maharishi Ayurveda and Weil is well, Weil. He's influential, but not Oprah material. Amrit > kalash is sweeping the emerging diabetics section of the country. The > issue for me isn't whether these alternative programs have potential > value, but how the tmo has managed them - the enlightenment centers in > malls plan is a joke and sweeping towards bankrupcy, but no-one dares > contradicts or gives reality checks to raja wynne or MMY. I'll have to get back to you on that one. The Tucson Maharishi Enlightenment Center is now open or soon will be. I haven't checked the physical location, so I don't know what the deal is. > > > > > Third, A little bit of Snake-Oil might be > > > > necessary to grease the wheels of a big movement. > > > > > > Who said a big movement was necessary? That's the > > > question that True Believers never seem to ask them- > > > selves. Many spiritual organizations (for example, > > > Vipassana) have entirely volunteer organizations that > > > teach for free and end up teaching ten to twenty times > > > the number of people worldwide to meditate that the > > > TM organization does. > > > > Vipassana has taught 3 million in this country? > > This is a really interesting pt. There has to be some middle ground > between being a effective (corporate-like) marketing org. (which is > necessary to actually reach people today) and being obsessed with > marketing driven by greed or culty evangelical zeal (which ultimately > undermines your original mission). I think the tmo balanced it pretty > well in the 70s. Not really. They had people banging on their door in the 70's. There was no need for competency back then. > > > In my opinion, the TMO has turned > > > into an entity primarily concerned with perpetuating > > > itself, not with helping others. The goals of the > > > organization are long forgotten; all that matters now > > > is perpetuating the organization. > > > > At this point in time, you may be correct. OTOH, the upcoming seminar > > on TM and its effect on education and ADHD is expected to have over > > 100 people. True, the invited guests don't have to pay for their > > lunch atthe Tucson Hilton, but even so, it's a good start. > > Certainly lots of potential for marketi
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
Comment below: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though I don't > > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is still > > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to people > > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing since > > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much on money > > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and file. > > > It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck me > that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's just > that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the buying of > titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually involves > is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule a > country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay enough > money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be able > to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. And > every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. > > It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to enter > some religious order. > > It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, holding > fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're actually > royalty. > > It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I always > knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. > **END** The scam of titles and the nobility has always existed in the same way. It was always about property and affluence. Queen Elizabeth of England and all her courtiers and the "Royal" family all look just as silly (to my eyes) as the current crop of TMO rajahs. The only real difference is that the House of Windsor has been in place within the cultural context of England for so long (though not under that name) that there is a presumed legitimacy that the TMO rajahs don't yet have (if ever). There are so many "titled" Europeans that they're categorized as eurotrash. Governmental authority only exists if you believe it does. When that belief gets shaky then the government starts imposing its authority by other means. Mao's statement that the only real power comes from the barrel of a gun is the expression of the authority of a government either on the way up or on the way down from recognized legitimacy. Real authority is expressed by someone like Guru Dev who spent his life in the solitude of the Self. All the rest of this stuff is funny hats. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > > > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though I don't > > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is still > > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to people > > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing since > > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much on money > > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and file. > > > It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck me > that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's just > that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the buying of > titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually involves > is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule a > country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay enough > money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be able > to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. And > every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. > > It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to enter > some religious order. > > It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, holding > fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're actually > royalty. > > It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I always > knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. While I agree, I might point out that the SCA (Society for Creative Anachronism) is a real bargain if what you want is a fancy title. All you do is make up your own, make sure that the name could have existed during the time period and geographical location your persona lived in but didn't actually exist (in other words, you can't use the names of real historical characters), and voila, you're Lord Whatever of Wherever. You can choose your own costume, too. Most of the crowns one sees in SCA gatherings are *much* nicer and more tasteful than the TMO Burger King crowns. And all in all, this is just good fantasy fun, more so because at the end of the weekend or whatever, you just go home and resume your real life don't have to pretend any more. Unlike the rajas, who are stuck with pretending that their version of fancy titles and dressup *are* real life. :-) Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
