OT - Looking for Information
We have a database here that we manage all of our inventory in (using mod_perl, of course), but our management is thinking of implementing Marimba. I've been all over the web and the news groups and no one seems to have anything to say. I was wondering if any of you out there on the mod_perl list, experienced as you are in the ways of management, have any ideas on where to find people who have actually used this product? ANY assistance apprecaited & I'm terribly sorry for the off topic post, Jimi
Re: mod_perl vs. C for high performance Apache modules
For some really high performance sites, compiled C is the way to go. It's faster and as long as you remove all compilers from the machines in question, it's also more secure. Having said that, I will also add that the downside is that in order to keep pace with your competitors who are writing code in Perl, PHP, and Python, it is going to cost you some serious dollars. You have to have deep pockets and in house coders to make it worth looking at, which normally limits this kind of thing to the Fortune 100. For the entire rest of the planet, perl is a perfectly good solution. IMHO, Jimi - Original Message - From: "Perrin Harkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Thomas Eibner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "Jeff Yoak" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 3:32 PM Subject: Re: mod_perl vs. C for high performance Apache modules > > So I'm trying to show that mod_perl doesn't suck, and that it is, in fact, > > a reasonable choice. Though within these limits it is still reasonable to > > point out the development cycle, emotionally it is the least compelling > > form of argument, because the investor has a hard time removing from > > consideration that given our particular situation, there was a very fast > > solution in using his C-based routines. > > Well, that is the primary reason for using Perl over C, and you really have > to count maintenance and the relative likelihood of C-ish bugs like buffer > overflows as part of it. > > Well-coded C should be faster than Perl, but Perl is fast enough for nearly > any web-based application. If this guy saw CPU spikes, he probably had > something else wrong, like running out of memory. > > You might find this article aboout C and Perl performance useful: > http://www.perl.com/pub/a/2001/06/27/ctoperl.html > > - Perrin >
Re: load balancing on apache
My recommendation is that you do none of the things that you are looking at for optimal performance. Instead, opt for a seperate hardware solution. We went through this about a year ago when we were architecting a solution for my employers site. Admittedly, takes more traffic than you do, but we found that the dedicated hardware device offers many advantages (including layer 7 routing capablity) which we have found to be extremely useful and well worth the extra cabbage. Cisco (and several other folks as well) make some fine load balancing hardware devices. Alteon makes one, I know . We evaluated it, but we got a better price and better support from Cisco so we went with the CSS even though I was as impressed with their device. I'm sure that there are lower end alternative, but it depends on what kind of load balancing you want to do. Do you want to do "round robin"? If not, then what criteria do you want to use? - Original Message - From: "Steven Lembark" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 3:15 AM Subject: Re: load balancing on apache > > > -- Hemant Singh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Hi All > > > > I am planning to host an application and its size is going to be big one > > , so expect the concurrent number of connection s to be around 2200.To > > combat the same , want to perform load sharing on 3-4 servers.So the ide > > is to put one machine on external IP and this machine , after receiving > > the requests would forward them to any of the other three machines having > > the application deployed and running on the same environment.Pls suggest > > how can i achieve this on apache. > > Randal Schwartz had a good article on this about a year > ago. You can use the re-write phase to balance the load > w/in Apache if you want to. Alternatives include round- > robin DNS and separate load balancing software. > > -- > Steven Lembark 2930 W. Palmer > Workhorse Computing Chicago, IL 60647 > +1 800 762 1582
Re: Hi
It's not him, it's a virus. - Original Message - From: "Ask Bjoern Hansen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Robert Landrum" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "mod_perl" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 6:57 PM Subject: Re: Hi > On Tue, 4 Dec 2001, Robert Landrum wrote: > > > If this guy is going to be sending us shit all night, I suggest we > > deactivate his account. > > I have unsubscribed him. In general it's much more useful to send > suggestions like that to [EMAIL PROTECTED] or [EMAIL PROTECTED] > than to the list. > > > - ask > > -- > ask bjoern hansen, http://ask.netcetera.dk/ !try; do(); > more than a billion impressions per week, http://valueclick.com >
Re: [OT]: Re: Just a few good men? Was: ignored (again)
Gunther, I think that mentions in publications like Ziff-Davis, CMP.net, maybe SysAdmin. However, the techies know mod_perl and love it. It's the PHB's that we need to convince of the merit of our chosen platform. Therefore, it also needs to make it into the rags that management reads like Forbes, Barron, New York Times, etc. SO if anyone knows of any reporters for these rags, we need to educate them so they can write a really good article. And the articles need to keep coming. Then maybe the PHB's will fall into line. Just an idea. Jimi - Original Message - From: Gunther Birznieks To: Matt Sergeant ; Joachim Zobel Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2001 6:24 AM Subject: [OT]: Re: Just a few good men? Was: ignored (again) At 07:44 AM 7/5/2001 +, Matt Sergeant wrote:>On 04 Jul 2001 17:31:24 +0200, Joachim Zobel wrote:> >> > Hi.> >> > The question is: Are a few good developers all we need? If this is the > case> > we can safely ignore to be ignored (we have them).> >> > It is OK to be one of the few people to know the leading Apache > development> > system. But it has serious drawbacks. Where I work people are migrating> > from server side javascript to java. With better Perl marketing they might> > migrate from Perl/CGI to mod_perl and my work would be more fun (I do> > consider changing my> > job an option, but I like the people I work with). It is however> > frustrating to leave work, get on the tram, take out my laptop and do it> > better than I did the 8h before.> >> > So do we want to be "Enterprise" and "Industry Standard" and such crap?>>>Yes, we do. But I don't think it's enough to convince people to move to>"mod_perl". They want to move to a better framework. I'm sure you know>which one I favour :-) Sadly most people *still* see Perl on the web as>CGI, as printing out your HTML from code, etc. It needs more articles in>the right places to fix that sort of misconception.>>Matt.This is really off topic.Anyway, so what are the right places for those articles? Microsoft Systems Journal? :)And what should we do to get the articles in the right places?__Gunther Birznieks ([EMAIL PROTECTED])eXtropia - The Open Web Technology Companyhttp://www.eXtropia.com/
