Re: Stus-List 3D Print a Ritchie Compass Replacement Cover

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Nicely done Dan!

I'd be interested in more details... Like cost and color options.


Thanks,

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C 37+
Solomons, MD



On Tue, Aug 14, 2018, 1:43 PM Dan via CnC-List 
wrote:

> I recently replaced my Ritchie compass cover with a 3D printed one!
> I have the Globemaster style compass (large model) with an original
> plastic cover. Ritchie only offers a soft cover now so if you want to
> replace the original cover you're SOL. My cover took a beating over the
> years so I had it 3D scanned then printed on a 3D printer. It fits exactly
> like the old one. I have the files so I can order more prints from
> Shapeways, etc. If anyone has this compass and wants a print, get in touch
> and I can make arrangements to have one printed for you :)
>
> I added a short segment about this in my latest video (first 1 minute):
>
> https://youtu.be/HfJpPZNnpFo
>
> Dan
> Breakaweigh
> C
> Halifax,NS
>
>
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
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Stus-List Paragon transmission

[Peter Schuitemaker via CnC-List]

My wife and I were headed to Desolation Sound and the Paragon transmission on 
our Landfall 38 stopped working and luckily no issues and managed to tie up 
again as we were leaving Ganges Marina in Salt Spring Island.

Our home port is Anacortes, WA at Cap Sante Marina and can anyone recommend a 
very good mechanic that can take a look and rebuild our transmission?

Harbor Marine in Everett, Washington works on Paragon but on our model OXKB.

Tomorrow we are getting towed (Boat US) back to Anacortes.

Thanks
Peter


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Stus-List Galvanic Corrosion

[ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List]

Since you are in fresh water, use aluminum anodes, not zinc.

Is your ground bus, behind the electrical panel, connected to the engine.
All of your instruments should have their negative leads going to the
electrical panel ground bus.  Then the ground bus should be connected to
the engine block.

Alan
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Stus-List Please trim your messages

[Stu via CnC-List]

I just received notice from our hosting company, that we have gone over another 
storage limit and the price is going up.

Every message that is sent out on this list is archived for future retrieval.  
If you send a message it is archived.  If someone replies, and leaves your 
original message, it gets archived.  Now if this goes on, the same original 
message could be archived many times – and that means archival space and space 
means money,

Please take the time to check your messages before you send them.  Trim off the 
fat and make a nice lean email message.

Thanks
Stu___

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Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion

[Dreuge via CnC-List]

I wavered in confusion too and landed on the side of not bolding.On the 
West Marine Advisor website they have reprinted a Practical Sailor article 
written by Stan Honey.  I include the link below.  It is a good read.  Under 
the section on “Bonding and Electrolytic Corrosion”, the first sentence 
read,”Do not bond any thru-hulls or other immersed metal that can be 
electrically isolated.”

https://www.westmarine.com/WestAdvisor/Marine-Grounding-Systems

All we need now is a discussion on galvanic isolators… 

-
Paul E.
1981 C Landfall 38 
S/V Johanna Rose
Fort Walton Beach, FL

http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/


> On Aug 14, 2018, at 3:06 PM, cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com wrote:
> 
> Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2018 14:43:02 -0400
> From: "Bill Coleman" mailto:colt...@verizon.net>>
> To: mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
> Subject: Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL]   Re:  Galvanic corrosion (Della
>   Barba, Joe)
> Message-ID: <3dc101d433fe$a252eb80$e6f8c280$@net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Well, Joe, you have just thrown some weight to a very weighty question in my 
> head.
> 
> I have read where these thru hulls are to be grounded, and then I read where 
> you shouldn?t , so I think over the years some I have re-done some grounds, 
> then I read the other way, and I don?t connect them, so half mine are 
> grounded, and the other half are not, just because I don?t know what to do! 
> 
> 
> 
> Are a couple drinks a day good for you, or bad for you?
> 
> Depends on the latest study you read! 
> 
> 
> 
> So, I am going with you, no grounds on any thru-hulls!
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for clearing my head. (At least until I read another article.)
> 
> 
> 
> Bill Coleman
> 
> C 39 Erie, PAanimated_favicon1

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Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

[Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List]

Not so fast, Bill.  I replaced a bronze thru-hull when doing extensive core 
repair about six years ago.  There was a ground wire connected to the original 
thru-hull that we did not re-connect.  About two years ago, I discovered that 
the thru-hull had been substantially eaten away.  The flange on the outside was 
about half gone and greenish-blue in color.  I replaced the thru-hull with an 
identical bronze unit and re-connected the ground wire.  Haven’t had a problem 
since.  

From: Bill Coleman via CnC-List 
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2018 2:43 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Bill Coleman 
Subject: Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

Well, Joe, you have just thrown some weight to a very weighty question in my 
head.

I have read where these thru hulls are to be grounded, and then I read where 
you shouldn’t , so I think over the years some I have re-done some grounds, 
then I read the other way, and I don’t connect them, so half mine are grounded, 
and the other half are not, just because I don’t know what to do! 

 

Are a couple drinks a day good for you, or bad for you?

Depends on the latest study you read! 

 

So, I am going with you, no grounds on any thru-hulls!

 

Thanks for clearing my head. (At least until I read another article.)

 

Bill Coleman

C 39 Erie, PA

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Della Barba, 
Joe via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2018 2:08 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Della Barba, Joe
Subject: Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

 

I am still not clear on how the voltage is being measured and between what 
points.

I have bronze thru-hulls that are not wired to anything. If I measured between 
them and the lead keel or the engine with the stainless shaft, I am sure I 
would read a voltage, they are dissimilar metals in salt water. Absent me 
wiring up the voltmeter, the thru-hulls have no connection to anything else and 
would not corrode. If you do have all these thru-hulls wired to ground, as is 
done on some boats, you now have a battery. You need to be sure there is a zinc 
involved in there somewhere and it had better have a good connection so that 
the zinc is the part of the battery corroding.

