[AFMUG] No escape!!

[Jaime Solorza]

Lol
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Re: [AFMUG] Tracking Down Licensed Noise

[Tim Hardy]

Nate,

Send me the call signs or path information on the path you’re
concerned about + any info on the other entities and we’ll run an analysis
for you.

Tim Hardy

On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 10:22 AM Josh Luthman 
wrote:

> I would use the SAF spectrum analyzer and go to where that dish is, since
> you know what it is, and check the 18 GHz output.  If you can do it in your
> day time window 7-1 that would be even better.  If you're getting the noise
> and you can see it's there, better still.
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> 
> Suite 1337
> 
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 9:09 AM Daniel White  wrote:
>
>> SAF Tehnika has an awesome spectrum analyzer that covers 18GHz and it
>> isn't too expensive.  That would allow you for instance to shut down your
>> radio during interference events and take a measurement and from there you
>> can take your spectrum hunting on the road.
>>
>> [image: photograph]
>> Daniel White
>> Co-Founder - Business Development & Operations
>> phone: +1 (702) 470-2766
>> direct: +1 (702) 470-2770
>> Nate Burke wrote on 8/29/19 06:55:
>>
>> In my ongoing saga of troubleshooting an 18ghz link, we think we're
>> pretty sure the issue we are having now is Noise.  From around 7am - noon
>> or 1pm, the background noise on my Horizontal polarity goes to about -81.
>> Has anyone had to troubleshoot finding the source of noise on a licensed
>> channel?  Do you just start contacting everyone on the same channel within
>> a few miles and see if they will disable their transmitter to see if it
>> goes away?
>>
>> We have found 2 other licenses which are pointing kind of at us.  If I
>> point my dish (in RX only mode) at one of the transmitters, which is 10
>> degrees off my path (I am 4 degrees off their path), I hear it at -70
>>
>> The Other license is for one of the Day Traders.  The GPS Coordinates in
>> the License put it 20 degrees off my path, I know there is no dish where
>> the GPS Coordinates say.  However, if it's where I think it might be (on a
>> pole on the other end of the building), then it's basically pointing at
>> me.  Although, with it being a Day trader, there's a good chance it was
>> never installed, or has been decommissioned.  Those guys throw licenses and
>> dishes up and down like yesterdays fashions.
>>
>> Any Tips for the next step?
>>
>>
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Re: [AFMUG] Urgent message for Chuck Macenski!

[Carl Peterson]

Why are UBNTs copper interfaces so prone to damage / CRC errors?  I'm at
the point where I just design for an FPOE ever time I install an AF(foo).

On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 1:29 PM Seth Mattinen  wrote:

> On 8/28/19 12:31, Mike Hammett wrote:
> > SFP+ should definitely be on there.
> >
> >
> > Honestly, Ubiquiti is a lost cause. All other major manufacturers have
> > put SFPs on radios.
>
>
> But it's air *fiber*, it's already got it, see?
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?

[Steve Jones]

we do a 600ss as a dmarc into every house. we care the mccown replacement
cards now for any that need replaced. We used the beehive ones back in the
day but they werent compatible with the 320 at the time so we did the
600ss. will probably migrate to mccown tech again since theyre not kidney
expensive and pretty universal

