[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-28 Thread Warren

It's true that some apps will be rated lower because they don't apply
to the user doing the judging. For instance I judged an app that was
designed specifically for users in Paris. It was low for me on the
indispensability scale as it would be for most people not in Paris.

BUT if it is clear from the outset that the app does not apply to you,
then you might skip it. This could lead to higher concentration of
judges who say, "Ahh, an app that serves my niche!" actually scoring
the app. For instance, an app named, "Find the Closest Bathroom in
Paris" would probably be skipped quite a bit by people not in Paris.
You might end up with 75% of the judges for that app actually being
from Paris. But if the app is called "Bathroom Finder" and gives no
hint that it is geographically limited, you'd get no such effect.

 Who knows? This is all just conjecture and guessing.  The effects
might balance each other out. They might not. There won't be a clear
picture until Google releases some results... maybe not even then.


On Sep 28, 12:12 pm, "ander...@phdgaming.com" 
wrote:
> > I have really tested maybe a dozen apps for the moment, and most of
> > them did not reach more than 2 stars in every line, because they are
> > not working, are one version of a concept among a hundred similar
> > implementations, or because they don't answer MY needs. This is true
> > for every other revewers, and it has to be like this if we really want
> > to see emerging the real best apps. There is no place for poor apps,
> > this is a contest for really outstanding apps that will show all the
> > power of the android platform against the others.
>
> I don't really agree with the "MY needs" line personally. We are
> acting as judges - and therefore should also take into consideration
> how an application would be useful to others. For example, I
> personally dislike most social networking applications, and do not
> even bother to use twitter or facebook outside of Android. Rating most
> social network application badly and giving them "1s" in
> indispensability due to my personal preference would not be right, in
> my opinion. Of course, I do skip most of those related to this
> category, just saying I think there might sometimes be more to it than
> "what does this app do for me".
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-28 Thread ander...@phdgaming.com

> I have really tested maybe a dozen apps for the moment, and most of
> them did not reach more than 2 stars in every line, because they are
> not working, are one version of a concept among a hundred similar
> implementations, or because they don't answer MY needs. This is true
> for every other revewers, and it has to be like this if we really want
> to see emerging the real best apps. There is no place for poor apps,
> this is a contest for really outstanding apps that will show all the
> power of the android platform against the others.

I don't really agree with the "MY needs" line personally. We are
acting as judges - and therefore should also take into consideration
how an application would be useful to others. For example, I
personally dislike most social networking applications, and do not
even bother to use twitter or facebook outside of Android. Rating most
social network application badly and giving them "1s" in
indispensability due to my personal preference would not be right, in
my opinion. Of course, I do skip most of those related to this
category, just saying I think there might sometimes be more to it than
"what does this app do for me".
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-28 Thread Nivek

I think there is a huge number of apps submitted in this contest and
sorting out the best is a huge work... that for once has been given to
the users ! This is a great opportunity for us, but it also shows us
that every app developer can't be the best.

The notes we have to give to apps are quite clear about what a winner
could be :
- it has to be an original concept
- it has to use the specific features of the android platforms
- it has to look good
- it has to be universally useful to all of the reviewers

Based on this, it's quite natural that applications that are not
working right, are too specifically oriented to a subset of the
population (religion, geography) will get eliminated on first round.

If most of reviewers skip 80% of the submitted apps, this is because
they, from the beginning, would not get a good mark on the "utility"
line.

I have really tested maybe a dozen apps for the moment, and most of
them did not reach more than 2 stars in every line, because they are
not working, are one version of a concept among a hundred similar
implementations, or because they don't answer MY needs. This is true
for every other revewers, and it has to be like this if we really want
to see emerging the real best apps. There is no place for poor apps,
this is a contest for really outstanding apps that will show all the
power of the android platform against the others.

So, even if after this round only a dozen of apps get high rates, I
think these apps will really be the ones that will deserve it and it's
allright !

It might be sad for developers who spent a lot of time in coding their
apps and do not get many reviews, but... hey, wake up ! this means
your app is either not good enough or too specific (and this does not
mean it is bad !).