IMHO and also the article referenced in another post, I like to make sure my 
seacocks and thru-hulls are NOT grounded. This eliminates the issue of poor 
contact to zincs and prevents the boat wiring from being a path for leakage 
between boats on one side of you and boats on the other, which is something a 
zinc will have a hard time saving you from.

Joe

Coquina

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Michael 
Brown via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2018 1:53 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Michael Brown 
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

 

You could try reading current with your multimeter instead of voltage. Small 
stray voltages

likely exist when measuring between lead and SS even in fresh water but I doubt 
they will

sustain much current.

 

Just as an example of magnitude very roughly if there was a current of 1 amp 
continuously

in normal soil it would corrode about 20 lbs of steel in a year.

 

If you are reading less than 0.5 milliamp I would say those two surfaces are 
not going to have

much corrosion between them. If you are seeing over a milliamp then there is an 
issue.

The circuit requires two paths, the dissimilar metals in water and then 
something on the boat

connecting them together. Some advice has been to connect the mast, standing 
rigging and

keel together but do not ground them to the boats electrical system. That may 
be difficult

if items like the VHF antenna is mounted to a metal bracket on the mast. You 
can test for

this by measuring the resistance between the mast and ship's ground. Anything 
under

10 ohms would indicate a connection.

 

Michael Brown

Windburn

C 30-1

 

 

  Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2018 13:41:43 + 
  From: "Della Barba, Joe"  


  Voltage readings between what and what? 


  Joe Della Barba 
  Coquina 

  Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 7:25 PM 

  Hi Alan 

  The readings I posted are at anchor in the Thousand Island area.  I almost 
never plug in during the cruising season.  I only use shore power to charge the 
batteries during winter layup when the solar and wind are removed, every 6 to 8 
weeks 

  So today I did more testing.  I disconnected the positive cable for the start 
battery and I still saw 0.02V at the prop shaft.  So I ruled out that as an 
issue.  I disconnected the battery charger and still saw voltage.  Next I took 
the wind generator out of the equation and the results were the same.  Next I 
disconnected the windlass, same results.  Next I moved inside and checked for 
voltage on the tube for the centre board pendant.  Saw 0.25 V.  I removed the 
positive cable to the house electrical panel.  Still saw 

Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

If the centerboard tube is not wired to the ground bus, you can see voltage 
between that and the engine. That would make sense.
In theory there should be 0 volts between the engine and the prop shaft. In 
practice, if you think about it, no part of the rotating mass of the engine can 
possibly be hardwired to the block or it couldn’t turn. There is oil and/or 
rubber seals between any part that turns and the block. Commercial vessels 
frequently use a carbon brush arrangement to connect the ground bus to the prop 
shaft. You also can loosen a prop bolt and make a jumper if the coupler is made 
that way where there is a nut on the backside. Another work around for this 
issue on powerboats is hull mounted zincs wired to the ground bus or you can 
get one of those zinc guppies and wire that to the ground bus when not underway.
The mast voltage is ??? Is the mast grounded in some way or connected to 
underwater metal? My mast is connected to a keel bolt with 4 gauge wire.
Joe
Coquina

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Persuasion37 
via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2018 4:03 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Persuasion37 
Subject: Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion

Joe

I connected the ground from the multi-meter to the engine block.  Then I took 
the positive lead and touched it against various pieces.  Largest voltage shown 
was at the stainless tube for the centre board 0.25.  The mast and prop shaft 
showed 0.02V

Mike
PERSUASION
C 37 K/CB
Long Sault

On Aug 14, 2018, at 9:41 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
Voltage readings between what and what?


Joe Della Barba
Coquina
___

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Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion

[Persuasion37 via CnC-List]

Alan

I have the book.  To the best of my knowledge I have three ground bus bars.  
One behind the electrical panel, engine block and one in the V berth.  I 
installed the v- berth one when I installed the windlass.  The windlass grounds 
directly to the battery, however I also installed a wash down pump and 
macerator pump that are grounded to a bus bar and the that grounds to the 
windlass ground in the v-berth.  Sounds contrary to what you said.

