Hugo - Does he believe he'll walk again?
My heart goes out to Thia and to Denise and Paul Vickers, prayers for Drachmboui. Thanks to all the wonderful berner-lovers who sent emails of support and ideas for sweet Hugo. He's depressed today maybe because, at the doctor's suggestion, we tried to get him to stand by holding him by the sling and he couldn't/wouldn't put any weight at all on his feet. I feel so bad for him. I wonder if he believes that he'll ever walk again. If there's a true hydro-therapy facility for dogs in the LA area, they're keeping it the best-kept secret around. But someone from this list who uses a San Diego facility emailed me. Hearing personally from someone made me feel like the drive could be worth it. I just have to take the large car into the shop first (minor problem I suspect but it's finding the time) and then find someone to help me load the 112 lb. big boy Hugo on my stretcher before that 2-3 hr. drive. Problems that wouldn't be obstacles if he were a poodle! I understand what you meant Ruth when you said the trimmer berner gals are a lot more manageable... Donna and Hugo (8 yr old BMD, ruptured disc, surgery 4/02, surgery 12/02 bulging disc, stroke)
Re: Eosinophilic Gastroenteritis
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assorted retrieving tricks
a simple retrieve can be renamed - retrieve stuffed sheep or cow - this is 'herding'. a friend of mine's sheltie would retrieve 2 stuffed sheep & deposit them in a basket - 'the barn'. retrieve hidden toy - stuffed rat - this is the popular terrier game of 'hunt the rat'. teach the names of more than one toy & teach to retrieve one particular one. retrieve wad of paper to trash can - pick up the garbage or do the recycle. we used to have a toy pedal operated garbage can & a brussels griffon would retrieve a wad of paper & open the can & drop it in. retrieve a wallet that you drop as you walk the dog down the room - find the wallet (yep, you knew that old utility seek back would come in handy) and for the more laid back - how about go to sleep? dog does down stay on side, doesn't get up until you tell him it's morning. especially cute with a pillow & blanket. lisa baldwin (dickens, bark & zel) seattle, wa [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Berners who can "turn tricks"
Weave around and thru your legs (tricky if you're short) Answer the phone (pick up a childs toy phone when you say 'ring.' Add a bark for more flash.) Go harvesting (put toy food into a basket) Tell a story (keep on barking) Marjie
Re: sick berner
Hello, Laura, My experience with a dog who had RMSF, years ago, before anyone wanted to admit that dogs in New England could contract it was that after 24 hours on strong antibiotics, she was markedly better. Her symptoms were physical, she was weak, could barely walk, not limping, and it seemed as if she had neurological problems. I'd go with your vets advice and see a specialist. Hugs to you and Jake, and I hope things turn out well for you both. Janice Parky North Truro, MA > My name is Laura Arch and I've been a happy lurker for 3 years. Now I need > some help. My Jake is 3 yrs old and up till now very healthy. About a month > ago he stopped eating like the chow hound that he is. The vet could find > nothing wrong. I took him back and he had lost 6 lbs in 2 weeks.We ran lots > of tests, xrays and even a baruim swallow test as he seemed to have trouble > with swallowing. He has a low hematocrit, low red blood count and low normal > platlets. His titer for Rocky Mountain spotted fever came back elevated so > we are treating him empirically with antibiotics to see if this helps. He's > been on them for 3 days and his appitite now is completely gone. My vet > suggested taking him to the specialists in Greenville, SC in a few days if > we see no improvement. Has anyone had experience with this kind of > problem?Thanks in advance. > > Laura Arch > [EMAIL PROTECTED] >
Re: BERNER-L digest 4248
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Re: www.exoticdogs.com
- Original Message - From: "Molly Bass" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > I just got an e-mail from these people asking if I had photos of my dogs > they could use on their website. All they offered in return was credit as > the photographer. That makes no difference to me but I figured I would > check them out first. Always a good plan. >I was actually quite upset when I read their page on > the BMD. Half of their information is incorrect - my favorite was "some > white markings on heat, chest, tip of tail and feet are permissible" Yikes! > These lines got me next: "Special Skills: In the past, it was a > cattle-driver, watchdog, and tracking dog. Today, it is a watchdog and > family pet. Well, they did move cattle and guard the farms. Less sure about the tracking. Mic is definately a watch dog and family pet--he alerts us whenever anyone is near the property with as much vigor as my Pyrs do. > Watch-dog: High I would agree with this for most Berners. They bark and let you know someone is coming onto your property. We call the dogs our doorbells, actually. > Guard-dog: Medium - High" This would also describe Mic, as well as quite a few other Berners I know. It fits others less well. > Then finally - "Activity: High. Needs exercise, but enjoys lounging with owner. That's my fellow! > Living Environment: A home with a back yard is essential. His natural > territorial instinct will keep him close to home." Well, Mic might come *back* home but I'd certainly not bank on him sticking around without supervision. Of course, I think all dogs should be exercised either with supervision and good recall training or in a safe, fenced enviornment. Too many cars going too fast and too many people and other pets too close together in most people's areas for the old days of dogs roaming about. So, I guess while I think they are not the most accurate in the world, especially on markings and yard management, I do think they have a fair assessment of many Berners in their other descriptions. Quite frankly, my Mic is in many ways tougher than many of the Rotties I've known, and while not the most typical personality in the Berner world, I've met enough Berners like him to know I don't have a freak of nature living with me. :-) Eileen Morgan The Mare's Nest http://www.enter.net/~edlehman --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.445 / Virus Database: 250 - Release Date: 1/21/2003
