RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
Whats a real arse is the fact you have to sign-in today anything but as soon as you do, you are presented with a load of survey bollox and not the page you actually requested. -Original Message- From: Willy Ray [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 07 March 2003 15:14 To: CF-Talk Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning about technology. That's what makes everyone a better programmer. That's why people take courses, for example. My underlying issue is that Macromedia is very fickle. I can't tell you where they are going to be in a year. Which mean I don't know where I, a MM developer will be in a year either. Well, I don't think anyone can realistically argue the new site hasn't been fully sign-posted. Anyone who is surprised by our RIA deployment has, frankly, been living under a stone :) And it is purely evolution. It's CF on the back end, several of the apps are pure CF. Nothing shocking there. We have just four RIAs on the new site - there are five pure CF applications. People have been using Flash UIs on CF apps for quite some time, certainly prior to the MX launches. Macromedia has been roundly criticized for not using our own technology and for being a few releases behind the leading edge. Now we're up to date. You can't really criticize us for pushing the envelope... Sean A Corfield -- Director, Architecture Web Technology Group -- Macromedia, Inc. tel: (415) 252-2287 -- cell: (415) 717-8473 aim/iChat: seancorfield -- http://www.macromedia.com An Architect's View -- http://www.macromedia.com/go/arch_blog Announcing Macromedia DevNet Subscriptions Maximize your power with our new premium software subscription Find out more: http://www.macromedia.com/go/devnetsubs ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq This list and all House of Fusion resources hosted by CFHosting.com. The place for dependable ColdFusion Hosting. Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
Its amusing how they blame it on the evil browser though ;) I love html and i actually hate alot of things about flash. I hate you cant right click and view page location, do save as, set as background. If they could get all that into flash then i'll be fine with the passing of html until then get that pretty crap outta here. - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:14 AM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning about technology. That's what makes everyone a better programmer. That's why people take courses, for example. My underlying issue is that Macromedia is very fickle. I can't tell you where they are going to be in a year. Which mean I don't know where I, a MM developer will be in a year either. Well, I don't think anyone can realistically argue the new site hasn't been fully sign-posted. Anyone who is surprised by our RIA deployment has, frankly, been living under a stone :) And it is purely evolution. It's CF on the back end, several of the apps are pure CF. Nothing shocking there. We have just four RIAs on the new site - there are five pure CF applications. People have been using Flash UIs on CF apps for quite some time, certainly prior to the MX launches. Macromedia has been roundly criticized for not using our own technology and for being a few releases behind the leading edge. Now we're up to date. You can't really criticize us for pushing the envelope... Sean A Corfield -- Director, Architecture Web Technology Group -- Macromedia, Inc. tel: (415) 252-2287 -- cell: (415) 717-8473 aim/iChat: seancorfield -- http://www.macromedia.com An Architect's View -- http://www.macromedia.com/go/arch_blog Announcing Macromedia DevNet Subscriptions Maximize your power with our new premium software subscription Find out more: http://www.macromedia.com/go/devnetsubs ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Get the mailserver that powers this list at http://www.coolfusion.com Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning about technology. That's what makes everyone a better programmer. That's why people take courses, for example. My underlying issue is that Macromedia is very fickle. I can't tell you where they are going to be in a year. Which mean I don't know where I, a MM developer will be in a year either. Well, I don't think anyone can realistically argue the new site hasn't been fully sign-posted. Anyone who is surprised by our RIA deployment has, frankly, been living under a stone :) And it is purely evolution. It's CF on the back end, several of the apps are pure CF. Nothing shocking there. We have just four RIAs on the new site - there are five pure CF applications. People have been using Flash UIs on CF apps for quite some time, certainly prior to the MX launches. Macromedia has been roundly criticized for not using our own technology and for being a few releases behind the leading edge. Now we're up to date. You can't really criticize us for pushing the envelope... Sean A Corfield -- Director, Architecture Web Technology Group -- Macromedia, Inc. tel: (415) 252-2287 -- cell: (415) 717-8473 aim/iChat: seancorfield -- http://www.macromedia.com An Architect's View -- http://www.macromedia.com/go/arch_blog Announcing Macromedia DevNet Subscriptions Maximize your power with our new premium software subscription Find out more: http://www.macromedia.com/go/devnetsubs ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq This list and all House of Fusion resources hosted by CFHosting.com. The place for dependable ColdFusion Hosting. Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