Mike
PERSUASION
C 37 K/CB
Long Sault

> On Aug 14, 2018, at 12:53 AM, ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Mike:
> 
> A good book for you is Nigel Calder's "Boatowner's Mechanical and Electrical 
> Manual".  In the book, it says:  "All equipment should have an insulated 
> ground that leads back to a central ground bus bar in the main distribution 
> panel, which in turn leads to a common ground point or bus." In other words, 
> don't connect one ground to another, and then to the ground bus.  Each piece 
> of equipment must have it's own ground going to the ground bus.
> 
> Alan
> 
> 
>> On Mon, Aug 13, 2018 at 4:25 PM, Mike via CnC-List  
>> wrote:
>> Hi Alan
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> The readings I posted are at anchor in the Thousand Island area.  I almost 
>> never plug in during the cruising season.  I only use shore power to charge 
>> the batteries during winter layup when the solar and wind are removed, every 
>> 6 to 8 weeks
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> So today I did more testing.  I disconnected the positive cable for the 
>> start battery and I still saw 0.02V at the prop shaft.  So I ruled out that 
>> as an issue.  I disconnected the battery charger and still saw voltage.  
>> Next I took the wind generator out of the equation and the results were the 
>> same.  Next I disconnected the windlass, same results.  Next I moved inside 
>> and checked for voltage on the tube for the centre board pendant.  Saw 0.25 
>> V.  I removed the positive cable to the house electrical panel.  Still saw 
>> voltage. 
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Am I doing this right.  My memory tells me that the way I’m testing might be 
>> creating some kind of battery but my memory might be tricking me.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Could really use some help from any electricians or corrosions specialist 
>> out there.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Mike
>> C 37 K/CB Shoal draft
>> Persuasion
>> Stormont Yacht Club
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> From: ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List
>> Sent: August 9, 2018 5:23 PM
>> To: C
>> Cc: ALAN BERGEN
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> You can use aluminum anodes in fresh water.  That's what I use.  They're 
>> cheaper than magnesium.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> To test for stray currents, borrow a clamp on ammeter.  Then check the AC 
>> line supply for your boat, and for the boats in nearby slips.  The ammeter 
>> should read zero amps.  Use the lowest scale, as stray currents could be 
>> pretty low.  If the reading isn't zero, some of the current is finding a 
>> return path, other than through the AC supply line.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Alan Bergen
>> 
>> 35 Mk III Thirsty
>> 
>> Rose City YC
>> 
>> Portland, OR
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> On Thu, Aug 9, 2018 at 6:01 AM, Mike Taylor via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Bob
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> I started the season with 1.5 anodes. I’m in fresh water, Lake Ontario and 
>> St. Lawrence river.  I believe I have the correct anodes for fresh water. I 
>> really don’t want to go the galvanic isolator route
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Mike 
>> 
>> 
>> On Aug 9, 2018, at 12:04 AM, Robert Boyer via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> What is the condition of your shaft zincs?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Are you in fresh water or salt water & do you have the correct zincs for the 
>> type of water your boats in?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Sounds like you may need a galvanic isolator...
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Bob
>> 
>> Bob Boyer
>> 
>> S/V Rainy Days (1983 C Landfall 38 - Hull #230)
>> 
>> Blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
>> 
>> Email: dainyr...@icloud.com
>> 
>> Annapolis, MD 
>> 
>> 
>> On Aug 8, 2018, at 8:10 PM, Persuasion37 via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Hey folks
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> I’m looking for some help.  Persuasion is suffering from galvanic corrosion 
>> or stray current corrosion or something.  When I connect a multi meter, 
>> ground to engine and positive lead to various place like keel bolt, mast and 
>> through hull I see ~0.5V.  Today I changed out the controller on the wind 
>> generator, with the circuit breaker open I saw 2.4V on the battery leads.  
>> Also the prop shaft was tarnished looking as well as the prop when I hauled 
>> out to do the centre board.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Before I call in the calvary can anyone advise me how to tackle this 
>> methodically and what I should look for.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Thanks in advance
>> 
>> Mike
>> 
>> PERSUASION
>> 
>> C 37 (k/cb) shoal draft
>> 
>> Long Sault
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to 

Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion

[Persuasion37 via CnC-List]

Joe 

I connected the ground from the multi-meter to the engine block.  Then I took 
the positive lead and touched it against various pieces.  Largest voltage shown 
was at the stainless tube for the centre board 0.25.  The mast and prop shaft 
showed 0.02V

Mike
PERSUASION
C 37 K/CB
Long Sault

> On Aug 14, 2018, at 9:41 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Voltage readings between what and what?
>  
>  
> Joe Della Barba
> Coquina
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Mike via 
> CnC-List
> Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 7:25 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Mike 
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion
>  
> Hi Alan
>  
> The readings I posted are at anchor in the Thousand Island area.  I almost 
> never plug in during the cruising season.  I only use shore power to charge 
> the batteries during winter layup when the solar and wind are removed, every 
> 6 to 8 weeks
>  
> So today I did more testing.  I disconnected the positive cable for the start 
> battery and I still saw 0.02V at the prop shaft.  So I ruled out that as an 
> issue.  I disconnected the battery charger and still saw voltage.  Next I 
> took the wind generator out of the equation and the results were the same.  
> Next I disconnected the windlass, same results.  Next I moved inside and 
> checked for voltage on the tube for the centre board pendant.  Saw 0.25 V.  I 
> removed the positive cable to the house electrical panel.  Still saw voltage. 
>  
> Am I doing this right.  My memory tells me that the way I’m testing might be 
> creating some kind of battery but my memory might be tricking me.
>  
> Could really use some help from any electricians or corrosions specialist out 
> there.
>  
>  
> Mike
> C 37 K/CB Shoal draft
> Persuasion
> Stormont Yacht Club
>  
> From: ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List
> Sent: August 9, 2018 5:23 PM
> To: C
> Cc: ALAN BERGEN
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion
>  
> You can use aluminum anodes in fresh water.  That's what I use.  They're 
> cheaper than magnesium.
>  
> To test for stray currents, borrow a clamp on ammeter.  Then check the AC 
> line supply for your boat, and for the boats in nearby slips.  The ammeter 
> should read zero amps.  Use the lowest scale, as stray currents could be 
> pretty low.  If the reading isn't zero, some of the current is finding a 
> return path, other than through the AC supply line.
> 
> Alan Bergen
> 35 Mk III Thirsty
> Rose City YC
> Portland, OR
>  
>  
> On Thu, Aug 9, 2018 at 6:01 AM, Mike Taylor via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> Hi Bob
>  
> I started the season with 1.5 anodes. I’m in fresh water, Lake Ontario and 
> St. Lawrence river.  I believe I have the correct anodes for fresh water. I 
> really don’t want to go the galvanic isolator route
>  
> Mike 
> 
> On Aug 9, 2018, at 12:04 AM, Robert Boyer via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> What is the condition of your shaft zincs?
>  
> Are you in fresh water or salt water & do you have the correct zincs for the 
> type of water your boats in?
>  
> Sounds like you may need a galvanic isolator...
>  
> Bob
> 
> Bob Boyer
> S/V Rainy Days (1983 C Landfall 38 - Hull #230)
> Blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
> Email: dainyr...@icloud.com
> Annapolis, MD 
> 
> On Aug 8, 2018, at 8:10 PM, Persuasion37 via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hey folks
>  
> I’m looking for some help.  Persuasion is suffering from galvanic corrosion 
> or stray current corrosion or something.  When I connect a multi meter, 
> ground to engine and positive lead to various place like keel bolt, mast and 
> through hull I see ~0.5V.  Today I changed out the controller on the wind 
> generator, with the circuit breaker open I saw 2.4V on the battery leads.  
> Also the prop shaft was tarnished looking as well as the prop when I hauled 
> out to do the centre board.
>  
> Before I call in the calvary can anyone advise me how to tackle this 
> methodically and what I should look for.
>  
>  
> Thanks in advance
> Mike
> PERSUASION
> C 37 (k/cb) shoal draft
> Long Sault
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   
> 