Re: mod_perl bof Oreilly Conference TShirts
Gunther, We are still interested in doing the design. If a corporate sponsor for the printing will step forward, we'd be happy to work their logo into the design. Jimi - Original Message - From: Gunther Birznieks To: mod_perl list Sent: Saturday, June 16, 2001 10:17 AM Subject: mod_perl bof Oreilly Conference TShirts A month ago I posed a question about TShirts for mod_perl BOF.One group of people did volunteer to do the design and posted interest on here. So if they are still up for it, it would be awesome to start discussing ideas/proof of concept.However, before such a thing can be discussed, unfortunately no one has come up to be able to sponsor the cost for the T-Shirts. So I figure I would raise the question again in case someone has a company that would be willing to corporate sponsor such a thing.__Gunther Birznieks ([EMAIL PROTECTED])eXtropia - The Open Web Technology Companyhttp://www.eXtropia.com/
Fw: Fw: Fw: OReilly Mod_Perl BoF TShirts
Gunther, I am a web designer and I have a friend who is a graphics designer (commercial artist who happens to specialize in designs to be screen printed). We'd like to volunteer to help out with the T-shirt design. We'd be pretty happy with some fairly obvious recognition in exchange. Jimi - Original Message - From: Gunther Birznieks To: Jimi Thompson Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2001 9:27 AM Subject: Re: Fw: Fw: OReilly Mod_Perl BoF TShirts No, we don't have a design yet as far I know. I am not really organizing it. I just thought I would post quickly to see what ideas people pop up because at ApacheCon/Santa Clara the issue of TShirts was only brought up the day before the conference.If you all can come up with a great design, that would be wonderful!I would recommending posting your intent to volunteer more publically so that whomever was organizing this in general can state what is needed. I would imagine if you or your friend can do the graphics art portion, then what is left is the monetary side plus someone to actually submit the shirt design to a printer.Thanks, GuntherAt 10:12 PM 5/14/01 -0500, you wrote:>Gunther,>>Do you have design yet? I have a commercial artist who specializes in >designs to be screen printed who would like to submit a design for the >t-shirt and/or graphics for the site.>>Jimi>>- Original Message ->From: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Michael K. Jones>To: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Jimi Thompson>Sent: Sunday, May 13, 2001 11:14 PM>Subject: Re: Fw: OReilly Mod_Perl BoF TShirts>>Let's do it, you'll have to help me. Let me see what they already have,>and we'll figure out what perl folk'll wanna see on their chests.>>xxxM>>Jimi Thompson wrote:>>Here's your chance to work with some really good people and to get your >>work in front of a bunch of people who would appreciate it. I've dealt >>with Gunther and Matt Seargant (who does the take23.org site and AxKit) >>for a while, albeit all on line. You tend to find out what kind >>of person you are dealing with when you have flame wars :) over >>differences of opinion. Just a thought.>>- Original Message ->>From: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Gunther Birznieks>>To: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>mod_perl listSent: Sunday, May 13, 2001 >>4:44 AMSubject: OReilly Mod_Perl BoF TShirts>> OK, so there are a lot of mod_perl talks this time..(YAY!)>>>>But what about the BoF. Will anyone be sponsoring a T-Shirt and/or design>>this time around? I figured I would ask because I know we ended up talking>>about this like a week before ApacheCon/Santa Clara and it seemed like it>>was too late.>>>>Maybe a couple months before the next conference would allow us to get a>>design and sponsor.>>>>The ideal(?) is also to perhaps tie this into spiffing up the mod_perl>>website (as people keep talking about) with graphics that would be similar>>in look-and-feel to the t-shirt.>>>>>>__>>Gunther Birznieks >>(<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>[EMAIL PROTECTED])>>eXtropia - The Open Web Technology Company>><http://www.eXtropia.com/>http://www.eXtropia.com/>>__>Gunther Birznieks ([EMAIL PROTECTED])>eXtropia - The Open Web Technology Company>http://www.eXtropia.com/
Re: security
Probably a stupid question, but wouldn't named virtuals solve this problem? I'm not all that familiar with MySQL, but we have a similar set up here with slightly different technology - Solaris, Netscape Enterprise Server, and Oracle. I should think that you could replicate this using BSD, Apache, and MySQL, but please don't quote me on that. Then again, we authenticate via LDAP and some of our other parameters vary from what you have as well. Thanks, Stas Bekman wrote: > On Wed, 28 Feb 2001, Gustavo Vieira Goncalves Coelho Rios wrote: > > > Hi folks! > > > > I have a FreeBSD server configured as a http server, running apache. > > This installation includes mod_perl+EmbPerl, mod_php4 mod_cgi and > > mod_fastcgi. Some of my users will be using mysql for database. The > > problem is that this scenario requires sensitive information inside > > file. This means no problem when these users write their dymanic pages > > inside a compiled program. I can chmod a-rw and nobody will be able to > > take away user/password from a compiled program. The problem happens > > when write their php or embperl pages! > > > > the key user\password are kept inside this file, so anyone can uses an > > editor to retrieve the user mysql account. I resolve this problem > > running php on secure mode and chgrping the php file the same user as > > the http process and removing other flags file access (g-rwx). So nobody > > besides the owner of the file (or the http process) will be able to read > > it. > > > > since php have some security facilities, like: if the file owner id != > > the file the script is trying to open => fails. > > My problem is with perl: how to solve such a problem in a perl > > environment? > > Does mod perl allows any kind of security, to prevent ones writing > > script to read others files? > > > > > > PS: All cgi runs through suexec, so even cgi are not able to run the > > script, ok? > > At this moment anybody who has an access to mod_perl server can read any > data which is accessible by the same server. suexec is not an option > because of process persistance. > > I understand that you want to store the SQL engine authentication info, > and users not to know each other's access credentials. The only solution > at this point is to either trust your users not to abuse each other, or > run a separate server for each one :( > > _ > Stas Bekman JAm_pH -- Just Another mod_perl Hacker > http://stason.org/ mod_perl Guide http://perl.apache.org/guide > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://apachetoday.com http://logilune.com/ > http://singlesheaven.com http://perl.apache.org http://perlmonth.com/ -- Jimi Thompson "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky."