On 28 sep, 16:47, Disconnect  wrote:
> If it doesn't work, it gets rated low. If it takes hours to set itself
> up (I'm looking at you local-radio-cache-app) it gets given up on and
> rated low. (Hours of downloads, on a link that can pull an entire
> ubuntu dvd in a few minutes..)  Any app that goes all FC after the
> first page (ahem, awesome-looking monster card game list) gets low
> ratings..
>
> I think the biggest two problems with the -number- of reviewers is
> that getting an app to actually install is a mess (I have only had one
> install via ADP app, and one that wouldn't install at -all- after
> trying half the weekend) and not that many people know it is there to
> begin with..
>
> On Mon, Sep 28, 2009 at 12:21 AM, Rud  wrote:
>
> > I agree. I wish the judging app allowed something like 5 apps to be
> > queued on the phone. There are some I skipped because I didn't have
> > time to explore them right now but did want to see what else is being
> > offered. I'm hoping some of the skipped ones will reappear at some
> > point.
>
> > Rud
>
> > On Sep 27, 9:03 pm, "Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)"
> >  wrote:
> >> > I wonder how many of the users judging the applications have submitted
> >> > their own applications and are just voting other applications down to
> >> > improve their own chances of winning...
>
> >> That's a rather cynical view, however, one that's probably close to
> >> the mark in a lot of cases.
>
> >> I've been testing apps since the judging began and frankly, the
> >> judging app is slanted toward apps that can produce the desired result
> >> with little or no user interaction or understanding of what the app
> >> does. If you require the user to actually understand what you're
> >> offering, with registration and other details, you're in for a bad
> >> time in ADC2. I think it was probably less than ideal that the judging
> >> app can only work one article at a time. It might have been more fair
> >> and even if it could have held a universe of apps the user would like
> >> to try out.
>
> >> -John Coryat
>
> >> "Radar Now!"
>
> >> "What Zip Code?"
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-28 Thread Disconnect

If it doesn't work, it gets rated low. If it takes hours to set itself
up (I'm looking at you local-radio-cache-app) it gets given up on and
rated low. (Hours of downloads, on a link that can pull an entire
ubuntu dvd in a few minutes..)  Any app that goes all FC after the
first page (ahem, awesome-looking monster card game list) gets low
ratings..

I think the biggest two problems with the -number- of reviewers is
that getting an app to actually install is a mess (I have only had one
install via ADP app, and one that wouldn't install at -all- after
trying half the weekend) and not that many people know it is there to
begin with..

On Mon, Sep 28, 2009 at 12:21 AM, Rud  wrote:
>
> I agree. I wish the judging app allowed something like 5 apps to be
> queued on the phone. There are some I skipped because I didn't have
> time to explore them right now but did want to see what else is being
> offered. I'm hoping some of the skipped ones will reappear at some
> point.
>
> Rud
>
>
> On Sep 27, 9:03 pm, "Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)"
>  wrote:
>> > I wonder how many of the users judging the applications have submitted
>> > their own applications and are just voting other applications down to
>> > improve their own chances of winning...
>>
>> That's a rather cynical view, however, one that's probably close to
>> the mark in a lot of cases.
>>
>> I've been testing apps since the judging began and frankly, the
>> judging app is slanted toward apps that can produce the desired result
>> with little or no user interaction or understanding of what the app
>> does. If you require the user to actually understand what you're
>> offering, with registration and other details, you're in for a bad
>> time in ADC2. I think it was probably less than ideal that the judging
>> app can only work one article at a time. It might have been more fair
>> and even if it could have held a universe of apps the user would like
>> to try out.
>>
>> -John Coryat
>>
>> "Radar Now!"
>>
>> "What Zip Code?"
> >
>

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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-27 Thread Rud

I agree. I wish the judging app allowed something like 5 apps to be
queued on the phone. There are some I skipped because I didn't have
time to explore them right now but did want to see what else is being
offered. I'm hoping some of the skipped ones will reappear at some
point.

Rud


On Sep 27, 9:03 pm, "Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)"
 wrote:
> > I wonder how many of the users judging the applications have submitted
> > their own applications and are just voting other applications down to
> > improve their own chances of winning...
>
> That's a rather cynical view, however, one that's probably close to
> the mark in a lot of cases.
>
> I've been testing apps since the judging began and frankly, the
> judging app is slanted toward apps that can produce the desired result
> with little or no user interaction or understanding of what the app
> does. If you require the user to actually understand what you're
> offering, with registration and other details, you're in for a bad
> time in ADC2. I think it was probably less than ideal that the judging
> app can only work one article at a time. It might have been more fair
> and even if it could have held a universe of apps the user would like
> to try out.
>
> -John Coryat
>
> "Radar Now!"
>
> "What Zip Code?"
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-27 Thread CraigsRace

Checked my server logs, 65 people have played the game.  3 people
actually got up to the 4th car, so that would be about 30 mins play
time (I'm impressed by this).