Re: sick berner
Hi Laura: Though not encouraging, my experience with positive tests to Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever (RMSF) in two dogs (ages 8 and 9) I believe were false positives. Both dogs ended up having cancer. Your dog, hopefully, is too young for cancer, maybe it is just RMSF. Though I too gave the antibiotic (Doxycycline) for RMSF it completely took my dogs' appetites. I would ask your vet to do an ultrasound to see if there are any masses, lungs, spleen, etc. I know this is not good news, but your guy's symptoms are a bit scary. Was his white blood count high? The ultrasound would pick up on masses that the x-rays would not. Best of luck! Gail Miller Cynosure Bernese in Arkansas [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: "Barry Arch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Bernese Mountain Dog Mailing List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2003 5:30 PM Subject: sick berner > My name is Laura Arch and I've been a happy lurker for 3 years. Now I need > some help. My Jake is 3 yrs old and up till now very healthy. About a month > ago he stopped eating like the chow hound that he is. The vet could find > nothing wrong. I took him back and he had lost 6 lbs in 2 weeks.We ran lots > of tests, xrays and even a baruim swallow test as he seemed to have trouble > with swallowing. He has a low hematocrit, low red blood count and low normal > platlets. His titer for Rocky Mountain spotted fever came back elevated so > we are treating him empirically with antibiotics to see if this helps. He's > been on them for 3 days and his appitite now is completely gone. My vet > suggested taking him to the specialists in Greenville, SC in a few days if > we see no improvement. Has anyone had experience with this kind of > problem?Thanks in advance. > > Laura Arch > [EMAIL PROTECTED] >
AKC Registration
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RE: www.exoticdogs.com
The photos on that site are available from webshots.com (I actually have had several of them in my screensaver for quite some time), so I doubt that the owner even knows they're being used by exoticdogs.com. Everything at Webshots main site is in the public domain and downloadable by anyone at no charge. Julia Lily & Max Astoria, OR -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Cata Villamil Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2003 5:49 PM To: Bernese Mountain Dog Mailing List Subject: RE: www.exoticdogs.com I have received the same e-mail from www.exotic-dogs.com If I remember well, someone last year said something about this site. The actual photos this site is using are from an italian kennel, but in no place they say anything about the owners of this Bernese. Catalina
Re: how to transport a large, injured dog - ?
Marion - What a sad story I have a 110 lb male who once collapsed and I had to call someone to drive over and help me get him to the vet. I have actually made the decision to not own a male Berner again because they are too big to carry myself. I have two girls that I can (barely) carry if necessary. Ruth in Sonoma Valley with Ranger "the big guy" 110 lbs, Breeze -only 70 lbs-usually, Claire -80 lbs and 10 months old! Sam the "one eyed" Berner kitty - 12 lbs - Original Message - From: "Marion Brown" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Bernese List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 3:48 AM Subject: Re: how to transport a large, injured dog - ? > In my case it was a fairly large, old, and helpless Rikki whom I was taking > to the vet for her last journey to the Bridge. I got to the vet and went to > carry her in and managed to get about halfway up the pathway when I couldn't > get any further and I fell down with my tragic burden. After a few minutes I > was found in tears over Rikki on the pathway and help was at hand to carry > her in. After all this she slipped away peacefully in my arms - it is almost > one year ago and the grief hasn't gone away yet. > > So how do we carry our precious cargoes when they can't help themselves??? > > Marion Brown > Teversal Bernese Mountain Dogs > South Africa > Dogs Never Lie About Love (Jeffrey Masson) >
RE: www.exoticdogs.com
I have received the same e-mail from www.exotic-dogs.com If I remember well, someone last year said something about this site. The actual photos this site is using are from an italian kennel, but in no place they say anything about the owners of this Bernese. Catalina - Original Message - From: Molly Bass <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2003 8:35 PM Subject: www.exoticdogs.com > Hi everyone, > > I just got an e-mail from these people asking if I had photos of my dogs > they could use on their website. All they offered in return was credit as > the photographer. That makes no difference to me but I figured I would > check them out first. I was actually quite upset when I read their page on > the BMD. Half of their information is incorrect - my favorite was "some > white markings on heat, chest, tip of tail and feet are permissible" > These lines got me next: "Special Skills: In the past, it was a > cattle-driver, watchdog, and tracking dog. Today, it is a watchdog and > family pet. > Watch-dog: High > Guard-dog: Medium - High" > > Then finally - "Activity: High. Needs exercise, but enjoys lounging with owner. > Living Environment: A home with a back yard is essential. His natural > territorial instinct will keep him close to home." > > These people do not appear to have a clue about a Bernese and they do not > mention cancer anywhere in their page as an ailment - they say eyes are a > problem.. > > I thought I had bernese but from this website, I think I have long haired > rottweilers with permissible white markings. Does anyone know anything > about this site? (no offense to Rotti people) > > I did send them a note saying that much of their information is incomplete > or inaccurate and that I do not wish to participate in their site, and that > they should visit the AKC web page and www.berner.org for more accurate and > correct information on the breed. > > Molly and the gang > Charlottesville, VA > > > > > >
BMDs & Eosinophilic Gastroenteritis