Re: Stus-List Pelican hook

[George Cone via CnC-List]

Here's the name and address for your parts

Hayn Enterprises, LLC
51 Inwood Road
Rocky Hill, CT 06067 USA
Telephone
800.346.4296
860.257.0680
Fax

George Cone
81 c & c 40

From: CnC-List  On Behalf Of George Cone via 
CnC-List
Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 3:10 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: George Cone 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Pelican hook

The company that hS them is out of Hartford, i have it in my file from last 
year, when mine fell of, home tomorrow
81 c & c 40
George



Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.


 Original message 
From: David Morrison via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
Date: 8/13/18 2:19 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: David Morrison mailto:d...@dwmorrison.com>>
Subject: Stus-List Pelican hook

I have a 1980 C 40 - somehow the pelican hook worked it's way off the 
lifeline gate.  I need to replace.  Went to local West Marine and the one hook 
that have does not match my threading.  Does anyone happen to know the thread 
spec for the hook?  I see Defender does offer a few options.

--Dave

Terrapin Flyer
New Haven


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Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

The reason to ground them is to prevent lightning flashovers. IMHO this is 
outweighed by the corrosion issues caused by this wiring.



Joe Della Barba
Coquina


From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Don Kern via 
CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2018 3:06 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Don Kern 
Subject: Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)


I also am of the convention of none of the overboards that have plastic/rubber 
inboard should be grounded.  When I first got the boat in 1980 we were eating 
zincs, one every other month.  I read an article at the time that basically 
said that if you have a copper base paint you were setting up eddy currents 
between the overboards and the prop zinc.  I remove all the grounds from the 
overboards and have had the zinc last the whole season (May-Oct), since then.  
My two cents
Don Kern
Fireball  12708
C 35 MK2 (1974)
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Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

[Don Kern via CnC-List]

I also am of the convention of none of the overboards that have 
plastic/rubber inboard should be grounded.  When I first got the boat in 
1980 we were eating zincs, one every other month.  I read an article at 
the time that basically said that if you have a copper base paint you 
were setting up eddy currents between the overboards and the prop zinc.  
I remove all the grounds from the overboards and have had the zinc last 
the whole season (May-Oct), since then.  My two cents


Don Kern
/Fireball /12708
C 35 MK2//(1974)/
/



On 8/14/2018 2:43 PM, Bill Coleman via CnC-List wrote:


Well, Joe, you have just thrown some weight to a very weighty question 
in my head.


I have read where these thru hulls are to be grounded, and then I read 
where you shouldn’t , so I think over the years some I have re-done 
some grounds, then I read the other way, and I don’t connect them, so 
half mine are grounded, and the other half are not, just because I 
don’t know what to do!


Are a couple drinks a day good for you, or bad for you?

Depends on the latest study you read!

So, I am going with you, no grounds on any thru-hulls!

Thanks for clearing my head. (At least until I read another article.)

Bill Coleman

C 39 Erie, PAanimated_favicon1

*From:*CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of 
*Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List

*Sent:* Tuesday, August 14, 2018 2:08 PM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
*Cc:* Della Barba, Joe
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion (Della 
Barba, Joe)


I am still not clear on how the voltage is being measured and between 
what points.


I have bronze thru-hulls that are not wired to anything. If I measured 
between them and the lead keel or the engine with the stainless shaft, 
I am sure I would read a voltage, they are dissimilar metals in salt 
water. Absent me wiring up the voltmeter, the thru-hulls have no 
connection to anything else and would not corrode. If you do have all 
these thru-hulls wired to ground, as is done on some boats, you now 
have a battery. You need to be sure there is a zinc involved in there 
somewhere and it had better have a good connection so that the zinc is 
the part of the battery corroding.


IMHO and also the article referenced in another post, I like to make 
sure my seacocks and thru-hulls are NOT grounded. This eliminates the 
issue of poor contact to zincs and prevents the boat wiring from being 
a path for leakage between boats on one side of you and boats on the 
other, which is something a zinc will have a hard time saving you from.


Joe

Coquina

*From:*CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of 
*Michael Brown via CnC-List

*Sent:* Tuesday, August 14, 2018 1:53 PM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
*Cc:* Michael Brown 
*Subject:* [EXTERNAL] Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

You could try reading current with your multimeter instead of voltage. 
Small stray voltages


likely exist when measuring between lead and SS even in fresh water 
but I doubt they will


sustain much current.

Just as an example of magnitude very roughly if there was a current of 
1 amp continuously


in normal soil it would corrode about 20 lbs of steel in a year.

If you are reading less than 0.5 milliamp I would say those two 
surfaces are not going to have


much corrosion between them. If you are seeing over a milliamp then 
there is an issue.


The circuit requires two paths, the dissimilar metals in water and 
then something on the boat


connecting them together. Some advice has been to connect the mast, 
standing rigging and


keel together but do not ground them to the boats electrical system. 
That may be difficult


if items like the VHF antenna is mounted to a metal bracket on the 
mast. You can test for


this by measuring the resistance between the mast and ship's ground. 
Anything under


10 ohms would indicate a connection.

Michael Brown

Windburn

C 30-1

Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2018 13:41:43 +
From: "Della Barba, Joe" mailto:joe.della.ba...@ssa.gov>>


Voltage readings between what and what?


