Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Aaron Kulkis]

Druid wrote:

There are no moderators of this list.


In case you are not sure, Ill take some time to explain. There is a
guy, who knows the root password for the server in which the mailing
list software, and probably the smtp server for this domain is
installed. And this guy, having the powers to change settings in the
list, he can be considered a moderator, or whatever.



This is an open list.
It is NOT moderated.

Just because someone has a root password doesn't make them
a moderator.

A moderator MODERATES.

If nobody MODERATES the list, then it is UNMODERATED.




Since there are no moderators in the list, fuck off with the "oh post
this or that way". I dont give a damn, go express your life
frustration elsewhere.



Fuck you too, you conceited asshole.






2) The moderator couldnt care less about that topic, it seems

I'm pretty sure you've read this before but, just in case you missed it,
there are no moderators of this list.



Again, read the root password etc etc etc. If the guy with the root
password was giving a damn about that, he would be doing something.
Since he is not doing a thing, and since you are not the guy with the
root password, fuck off again.


Posessing the root password does not make ANYONE a moderator.

Get that through your thick, shit-filled, maggot-infested skull.




Not specifically aimed at you, but this seems like a good place to add
it. It would appear that a lot of the users of this list could do with
reading this:


Sure. Now fuck off


You were already instructed to do that several hours ago.



Best regards

Marcio
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Re: [opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[Stan Goodman]

** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
on Sat, 08 Sep 2007 00:46:00 +0100

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Stan Goodman wrote:
> > ** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 22:16:55 +0100
> > 
> >> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> >> Hash: SHA1
> >>
> >> Stan Goodman wrote:
> >>> ** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >>> on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 20:27:20 +0100
> >>>
> >>> 2) The jdk was installed (foolishly, without thinking) in my home 
> >>> directory,
> > 
> 
> 
> > No. The "foolishly, without thinking" was that I did NOT install with YaST; 
> > if
> > I had, the answer to (2) would have been the same as for (1), and no problem
> > would exist. What is a safe way to remove the jdk, given that YaST is of no
> > help?
> >  
> 
> Therefore I assume that you installed with rpm without running the
> SuSEconfig script ... uninstalling with rpm should remove the package
> without any problems... not knowing what you options you used to install
> I would refer to the rpm manpage for the appropriate options to
> uninstall...

This must refer to the jre package,  (which YaST shows with a
padlock - how do I remove the protection?).

But the installed jdk doesn't show in the list of packages at all, because it
was not installed with rpm; it came with its own installer, as
. How to remove it?

> 
> 
> >> Here you are talking about modifying the bash profiles... Where you make
> >> the changes depends on whether you want the path to change globally or
> >> for a particular user, or on login.
> > 
> > I would like to understand both the global and user-only cases. For each of
> > these, I am most interested in producing a permanent change that will 
> > survive
> > reboot, so what you have called "on logon".
> >>
> >> /etc/profile for system wide configuration
> 
> This is the system wide profile... there are other scripts in profile.d
> that are used, it is called before...
> 
> >> ~/.bash_profile ~/.bash_login or ~/.profile) for user login
> 
> (Actually, these are not aliases so much as alternates, the shell
> searches for these files in that order... a login shell is the initial
> login prompt shell)...Different distros do vary a bit on this..
> 
> or
> 
> >> ~/.bashrc for non login shells
> 
> which is used for further instances of the shell.
> 
> These are related to settings in /etc/sysconfig.. in most cases user
> modifications should placed in .local (read docs for more
> detail than really be given in an email).
> 
> I will repeat it is not a good idea to make changes to these unless you
> have a good knowledge of bash/sh, if you do wish to experiment use a
> local settings in a test account.

That is good advice that I might not have thought of soon enough. Thank you.

> If your unfamiliar with Bash a good book is 'Learning the Bash Shell' by
> Newham and Rosenblatt. There is also a bash guide somewhere in the user
> documentation (cant for the life of me remember where should be at the
> moment)...

I do have the Newham and Rosenblatt book;  it arrived here only a few days ago.
Thanks for suggesting it, and confirming that I chose a good one.

> 
> >> for a starter
> >>
> >> these are effectively scripts and some knowledge of BASH scripting is a
> >> good idea before attempting to modify these, (and read the BASH
> >> documentation). Getting this wrong could make life rather interesting :-)
> >>
> >> For Java use editing the PATH variable is NOT required...
> > 
> > As I have said, I am currently operating successfully with an incorrect PATH
> > variable. But that means that I have to specify the full pathname for the
> 
> Once you have loaded the java instance it does not care.. If you have a
> close look at the bin directories you will come across links to things
> in other directories... The standard path finds the link and then
> executes the program.. simple... The SuSE rpm sets up this link ...
> There is Randalls interesting suggestion which I had not heard any
> references to before (which is something new to explore :-) ).


This is mentioned on Novell's page at . I think I
will avoid the need for it by settling on only one jvm, which would be the jdk.
This page also tells me that there is no Su/se jdk for v1.6, only for v1.5,
which it explains how to install.
 
> If you  really are worried about having the path include the location of
> the java directory then invoke java with a script that sets appropriate
> path changes then calls java ...

I may just leave the superfluous path where it is, and avoid unnecessary
complication.

-- 
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel

REAL similes/metaphors by high school students; #15: They lived in a typical
suburban neighborhood with picket fence that resembled Nancy Kerrigan's teeth.
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Re: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's

[Mike McMullin]

On Sat, 2007-08-09 at 00:49 -0400, Bob S wrote:
> Hello SuSE people,
> 
> This is especially for you guys/gals that run 3or 4 os's on a big hard drive. 
> How do you handle the primary and extended partitions? 
> 
> A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install different 
> os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new drive but I 
> stupidly partitioned 3 primaries,  /,  /swap, and /home, and used the fourth 
> primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of partitions with about 
> 150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE drive)

  I've got a big HD on my main system, and I'm running 5.  Two Os's on
one one hd and three are on the big drive.  The one with three
partitions I set up as such: hdb1=swap,
hdb2=/ for 10.1, hdb3=/home for 10.1, then there is an extended
partition where hdb5=/ for 10.2, hdb6=/home for 10.2, hdb7=/ for
LinuxXP.  I do have on hda2 a swap partition, on hda1 Windows XP, on
hda3 Ubuntu root, and on hda4 Ubuntu Home.

> Now, I guess I could move my /home and /swap into the extended partition to 
> free up two primary partitions. Hopefully that would give me access to the 
> rest of the unused space on the drive. I always liked having my /home on it's
> own partition to guard it from mishap.  Now, here are some of my questions:
> 
> Is the /home as safe residing in the extended partition? I could never delete 
> or change the extended partition because they would wipe out /home - right?
u
  Yes to both, almost.  You could always backup your /home partition to
move it to a new hard drive.  Strategies for this have been discussed ad
nauseum on this list over the past 18 or so months.

> Is it a good idea to have /swap on the extended partition? Do you use the 
> same /swap for all of the os's? (e.g. like my /swap for 10.0 on the IDE 
> drive?)

  I have my swap in a primary partition on any drive that I have a swap
on, and I have the 4 Linux's use the swap partition on hdb.  I'm keeping
the one on hda there in case I remove my hdb.  I'll tweak Ubuntu to use
it using a live cd to make the edit to fstab.

> How do you manage to run 3 or 4 os variants on just 4 primary partitions?

  I give my heavy lifting/everyday Linux the primary partitions and use
the extended partition for checking out other releases/distros.

> Love to hear your individual strategies. 
> 
> Anxiously awaiting the final 10.3 so I can try Compiz-Fusion, Beryl whatever 
> and be able to fall back to 10.2 when I screw it up.
> 
> Bob S.

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Re: [opensuse] Got a Call from Novell Today

[Mike McMullin]

On Fri, 2007-07-09 at 18:06 -0700, Kai Ponte wrote:
> Coolness! I got a call from a sales rep at Novell today inquiring if I'd be 
> interested in looking at SUSE migration from Windows.  I told him I was 
> running openSUSE on my lappie and a few desktops.
> 
> He said there were several dozen SLED servers (mostly oracle) and a few 
> hundred SLES machines scattered throughout my organization.  
> 
> The dam has sprung a small leak!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and by the way - Rory is out of the office.

  I noticed when browsing the corporate net at work that some had the
brains to set up a Linux_Samba test server for one of our divisions.  I
hope they nail it and it moves from test to production on that side.
Our side is running Windows-2003 servers and they're being rebooted with
obnoxious regularity.

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Re: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's

[Felix Miata]

On 2007/09/08 00:49 (GMT-0400) Bob S apparently typed:

> A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install different 
> os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new drive but I 
> stupidly partitioned 3 primaries,  /,  /swap, and /home, and used the fourth 
> primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of partitions with about 
> 150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE drive)

Not exactly dumb. Without "sacrificing" a primary for use as an extended,
you're limited to 4 partitions total. There are only two ways to be out of
available unpartitioned space to add a logical if an extended already exists:

1-100% of freespace is already allocated to partitions
2-all existing freespace is located in between two primary partitions neither
of which is an extended partition

If the latter is your problem, all primaries need to be made adjacent.

> Is the /home as safe residing in the extended partition?

The difference between logical and primary partitions only matters to boot
loaders and legacy DOS and windoz operating systems. Linux once booted sees
partitions as partitions without distinction between logical & primary, which
means there's no difference in "safety", whatever that means.

> I could never delete 
> or change the extended partition because they would wipe out /home - right?

The "extended partition" is nothing but a series of marker sectors pointing
to partitions that don't have table entries in the MBR, plus a primary
partition table entry that starts the marker chain by pointing to the first
logical partition.

> Is it a good idea to have /swap on the extended partition?

Linux doesn't care. Generally the best place for swap is wherever your disk's
fastest access exists, usually but not always at or near the "front".

> Do you use the 
> same /swap for all of the os's? (e.g. like my /swap for 10.0 on the IDE 
> drive?)

Linux installers generally will use every swap partition they can find. If
you have multiple swap partitions, you'll have to manually change each new
fstab to use whichever swap partitions you want used for that Linux.

> How do you manage to run 3 or 4 os variants on just 4 primary partitions?

I doubt anyone does. There's no reason to. I usually have a maintenance
and/or boot partition on the first, a boot manager on the second, a small
primary type 0x06 for DOS and/or windoz, and everything else as logicals,
typically more than 20 total per disk.

On partitioning generally: http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/partitioningindex.html
-- 
"It yet remains a problem to be solved in human affairs,
whether any free government can be permanent, where the
public worship of God, and the support of religion,
constitute no part of the policy or duty of the state in
any assignable shape."
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 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409

Felix Miata  ***  http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/
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Re: [opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's

[Rajko M.]

On Friday 07 September 2007 11:49:51 pm Bob S wrote:

> A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install
> different os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new
> drive but I stupidly partitioned 3 primaries,  /,  /swap, and /home, and
> used the fourth primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of
> partitions with about 150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE
> drive)

The extended partition is just a container for logical partitions, kind of 
virtual hard disk within real hard disk.  
So nothing to move, just add new partitions. 
My favorite for partitioning is command line program 'cfdisk', or recently 
YaST Partitioner that makes possible to prepare disk from partitioning and 
resizing to formating.

I use cca 10 GB for installation. 
For new installations I use old home directory, but create new users. That way 
changes in configuration of desktop (KDE, GNOME, other applications) doesn't 
interfere with older versions. 

The newest tool to experiment with new versions of openSUSE, Live CDs, other 
distros, is virtual machine. In openSUSE you have options to use QEMU,  
VirtualBox or Xen, but you can opt for VMware, Parallels etc. For details 
just ask Google, there is few articles on openSUSE about virtual machines 
too. 

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Rajko.
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Bob S]

On Friday 07 September 2007 22:11, Druid wrote:
> > There are no moderators of this list.
>
> In case you are not sure, Ill take some time to explain. There is a
> guy, who knows the root password for the server in which the mailing
> list software, and probably the smtp server for this domain is
> installed. And this guy, having the powers to change settings in the
> list, he can be considered a moderator, or whatever.
>
> Since there are no moderators in the list, fuck off with the "oh post
> this or that way". I dont give a damn, go express your life
> frustration elsewhere.
>
> > >2) The moderator couldnt care less about that topic, it seems
> >
> > I'm pretty sure you've read this before but, just in case you missed it,
> > there are no moderators of this list.
>
> Again, read the root password etc etc etc. If the guy with the root
> password was giving a damn about that, he would be doing something.
> Since he is not doing a thing, and since you are not the guy with the
> root password, fuck off again.
>
> > Not specifically aimed at you, but this seems like a good place to add
> > it. It would appear that a lot of the users of this list could do with
> > reading this:
>
> Sure. Now fuck off
>
Hi Marcio,

You are a super grade A #1 asshole.