Greetings from Montreal. Our 7 1/2 yr. BMD, Mick, had a bad holiday season: gas, lip smacking, frequent (& difficult?) swallowing, occasional cough, excessive saliva, slow eating (Kibble) and a slowly progressing lethargy. All the symptoms, except the lethargy, seemed to be episodic though, and he looked fine "in between". No diarrhea, no vomiting -- but we thought that the symptoms might be due reflux or heartburn. Just after New Year's he started coughing and gagging in the middle of his morning meal. He calmed down quicky, but wanted to go outside, so we let him out thinking he was going to perform his usual morning toilet. Instead he ran into the middle of the backyard and starting eating mouthfuls of snow, and when that didn't satisfy him he bounded over to the cedar hedge and started pulling at leaves and small branches, swallowing some before we could run out and stop him. From there his symptoms became more frequent, his appetite did decrease and he started looking more sick than well. We were thinking foreign body (gloves, plush toy pieces, cedar bits!), but at this point he needed serious vet. attention. We went to a vet. internist who examined him (he was feeling good that morning!) and then did a "pan-oscopy" looking at his esophagus, stomach, pharyx, larynx, trachea and bronchi. She found diffuse esophagitis, areas of gastritis and a clear respiratory system. She also pulled out about 15 2 - 3 inch cedar twigs, the end of a glove finger, and some fabric from toys? All in all enough to bother him, but what about the esophagitis, gastritis. It took a while for him to recover (mouth, etc. sore already) but about five days later he started another round of couging, gagging, choking, etc. and we were beside ourselves. The vet. had done some stomach biopsies and the pathology came back the evening he started his symptoms again and... eosinophilic gastroenteritis. He's on antacids, Prednisone (burst, for the pathological diagnosis) and we will start "de-worming" tomorrow. After the first steroid dose, his symptoms are much better, though if anything his energy level is down as well (maybe relieved that his symptoms/pain are better?) We have also started an elimination diet (fish and potato), and in retrospect we do recall a gradual increase in paw and leg "chewing" over the last six or so months. His diet has been steady though for at least two years: Wysong Synergon kibble and Missing Link supplement. We are hoping that he's on the mend now. Please excuse the length of this first post. I was wondering if anyone has any experience with eosinophilic gastroenteritis in their Berner, or with the diet mentioned? Although the pathology says "eosinophilic gastroenteritis", my own limited reading leads me to believe that the esophagus is not usually the primary site of inflammation, although bad "heartburn" will make it go red, for sure. We'd appreciate any comments/opinion/advice. Thanks. Fred. Salevsky Helen Macgregor Mick Montreal, Quebec.
Re: Tricks
Hi Kelly! I am currently teaching Frazier to "take a bow". He stretched with his butt up in the air, so I just started shaping this behavior. Since Frazier knows a click! or "yes!" will get him a treat, it has been pretty easy so far (at least in the house). Lesley Lesley & Steve Koonce Casey (Pinnacle's Chases The Wind CD CGC DD HIC) Rigley (Reflection's Double Your Fun CGC) Frazier (Pinnacle's Full House) Rancho Cordova, CA
RE: drug question - male incontinence
Hi vicky, Urine incontinence is when the dog dribbles without stimulation or knowing about it. When a male is young and urinating frequently you need to check for UTIs and if necessary have a urine culture done. Low ranking dogs and bitches will partially urinate as a sign of submission to a senior ranking dog and their interpretation of a dominant person. Maturity in the intact male usually cures the problem. The effect of Vitamin C on the amount of urine passed will often be a result of giving too much. If a dog is making enough of his own or other aspects of his diet are providing plenty then he is simply urinating the excess. There is a big difference between a dog emptying his bladder multiple times and the leaks caused by an expression of the "I'm lower on the totem pole than you" that youngsters tend to make. As Major is fed BARF diet I would presume the fruits you feed provide him with enough Vitamin C without needing to add extra. My kibble fed dogs are given 500mgs of Vitamin C and never more, if I'm doing the fruit thing then they are not given any supplement. A good BARF diet does not need extra supplementation of Vitamin C. When you think that 375mgs is enough for a human who cannot make their own Vitamin C then 500mgs is more than enough for a dog that can. Rose -Original Message- From: Vicky Whitney [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: January 29, 2003 6:02 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: drug question - male incontinence ORIGINAL POST >>>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Could anyone share their experience with using Proin 50 with their male dogs? The drug name is . . . Phenylpropanolamine HCL 50 mg. I think. What is/was your situation with your male that perhaps caused the incontinence, and did it work, and if so what did the dog weigh and what was the dosage? Thanks a ton Patt Wiegand<<< Patt, I have no experience with the drug you mentioned, but have had a small problem with male incontinence. Major was a much "leakier" puppy than our girl Maddie. While in much better control now at 18 months, I found through trial and error that Ester-C appears to cause the problem. No Ester-C, no incontinence; even a little Ester-C, and he will "lose" a little urine when overly excited. I'm not sure what you're experiencing, but I just thought I'd share this as I'd never seen anything posted about a connection with incontinence and Ester-C in dogs. I just happened to discover ths by accident when I ran out of Ester-C and he didn't have any for a couple of weeks, and had no more accidents. Perhaps there are other common supplements that have this effect? Vicky Whitney Bozeman, Montana _ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
Re: AKC registry question
Hi, >From a breeders perspective, if you don't register your puppy then in the eyes of the AKC and Bernergarde records the puppy is always on record as belonging to the breeder. The breeder then retains some responsibility for updating records with those registries. Sandie Hawkins