Joe Della Barba
Coquina

Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 7:25 PM

Hi Alan

The readings I posted are at anchor in the Thousand Island area.
 I almost never plug in during the cruising season.  I only use
shore power to charge the batteries during winter layup when the
solar and wind are removed, every 6 to 8 weeks

So today I did more testing.  I disconnected the positive cable
for the start battery and I still saw 0.02V at the prop shaft.  So
I ruled out that as an issue.  I disconnected the battery charger
and still saw voltage.  Next I took the wind generator out of the
equation and the results were the same.  Next I disconnected the
windlass, same results.  Next I moved inside and checked for
voltage on the tube for the centre board pendant.  Saw 0.25 V.  I
removed the positive cable to the house electrical panel.  Still
saw 

Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

[Bill Coleman via CnC-List]

Well, Joe, you have just thrown some weight to a very weighty question in my 
head.

I have read where these thru hulls are to be grounded, and then I read where 
you shouldn’t , so I think over the years some I have re-done some grounds, 
then I read the other way, and I don’t connect them, so half mine are grounded, 
and the other half are not, just because I don’t know what to do! 

 

Are a couple drinks a day good for you, or bad for you?

Depends on the latest study you read! 

 

So, I am going with you, no grounds on any thru-hulls!

 

Thanks for clearing my head. (At least until I read another article.)

 

Bill Coleman

C 39 Erie, PAanimated_favicon1

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Della Barba, 
Joe via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2018 2:08 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Della Barba, Joe
Subject: Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

 

I am still not clear on how the voltage is being measured and between what 
points.

I have bronze thru-hulls that are not wired to anything. If I measured between 
them and the lead keel or the engine with the stainless shaft, I am sure I 
would read a voltage, they are dissimilar metals in salt water. Absent me 
wiring up the voltmeter, the thru-hulls have no connection to anything else and 
would not corrode. If you do have all these thru-hulls wired to ground, as is 
done on some boats, you now have a battery. You need to be sure there is a zinc 
involved in there somewhere and it had better have a good connection so that 
the zinc is the part of the battery corroding.

IMHO and also the article referenced in another post, I like to make sure my 
seacocks and thru-hulls are NOT grounded. This eliminates the issue of poor 
contact to zincs and prevents the boat wiring from being a path for leakage 
between boats on one side of you and boats on the other, which is something a 
zinc will have a hard time saving you from.

Joe

Coquina

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Michael 
Brown via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2018 1:53 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Michael Brown 
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

 

You could try reading current with your multimeter instead of voltage. Small 
stray voltages

likely exist when measuring between lead and SS even in fresh water but I doubt 
they will

sustain much current.

 

Just as an example of magnitude very roughly if there was a current of 1 amp 
continuously

in normal soil it would corrode about 20 lbs of steel in a year.

 

If you are reading less than 0.5 milliamp I would say those two surfaces are 
not going to have

much corrosion between them. If you are seeing over a milliamp then there is an 
issue.

The circuit requires two paths, the dissimilar metals in water and then 
something on the boat

connecting them together. Some advice has been to connect the mast, standing 
rigging and

keel together but do not ground them to the boats electrical system. That may 
be difficult

if items like the VHF antenna is mounted to a metal bracket on the mast. You 
can test for

this by measuring the resistance between the mast and ship's ground. Anything 
under

10 ohms would indicate a connection.

 

Michael Brown

Windburn

C 30-1

 

 

Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2018 13:41:43 + 
From: "Della Barba, Joe"  


Voltage readings between what and what? 


Joe Della Barba 
Coquina 

Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 7:25 PM 

Hi Alan 

The readings I posted are at anchor in the Thousand Island area.  I almost 
never plug in during the cruising season.  I only use shore power to charge the 
batteries during winter layup when the solar and wind are removed, every 6 to 8 
weeks 

So today I did more testing.  I disconnected the positive cable for the start 
battery and I still saw 0.02V at the prop shaft.  So I ruled out that as an 
issue.  I disconnected the battery charger and still saw voltage.  Next I took 
the wind generator out of the equation and the results were the same.  Next I 
disconnected the windlass, same results.  Next I moved inside and checked for 
voltage on the tube for the centre board pendant.  Saw 0.25 V.  I removed the 
positive cable to the house electrical panel.  Still saw voltage. 

Am I doing this right.  My memory tells me that the way I?m testing might be 
creating some kind of battery but my memory might be tricking me. 

Could really use some help from any electricians or corrosions specialist out 
there. 


Mike 
C 37 K/CB Shoal draft 
Persuasion 
Stormont Yacht Club 

___

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every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
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Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion

[Michael Brown via CnC-List]

I was mainly answering Mike but adding to your question also. I am not clear on 
what is being
measured, assumed something to ship's ground.


I have not understood the need to ground an otherwise electrically isolated 
bronze through hull
or seacock though I think at one point it was recommended.


Michael Brown
Windburn
C 30-1


Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2018 18:07:44 + 
From: "Della Barba, Joe"  

 
I am still not clear on how the voltage is being measured and between what 
points. 
I have bronze thru-hulls that are not wired to anything. If I measured between 
them and the lead keel or the engine with the stainless shaft, I am sure I 
would read a voltage, they are dissimilar metals in salt water. Absent me 
wiring up the voltmeter, the thru-hulls have no connection to anything else and 
would not corrode. If you do have all these thru-hulls wired to ground, as is 
done on some boats, you now have a battery. You need to be sure there is a zinc 
involved in there somewhere and it had better have a good connection so that 
the zinc is the part of the battery corroding. 
IMHO and also the article referenced in another post, I like to make sure my 
seacocks and thru-hulls are NOT grounded. This eliminates the issue of poor 
contact to zincs and prevents the boat wiring from being a path for leakage 
between boats on one side of you and boats on the other, which is something a 
zinc will have a hard time saving you from. 
Joe 
Coquina 
___

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every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