I was reading Dave Watts post about HTML sucking earlier and i am really curious dave why do you think it sucks. Sure it has a few weak points but all the nice pretty flash is just pretty and its really a pain in the ass how they implemented it on macromedia. I use the site everyday i dont need pretty i need it to work and html does that nicely. Of course html is annoying because its stateless yadda yadda. - Original Message - From: Stephen Moretti [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:40 AM Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning about technology. That's what makes everyone a better programmer. That's why people take courses, for example. My underlying issue is that Macromedia is very fickle. I can't tell you where they are going to be in a year. Which mean I don't know where I, a MM developer will be in a year either. Well, I don't think anyone can realistically argue the new site hasn't been fully sign-posted. Anyone who is surprised by our RIA deployment has, frankly, been living under a stone :) And it is purely evolution. It's CF on the back end, several of the apps are pure CF. Nothing shocking there. We have just four RIAs on the new site - there are five pure CF applications. People have been using Flash UIs on CF apps for quite some time, certainly prior to the MX launches. Macromedia has been roundly criticized for not using our own technology and for being a few releases behind the leading edge. Now we're up to date. You can't really criticize us for pushing the envelope... Sean A Corfield -- Director, Architecture Web Technology Group -- Macromedia, Inc. tel: (415) 252-2287 -- cell: (415) 717-8473 aim/iChat: seancorfield -- http://www.macromedia.com An Architect's View -- http://www.macromedia.com/go/arch_blog Announcing Macromedia DevNet Subscriptions Maximize your power with our new premium software subscription Find out more: http://www.macromedia.com/go/devnetsubs ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Your ad could be here. Monies from ads go to support these lists and provide more resources for the community. http://www.fusionauthority.com/ads.cfm Unsubscribe: http
RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/internet/03/07/macromedia.warns/index.html just to throw a little bit of flame on the fire :) ...tony Tony Weeg Senior Web Developer UnCertified Advanced ColdFusion Developer Information System Design Navtrak, Inc. Mobile workforce monitoring, mapping reporting www.navtrak.net 410.548.2337 -Original Message- From: Stephen Moretti [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:40 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning about technology. That's what makes everyone a better programmer. That's why people take courses, for example. My underlying issue is that Macromedia is very fickle. I can't tell you where they are going to be in a year. Which mean I don't know where I, a MM developer will be in a year either. Well, I don't think anyone can realistically argue the new site hasn't been fully sign-posted. Anyone who is surprised by our RIA deployment has, frankly, been living under a stone :) And it is purely evolution. It's CF on the back end, several of the apps are pure CF. Nothing shocking there. We have just four RIAs on the new site - there are five pure CF applications. People have been using Flash UIs on CF apps for quite some time, certainly prior to the MX launches. Macromedia has been roundly criticized for not using our own technology and for being a few releases behind the leading edge. Now we're up to date. You can't really criticize us for pushing the envelope... Sean A Corfield -- Director, Architecture Web Technology Group -- Macromedia, Inc. tel: (415) 252-2287 -- cell: (415) 717-8473 aim/iChat: seancorfield -- http://www.macromedia.com An Architect's View -- http://www.macromedia.com/go/arch_blog Announcing Macromedia DevNet Subscriptions Maximize your power with our new premium software subscription Find out more: http://www.macromedia.com/go/devnetsubs ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Signup for the Fusion Authority news alert and keep up with the latest news in ColdFusion and related topics. http://www.fusionauthority.com/signup.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