Bye Marcio,

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[opensuse] Questions for Partitioning guru's

[Bob S]

Hello SuSE people,

This is especially for you guys/gals that run 3or 4 os's on a big hard drive. 
How do you handle the primary and extended partitions? 

A while back I purchased a 250 GB Sata drive, intending to install different 
os's and or versions of SuSE. I installed 10.2 on my shiny new drive but I 
stupidly partitioned 3 primaries,  /,  /swap, and /home, and used the fourth 
primary for the extended partition. Dumb move - Out of partitions with about 
150GB of free space. (I run 10.0 on another small IDE drive)

Now, I guess I could move my /home and /swap into the extended partition to 
free up two primary partitions. Hopefully that would give me access to the 
rest of the unused space on the drive. I always liked having my /home on it's
own partition to guard it from mishap.  Now, here are some of my questions:

Is the /home as safe residing in the extended partition? I could never delete 
or change the extended partition because they would wipe out /home - right?

Is it a good idea to have /swap on the extended partition? Do you use the 
same /swap for all of the os's? (e.g. like my /swap for 10.0 on the IDE 
drive?)

How do you manage to run 3 or 4 os variants on just 4 primary partitions?

Love to hear your individual strategies. 

Anxiously awaiting the final 10.3 so I can try Compiz-Fusion, Beryl whatever 
and be able to fall back to 10.2 when I screw it up.

Bob S.
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[opensuse] Session locks under ASUS M2N-MX SE

[Scott Newton]

I have openSUSE 10.2 (with all the latest updates) installed on a machine that 
has an ASUS M2N-MX SE motherboard. Quite regularly the machine will lock up, 
independent of whether it is running in a tty or in X (ie locks up even when 
X is not running). It doesn't seem to make any difference what parameters I 
pass to the kernel (tried noacpi, irqpoll, etc). The motherboard and the hard 
drive have been replaced so I don't believe it is a hardware fault unless 
it's the power supply. I thought it might be the wireless card but it locks 
up independent of whether it is in the machine or not. I've tried the latest 
NVIDIA drivers but as it locks up even when X isn't running I don't think it 
is the NVIDIA drivers. There is nothing in the log files that I can find or 
in dmesg. 

When the machine locks the only way to reset it is to hit the reset button.

The only thing odd I can find is that it seems to be only finding one of the 
processors.

I was wondering if anyone had any ideas as to what might be happening.

Thanks

eta:/proc # uname -a
Linux eta 2.6.18.8-0.5-default #1 SMP Fri Jun 22 12:17:53 UTC 2007 i686 athlon 
i386 GNU/Linux

eta:/proc # lspci
00:00.0 RAM memory: nVidia Corporation MCP61 Memory Controller (rev a1)
00:01.0 ISA bridge: nVidia Corporation MCP61 LPC Bridge (rev a2)
00:01.1 SMBus: nVidia Corporation MCP61 SMBus (rev a2)
00:01.2 RAM memory: nVidia Corporation MCP61 Memory Controller (rev a2)
00:02.0 USB Controller: nVidia Corporation MCP61 USB Controller (rev a2)
00:02.1 USB Controller: nVidia Corporation MCP61 USB Controller (rev a2)
00:04.0 PCI bridge: nVidia Corporation MCP61 PCI bridge (rev a1)
00:05.0 Audio device: nVidia Corporation MCP61 High Definition Audio (rev a2)
00:06.0 IDE interface: nVidia Corporation MCP61 IDE (rev a2)
00:07.0 Bridge: nVidia Corporation MCP61 Ethernet (rev a2)
00:08.0 IDE interface: nVidia Corporation MCP61 SATA Controller (rev a2)
00:09.0 PCI bridge: nVidia Corporation MCP61 PCI Express bridge (rev a2)
00:0b.0 PCI bridge: nVidia Corporation MCP61 PCI Express bridge (rev a2)
00:0c.0 PCI bridge: nVidia Corporation MCP61 PCI Express bridge (rev a2)
00:0d.0 VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation GeForce 6100 nForce 430 
(rev a2)
00:18.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] 
HyperTransport Technology Configuration
00:18.1 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] 
Address Map
00:18.2 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] DRAM 
Controller
00:18.3 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] 
Miscellaneous Control
01:06.0 Ethernet controller: Marvell Technology Group Ltd. 88w8335 [Libertas] 
802.11b/g Wireless (rev 03)

eta:/proc # cat cpuinfo
processor   : 0
vendor_id   : AuthenticAMD
cpu family  : 15
model   : 75
model name  : AMD Athlon(tm) 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 3800+
stepping: 2
cpu MHz : 2009.238
cache size  : 512 KB
physical id : 0
siblings: 1
core id : 0
cpu cores   : 1
fdiv_bug: no
hlt_bug : no
f00f_bug: no
coma_bug: no
fpu : yes
fpu_exception   : yes
cpuid level : 1
wp  : yes
flags   : fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca 
cmov pat pse36 clflush mmx fxsr sse sse2 ht syscall nx mmxext fxsr_opt lm 
3dnowext 3dnow up pni cx16 lahf_lm cmp_legacy svm cr8legacy ts fid vid ttp tm 
stc
bogomips: 4027.80

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Scott Newton
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Re: [opensuse] USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[Bob S]

On Friday 07 September 2007 09:40, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
> * Carlos E. R. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [09-07-07 08:55]:
> > The Friday 2007-09-07 at 08:45 -0400, Ciro Iriarte wrote:
> > > You'll have to go with an eSATA enclosure
> >
> > My MB doesn't have sata.
>
> MoxNix, smartd doesn't appear to work on my sata drives ..  :^(
>
smartctl works here on my SATA disk and my two IDE disks. 10.2 x86.64

Been just running it manually. Haven't taken the time to try and log the 
results and send me a mail.

Bob S
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Druid]

> There are no moderators of this list.

In case you are not sure, Ill take some time to explain. There is a
guy, who knows the root password for the server in which the mailing
list software, and probably the smtp server for this domain is
installed. And this guy, having the powers to change settings in the
list, he can be considered a moderator, or whatever.

Since there are no moderators in the list, fuck off with the "oh post
this or that way". I dont give a damn, go express your life
frustration elsewhere.


>
> >2) The moderator couldnt care less about that topic, it seems
>
> I'm pretty sure you've read this before but, just in case you missed it,
> there are no moderators of this list.
>

Again, read the root password etc etc etc. If the guy with the root
password was giving a damn about that, he would be doing something.
Since he is not doing a thing, and since you are not the guy with the
root password, fuck off again.

>
> Not specifically aimed at you, but this seems like a good place to add
> it. It would appear that a lot of the users of this list could do with
> reading this:

Sure. Now fuck off

Best regards

Marcio
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Re: [opensuse] IDE for Mono

[Kai Ponte]

On Friday 07 September 2007 18:28, Benji Weber wrote:
> On 08/09/2007, Kai Ponte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I'm getting kind of tired of fighting Java for one of my apps. Since most
> > of my staff is C# trained, I'm thinking it is time to switch and leverage
> > their knowledge.
> >
> > Anybody know of a good IDE for Mono?  I know there's the MonoDevelop
> > editor, but I've yet to find an IDE out there.
>
> In what way is monodevelop not an IDE? It has things such as editor,
> code completion, graphical GTK# designer, graphical winforms designer
> (partially), graphical asp.net designer, debugger, etc etc.

It now has a GUI designer?  Oh.

That's the sign of an IDE for me.   I'll install it and give it another look.  
the only other thing I'd seen is Stetic (http://www.mono-project.com/Stetic) 
but haven't seen any examples of real use.


-- 
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www.perfectreign.com
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Re: [opensuse] Re: list cops blaming top posts

[David Bolt]

On Thu, 6 Sep 2007, Carlos E. R. wrote:-

>
>The Thursday 2007-09-06 at 11:11 -0500, Stevens wrote:
>
>> I think that there is a bit of confusion here. On the one hand we talk of
>> "standards" and on the other speak of accomodation. I submit that the
>> de facto standard is the way that millions of emailers send email, not
>> the way that a miniscule number of newsgroupies do. As far as
>> accomodation, please note that I, in fact, do bottom post. I just don't care
>> if someone else does not.
>
>There is an RFC about this... so it is an standard :-P

And it's even mentioned here:

http://en.opensuse.org/OpenSUSE_mailing_list_netiquette#Bottom_post>


Regards,
David Bolt

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RISC OS 3.11 | SUSE 10.0 32bit | SUSE 10.1 32bit | openSUSE 10.2 32bit
RISC OS 3.6  | SUSE 10.0 64bit | SUSE 10.1 64bit | openSUSE 10.2 64bit
TOS 4.02 | SUSE 9.3 32bit  | | openSUSE 10.3b2 32bit
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[David Bolt]

On Fri, 7 Sep 2007, Druid wrote:-

>What you two think or want is completely irrelevant, for 2 reasons:

Well, not quite irrelevant. It may be to you, but it isn't to them.

>1) You are not the moderators of the list

There are no moderators of this list.

>2) The moderator couldnt care less about that topic, it seems

I'm pretty sure you've read this before but, just in case you missed it,
there are no moderators of this list.



>PS: I top posted and bottom posted this reply so everybody will feel
>all warm and fuzzy

Not specifically aimed at you, but this seems like a good place to add
it. It would appear that a lot of the users of this list could do with
reading this:

http://en.opensuse.org/OpenSUSE_mailing_list_netiquette>

and specifically this part:

http://en.opensuse.org/OpenSUSE_mailing_list_netiquette#Bottom_post>


Regards,
David Bolt

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Re: [opensuse] Smart developers Way OT

[Bob S]

On Friday 07 September 2007 17:31, Rajko M. wrote:
> On Thursday 06 September 2007 11:22:20 pm Bob S wrote:
> > You see, I am sight impaired and I need pretty large fonts and/or icons.
>
> Hi Bob,
>
> besides Ctrl-Alt-Plus (I use one on numeric keyboard) to change resolution
> there is Ctrl-Plus to increase font sizes in browsers.
>
Thanks Rajko.

Browsers not a problem. I use Ctrl and scrollwheel on mouse.

Bob S
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Re: [opensuse] Smart developers Way OT

[Bob S]

On Friday 07 September 2007 00:34, M Harris wrote:
> On Thursday 06 September 2007 23:22, Bob S wrote:
> > Please don't suggest the accessability thing. That is a horror to use.
>
>   What I do when the eyes are tired and I need a serious font/icon size
> distortion is to use the ctrl+alt+[+] key to bump the screen resolution---
> sometimes even to 800x600 or 640x480  and with a virtual window of 1024x768
> or higher.  Then I use the mouse to move the window... and I have "giant"
> fonts/icons in every application across the board. And since I went to the
> SyncMaster 226BW  wide flat-panel the eyes are strained no longer.
>
Thanks Stan,

But the ctrl+alt++ doesn't seem to work in my 10.2. It used to work back 
several releases ago, but it hasn't worked since at least 10.0

Kai,

Thanks for the suggestion but that list is completely useless. I've asked 
several times on that list and have never received a reply. Seems nobody uses 
it.

Bob S. 
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Robert Smits]

On Friday 07 September 2007 10:49, jdd wrote:
> Sloan wrote:
> > What I don't like is having to wade down through the tedious history of
> > a huge series of postings (all of which I've read several times before)
> > just to see a one-line answer buried at the very bottom.
>
> this is also a very bad action by the poster

Yes, but this is the result of being lazy and not trimming the reply to the 
relevant part, which all of us should do anyway. I find top posters are worse 
at doing this because they don't see the rest of the article as easily as you 
do if you bottom post.
-- 
Bob Smits [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Windows - noun. 1. Global virus. 2. 32 bit extension and a graphical shell for 
a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit operating system originally coded for a 4 bit 
microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company that can't stand 1 bit of 
competition. - Harry Martin
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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[David Bolt]

On Fri, 7 Sep 2007, Kenneth Schneider wrote:-



>Download the delta iso and use applydeltaiso to the old iso.
>
>applydeltaiso   
>
>I've been using this method since 10.0, downloads are much quicker and
>applying the delta is certainly much faster then waiting for the
>torrents to finish.