I am still not clear on how the voltage is being measured and between what 
points.
I have bronze thru-hulls that are not wired to anything. If I measured between 
them and the lead keel or the engine with the stainless shaft, I am sure I 
would read a voltage, they are dissimilar metals in salt water. Absent me 
wiring up the voltmeter, the thru-hulls have no connection to anything else and 
would not corrode. If you do have all these thru-hulls wired to ground, as is 
done on some boats, you now have a battery. You need to be sure there is a zinc 
involved in there somewhere and it had better have a good connection so that 
the zinc is the part of the battery corroding.
IMHO and also the article referenced in another post, I like to make sure my 
seacocks and thru-hulls are NOT grounded. This eliminates the issue of poor 
contact to zincs and prevents the boat wiring from being a path for leakage 
between boats on one side of you and boats on the other, which is something a 
zinc will have a hard time saving you from.
Joe
Coquina

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Michael 
Brown via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2018 1:53 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Michael Brown 
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

You could try reading current with your multimeter instead of voltage. Small 
stray voltages
likely exist when measuring between lead and SS even in fresh water but I doubt 
they will
sustain much current.

Just as an example of magnitude very roughly if there was a current of 1 amp 
continuously
in normal soil it would corrode about 20 lbs of steel in a year.

If you are reading less than 0.5 milliamp I would say those two surfaces are 
not going to have
much corrosion between them. If you are seeing over a milliamp then there is an 
issue.
The circuit requires two paths, the dissimilar metals in water and then 
something on the boat
connecting them together. Some advice has been to connect the mast, standing 
rigging and
keel together but do not ground them to the boats electrical system. That may 
be difficult
if items like the VHF antenna is mounted to a metal bracket on the mast. You 
can test for
this by measuring the resistance between the mast and ship's ground. Anything 
under
10 ohms would indicate a connection.

Michael Brown
Windburn
C 30-1


Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2018 13:41:43 +
From: "Della Barba, Joe" 
mailto:joe.della.ba...@ssa.gov>>


Voltage readings between what and what?


Joe Della Barba
Coquina

Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 7:25 PM

Hi Alan

The readings I posted are at anchor in the Thousand Island area.  I almost 
never plug in during the cruising season.  I only use shore power to charge the 
batteries during winter layup when the solar and wind are removed, every 6 to 8 
weeks

So today I did more testing.  I disconnected the positive cable for the start 
battery and I still saw 0.02V at the prop shaft.  So I ruled out that as an 
issue.  I disconnected the battery charger and still saw voltage.  Next I took 
the wind generator out of the equation and the results were the same.  Next I 
disconnected the windlass, same results.  Next I moved inside and checked for 
voltage on the tube for the centre board pendant.  Saw 0.25 V.  I removed the 
positive cable to the house electrical panel.  Still saw voltage.

Am I doing this right.  My memory tells me that the way I?m testing might be 
creating some kind of battery but my memory might be tricking me.

Could really use some help from any electricians or corrosions specialist out 
there.


Mike
C 37 K/CB Shoal draft
Persuasion
Stormont Yacht Club
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion (Della Barba, Joe)

[Michael Brown via CnC-List]

You could try reading current with your multimeter instead of voltage. Small 
stray voltages
likely exist when measuring between lead and SS even in fresh water but I doubt 
they will
sustain much current.


Just as an example of magnitude very roughly if there was a current of 1 amp 
continuously
in normal soil it would corrode about 20 lbs of steel in a year.


If you are reading less than 0.5 milliamp I would say those two surfaces are 
not going to have
much corrosion between them. If you are seeing over a milliamp then there is an 
issue.
The circuit requires two paths, the dissimilar metals in water and then 
something on the boat
connecting them together. Some advice has been to connect the mast, standing 
rigging and
keel together but do not ground them to the boats electrical system. That may 
be difficult
if items like the VHF antenna is mounted to a metal bracket on the mast. You 
can test for
this by measuring the resistance between the mast and ship's ground. Anything 
under
10 ohms would indicate a connection.


Michael Brown
Windburn
C 30-1
 




Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2018 13:41:43 + 
From: "Della Barba, Joe"  

 
Voltage readings between what and what? 
 
 
Joe Della Barba 
Coquina 

Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 7:25 PM 

Hi Alan 
 
The readings I posted are at anchor in the Thousand Island area.  I almost 
never plug in during the cruising season.  I only use shore power to charge the 
batteries during winter layup when the solar and wind are removed, every 6 to 8 
weeks 
 
So today I did more testing.  I disconnected the positive cable for the start 
battery and I still saw 0.02V at the prop shaft.  So I ruled out that as an 
issue.  I disconnected the battery charger and still saw voltage.  Next I took 
the wind generator out of the equation and the results were the same.  Next I 
disconnected the windlass, same results.  Next I moved inside and checked for 
voltage on the tube for the centre board pendant.  Saw 0.25 V.  I removed the 
positive cable to the house electrical panel.  Still saw voltage. 
 
Am I doing this right.  My memory tells me that the way I?m testing might be 
creating some kind of battery but my memory might be tricking me. 
 
Could really use some help from any electricians or corrosions specialist out 
there. 
 
 
Mike 
C 37 K/CB Shoal draft 
Persuasion 
Stormont Yacht Club 
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Stus-List 3D Print a Ritchie Compass Replacement Cover

[Dan via CnC-List]

I recently replaced my Ritchie compass cover with a 3D printed one!
I have the Globemaster style compass (large model) with an original plastic
cover. Ritchie only offers a soft cover now so if you want to replace the
original cover you're SOL. My cover took a beating over the years so I had
it 3D scanned then printed on a 3D printer. It fits exactly like the old
one. I have the files so I can order more prints from Shapeways, etc. If
anyone has this compass and wants a print, get in touch and I can make
arrangements to have one printed for you :)

I added a short segment about this in my latest video (first 1 minute):

https://youtu.be/HfJpPZNnpFo

Dan
Breakaweigh
C
Halifax,NS
___

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every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion

[David Castor via CnC-List]

I installed a galvanic isolator, but they really don't help much with stray
dc current, unfortunately.  I do hang a large zince anode off the boat and
connect to the engine ground.  This anode is supposed to extend the life of
the shaft anodes.  I haven't noticed much difference, but most boats here
have one.   We do have a lot of fairly old fishing boats here so a galvanic
isolator or isolation transformer is standard practice.   In fact, a 77 ft
wooden fishing boat just sank at the dock yesterday.