IDE for Perl
Can anyone tell me if there's a good IDE for PERL? I have some big projects coming and having the debug/testing etc. would be sooo bonus. I looked at ActivePerl, but was hoping that maybe there was something else either better or cheaper. I wish Adobe and Macromedia would make a Linux version of everything. Then I'd never have to touch "the other OS" again. -- Jimi Thompson Web Master Link.com "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky."
Re: Cannot make mod_perl on &&*@!* RH Linux :(
Have any of you tried Apache Toolbox? I just configured Apache with mod_ssl, mod_perl, etc under RedHat 7 in about an hour on an old Pentium 133. It works fine. www.apachetoolbox.com Doug MacEachern wrote: > On Wed, 31 Jan 2001, Nick Tonkin wrote: > > > > > Thanks for the suggestion, Doug, but no go. > > simply looks like you need to install openssl-0.9.6. was not included in > the rh7.0 distro that i installed. -- Jimi Thompson "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky."
Re: problem to configure perl with apache
I would suggest that you visit www.apachetoolbox.com and get the toolbox. Use that to install. Since it uses sources that are known to work with each other, it should be relatively painless. It should come off without a hitch. Also, next time you post, you might want to mention what your platform is (Linux, Unix, NT, etc.). You also need to be accurate about what versions you have installed. I'm pretty sure you "fat fingered" the Apache version. Perl hasn't been version 1 since...well, let's just say that version 1 is older than I am :) and leave it at that. I'd also suggest that if you are having problems with the httpd.conf you get a copy of O'Reilly's Apache The Definitive Guide. You can get it for cheap at www.bookpool.com. The whole book is pretty much devoted to the httpd.conf and goes into it in far more detail than you can get from a mailing list. HTH, "initiative.fr : COUTEL Jean-Francois" wrote: > Hello It is my first install of perl and i have problem I have install > APACHE 10.3.14 with APXS, PHP 4.0.3 pl1 with APXS, mysql and > mod_perl-1.24_01 with apxs apache, php and mysql are okperl is install > but i can't use it can you help me about- configuration of httpd.conf > for perl- other configuration file?- file exemple to > test Thanks Jean-Francois [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jimi Thompson Web Master Link.com "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky."
[OT] ROFLMAO Web Site
For everyone who's every been presented with one of those stupid "motivational" posters, mugs, etc. when you would have rather been given what they spent for the piece of crap.. http://www.despair.com/
Re: Looking for a new distro
Jamie, I'm sorry you are having problems with it. I am running it here and it's fine. I used Apache Toolbox to install it though, which you will probably want to take a look at for future reference. The site is at www.apachetoolbox.com. It will install Apache and most of the major mod's from source. It's easy to compile and then all you have to do is adjust the conf files. HTH - Next time :) Jamie Krasnoo wrote: > Ok, I've had it with RH 7.0. Too many problems. What Linux distro are some > of you using with Apache 1.3.14 and mod perl 1.24_01? > > Jamie -- Jimi Thompson Web Master Link.com "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky."
Re: Specific limiting examples (was RE: Apache::SizeLimit for unsharedRAM ???)