Upto the removal of the separate CDs ISOs, I used to download the deltas
using FTP and start sharing them. Then I applied the deltas to create
the full CDs and started sharing those.

With the removal of the CD ISOs, I had to download the full DVD ISO.
Since then I've gone back to the "download delta, start sharing it,
apply delta, start sharing full DVD"[0].

Being distinctly lazy, I configured Azureus to auto-start torrents in a
particular directory and then scripted everything so all I need to do is
start it off and go to bed. By the time I get up the following morning,
the full DVD ISO is ready and the both the delta and full ISO are
already being shared.


[0] Well, this time I've also got the Gnome and KDE CDs being shared as
well since I had a play about with them and makeSUSEdvd to add the
Packman repo right from the start. I would have added Guru as well, but
the 10.3 repo is empty and the beta2 installation crashed when it was
enabled :| Got to have another go and see if they've fixed that bug.

Regards,
David Bolt

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Re: [opensuse] IDE for Mono

[Sunny]

On 9/7/07, Kai Ponte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm getting kind of tired of fighting Java for one of my apps. Since most of
> my staff is C# trained, I'm thinking it is time to switch and leverage their
> knowledge.
>
> Anybody know of a good IDE for Mono?  I know there's the MonoDevelop editor,
> but I've yet to find an IDE out there.
>
>

There is a proprietary product - looks interesting:

http://www.omnicore.com/en/xdevelop.htm

But I would better stay with MonoDevelop - they improve it very
rapidly, and so far I find it working for most of my tasks.

-- 
Svetoslav Milenov (Sunny)

Even the most advanced equipment in the hands of the ignorant is just
a pile of scrap.
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Re: [opensuse] IDE for Mono

[Benji Weber]

On 08/09/2007, Kai Ponte <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm getting kind of tired of fighting Java for one of my apps. Since most of
> my staff is C# trained, I'm thinking it is time to switch and leverage their
> knowledge.
>
> Anybody know of a good IDE for Mono?  I know there's the MonoDevelop editor,
> but I've yet to find an IDE out there.

In what way is monodevelop not an IDE? It has things such as editor,
code completion, graphical GTK# designer, graphical winforms designer
(partially), graphical asp.net designer, debugger, etc etc.

_
Benjamin Weber
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Randall R Schulz]

On Friday 07 September 2007 17:59, steve wrote:
> ...
>
> good one.
> I cant believe there is no  monthly charge for the  list,  its almost
> as amusing  as  Comedy Central.

Eh? You must not be watching The Daily Show. Jon Stewart et. cie. are a 
over-the-top hilarious. And it's real humor, not like these bozos, who 
just parade their mental impairments. Of course, the grist coming from 
Washington makes it easy for The Daily Show writers, but still, they 
really do it well.


RRS
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[opensuse] IDE for Mono

[Kai Ponte]

I'm getting kind of tired of fighting Java for one of my apps. Since most of 
my staff is C# trained, I'm thinking it is time to switch and leverage their 
knowledge.

Anybody know of a good IDE for Mono?  I know there's the MonoDevelop editor, 
but I've yet to find an IDE out there.


-- 
kai ponte
www.perfectreign.com
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[opensuse] Got a Call from Novell Today

[Kai Ponte]

Coolness! I got a call from a sales rep at Novell today inquiring if I'd be 
interested in looking at SUSE migration from Windows.  I told him I was 
running openSUSE on my lappie and a few desktops.

He said there were several dozen SLED servers (mostly oracle) and a few 
hundred SLES machines scattered throughout my organization.  

The dam has sprung a small leak!





Oh, and by the way - Rory is out of the office.


-- 
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www.perfectreign.com
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[steve]

M Harris wrote:

On Thursday 06 September 2007 10:21, Stevens wrote:
  

I don't give a rip one way or the other



If you post in a flame war regarding top-posting, are those postings then 
therefore hot postings or post toasties...   or are they just toasted posts?   
Inquiring minds want to know...  which is all together different from toasted 
puffs... which are made from oats instead of corn...  what were we talking 
about? ...oh yeah, I think it is best to put your fruit on top of the post 
toasties  instead of the bottom... although sometimes the little slices of 
bannana slip to the bottom of the toasted posts making them hard to find in 
the milk... unless its shallow... but by that time they are soggy anyway... 
you know what I mean Marynard?  But I don't give a rip... eat your post 
toasties dry if you want to ...  huh? 




  

good one.
I cant believe there is no  monthly charge for the  list,  its almost as 
amusing  as  comedy central. 


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[opensuse] Contract-to-Hire: Sysadmin

[JJB]

Please send responses to:

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

It would be helpful if you include [resume] in the subject line.

The position is located in the area of Santa Cruz, California.

*Strong systems knowledge of Linux operating systems, especially 
SUSE 10.2

*Strong understanding of network protocols and internet security
*Configuration of Linux based LDAP, firewalls, VPN, Samba and 
Primary Domain Controllers

*Strong knowledge of Windows and Macintosh operating systems
*Configuration and maintenance of company server computers.
*Configuration and maintenance of desktop computers.
*Configuration and maintenance of company computer network.
*Ability to learn and apply new technologies quickly.
*Ability to work well with others is important.
*Ability to work independently, guiding projects to completion
*Understanding of email routing, firewalls, tcp/ip

Responsibilities may include:

*Evaluation, recommendation, purchasing of computer related 
equipment for company.

*Regular backups of all computer systems in company.
*Desktop Support for Windows and Macintosh workstations, Microsoft 
Outlook mail clients.


Pluses would include:
*Experience with Retrospect backup server and client software on 
Windows, Mac and Linux

*Some experience with PHP/MySQL
*Experience with Postfix, Kerio Mail Server
*A personal interest in digital audio and recording technology.
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Re: [opensuse] hiring linux sysadmin?

[Carl Hartung]

On Fri September 7 2007 20:34, Tony Alfrey wrote:
> Considering that we've just filled the list for two days of solid rant
> about top posting or bottom posting, I think that anything remotely
> connected to linux would be appropriate.

amen! :-)

And well put, too.

Carl
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Re: [opensuse] hiring linux sysadmin?

[Tony Alfrey]

joe wrote:


JJB wrote:

Would this list be an appropriate place to post a job req for a Sysadmin?
Thanks,


Sure, if it's an admin job for suse linux servers -

Joe



Considering that we've just filled the list for two days of solid rant 
about top posting or bottom posting, I think that anything remotely 
connected to linux would be appropriate.



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Tony Alfrey
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Re: [opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[Joe Morris (NTM)]

On 09/08/2007 06:13 AM, Stan Goodman wrote:
> I too am bemused. I think the insistence that the PATH is irrelevant comes
> because you are thinking of the various java apps one might be using, rather
> than the java executable. I am thinking of the latter alone, and PATH is
> convenient, if not necessary.
I believe you are confusing PATH with the links SUSE uses for java. 
Please check, in a console as root, update-alternatives --help, which
will give you some good help in understanding the equivalent of PATH for
java.  Try update-alternatives --display java to get an idea of all that
is involved.  You had problems because you installed a fedora rpm
instead of a SUSE.

-- 
Joe Morris
Registered Linux user 231871 running openSUSE 10.2 x86_64





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Re: [opensuse] hiring linux sysadmin?

[joe]

JJB wrote:
> Would this list be an appropriate place to post a job req for a Sysadmin?
> Thanks,

Sure, if it's an admin job for suse linux servers -

Joe
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[opensuse] hiring linux sysadmin?

[JJB]

Would this list be an appropriate place to post a job req for a Sysadmin? 


Thanks,

Joel
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Re: [opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[G T Smith]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Stan Goodman wrote:
> ** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 22:16:55 +0100
> 
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Stan Goodman wrote:
>>> ** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 20:27:20 +0100
>>>
>>> 2) The jdk was installed (foolishly, without thinking) in my home directory,
> 


> No. The "foolishly, without thinking" was that I did NOT install with YaST; if
> I had, the answer to (2) would have been the same as for (1), and no problem
> would exist. What is a safe way to remove the jdk, given that YaST is of no
> help?
>  

Therefore I assume that you installed with rpm without running the
SuSEconfig script ... uninstalling with rpm should remove the package
without any problems... not knowing what you options you used to install
I would refer to the rpm manpage for the appropriate options to
uninstall...



>> Here you are talking about modifying the bash profiles... Where you make
>> the changes depends on whether you want the path to change globally or
>> for a particular user, or on login.
> 
> I would like to understand both the global and user-only cases. For each of
> these, I am most interested in producing a permanent change that will survive
> reboot, so what you have called "on logon".
>>
>> /etc/profile for system wide configuration

This is the system wide profile... there are other scripts in profile.d
that are used, it is called before...

>> ~/.bash_profile ~/.bash_login or ~/.profile) for user login

(Actually, these are not aliases so much as alternates, the shell
searches for these files in that order... a login shell is the initial
login prompt shell)...Different distros do vary a bit on this..

or

>> ~/.bashrc for non login shells

which is used for further instances of the shell.

These are related to settings in /etc/sysconfig.. in most cases user
modifications should placed in .local (read docs for more
detail than really be given in an email).

I will repeat it is not a good idea to make changes to these unless you
have a good knowledge of bash/sh, if you do wish to experiment use a
local settings in a test account.

If your unfamiliar with Bash a good book is 'Learning the Bash Shell' by
Newham and Rosenblatt. There is also a bash guide somewhere in the user
documentation (cant for the life of me remember where should be at the
moment)...


>> for a starter
>>
>> these are effectively scripts and some knowledge of BASH scripting is a
>> good idea before attempting to modify these, (and read the BASH
>> documentation). Getting this wrong could make life rather interesting :-)
>>
>> For Java use editing the PATH variable is NOT required...
> 
> As I have said, I am currently operating successfully with an incorrect PATH
> variable. But that means that I have to specify the full pathname for the

Once you have loaded the java instance it does not care.. If you have a
close look at the bin directories you will come across links to things
in other directories... The standard path finds the link and then
executes the program.. simple... The SuSE rpm sets up this link ...
There is Randalls interesting suggestion which I had not heard any
references to before (which is something new to explore :-) ).

If you  really are worried about having the path include the location of
the java directory then invoke java with a script that sets appropriate
path changes then calls java ...

> 


- --
==
I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my
telephone.
My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone.

Bjarne Stroustrup
==

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Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iD8DBQFG4eK4asN0sSnLmgIRAsdzAJ90rbsZWxs0ZWK1qYzjutYlmxaVTQCg2jRd
ZKWueZ/1xmiNy16l8jBof70=
=Ufya
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Druid]

On 9/7/07, Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Druid wrote:
> >> There is no moderator, you twit.
> >
> > there is
>
> Then why wasn't my previous posting moderated out?

Dunno, maybe the guy is sleeping or something. Some people have life.

That said, there are far too many idiots in the planet, dont feel all
special, cause you are not,

Doh

Marcio
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Aaron Kulkis]

Druid wrote:

There is no moderator, you twit.


there is


Then why wasn't my previous posting moderated out?





Shut up,  you arrogant, stuck-up pompous asshole.


Some people on this list (and others) say I'm rude...
but it's ONLY towards jerks such as yourself.


They mean dumb, ok? Dumb, not rude.


Look in the mirror.




Marcio
---
Druid




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Re: [opensuse] Is there someone on the list from Santa Rosa, California?