Berners who can "turn tricks"
Trick ideas for that obedience class assignment: Balance a large dry dog biscuit on his nose Retrieve above biscuit (or even just hold and carry and release) "shark" -- my Bean will flip his head back and snap up at the air you sneeze and the dog runs and gets you a Kleenex (or hankie, which doesnt get as soggy) "say your prayers" (front paws on edge of chair and nose under paws) turn around in place clockwise and counter clockwise, "spin" vs "wind" or "twist" Vilma Briggs (Kistner) Mt. Gilead, OH U-UD Mocha Java Slurp, UDX, HIC, TT Ch. Brighteye Expresso Bean, UD, NDD, TT U-CDX Our Little Buddy, UD, NA, TT Thirdtym's A Charm, CGC and Ted
Seizures and anesthesia for MRI
My 6 year old male began having seizures a week ago. We have determined there is a tumor in the lung. The second oncologist we consulted with strongly suggests we have an MRI and not assume that there is a "matching" tumor in the brain. My concern is that the vet who was taking care of him in ICU for 4 days said it was too dangerous to give him anesthesia to do an MRI. Others (including the second oncologist) have said it is standard procedure to do an MRI when there are seizures. Help. If anyone has specific experience with this, I would appreciate any advice you might have. We currently have an appointment scheduled for 8am Thursday morning. Thank you, Thia Cochran So. Cal.
berner-l@prairienet.org
Hello Everyone, Berkley and I started our Intermediate Obedience Class on Monday. One of the things we will be doing in our 7 week class is teaching our dogs an extra trick on our own. This is supposed to help us start thinking like a trainer, so after the class is over we'll be able to continue training on our own. They'll of course help us out during the class with our special tricks. Then at the end of the 7 weeks at the end of our final we'll have a talent show do show off all of our new tricks/behaviors. I'm looking for ideas. Something more fun than rollover, or shake. People in the past have taught their dogs to go to their crate, fetch their slippers, and things like that. I guess my real question to the list is what are some of the more unusual/unique tricks that your Berners do? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Kelly Williamson Berkley (hey mom, I already know how to go to my crate, can't that count?) Cisco - Golden (I never learned my trick) Leesburg, VA
www.exoticdogs.com
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sick berner
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drug question - male incontinence
ORIGINAL POST From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Could anyone share their experience with using Proin 50 with their male dogs? The drug name is . . . Phenylpropanolamine HCL 50 mg. I think. What is/was your situation with your male that perhaps caused the incontinence, and did it work, and if so what did the dog weigh and what was the dosage? Thanks a ton Patt Wiegand<<< Patt, I have no experience with the drug you mentioned, but have had a small problem with male incontinence. Major was a much "leakier" puppy than our girl Maddie. While in much better control now at 18 months, I found through trial and error that Ester-C appears to cause the problem. No Ester-C, no incontinence; even a little Ester-C, and he will "lose" a little urine when overly excited. I'm not sure what you're experiencing, but I just thought I'd share this as I'd never seen anything posted about a connection with incontinence and Ester-C in dogs. I just happened to discover ths by accident when I ran out of Ester-C and he didn't have any for a couple of weeks, and had no more accidents. Perhaps there are other common supplements that have this effect? Vicky Whitney Bozeman, Montana _ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
Therapy Dogs
Well, my computer is apparently a lot more efficient about "cleaning" than I am. Having responded earlier today to someone about therapy dogs, my "sent mail" has already been filed somewhere unknown to me in cyberspace. I wanted to tell someone named Mary that the website www.nose-to-nose.com has a great list of resources to help her get started or answer questions. Plus it has some great photos of our own celebrity therapy Berner, Moritz (and his charming dad, Barry)!!! Check it out if you're interested in getting started with therapy work. Vicky Whitney Bozeman, Montana _ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus
reocurring diarrhea
Am wondering if anyone can shed some light into a problem we are having with our 9 month old bitch, Barli. Since December, she has had reocurring bouts of diarrhea. The first incidence in December was severe. She had copious amounts of diarrhea for several hours and wouldn't eat. We treated this by taking her off all food for 24 hours and then slowly introduced rice. She recovered but the diarrhea now happens every 8-9 days. It is not severe and she only has about 2 episodes within a few hours each time. We are continuing feeding her lightly after these attacks with her regular food (Eagle Pack for large puppies) and her stools return to normal only to have diarrhea return in 8-9 days. There is no blood or mucous in the stools. She acts like a normal puppy in all respects and her weight remains the same. The only behaviour difference we have noticed in the past few months is that she is always eating twigs and bark. We can't figure out if these are causing the diarrhea or if she feels some irritation and is eating them as she would grass or if she is just being playful. We have taken in stool samples and our vet cannot find any parasites. The sample was sent away for a giardia test and came back negative. We are taking her back to our vet but would really appreciate hearing from any of you who have encountered something similar or who can shed light on this. Many thanks. Marilyn Lister Chelsea, Quebec
Re: Question about overhead trolleys