I think that the problem here is that we've asked for more info and he hasn't supplied it. He's given us generics and as a result has gotten generic answers. 1) What are the average hits per second that you are projecting this box to handle? 2) What is the peak hits per second that you are project this box to handle? 3) We know you have a gig of ram, but give us info on the rest of the platform? 4) What's your OS like? Solaris, AIX, HP-UX, Linux, FreeBSD, etc. & which version and/or flavor 5) What other processes are you running? 6) Do you have a Database? Which one? A gig of ram is nothing to Oracle 6a) Will be running queries constantly or will you be caching a lot? 7) What other modules are you running? PhP? SpeedyCGI? Axkit? Cocoon? In short what is the server DOING at any given moment. Until folks have a feel for this no one is going to be able to offer you any insight beyond what you already have. Perrin Harkins wrote: > On Thu, 11 Jan 2001, Rob Bloodgood wrote: > > Second of all, with the literally thousands of pages of docs necessary to > > understand in order to be really mod_perl proficient > > Most of the documentation is really reference-oriented. All the important > concepts in mod_perl performance tuning fit in a few pages of the guide. > > > I mean, 1GB is a lot of ram. > > It's all relative. If you have significant traffic on your site, 1GB RAM > might not be nearly enough. > > > And finally, I was hoping to prod somebody into posting snippets of > > CODE > > and > > httpd.conf > > > > that describe SPECIFIC steps/checks/modules/configs designed to put a > > reasonable cap on resources so that we can serve millions of hits w/o > > needing a restart. > > I think you're making this much harder than it needs to be. It's this > simple: > > MaxClients 30 > > PerlFixupHandler Apache::SizeLimit > > use Apache::SizeLimit; > # sizes are in KB > $Apache::SizeLimit::MAX_PROCESS_SIZE = 3; > $Apache::SizeLimit::CHECK_EVERY_N_REQUESTS = 5; > > > If you're paranoid, you can throw BSD::Resource in the mix to catch > things like infinite loops in your code. > > None of this will make your code faster or your server bigger. It will > just prevent it from going into swap. Having too much traffic can still > hose your site in lots of other ways that have nothing to do with swap and > everything to do with the design of your application and the hardware you > run it on, but there's nothing mod_perl-specific about those issues. > > - Perrin -- Jimi Thompson Web Master Link.com "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky."
Re: mod-perl on Solaris 2.6
You need to run, do not walk, immediately to www.sun.com and apply all of the Solaris patches to your machine. Siddhartha Jain wrote: > > Hi, > > I have been trying to compile mod-perl (various 1.21 to 1.24_01 ) on Solaris > 2.6 with apache (various 1.3.11 to 1.3.14) with perl-5.005003 and also > perl-5.6. If i compile it statically, i get a core dump on running apache > and if i compile it via apxs, i get a "Symbol not found main, in libperl.so" > error. I had compiled perl-5.6 using Solaris's malloc and later i compiled > perl-5.005 with perl's malloc but nothing helped. I am mostly at my wits > ends having tried all sorts of combinations. Could someone help me? > > Siddhartha Jain begin:vcard n:Thompson;Jimi tel;pager:877-309-2784 tel;cell:817-980-7863 tel;work:817-619-3612 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:http://www.link.com org:Link.com;Unix Team, IT version:2.1 email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] title:Web Master adr;quoted-printable:;;2200 Arlington Downs Rd =0D=0AMail Stop 148=0D=0A;Arlington;TX;76011;USA fn:Jimi Thompson end:vcard
Re: Apache::Reload and environment variables
Mark, If the variable ORACLE_HOME doesn't change why not just set it as an environment variable outside the program and export it? Mark Doyle wrote: > > Greetings, > > I tried using Apache::Reload: > > PerlSetEnv ORACLE_HOME /oracle/app/oracle/product/8.0.3/ > PerlModule Apache::DBI > [...] > PerlModule Apache::Reload > PerlInitHandler Apache::Reload > PerlSetVar ReloadAll Off > > but when I do, the error log gets filled with > "ORACLE_HOME not set!" > > Only one module (one that doesn't use DBI) has a 'use > Apache::Reload" in it. > > Any one know why this happens? > > Cheers, > Mark begin:vcard n:Thompson;Jimi tel;pager:877-309-2784 tel;cell:817-980-7863 tel;work:817-619-3612 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:hww adr:;; version:2.1 email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] fn:Jimi Thompson end:vcard
Re: [heh] Larry Wall on CNBC
Only from someone on AOL ;) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > We need to see Larry Wall on CNBC taking questions like > > "So it's free?" >"yes" > "And you don't get any money for it?" >"Correct" > "And you keep working on it?" >"That's my perogative"short Bobby Brown move> > "And you don't charge anyone?" >"S/he catches on quick, don't s/he folks?" > "Does anyone use Perl?" >"Probably more than any other language on the web" > "You mean any free language, right?" >"No, including the ones that cost thousands of dollars to license" > "It doesn't work with anything else, does it?" >"You couldn't name something it won't work with." > "What can't I name?" > begin:vcard n:Thompson;Jimi tel;pager:877-309-2784 tel;cell:817-980-7863 tel;work:817-619-3612 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:hww adr:;; version:2.1 email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] fn:Jimi Thompson end:vcard
Mod_perl vs mod_php
Does anyone have any mod_perl vs. mod_php benchmarks? Jimi begin:vcard n:Thompson;Jimi tel;pager:877-309-2784 tel;cell:817-980-7863 tel;work:817-619-3612 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:hww adr:;; version:2.1 email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] fn:Jimi Thompson end:vcard
Re: 'why mod_perl' rebate anybody?