On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 9:59 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Good article.
> Do you use an isolator on your shore power? Really bad marinas can require
> isolation transformers.
> Joe
>
> Coquina
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *David
> Castor via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 14, 2018 12:21 PM
> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Cc:* David Castor 
> *Subject:* [EXTERNAL] Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion
>
>
>
> Normally a lurker on this list, since I don't own a C, but thought I'd
> post this link to a paper on corrosion issues by Stan Honey.
> http://honeynav.com/grounding-on-sailboats/
>
>
>
> West Marine has a version of this on their website.  From my perspective
> as a EE (but certainly not a corrosion expert), Stan's suggestions seem to
> sum up the issues and possible remedies pretty well.
>
>
>
> There is no perfect solution, particularly regarding stray currents.   At
> my "hot" marina, I go through two oversized shaft anodes every 5-6 months.
>
>
>
> David Castor
>
> Port Angeles, WA
>
>
>
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List C 30 Mk1 - Teak Grab handles on outside of cabin top

[Randy Stafford via CnC-List]

Hi Wade,

I had the exact same problem on my 30 MK I hull #7 (built September 1972) when 
replacing her exterior handrails two offseasons ago.  There’s a screw from the 
inside out, between the cabintop and the starboard bulkhead (or its trim) 
separating the settee from the hanging locker.  I wasn’t going to tear apart 
all that trim to get at that screw.  I removed the old exterior starboard 
handrail destructively from that screw, and clipped off the screw flush with 
the exterior cabintop.  As a result the new replacement handrail is fastened 
with only one screw, instead of two, at that handrail base.  The other screw 
head was under a metal cover button forward of the bulkhead above the shelf 
over the hanging locker.

I was so vexed by the problem initially that I actually called Gert Tiel who 
used to work at C NOTL from the mid-70s onward for advice.  See these 
threads: 
http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/2016-November/190761.html 
 
and  http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/2017-March/192518.html 


Cheers,
Randy Stafford
S/V Grenadine
C 30-1 #7
Ken Caryl, CO


> On Aug 14, 2018, at 10:25 AM, Wade Harrogate via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Everyone,
> I have a question for the group and I am hoping someone has encountered this 
> problem before me.
> I had rain drops coming through my grab handle on the starboard side of my 
> boat. I decided I would take the inside and outside handles off to sand them, 
> varnish and then re-pot all the holes. Problem I ran into was, on the outside 
> grab handle, I could not locate one of the screws as it seems to blocked or 
> behind the bulk head. Does anyone have any knowledge of this and how to get 
> it off? I did find a broken screw where the drip was coming from, but now I 
> am having a problem finishing the job. Thanks for any suggestions, or help.
> Silik - 1974 C 30 Mk1
> 
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
> 
___

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every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

Good article.
Do you use an isolator on your shore power? Really bad marinas can require 
isolation transformers.
Joe
Coquina

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of David Castor 
via CnC-List
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2018 12:21 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: David Castor 
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion

Normally a lurker on this list, since I don't own a C, but thought I'd post 
this link to a paper on corrosion issues by Stan Honey.  
http://honeynav.com/grounding-on-sailboats/

West Marine has a version of this on their website.  From my perspective as a 
EE (but certainly not a corrosion expert), Stan's suggestions seem to sum up 
the issues and possible remedies pretty well.

There is no perfect solution, particularly regarding stray currents.   At my 
"hot" marina, I go through two oversized shaft anodes every 5-6 months.

David Castor
Port Angeles, WA

___

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every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List C 30 Mk1 - Teak Grab handles on outside of cabin top

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

The screws come from the outside and screw into the cabin top.  They have teak 
plugs covering them.  You will have to drill out the plug and redo them when 
you put the grab rails back on.

Bob

Bob Boyer
s/v Rainy Days
C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
(Presently in Baltimore for the summer)
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
email: dainyr...@icloud.com

> On Aug 14, 2018, at 12:25 PM, Wade Harrogate via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Everyone,
> I have a question for the group and I am hoping someone has encountered this 
> problem before me.
> I had rain drops coming through my grab handle on the starboard side of my 
> boat. I decided I would take the inside and outside handles off to sand them, 
> varnish and then re-pot all the holes. Problem I ran into was, on the outside 
> grab handle, I could not locate one of the screws as it seems to blocked or 
> behind the bulk head. Does anyone have any knowledge of this and how to get 
> it off? I did find a broken screw where the drip was coming from, but now I 
> am having a problem finishing the job. Thanks for any suggestions, or help.
> Silik - 1974 C 30 Mk1
> 
> ___
> 
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Stus-List C 30 Mk1 - Teak Grab handles on outside of cabin top

[Wade Harrogate via CnC-List]

Hi Everyone,
I have a question for the group and I am hoping someone has encountered this 
problem before me.
I had rain drops coming through my grab handle on the starboard side of my 
boat. I decided I would take the inside and outside handles off to sand them, 
varnish and then re-pot all the holes. Problem I ran into was, on the outside 
grab handle, I could not locate one of the screws as it seems to blocked or 
behind the bulk head. Does anyone have any knowledge of this and how to get it 
off? I did find a broken screw where the drip was coming from, but now I am 
having a problem finishing the job. Thanks for any suggestions, or help.
Silik - 1974 C 30 Mk1

___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion

[David Castor via CnC-List]

Normally a lurker on this list, since I don't own a C, but thought I'd
post this link to a paper on corrosion issues by Stan Honey.
http://honeynav.com/grounding-on-sailboats/

West Marine has a version of this on their website.  From my perspective as
a EE (but certainly not a corrosion expert), Stan's suggestions seem to sum
up the issues and possible remedies pretty well.