> My application requires that users register using the application
> before they can use it (probably a mistake as far as the competition
> goes, but unavoidable in practice).

I have to admit, any request for me to enter my e-mail address, I skip
it.  If I can enter just a user name / password, then no problem.

> I wonder how many of the users judging the applications have submitted
> their own applications and are just voting other applications down to
> improve their own chances of winning...

I think if someone did this, it wouldn't really make that much of a
difference to their score (assuming there is a decent amount of votes
submitted).
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-27 Thread Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)

> I wonder how many of the users judging the applications have submitted
> their own applications and are just voting other applications down to
> improve their own chances of winning...

That's a rather cynical view, however, one that's probably close to
the mark in a lot of cases.

I've been testing apps since the judging began and frankly, the
judging app is slanted toward apps that can produce the desired result
with little or no user interaction or understanding of what the app
does. If you require the user to actually understand what you're
offering, with registration and other details, you're in for a bad
time in ADC2. I think it was probably less than ideal that the judging
app can only work one article at a time. It might have been more fair
and even if it could have held a universe of apps the user would like
to try out.

-John Coryat

"Radar Now!"

"What Zip Code?"
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-27 Thread Nicholas Albion

> 36 visits (80 hits) for page 1's audio.

My application requires that users register using the application
before they can use it (probably a mistake as far as the competition
goes, but unavoidable in practice).

I've had about 15 people register, and only one of those has bothered
to progress past the 3rd Activity within the application, so I would
not consider the others to be in a position where they can fairly
judge my application.

I wonder how many of the users judging the applications have submitted
their own applications and are just voting other applications down to
improve their own chances of winning...
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-27 Thread alex

>From marketing point of view guys have made a little too many mistakes
to this moment.

On Sep 27, 1:37 pm, Izard  wrote:
> As a lot of ppl (including me) skip many applications, I wonder what
> would be an implication for judging?
>
> e.g. there are 2 programs, one got scores of 5 5 and another of 5 5 5
> 1.
> Average for the first is 5, and for the second is 4. But second got a
> higher score from more ppl. Which would win in this case?
>
> I cannot find an answer in the rules, may be someone has a guess?
>
> Alexander
>
> On Sep 27, 5:34 am, "Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)"
>
>  wrote:
> > I have three apps in ADC2 and so far have seen a total of 63 users run
> > them.
>
> > There seems to be a very low number of judges participating in ADC2.
> > I've seen no publicity at all, no mention in the tech press, no TV
> > coverage, nothing to indicate this contest is running.
>
> > I'm guessing that the majority of judges at this point are developers.
> > Won't that skew the results? Is this supposed to be a developer or
> > user contest?
>
> > -John Coryat
>
> > "Radar Now!"
>
> > "What Zip Code?"
>
>
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-27 Thread Maan Najjar
I think they won't end first round until they collect enough reviews for all
applications.
In your scenario, the first program should appear more frequently until it
gets enough reviews.

On Sun, Sep 27, 2009 at 6:37 AM, Izard  wrote:

>
> As a lot of ppl (including me) skip many applications, I wonder what
> would be an implication for judging?
>
> e.g. there are 2 programs, one got scores of 5 5 and another of 5 5 5
> 1.
> Average for the first is 5, and for the second is 4. But second got a
> higher score from more ppl. Which would win in this case?
>
> I cannot find an answer in the rules, may be someone has a guess?
>
> Alexander
>
> On Sep 27, 5:34 am, "Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)"
>  wrote:
> > I have three apps in ADC2 and so far have seen a total of 63 users run
> > them.
> >
> > There seems to be a very low number of judges participating in ADC2.
> > I've seen no publicity at all, no mention in the tech press, no TV
> > coverage, nothing to indicate this contest is running.
> >
> > I'm guessing that the majority of judges at this point are developers.
> > Won't that skew the results? Is this supposed to be a developer or
> > user contest?
> >
> > -John Coryat
> >
> > "Radar Now!"
> >
> > "What Zip Code?"
> >
>

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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-27 Thread Maan Najjar
It think too many chose not to participate because of  *C&D Cyanogen*. ADC2
app is now 3.5 stars,  other Google apps are getting 1-star ratings as well.
I think it was bad move from Google although they have the right to do it.
Even Apple chose not to poke with the dev-team.