On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 2:33 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> The other thing that plagued us, at least with the 600SS, was the
> protection diodes would get partially blown after a surge event, causing
> really bad CRC errors.  We wouldn’t have a clue until the customer called
> bitching his Internet was slow.  Usually, not always, we could force
> 10BaseT on the SM until we could roll a truck and replace the 600SS.
> Actually we would take out the PCB and replace it with an inline coupler.
> Now that Chuck has a gas tube replacement PCB maybe we would use those
> instead of a coupler.  I don’t think a GDT would degrade like the diodes.
> FWIW we still have that problem with the Tycon POEs that include a surge
> protector, but we can just send UPS out with a replacement and have the
> customer DIY the replacement.
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Mark Radabaugh
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 29, 2019 1:59 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?
>
>
>
> Not sure on the ‘listed’ question, but you are correct about damage to the
> router.
>
>
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> On Aug 29, 2019, at 2:29 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>
>
> But wouldn’t NEC require a “listed” antenna discharge unit (i.e. surge
> suppressor)?  I doubt any of the usual suspects are listed.  The
> alternative would be to use shielded cable and ground the shield with a
> grounding block at the entrance to the house.  That seems to be the
> approach taken by sat TV installers, but they are using coax anyway and it
> has a shield.
>
>
>
> With a grounding block, I’m not sure if the requirement is that it be
> bonded to the electrical system ground, probably with a humongous wire.
>
>
>
> That’s why we stopped putting the Canopy surge suppressors on the outside
> of houses, in our rural area, properly bonding the ground is impossible on
> many houses.  But with imperfect grounding, we found that the outside surge
> suppressors greatly increased the likelihood that the customer’s router
> would get the Internet port fried.  Ground potential differences.  The old
> adage “ground’s ground the world around” ain’t true, at least not when
> lightning hits a tree in the yard or the transformer on the utility pole.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Mark Radabaugh
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 29, 2019 12:41 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?
>
>
>
> We do and always have.When lightning burns down the house I very much
> want the fire inspector to find the melted Cambium logo on the surge
> suppressor cover.We built it per NEC, sorry about the house burning
> down.   Sue the guys with the deep pockets, not me.
>
>
>
> Mark
>
>
>
>
> On Aug 29, 2019, at 1:05 PM, Sam Lambie  wrote:
>
>
>
> I am wondering how many of you install either a Cambium SS, McCowntech SS
> or Ubiquiti SS at a customers house.
>
> We have been doing it since day one by placing inside at the antenna cable
> ingress location. Makes for a great coupler to change the cable from
> outdoor to indoor as well.
> Since Cambiums SS's have gotten stupidly pricey, we have switched to
> Ubiquiti, but they suck to mount cleanly and quickly. And to be honest,
> Mccowntech are expensive as well.
> My question is this, who thinks it's worth it to do every home all the
> time?
>
>
>
> --
>
> --
> *Sam Lambie*
> Taosnet Wireless Tech.
> 575-758-7598 Office
> www.Taosnet.com 
>
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>
>
>
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?

[Ken Hohhof]

The other thing that plagued us, at least with the 600SS, was the protection 
diodes would get partially blown after a surge event, causing really bad CRC 
errors.  We wouldn’t have a clue until the customer called bitching his 
Internet was slow.  Usually, not always, we could force 10BaseT on the SM until 
we could roll a truck and replace the 600SS.  Actually we would take out the 
PCB and replace it with an inline coupler.  Now that Chuck has a gas tube 
replacement PCB maybe we would use those instead of a coupler.  I don’t think a 
GDT would degrade like the diodes.  FWIW we still have that problem with the 
Tycon POEs that include a surge protector, but we can just send UPS out with a 
replacement and have the customer DIY the replacement.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Mark Radabaugh
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 1:59 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?

 

Not sure on the ‘listed’ question, but you are correct about damage to the 
router.   

 

Mark





On Aug 29, 2019, at 2:29 PM, Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

 

But wouldn’t NEC require a “listed” antenna discharge unit (i.e. surge 
suppressor)?  I doubt any of the usual suspects are listed.  The alternative 
would be to use shielded cable and ground the shield with a grounding block at 
the entrance to the house.  That seems to be the approach taken by sat TV 
installers, but they are using coax anyway and it has a shield.

 

With a grounding block, I’m not sure if the requirement is that it be bonded to 
the electrical system ground, probably with a humongous wire.

 

That’s why we stopped putting the Canopy surge suppressors on the outside of 
houses, in our rural area, properly bonding the ground is impossible on many 
houses.  But with imperfect grounding, we found that the outside surge 
suppressors greatly increased the likelihood that the customer’s router would 
get the Internet port fried.  Ground potential differences.  The old adage 
“ground’s ground the world around” ain’t true, at least not when lightning hits 
a tree in the yard or the transformer on the utility pole.