Count me in! I'll help! Stas Bekman wrote: > > Er. I think you mean 'rebuttal'. > > I don't know what kind of rebate anyone's expecting from mod_perl, since it's free. > > In fact, more people might be expecting to pay for it ;-) > > So you've know my secret now... my English sucks... please don't tell > anybody... Now you start wondering how he [me] is capable of writing a > book... in English... well it's easy, I write it in Russian using English > words and a few folks are translating it to the proper English... cvs > helps a lot :) > > Anyway at least the subject has pulled attention to the post (at least > among our American readers :) > > So anybody wants to write a rebuttal? Don't you care about making mod_perl > more known at least in the web developers forum? I suppose this kind of > magazines are read by IT people. > > _ > Stas Bekman JAm_pH -- Just Another mod_perl Hacker > http://stason.org/ mod_perl Guide http://perl.apache.org/guide > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://apachetoday.com http://logilune.com/ > http://singlesheaven.com http://perl.apache.org http://perlmonth.com/ -- Jimi Thompson Web Master L3 communications "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." begin:vcard n:Thompson;Jimi tel;pager:877-309-2784 tel;cell:817-980-7863 tel;work:817-619-3612 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:hww adr:;; version:2.1 email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] fn:Jimi Thompson end:vcard
Apache / ModPerl and IPv6
I know this is off topic, but does anyone know if the config files in Apache support IPv6 addresses? -- Jimi Thompson Web Master L3 communications "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." begin:vcard n:Thompson;Jimi tel;pager:877-309-2784 tel;cell:817-980-7863 tel;work:817-619-3612 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:hww adr:;; version:2.1 email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] fn:Jimi Thompson end:vcard
Re: [certification]
See - I KNEW IT!!! You aren't a PHB. You have to look at this like a PHB. PHB's don't care if the paper means anything relevant. PHB's live for Plausible Deniability and Glory Hogging. If they can't take credit for it, they don't want to get blamed for it either. If anything goes wrong, they want to be able to say that he had so I thought he was qualified. On the other hand, if it does well then he can then take the credit because the person he hired had . Heck, I got started in the IT business professionally years ago because I fooled a PHB into letting me take over his network while working on a degree in Biochemistry. He actually thought it had something to do with computers. Geeks know its just paper and that paper three appropriate uses (for writing on, paper airplanes, and TP). Geeks know that paper doesn't pass for credentials. The PHB's haven't gotten around to that idea yet. They probably never will. Personally, I don't mind getting the paper. It usually means that the PHB's are willing to put more zero's on my paycheck because I have acquired another piece of paper. Getting more zero's from the PHB's is a good thing. Eric Strovink wrote: > You smoked me out -- lots of hair, all limp. And yes, I am a "geeks dream boss." >I'm a > geek. > > Jimi Thompson wrote: > > > Eric, > > > > You fail to understand that while you are probably a geeks dream boss, you are not >the > > average PHB. Heck, your hair is probably limp ;). The idea here is to gain >acceptance > > and even status with the PHB. PHB's like paper. It doesn't matter if its a useful > > piece of paper or not (MCSE's are a PRIME example of a useless paper - as are many > > college degrees). They live for paper. Its job security for them. It makes them >feel > > warm and fuzzy inside. It also allows them to cover their butts should anything go > > wrong with said hire-ee. > > > > Eric Strovink wrote: > > > > > Somebody wrote: > > > > > > > > If I'm way off base, please let me know. I'm spending considerable > > > > > brain power on this idea and if I'm wasting it, I need to know. I > > > > > don't have much spare brain power and I could use it to try to figure > > > > > out my wife . . . > > > > > > You're way off base. Figure out the wife. I've never hired a "certified" >engineer, > > > and almost without exception the ones I've come across were empty sacks of shit. > > > > > > In fact, I've had great success doing exactly the opposite, and *hiring the wrong > > > guy*. Take a person who's been writing compiler back ends for the last 10 years. > > > This person is constantly pigeonholed by every headhunter out there into yet >another > > > compiler job, and he'd give his eye teeth to do something different. You hire >him > > > for something completely different, and he ends up being the most enthusiastic >and > > > productive person you've got, because everything's new and exciting to him. And > > > believe me, folks, if he can write the back end to a compiler, he can figure out > > > mod_perl. > > > > > > Or, I could hire Ferd over here, with a limp certificate from Randal saying he's > > > passed some clever little test on the six most obscure ways to . Uh, no > > > thanks. > > > > > > - > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > -- > > Jimi Thompson > > Web Master > > L3 communications > > > > "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." -- Jimi Thompson Web Master L3 communications "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Dependent modules
Aaron, That would be a comment from me :) On Sparc-Solaris 2.6, getting CPAN to install the dependent modules or even tell you what they are doesn't always (read - seldom - at least in my experience) work. In the cases where it does at least tell you which one, there are several modules with nearly identical names. The descriptions are also often virtually identical as well. In which case, one is left to resolve the module dependencies by hand. Module::A Possibly dependent on Module::B, Module::C, or Module::D Module B is possibly dependent on B1, B2, or B3 Module C is possibly dependent on C1, C2, or C3 Module D is possibly dependent on D1, D2, or D3 B1 is dependent on ba, bb, or bc B2 is dependent on bd, be, or bf B3 is dependent on bg, bh, or bi Same for Modules C and D. So, with out doing some extensive empirical testing, which combination works... See why this gets frustrating.. Which means that you get to do a lot of work to find out which combination will work because you have to work your way down and resolve the initial dependency which may be down at say , B1/bb/Bg/b7. before any of the higher level things will work. It rather quickly becomes a royal pima. This is why CPAN needs to list it on the web site. Aaron Johnson wrote: > I saw reference in some of the advocacy thread to having some way to > list what modules are dependent on others. When I use CPAN (the module > not the site) to install some modules it automatically installs the > other required modules, but I assume this only works with modules that > are on CPAN (the site not the module). If a module has a dependency on > an item outside of CPAN shouldn't CPAN allow for a hook or something > that can tell CPAN where to look for a dependency? > > I also notice that not all modules will auto install dependent modules, > i.e. Apache::ASP. But most will. I suppose this is all documented some > where, but since I don't have anything on CPAN currently I haven't > really looked. > > Did I miss understand the comments inside of the other thread? > > Aaron Johnson > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jimi Thompson Web Master L3 communications "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [certification]