HTML hardly has any controls, compared to c/s environments such as VC++, VB, or Java. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bill Wheatley) Date: Friday, March 7, 2003 9:26 am Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website I was reading Dave Watts post about HTML sucking earlier and i am reallycurious dave why do you think it sucks. Sure it has a few weak points but all the nice pretty flash is just pretty and its really a pain in the ass how they implemented it on macromedia. I use the site everyday i dont need pretty i need it to work and html does that nicely. Of course html is annoying because its stateless yadda yadda. - Original Message - From: Stephen Moretti [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:40 AM Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning about technology. That's what makes everyone a better programmer. That's why people take courses, for example. My underlying issue is that Macromedia is very fickle. I can't tell you where they are going to be in a year. Which mean I don't know where I, a MM developer will be in a year either. Well, I don't think anyone can realistically argue the new site hasn't been fully sign-posted. Anyone who is surprised by our RIA deployment has, frankly, been living under a stone :) And it is purely evolution. It's CF on the back end, several of the apps are pure CF. Nothing shocking there. We have just four RIAs on the new site - there are five pure CF applications. People have been using Flash UIs on CF apps for quite some time, certainly prior to the MX launches. Macromedia has been roundly criticized for not using our own technology and for being a few releases behind the leading edge. Now we're up to date. You can't really criticize us for pushing the envelope... Sean A Corfield -- Director, Architecture Web Technology Group -- Macromedia, Inc. tel: (415) 252-2287 -- cell: (415) 717-8473 aim/iChat: seancorfield -- http://www.macromedia.com An Architect's View -- http://www.macromedia.com/go/arch_blog Announcing Macromedia DevNet Subscriptions Maximize your power with our new premium software subscription Find out more: http://www.macromedia.com/go/devnetsubs
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
http://www.macromedia.com/security That news is a week old... ;o) Sign up for the security bulletins Tony :oD Stephen (going home before Tony lynches him...) === CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Tony Weeg [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:29 PM Subject: RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/internet/03/07/macromedia.warns/index.html just to throw a little bit of flame on the fire :) ...tony Tony Weeg Senior Web Developer UnCertified Advanced ColdFusion Developer Information System Design Navtrak, Inc. Mobile workforce monitoring, mapping reporting www.navtrak.net 410.548.2337 -Original Message- From: Stephen Moretti [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:40 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning about technology. That's what makes everyone a better programmer. That's why people take courses, for example. My underlying issue is that Macromedia is very fickle. I can't tell you where they are going to be in a year. Which mean I don't know where I, a MM developer will be in a year either. Well, I don't think anyone can realistically argue the new site hasn't been fully sign-posted. Anyone who is surprised by our RIA deployment has, frankly, been living under a stone :) And it is purely evolution. It's CF on the back end, several of the apps are pure CF. Nothing shocking there. We have just four RIAs on the new site - there are five pure CF applications. People have been using Flash UIs on CF apps for quite some time, certainly prior to the MX launches. Macromedia has been roundly criticized for not using our own technology and for being a few releases behind the leading edge. Now we're up to date. You can't really criticize us for pushing the envelope... Sean A Corfield -- Director, Architecture Web Technology Group -- Macromedia, Inc. tel: (415) 252-2287 -- cell: (415) 717-8473 aim/iChat: seancorfield -- http://www.macromedia.com An Architect's View -- http://www.macromedia.com/go/arch_blog Announcing Macromedia DevNet Subscriptions Maximize your power with our new
RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
:) no lynching here mang. I just happened to see it on cnn.com this morning, and thought id pass it along!! that's allsec. bulletins? where? ...tony Tony Weeg Senior Web Developer UnCertified Advanced ColdFusion Developer Information System Design Navtrak, Inc. Mobile workforce monitoring, mapping reporting www.navtrak.net 410.548.2337 -Original Message- From: Stephen Moretti [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 11:54 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website http://www.macromedia.com/security That news is a week old... ;o) Sign up for the security bulletins Tony :oD Stephen (going home before Tony lynches him...) === CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Tony Weeg [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:29 PM Subject: RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/internet/03/07/macromedia.warns/index.html just to throw a little bit of flame on the fire :) ...tony Tony Weeg Senior Web Developer UnCertified Advanced ColdFusion Developer Information System Design Navtrak, Inc. Mobile workforce monitoring, mapping reporting www.navtrak.net 410.548.2337 -Original Message- From: Stephen Moretti [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:40 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning about technology. That's what makes everyone a better programmer. That's why people take courses, for example. My underlying issue is that Macromedia is very fickle. I can't tell you where they are going to be in a year. Which mean I don't know where I, a MM developer will be in a year either. Well, I don't think anyone can realistically argue the new site hasn't been fully sign-posted. Anyone who is surprised by our RIA deployment has, frankly, been living under a stone :) And it is purely evolution. It's CF on the back end, several of the apps are pure CF. Nothing shocking there. We have just four RIAs on the new site - there are five pure CF applications. People have been using Flash UIs on CF apps for quite some time, certainly prior to the MX launches
RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
Yes, but the controls that HTML has all adhere to the interface standards of the host OS. This is in contrast to Flash widgets that look and feel differently not only within Flash in general, but in just about every Flash UI environment you go to. And the scrollwheel not working is just another example of how Flash RIA's are going to confuse and frustrate the users because they don't behave right. I love the Flash RIA concept. I intend to use it in some situations. But I feel that it has a long, long way to go before it meets the useability needs of a general audience. It's almost like there needs to be a way to call OS controls within Flash, but then we're sort of getting into Java RIA territory. -Kevin -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:43 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website HTML hardly has any controls, compared to c/s environments such as VC++, VB, or Java. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bill Wheatley) Date: Friday, March 7, 2003 9:26 am Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website I was reading Dave Watts post about HTML sucking earlier and i am reallycurious dave why do you think it sucks. Sure it has a few weak points but all the nice pretty flash is just pretty and its really a pain in the ass how they implemented it on macromedia. I use the site everyday i dont need pretty i need it to work and html does that nicely. Of course html is annoying because its stateless yadda yadda. - Original Message - From: Stephen Moretti [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:40 AM Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning about technology. That's what makes everyone a better programmer. That's why people take courses, for example. My underlying issue is that Macromedia is very fickle. I can't tell you where they are going to be in a year. Which mean I don't know where I, a MM developer will be in a year either. Well, I don't think anyone can realistically argue the new site hasn't been fully sign-posted. Anyone who is surprised by our RIA deployment has, frankly, been living under a stone :) And it is purely
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
haha its probably just a trick to get people to get the latest player so they can view the new MM site :) j/k - Original Message - From: Tony Weeg [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 11:29 AM Subject: RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/internet/03/07/macromedia.warns/index.html just to throw a little bit of flame on the fire :) ...tony Tony Weeg Senior Web Developer UnCertified Advanced ColdFusion Developer Information System Design Navtrak, Inc. Mobile workforce monitoring, mapping reporting www.navtrak.net 410.548.2337 -Original Message- From: Stephen Moretti [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:40 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning about technology. That's what makes everyone a better programmer. That's why people take courses, for example. My underlying issue is that Macromedia is very fickle. I can't tell you where they are going to be in a year. Which mean I don't know where I, a MM developer will be in a year either. Well, I don't think anyone can realistically argue the new site hasn't been fully sign-posted. Anyone who is surprised by our RIA deployment has, frankly, been living under a stone :) And it is purely evolution. It's CF on the back end, several of the apps are pure CF. Nothing shocking there. We have just four RIAs on the new site - there are five pure CF applications. People have been using Flash UIs on CF apps for quite some time, certainly prior to the MX launches. Macromedia has been roundly criticized for not using our own technology and for being a few releases behind the leading edge. Now we're up to date. You can't really criticize us for pushing the envelope... Sean A Corfield -- Director, Architecture Web Technology Group -- Macromedia, Inc. tel: (415) 252-2287 -- cell: (415) 717-8473 aim/iChat: seancorfield -- http://www.macromedia.com An Architect's View -- http://www.macromedia.com/go/arch_blog Announcing Macromedia DevNet Subscriptions Maximize your power with our new premium software subscription Find out more: http://www.macromedia.com/go/devnetsubs ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Get
Re: RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
