Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Jon Langeler]

It seems anti-Cambium not to have that sync work 100%. And anything less than 
100% these days and the customers will notice.

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


On Oct 28, 2016, at 11:11 AM, Matt  wrote:

>> Not 100% impossible. It's worked for us if the master PTP450 is co-located
>> with the PMP450 APs. We set the DL % to the same (we're using 65% DL where
>> we're doing this).
>> 
>> The big problem is the auto-ranging that the PTP450 does, and there's not
>> much you can do about it. Once it's synced up, if you've set the framing
>> properly, they will sync just fine.
>> 
>> Many people on the list have asked for, like, forever to have a way to "set"
>> the framing parameters so that this would be easier.
> 
> Back with the backhaul 20's transmit frame spreading used to help a
> lot with the issue.  I would think having a setting to cap range would
> be easy for cambium to do since they are based on an AP anyway.
> 
> 
> 
>> The other problem since the beginning of time with Canopy style PTPs is that
>> the master starts up in beaconing mode with a max range of like 120 miles
>> and waits for a BHS reg attempt then does auto-ranging and shifts the
>> timing. So yeah, it's pretty much impossible.
>> 
>> On 10/27/2016 3:18 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>> 
>> that's been true since the beginning of time.
>> 
>> you can get it close with 50% downlink on the AP and then use the frame
>> calculator to match the air delay parameter to the BHS.  not easy at all but
>> you could probably get it to work.
>> 
>> your best bet is to use different bands for PMP and PTP tho.
>> 
>> -Sean
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:37 PM, Jon Langeler 
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync.
>>> But as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP
>>> products. Oh well
>>> 
>>> Jon Langeler
>>> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>> 
>> 
>> 

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Matt]

> Not 100% impossible. It's worked for us if the master PTP450 is co-located
> with the PMP450 APs. We set the DL % to the same (we're using 65% DL where
> we're doing this).
>
> The big problem is the auto-ranging that the PTP450 does, and there's not
> much you can do about it. Once it's synced up, if you've set the framing
> properly, they will sync just fine.
>
> Many people on the list have asked for, like, forever to have a way to "set"
> the framing parameters so that this would be easier.

Back with the backhaul 20's transmit frame spreading used to help a
lot with the issue.  I would think having a setting to cap range would
be easy for cambium to do since they are based on an AP anyway.



> The other problem since the beginning of time with Canopy style PTPs is that
> the master starts up in beaconing mode with a max range of like 120 miles
> and waits for a BHS reg attempt then does auto-ranging and shifts the
> timing. So yeah, it's pretty much impossible.
>
> On 10/27/2016 3:18 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>
> that's been true since the beginning of time.
>
> you can get it close with 50% downlink on the AP and then use the frame
> calculator to match the air delay parameter to the BHS.  not easy at all but
> you could probably get it to work.
>
> your best bet is to use different bands for PMP and PTP tho.
>
> -Sean
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:37 PM, Jon Langeler 
> wrote:
>>
>> I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync.
>> But as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP
>> products. Oh well
>>
>> Jon Langeler
>> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>>
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Bill Prince]

Not 100% impossible. It's worked for us if the master PTP450 is 
co-located with the PMP450 APs. We set the DL % to the same (we're using 
65% DL where we're doing this).


The big problem is the auto-ranging that the PTP450 does, and there's 
not much you can do about it. Once it's synced up, if you've set the 
framing properly, they will sync just fine.


Many people on the list have asked for, like, forever to have a way to 
"set" the framing parameters so that this would be easier.



bp


On 10/27/2016 1:23 PM, George Skorup wrote:
The other problem since the beginning of time with Canopy style PTPs 
is that the master starts up in beaconing mode with a max range of 
like 120 miles and waits for a BHS reg attempt then does auto-ranging 
and shifts the timing. So yeah, it's pretty much impossible.


On 10/27/2016 3:18 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

that's been true since the beginning of time.

you can get it close with 50% downlink on the AP and then use the 
frame calculator to match the air delay parameter to the BHS.  not 
easy at all but you could probably get it to work.


your best bet is to use different bands for PMP and PTP tho.