Eric, You fail to understand that while you are probably a geeks dream boss, you are not the average PHB. Heck, your hair is probably limp ;). The idea here is to gain acceptance and even status with the PHB. PHB's like paper. It doesn't matter if its a useful piece of paper or not (MCSE's are a PRIME example of a useless paper - as are many college degrees). They live for paper. Its job security for them. It makes them feel warm and fuzzy inside. It also allows them to cover their butts should anything go wrong with said hire-ee. Eric Strovink wrote: > Somebody wrote: > > > > If I'm way off base, please let me know. I'm spending considerable > > > brain power on this idea and if I'm wasting it, I need to know. I > > > don't have much spare brain power and I could use it to try to figure > > > out my wife . . . > > You're way off base. Figure out the wife. I've never hired a "certified" engineer, > and almost without exception the ones I've come across were empty sacks of shit. > > In fact, I've had great success doing exactly the opposite, and *hiring the wrong > guy*. Take a person who's been writing compiler back ends for the last 10 years. > This person is constantly pigeonholed by every headhunter out there into yet another > compiler job, and he'd give his eye teeth to do something different. You hire him > for something completely different, and he ends up being the most enthusiastic and > productive person you've got, because everything's new and exciting to him. And > believe me, folks, if he can write the back end to a compiler, he can figure out > mod_perl. > > Or, I could hire Ferd over here, with a limp certificate from Randal saying he's > passed some clever little test on the six most obscure ways to . Uh, no > thanks. > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jimi Thompson Web Master L3 communications "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Certification
When MCSE's were just starting to be issued, no one thought that they were important either. However, the PHB's who do the hiring said "Oo, you have a sheet of paper from M$ that says your ok. You're hired!" My point is that if you are trying to appeal to the businesses, please look at what has worked in the past for others and see if it can work for Perl as well. Perl needs to move out of the hacker market and in to the mainstream if it is to thrive. In order to move into the mainstream and take its rightful place with Java, it's go to have a perception change. I think that certification would certainly help. Where can I go to get mine? John Reid wrote: > > > If I'm way off base, please let me know. I'm spending considerable > > > brain power on this idea and if I'm wasting it, I need to know. I > > > don't have much spare brain power and I could use it to try to figure > > > out my wife . . . > > > > Ask yourself this question: Are you in need of a mod_perl job? If so, I'm > > willing to bet that there are employers who would snap you up in a second. > > > > As has been said a few times here, certification is pretty pointless > > unless you need some distinguishing factor. With mod_perl, the > > distinguishing factor is that you're available! > > This is an interesting thread. Just one point though ... just who is > available? Are they any good? Have they any experience? Are they telling the > truth? > > Certification may be an issue that deserves careful attention, before idiots > go and try to implement mod_perl solutions, make a complete pig's ear and > give us all a bad name. > > John Reid > OpenConnect (Ireland) Ltd > - > You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear ... > ... but it does make a rather attractive novelty luggage tag. > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.215 / Virus Database: 101 - Release Date: 16/11/2000 > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jimi Thompson Web Master L3 communications "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Smart installing (Re: mod_perl advocacy project resurrection)
Marc, In order to be kind to newbie's, you will need to mention tar and gnu zip which don't come standard on some flavors of Unix. In my case Solaris 2.6 only has tar. Zip must be installed. Also, you are going to need to at least point them to documentation. Maybe we could make extra $$$ selling tech support for your bundle (a la Red Hat)??? The extra cabbage could go to buying ads. I think the goal of the "total installation" should be something akin to M$ Office if you are aiming at the corporate/business user. PHB's like things that they feel like they can control. I have no idea how you could idiot proof this, though, unless you set LOTS of defaults. Marc Spitzer wrote: > I don't know about that, getting the correct version of perl, mod_perl. > apache and all the preconfigured modules together and configuring cpan... as > apposed to installing DBD::Postgres(uses XS), hell I could stick gcc > postgres and open ldap in the package. krap I just gave my self more work. > Here is the list so far: > apache > postgres > openldap > perl > mod_perl > libnet > configure CPAN > DBI > DBD::CSV > DBD:Pg > BerkleyDB 3.x (openLDAP), this could cause a problem 2.x in in some linuxs > glibc, I think > berkelyDB perl module > GCC > gmake > > This gives you a nice base system and everything you need to add stuff to > it. > > Now I have 2 questions for the list: > 1: is this a good idea or a waste of my time > 2: did I forget anything > > marc > > - Original Message - > From: barries <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: Marc Spitzer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Cc: mod_perl list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Marc Spitzer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Thursday, 7. December 2000 7:12 > Subject: Re: Smart installing (Re: mod_perl advocacy project resurrection) > > > On Thu, Dec 07, 2000 at 12:30:53AM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: > > > the only thing I would add is DBI and DBD:::CSV, > > > > No joins. Therefore not very useful. > > > > > you get a basic prototyping > > > db and you can add other drivers as you need them. And the package > needs to > > > specify the version of gcc it was built with, so you can add dso's > and/or > > > perl XS modules. > > > > If you're doing that, you've graduated yourself to recompiling the whole > > kit and kabootle. > > > > - Barrie > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jimi Thompson Web Master L3 communications "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: mod_perl advocacy project resurrection