- Original Message - From: "David & Joanna" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > I just wanted to know if anyone has used the heavy duty overhead trolleys > for their berner and if they worked. My husband and I set it up for our > 60lb. std. poodle and he broke it after two days. So we went to the hundred > foot heavy one. Friends of mine live in a no-fence community, near a road, so they keep their highly active standard poodle on an overhead trolley when he is outside. They have a really heavy duty one, and there is a slight dip in it, so there is a little spring to it. They also have a cord with some stretch and give to it, not a chain, so he is less likely to hurt himself if he plunges to the end of it. Eileen Morgan The Mare's Nest http://www.enter.net/~edlehman --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.445 / Virus Database: 250 - Release Date: 1/21/2003
Berner sighting (movie)
At work today, one of my co-workers called me over to her cubicle (she views the pay-per-view screeners before they go out) and she happened to be viewing a movie called "Equilibrium". She told me to watch this scene (which was aweful) the movie is set in the future after world war 3 and people take medication to not feel anything. The soldiers come across some place that has a bunch of dogs (which aren't allowed in the present time and must be destroyed). They start to destroy the dogs when one of the men (who hasn't been taking his medication of not having feelings picks up a bernese mountain dog puppy (8-9 weeks old perhaps). The dog licks the man's face. The soldier orders it to be destroyed along with the other dogs (I know, a horrible scene) but, the man who hasn't taken his medication makes the excuse that the puppy must be tested for diseases (trying to save the puppy's life and not get caught for having feels because he hasn't taken his meds). He takes the puppy away. The director obviously wanted to use the cutest puppy he could find in order to draw sympathy from the character and the audience.
Sierra West Health Day- Feb 8
Sierra West BMDC is hosting its annual Health Day on Saturday, February 8 at The Barn in Livermore. Activities will begin at 10:00am. Everyone is welcome. For all of the details and directions go to the events page at http://www.sierrawest.org We will have CERF eye screening and OFA heart screening. There will be a lecture on canine genetics and some time to work on behavior issues with some experienced trainers. We will also be holding a silent auction of some health related items. Come join us for a fun, informative day. Karen Heitkamp Mtn View, CA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: BERNER-L digest 4247
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Question about overhead trolleys
Hello, I just wanted to know if anyone has used the heavy duty overhead trolleys for their berner and if they worked. My husband and I set it up for our 60lb. std. poodle and he broke it after two days. So we went to the hundred foot heavy one. I wanted to find out if anyone has experience in putting these up and if it is supposed to be super tight or if it is supposed to have a slight dip in it. As I figured the last time we put one up we must have had it to tight or something. If you have any suggestions please let me know. Also, in case anyone was wondering we plan on fencing the yard in the spring this is just spare room for visiting dogs and to let them run more. My berner is 100lb female and the other dogs that would use it are about 50-70lbs. Thanks for your help! Mrs. Williams And the Zoo 1 rescue Berner 2std. poodles 1 cockapoo 7 cats - 3 ferrets a fish tank 2 guinea pigs and 45 show rabbits (flemish giants, dutch, and polish) - Original Message - From: "Bernese Mountain Dog Mailing List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Bernese Mountain Dog Mailing List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2003 1:01 AM Subject: BERNER-L digest 4247 > > BERNER-L Digest 4247 > > Topics covered in this issue include: > > 1) Berner L cookies?...what are they? > by Emma Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 2) a test > by Frances C Broome <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 3) RE: how to transport a large, injured dog - ? > by Rose Tierney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 4) RE: berners & small dogs > by Rose Tierney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 5) RE: Shy Berner? > by Rose Tierney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 6) Baby Steps for Stevie > by "Karen McFarlane" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 7) Prayers Needed > by [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 8) Great learning oppty in MA > by [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 9) Another BMD ad responded to > by [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 10) Stevie and BEHAF > by [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 11) FW: Stevie and BEHAF > by "Karen McFarlane" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 12) Karen and Stevie > by "nbmws6" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 13) Prelim News!!! > by Kim Morrow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 14) AKC registry question > by Jim & Mary Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 15) gonna get bigger? > by Jim & Mary Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 16) (no subject) > by Nancy Pedersen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 17) Supported Entry - CVBMDC > by "Mary Shaver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 18) Re: Shy Berner? > by [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 19) Fwd: Amy's Results Response > by [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 20) Re: BERNER-L digest 4243 > by [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 21) fwd BY MISTAKE > by [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 22) berners & small dogsthanks! > by "P & J Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 23) drug question > by [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 24) Re: AKC registry question > by "Janice Parky" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 25) Re: BERNER-L digest 4228 > by [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 26) Norwegian > by "Coral and David Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 27) puppies experience their first snow - kind of long and a bit melodramatic > by "Mark Mohapp" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >
Moving a large injured dog