[Art Fore]

On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:41 -0400, taharka wrote:
> How do,
> 
> On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:03 +0800, Art Fore wrote:
> > If there is anyone on the list from Santa Rosa who would be willing to
> > help out my Ex with her computer, please contact me. It is a Dell
> > Latitude D620 with Suse 10.0. Her problm is that Evolution sometimes
> > does not send email, it just leaves it in the outbox. I remember having
> > the problem before, but an upgrade to Evolution seemed to fix it. I
> > think and upgrade from 10.0 to 10.2 would all that would be necessary,
> > but she is computer illiterate and I am here in Taiwan. She is also, or
> > rather her accountant, is running XP under parallels to use Quickbooks
> > (I tried to get her to use gnucash, but she didn't want to learn it), I
> > believe it is version 2.0 if I remember correctly. It is running fine,
> > but will have to have the parallels-config run as root after the
> > upgrade.
> > 
> > She is traveling most weekends, so she could bring the computer by and
> > you could work on it during the weekend if so desired, or she is
> > sometimes gone for a whole week.
> > 
> > Would appreciate anyone who could help so she won't want to go back to
> > the lying, thieving, unethical convicted monopolist software again. She
> > does like Suse Linux, he only complaint is she has no one to fix it if
> > something goes wrong like the presebnt situation. She said she had a few
> > people look at it, but they just say it looks nice, but don't have a
> > clue on what to do.
> 
> Not from Santa Rosa but how bout posting this on the "North Bay Linux
> Users Group" mailing list? They're located in Sonoma County and should
> have some members in Santa Rosa ;-) Web site is,  http://nblug.org/
> 
> > 
> > Art
> 
> taharka
> 
> Lexington, Kentucky U.S.A.
> 

Thanks for the suggestion, I hadn't thought of that.

Art

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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Druid]

And next time you are in need of attention, just call your mom.
Remember: she has an obligation of hearing your pathetic bla bla bla.
We dont.

On 9/7/07, Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Druid wrote:
>
>  >> [Druid's assertion that the list is moderated (deleted by Druid)]
>
> >> Really?
> >>
> >> Then why wasn't my previous post moderated out?
> >
> > Who knows? Maybe you will receive an email soon...
> >
> > You are a living proof that we shouldnt let kids post in the list heh
> >
>
> So in other words, your thesis (that this list has an active
> moderator) is disproved by reality.
>
> So long, and thank you for playing.  We have some nice parting gifts...
>
>
>
> > Marcio
> > ---
> > druid
>
>
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>
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Druid]

> So in other words, your thesis (that this list has an active
> moderator) is disproved by reality.
>
> So long, and thank you for playing.  We have some nice parting gifts...
>

whatever makes your little heart happy, my dear
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Aaron Kulkis]

Druid wrote:

>> [Druid's assertion that the list is moderated (deleted by Druid)]


Really?

Then why wasn't my previous post moderated out?


Who knows? Maybe you will receive an email soon...

You are a living proof that we shouldnt let kids post in the list heh



So in other words, your thesis (that this list has an active
moderator) is disproved by reality.

So long, and thank you for playing.  We have some nice parting gifts...




Marcio
---
druid



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Re: [opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[Randall R Schulz]

On Friday 07 September 2007 15:13, Stan Goodman wrote:
> ...
>
> As I have said, I am currently operating successfully with an
> incorrect PATH variable. But that means that I have to specify the
> full pathname for the  executable, whereas if the PATH were
> correct, I could just call it "java". There is no difference between
> Java and any other executable -- one either specifies full pathname,
> or needs to have a correct pointer in PATH..
>
> I too am bemused. I think the insistence that the PATH is irrelevant
> comes because you are thinking of the various java apps one might be
> using, rather than the java executable. I am thinking of the latter
> alone, and PATH is convenient, if not necessary.

Have you consulted the manual page for "update-alternatives?" I believe 
it may offer you the control you require.


> --
> Stan Goodman


Randall Schulz
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Druid]

>
> Really?
>
> Then why wasn't my previous post moderated out?

Who knows? Maybe you will receive an email soon...

You are a living proof that we shouldnt let kids post in the list heh

Marcio
---
druid
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Aaron Kulkis]

Michael Skiba wrote:

Am Freitag, 7. September 2007 22:46:22 schrieb Aaron Kulkis:

Bottom posting without removing extra quotes is, IMO, somewhat worse than
top posting.

Indeed, for a couple of years, I once did that deliberately
with ALL messages to soc.singles, just because the majority
of the participants on that newsgroup were assholes.

>
Afaik it's something different on newsgroups! Where an answer can arrive 
before the original post. It's not the same as a ML ;)


Out-of-order delivery happens on mailing lists, too.
I notice it frequently (several times/week)



Greetings



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Re: [opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[Stan Goodman]

** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 22:16:55 +0100

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Stan Goodman wrote:
> > ** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 20:27:20 +0100
> > 
> >> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> >> Hash: SHA1
> >>
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> > But at the moment, there are three questions on the practical level, of 
> > which
> > two remain problems:
> > 
> > 1) The jre was installed where it is by rpm without asking me; it is easy to
> > remove if I choose to do so; this is not a problem.
> 
> True..
> 
> > 2) The jdk was installed (foolishly, without thinking) in my home directory,
> > and I really want to remove, and to do so in such a way as not to make more
> > trouble for myself. The Software Management tool is of no help for this. How
> > should I go about removing it, so that I can reinstall from an rpm package?
> 
> I am a bit bemused by this... the SuSE install usually puts the JDK in
> the Java installation tree... Did you install with YaST or with the rpm
> installation tools? Yast should give you the option to remove it if it
> was installed via Yast...

No. The "foolishly, without thinking" was that I did NOT install with YaST; if
I had, the answer to (2) would have been the same as for (1), and no problem
would exist. What is a safe way to remove the jdk, given that YaST is of no
help?
 
> > 3) It is possible that the jdk installed by rpm will straighten out the PATH
> > question automatically. I would still like to know how one can revise or 
> > remove
> > a directory (i.e. the string between two colons) in the PATH variable. Can
> > someone tell me that?
> > 
> 
> Here you are talking about modifying the bash profiles... Where you make
> the changes depends on whether you want the path to change globally or
> for a particular user, or on login.

I would like to understand both the global and user-only cases. For each of
these, I am most interested in producing a permanent change that will survive
reboot, so what you have called "on logon".
> 
> 
> /etc/profile for system wide configuration
> ~/.bash_profile ~/.bash_login or ~/.profile) for user login
> ~/.bashrc for non login shells

For the user login case, one can use any of the three you mention? Are these
aliases for a single file?

> for a starter
> 
> these are effectively scripts and some knowledge of BASH scripting is a
> good idea before attempting to modify these, (and read the BASH
> documentation). Getting this wrong could make life rather interesting :-)
> 
> For Java use editing the PATH variable is NOT required...

As I have said, I am currently operating successfully with an incorrect PATH
variable. But that means that I have to specify the full pathname for the
 executable, whereas if the PATH were correct, I could just call it
"java". There is no difference between Java and any other executable -- one
either specifies full pathname, or needs to have a correct pointer in PATH.. 

I too am bemused. I think the insistence that the PATH is irrelevant comes
because you are thinking of the various java apps one might be using, rather
than the java executable. I am thinking of the latter alone, and PATH is
convenient, if not necessary.

-- 
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel

>From REAL answers on children's science examinations (#5):
Q: What causes the tides in the oceans?
A: The tides are a fight between the Earth and the Moon. All water tends to 
flow towards the moon, because there is no water on the moon, and nature hates 
a vacuum. I forget where the sun joins in this fight.
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Michael Skiba]

Am Freitag, 7. September 2007 22:46:22 schrieb Aaron Kulkis:
> > Bottom posting without removing extra quotes is, IMO, somewhat worse than
> > top posting.
>
> Indeed, for a couple of years, I once did that deliberately
> with ALL messages to soc.singles, just because the majority
> of the participants on that newsgroup were assholes.
Afaik it's something different on newsgroups! Where an answer can arrive 
before the original post. It's not the same as a ML ;)

Greetings


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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Hans Witvliet]

On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 19:01 +0800, Art Fore wrote:
> On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:20 +0100, Matthew Stringer wrote:
> > Anyone know of where this is available, only sites I've seen offer 
> > downloads 
> > via BitTorrent which will take ages.
> > 
> > Regards
> > 
> > Matthew
> > 
> Glad to see that I am not the only who has slow downloads via
> bittorrent, and you are considerably closer to OpenSuse than I am.
> (Taiwan)
> 
> Art
> 
Just noticed that torrent is horrible slow.
a couple of days ago i could get beta-2 at 24Mbps, but beta-3 crawls at
200kbps. 
I just have to sleep over it ;-)

Hans
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Re: [opensuse] Smart developers Way OT

[Rajko M.]

On Thursday 06 September 2007 11:22:20 pm Bob S wrote:
> You see, I am sight impaired and I need pretty large fonts and/or icons.

Hi Bob,

besides Ctrl-Alt-Plus (I use one on numeric keyboard) to change resolution 
there is Ctrl-Plus to increase font sizes in browsers. 

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Rajko.
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Re: [opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[G T Smith]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Stan Goodman wrote:
> ** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 20:27:20 +0100
> 
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>



> 
> But at the moment, there are three questions on the practical level, of which
> two remain problems:
> 
> 1) The jre was installed where it is by rpm without asking me; it is easy to
> remove if I choose to do so; this is not a problem.

True..

> 2) The jdk was installed (foolishly, without thinking) in my home directory,
> and I really want to remove, and to do so in such a way as not to make more
> trouble for myself. The Software Management tool is of no help for this. How
> should I go about removing it, so that I can reinstall from an rpm package?

I am a bit bemused by this... the SuSE install usually puts the JDK in
the Java installation tree... Did you install with YaST or with the rpm
installation tools? Yast should give you the option to remove it if it
was installed via Yast...


> 3) It is possible that the jdk installed by rpm will straighten out the PATH
> question automatically. I would still like to know how one can revise or 
> remove
> a directory (i.e. the string between two colons) in the PATH variable. Can
> someone tell me that?
> 

Here you are talking about modifying the bash profiles... Where you make
the changes depends on whether you want the path to change globally or
for a particular user, or on login.


/etc/profile for system wide configuration
~/.bash_profile ~/.bash_login or ~/.profile) for user login
~/.bashrc for non login shells

for a starter

these are effectively scripts and some knowledge of BASH scripting is a
good idea before attempting to modify these, (and read the BASH
documentation). Getting this wrong could make life rather interesting :-)

For Java use editing the PATH variable is NOT required...


- --
==
I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my
telephone.
My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone.

Bjarne Stroustrup
==
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Druid]

>
> There is no moderator, you twit.

there is


>
> Shut up,  you arrogant, stuck-up pompous asshole.
>
>
> Some people on this list (and others) say I'm rude...
> but it's ONLY towards jerks such as yourself.

They mean dumb, ok? Dumb, not rude.

Marcio
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Druid
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Aaron Kulkis]

Greg Freemyer wrote:

On 9/7/07, Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Felix Miata wrote:

You won't get it from this old geezer. I see hundreds of posts from dozens of 
mailing lists each day. There's no way I'm going to remember the context of 
some random reply, so I nearly always have to read some quoted
material before the reply can have contextual meaning.



I don't mind top posts at all, because the subject is enough to give me
context. The answer is what I want, and quickly. A small snippet of the
previous thread, just enough to give context, is optimal, and I don't
care too much if it's above or below the answer.

What I don't like is having to wade down through the tedious history of
a huge series of postings (all of which I've read several times before)
just to see a one-line answer buried at the very bottom.

Joe


Joe,

You might want to experiment with gmail.  It takes all quoted text and
hides it behind a hypertext that says "- Show quoted text -" most of
the time.

Then if you need the context you just click on it.  I too read
hundreds of list based emails a day.  I only expand the quoted text a
couple times a day (if that).



That's great if you like web-mail, and all of it's attendant
slowness associated with synchronous download operation, as
opposed to the advantages of asynchronous download operation
with normal, workstation-based mailers, in which all messages
are downloaded to my computer as soon as they're available.
Thus, I can go from message to message with the speed limited
only by the 1/4 Gigabyte/second data transfer speeds of my
machine's internal data busses, NOT the 1 MB/second or less
of my ISP connection (and even WORSE when I was in Baghdad...)

It's quite presumptuous to assume that everyone has
good network bandwidth.  Many participants do not.



Greg




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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Aaron Kulkis]

Carlos E. R. wrote:

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1


The Friday 2007-09-07 at 14:07 -0400, Greg Freemyer wrote:


You might want to experiment with gmail.  It takes all quoted text and
hides it behind a hypertext that says "- Show quoted text -" most of
the time.


This has the side effect that when people reply, they "forget" to remove 
the extra material, because they don't see it.


Bottom posting without removing extra quotes is, IMO, somewhat worse than 
top posting.



Indeed, for a couple of years, I once did that deliberately
with ALL messages to soc.singles, just because the majority
of the participants on that newsgroup were assholes.


