[AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
I'd love to see some politicians lead the way in finding things we can unite around. A real uniter, so to speak. I'm in total agreement with you on this - but fear the country is so polarized by absolutists who believe they are completely and totally right and anyone who doesn't agree with every aspect of their position is totally wrong. The immigration debate is a great (or bad) illustration of exactly that (just watch Lou Dobbs for a while as he clearly sees himself as the smartest man on earth). In a country who's entire system was built on compromise it seems that compromise has become a four-letter word. To me, that's scary. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, asburycouple [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd love to see some politicians lead the way in finding things we can unite around. A real uniter, so to speak. One of my first consulting jobs was a uniter. A large co fired all their programmers and outsourced the work to India. It made the news. That failed. I came in as part of a new team of Americans. My job was to unite or translate the requirements to all the american programmers. The Asians, Russians, The Boys from India. The russians would draw a picture of the kremlin on a white board, because the room they worked out of had no windows. It reminded them of life in Russia. I had more fun, while getting paid, to work with all these guys and girls. Even more interesting, in evening, the code was shipped to Malaysia, so coding could continue for the next 12 hours, at a fraction of the price. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
In a message dated 6/20/2007 6:50:24 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: but fear the country is so polarized by absolutists ... The immigration debate is a great (or bad) illustration of exactly that...In a country who's entire system was built on compromise it seems that compromise has become a four-letter word. To me, that's scary. Lots of scary shitake out there. 2000 years ago the Romans were suckered and distracted by bread and circuses. Orwell's 20th century version works too. War is Peace; Freedom is Slavery Ignorance is Strength (bliss). (and keep 'em distracted by lotteries, shortages, pornography, and sensationalized media.). Distractions. More crawlers, more booming base sound effects touting Wolfe's latest just in, stay tuned. More chocolate Jesuses; red blue states, red alerts, if it bleeds it leads Keep 'em distracted and the 2% Inner Party will always thrive. Network redux: _Click here: Network (1976) - Memorable quotes_ (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0074958/quotes) And so it goes Unless more audiences like this act up: (YouTube segment) _Click here: Audience Heckles Matthews During Clinton Interview - Politics on The Huffington Post_ (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2007/06/19/audience-heckles-matthews_n_52875.html) Bravo! Soma, anyone? ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
[AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
Mario; one word, AMEN! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 6/19/2007 11:16:50 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How about taking the opportunity to better one's own condition and that of their family by using all the resources available to them to get ahead? My kids want a huge on the ocean, boats and fancy cars. I busted my rear to have what I owe the bank today. On most weekends over the psat 20 years, my friends would stop by and i'd be covered in spackle, paint or dirt working on our house(s). This is America, the land of opportunity, of which there are tons. Sometimes you have to break out in a sweat to get paid. Most people don't want to That about the weakest argument against reparations there is on the topic. Among other things it doesn't address the issue of reparations for slavery and land granted, then taken back, which is what the proponents stress. Instead, it implies that anyone who doesn't achieve success must be lazy (never breaks out in a sweat). It's a very live issue. Try Reparation Arguments 101 where you'll find arguments from both sides. _http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reparations_for_slavery_ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reparations_for_slavery)(Wikimedia folks are still working on it; see the discussion page there.) Reparations 201: _http://news.minnesota.publicradio.org/features/200011/13_williamsb_reparations/_ (http://news.minnesota.publicradio.org/features/200011/13_williamsb_reparations/) And of Horowitiz's opposition: _http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=1153_ (http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=1153) It's an issue I haven't formed an opinion on as yet, but recent precedents include our government's reparations to Japanese-Americans interred during WWII; various governments and banks to survivors and descendants of the Holocaust; Native-Americans and also Korean women. Still disputed in Japan and Turkey. The Christian Science Monitor's approach was to focus on the implications for corporations: _Click here: Slave reparations are unlikely, but lawsuit may prod companies | csmonitor.com_ (http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0328/p02s01-usju.html) Finally, Oakdorf writes: Having been around that world, as you have, I'm sure you noticed that at times, jobs are given to people who simply shouldn't have them, given the qualifications. Reminds me of many appointments made by the Bush/Cheney administration: FEMA, Justice, ad nauseum. ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
Mario: ROTFLMAO! Twice! He forgot Condi! --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I could be wrong!_Click here: YouTube - But I Could Be Wrong_ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-5d5IfdYK4) ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