One time when my very large boy couldnt get up we carried him down the stairs in the bottom of the vari-kennel. He seemed pretty comfortable in it. It has a sturdy bottom so he felt like somehting solid was under him. We just slid it into the back of the car and carried him right into the vets office with it too. We also used a blanket another time just grabbing up at the corners but he wasnt as confident with that. Cheryl TRapani
Natural Berners
Thanks L'ers, I have the Natural Berners site now. Maria Crifasi Catoctin Mountains, Maryland
Bernerbones
Would anyone know what happened to Bernerbones. someone said it was now called NaturalBerners but when I entered that name, I got a "no match." I would like the website if anyone has the url. Thanks in advance! Maria Crifasi Catoctin Mountains, Maryland
Re: gonna get bigger? - size vs longevity
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Darwin, anyone?? Intuitively this would make > sense, as smaller and more moderate sized breeds in general tend to live > longer. Living longer doesn't always fit with the Darwinian model. The goal in Darwin's terms is to produce as many offspring as possible. That's what makes you survive, not the longest life. Don't know how this fits with big boned Bernese, but hey, I was trained as an Anthropologist! Its just plain interesting. :-) Marjie
Sleeping Giant Update(Stevie)
Dear List, Stevie continues to progress, slowly, but I see a difference in his appetite today. The steroidal factor, I am sure, will soon kick in when his strength increases and we will have to be careful with his weight. He is less shaky getting to his feet but still pretty staggery, I do not want him to fall reinjuring himself in any way so he is never any further than at arm's reach from us. This morning, it is a bright sunny but cold day and when we got him outside, and after his pee, he just wanted to lay in the snow. We hadn't allowed him to do this until now, so there he was, in the snow with his sling on and his tail slowly WAGGING!! Meanwhile, my sis and I are freezing. Oh well, all for the sake of progress. We had many suggestions to accommodate him through the day so that I could still get around the house without him becoming anxious. A neighbour of ours brought a mechanics trolley with locking wheels that he had covered with carpet for Stevie. So we can lay him on that when he is tired and roll him into whatever room we are going to be in. Right now he is on it by my side while I am at the computer. I think that he kind of likes the ride!! H still sleeps a great deal, about 22 out of 24 hours!! When he is awake, he just sort of watches me. It is almost like he is waiting for something!! Thank you to all for your continued support and kind words, they really mean alot to us. I have only been able to reply back to a few, (my sis is trying to sort through some of the notes for me on a priority basis) but I want you to know that we appreciate each and every note, prayer and good wishes sent our way. I really don't know how I can ever repay the kindnesses shown to us. Love to you All Karen and her "Sleeping Giant" Stevie xoxo --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.443 / Virus Database: 248 - Release Date: 10/01/2003
Re: gonna get bigger? - size vs longevity
In a message dated 1/29/2003 7:56:05 AM Eastern Standard Time, Brnrmom writes: > I would be very interested to know if the lighter boned Berners are actually > the longer lived ones. Is that why the dogs seem to "want" to stay smaller?? > Darwin, anyone?? Intuitively this would make sense, as smaller and more > moderate sized breeds in general tend to live longer. So I wonder if the > smaller, lighter boned dogs in a very short lived breed (like Berners) would > live the longest, as a whole (not a few individual dogs here and there.) > Wonder if this data can be accessed from Berner Garde or any other source? Interesting idea Vilma...but my intuition goes in a different direction . First because Darwin's premise depends on *natural selection*. There is nothing *natural* about the selection process in purebred dogs. Even in the earliest days of a breed, prior to naming or writing a standard for evaluation... the needs of men, movement of men, and geography of a region, determined the shape and temperament of the foundation stock from which the formalized breed would come. I think the tendancy toward the lighter built dog (and the oft found 'houndy head', 'snipey muzzle', curly coat, and gay tail, as well) goes back to the very beginnings of our breedthe specific dogs that made up the first Durbachler/Berner Sennenhund gene pool. In my version of genetics (totally inexpert!), genes don't really go away much...they mostly keep recombining with the genes for some characteristics becoming more prevalent and others less common, based on selection pressures over time. All of the 'undesireable' traits above are clearly evident in the foundation stock for our breed, dating to the early part of the 20th century. (http://www-nmbe.unibe.ch/abtwt/bmd_histpics.html) The breed was developing for roughly 50 years before the introduction of Newfoundland genes in 1948. One dog...Alex v. Angstorf born in 1952... the great grandson of the Newf (12.5% newf genes), would become the archetype for the modern Bernese and the lynch pin around which many generations of Bernese would be bred. My sense is that there was probably a sizeable narrowing of the gene pool (markedly increased coefficient of inbreeding) in the wake of Alex and that many (possibly most) of both the desireable and the undesireable traits we're working with now were funneled through him. Much as he was a striking, heavily built, dog... keep in mind that 87.5% of his genetic package came from those early Durrbachlers. So... I don't think we tend to drift towards the lightly built dog because it's a 'naturally' longer lived dog. I think it's just a very large part of our genetic heritage and there's no reason to think it wouldn't be expressed. -Sherri V. P.S.- I don't know how one could possibly garner accurate data to arrive at a more scientific answer. Big boned, substance, etc are all very subject terms that have never been quantified for data collection purposes. Weight doesn't tell you much because there's no way of knowing how much of that was fat, muscle, or bone. Height doesn't at all correlate with bone and substance so can't use that as a 'marker' either.