-Sean

On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:37 PM, Jon Langeler 
> wrote:


I don't think their support department understands the concept of
sync. But as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100%
with PMP products. Oh well

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Jon Langeler]

We do. Just thought I would try PTP in a small instance 

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


> On Oct 28, 2016, at 6:44 AM, Gino Villarini  wrote:
> 
> Why no use a 900 ap and sm?
> 
> Gino A. Villarini
> @gvillarini
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Gino Villarini
> 
> President
> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
> 
> 
> On Oct 27, 2016, at 6:21 PM, Jon Langeler  wrote:
> 
>> Yeah. I never tried it before. It's not an awesome idea. But if the customer 
>> pays $1500 for the install, we thought we would try a PTP in their 
>> direction. 900MHz :-)
>> 
>> Jon Langeler
>> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>> 
>> 
>> On Oct 27, 2016, at 4:35 PM, Adam Moffett  wrote:
>> 
>>> YeahI'm curious who/what led you to believe otherwise.
>>> 
>>> Did Cambium sales or support ever say that a PTP could sync with a PMP? 
>>> 
 On 10/27/2016 4:23 PM, George Skorup wrote:
 The other problem since the beginning of time with Canopy style PTPs is 
 that the master starts up in beaconing mode with a max range of like 120 
 miles and waits for a BHS reg attempt then does auto-ranging and shifts 
 the timing. So yeah, it's pretty much impossible.
 
> On 10/27/2016 3:18 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
> that's been true since the beginning of time.  
> 
> you can get it close with 50% downlink on the AP and then use the frame 
> calculator to match the air delay parameter to the BHS.  not easy at all 
> but you could probably get it to work.
> 
> your best bet is to use different bands for PMP and PTP tho.
> 
> -Sean
>  
> 
>> On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:37 PM, Jon Langeler 
>>  wrote:
>> I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync. 
>> But as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP 
>> products. Oh well
>> 
>> Jon Langeler
>> Michwave Technologies, Inc.

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Dennis Burgess]

Should be bumping up to the licensed radios for your backhauls anyways .. just 
a FYI. :) 


Dennis Burgess – Network Solution Engineer – Consultant 
MikroTik Certified Trainer/Consultant – MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE

For Wireless Hardware/Routers visit www.linktechs.net
Radio Frequiency Coverages: www.towercoverage.com 
Office: 314-735-0270
E-Mail: dmburg...@linktechs.net 

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt
Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2016 5:37 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

I know it would not be a good idea to run PMP450 and PTP450 on same frequency 
but it sure would be nice if it allowed the next adjacent frequency to be used. 
 We run multiple 5ghz PTP450i synced masters's on same frequency in different 
directions on same tower all the time.
Keep them on one side of band and PMP450i's on other.


On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 5:20 PM, Jon Langeler <jon-ispli...@michwave.net> wrote:
> Yeah. I never tried it before. It's not an awesome idea. But if the 
> customer pays $1500 for the install, we thought we would try a PTP in 
> their direction. 900MHz :-)
>
> Jon Langeler
> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>
>
> On Oct 27, 2016, at 4:35 PM, Adam Moffett <dmmoff...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> YeahI'm curious who/what led you to believe otherwise.
>
> Did Cambium sales or support ever say that a PTP could sync with a PMP?
>
>
> On 10/27/2016 4:23 PM, George Skorup wrote:
>
> The other problem since the beginning of time with Canopy style PTPs 
> is that the master starts up in beaconing mode with a max range of 
> like 120 miles and waits for a BHS reg attempt then does auto-ranging 
> and shifts the timing. So yeah, it's pretty much impossible.
>
> On 10/27/2016 3:18 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>
> that's been true since the beginning of time.
>
> you can get it close with 50% downlink on the AP and then use the 
> frame calculator to match the air delay parameter to the BHS.  not 
> easy at all but you could probably get it to work.
>
> your best bet is to use different bands for PMP and PTP tho.
>
> -Sean
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:37 PM, Jon Langeler 
> <jon-ispli...@michwave.net>
> wrote:
>>
>> I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync.
>> But as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP 
>> products. Oh well
>>
>> Jon Langeler
>> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>>
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Gino Villarini]

Why no use a 900 ap and sm?

