Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread audiomuze

TimT wrote: 
> Perhaps. Consider this: John Audiophile has just dropped $15,000 on a
> pair of speakers, $7500 on amplification and playback. What
> interconnects does he buy? $15 for a pair of 10-foot speaker cables? Or
> does he spend $300 on a "name brand" pair? Maybe $300 won't buy him
> better sound; but almost certainly, John A thinks, it won't buy him
> worse sound. No question that John can afford to spend more. What would
> you do? What does the "rational audiophile" do?I'll answer i.r.o. what I did 
> and have stayed with having dropped
$30,000 in 2004 money on a pair of active speakers and preamplifier.  I
bought a run of Belden 1800F and as many Neutrik connectors as I needed
to make up interconnects from DAC to preamp and preamp to speakers, had
them made up and soldered using silver solder.  Over the years I've had
many audiophiles through my place, many with exotic cable in hand to
prove I was missing something.  After listening they've all left
disappointed.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] MEASUREMENTS / IMPRESSIONS: PCM 24/192 vs. Decoded MQA using Meridian Explorer2

2016-02-14 Thread Wombat

Nice!
"...the noise tonally is higher with a rising noise level above 5kHz" <-
especially above 7.5kHz can this be the 'sparkle' itself? Be it added
harmonics, EQ or other DSP?



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread TimT

audiomuze wrote: 
> Take cables ... a fool and their money are soon parted.

Perhaps. Consider this: John Audiophile has just dropped $15,000 on a
pair of speakers, $7500 on amplification and playback. What
interconnects does he buy? $15 for a pair of 10-foot speaker cables? Or
does he spend $300 on a "name brand" pair? Maybe $300 won't buy him
better sound; but almost certainly, John A thinks, it won't buy him
worse sound. No question that John can afford to spend more. What would
you do? What does the "rational audiophile" do?



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread audiomuze

Take cables ... a fool and their money are soon parted.



SqueezeWand | 'Vivere DAC MKI'
(http://vivereaudio.com/post/2013/08/16/DAC-I-is-Born!.aspx) | 'ATC
SCA2'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/electronics/source-pre-amplifiers/sca2/)
| 'ATC SCM100ASLT'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/loudspeakers/tower-series/scm100aslt/)

*'Linux finally gets a great audio tagger'
(http://www.ubuntugeek.com/linux-finally-gets-a-great-audio-tagger.html):
'puddletag' (http://puddletag.sourceforge.net/)* - now packaged in most
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[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] MEASUREMENTS / IMPRESSIONS: PCM 24/192 vs. Decoded MQA using Meridian Explorer2

2016-02-14 Thread Archimago

Well... Got hold of some recordings off the Explorer2 DAC with MQA
decoding enabled.

No surprise. Still looks like 16-bit dynamic range limitation as I
suspected. I was able to ABX the difference reasonably well. Check it
out:
'PCM 24/192 vs. Decoded MQA with Meridian Explorer2'
(http://archimago.blogspot.ca/2016/02/measurements-impressions-meridian.html)

Have a great week ahead everyone!



Archimago's Musings: (archimago.blogspot.com) A 'more objective'
audiophile blog.

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Gravitational Waves

2016-02-14 Thread bonze

Julf wrote: 
> This new technology necessitates maintaining a double inventory, as all
> cables shipped to the southern hemisphere must have their conductor
> strands wound in the opposite direction.”
Surely the use of one of these cables in the southern hemisphere must
also necessitate the use of an "opposite" cable in the northern
hemisphere? 
Otherwise he's putting the Earth out of balance.

For example, for every cable shipped to Australia there should be a
cable stored in a warehouse in the UK (for an annual fee - obviously)



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread ralphpnj

audiomuze wrote: 
> agreed, and it's surpassed only by stupidity.

As a reformed audiophile I have to either disagree or take the fifth (
https://www.google.com/#newwindow=1=off=take+the+fifth ). Often
times the answer to something is hiding in plain sight and all one needs
to do is connect the dots in the proper order.