 

 

From: AF <  af-boun...@af.afmug.com> On Behalf 
Of Mark Radabaugh
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 12:41 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <  af@af.afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?

 

We do and always have.When lightning burns down the house I very much want 
the fire inspector to find the melted Cambium logo on the surge suppressor 
cover.We built it per NEC, sorry about the house burning down.   Sue the 
guys with the deep pockets, not me.

 

Mark






On Aug 29, 2019, at 1:05 PM, Sam Lambie <  
samtaos...@gmail.com> wrote:

 

I am wondering how many of you install either a Cambium SS, McCowntech SS or 
Ubiquiti SS at a customers house. 

We have been doing it since day one by placing inside at the antenna cable 
ingress location. Makes for a great coupler to change the cable from outdoor to 
indoor as well. 
Since Cambiums SS's have gotten stupidly pricey, we have switched to Ubiquiti, 
but they suck to mount cleanly and quickly. And to be honest, Mccowntech are 
expensive as well.
My question is this, who thinks it's worth it to do every home all the time? 


 

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Taosnet Wireless Tech.
575-758-7598 Office
  www.Taosnet.com

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Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?

[Mark Radabaugh]

Not sure on the ‘listed’ question, but you are correct about damage to the 
router.   

Mark

> On Aug 29, 2019, at 2:29 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> 
> But wouldn’t NEC require a “listed” antenna discharge unit (i.e. surge 
> suppressor)?  I doubt any of the usual suspects are listed.  The alternative 
> would be to use shielded cable and ground the shield with a grounding block 
> at the entrance to the house.  That seems to be the approach taken by sat TV 
> installers, but they are using coax anyway and it has a shield.
>  
> With a grounding block, I’m not sure if the requirement is that it be bonded 
> to the electrical system ground, probably with a humongous wire.
>  
> That’s why we stopped putting the Canopy surge suppressors on the outside of 
> houses, in our rural area, properly bonding the ground is impossible on many 
> houses.  But with imperfect grounding, we found that the outside surge 
> suppressors greatly increased the likelihood that the customer’s router would 
> get the Internet port fried.  Ground potential differences.  The old adage 
> “ground’s ground the world around” ain’t true, at least not when lightning 
> hits a tree in the yard or the transformer on the utility pole.
>  
>  
> From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf 
> Of Mark Radabaugh
> Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 12:41 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group  >
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?
>  
> We do and always have.When lightning burns down the house I very much 
> want the fire inspector to find the melted Cambium logo on the surge 
> suppressor cover.We built it per NEC, sorry about the house burning down. 
>   Sue the guys with the deep pockets, not me.
>  
> Mark
> 
> 
>> On Aug 29, 2019, at 1:05 PM, Sam Lambie > > wrote:
>>  
>> I am wondering how many of you install either a Cambium SS, McCowntech SS or 
>> Ubiquiti SS at a customers house. 
>> We have been doing it since day one by placing inside at the antenna cable 
>> ingress location. Makes for a great coupler to change the cable from outdoor 
>> to indoor as well. 
>> Since Cambiums SS's have gotten stupidly pricey, we have switched to 
>> Ubiquiti, but they suck to mount cleanly and quickly. And to be honest, 
>> Mccowntech are expensive as well.
>> My question is this, who thinks it's worth it to do every home all the time? 
>>  
>> -- 
>> -- 
>> Sam Lambie
>> Taosnet Wireless Tech.
>> 575-758-7598 Office
>> www.Taosnet.com 
>> -- 
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>> AF@af.afmug.com 
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com 
>> 
>  
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Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?

[Carl Peterson]

We install a one at the entry on every 450 install.  End up grounding to a
hose bib or conduit into the ground at the back of the house half the
time.  Service grounds in the city are generally long gone/built over and
impossible to find.