On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 1:00 PM, tauntz  wrote:

>
> Sorry about TV ads - don't know where I got the idea :)
> readingComprehension--;
>
> On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 7:55 PM, Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)
>  wrote:
> >
> >> 1) This belongs to android-discuss, it has nothing to do with
> >> developing apps using the public SDK
> >
> > Maybe. There are enough conversations regarding ADC2 on this forum to
> > make it relevant. If Google would open an ADC2 forum, that would be a
> > better place.
> >
> >> 2) TV adds? Are you kidding us or you really want to have TV ads in
> >> all countries where Android phones are sold? :)
> >
> > Where in my post did I mention TV ads? TV coverage is about media
> > exposure. You may have heard of CBS, CNN, CNBC and the other networks.
> > They put enough time into covering lottery jackpots, spelling bees,
> > pie eating and other events, why not this contest?
> > >
> >
>
> >
>

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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-27 Thread Izard

As a lot of ppl (including me) skip many applications, I wonder what
would be an implication for judging?

e.g. there are 2 programs, one got scores of 5 5 and another of 5 5 5
1.
Average for the first is 5, and for the second is 4. But second got a
higher score from more ppl. Which would win in this case?

I cannot find an answer in the rules, may be someone has a guess?

Alexander

On Sep 27, 5:34 am, "Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)"
 wrote:
> I have three apps in ADC2 and so far have seen a total of 63 users run
> them.
>
> There seems to be a very low number of judges participating in ADC2.
> I've seen no publicity at all, no mention in the tech press, no TV
> coverage, nothing to indicate this contest is running.
>
> I'm guessing that the majority of judges at this point are developers.
> Won't that skew the results? Is this supposed to be a developer or
> user contest?
>
> -John Coryat
>
> "Radar Now!"
>
> "What Zip Code?"
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-26 Thread nEx.Software

I personally have skipped about 75% of the apps that have come up in
my queue. Why? Because most of them are irrelevant to me. I can't be
bothered to try an app which gets public transit information in Paris,
tells me which direction to face when I pray, tells me when I am
supposed to pray, and the list goes on. Most of the applications I
have seen are poorly designed, half implemented, or even contain major
bugs which make them unusable. I had one app that was simply a Hello
World... of course that is not what the uploader described, so I
wonder if they uploaded the wrong APK. I had another that forgot to
include the one button that the application required (the one that
triggered the one and only task that the application had to do). I
have come across a few gems though. But overall I have been really
disappointed in the showing.

Note: I am judging these applications as a user only, though I suppose
being a developer might color my responses a certain way. I did not
get an application submitted because the bar that I set for myself was
higher than the apps that won ADC1. Had I anticipated that that would
not be the case for everyone else, I might have dedicated myself to an
entry.

On Sep 26, 10:56 am, "ander...@phdgaming.com" 
wrote:
> As my applications audio is streamed from the net, some numbers from
> me based on my webhost:
>
> 36 visits (80 hits) for page 1's audio.
> 1 visit (1 hit) for someone who made it all the way to page 17.
> The application has 40 pages of content - but the uninstall to
> continue to the next application makes it unlikely anyone would get
> that far.
>
> Voice definition audio:
> 6 visits (11 hits) for the word on the first page "Ancestral".
> Subsequent pages have from 1-3 hits for the definitions that are
> clickable.
>
> My application is a 10.75 MB behemoth though which is likely causing
> people to skip it (one such person even posted doing so in these
> forums :p). Also doesn't help that there are bugs / grammar errors in
> the version I submitted.
>
> Anyway - better than I expected, to be honest. Assuming the same rate,
> it should be rated ~360 times by the end of the challenge, which isn't
> bad. I'd also assume Google would begin to publicize the judging
> application more next week having used the initial few days as a "beta
> test" by more savvy developers and power users.
>
> On Sep 26, 12:34 pm, "Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)"
>
>
>
>  wrote:
> > I have three apps in ADC2 and so far have seen a total of 63 users run
> > them.
>
> > There seems to be a very low number of judges participating in ADC2.
> > I've seen no publicity at all, no mention in the tech press, no TV
> > coverage, nothing to indicate this contest is running.
>
> > I'm guessing that the majority of judges at this point are developers.
> > Won't that skew the results? Is this supposed to be a developer or
> > user contest?
>
> > -John Coryat
>
> > "Radar Now!"
>
> > "What Zip Code?"
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-26 Thread ander...@phdgaming.com

As my applications audio is streamed from the net, some numbers from
me based on my webhost:

36 visits (80 hits) for page 1's audio.
1 visit (1 hit) for someone who made it all the way to page 17.
The application has 40 pages of content - but the uninstall to
continue to the next application makes it unlikely anyone would get
that far.