On Apr 7, 2006, at 9:48 AM, markmeredith2002 wrote: > Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though I don't > consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is still > giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to people > based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing since > the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to > whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much on money > all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and file. It's interesting that you mention this, the thought just struck me that this type of thing is going on constantly in the west, it's just that most probably never aware of it. I'm referring to the buying of titles. It's actually quite a big business. What it usually involves is giving money to some foreign ruler, most who no longer rule a country or are simply members of royal families. If you pay enough money they will give you a title. This will authorize you to be able to wear certain regalia, add certain titles to your name, etc. And every now and then you can pay money to hang with various royals. It's also popular in Neo-Templar circles where you pay money to enter some religious order. It's quite expensive, but some people are really into it, holding fancy parties where they congregate and act like they're actually royalty. It just dawned on me that this is basically the same scam. I always knew it was a scam, but this puts it in perspective. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB wrote: > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock > > wrote: > > > > > > First, What is your definition of insanity.?? > > > > It would be complex, because insanity is a complex > > subject, but I'm pretty sure that one aspect of it > > would include defining as insane people who give > > themselves the titles of kings and expect others to > > honor those titles. > > Who expects anyone to honor the rajah titles, even within the TMO? Those full-time in the tmo definitely honor the titles, though I don't consider that insane. My main problem here is that MMY is still giving out aristocratic titles and positions of authority to people based on their financial contributions, which has been ongoing since the 108 days. I'm all for recognizing people who contribute to whatever cause, but I think basing a spiritual mov't so much on money all these yrs has undermined the heart value of the rank and file. > It would also include those > > stupid enough *to* honor these self-given titles. :-) > > > Who DOES honor those titles outside the ceremonies of the club that > they belong to? You're right, no-one ... but MMY has expressed genuine disappointment that Hagelin was not elected president and at other rather bizarre notions, so it seems he and others in the inner circle might take these titles very seriously. > > > Second, it may not be sane, but you cannot ignore > > > the teachings completely. That would be like throwing > > > the baby along with the bathwater. > > > > Some babies deserve to be thrown out. I'm with Shemp > > on this one -- the *only* teaching I think was *ever* > > of worth in the TM movement was how to do basic TM. > > > I think that's a good start for almost anyone, and > > thus potentially valuable. I think that everything > > else, including the siddhis and the diet advice and > > all the "Vedic" bullshit, is better thrown out. > > The Sidhis aren't of value? Amrit kalash isn't? Ayurveda isn't > sweeping the country in popularity? Ayurved is popular in new agey and wholistic circles, but not sweeping the nation IMO, and sweeping mainly in Chopra and Weil circles. Amrit kalash is sweeping the emerging diabetics section of the country. The issue for me isn't whether these alternative programs have potential value, but how the tmo has managed them - the enlightenment centers in malls plan is a joke and sweeping towards bankrupcy, but no-one dares contradicts or gives reality checks to raja wynne or MMY. > > > Third, A little bit of Snake-Oil might be > > > necessary to grease the wheels of a big movement. > > > > Who said a big movement was necessary? That's the > > question that True Believers never seem to ask them- > > selves. Many spiritual organizations (for example, > > Vipassana) have entirely volunteer organizations that > > teach for free and end up teaching ten to twenty times > > the number of people worldwide to meditate that the > > TM organization does. > > Vipassana has taught 3 million in this country? This is a really interesting pt. There has to be some middle ground between being a effective (corporate-like) marketing org. (which is necessary to actually reach people today) and being obsessed with marketing driven by greed or culty evangelical zeal (which ultimately undermines your original mission). I think the tmo balanced it pretty well in the 70s. > In my opinion, the TMO has turned > > into an entity primarily concerned with perpetuating > > itself, not with helping others. The goals of the > > organization are long forgotten; all that matters now > > is perpetuating the organization. > > At this point in time, you may be correct. OTOH, the upcoming seminar > on TM and its effect on education and ADHD is expected to have over > 100 people. True, the invited guests don't have to pay for their > lunch atthe Tucson Hilton, but even so, it's a good start. Certainly lots of potential for marketing TM via specific areas like high blood pressure, ADHD and others, but doesn't seem to be the desire of the central org. who whole heartedly believe MMY and the TMO are the only hope for world salvation right now and who want billions to achieve it. For 2 decades now these good little projects have withered away for this reason. > > > Fourth, Take what is good in all the masters and > > > leave out the irrelevant and the unnecessary. > > > > IMO, there have never been any "masters" in history, > > only people who longed to be subservient and thus > > picked someone to be subservient to so that they > > could call them "master." > Which is why I still call my ole gung fu teacher "sifu" when I see > him, and why I call my former Japanese teacher "Yamashita-sensei," > even though he hasn't been my teacher in over a year, when he calls > to say hi. Sounds like you're gi