Matt, Everything required to make the module work ought to be included in the package or at least cross referenced to it. I have been having a problem in which I have had to manually resolve module dependencies on a Solaris 2.6 box. It went through several layers with several candidates for each layer. It's taken me a couple of months to get here. If you want corporate america to buy in to Perl, which seems to be the general gist of this thread, and not to loose any of the freedom you have in coding Perl, then you are going to have to find a way to make Perl easier to use. If it stays this hard, most employers are not going to let their precious IT staff devote time and energy to doing things in Perl that they can buy off the shelf elsewhere. It's really been an ugly process. My suggestion, I think that CPAN could make things a whole lot easier by simply asking the folks who wrote the module to link to the things it's dependent on. I also think that CPAN could make a good many folks lives easier by listing system requirements, when known. My point is that if things have been this bad for me, an end user (Joe Small Business Owner) would have given long ago and used php for his web site because he can probably figure that out. Matt Sergeant wrote: > On Tue, 5 Dec 2000, Jeffrey W. Baker wrote: > > > I haven't looked at AO or AxKit, but if I can untar either one of them and > > just get to work, that will rule. > > You can't, but thats because I believe in the CPAN model - use pre-written > components. I don't believe shipping all those components in AxKit (and > there are a fair number required) is the right solution. Maybe I'm > mistaken. > > -- > > > /||** Director and CTO ** >//||** AxKit.com Ltd ** ** XML Application Serving ** > // ||** http://axkit.org ** ** XSLT, XPathScript, XSP ** > // \\| // ** Personal Web Site: http://sergeant.org/ ** > \\// > //\\ > // \\ > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jimi Thompson Web Master L3 communications "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Dealing with spiders
gt; > usage reports. I know I could post-process the logs before running the web > > reports, but it would be much more fun to use mod_perl to catch and block > > them on the fly. > > > > BTW -- I have blocked spiders on the fly before -- I used to have a decoy > > in robots.txt that, if followed, would add that IP to the blocked list. It > > was interesting to see one spider get caught by that trick because it took > > thousands and thousands of 403 errors before that spider got a clue that it > > was blocked on every request. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Bill Moseley > > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- > Yours sincerely, > Met vriendelijke groeten, > > Marko van der Puil http://www.renesse.com >[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jimi Thompson Web Master L3 communications "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: compiling modperl on alpha
Try getting rid of Perl 5.6 and using 5.005. This has worked for me and for several other folks running other flavors of Unix. Didier Godefroy wrote: > More troubles in this saga to install mod_perl with apache: > > After building mod_perl static with apache on DU4.0b and getting no errors > (so far), I tried the same thing on Tru64 5.1 and I'm still getting this: > > ld -shared -expect_unresolved "*" -O4 -msym -std -s -L/usr/local/lib -o > libperl.so mod_perl.lo perlxsi.lo perl_config.lo perl_util.l > o perlio.lo mod_perl_opmask.lo Apache.lo Constants.lo ModuleConfig.lo > Log.lo URI.lo Util.lo Connection.lo Server.lo File.lo Table.l > o -Wl,-rpath,/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.6.0/alpha-dec_osf/CORE -L/usr/local/lib > /usr/local/lib/perl5/5.6.0/alpha-dec_osf/auto/DynaLoade > r/DynaLoader.a -L/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.6.0/alpha-dec_osf/CORE -lperl -lbind > -lgdbm -ldbm -ldb -lm -liconv > ld: > Invalid flag usage: Wl,-rpath,/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.6.0/alpha-dec_osf/CORE, > -Wx,-option must appear after -_SYSTYPE_SVR4 > ld: Usage: ld [options] file [...] > > I'm trying again to do it static, I thought that stuff wasn't used in the > static build! What could be the difference between DU4.0b and Tru64 5.1 that > could cause this? > Both systems have Perl 5.6.0 installed (from source), I'm using cc and there > is no GNU ld in either. Apache is 1.3.14 and mod_perl 1.24_01 > > -- > Didier Godefroy > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > ----- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Jimi Thompson Web Master L3 communications "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: compiling modperl on alpha
I suspect that this has something to do with using Perl 5.6.0. I and several others have had problems getting mod_perl to work with this version of Perl under various flavors of Unix (Solaris, AIX, HP-UX). We have all also found that if you roll Perl back to 5.005 that this appears to solve the problem. "Jeremy A. Mates" wrote: > On Thu, 16 Nov 2000, Didier Godefroy wrote: > > GNU ld isn't on either system and the error is the exact same on both, > > they seem to all this in common: > > > > -Wl,-rpath,/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.6.0/alpha-dec_osf/CORE' > [snip] > > dlsrc=dl_dlopen.xs, dlext=so, d_dlsymun=undef, ccdlflags=' > > -Wl,-rpath,/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.6.0/alpha-dec_osf/CORE' > > cccdlflags=' ', lddlflags='-shared -expect_unresolved "*" -O4 -msym -std > > -s -L/usr/local/lib' > > Hmmm... the Digitals I have share similar ccdlflags statements. Did you > install perl 5.6.0 from scratch or via a package of some kind? (If via > package, the people who built the package may have used a different ld or > had different environment settings from yours.) > > You might be able to pass the flag ld appeared to be complaining about > with the following