On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 12:06 PM Sam Lambie  wrote:

> I am wondering how many of you install either a Cambium SS, McCowntech SS
> or Ubiquiti SS at a customers house.
> We have been doing it since day one by placing inside at the antenna cable
> ingress location. Makes for a great coupler to change the cable from
> outdoor to indoor as well.
> Since Cambiums SS's have gotten stupidly pricey, we have switched to
> Ubiquiti, but they suck to mount cleanly and quickly. And to be honest,
> Mccowntech are expensive as well.
> My question is this, who thinks it's worth it to do every home all the
> time?
>
> --
> --
> *Sam Lambie*
> Taosnet Wireless Tech.
> 575-758-7598 Office
> www.Taosnet.com 
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


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*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707
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Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?

[Ken Hohhof]

But wouldn't NEC require a "listed" antenna discharge unit (i.e. surge
suppressor)?  I doubt any of the usual suspects are listed.  The alternative
would be to use shielded cable and ground the shield with a grounding block
at the entrance to the house.  That seems to be the approach taken by sat TV
installers, but they are using coax anyway and it has a shield.

 

With a grounding block, I'm not sure if the requirement is that it be bonded
to the electrical system ground, probably with a humongous wire.

 

That's why we stopped putting the Canopy surge suppressors on the outside of
houses, in our rural area, properly bonding the ground is impossible on many
houses.  But with imperfect grounding, we found that the outside surge
suppressors greatly increased the likelihood that the customer's router
would get the Internet port fried.  Ground potential differences.  The old
adage "ground's ground the world around" ain't true, at least not when
lightning hits a tree in the yard or the transformer on the utility pole.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Mark Radabaugh
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 12:41 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?

 

We do and always have.When lightning burns down the house I very much
want the fire inspector to find the melted Cambium logo on the surge
suppressor cover.We built it per NEC, sorry about the house burning
down.   Sue the guys with the deep pockets, not me.

 

Mark





On Aug 29, 2019, at 1:05 PM, Sam Lambie mailto:samtaos...@gmail.com> > wrote:

 

I am wondering how many of you install either a Cambium SS, McCowntech SS or
Ubiquiti SS at a customers house. 

We have been doing it since day one by placing inside at the antenna cable
ingress location. Makes for a great coupler to change the cable from outdoor
to indoor as well. 
Since Cambiums SS's have gotten stupidly pricey, we have switched to
Ubiquiti, but they suck to mount cleanly and quickly. And to be honest,
Mccowntech are expensive as well.
My question is this, who thinks it's worth it to do every home all the time?



 

-- 

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Taosnet Wireless Tech.
575-758-7598 Office
www.Taosnet.com  

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Re: [AFMUG] Urgent message for Chuck Macenski!

[Seth Mattinen]

On 8/28/19 12:31, Mike Hammett wrote:

SFP+ should definitely be on there.


Honestly, Ubiquiti is a lost cause. All other major manufacturers have 
put SFPs on radios.



But it's air *fiber*, it's already got it, see?

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Re: [AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?

[Mark Radabaugh]

We do and always have.When lightning burns down the house I very much want 
the fire inspector to find the melted Cambium logo on the surge suppressor 
cover.We built it per NEC, sorry about the house burning down.   Sue the 
guys with the deep pockets, not me.

Mark

> On Aug 29, 2019, at 1:05 PM, Sam Lambie  wrote:
> 
> I am wondering how many of you install either a Cambium SS, McCowntech SS or 
> Ubiquiti SS at a customers house. 
> We have been doing it since day one by placing inside at the antenna cable 
> ingress location. Makes for a great coupler to change the cable from outdoor 
> to indoor as well. 
> Since Cambiums SS's have gotten stupidly pricey, we have switched to 
> Ubiquiti, but they suck to mount cleanly and quickly. And to be honest, 
> Mccowntech are expensive as well.
> My question is this, who thinks it's worth it to do every home all the time? 
> 
> -- 
> -- 
> Sam Lambie
> Taosnet Wireless Tech.
> 575-758-7598 Office
> www.Taosnet.com -- 
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

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[AFMUG] Using Surge Suppressors at CPE? Who does it?