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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Michael Skiba]

Am Freitag, 7. September 2007 19:33:54 schrieb Druid:
> PS: I top posted and bottom posted this reply so everybody will feel
> all warm and fuzzy
Unfortunately I just read it after I read the whole Top-Posting - where I had 
to wonder. So it didn't really help, sorry.

Just for the record I didn't take a position in this argue yet, but I can 
understand the people who don't like Top-Posting.

Greetings
Michael


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Re: [opensuse] Re: list cops blaming top posts

[Aaron Kulkis]

Stevens wrote:

On Thursday 06 September 2007 10:55, Eberhard Roloff wrote:

At the same time I am not someone that expects anyone in Italy (where I
happened to do some vacation) to understand and speak my language.
Instead I struggle hard to meet Italians within their own comfort zone
as much as I can.

Surprise, this works much better for me. :-)))

kind regards
Eberhard


Also,

On Thursday 06 September 2007 10:33  Patrick Shanahan wrote:

Almost like refusing to remove your shoes when entering an
establishment where that action is required.

Please, refuse to recognize accepted standards.  It's the way to show
that you are you.  My sons both acted that way when they were 3-5  :^)


=

I think that there is a bit of confusion here. On the one hand we talk of 
"standards" and on the other speak of accomodation. I submit that the

de facto standard is the way that millions of emailers send email, not
the way that a miniscule number of newsgroupies do. As far as 
accomodation, please note that I, in fact, do bottom post. I just don't care 
if someone else does not.


Just because the morons in Redmond set up a stupid default
configuration in no way obligates everyone else to follow
a stupid example.  Especially people on a list such as this--
who, by the very fact that they have installed an operating
system, and use it, and it's NOT windows, have demonstrated
the required computer proficiency to be able to figure out
how to properly reply to an e-mail in a coherent readable
manner.



As far as removing shoes, I guess it depends on how bad your feet stink
and what that does to the taste of the sushi.


Sushi's not food... sushi is the bait you use to catch food ;-)



Fred



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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Aaron Kulkis]

Stevens wrote:

Eberhard, and others:

I view the list's messages individually in kmail, not as a newsgroup
and not with a threaded view. It matters not to me if someone top 
posts, bottom posts or inserts comments in the included text.


In fairness to those who make the "mistake" of top posting, many
email clients (especially the free ones, like Yahoo mail) put you
at the top of any included text when you do a "reply to". It takes


Lots of things take effort... like turning the key before you
drive your carsuch a GREAT effort, and yet, millions upon
millions of people do it several times each day.

I never realized that holding down the [down-arrow]
key was such a great effort...

By the way, bottom posting also encourages TRIMMING of
the previous replies.  Every group I've been in which
top-posting is the norm, individual messages contain
a dozen or more prior postings in each new reply...which,
to be frank, provides TOO MUCH history (while, still
difficult to follow because it's stacked backwards.




a bit of effort to invert that order. Also, most, if not all, corporate
email exchanges use top posting, so insisting that users bottom
post is forcing users to modify their behavior to satisfy the limits
of the software (your threading newsgroup stuff).

Like I said above, I don't give a rip one way or the other. I just find it
amusing that I can almost set my watch to the time that it takes
someone to admonish "No top post, please!"

Fred



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Re: [opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[Stan Goodman]

** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 20:27:20 +0100

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Stan Goodman wrote:
> > ** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 15:21:38 +0100
> > 
> >> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> >> Hash: SHA1
> >>
> >> Stan Goodman wrote:
> >>> The system is x86_64 openSuSE v10.2.
> >>>
> >>> Previously, it contained jre v1.4.2, and PATH contained the string
> >>> .
> >>>
> 
> >>>
> >>> but seems to ignore completely the question of changing existing 
> >>> directories.
> >>> How to go about this?
> >>>
> >> The first thing is that Java is a bit special about it handles these
> >> things, the system path is usually irrelevant to java. JAVA_HOME is
> >> important... as are a few other variables...
> > 
> > So far, I have been using full pathname to call java 1.6.0 to start java
> > applications (because PATH isn't correct for this version, as I said). I 
> > would,
> > however, like to make the needed correction, if for no other reason than to
> > shorten the command line in the scripts that call these apps. But I take 
> > your
> > point -- the other variables are important.
> > 
> > The jre that I installed was indeed installed through YaST from an rpm 
> > package:
> > , because I find it in YaST's Software Management tool. I 
> > do
> > not find the jdk; what is the method I need to use for removing it properly,
> > after which I will try to find the appropriate rpm package? 
> > 
> > Although I removed the jre v1.4.2 package using YaST, I now find the 
> > following
> > two installed packages in Software Management:
> > 
> > jre-1_4_2-gci-compat
> > jre-1_4_2-gci-compat.32bit
> > 
> > I don't recognize these; shall I remove them, since there is no 
> > corresponding
> > jre?
> > 
> > 
> >> Look at the following
> >>
> >> /etc/java/java.conf
> >> /etc/profile.d/alljava.sh
> >>
> >> to get an idea of what is happening.
> >>
> >> I would recommend using the SuSE rpms (particularly on x64 systems) as
> >> things are a bit non standard (in a rather elegant manner).
> > 
> 
> Firstly with the SuSE Java installation I would have expected a symbolic
> link from /usr/bin/java to /etc/alternatives/java for later
> configurations (this is a link into the the java installation tree. This
> rather hides some of the messy version numbering bits so is largely
> version tolerant...)... or some such..
> 
> The other two are hangovers from 1.4.2 which was only available in a
> 32bit form...

Then I gather that I may remove them, as seemed reasonable.
> 
> I do not remember seeing any java stuff in the system path in the past
> on SuSE but I tend to work with Eclipse so this usually well hidden...
> Java is supposed to be OS agnostic so it carrys around it own
> environment. ...

But at the moment, there are three questions on the practical level, of which
two remain problems:

1) The jre was installed where it is by rpm without asking me; it is easy to
remove if I choose to do so; this is not a problem.
2) The jdk was installed (foolishly, without thinking) in my home directory,
and I really want to remove, and to do so in such a way as not to make more
trouble for myself. The Software Management tool is of no help for this. How
should I go about removing it, so that I can reinstall from an rpm package?
3) It is possible that the jdk installed by rpm will straighten out the PATH
question automatically. I would still like to know how one can revise or remove
a directory (i.e. the string between two colons) in the PATH variable. Can
someone tell me that?

-- 
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel

Did Ken Starr suffer from Subpoenis Envy?
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Re: [opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[G T Smith]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Stan Goodman wrote:
> ** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 15:21:38 +0100
> 
>> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Stan Goodman wrote:
>>> The system is x86_64 openSuSE v10.2.
>>>
>>> Previously, it contained jre v1.4.2, and PATH contained the string
>>> .
>>>

>>>
>>> but seems to ignore completely the question of changing existing 
>>> directories.
>>> How to go about this?
>>>
>> The first thing is that Java is a bit special about it handles these
>> things, the system path is usually irrelevant to java. JAVA_HOME is
>> important... as are a few other variables...
> 
> So far, I have been using full pathname to call java 1.6.0 to start java
> applications (because PATH isn't correct for this version, as I said). I 
> would,
> however, like to make the needed correction, if for no other reason than to
> shorten the command line in the scripts that call these apps. But I take your
> point -- the other variables are important.
> 
> The jre that I installed was indeed installed through YaST from an rpm 
> package:
> , because I find it in YaST's Software Management tool. I do
> not find the jdk; what is the method I need to use for removing it properly,
> after which I will try to find the appropriate rpm package? 
> 
> Although I removed the jre v1.4.2 package using YaST, I now find the following
> two installed packages in Software Management:
> 
> jre-1_4_2-gci-compat
> jre-1_4_2-gci-compat.32bit
> 
> I don't recognize these; shall I remove them, since there is no corresponding
> jre?
> 
> 
>> Look at the following
>>
>> /etc/java/java.conf
>> /etc/profile.d/alljava.sh
>>
>> to get an idea of what is happening.
>>
>> I would recommend using the SuSE rpms (particularly on x64 systems) as
>> things are a bit non standard (in a rather elegant manner).
> 

Firstly with the SuSE Java installation I would have expected a symbolic
link from /usr/bin/java to /etc/alternatives/java for later
configurations (this is a link into the the java installation tree. This
rather hides some of the messy version numbering bits so is largely
version tolerant...)... or some such..

The other two are hangovers from 1.4.2 which was only available in a
32bit form...

I do not remember seeing any java stuff in the system path in the past
on SuSE but I tend to work with Eclipse so this usually well hidden...
Java is supposed to be OS agnostic so it carrys around it own
environment. ...


- --
==
I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my
telephone.
My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone.

Bjarne Stroustrup
==
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Re: [opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[Stan Goodman]

** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 15:21:38 +0100

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Stan Goodman wrote:
> > The system is x86_64 openSuSE v10.2.
> > 
> > Previously, it contained jre v1.4.2, and PATH contained the string
> > .
> > 
> > Recently I updated to jre v1.6.0, and the new PATH string should be
> >  (but it remains as before, because I am not 
> > clear
> > on how to change it).
> > 
> > But then I decided that what I really need is a JDK, so I installed jdk
> > v1.6.0_02. The installer suggested installing in <~/jdk1.6.0_02/bin>, and I
> > accepted this. -- I am not uncomfortable with the JDK in the user directory,
> > with a JRE available for anyone else, so the new phrase in PATH should be
> > , and the JDK equivalent should be in the user's
> > PATH.
> > 
> > The sources I have found from a Google search indicate that I should change 
> > the
> > global PATH variable by editing the file /etc/profile. But when I opened (as
> > root) that file, and searched for the string "jre" to find the place to 
> > edit, I
> > was unable to find it. Moreover, there is a warning at the top of that file
> > telling me that changes in the profile may not survive a system update, 
> > which
> > is discouraging. The fact that "jre" is not found at all is inexplicable to 
> > me,
> > since "jre" is known to be contained in the PATH, and I would like to
> > understand why it isn't present.
> > 
> > The 'Net offers much advice on how to add a directory to PATH by the 
> > sequence:
> > 
> > PATH = $PATH:
> > export PATH
> > 
> > but seems to ignore completely the question of changing existing 
> > directories.
> > How to go about this?
> > 
> 
> The first thing is that Java is a bit special about it handles these
> things, the system path is usually irrelevant to java. JAVA_HOME is
> important... as are a few other variables...

So far, I have been using full pathname to call java 1.6.0 to start java
applications (because PATH isn't correct for this version, as I said). I would,
however, like to make the needed correction, if for no other reason than to
shorten the command line in the scripts that call these apps. But I take your
point -- the other variables are important.

The jre that I installed was indeed installed through YaST from an rpm package:
, because I find it in YaST's Software Management tool. I do
not find the jdk; what is the method I need to use for removing it properly,
after which I will try to find the appropriate rpm package? 

Although I removed the jre v1.4.2 package using YaST, I now find the following
two installed packages in Software Management:

jre-1_4_2-gci-compat
jre-1_4_2-gci-compat.32bit

I don't recognize these; shall I remove them, since there is no corresponding
jre?


> 
> Look at the following
> 
> /etc/java/java.conf
> /etc/profile.d/alljava.sh
> 
> to get an idea of what is happening.
> 
> I would recommend using the SuSE rpms (particularly on x64 systems) as
> things are a bit non standard (in a rather elegant manner).

-- 
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel

REAL similes/metaphors by high school students; #19: The plan was simple, like 
my brother-in-law Phil. But unlike Phil, this plan just might work.
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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Carlos E. R.]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1


The Friday 2007-09-07 at 16:06 +0100, Matthew Stringer wrote:

> > applying the delta is certainly much faster then waiting for the
> > torrents to finish.
> 
> Forgive me, not done this before so the old iso would be a 10.2 DVD ISO or do 
> I need a 10.3 DVD image of some sort to start off with?

Yes, of course. You need the previous iso, ie, 10.3 beta 2.

If you have beta 1 you have to apply two deltas in succession.

- -- 
Cheers,
   Carlos E. R.

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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Carlos E. R.]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1


The Friday 2007-09-07 at 14:07 -0400, Greg Freemyer wrote:

> You might want to experiment with gmail.  It takes all quoted text and
> hides it behind a hypertext that says "- Show quoted text -" most of
> the time.