On Jun 19, 2007, at 11:57 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 6/19/2007 11:18:10 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So far what I've seen is the emergence of two languages that do not look like they have any plans to become one. Once again, I agree. Makes me somewhat uncomfortable, as do the burkas one sees more and more. I hope we don't get as nuts about this as the Quebecois and the Anglo Quebecers during the 1970s. I think that's all quieted down now. Not sure though. That's what I think is funny. You hear some people saying how Canada does so well with two languages (although I think they've made both languages official) but the Francophones still start movements to succeed every few years. Things aren't as pleasant between the two worlds there as some would like you to believe. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
On the other hand, much of Europe is already multi-lingual, n'est-ce pas? More critical than English only IMO: Our country better get more serious about real teaching of math and science. Asians are heavily focused on those areas. If we lose our technological edge (if not already), it won't matter if we all start speaking pig-Latin! In a message dated 6/20/2007 10:33:48 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Jun 19, 2007, at 11:57 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 6/19/2007 11:18:10 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So far what I've seen is the emergence of two languages that do not look like they have any plans to become one. Once again, I agree. Makes me somewhat uncomfortable, as do the burkas one sees more and more. I hope we don't get as nuts about this as the Quebecois and the Anglo Quebecers during the 1970s. I think that's all quieted down now. Not sure though. That's what I think is funny. You hear some people saying how Canada does so well with two languages (although I think they've made both languages official) but the Francophones still start movements to succeed every few years. Things aren't as pleasant between the two worlds there as some would like you to believe. Yahoo! Groups Links ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
[AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
Mario: Don't remember that exchange from Network, but I saw the piece on Chris I'm in love with myself Matthews! He is a definite DEM, hater! Loves to carp on them and put them down! Must be because the Republicans have slipped to a new low, in the polls! To all Republicans out there, I can't stand the Democrats, either! Not because I am one, but, because they are as sleazy, as any other politician! I'm not fooled one bit, by their self-righteous stance, against other politicians. They're ALL in bed, with each other, would sell out their mothers, for a nickle and have no solutions, to the many problems, this Nation, faces, so please, no flames! I hate them ALL! We need a third party, for those of us, who want change; real change, where a job, health care and a free education, is given to all, LEGAL citizens! Isn't that what the Constitution USED to promise? Give us your tired, your poor,.. --- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 6/20/2007 6:50:24 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: but fear the country is so polarized by absolutists ... The immigration debate is a great (or bad) illustration of exactly that...In a country who's entire system was built on compromise it seems that compromise has become a four-letter word. To me, that's scary. Lots of scary shitake out there. 2000 years ago the Romans were suckered and distracted by bread and circuses. Orwell's 20th century version works too. War is Peace; Freedom is Slavery Ignorance is Strength (bliss). (and keep 'em distracted by lotteries, shortages, pornography, and sensationalized media.). Distractions. More crawlers, more booming base sound effects touting Wolfe's latest just in, stay tuned. More chocolate Jesuses; red blue states, red alerts, if it bleeds it leads Keep 'em distracted and the 2% Inner Party will always thrive. Network redux: _Click here: Network (1976) - Memorable quotes_ (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0074958/quotes) And so it goes Unless more audiences like this act up: (YouTube segment) _Click here: Audience Heckles Matthews During Clinton Interview - Politics on The Huffington Post_ (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2007/06/19/audience-heckles-matthews_n_52875.html) Bravo! Soma, anyone? ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
--- In AsburyPark@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 6/19/2007 11:16:50 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How about taking the opportunity to better one's own condition and that of I wasn't talking about Reparations, more of one's desire to work at work, work at getting work and the opportunities that do exist. Everyone should learn MORE then one job, have more then career so if one fails, one can still survive. You may not survive as in Job A, some do better after Job A, some fail. A lawyer can be a teacher, a lawyer can be a plumber. I knew a georgetown lawyer who sold and fixed cars instead of practicing. Do I want to go back and flip burgers? No. One of the best things I learned early on is that to get ahead in life, you have to move on to the next company. That is what builds a career and expertise and enables you to succeed. It was beneficial in the consulting world. Had I stayed put on Job A, I'd be a career man in ca corporate world in a position that would be easily done with out. Many, many jobs in the real world are at the mercy of the corp. I know, because it was job to tell ceos how to cut fat or streamline their biz or reengineer or automate, workflow, retrain, or whatever you call it. Most just renamed people postions or promoted the people out. If you want to talk about Reparations I don't know that much, other then to say the holocaust eliminated billons in Jewish and others wealth in various forms of properties. The banks hid and still do billions. Lot's ahve been written about various other religious orgs role in hiding money. you can't right every wrong of the past with money, nor can money correct the current or future plight of a number of people in the US. It works to some degree in real poor countries. First define poor. Poor here and poor elsewhere is vastly different. Where you give a shirt off your back means something. Here, it's meaningless. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