I don't believe that just because Flash has a more customizable interface design means HTML controls are better. Fact is, HTML controls are still very extremely limited, no matter what Flash has. - Original Message - From: Kevin Graeme [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, March 7, 2003 10:24 am Subject: RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Yes, but the controls that HTML has all adhere to the interface standards of the host OS. This is in contrast to Flash widgets that look and feel differently not only within Flash in general, but in just about every Flash UI environment you go to. And the scrollwheel not working is just anotherexample of how Flash RIA's are going to confuse and frustrate the users because they don't behave right. I love the Flash RIA concept. I intend to use it in some situations. But I feel that it has a long, long way to go before it meets the useability needs of a general audience. It's almost like there needs to be a way to call OS controls within Flash, but then we're sort of getting into Java RIA territory. -Kevin -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:43 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website HTML hardly has any controls, compared to c/s environments such as VC++, VB, or Java. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bill Wheatley) Date: Friday, March 7, 2003 9:26 am Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website I was reading Dave Watts post about HTML sucking earlier and i am reallycurious dave why do you think it sucks. Sure it has a few weak points but all the nice pretty flash is just pretty and its really a pain in the ass how they implemented it on macromedia. I use the site everyday i dont need pretty i need it to work and html does that nicely. Of course html is annoying because its stateless yadda yadda. - Original Message - From: Stephen Moretti [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:40 AM Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
Yes if you could copy and paste from within flash, open links in new windows and do everything you could with HTML in standard i would be happy with flash. it is extremly annoying and i would hope flash EVENTUALLY lets you do the same type things you can with html if it is the thing MM wants to become the standard it has to allow to do the things people have been doing for 10 years. - Original Message - From: Kevin Graeme [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:24 PM Subject: RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Yes, but the controls that HTML has all adhere to the interface standards of the host OS. This is in contrast to Flash widgets that look and feel differently not only within Flash in general, but in just about every Flash UI environment you go to. And the scrollwheel not working is just another example of how Flash RIA's are going to confuse and frustrate the users because they don't behave right. I love the Flash RIA concept. I intend to use it in some situations. But I feel that it has a long, long way to go before it meets the useability needs of a general audience. It's almost like there needs to be a way to call OS controls within Flash, but then we're sort of getting into Java RIA territory. -Kevin -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:43 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website HTML hardly has any controls, compared to c/s environments such as VC++, VB, or Java. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bill Wheatley) Date: Friday, March 7, 2003 9:26 am Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website I was reading Dave Watts post about HTML sucking earlier and i am reallycurious dave why do you think it sucks. Sure it has a few weak points but all the nice pretty flash is just pretty and its really a pain in the ass how they implemented it on macromedia. I use the site everyday i dont need pretty i need it to work and html does that nicely. Of course html is annoying because its stateless yadda yadda. - Original Message - From: Stephen Moretti [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:40 AM Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
I think the key here Kevein is for us as developers to develop UIs that are better than what is currently available with HTML without confusing users. Yes there will be some confusion, but if done right a new UI can be more intuitive than what users are used tothis is the benefit of RIAs. Granted there will be resistance to changethat's a fact of life...but we have to start somewhere. There will also be developers that create useless confusing peices of ;-) As with any new technology...it gets better over time or washes out Bryan Stevenson B.Comm. VP Director of E-Commerce Development Electric Edge Systems Group Inc. t. 250.920.8830 e. [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Macromedia Associate Partner www.macromedia.com - Vancouver Island ColdFusion Users Group Founder Director www.cfug-vancouverisland.com - Original Message - From: Kevin Graeme [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 9:24 AM Subject: RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Yes, but the controls that HTML has all adhere to the interface standards of the host OS. This is in contrast to Flash widgets that look and feel differently not only within Flash in general, but in just about every Flash UI environment you go to. And the scrollwheel not working is just another example of how Flash RIA's are going to confuse and frustrate the users because they don't behave right. I love the Flash RIA concept. I intend to use it in some situations. But I feel that it has a long, long way to go before it meets the useability needs of a general audience. It's almost like there needs to be a way to call OS controls within Flash, but then we're sort of getting into Java RIA territory. -Kevin -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:43 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website HTML hardly has any controls, compared to c/s environments such as VC++, VB, or Java. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bill Wheatley) Date: Friday, March 7, 2003 9:26 am Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website I was reading Dave Watts post about HTML sucking earlier and i am reallycurious dave why do you think it sucks. Sure it has a few weak points but all the nice pretty flash is just pretty and its really a pain in the ass how they implemented it on macromedia. I use the site everyday i dont need pretty i need it to work and html does that nicely. Of course html is annoying because its stateless yadda yadda. - Original Message - From: Stephen Moretti [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:40 AM Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
www.macromedia.com/security/ - Original Message - From: Tony Weeg [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:35 PM Subject: RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website :) no lynching here mang. I just happened to see it on cnn.com this morning, and thought id pass it along!! that's allsec. bulletins? where? ...tony Tony Weeg Senior Web Developer UnCertified Advanced ColdFusion Developer Information System Design Navtrak, Inc. Mobile workforce monitoring, mapping reporting www.navtrak.net 410.548.2337 -Original Message- From: Stephen Moretti [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 11:54 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website http://www.macromedia.com/security That news is a week old... ;o) Sign up for the security bulletins Tony :oD Stephen (going home before Tony lynches him...) === CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Tony Weeg [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:29 PM Subject: RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website http://www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/internet/03/07/macromedia.warns/index.html just to throw a little bit of flame on the fire :) ...tony Tony Weeg Senior Web Developer UnCertified Advanced ColdFusion Developer Information System Design Navtrak, Inc. Mobile workforce monitoring, mapping reporting www.navtrak.net 410.548.2337 -Original Message- From: Stephen Moretti [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:40 AM To: CF-Talk Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Thought this link might be of interest to you all. http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm Its an article on Mike Chamber's blog, by Tony Lopez, Executive Producer of Macromedia. Please note the links to the survey and feedback pages at the bottom of the article. These are the appropriate places to make a response. Regards Stephen == CF-Europe http://www.cf-europe.org/ Olymia Conference Centre, London 29-30 May 2003 Keynote by Ben Forta and Tim Buntel Discount tickets before March 14th 2003 - Original Message - From: Willy Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:14 PM Subject: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? Willy [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 05:18AM Ahh good I am quite happy now that it was finally fixed so I can see the site. That song on the front page is nice for all of 2 seconds and then it burns into your skull lol. But looks like its not quite as laggy as it was in ie other 2 days. Kudos MM for at least letting those people who like a good browser :) (Opera) to use your site. - Original Message - From: Sean A Corfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:31 AM Subject: Re: The New Macromedia Website On Thursday, Mar 6, 2003, at 14:08 US/Pacific, Adrocknaphobia Jones wrote: For the last few years I've been telling upper management that I can cut costs, raise quality, and employ less developers. Cold Fusion is the solution for us. Am I supposed to go to them and say, I need 3 times the budget per project and quadruple my department size I'm not sure why you think you need to do this? No one is forcing you to abandon CF nor forcing you to use Flash - you can continue to sell your CF is cheap position and continue building great sites, quickly. CF is great for that. But last month I noticed a large part of this community actively learning .NET. I'd hope large parts of this community would be constantly learning about technology. That's what makes everyone a better programmer. That's why people take courses, for example. My underlying issue is that Macromedia is very fickle. I can't tell you where they are going to be in a year. Which mean I don't know where I, a MM developer will be in a year either. Well, I don't think anyone can realistically argue the new site hasn't been fully sign-posted. Anyone who is surprised by our RIA deployment has, frankly, been living under a stone :) And it is purely evolution. It's CF on the back end, several of the apps are pure CF