This has the side effect that when people reply, they "forget" to remove 
the extra material, because they don't see it.

Bottom posting without removing extra quotes is, IMO, somewhat worse than 
top posting. And chained top-posting (dozens of old posts, complete, at 
the bottom) is the worst of all.

- -- 
Cheers,
   Carlos E. R.

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=HSyR
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Re: [opensuse] Re: USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[James Knott]

Carlos E. R. wrote:
>
> At least till my PC falls to pieces and I'm forced to replace it :-p
>
That can be arranged.  ;-)
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Greg Freemyer]

On 9/7/07, Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Felix Miata wrote:
> > You won't get it from this old geezer. I see hundreds of posts from dozens 
> > of mailing lists each day. There's no way I'm going to remember the context 
> > of some random reply, so I nearly always have to read some quoted
> > material before the reply can have contextual meaning.
> >
> >
> I don't mind top posts at all, because the subject is enough to give me
> context. The answer is what I want, and quickly. A small snippet of the
> previous thread, just enough to give context, is optimal, and I don't
> care too much if it's above or below the answer.
>
> What I don't like is having to wade down through the tedious history of
> a huge series of postings (all of which I've read several times before)
> just to see a one-line answer buried at the very bottom.
>
> Joe

Joe,

You might want to experiment with gmail.  It takes all quoted text and
hides it behind a hypertext that says "- Show quoted text -" most of
the time.

Then if you need the context you just click on it.  I too read
hundreds of list based emails a day.  I only expand the quoted text a
couple times a day (if that).

Greg
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[G T Smith]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Chuck Davis wrote:
> I'm an old geezer but have not yet gotten so decrepit that I cannot
> remember the essence of threads in which I participate.  I want
> 


This is getting a little out of hand ...

This is really to some extent a matter of common sense. This most
important thing is to keep the content in some sort of coherent order so
others can have a good chances of comprehending what the information is...

As an aside there is a rational rather than religious reason that bottom
posting is probably a better practise...

For written English it is more natural to follow the sequence of
responses down the page, it is expected that the last thing written is
the most recent thing written... Top posting to be consistent would need
to be the a push down stack of replies which is the complete reverse of
the way that most western readers readers scan written english,... it
effectively makes anything of any substance more difficult to read... (I
believe there has been research to that supports this statement).

(AFAIK there is no written script which goes bottom to top, right to
left, left to right top to bottom are used in various combinations but
bottom to top is unknown ..., )

mean.
I
what  ...
see
you
if

:-)
- --
==
I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my
telephone.
My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone.

Bjarne Stroustrup
==
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

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ZGNrJ6gVFCt/IfDXveCRJ8k=
=wkAf
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[jdd]

Sloan wrote:


What I don't like is having to wade down through the tedious history of
a huge series of postings (all of which I've read several times before)
just to see a one-line answer buried at the very bottom.


this is also a very bad action by the poster
jdd

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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Druid]

What you two think or want is completely irrelevant, for 2 reasons:
1) You are not the moderators of the list
2) The moderator couldnt care less about that topic, it seems

But its good you guys send those passionate emails telling what you
guys think and stuff, so you can let go with your internal emotions
and you will have a better day. Just let go, cry or shout  if you feel
like too. Then take a deep breath and continue with your life.

Marcio
---
Druid

PS: I top posted and bottom posted this reply so everybody will feel
all warm and fuzzy

On 9/7/07, Felix Miata <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 2007/09/07 10:01 (GMT-0700) Chuck Davis apparently typed:
>
> > I'm an old geezer but have not yet gotten so decrepit that I cannot
> > remember the essence of threads in which I participate.  I want
> > replies posted at the top so that I can a) find them easily and b)
> > don't have to wast time scrolling down.  Now, if I've forgotten the
> > essence of the thread I can always scroll down to refresh my mind --
> > which is MY problem, not the other poster's.  So I always top post and
> > I want everybody else to top post.
>
> You won't get it from this old geezer. I see hundreds of posts from dozens of 
> mailing lists each day. There's no way I'm going to remember the context of 
> some random reply, so I nearly always have to read some quoted
> material before the reply can have contextual meaning.
>
> A: Because it breaks the logical sequence of the discussion.
> Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
> A: Top-posting.
> Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?
> --
> "It yet remains a problem to be solved in human affairs,
> whether any free government can be permanent, where the
> public worship of God, and the support of religion,
> constitute no part of the policy or duty of the state in
> any assignable shape."
>  Chief Justice Joseph Story
>
>  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409
>
> Felix Miata  ***  http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/
> --
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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>
>

What you two think or want is completely irrelevant, for 2 reasons:
1) You are not the moderators of the list
2) The moderator couldnt care less about that topic, it seems

But its good you guys send those passionate emails telling what you
guys think and stuff, so you can let go with your internal emotions
and you will have a better day. Just let go, cry or shout  if you feel
like too. Then take a deep breath and continue with your life.

Marcio
---
Druid

PS: I top posted and bottom posted this reply so everybody will feel
all warm and fuzzy
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[opensuse] AMD nurtures open-source graphics

[Fred A. Miller]

"AMD is funding Suse Linux programmers at Novell to create the driver,
sharing hardware details and providing engineering help, said John
Bridgman, program manager and engineering leader for the project. An
early incarnation of the driver should be available Monday, and AMD will
help programmers gradually expand it with features such as 2D and 3D
graphics acceleration."

http://news.zdnet.com/2100-3513_22-6206581.html?tag=nl.e539

-- 
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the rich. The poor have the illusion that they would be
happier if they had more money. The rich know better.”

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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Sloan]

Felix Miata wrote:
> You won't get it from this old geezer. I see hundreds of posts from dozens of 
> mailing lists each day. There's no way I'm going to remember the context of 
> some random reply, so I nearly always have to read some quoted
> material before the reply can have contextual meaning.
>
>   
I don't mind top posts at all, because the subject is enough to give me
context. The answer is what I want, and quickly. A small snippet of the
previous thread, just enough to give context, is optimal, and I don't
care too much if it's above or below the answer.

What I don't like is having to wade down through the tedious history of
a huge series of postings (all of which I've read several times before)
just to see a one-line answer buried at the very bottom.

Joe
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Felix Miata]

On 2007/09/07 10:01 (GMT-0700) Chuck Davis apparently typed:

> I'm an old geezer but have not yet gotten so decrepit that I cannot
> remember the essence of threads in which I participate.  I want
> replies posted at the top so that I can a) find them easily and b)
> don't have to wast time scrolling down.  Now, if I've forgotten the
> essence of the thread I can always scroll down to refresh my mind --
> which is MY problem, not the other poster's.  So I always top post and
> I want everybody else to top post.

You won't get it from this old geezer. I see hundreds of posts from dozens of 
mailing lists each day. There's no way I'm going to remember the context of 
some random reply, so I nearly always have to read some quoted
material before the reply can have contextual meaning.

A: Because it breaks the logical sequence of the discussion.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?
-- 
"It yet remains a problem to be solved in human affairs,
whether any free government can be permanent, where the
public worship of God, and the support of religion,
constitute no part of the policy or duty of the state in
any assignable shape."
 Chief Justice Joseph Story

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409

Felix Miata  ***  http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/
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Re: [opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[Stan Goodman]

** Reply to message from G T Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
on Fri, 07 Sep 2007 15:21:38 +0100

> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Stan Goodman wrote:
> > The system is x86_64 openSuSE v10.2.
> > 
> > Previously, it contained jre v1.4.2, and PATH contained the string
> > .
> > 
> > Recently I updated to jre v1.6.0, and the new PATH string should be
> >  (but it remains as before, because I am not 
> > clear
> > on how to change it).
> > 
> > But then I decided that what I really need is a JDK, so I installed jdk
> > v1.6.0_02. The installer suggested installing in <~/jdk1.6.0_02/bin>, and I
> > accepted this. -- I am not uncomfortable with the JDK in the user directory,
> > with a JRE available for anyone else, so the new phrase in PATH should be
> > , and the JDK equivalent should be in the user's
> > PATH.
> > 
> > The sources I have found from a Google search indicate that I should change 
> > the
> > global PATH variable by editing the file /etc/profile. But when I opened (as
> > root) that file, and searched for the string "jre" to find the place to 
> > edit, I
> > was unable to find it. Moreover, there is a warning at the top of that file
> > telling me that changes in the profile may not survive a system update, 
> > which
> > is discouraging. The fact that "jre" is not found at all is inexplicable to 
> > me,
> > since "jre" is known to be contained in the PATH, and I would like to
> > understand why it isn't present.
> > 
> > The 'Net offers much advice on how to add a directory to PATH by the 
> > sequence:
> > 
> > PATH = $PATH:
> > export PATH
> > 
> > but seems to ignore completely the question of changing existing 
> > directories.
> > How to go about this?
> > 
> 
> The first thing is that Java is a bit special about it handles these
> things, the system path is usually irrelevant to java. JAVA_HOME is
> important... as are a few other variables...

So far, I have been using full pathname to call java 1.6.0 to start java
applications (because PATH isn't correct for this version, as I said). I would,
however, like to make the needed correction, if for no other reason than to
shorten the command line in the scripts that call these apps. But I take your
point -- the other variables are important.

The jre that I installed was indeed installed through YaST from an rpm package:
, because I find it in YaST's Software Management tool. I do
not find the jdk; what is the method I need to use for removing it properly,
after which I will try to find the appropriate rpm package? 

Although I removed the jre v1.4.2 package using YaST, I now find the following
two installed packages in Software Management:

jre-1_4_2-gci-compat
jre-1_4_2-gci-compat.32bit

I don't recognize these; shall I remove them, since there is no corresponding
jre?


> 
> Look at the following
> 
> /etc/java/java.conf
> /etc/profile.d/alljava.sh
> 
> to get an idea of what is happening.
> 
> I would recommend using the SuSE rpms (particularly on x64 systems) as
> things are a bit non standard (in a rather elegant manner).

-- 
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel

REAL similes/metaphors by high school students; #19: The plan was simple, like 
my brother-in-law Phil. But unlike Phil, this plan just might work.
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Re: [opensuse] USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[Patrick Shanahan]

* Greg Freemyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [09-07-07 13:10]:
> 
> It really should.  Maybe 10.3 will have your issue fixed?
> 

Hope so, I'm ready for 10.3, but depend on system t much to play
with beta and rc's.  But 10.1 has been solid w/smart, for me.

tks,
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Re: [opensuse] USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[Greg Freemyer]

On 9/7/07, Patrick Shanahan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> * Carlos E. R. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [09-07-07 08:55]:
> > The Friday 2007-09-07 at 08:45 -0400, Ciro Iriarte wrote:
> > > You'll have to go with an eSATA enclosure
> >
> > My MB doesn't have sata.
>
> MoxNix, smartd doesn't appear to work on my sata drives ..  :^(

It really should.  Maybe 10.3 will have your issue fixed?

Greg
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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Chuck Davis]

I'm an old geezer but have not yet gotten so decrepit that I cannot
remember the essence of threads in which I participate.  I want
replies posted at the top so that I can a) find them easily and b)
don't have to wast time scrolling down.  Now, if I've forgotten the
essence of the thread I can always scroll down to refresh my mind --
which is MY problem, not the other poster's.  So I always top post and
I want everybody else to top post.

There, I've come out of the closet!