Dave, You wrote: I wasn't talking about Reparations, OK, but the post you were responding to was about reparations. more of one's desire to work at work, work at getting work and the opportunities that do exist. Everyone should learn MORE then one job, have more then career so if one fails, one can still survive. I agree with all that I think the thread started several posts back with talk about undocumented immigrants, etc., then moved on to English only, assimilation, etc. Very complex issues from listening to the debates on C-Span during recent attempts at fixing the immigration laws. Doesn't seem to be down party lines either. Personally, I hate going to Home Depot or any other store, turning over a box several times trying to find the English version of contents/instructions. Once I do find it, the words Made in China will most likely be there. I also hate having to push a button for the English version. My father, an immigrant from Italy, spoke very broken English throughout his 60 some years here. And yes, he worked very hard -- to enable my brother and me to better ourselves through education. And yet -- at a nearby garden center, for example, I always get the best service (pricing, loading the car, etc.) from employees who are brown-skinned immigrants; most of the white boys there are rarely as helpful. I stupidly left my wallet on the roof of my car one day last year. I fell off onto Sunset Ave, but I didn't miss it until I got to Red Bank. A day later I get a call I could barely understand. It was a Mexican man (one of many who bicycle to work every day on this route) who found it and all my money and all my credit cards strewn on the street. He asked if I would drive to his apt just off Kingsley to pick it up. He had put everything neatly back in the wallet. The only thing missing was my Triple A card which I found in the gutter a few days later, so I know everything had spilled out. Yep, an anecdote. But I still have mixed feelings, as in I don't know enough, about all the proposed fixes out there. I do know that I can count on AM radio and some bloggers to stir up more emotional culture wars. Isn't that how Sunni vs. Shia started? I could be wrong!_Click here: YouTube - But I Could Be Wrong_ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-5d5IfdYK4) ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
My father, an immigrant from Italy, spoke very broken English throughout his 60 some years here. And yes, he worked very hard -- to enable my brother and me to better ourselves through education. It's definitely possible that the immigrants want to learn English and may even be doing so - I just haven't personally seen it. I have immigrants as neighbors and pass at least 50-100 every day while walking my dog. I've yet to hear a word of English. What I have been seeing in Shore towns is not much different from when I used to go to Elizabeth in the '90s. I'm not sure how it is now, but about 10-15 years ago, English was pretty much a forgotten language everywhere but at City Hall (where I think they had a mandatory English only policy at the time). Every sign for every business on Main Street was in Spanish. Is that bad? Yes and no. It's nice to have a mixture of cultures; however, places like Little Italy and Chinatowns are not seen spreading across an entire city. When an entire city is in a foreign language, it seems a bit far fetched to think those people are assimilating. After all, why should they? Everything they need is in their native tongue. But, just as you stated, I know I could be wrong about this. I'm not quoting statistics across the country, I'm only saying what I believe based on what I see every day. The wave of immigration to the Shore hasn't been just a few months - it's been several years. So far what I've seen is the emergence of two languages that do not look like they have any plans to become one. And as someone else pointed out, when I'm in a foreign country I try to learn the language. Maybe they are too, but so far I haven't seen it. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AsburyPark/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [AsburyPark] Re: Reparations
In a message dated 6/19/2007 11:18:10 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So far what I've seen is the emergence of two languages that do not look like they have any plans to become one. Once again, I agree. Makes me somewhat uncomfortable, as do the burkas one sees more and more. I hope we don't get as nuts about this as the Quebecois and the Anglo Quebecers during the 1970s. I think that's all quieted down now. Not sure though. I just don't see it as a critical issue as yet, relatively speaking. Media and bloggers love it, but are too emotional and anecdotal to achieve any solutions. Someone's always moving the cheese. I'd love to see some politicians lead the way in finding things we can unite around. A real uniter, so to speak. ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