Back in high school and college I learned how to read equipment
specifications and then learned how to really read specs and began to
see what the manufacturer was trying to hide. My growing distrust of
mass market audio moved me towards high end audio, albeit at the "most
bang for the buck" end of things, and once again I had to relearn how to
specs, which for the most part are badly misused in high end audio, in
fact way more than in mass market audio. And then along came computer
based digital audio and audio equipment, especially front ends, became
more about proper/pure fidelity and less about euphonic coloration. And
as I slowly started connecting the dots, I came to distrust much of what
is written in the high end audio media. I still understand the need for
something better than mass market audio but with today's rapidly rising
prices it's more important than ever to find audio equipment that offers
great value for the money. Such as the Squeezebox Touch, the best $300 I
ever spent on a piece of audio equipment.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Gravitational Waves

2016-02-14 Thread SlimChances

bonze wrote: 
> Surely the use of one of these cables in the southern hemisphere must
> also necessitate the use of an "opposite" cable in the northern
> hemisphere? 
> Otherwise he's putting the Earth out of balance.
> 
> For example, for every cable shipped to Australia there should be a
> cable stored in a warehouse in the UK (for an annual fee - obviously)

I guess it would be cataclysmic if an owner of a cable  travelled with
his cable to the opposite hemisphere'**'
(https://www.google.ca/search?client=ubuntu=O7k=fs=cataclysmic=1=X=0ahUKEwjAtK2UkPjKAhXJmR4KHZ00AD0QvwUIGSgA=1088=510)



Logitech Media Server Version: 7.9.0 - 145495 @ Mon Feb  8 19:16:07
UTC 2016
Operating system: Debian - EN - utf8Platform Architecture:
x86_64-linux
Perl Version: 5.18.2 - x86_64-linux-gnu-thread-multi
Database Version: DBD::SQLite 
1.34_01 (sqlite 3.7.7.1)

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4.1 speakers
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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Gravitational Waves

2016-02-14 Thread Greg Erskine

Julf wrote: 
> Appropriately the 'Real HD Audio blog of Mark Waldrep'
> (http://www.realhd-audio.com/?p=5574) had this pearl yesterday:
> 
> "Wait, there’s more:
> To make the best even better, our Earth MFC (Magnetic Field
> Cancellation) option can be added for only $30,000. As the name implies,
> Earth MFC cancels the negative effects of the earth’s magnetic field,
> using precision calibrated magnetometers coupled to proprietary
> monitoring circuitry. The monitoring circuitry is necessary to maintain
> calibration should the planet’s magnetic poles ever reverse.

I hope there is a toggle switch as the earth's magnetic field is due for
a reversal. ;)



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread ralphpnj

Wombat wrote: 
> I see some audio engineers really can measure or demonstrate technical
> differences. These things are often far, far from being audible but are
> taken as proof.
> The bad thing is that exactly this creates audiophils that are
> absolutely rational to other aspects of live but when it comes to audio
> their imagination gets tricked only because they believe in it.
> 
> 
> @arnyk
> Nice to see you and i hope you are fine. Very few posts of yours lately.

I've said it many times before that measurements and high end audio work
two ways:

1) measurements are given as proof that A must sound better than B. For
example A has measurable (but still not audible) jitter and B has even
less (lower) jitter. Or A is a standard resolution file (24 bit and
44.1kHz) and B is a high resolution file (24bit and 96kHz)

2) measurements cannot show why A sounds so good. This argument is
ALWAYS used for ALL tube equipment and ALL vinyl playback equipment.

Remember when money is involved, and money is always the primary driver
in all things high end audio, hypocrisy has no bounds.



Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. &
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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread audiomuze

ralphpnj wrote: 
> ...in all things high end audio, hypocrisy has no bounds.agreed, and it's 
> surpassed only by stupidity.



SqueezeWand | 'Vivere DAC MKI'
(http://vivereaudio.com/post/2013/08/16/DAC-I-is-Born!.aspx) | 'ATC
SCA2'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/electronics/source-pre-amplifiers/sca2/)
| 'ATC SCM100ASLT'
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*'Linux finally gets a great audio tagger'
(http://www.ubuntugeek.com/linux-finally-gets-a-great-audio-tagger.html):
'puddletag' (http://puddletag.sourceforge.net/)* - now packaged in most
Linux distributions.