Chuck Davis

On 9/7/07, Donald D Henson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > It's so sad that your sons no longer have any individuality...  :(
> >
> >
> > Note the top post!
> >
> > (AND the dripping sarcasm...)
>
> I've been around for awhile and have participated in several discussion
> lists like this one. In most of them, the topic of top-posting vs
> bottom-posting comes up sooner or later. In many of those, the topic
> takes on the character of a flame war, some of the discussion lists
> being destroyed by such wars. In those that survived, not much changed.
> Some people still top-posted while others still bottom-posted. My point
> is to be careful with this topic. This is a good list with lots of
> experienced people helping lots of newbies. Let's not destroy it.
>
> Don Henson
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>
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Re: [opensuse] USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[Ciro Iriarte]

2007/9/7, Carlos E. R. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
>
> The Friday 2007-09-07 at 09:40 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
>
> > MoxNix, smartd doesn't appear to work on my sata drives ..  :^(
>
> Yes, I heard that smart support is not complete yet in linux...
>
> - --
> Cheers,
>Carlos E. R.
>

S.M.A.R.T works with SATA here, even on my laptop

Regards,
Ciro
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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Michel Salim]

On 07/09/2007, Matthew Stringer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Friday 07 September 2007 15:07:58 Kenneth Schneider wrote:
> > On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 10:01 -0400, Kenneth Schneider wrote:
> > > On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:20 +0100, Matthew Stringer wrote:
> > > > Anyone know of where this is available, only sites I've seen offer
> > > > downloads via BitTorrent which will take ages.
> > >
> > > http://mirrors.kernel.org/opensuse/distribution/
> >
> > Should have added...
> >
> > Download the delta iso and use applydeltaiso to the old iso.
> >
> > applydeltaiso   
> >
> > I've been using this method since 10.0, downloads are much quicker and
> > applying the delta is certainly much faster then waiting for the
> > torrents to finish.
>
> Forgive me, not done this before so the old iso would be a 10.2 DVD ISO or do
> I need a 10.3 DVD image of some sort to start off with?
>
http://mirrors.kernel.org/opensuse/distribution/10.3-Beta3/iso/delta/

For 10.3-Beta3, deltas are only available from 10.3-Beta2, and
10.3-Beta2 has deltas from 10.3-Beta1. The mirror in question does not
carry older ISOs, though, so your best bet would be downloading the
full ISO this time and then applying the deltas for RC1 and RC2.

Regards,

-- 
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Re: [opensuse] Is there someone on the list from Santa Rosa, California?

[taharka]

How do,

On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:03 +0800, Art Fore wrote:
> If there is anyone on the list from Santa Rosa who would be willing to
> help out my Ex with her computer, please contact me. It is a Dell
> Latitude D620 with Suse 10.0. Her problm is that Evolution sometimes
> does not send email, it just leaves it in the outbox. I remember having
> the problem before, but an upgrade to Evolution seemed to fix it. I
> think and upgrade from 10.0 to 10.2 would all that would be necessary,
> but she is computer illiterate and I am here in Taiwan. She is also, or
> rather her accountant, is running XP under parallels to use Quickbooks
> (I tried to get her to use gnucash, but she didn't want to learn it), I
> believe it is version 2.0 if I remember correctly. It is running fine,
> but will have to have the parallels-config run as root after the
> upgrade.
> 
> She is traveling most weekends, so she could bring the computer by and
> you could work on it during the weekend if so desired, or she is
> sometimes gone for a whole week.
> 
> Would appreciate anyone who could help so she won't want to go back to
> the lying, thieving, unethical convicted monopolist software again. She
> does like Suse Linux, he only complaint is she has no one to fix it if
> something goes wrong like the presebnt situation. She said she had a few
> people look at it, but they just say it looks nice, but don't have a
> clue on what to do.

Not from Santa Rosa but how bout posting this on the "North Bay Linux
Users Group" mailing list? They're located in Sonoma County and should
have some members in Santa Rosa ;-) Web site is,  http://nblug.org/

> 
> Art

taharka

Lexington, Kentucky U.S.A.

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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Matthew Stringer]

On Friday 07 September 2007 15:07:58 Kenneth Schneider wrote:
> On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 10:01 -0400, Kenneth Schneider wrote:
> > On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:20 +0100, Matthew Stringer wrote:
> > > Anyone know of where this is available, only sites I've seen offer
> > > downloads via BitTorrent which will take ages.
> >
> > http://mirrors.kernel.org/opensuse/distribution/
>
> Should have added...
>
> Download the delta iso and use applydeltaiso to the old iso.
>
> applydeltaiso   
>
> I've been using this method since 10.0, downloads are much quicker and
> applying the delta is certainly much faster then waiting for the
> torrents to finish.

Forgive me, not done this before so the old iso would be a 10.2 DVD ISO or do 
I need a 10.3 DVD image of some sort to start off with?

Regards

Matthew

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Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Donald D Henson]

> It's so sad that your sons no longer have any individuality...  :(
> 
> 
> Note the top post!
> 
> (AND the dripping sarcasm...)

I've been around for awhile and have participated in several discussion
lists like this one. In most of them, the topic of top-posting vs
bottom-posting comes up sooner or later. In many of those, the topic
takes on the character of a flame war, some of the discussion lists
being destroyed by such wars. In those that survived, not much changed.
Some people still top-posted while others still bottom-posted. My point
is to be careful with this topic. This is a good list with lots of
experienced people helping lots of newbies. Let's not destroy it.

Don Henson
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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Carlos E. R.]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1


The Friday 2007-09-07 at 10:07 -0400, Kenneth Schneider wrote:

> Download the delta iso and use applydeltaiso to the old iso. 
> 
> applydeltaiso   

which is also cpu intensive for a long time.


> I've been using this method since 10.0, downloads are much quicker and
> applying the delta is certainly much faster then waiting for the
> torrents to finish.

Provided you already have the old_iso, which I don't.


Right now, the torrent is incoming at 20 Kb/s, less than my outgoing side. 
Sometimes it ups to 100KB/s, the maximum my adsl can manage. But it 
doesn't keep.

Ah! A chap from Korea was feeding me with 60KB/s an hour ago. Very nice, 
considering we are half a world apart...

- -- 
Cheers,
   Carlos E. R.

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=z32S
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: [opensuse] USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[Carlos E. R.]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1


The Friday 2007-09-07 at 09:40 -0400, Patrick Shanahan wrote:

> MoxNix, smartd doesn't appear to work on my sata drives ..  :^(

Yes, I heard that smart support is not complete yet in linux...

- -- 
Cheers,
   Carlos E. R.

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=bL2l
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: [opensuse] Re: USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[Carlos E. R.]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1


The Friday 2007-09-07 at 15:17 +0200, Eberhard Roloff wrote:

> >> You'll have to go with an eSATA enclosure
> > 
> > My MB doesn't have sata.
> > 
> With e.x. the Dawicontrol DC-154 RAID controller, you will have two
> external sata ports available and according to what I heard, they run
> well under Linux.

My last free pci port is in use by the new usb 2 card, so a sata card is 
not an option either.

It has to be usb.

At least till my PC falls to pieces and I'm forced to replace it :-p

- -- 
Cheers,
   Carlos E. R.
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0KLUQDGYaxZd/bo+tApfWeE=
=WNuo
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: [opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[G T Smith]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Stan Goodman wrote:
> The system is x86_64 openSuSE v10.2.
> 
> Previously, it contained jre v1.4.2, and PATH contained the string
> .
> 
> Recently I updated to jre v1.6.0, and the new PATH string should be
>  (but it remains as before, because I am not clear
> on how to change it).
> 
> But then I decided that what I really need is a JDK, so I installed jdk
> v1.6.0_02. The installer suggested installing in <~/jdk1.6.0_02/bin>, and I
> accepted this. -- I am not uncomfortable with the JDK in the user directory,
> with a JRE available for anyone else, so the new phrase in PATH should be
> , and the JDK equivalent should be in the user's
> PATH.
> 
> The sources I have found from a Google search indicate that I should change 
> the
> global PATH variable by editing the file /etc/profile. But when I opened (as
> root) that file, and searched for the string "jre" to find the place to edit, 
> I
> was unable to find it. Moreover, there is a warning at the top of that file
> telling me that changes in the profile may not survive a system update, which
> is discouraging. The fact that "jre" is not found at all is inexplicable to 
> me,
> since "jre" is known to be contained in the PATH, and I would like to
> understand why it isn't present.
> 
> The 'Net offers much advice on how to add a directory to PATH by the sequence:
> 
> PATH = $PATH:
> export PATH
> 
> but seems to ignore completely the question of changing existing directories.
> How to go about this?
> 

The first thing is that Java is a bit special about it handles these
things, the system path is usually irrelevant to java. JAVA_HOME is
important... as are a few other variables

Look at the following

/etc/java/java.conf
/etc/profile.d/alljava.sh

to get an idea of what is happening.

I would recommend using the SuSE rpms (particularly on x64 systems) as
things are a bit non standard (in a rather elegant manner).



- --
==
I have always wished that my computer would be as easy to use as my
telephone.
My wish has come true. I no longer know how to use my telephone.

Bjarne Stroustrup
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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Kenneth Schneider]

On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 10:01 -0400, Kenneth Schneider wrote:
> On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:20 +0100, Matthew Stringer wrote:
> > Anyone know of where this is available, only sites I've seen offer 
> > downloads 
> > via BitTorrent which will take ages.
> > 
> 
> http://mirrors.kernel.org/opensuse/distribution/
> 

Should have added...

Download the delta iso and use applydeltaiso to the old iso. 

applydeltaiso   

I've been using this method since 10.0, downloads are much quicker and
applying the delta is certainly much faster then waiting for the
torrents to finish.

-- 
Ken Schneider
UNIX  since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE  since 1998

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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Kenneth Schneider]

On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:20 +0100, Matthew Stringer wrote:
> Anyone know of where this is available, only sites I've seen offer downloads 
> via BitTorrent which will take ages.
> 

http://mirrors.kernel.org/opensuse/distribution/

-- 
Ken Schneider
UNIX  since 1989, linux since 1994, SuSE  since 1998

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[opensuse] Re: [opensuse-gnome] Weird GNOME-related RPM problems

[Michel Salim]

On 07/09/2007, Stanislav Brabec <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On Pá, 2007-09-07 at 00:15 -0400, Michel Salim wrote:
> > I've noticed these related problems on-and-off involving GNOME
> > packages on openSUSE 10.2:
> >
> > - on a stock install, gnome-games when queried would list, among
> > others /var/games/glines.{Large,Medium,Small}.scores   --  but the RPM
> > actually installs /var/games/glines.scores
>
> Good hint. Somebody did not read updating instructions in the spec files
> and did not update scriptlets. I'll fix it. Please retest when you will
> see changelog entry regarding this problem.
>
Will do.

> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~> rpm -ql gtk2 | grep gdk-pixbuf
> > /etc/opt/gnome/gtk-2.0/gdk-pixbuf.loaders
> > /opt/gnome/bin/gdk-pixbuf-query-loaders
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~> ls /etc/opt/gnome/gtk-2.0/*.loaders
> > ls: cannot access /etc/opt/gnome/gtk-2.0/*.loaders: No such file or 
> > directory
>
> It seems, that while upgrading, it calls old binary instead of
> just-installed one.
>
> Strange. It should be done by SuSEconfig (did you installed by YaST or
> manually; if manually, did you run it?).
Ah yes. I forgot that! smart is so much faster than YaST or zypper in
10.2 that I've started using it, forgetting the need to run
SuSEconfig.

>
> Maybe gtk2 reported some upgrade error and both instances were kept?
No, I actually tried removing (--nodeps) and then installing it.

So the GTK2 packaging (and gnome-games) actually installs
configuration files, and then a post-install scriptlet *remove* them,
and the files are only reintroduced when the corresponding SuSEconfig
script is run?

Shouldn't rpm -V catch the problem? (It does not in this case)

Thanks,

-- 
Michel
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Re: [opensuse] USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[Patrick Shanahan]

* Carlos E. R. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [09-07-07 08:55]:
> The Friday 2007-09-07 at 08:45 -0400, Ciro Iriarte wrote:
> > You'll have to go with an eSATA enclosure
> 
> My MB doesn't have sata.

MoxNix, smartd doesn't appear to work on my sata drives ..  :^(

-- 
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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Roger Oberholtzer]

On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 19:01 +0800, Art Fore wrote:
> On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:20 +0100, Matthew Stringer wrote:
> > Anyone know of where this is available, only sites I've seen offer 
> > downloads 
> > via BitTorrent which will take ages.
> > 
> > Regards
> > 
> > Matthew
> > 
> Glad to see that I am not the only who has slow downloads via
> bittorrent, and you are considerably closer to OpenSuse than I am.
> (Taiwan)

I think it could be useful if it was announced a few days ahead. The we
could all start our torrents then the starter pistol fires and be happy.

I downloaded the latest beta last weekend and it averaged 300kb or so.
Not bad. But it still took a long time.

I can understand a policy of torrent only for a certain time after the
initial release, when activity should keep the download time reasonable.
Does the OpenSUSE torrent track how many systems are downloading?
Perhaps, when that dips below some reasonable number, the more direct
access can be enabled?