[Sam Lambie]

I am wondering how many of you install either a Cambium SS, McCowntech SS
or Ubiquiti SS at a customers house.
We have been doing it since day one by placing inside at the antenna cable
ingress location. Makes for a great coupler to change the cable from
outdoor to indoor as well.
Since Cambiums SS's have gotten stupidly pricey, we have switched to
Ubiquiti, but they suck to mount cleanly and quickly. And to be honest,
Mccowntech are expensive as well.
My question is this, who thinks it's worth it to do every home all the
time?

-- 
-- 
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Taosnet Wireless Tech.
575-758-7598 Office
www.Taosnet.com 
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Re: [AFMUG] Chuck, what surge should I use

[Craig Schmaderer]

It is hitting this one bin that is not grounded at all.  Other bins with 
cameras have been fine, so we are going to ground the bin, but I want to stop 
this camera from at least frying the switch again if the camera goes.   Best 
way to protect the camera is give the bin a better path, but just incase I want 
to protect the switch.

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2019 9:34 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Chuck, what surge should I use

Some do both ends.  Some one end.  Both camps think they are doing things 
optimally.
Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 28, 2019, at 4:07 PM, Ken Hohhof 
mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:
I understand how a surge protector at the switch end of the cable will protect 
the switch, but I’m not sure how much it protects the camera.  I guess it 
depends on what you think is the surge source and the path it is taking to 
ground.  Or are you talking about putting a surge protector at the camera also?

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2019 3:33 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Chuck, what surge should I use

CAT6 always works on everything, everywhere.  The GIGE is faster to act ang 
gives more protection but it causes errors on Cambium equipment.  If it is a 
hard to access area I would use the CAT6 otherwise the GIGE.
Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 28, 2019, at 2:16 PM, Craig Schmaderer 
mailto:cr...@skywaveconnect.com>> wrote:
I lost a few poe ip cameras on some grain bins.   I am going to add some 
grounding to the bins, but what would you think is the best surge to use of 
yours?

Cameras are powered by a Cisco POE switch

800-CAT6-APC
Or
800-GIGE-APC-HV

Thanks, Craig.


Craig R. Schmaderer
CEO | Skywave Wireless, Inc.
Ph: 402-372-1975 | Fax: 402-372-1058
Direct: 402-372-1052

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Re: [AFMUG] DW Plow/Chute Blades

[chuck]

I had a blade made for my RT120 that will do 43 inches of cover.  

I designed and built my own chute for it so I can plow 4 ducts or MD7.  

https://tomwilliamsmachine.com/

From: Jason McKemie 
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 9:18 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] DW Plow/Chute Blades

Does anyone have a good source for plow blades for a 410sx? I haven't checked 
with ditch witch yet, thought I'd see what else is out there. 



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[AFMUG] DW Plow/Chute Blades

[Jason McKemie]

Does anyone have a good source for plow blades for a 410sx? I haven't
checked with ditch witch yet, thought I'd see what else is out there.
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: RF aggregate energy

[Ken Hohhof]

Silly rabbit.  You can take those kindergartners.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Upwg6JMtyCg

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 9:16 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] OT: RF aggregate energy

 

You guys are smart, maybe you know. Has there ever been a study on how much 
energy geographically or globally is released via all rf means? 

one kindergartner I can beat up, but 20 is gonna be tough and 100, ill be 
slaughtered.

 

Im just curious, on a global scale how much combined energy/heat is put out 
into the world, and absorbed by everything else. We take the stored energy in 
fossil fuels or other materials and ultimately release it vie rf propagation. 
the combined sum must be pretty substantial even excluding the ultra high power 
transmitters.