Re: food aggression question
I have four dogs, and I separate them with gates, crates, and doors when they have a high value item like a bone or stuffed Kong and also for meals. I don't want or need a serious dog fight over something really special to one if the dogs. I make sure that I can take food and treats out of their mouths at any time, and then I just separate them if I am going to give them something so high value. I have a Newfoundland, a Berner, and two Great Pyrs; my Berner and one of my Pyrs are both quite dominant and a little possessive. I second getting the Jean Donaldson book (and also recommend her earlier book, The Culture Clash). You want to be very certain as you socialize your Berner than you remain on top and she wants to please you. It would be a pretty rude awakening to discover that she had developed maturity and dominance to the point where she would go after a guest or family member to guard her treasures. Don't let things escape you and get to that point! Eileen Morgan The Mare's Nest http://www.enter.net/~edlehman --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.445 / Virus Database: 250 - Release Date: 1/21/2003
Re: HELP! HELP! HELP!
1) Call your vet. Describe what is going on--you might have a blockage started, you might be having the beginnings of a problem with poisonous plants. 2) NEVER feed a dog which is having serious diarrhea. If my dogs get into something which gives them very loose stools, I fast them for 24 hours and then start back with small amounts of white rice, then white rice mixed with boiled and drained hamburger, then slowly add in the kibble and take out the rice/meat until they are back to normal. Eileen Morgan The Mare's Nest http://www.enter.net/~edlehman --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.445 / Virus Database: 250 - Release Date: 1/21/2003
PLEASE TAKE ME OFF OF THE EMAIL LIST
I would like our email to be taken off the list- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank you! ---Original Message--- From: Bernese Mountain Dog Mailing List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: 01/29/03 01:01 AM To: Bernese Mountain Dog Mailing List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: BERNER-L digest 4247 > > BERNER-L Digest 4247 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Berner L cookies?...what are they? by Emma Goodall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 2) a test by Frances C Broome <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 3) RE: how to transport a large, injured dog - ? by Rose Tierney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 4) RE: berners & small dogs by Rose Tierney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 5) RE: Shy Berner? by Rose Tierney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 6) Baby Steps for Stevie by "Karen McFarlane" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 7) Prayers Needed by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 8) Great learning oppty in MA by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9) Another BMD ad responded to by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10) Stevie and BEHAF by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11) FW: Stevie and BEHAF by "Karen McFarlane" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 12) Karen and Stevie by "nbmws6" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 13) Prelim News!!! by Kim Morrow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 14) AKC registry question by Jim & Mary Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 15) gonna get bigger? by Jim & Mary Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 16) (no subject) by Nancy Pedersen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 17) Supported Entry - CVBMDC by "Mary Shaver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 18) Re: Shy Berner? by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 19) Fwd: Amy's Results Response by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 20) Re: BERNER-L digest 4243 by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 21) fwd BY MISTAKE by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 22) berners & small dogsthanks! by "P & J Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 23) drug question by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24) Re: AKC registry question by "Janice Parky" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 25) Re: BERNER-L digest 4228 by [EMAIL PROTECTED] 26) Norwegian by "Coral and David Denis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 27) puppies experience their first snow - kind of long and a bit melodramatic by "Mark Mohapp" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >
nj, pa, excellent boarding facilities
we are looking for an excellent backup boarding facility within two hours of our home. we are near wilkes barre and scranton, pa. does anyone know of one? thanks andrea, woofit and chi shavertown, pa http://www.brin.org/Woofit_and_Chi/
Re: gonna get bigger? - size vs longevity
Sherri raises a very interesting point, mentioing that being a heavy boned, deep chested dog w/ a lot of substance seems to be a recessive trait, and even dogs w/ these characteristics often produce many lighter boned dogs. "Regression to the mean" is what this was called in genetics class. I bet Darwin would have an explanation for this. (As much as we fight him!) Personally I love the look of these dogs, despite their handicap in the performance events, but I would be very interested to know if the lighter boned Berners are actually the longer lived ones. Is that why the dogs seem to "want" to stay smaller?? Darwin, anyone?? Intuitively this would make sense, as smaller and more moderate sized breeds in general tend to live longer. So I wonder if the smaller, lighter boned dogs in a very short lived breed (like Berners) would live the longest, as a whole (not a few individual dogs here and there.) Wonder if this data can be accessed from Berner Garde or any other source? Vilma Briggs (Kistner) Mt. Gilead, OH U-UD Mocha Java Slurp, UDX, HIC, TT Ch. Brighteye Expresso Bean, UD, NDD, TT U-CDX Our Little Buddy, UD, NA, TT Thirdtym's A Charm, CGC and Ted
Re: gonna get bigger?