BTW, I like lots of what I see in 10.3. Only a few warts. I am going to
check the bugzilla and see if I have anything not known.

-- 
Roger Oberholtzer

OPQ Systems / Ramböll RST

Ramböll Sverige AB
Kapellgränd 7
P.O. Box 4205
SE-102 65 Stockholm, Sweden

Tel: Int +46 8-615 60 20
Fax: Int +46 8-31 42 23

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[opensuse] Editting PATH variable

[Stan Goodman]

The system is x86_64 openSuSE v10.2.

Previously, it contained jre v1.4.2, and PATH contained the string
.

Recently I updated to jre v1.6.0, and the new PATH string should be
 (but it remains as before, because I am not clear
on how to change it).

But then I decided that what I really need is a JDK, so I installed jdk
v1.6.0_02. The installer suggested installing in <~/jdk1.6.0_02/bin>, and I
accepted this. -- I am not uncomfortable with the JDK in the user directory,
with a JRE available for anyone else, so the new phrase in PATH should be
, and the JDK equivalent should be in the user's
PATH.

The sources I have found from a Google search indicate that I should change the
global PATH variable by editing the file /etc/profile. But when I opened (as
root) that file, and searched for the string "jre" to find the place to edit, I
was unable to find it. Moreover, there is a warning at the top of that file
telling me that changes in the profile may not survive a system update, which
is discouraging. The fact that "jre" is not found at all is inexplicable to me,
since "jre" is known to be contained in the PATH, and I would like to
understand why it isn't present.

The 'Net offers much advice on how to add a directory to PATH by the sequence:

PATH = $PATH:
export PATH

but seems to ignore completely the question of changing existing directories.
How to go about this?

-- 
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel

Idiotic commercials heard on CNN, #3: "It's funny how airlines always focus on 
the big things. To me, it's the little things that are important." -- for 
Scandinavian Airlines
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[opensuse] Re: USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[Eberhard Roloff]

Carlos E. R. wrote:
> 
> The Friday 2007-09-07 at 08:45 -0400, Ciro Iriarte wrote:
> 
>>> Somebody knows of an external ide-usb box supporting smart
>>> (Self-Monitoring, Analysis and Reporting Technology)?
>> You'll have to go with an eSATA enclosure
> 
> My MB doesn't have sata.
> 
With e.x. the Dawicontrol DC-154 RAID controller, you will have two
external sata ports available and according to what I heard, they run
well under Linux.

regards
Eberhard

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Re: [opensuse] USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[Carlos E. R.]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1


The Friday 2007-09-07 at 08:45 -0400, Ciro Iriarte wrote:

> > Somebody knows of an external ide-usb box supporting smart
> > (Self-Monitoring, Analysis and Reporting Technology)?
> 
> You'll have to go with an eSATA enclosure

My MB doesn't have sata.

- -- 
Cheers,
   Carlos E. R.
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Re: [opensuse] USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[Ciro Iriarte]

2007/9/7, Carlos E. R. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
>
> The Wednesday 2007-09-05 at 20:31 -0400, Jorge Fábregas wrote:
>
> > Thank you guys for your comments/suggestions. I really appreciate it. I 
> > think
> > I'll be considering one of these USB IDE disk caddies.  I never thought 
> > about
> > them.
>
> Yes, I'm starting to use them, too.
>
> There is one concern I have about these: they don't support the full IDE
> standard, meaning that SMART doesn't work. The drive can't be tested.
> True, smart doesn't always predict failure, but it helps.
>
> Somebody knows of an external ide-usb box supporting smart
> (Self-Monitoring, Analysis and Reporting Technology)?
>
> - --
> Cheers,
>Carlos E. R.

You'll have to go with an eSATA enclosure

Regards,
Ciro

RE: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

[Michael Smith]

It's so sad that your sons no longer have any individuality...  :(


Note the top post!

(AND the dripping sarcasm...)

-Original Message-
From: Patrick Shanahan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2007 11:34 AM
To: opensuse@opensuse.org
Subject: Re: [opensuse] list cops blaming top posts

* Stevens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [09-06-07 11:25]:
> I view the list's messages individually in kmail, not as a newsgroup
> and not with a threaded view. It matters not to me if someone top 
> posts, bottom posts or inserts comments in the included text.

your choice

> In fairness to those who make the "mistake" of top posting, many
> email clients (especially the free ones, like Yahoo mail) put you
> at the top of any included text when you do a "reply to". 

still choice

> It takes a bit of effort to invert that order. Also, most, if not all,
> corporate email exchanges use top posting, so insisting that users
> bottom post is forcing users to modify their behavior to satisfy the
> limits of the software (your threading newsgroup stuff).

Kind of like going to another country and refusing to observe their
customs, use their language, eat their food or commerce with their coin.

> Like I said above, I don't give a rip one way or the other. I just
> find it amusing that I can almost set my watch to the time that it
> takes someone to admonish "No top post, please!"

Almost like refusing to remove your shoes when entering an
establishment where that action is required.

Please, refuse to recognize accepted standards.  It's the way to show
that you are you.  My sons both acted that way when they were 3-5  :^)


-- 
Patrick Shanahan Plainfield, Indiana, USAHOG # US1244711
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Registered Linux User #207535@ http://counter.li.org
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No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition. 
Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.7/992 - Release Date: 9/6/2007
8:36 AM
 
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[opensuse] USB IDE disk caddies [Was: Tape Drive for personal usage]

[Carlos E. R.]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1


The Wednesday 2007-09-05 at 20:31 -0400, Jorge Fábregas wrote:

> Thank you guys for your comments/suggestions. I really appreciate it. I think 
> I'll be considering one of these USB IDE disk caddies.  I never thought about 
> them.

Yes, I'm starting to use them, too.

There is one concern I have about these: they don't support the full IDE 
standard, meaning that SMART doesn't work. The drive can't be tested. 
True, smart doesn't always predict failure, but it helps.

Somebody knows of an external ide-usb box supporting smart 
(Self-Monitoring, Analysis and Reporting Technology)? 

- -- 
Cheers,
   Carlos E. R.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Matthew Stringer]

On Friday 07 September 2007 12:01:04 Art Fore wrote:
> On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:20 +0100, Matthew Stringer wrote:
> > Anyone know of where this is available, only sites I've seen offer
> > downloads via BitTorrent which will take ages.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Matthew
>
> Glad to see that I am not the only who has slow downloads via
> bittorrent, and you are considerably closer to OpenSuse than I am.
> (Taiwan)
>
> Art

I'm getting about 170KB/s will take about 24 hours to download. From a decent 
FTP server I'd get between 4 and 40MB/s would be able to download this in 
minutes (perks of working for a large ISP).

Matthew

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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Art Fore]

On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 19:01 +0800, Art Fore wrote:
> On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:20 +0100, Matthew Stringer wrote:
> > Anyone know of where this is available, only sites I've seen offer 
> > downloads 
> > via BitTorrent which will take ages.
> > 
> > Regards
> > 
> > Matthew
> > 
> Glad to see that I am not the only who has slow downloads via
> bittorrent, and you are considerably closer to OpenSuse than I am.
> (Taiwan)
> 
> Art
> 

Just tried it in Suse 10.2, it came up 27 days after about 10 minutes.
10.2 Beta2 is coming up a more reasonable 3 day, but that is still a
long time.

Art

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Re: [opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Art Fore]

On Fri, 2007-09-07 at 11:20 +0100, Matthew Stringer wrote:
> Anyone know of where this is available, only sites I've seen offer downloads 
> via BitTorrent which will take ages.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Matthew
> 
Glad to see that I am not the only who has slow downloads via
bittorrent, and you are considerably closer to OpenSuse than I am.
(Taiwan)

Art

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[opensuse] FTP download of 10.3 Beta3 DVD ISO

[Matthew Stringer]

Anyone know of where this is available, only sites I've seen offer downloads 
via BitTorrent which will take ages.

Regards

Matthew

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Re: [opensuse] How to manage 100+ linux boxes?

[Gaël Lams]

Hi,

> > Is there a standard way to remotely manage 100+ SUSE boxes?  The
> > machines are NLPOS9, which is based on SLES9, which is in turn based
> > on SUSE 9.1.  I need a way to remotely administer them, with cheaper
> > solutions being ideal.

I'm not sure that there is a "standard" way. There are different
tools. Someone indicated cfengine, which is the "oldest" of these
tools.
There is also puppet and bcfg2.
I've heard that bcfg2 it's easier than cfengine but never tried it.

> > The problem is having to individually log in and tweak things on 100+
> > boxes. The administration tasks would be applying security updates,
> > and working with files for custom applications.
> >
> > I believe I can do this with two shell scripts, a "control" script and
> > a "job" script.  The control script would copy (via scp) and remotely
> > run (via SSH) the job script to a list of servers stored in an ASCII
> > file. Is this the standard way of doing this?

Shell scripts are for sure the easiest way to start and there are some
scripts around

> and i thought that NLPOS9  was supposed to do such things completly different.
> Whats about uploading new image with sec update installed (you can do delta
> image)? There is also utility to do same basic maintanence utility to
> configure boxes from AdminServer.

NLP is still based on linux, it probably has some specific commands,
but I immagine that they should be scriptable.

Regards,

Gael
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Re: [opensuse] Where can I send corrections for fortune?

[Pavel Nemec]

Dne Thursday 06 September 2007 11:16:09 Johannes Jowereit napsal(a):
> Hello,
> 
> I have discovered a few minor mistakes (double entries/typos) in the 
> fortune program included in openSUSE 10.2.
> 
> Unfortunately I could not find any information about the author in the 
> package, so can anybody tell me where I can send the corrections? 
> Shall I give them directly to the openSUSE team?

You can create bug, add your suggestion and hope that maintainer of fortune 
will add them to patch.
BTW did you try fortune with cows?

 
/ All syllogisms have three parts,   \
\ therefore this is not a syllogism. /
 
\   ^__^
 \  (oo)\___
(__)\   )\/\
||w |
|| ||


> 
> Best regards,
> Johannes Jowereit
> --
> Black holes are where God divided by zero -- Steven Wright
> 



-- 
Pavel Nemec
Software Engineer
-  
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190 00 Praha 9  fax:+420 296 542 374   
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Re: [opensuse] How to manage 100+ linux boxes?

[Pavel Nemec]

Dne Wednesday 05 September 2007 17:54:09 Xn Nooby napsal(a):
> Is there a standard way to remotely manage 100+ SUSE boxes?  The
> machines are NLPOS9, which is based on SLES9, which is in turn based
> on SUSE 9.1.  I need a way to remotely administer them, with cheaper
> solutions being ideal.
> 
> The problem is having to individually log in and tweak things on 100+
> boxes. The administration tasks would be applying security updates,
> and working with files for custom applications.
> 
> I believe I can do this with two shell scripts, a "control" script and
> a "job" script.  The control script would copy (via scp) and remotely
> run (via SSH) the job script to a list of servers stored in an ASCII
> file. Is this the standard way of doing this?
> 
> Any suggestions?
> -- 
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> 

and i thought that NLPOS9  was supposed to do such things completly different. 
Whats about uploading new image with sec update installed (you can do delta 
image)? There is also utility to do same basic maintanence utility to 
configure boxes from AdminServer.

Anyway i will be very happy if you share how you are using NLPOS9. It is quite 
important for me ;)


-- 
Pavel Nemec
Software Engineer
-  
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[opensuse] Re: No icons

[Eberhard Roloff]

Bogdan Cristea wrote:
> I am using openSuSE 10.2 with KDE from DVD GM distribution. I have changed
> the kernel to 2.6.22.5-8 version due to some issues with ACPI.
>I have two distinct partitions for root and home dir and my guess is that
> there are some configuration files left behind from previous installations in
> my home dir. which affect my current installation. Now I have started with a
> fresh installation formating the home partition too. I will see if the
> problem occurs again.
> 
>> Which indicates that the problem is in a desktop configuration file
>> inside your home directory (or more likely a subdirectory of it).  Since
>> you didn't tell us which GUI you're using, it's impossible to be any
>> more specific than that.
Hi Bogdan,

if I recall correctly, you had setup a differnt user for testing
purposes, i.e. a user that did not exist previously . When you used that
new user id, you automatically used a "freshly created from scratch"
home directory.

So I doubt that this is the cause of your problems. If I understood
correctly, that is.

kind regards
Eberhard

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