Gino A. Villarini
@gvillarini






Gino Villarini


President
Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

[cid:aeronet-logo_310cfc3e-6691-4f69-bd49-b37b834b9238.png]

On Oct 27, 2016, at 6:21 PM, Jon Langeler 
> wrote:

Yeah. I never tried it before. It's not an awesome idea. But if the customer 
pays $1500 for the install, we thought we would try a PTP in their direction. 
900MHz :-)

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


On Oct 27, 2016, at 4:35 PM, Adam Moffett 
> wrote:


YeahI'm curious who/what led you to believe otherwise.

Did Cambium sales or support ever say that a PTP could sync with a PMP?

On 10/27/2016 4:23 PM, George Skorup wrote:
The other problem since the beginning of time with Canopy style PTPs is that 
the master starts up in beaconing mode with a max range of like 120 miles and 
waits for a BHS reg attempt then does auto-ranging and shifts the timing. So 
yeah, it's pretty much impossible.

On 10/27/2016 3:18 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
that's been true since the beginning of time.

you can get it close with 50% downlink on the AP and then use the frame 
calculator to match the air delay parameter to the BHS.  not easy at all but 
you could probably get it to work.

your best bet is to use different bands for PMP and PTP tho.

-Sean


On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:37 PM, Jon Langeler 
> wrote:
I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync. But as 
of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP products. Oh well

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Matt]

I know it would not be a good idea to run PMP450 and PTP450 on same
frequency but it sure would be nice if it allowed the next adjacent
frequency to be used.  We run multiple 5ghz PTP450i synced masters's
on same frequency in different directions on same tower all the time.
Keep them on one side of band and PMP450i's on other.


On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 5:20 PM, Jon Langeler  wrote:
> Yeah. I never tried it before. It's not an awesome idea. But if the customer
> pays $1500 for the install, we thought we would try a PTP in their
> direction. 900MHz :-)
>
> Jon Langeler
> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>
>
> On Oct 27, 2016, at 4:35 PM, Adam Moffett  wrote:
>
> YeahI'm curious who/what led you to believe otherwise.
>
> Did Cambium sales or support ever say that a PTP could sync with a PMP?
>
>
> On 10/27/2016 4:23 PM, George Skorup wrote:
>
> The other problem since the beginning of time with Canopy style PTPs is that
> the master starts up in beaconing mode with a max range of like 120 miles
> and waits for a BHS reg attempt then does auto-ranging and shifts the
> timing. So yeah, it's pretty much impossible.
>
> On 10/27/2016 3:18 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>
> that's been true since the beginning of time.
>
> you can get it close with 50% downlink on the AP and then use the frame
> calculator to match the air delay parameter to the BHS.  not easy at all but
> you could probably get it to work.
>
> your best bet is to use different bands for PMP and PTP tho.
>
> -Sean
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:37 PM, Jon Langeler 
> wrote:
>>
>> I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync.
>> But as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP
>> products. Oh well
>>
>> Jon Langeler
>> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>>
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Jon Langeler]

Yeah. I never tried it before. It's not an awesome idea. But if the customer 
pays $1500 for the install, we thought we would try a PTP in their direction. 
900MHz :-)

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


> On Oct 27, 2016, at 4:35 PM, Adam Moffett  wrote:
> 
> YeahI'm curious who/what led you to believe otherwise.
> 
> Did Cambium sales or support ever say that a PTP could sync with a PMP? 
> 
>> On 10/27/2016 4:23 PM, George Skorup wrote:
>> The other problem since the beginning of time with Canopy style PTPs is that 
>> the master starts up in beaconing mode with a max range of like 120 miles 
>> and waits for a BHS reg attempt then does auto-ranging and shifts the 
>> timing. So yeah, it's pretty much impossible.
>> 
>>> On 10/27/2016 3:18 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>>> that's been true since the beginning of time.  
>>> 
>>> you can get it close with 50% downlink on the AP and then use the frame 
>>> calculator to match the air delay parameter to the BHS.  not easy at all 
>>> but you could probably get it to work.
>>> 
>>> your best bet is to use different bands for PMP and PTP tho.
>>> 
>>> -Sean
>>>  
>>> 
>>> On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:37 PM, Jon Langeler  
>>> wrote:
 I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync. 
 But as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP 
 products. Oh well
 
 Jon Langeler
 Michwave Technologies, Inc.
> 

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Adam Moffett]

YeahI'm curious who/what led you to believe otherwise.