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock > wrote: > > > > First, What is your definition of insanity.?? > > It would be complex, because insanity is a complex > subject, but I'm pretty sure that one aspect of it > would include defining as insane people who give > themselves the titles of kings and expect others to > honor those titles. Who expects anyone to honor the rajah titles, even within the TMO? It would also include those > stupid enough *to* honor these self-given titles. :-) Who DOES honor those titles outside the ceremonies of the club that they belong to? > > > Second, it may not be sane, but you cannot ignore > > the teachings completely. That would be like throwing > > the baby along with the bathwater. > > Some babies deserve to be thrown out. I'm with Shemp > on this one -- the *only* teaching I think was *ever* > of worth in the TM movement was how to do basic TM. > I think that's a good start for almost anyone, and > thus potentially valuable. I think that everything > else, including the siddhis and the diet advice and > all the "Vedic" bullshit, is better thrown out. The Sidhis aren't of value? Amrit kalash isn't? Ayurveda isn't sweeping the country in popularity? > > > Third, A little bit of Snake-Oil might be > > necessary to grease the wheels of a big movement. > > Who said a big movement was necessary? That's the > question that True Believers never seem to ask them- > selves. Many spiritual organizations (for example, > Vipassana) have entirely volunteer organizations that > teach for free and end up teaching ten to twenty times > the number of people worldwide to meditate that the > TM organization does. Vipassana has taught 3 million in this country? In my opinion, the TMO has turned > into an entity primarily concerned with perpetuating > itself, not with helping others. The goals of the > organization are long forgotten; all that matters now > is perpetuating the organization. At this point in time, you may be correct. OTOH, the upcoming seminar on TM and its effect on education and ADHD is expected to have over 100 people. True, the invited guests don't have to pay for their lunch atthe Tucson Hilton, but even so, it's a good start. > > > Fourth, Take what is good in all the masters and > > leave out the irrelevant and the unnecessary. > > IMO, there have never been any "masters" in history, > only people who longed to be subservient and thus > picked someone to be subservient to so that they > could call them "master." > Which is why I still call my ole gung fu teacher "sifu" when I see him, and why I call my former Japanese teacher "Yamashita-sensei," even though he hasn't been my teacher in over a year, when he calls to say hi. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > First, What is your definition of insanity.?? It would be complex, because insanity is a complex subject, but I'm pretty sure that one aspect of it would include defining as insane people who give themselves the titles of kings and expect others to honor those titles. It would also include those stupid enough *to* honor these self-given titles. :-) > Second, it may not be sane, but you cannot ignore > the teachings completely. That would be like throwing > the baby along with the bathwater. Some babies deserve to be thrown out. I'm with Shemp on this one -- the *only* teaching I think was *ever* of worth in the TM movement was how to do basic TM. I think that's a good start for almost anyone, and thus potentially valuable. I think that everything else, including the siddhis and the diet advice and all the "Vedic" bullshit, is better thrown out. > Third, A little bit of Snake-Oil might be > necessary to grease the wheels of a big movement. Who said a big movement was necessary? That's the question that True Believers never seem to ask them- selves. Many spiritual organizations (for example, Vipassana) have entirely volunteer organizations that teach for free and end up teaching ten to twenty times the number of people worldwide to meditate that the TM organization does. In my opinion, the TMO has turned into an entity primarily concerned with perpetuating itself, not with helping others. The goals of the organization are long forgotten; all that matters now is perpetuating the organization. > Fourth, Take what is good in all the masters and > leave out the irrelevant and the unnecessary. IMO, there have never been any "masters" in history, only people who longed to be subservient and thus picked someone to be subservient to so that they could call them "master." To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > First, What is your definition of insanity.?? It would be complex, because insanity is a complex subject, but I'm pretty sure that one aspect of it would include people who give themselves the titles of kings and expect others to honor those titles. It would also include those stupid enough *to* honor these self-given titles. :-) > Second, it may not be sane, but you cannot ignore > the teachings completely. That would be like throwing > the baby along with the bathwater. Some babies deserve to be thrown out. I'm with Shemp on this one -- the *only* teaching I think was *ever* of worth in the TM movement was how to do basic TM. I think that's a good start for almost anyone, and thus potentially valuable. I think that everything else, including the siddhis and the diet advice and all the "Vedic" bullshit, is better thrown out. > Third, A little bit of Snake-Oil might be > necessary to grease the wheels of a big movement. Who said a big movement was necessary? It has turned into an entity mostly concerned with continuing itself, not with helping others. Also, anyone who can actually *justify* "snake oil" (that is, lying) to further a goal they think is worthy has already lost his soul. > Fourth, Take what is good in all the masters and > leave out the irrelevant and the unnecessary. There have never been any "masters" in history, only people who longed to be subservient and thus picked someone to be subservient to so that they could call them "master." > TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 21:11:01 - > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp] > > > And you believe this is sane? > > > > > - > Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. > To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