In a message dated 1/28/2003 5:45:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > I'm wondering, when does the Bernese stop growing, and when they do stop > getting taller, etc, I think they usually have most of their full height by the time they're a year old. > do they then "fill out" Yes...through the teens to full maturity (2-3 years, sometimes longer) you'll notice slow changes. The ribs will 'spring', the back will broaden, the head will broaden, and the chest will drop. > and get that nice husky, big hunk of dog look? > Or does that depend on the genes? It does depend on the genes. > Most Bernese I've seen are the big full-chested, thick legged etc. That's a function of maturity and the dogs you've seen. If most of the Berners you've seen are carefully selected breeding dogs, the odds are they're more burly than average. In my experience, bone, chest, and substance seem to be pretty recessive in that even dogs who excel in those characteristics often produce lighter built offspring...with a few exceptional puppies in the mix. If the breeders behind your Berner have focused heavily on bone and substance for many generations, the odds increase that the puppies they produce will be heavily built. But...if you were to select breeding stock solely on those attributes, what do you think would happen to hips, elbows, health, longevity, and temperament? > My dog seems like she's kind of on the lanky side, > and not that filled out. (13 months old). She's a teenagerand just like a 13 y.o. girl...she's just beginning to develop her mature body. You won't know the finished product for another year or two. -Sherri Venditti
Re: HELP! HELP! HELP!
If he ate river stones and is having diarrhea, he may have a partial blockage. Whether he can pass the stones or not remains to be seen and I would consult with a vet as a complete blockage could occur at any time and result in emergency surgery. Better IMO to do surgery prior to a complete block while Cooper is still in good condition if that is what your vet recommends than to wait til the bowel is total blocked and compromised. Susan Ablon Gweebarra BMD Balch Springs, Tx http://www.pageweb.com/gwebara On Wed, 29 Jan 2003 10:54:04 +0100 Lindsay Cox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Hi everyone! I need HELP!!! > First of all, I have to thank everyone that commented on the > website! It > made our day! I promise to keep updating it so that we can all > share in the > unbelievably amazing growth of Cooper! > Secondly, but by far, first priority > This is really kind of gross but I need your help. Cooper ate LOTS > of moss > from one of artificial trees this past Sunday (the remaining moss > was > discarded and replaced with lovely BIG inedible river stones!) > Well, this morning, you would have thought a land mine filled with > you-know-what had exploded all over the house (thank GOD for wood > floors and > Swifer Wets!) > The problem is that he has massive, explosive diarrhea. My bet is > that the > plant moss is stuck and/or working its way out. Other than having > to go out > about every 30 minutes, he acts completely normal. I fed him his > breakfast > this morning and made sure that he had LOTS of water. Is there > anything > else I can do to speed up the process or do I have to just wait it > out (HA! > Literally!) > Any advice would GREATLY appreciated. > Lindsay and not "Super Cooper", but POOPER Cooper! > > >
Re: AKC registry question
In a message dated 1/28/2003 10:43:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > So, register Nola and go for it!! Thanks Janice for writing all the stuff I was going to! PLEASE, do register your Berner puppy. You might think of it in terms of *why* you chose to buy a purebred. You paid all that money so that you'd have a good idea of what you would get, right? That benefit comes from pedigrees which are maintained in a *registry* so whether you plan to breed or show or not, it's important that your BMD be IN the registry. And, once your pup is registered...enter her in the Berner Garde database (http://www.bernergarde.org/) and update the record throughout her lifetime. For $15 and a couple of minutes to fill out the paperwork, there's no question in my mind... ALL BMDs eligible for registeration with the AKC should be. It's a part of our future. -Sherri Venditti
Re: food aggression question
I gotta runto work, so will reply in more detail soon, but the first thing you need to do is order the book "Mine! A Guide to Rescource Guarding in Dogs" by Jean Donaldson PhD. It describes your dog to a T (and my foster-turned-permanant rescue Berner, Charm) and has an excellent desensitization (gradual counter conditioning) program that you will want to start working on ASAP. It is a positively based training program that does not use aversive methods (which could potentially worsen the aggression.) This is an inexpensive little easy to read paperback book, available from www.dogwise.com. Vilma Briggs (Kistner) Mt. Gilead, OH U-UD Mocha Java Slurp, UDX, HIC, TT Ch. Brighteye Expresso Bean, UD, NDD, TT U-CDX Our Little Buddy, UD, NA, TT Thirdtym's A Charm, CGC and Ted
HELP! HELP! HELP!
Hi everyone! I need HELP!!! First of all, I have to thank everyone that commented on the website! It made our day! I promise to keep updating it so that we can all share in the unbelievably amazing growth of Cooper! Secondly, but by far, first priority This is really kind of gross but I need your help. Cooper ate LOTS of moss from one of artificial trees this past Sunday (the remaining moss was discarded and replaced with lovely BIG inedible river stones!) Well, this morning, you would have thought a land mine filled with you-know-what had exploded all over the house (thank GOD for wood floors and Swifer Wets!) The problem is that he has massive, explosive diarrhea. My bet is that the plant moss is stuck and/or working its way out. Other than having to go out about every 30 minutes, he acts completely normal. I fed him his breakfast this morning and made sure that he had LOTS of water. Is there anything else I can do to speed up the process or do I have to just wait it out (HA! Literally!) Any advice would GREATLY appreciated. Lindsay and not "Super Cooper", but POOPER Cooper!