 

I think I found the root source of global warming. Im pretty sure the 
environmentalists will support shutting down all wireless.  

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Re: [AFMUG] Tracking Down Licensed Noise

[chuck]

First, it all depends on who you used for frequency coordination and licensing. 
 Different companies do it differently.  Some much more exhaustive than others, 
some with ongoing protection.

Second, contact the guy you think is causing the noise.  Normally that is the 
quickest and easiest way to get it fixed.
If they are being turds, and if you are sure you are right, you can threaten 
FCC involvement.

However involving the FCC would be the last thing I would actually do, because 
they come to your house and look under all of your beds first.  And they will 
most likely find something.  Then they will go look at the other guy.  I think 
they do it this way to make people think twice about filing complaints.  

From: Steve Jones 
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 8:21 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Tracking Down Licensed Noise

Where is the onus at to track when you pay for the license? The "protection" 
would not seem to exist if that protection did not come with location and 
mitigation. I assume you dont just say, hey, fcc theres noise, fine them.

On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 8:45 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

  Is the other path 4 degrees off from you on the same frequency and
  polarization?  If so, wow, 4 degrees doesn't sound like much.  Have you
  checked with your frequency coordinator to see if that's kosher?  Maybe it
  is, I don't know how they determine such things, just seemed surprising to
  me, even with Cat A antennas having very narrow beams and low sidelobes.

  Also curious, does the signal go away completely after noon?  That seems
  strange, unless it's being affected by some sort of ducting or reflection.
  18 GHz links normally transmit 24x7.


  -Original Message-
  From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke
  Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 7:56 AM
  To: Animal Farm 
  Subject: [AFMUG] Tracking Down Licensed Noise

  In my ongoing saga of troubleshooting an 18ghz link, we think we're pretty
  sure the issue we are having now is Noise.  From around 7am - noon or 1pm,
  the background noise on my Horizontal polarity goes to about -81.  Has
  anyone had to troubleshoot finding the source of noise on a licensed
  channel?  Do you just start contacting everyone on the same channel within a
  few miles and see if they will disable their transmitter to see if it goes
  away?

  We have found 2 other licenses which are pointing kind of at us.  If I point
  my dish (in RX only mode) at one of the transmitters, which is 10 degrees
  off my path (I am 4 degrees off their path), I hear it at -70

  The Other license is for one of the Day Traders.  The GPS Coordinates in the
  License put it 20 degrees off my path, I know there is no dish where the GPS
  Coordinates say.  However, if it's where I think it might be (on a pole on
  the other end of the building), then it's basically pointing at me.
  Although, with it being a Day trader, there's a good chance it was never
  installed, or has been decommissioned.  Those guys throw licenses and dishes
  up and down like yesterdays fashions.

  Any Tips for the next step?

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Re: [AFMUG] Tracking Down Licensed Noise

[Steve Jones]

Where is the onus at to track when you pay for the license? The
"protection" would not seem to exist if that protection did not come with
location and mitigation. I assume you dont just say, hey, fcc theres noise,
fine them.

On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 8:45 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Is the other path 4 degrees off from you on the same frequency and
> polarization?  If so, wow, 4 degrees doesn't sound like much.  Have you
> checked with your frequency coordinator to see if that's kosher?  Maybe it
> is, I don't know how they determine such things, just seemed surprising to
> me, even with Cat A antennas having very narrow beams and low sidelobes.
>
> Also curious, does the signal go away completely after noon?  That seems
> strange, unless it's being affected by some sort of ducting or reflection.
> 18 GHz links normally transmit 24x7.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke
> Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 7:56 AM
> To: Animal Farm 
> Subject: [AFMUG] Tracking Down Licensed Noise
>
> In my ongoing saga of troubleshooting an 18ghz link, we think we're pretty
> sure the issue we are having now is Noise.  From around 7am - noon or 1pm,
> the background noise on my Horizontal polarity goes to about -81.  Has
> anyone had to troubleshoot finding the source of noise on a licensed
> channel?  Do you just start contacting everyone on the same channel within
> a
> few miles and see if they will disable their transmitter to see if it goes
> away?
>
> We have found 2 other licenses which are pointing kind of at us.  If I
> point
> my dish (in RX only mode) at one of the transmitters, which is 10 degrees
> off my path (I am 4 degrees off their path), I hear it at -70
>
> The Other license is for one of the Day Traders.  The GPS Coordinates in
> the
> License put it 20 degrees off my path, I know there is no dish where the
> GPS
> Coordinates say.  However, if it's where I think it might be (on a pole on
> the other end of the building), then it's basically pointing at me.
> Although, with it being a Day trader, there's a good chance it was never
> installed, or has been decommissioned.  Those guys throw licenses and
> dishes
> up and down like yesterdays fashions.
>
> Any Tips for the next step?
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Tracking Down Licensed Noise