First, What is your definition of insanity.?? Second, it may not be sane, but you cannot ignore the teachings completely. That would be like throwing the baby along with the bathwater. Third, A little bit of Snake-Oil might be necessary to grease the wheels of a big movement. Fourth, Take what is good in all the masters and leave out the irrelevant and the unnecessary. TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 21:11:01 -Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp] And you believe this is sane? Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "FairfieldLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I think it's the age difference. I am only 34. Having seen them on VedaVision for many years on gets to feel an affinity for them. > > Only after I looked into FairFieldLife the dirty linen came out. Could you share a bit of your background, please? Do you live in Fairfield? Did you go to MIU? Parents/family are Fairfield Ru's and that's how you got into it? Enquiring minds want to know... > > shempmcgurk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 21:19:39 -0000 > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp] > > > I guess I should have been clearer with my question: why do you feel it necessary to use these titles when writing about them? > > > > > - > Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. > To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
I think it's the age difference. I am only 34. Having seen them on VedaVision for many years on gets to feel an affinity for them. Only after I looked into FairFieldLife the dirty linen came out. shempmcgurk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 21:19:39 -0000Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp] I guess I should have been clearer with my question: why do you feel it necessary to use these titles when writing about them? Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "FairfieldLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I refered to him as, "His Majesty". Other Ministers in the Global country should be refered as Excellencies. Exc. Bevan Morris says Maharishi insists on calling them as Excellencies. I guess I should have been clearer with my question: why do you feel it necessary to use these titles when writing about them? > > shempmcgurk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 20:53:47 - > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes > > > Jason: > > May I ask you why you are preceeding Nader's name with "His Excellency" and Bevan's with "Exc"? > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock > wrote: > > I think His Majesty Dr. Nader is a Master of the Absolute, Relative and he's qualified for the Light-sabre as well. Looks like a Genuine guy. > > > Vaj wrote: > > Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2006 08:51:52 -0400 > > Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes > > > > True. And you have to be established in Brahman and > essentially a pandit of the tradition--in other words, you had to be a master of absolute and relative jnana or no light saber...so he's down on several counts. > > > > > > > - > How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. > To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I refered to him as, "His Majesty". Other Ministers > in the Global country should be refered as Excellencies. > Exc. Bevan Morris says Maharishi insists on calling them > as Excellencies. And you believe this is sane? > shempmcgurk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 20:53:47 - > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes > > > Jason: > > May I ask you why you are preceeding Nader's name with "His Excellency" and Bevan's with "Exc"? > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock > wrote: > > I think His Majesty Dr. Nader is a Master of the Absolute, Relative and he's qualified for the Light-sabre as well. Looks like a Genuine guy. > > > Vaj wrote: > > Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2006 08:51:52 -0400 > > Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes > > > > True. And you have to be established in Brahman and > essentially a pandit of the tradition--in other words, you had to be a master of absolute and relative jnana or no light saber...so he's down on several counts. > > > > > > > - > How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger's low PC-to-Phone call rates. > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM ~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes [Shemp]
I refered to him as, "His Majesty". Other Ministers in the Global country should be refered as Excellencies. Exc. Bevan Morris says Maharishi insists on calling them as Excellencies.shempmcgurk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2006 20:53:47 -Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes Jason: May I ask you why you are preceeding Nader's name with "His Excellency" and Bevan's with "Exc"? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason Spock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I think His Majesty Dr. Nader is a Master of the Absolute, Relative and he's qualified for the Light-sabre as well. Looks like a Genuine guy. > Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:> Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2006 08:51:52 -0400> Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The four classes> > True. And you have to be established in Brahman and essentially a pandit of the tradition--in other words, you had to be a master of absolute and relative jnana or no light saber...so he's down on several counts.> How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messengers low PC-to-Phone call rates. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "FairfieldLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