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
When you talk about save as, and save as background, are you talking about the entire flash movie, or elements within the movie? In regards to the browser: http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm mike chambers [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Bill Wheatley [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:33 AM Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Its amusing how they blame it on the evil browser though ;) I love html and i actually hate alot of things about flash. I hate you cant right click and view page location, do save as, set as background. If they could get all that into flash then i'll be fine with the passing of html until then get that pretty crap outta here. ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Get the mailserver that powers this list at http://www.coolfusion.com Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
Open IE and right click on a link and you have save as. And then you can also copy and paste text from the screen. Stuff like that. You can take pictures and set them as your background for your display - Original Message - From: Mike Chambers [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 2:06 PM Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website When you talk about save as, and save as background, are you talking about the entire flash movie, or elements within the movie? In regards to the browser: http://www.markme.com/mesh/archives/001871.cfm mike chambers [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Bill Wheatley [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 10:33 AM Subject: Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Its amusing how they blame it on the evil browser though ;) I love html and i actually hate alot of things about flash. I hate you cant right click and view page location, do save as, set as background. If they could get all that into flash then i'll be fine with the passing of html until then get that pretty crap outta here. ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
I was reading Dave Watts post about HTML sucking earlier and i am really curious dave why do you think it sucks. I hardly know where to begin. There are just so many reasons why it's bad for application interfaces. Just imagine if, for everything you did on your computer, you had to do it through an HTML interface. Just compare it to the desktop applications you use everyday. HTML (or rather HTTP) is stateless, HTML isn't event-driven, HTML controls are very limited, and so on. It's great for formatting documents for people to read. That's about it. Sure it has a few weak points but all the nice pretty flash is just pretty and its really a pain in the ass how they implemented it on macromedia. I use the site everyday i dont need pretty i need it to work and html does that nicely. Of course html is annoying because its stateless yadda yadda. I'm not a big fan of the nice pretty flash, either. I like functionality and usability. But I do think that you can get more functionality and usability with Flash than you can with HTML for application interfaces. Of course, most of what's interesting on the Macromedia site is content, and HTML is better for that. Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ voice: (202) 797-5496 fax: (202) 797-5444 ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Get the mailserver that powers this list at http://www.coolfusion.com Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
Of course, most of what's interesting on the Macromedia site is content, and HTML is better for that. Dave.. Now you are talking! No need for complicated overhead.. when there is no need/use for it. Joe ---Original Message--- From: Dave Watts [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 03/07/03 03:54 PM To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website I was reading Dave Watts post about HTML sucking earlier and i am really curious dave why do you think it sucks. I hardly know where to begin. There are just so many reasons why it's bad for application interfaces. Just imagine if, for everything you did on your computer, you had to do it through an HTML interface. Just compare it to the desktop applications you use everyday. HTML (or rather HTTP) is stateless, HTML isn't event-driven, HTML controls are very limited, and so on. It's great for formatting documents for people to read. That's about it. Sure it has a few weak points but all the nice pretty flash is just pretty and its really a pain in the ass how they implemented it on macromedia. I use the site everyday i dont need pretty i need it to work and html does that nicely. Of course html is annoying because its stateless yadda yadda. I'm not a big fan of the nice pretty flash, either. I like functionality and usability. But I do think that you can get more functionality and usability with Flash than you can with HTML for application interfaces. Of course, most of what's interesting on the Macromedia site is content, and HTML is better for that. Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software a target=_blank href=http://www.figleaf.com/;http://www.figleaf.com//a voice: (202) 797-5496 fax: (202) 797-5444 ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Get the mailserver that powers this list at http://www.coolfusion.com Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