[Josh Luthman]

I would use the SAF spectrum analyzer and go to where that dish is, since
you know what it is, and check the 18 GHz output.  If you can do it in your
day time window 7-1 that would be even better.  If you're getting the noise
and you can see it's there, better still.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 9:09 AM Daniel White  wrote:

> SAF Tehnika has an awesome spectrum analyzer that covers 18GHz and it
> isn't too expensive.  That would allow you for instance to shut down your
> radio during interference events and take a measurement and from there you
> can take your spectrum hunting on the road.
>
> [image: photograph]
> Daniel White
> Co-Founder - Business Development & Operations
> phone: +1 (702) 470-2766
> direct: +1 (702) 470-2770
> Nate Burke wrote on 8/29/19 06:55:
>
> In my ongoing saga of troubleshooting an 18ghz link, we think we're pretty
> sure the issue we are having now is Noise.  From around 7am - noon or 1pm,
> the background noise on my Horizontal polarity goes to about -81.  Has
> anyone had to troubleshoot finding the source of noise on a licensed
> channel?  Do you just start contacting everyone on the same channel within
> a few miles and see if they will disable their transmitter to see if it
> goes away?
>
> We have found 2 other licenses which are pointing kind of at us.  If I
> point my dish (in RX only mode) at one of the transmitters, which is 10
> degrees off my path (I am 4 degrees off their path), I hear it at -70
>
> The Other license is for one of the Day Traders.  The GPS Coordinates in
> the License put it 20 degrees off my path, I know there is no dish where
> the GPS Coordinates say.  However, if it's where I think it might be (on a
> pole on the other end of the building), then it's basically pointing at
> me.  Although, with it being a Day trader, there's a good chance it was
> never installed, or has been decommissioned.  Those guys throw licenses and
> dishes up and down like yesterdays fashions.
>
> Any Tips for the next step?
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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[AFMUG] OT: RF aggregate energy

[Steve Jones]

You guys are smart, maybe you know. Has there ever been a study on how much
energy geographically or globally is released via all rf means?
one kindergartner I can beat up, but 20 is gonna be tough and 100, ill be
slaughtered.

Im just curious, on a global scale how much combined energy/heat is put out
into the world, and absorbed by everything else. We take the stored energy
in fossil fuels or other materials and ultimately release it vie rf
propagation. the combined sum must be pretty substantial even excluding the
ultra high power transmitters.

I think I found the root source of global warming. Im pretty sure the
environmentalists will support shutting down all wireless.
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Re: [AFMUG] Tracking Down Licensed Noise

[Ken Hohhof]

Is the other path 4 degrees off from you on the same frequency and
polarization?  If so, wow, 4 degrees doesn't sound like much.  Have you
checked with your frequency coordinator to see if that's kosher?  Maybe it
is, I don't know how they determine such things, just seemed surprising to
me, even with Cat A antennas having very narrow beams and low sidelobes.

Also curious, does the signal go away completely after noon?  That seems
strange, unless it's being affected by some sort of ducting or reflection.
18 GHz links normally transmit 24x7.