Did Cambium sales or support ever say that a PTP could sync with a PMP?


On 10/27/2016 4:23 PM, George Skorup wrote:
The other problem since the beginning of time with Canopy style PTPs 
is that the master starts up in beaconing mode with a max range of 
like 120 miles and waits for a BHS reg attempt then does auto-ranging 
and shifts the timing. So yeah, it's pretty much impossible.


On 10/27/2016 3:18 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

that's been true since the beginning of time.

you can get it close with 50% downlink on the AP and then use the 
frame calculator to match the air delay parameter to the BHS.  not 
easy at all but you could probably get it to work.


your best bet is to use different bands for PMP and PTP tho.

-Sean

On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:37 PM, Jon Langeler 
> wrote:


I don't think their support department understands the concept of
sync. But as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100%
with PMP products. Oh well

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[George Skorup]

The other problem since the beginning of time with Canopy style PTPs is 
that the master starts up in beaconing mode with a max range of like 120 
miles and waits for a BHS reg attempt then does auto-ranging and shifts 
the timing. So yeah, it's pretty much impossible.


On 10/27/2016 3:18 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

that's been true since the beginning of time.

you can get it close with 50% downlink on the AP and then use the 
frame calculator to match the air delay parameter to the BHS.  not 
easy at all but you could probably get it to work.


your best bet is to use different bands for PMP and PTP tho.

-Sean

On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:37 PM, Jon Langeler 
> wrote:


I don't think their support department understands the concept of
sync. But as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100%
with PMP products. Oh well

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Sean Heskett]

that's been true since the beginning of time.

you can get it close with 50% downlink on the AP and then use the frame
calculator to match the air delay parameter to the BHS.  not easy at all
but you could probably get it to work.

your best bet is to use different bands for PMP and PTP tho.

-Sean


On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:37 PM, Jon Langeler 
wrote:

> I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync.
> But as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP
> products. Oh well
>
> Jon Langeler
> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Nathan Anderson]

You want to re-use a distribution channel as a backhaul channel, too?  That 
seems like a bad idea anyway.

-- Nathan

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jon Langeler
Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2016 12:21 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

Nah PMP450 with PTP450
Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


On Oct 27, 2016, at 2:44 PM, Josh Luthman 
<j...@imaginenetworksllc.com<mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>> wrote:

I don't believe they're supposed to, assuming ptp650?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Oct 27, 2016 2:37 PM, "Jon Langeler" 
<jon-ispli...@michwave.net<mailto:jon-ispli...@michwave.net>> wrote:
I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync. But as 
of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP products. Oh well

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Jon Langeler]

Nah PMP450 with PTP450

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


> On Oct 27, 2016, at 2:44 PM, Josh Luthman  wrote:
> 
> I don't believe they're supposed to, assuming ptp650?
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> 
>> On Oct 27, 2016 2:37 PM, "Jon Langeler"  wrote:
>> I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync. But 
>> as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP products. 
>> Oh well
>> 
>> Jon Langeler
>> Michwave Technologies, Inc.

Re: [AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Josh Luthman]

I don't believe they're supposed to, assuming ptp650?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Oct 27, 2016 2:37 PM, "Jon Langeler"  wrote:

> I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync.
> But as of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP
> products. Oh well
>
> Jon Langeler
> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>
>

[AFMUG] FYI Cambium PTP doesn't sync with PMP

[Jon Langeler]

I don't think their support department understands the concept of sync. But as 
of now we have given up on PTP products syncing 100% with PMP products. Oh well 

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.