Agreed. That is why the vast majority of the content in our site is in html. mike chambers [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Joe Eugene [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CF-Talk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 1:22 PM Subject: RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website Of course, most of what's interesting on the Macromedia site is content, and HTML is better for that. Dave.. Now you are talking! No need for complicated overhead.. when there is no need/use for it. Joe ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq This list and all House of Fusion resources hosted by CFHosting.com. The place for dependable ColdFusion Hosting. Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
RE: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
Yes if you could copy and paste from within flash, open links in new windows and do everything you could with HTML in standard i would be happy with flash. it is extremly annoying and i would hope flash EVENTUALLY lets you do the same type things you can with html if it is the thing MM wants to become the standard it has to allow to do the things people have been doing for 10 years. All of those things seem appropriate for content, but less so for applications. I'd definitely stick with HTML for most content, I think. Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software http://www.figleaf.com/ voice: (202) 797-5496 fax: (202) 797-5444 ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Structure your ColdFusion code with Fusebox. Get the official book at http://www.fusionauthority.com/bkinfo.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
On Friday, Mar 7, 2003, at 07:14 US/Pacific, Willy Ray wrote: Except for the Download page that tells Opera users to Please Use a Supported Browser. Baby steps, I guess. Hopefully they'll get that working at some point soon. Opera does not currently support Flash Remoting properly which is why you cannot view the Rich Internet Applications on the site. We are working with the Opera team to resolve this. The home page is working great. So, as a developer who's doing some remoting, some RIAs (regardless of how *that* thread pans out), I'm intensly curious: What *exactly* was the problem, and will it effect me, as I build RIAs? The home page problem was two-fold: 1) we had amp; in the flashVars query string for the Flash movie but Opera did not convert it to before passing the string into the movie so we changed it to just plain (not XHTML compliant) so Opera would handle it correctly. 2) we called a JavaScript function from Flash that Opera didn't seem to like (works fine in other browsers) so we removed that call for the time being As for RIAs, see the comment above. This also applies to Safari - it does not yet support Flash Remoting properly - and we're working with the Safari team to resolve this. Sean A Corfield -- Director, Architecture Web Technology Group -- Macromedia, Inc. tel: (415) 252-2287 -- cell: (415) 717-8473 aim/iChat: seancorfield -- http://www.macromedia.com An Architect's View -- http://www.macromedia.com/go/arch_blog Announcing Macromedia DevNet Subscriptions Maximize your power with our new premium software subscription Find out more: http://www.macromedia.com/go/devnetsubs ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq This list and all House of Fusion resources hosted by CFHosting.com. The place for dependable ColdFusion Hosting. Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
Re: Day 3 Opera works! Re: The New Macromedia Website
On Friday, Mar 7, 2003, at 12:54 US/Pacific, Dave Watts wrote: I hardly know where to begin. There are just so many reasons why it's bad for application interfaces. Just imagine if, for everything you did on your computer, you had to do it through an HTML interface. Just compare it to the desktop applications you use everyday. Ask anyone who has used both MS Exchange webmail and MS Outlook... I've seen a few Flash mail clients that allow the convenience and interactivity of Outlook in a portable, web environment. That's a good example of HTML bad, Flash good :) Sean A Corfield -- http://www.corfield.org/blog/ If you're not annoying somebody, you're not really alive. -- Margaret Atwood ~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=4 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribeforumid=4 FAQ: http://www.thenetprofits.co.uk/coldfusion/faq Signup for the Fusion Authority news alert and keep up with the latest news in ColdFusion and related topics. http://www.fusionauthority.com/signup.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.4