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread ralphpnj

Mnyb wrote: 
> I think the audiophile culture actually traps some reasonable people now
> and then . Its not hard to see why 99% of the so called "information"
> the audiophile can enjoy in magazines and online is of very questinable
> quality . I never seen any other hobby where almost all "knowledge" is
> totally bogus and every magazine or forum or blog feeds you 99% nonsense
> and lies . If you then does not have any enginnering background or
> otherwise experienced in critical thinking ? I may not be easy to see
> trough this.

I can name another group where 99% of the "information" and"knowledge"
is just nonsense and lies - The US Republican party. Just a tad bit more
important than high end audio, although the Republicans do follow almost
the exact playbook as high end audio.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread Julf

ralphpnj wrote: 
> I can name another group where 99% of the "information" and"knowledge"
> is just nonsense and lies - The US Republican party. Just a tad bit more
> important than high end audio, although the Republicans do follow almost
> the exact playbook as high end audio.

Not going to touch the politics with a 3-metre pole, but I think what we
are seeing in high end audio, politics, health fads etc. is actually
rejection of science and escapism - into "my opinion is just as valid as
that of all those fancy PhDs".



"To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this
fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt
edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread cliveb

ralphpnj wrote: 
> No I really do mean audiophiles and NOT audiophools since I don't
> believe that audiophiles are fools. I believe that the vast majority of
> audiophiles have been fooled into believing so much nonsense by a very
> complex system that is working very hard to separate them from their
> money.
The way you phrase it implies that the conspiracy is being perpetrated
by organisations and individuals who have full knowledge that they are
lying and it is all nonsense.

But I think that the vast majority of high-end audio manufacturers
actually believe their own propaganda.
Which in a way is even more shocking: the vendors of items of
engineering don't actually understand the engineering they are
delivering.

Keep in mind Hanlon's razor: "never ascribe to malice that which can be
explained by stupidity"?



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread arnyk

cliveb wrote: 
> The way you phrase it implies that the conspiracy is being perpetrated
> by organisations and individuals who have full knowledge that they are
> lying and it is all nonsense.
> 
> But I think that the vast majority of high-end audio manufacturers
> actually believe their own propaganda.
> Which in a way is even more shocking: the vendors of items of
> engineering don't actually understand the engineering they are
> delivering.
> 
> Keep in mind Hanlon's razor: "never ascribe to malice that which can be
> explained by stupidity"?

Current understandings of perception and memory suggest that initially
these people may have been well-tutored in the basics, and knew them
very well. However, years of success with we might call  "Alternative
wisdom" has literally changed their minds.  The name John Atkinson
somehow comes to mind. ;-)



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread ralphpnj

Julf wrote: 
> Not going to touch the politics with a 3-metre pole, but I think what we
> are seeing in high end audio, politics, health fads etc. is actually
> rejection of science and escapism - into "my opinion is just as valid as
> that of all those fancy PhDs".

I agree and therefore apologize for my lapse into politics. However I
don't think of it as a rejection of science but rather a rejection of
any science which gets in the way of profits, which is why Al Gore used
the label "An Inconvenient Truth". 

cliveb wrote: 
> The way you phrase it implies that the conspiracy is being perpetrated
> by organisations and individuals who have full knowledge that they are
> lying and it is all nonsense.
> 
> But I think that the vast majority of high-end audio manufacturers
> actually believe their own propaganda.
> Which in a way is even more shocking: the vendors of items of
> engineering don't actually understand the engineering they are
> delivering.
> 
> Keep in mind Hanlon's razor: "never ascribe to malice that which can be
> explained by stupidity"?