Voice definition audio:
6 visits (11 hits) for the word on the first page "Ancestral".
Subsequent pages have from 1-3 hits for the definitions that are
clickable.

My application is a 10.75 MB behemoth though which is likely causing
people to skip it (one such person even posted doing so in these
forums :p). Also doesn't help that there are bugs / grammar errors in
the version I submitted.

Anyway - better than I expected, to be honest. Assuming the same rate,
it should be rated ~360 times by the end of the challenge, which isn't
bad. I'd also assume Google would begin to publicize the judging
application more next week having used the initial few days as a "beta
test" by more savvy developers and power users.

On Sep 26, 12:34 pm, "Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)"
 wrote:
> I have three apps in ADC2 and so far have seen a total of 63 users run
> them.
>
> There seems to be a very low number of judges participating in ADC2.
> I've seen no publicity at all, no mention in the tech press, no TV
> coverage, nothing to indicate this contest is running.
>
> I'm guessing that the majority of judges at this point are developers.
> Won't that skew the results? Is this supposed to be a developer or
> user contest?
>
> -John Coryat
>
> "Radar Now!"
>
> "What Zip Code?"
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-26 Thread nuno

Really no idea where you got that thought from maybe all the
iPhone ads  in almost all european country I travel to.


On Sep 26, 6:00 pm, tauntz  wrote:
> Sorry about TV ads - don't know where I got the idea :) 
> readingComprehension--;
>
> On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 7:55 PM, Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)
>
>
>
>  wrote:
>
> >> 1) This belongs to android-discuss, it has nothing to do with
> >> developing apps using the public SDK
>
> > Maybe. There are enough conversations regarding ADC2 on this forum to
> > make it relevant. If Google would open an ADC2 forum, that would be a
> > better place.
>
> >> 2) TV adds? Are you kidding us or you really want to have TV ads in
> >> all countries where Android phones are sold? :)
>
> > Where in my post did I mention TV ads? TV coverage is about media
> > exposure. You may have heard of CBS, CNN, CNBC and the other networks.
> > They put enough time into covering lottery jackpots, spelling bees,
> > pie eating and other events, why not this contest?
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-26 Thread tauntz

Sorry about TV ads - don't know where I got the idea :) readingComprehension--;

On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 7:55 PM, Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)
 wrote:
>
>> 1) This belongs to android-discuss, it has nothing to do with
>> developing apps using the public SDK
>
> Maybe. There are enough conversations regarding ADC2 on this forum to
> make it relevant. If Google would open an ADC2 forum, that would be a
> better place.
>
>> 2) TV adds? Are you kidding us or you really want to have TV ads in
>> all countries where Android phones are sold? :)
>
> Where in my post did I mention TV ads? TV coverage is about media
> exposure. You may have heard of CBS, CNN, CNBC and the other networks.
> They put enough time into covering lottery jackpots, spelling bees,
> pie eating and other events, why not this contest?
> >
>

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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-26 Thread Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)

> 1) This belongs to android-discuss, it has nothing to do with
> developing apps using the public SDK

Maybe. There are enough conversations regarding ADC2 on this forum to
make it relevant. If Google would open an ADC2 forum, that would be a
better place.

> 2) TV adds? Are you kidding us or you really want to have TV ads in
> all countries where Android phones are sold? :)

Where in my post did I mention TV ads? TV coverage is about media
exposure. You may have heard of CBS, CNN, CNBC and the other networks.
They put enough time into covering lottery jackpots, spelling bees,
pie eating and other events, why not this contest?
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[android-developers] Re: ADC2: Low volume of judges

2009-09-26 Thread tauntz

1) This belongs to android-discuss, it has nothing to do with
developing apps using the public SDK :)
2) TV adds? Are you kidding us or you really want to have TV ads in
all countries where Android phones are sold? :)

Tauno

On Sat, Sep 26, 2009 at 7:34 PM, Maps.Huge.Info (Maps API Guru)
 wrote:
>
> I have three apps in ADC2 and so far have seen a total of 63 users run
> them.
>
> There seems to be a very low number of judges participating in ADC2.
> I've seen no publicity at all, no mention in the tech press, no TV
> coverage, nothing to indicate this contest is running.
>
> I'm guessing that the majority of judges at this point are developers.
> Won't that skew the results? Is this supposed to be a developer or
> user contest?
>
> -John Coryat
>
> "Radar Now!"
>
> "What Zip Code?"
> >
>

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