-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 7:56 AM
To: Animal Farm 
Subject: [AFMUG] Tracking Down Licensed Noise

In my ongoing saga of troubleshooting an 18ghz link, we think we're pretty
sure the issue we are having now is Noise.  From around 7am - noon or 1pm,
the background noise on my Horizontal polarity goes to about -81.  Has
anyone had to troubleshoot finding the source of noise on a licensed
channel?  Do you just start contacting everyone on the same channel within a
few miles and see if they will disable their transmitter to see if it goes
away?

We have found 2 other licenses which are pointing kind of at us.  If I point
my dish (in RX only mode) at one of the transmitters, which is 10 degrees
off my path (I am 4 degrees off their path), I hear it at -70

The Other license is for one of the Day Traders.  The GPS Coordinates in the
License put it 20 degrees off my path, I know there is no dish where the GPS
Coordinates say.  However, if it's where I think it might be (on a pole on
the other end of the building), then it's basically pointing at me.
Although, with it being a Day trader, there's a good chance it was never
installed, or has been decommissioned.  Those guys throw licenses and dishes
up and down like yesterdays fashions.

Any Tips for the next step?

--
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AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com



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Re: [AFMUG] Tracking Down Licensed Noise

[Daniel White]

SAF Tehnika has an awesome spectrum analyzer that covers 18GHz and it 
isn't too expensive.  That would allow you for instance to shut down 
your radio during interference events and take a measurement and from 
there you can take your spectrum hunting on the road.


photograph  
Daniel White
Co-Founder - Business Development & Operations
phone: +1 (702) 470-2766
direct:+1 (702) 470-2770

Nate Burke wrote on 8/29/19 06:55:
In my ongoing saga of troubleshooting an 18ghz link, we think we're 
pretty sure the issue we are having now is Noise.  From around 7am - 
noon or 1pm, the background noise on my Horizontal polarity goes to 
about -81.  Has anyone had to troubleshoot finding the source of noise 
on a licensed channel?  Do you just start contacting everyone on the 
same channel within a few miles and see if they will disable their 
transmitter to see if it goes away?


We have found 2 other licenses which are pointing kind of at us.  If I 
point my dish (in RX only mode) at one of the transmitters, which is 
10 degrees off my path (I am 4 degrees off their path), I hear it at -70


The Other license is for one of the Day Traders.  The GPS Coordinates 
in the License put it 20 degrees off my path, I know there is no dish 
where the GPS Coordinates say.  However, if it's where I think it 
might be (on a pole on the other end of the building), then it's 
basically pointing at me.  Although, with it being a Day trader, 
there's a good chance it was never installed, or has been 
decommissioned.  Those guys throw licenses and dishes up and down like 
yesterdays fashions.


Any Tips for the next step?



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[AFMUG] Tracking Down Licensed Noise

[Nate Burke]

In my ongoing saga of troubleshooting an 18ghz link, we think we're 
pretty sure the issue we are having now is Noise.  From around 7am - 
noon or 1pm, the background noise on my Horizontal polarity goes to 
about -81.  Has anyone had to troubleshoot finding the source of noise 
on a licensed channel?  Do you just start contacting everyone on the 
same channel within a few miles and see if they will disable their 
transmitter to see if it goes away?


We have found 2 other licenses which are pointing kind of at us.  If I 
point my dish (in RX only mode) at one of the transmitters, which is 10 
degrees off my path (I am 4 degrees off their path), I hear it at -70


The Other license is for one of the Day Traders.  The GPS Coordinates in 
the License put it 20 degrees off my path, I know there is no dish where 
the GPS Coordinates say.  However, if it's where I think it might be (on 
a pole on the other end of the building), then it's basically pointing 
at me.  Although, with it being a Day trader, there's a good chance it 
was never installed, or has been decommissioned.  Those guys throw 
licenses and dishes up and down like yesterdays fashions.


Any Tips for the next step?

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