I believe that most high end audio engineers and designers fully
understand the science of audio but they are only a small part of the
team that make up a high end audio manufacturer. It's the marketing
people and others who are directing these engineers into the world of
voodoo science. For example I believe that the engineering team which
developed Audioquest's Jitterbug know full well that it's a complete
waste of money but that money is paying their salaries.

arnyk wrote: 
> Current understandings of perception and memory suggest that initially
> these people may have been well-tutored in the basics, and knew them
> very well. However, years of success with we might call  "Alternative
> wisdom" has literally changed their minds.  The name John Atkinson
> somehow comes to mind. ;-)

Even hinting that John Atkinson (or for that matter Robert Harley) has
or ever had any understanding of the basics of audio engineering is
completely laughable and an insult to all engineers, not just audio
engineers. They are both plain and simply shills for their advertisers.
Giving them even the slightest hint of respectability is exactly how
they are able to succeed. I much prefer to call them what they really
are - people who lie for money.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread Wombat

I see some audio engineers really can measure or demonstrate technical
differences. These things are often far, far from being audible but are
taken as proof.
The bad thing is that exactly this creates audiophils that are
absolutely rational to other aspects of live but when it comes to audio
their imagination gets tricked only because they believe in it.


@arnyk
Nice to see you and i hope you are fine. Very few posts of yours lately.



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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread audiomuze

far as I'm concerned people that fall victim to that nonsense are
audiophools, seemingly incapable of exercising critical thinking.



SqueezeWand | 'Vivere DAC MKI'
(http://vivereaudio.com/post/2013/08/16/DAC-I-is-Born!.aspx) | 'ATC
SCA2'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/electronics/source-pre-amplifiers/sca2/)
| 'ATC SCM100ASLT'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/loudspeakers/tower-series/scm100aslt/)

*'Linux finally gets a great audio tagger'
(http://www.ubuntugeek.com/linux-finally-gets-a-great-audio-tagger.html):
'puddletag' (http://puddletag.sourceforge.net/)* - now packaged in most
Linux distributions.

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Gravitational Waves

2016-02-14 Thread Julf

ralphpnj wrote: 
> Now that gravitational waves have been detected how long before their
> adverse effects on audio will be noted along a solution to repair those
> adverse effects?


Appropriately the 'Real HD Audio blog of Mark Waldrep'
(http://www.realhd-audio.com/?p=5574) had this pearl yesterday:

"DH Labs introduces Gravitationally Compensated Audio Cables

If the moon’s gravitational pull has the power to move entire oceans,
imagine what it does to the tiny electrons traveling through your audio
cables. In light of this, DH Labs has created the world’s first
gravitationally compensated audio cables. By using proprietary
electro-gyroscopic technology, DH Labs has defeated the laws of physics,
and the results are spectacular. This new technology necessitates
maintaining a double inventory, as all cables shipped to the southern
hemisphere must have their conductor strands wound in the opposite
direction. Price: $7000 per meter.

Wait, there’s more:
To make the best even better, our Earth MFC (Magnetic Field
Cancellation) option can be added for only $30,000. As the name implies,
Earth MFC cancels the negative effects of the earth’s magnetic field,
using precision calibrated magnetometers coupled to proprietary
monitoring circuitry. The monitoring circuitry is necessary to maintain
calibration should the planet’s magnetic poles ever reverse.

The net effect of these revolutionary new technologies is the purest
sound ever heard.”

(and yes, it is a joke)



"To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this
fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt
edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread Julf

audiomuze wrote: 
> far as I'm concerned people that fall victim to that nonsense are
> audiophools, seemingly incapable of exercising critical thinking.

Not true. They are definitely very critical against any criticism.
Confirmation and group bias are rather strong influences.



"To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this
fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt
edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953

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Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

2016-02-14 Thread Mnyb

I think the audiophile culture actually traps some reasonable people now
and then . Its not hard to see why 99% of the so called "information"
the audiophile can enjoy in magazines and online is of very questinable
quality . I never seen any other hobby where almost all "knowledge" is
totally bogus and every magazine or forum or blog feeds you 99% nonsense
and lies . If you then does not have any enginnering background or
otherwise experienced in critical thinking ? I may not be easy to see
trough this.




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