trick: > > $ LDFLAGS="-_SYSTYPE_SVR4" command_that_fails > > Which should work for Bourne-related shells. The ld man page didn't > appear contain anything useful, so I'm guessing moreso than usual at this > point. :) > > You could also try asking on the tru64-unix-managers list: > > http://www.ornl.gov/cts/archives/mailing-lists/ > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=subscribe> > > > What is the problem with doing that? I tried compiling it statically > > first, but I get other types of errors when running the tests, it > > always fails. The httpd is running but the tests won't, and the log > > doesn't say anything that helps to find out why. What other choices > > are there then? > > If static fails, then you can probably get away with DSO if you keep the > httpd process memory usage down with various directives. There's more on > this just recently in this list's archives, as I recall... > > -- > Jeremy Mates > http://www.sial.org/ -- Jimi Thompson Web Master L3 communications "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Apache Modules in General
It is me or has anyone noticed a definite LACK of information on how to modify the httpd.conf for the various modules in order to get them working??? Why is it that no one has ever posted an actual working copy of an httpd.conf file for mod_perl in its various incarnations? Could it be because one doesn't exist? I have also noticed a large amount of MISSING information regarding dependencies among the various modules. I think it's all a hoax and no one else can get the stupid thing to work either ;) You know, Santa Claus, Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy, Working Mod_perl Totally frustrated, Jimi Thompson "It's the same thing we do every night, Pinky." begin:vcard n:Thompson;Jimi tel;cell:817-980-7863 tel;work:817-619-3612 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:hww adr:;; version:2.1 email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] fn:Jimi Thompson end:vcard
Probably a really stupid question
Problem - all files ending in the .pl extension display source code rather than being executed. In addition to not seeing the .pl's as executable I get this message when I try to start apache - callmaster% apachectl start Syntax error on line 793 of /usr/local/apache/conf/httpd.conf: Invalid command 'PerlHandler', perhaps mis-spelled or defined by a module not included in the server configuration apachectl start: httpd could not be started So then I change the LoadModule to LoadModule perl_module libexec/libperl.so which then generates this error message - callmaster% apachectl start Syntax error on line 203 of /usr/local/apache/conf/httpd.conf: Invalid command 'LoadModule', perhaps mis-spelled or defined by a module not included in the server configuration apachectl start: httpd could not be started This would seem to indicate that mod_perl did not install correctly. However, mod_perl states that it has installed. When I go to check the apache/libexec, it is empty - no mod-perl. I don't understand why this isn't building properly. Any insight would be helpful... I've always done this via the RPM in Red Hat and this is on a Sparc Solaris 2.6 box so maybe someone can give me a hand and tell me what I've missed. I've attached the httpd.conf file and it appears to be correct, but it errors out (see above) Jimi Thompson # # Based upon the NCSA server configuration files originally by Rob McCool. # # This is the main Apache server configuration file. It contains the # configuration directives that give the server its instructions. # See http://www.apache.org/docs/> for detailed information about # the directives. # # Do NOT simply read the instructions in here without understanding # what they do. They're here only as hints or reminders. If you are unsure # consult the online docs. You have been warned. # # After this file is processed, the server will look for and process # @@ServerRoot@@/conf/srm.conf and then @@ServerRoot@@/conf/access.conf # unless you have overridden these with ResourceConfig and/or # AccessConfig directives here. # # The configuration directives are grouped into three basic sections: # 1. Directives that control the operation of the Apache server process as a # whole (the 'global environment'). # 2. Directives that define the parameters of the 'main' or 'default' server, # which responds to requests that aren't handled by a virtual host. # These directives also provide default values for the settings # of all virtual hosts. # 3. Settings for virtual hosts, which allow Web requests to be sent to # different IP addresses or hostnames and have them handled by the # same Apache server process. # # Configuration and logfile names: If the filenames you specify for many # of the server's control files begin with "/" (or "drive:/" for Win32), the # server will use that explicit path. If the filenames do *not* begin # with "/", the value of ServerRoot is prepended -- so "logs/foo.log" # with ServerRoot set to "/usr/local/apache" will be interpreted by the # server as "/usr/local/apache/logs/foo.log". # ### Section 1: Global Environment # # The directives in this section affect the overall operation of Apache, # such as the number of concurrent requests it can handle or where it # can find its configuration files. # # # ServerType is either inetd, or standalone. Inetd mode is only supported on # Unix platforms. # ServerType standalone # # ServerRoot: The top of the directory tree under which the server's # configuration, error, and log files are kept. # # NOTE! If you intend to place this on an NFS (or otherwise network) # mounted filesystem then please read the LockFile documentation # (available at http://www.apache.org/docs/mod/core.html#lockfile>); # you will save yourself a lot of trouble. # # Do NOT add a slash at the end of the directory path. # ServerRoot "/usr/local/apache # # The LockFile directive sets the path to the lockfile used when Apache # is compiled with either USE_FCNTL_SERIALIZED_ACCEPT or # USE_FLOCK_SERIALIZED_ACCEPT. This directive should normally be left at # its default value. The main reason for changing it is if the logs # directory is NFS mounted, since the lockfile MUST BE STORED ON A LOCAL # DISK. The PID of the main server process is automatically appended to # the filename. # #LockFile logs/accept.lock # # PidFile: The file in which the server should record its process # identification number when it starts. # PidFile logs/httpd.pid # # ScoreBoardFile: File used to store internal server process information. # Not all architectures require this. But if yours does (you'll know because # this file will be created when you run Apache) then you *must* ensure that # no two invocations of Apache share the same sco