There is no perfect solution, particularly regarding stray currents.   At
my "hot" marina, I go through two oversized shaft anodes every 5-6 months.

David Castor
Port Angeles, WA


On Mon, Aug 13, 2018 at 9:53 PM, ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hi Mike:
>
> A good book for you is Nigel Calder's "Boatowner's Mechanical and
> Electrical Manual".  In the book, it says:  "All equipment should have an
> insulated ground that leads back to a central ground bus bar in the main
> distribution panel, which in turn leads to a common ground point or bus."
> In other words, don't connect one ground to another, and then to the ground
> bus.  Each piece of equipment must have it's own ground going to the ground
> bus.
>
> Alan
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 13, 2018 at 4:25 PM, Mike via CnC-List 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi Alan
>>
>>
>>
>> The readings I posted are at anchor in the Thousand Island area.  I
>> almost never plug in during the cruising season.  I only use shore power to
>> charge the batteries during winter layup when the solar and wind are
>> removed, every 6 to 8 weeks
>>
>>
>>
>> So today I did more testing.  I disconnected the positive cable for the
>> start battery and I still saw 0.02V at the prop shaft.  So I ruled out that
>> as an issue.  I disconnected the battery charger and still saw voltage.
>> Next I took the wind generator out of the equation and the results were the
>> same.  Next I disconnected the windlass, same results.  Next I moved inside
>> and checked for voltage on the tube for the centre board pendant.  Saw 0.25
>> V.  I removed the positive cable to the house electrical panel.  Still saw
>> voltage.
>>
>>
>>
>> Am I doing this right.  My memory tells me that the way I’m testing might
>> be creating some kind of battery but my memory might be tricking me.
>>
>>
>>
>> Could really use some help from any electricians or corrosions specialist
>> out there.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Mike
>> C 37 K/CB Shoal draft
>> Persuasion
>> Stormont Yacht Club
>>
>>
>>
>> *From: *ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List 
>> *Sent: *August 9, 2018 5:23 PM
>> *To: *C 
>> *Cc: *ALAN BERGEN 
>> *Subject: *Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion
>>
>>
>>
>> You can use aluminum anodes in fresh water.  That's what I use.  They're
>> cheaper than magnesium.
>>
>>
>>
>> To test for stray currents, borrow a clamp on ammeter.  Then check the AC
>> line supply for your boat, and for the boats in nearby slips.  The ammeter
>> should read zero amps.  Use the lowest scale, as stray currents could be
>> pretty low.  If the reading isn't zero, some of the current is finding a
>> return path, other than through the AC supply line.
>>
>>
>> Alan Bergen
>>
>> 35 Mk III Thirsty
>>
>> Rose City YC
>>
>> Portland, OR
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 9, 2018 at 6:01 AM, Mike Taylor via CnC-List <
>> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Bob
>>
>>
>>
>> I started the season with 1.5 anodes. I’m in fresh water, Lake Ontario
>> and St. Lawrence river.  I believe I have the correct anodes for fresh
>> water. I really don’t want to go the galvanic isolator route
>>
>>
>>
>> Mike
>>
>>
>> On Aug 9, 2018, at 12:04 AM, Robert Boyer via CnC-List <
>> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>>
>> What is the condition of your shaft zincs?
>>
>>
>>
>> Are you in fresh water or salt water & do you have the correct zincs for
>> the type of water your boats in?
>>
>>
>>
>> Sounds like you may need a galvanic isolator...
>>
>>
>>
>> Bob
>>
>> Bob Boyer
>>
>> S/V Rainy Days (1983 C Landfall 38 - Hull #230)
>>
>> Blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com
>> 
>>
>> Email: dainyr...@icloud.com
>>
>> Annapolis, MD
>>
>>
>> On Aug 8, 2018, at 8:10 PM, Persuasion37 via CnC-List <
>> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hey folks
>>
>>
>>
>> I’m looking for some help.  Persuasion is suffering from galvanic
>> corrosion or stray current corrosion or something.  When I connect a multi
>> meter, ground to engine and positive lead to various place like keel bolt,
>> mast and through hull I see ~0.5V.  Today I changed out the controller on
>> the wind generator, with the circuit breaker open I saw 2.4V on the battery
>> leads.  Also the prop shaft was tarnished looking as well as the prop when
>> I hauled out to do the centre board.
>>
>>
>>
>> Before I call in the calvary can anyone advise me how to tackle this
>> methodically and what I should look for.
>>
>>
>>

Re: Stus-List Landfall 38 stemhead bow roller replacement

[Bill Coleman via CnC-List]

Nice looking!

That salt sure is rough on things . . . 

 

Bill Coleman

C 39 Erie, PAanimated_favicon1

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dreuge via 
CnC-List
Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 6:17 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Dreuge
Subject: Stus-List Landfall 38 stemhead bow roller replacement

 

Folks,

 

I mentioned some time back that I needed to replace a broken stemhead bow 
roller on my Landfall 38.  I came up with a design and fabricated it with the 
help of a friend.   I installed the new stemhead bow roller this past weekend, 
and I’m pleased with the outcome.For those interested, I put a few details 
and photos online.


See https://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/2018/06/stemhead-replacement.html



-
Paul E.

1981 C Landfall 38 
S/V Johanna Rose
Fort Walton Beach, FL

 

http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/

 

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Re: Stus-List C hull number

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

Veiko,

Similar experience as Fred states.  As a pre-November 1, 1972 vessel, my
35-1 did not have the molded HIN on the transom.  It has the metal plate as
Jim states.  The HIN does not conform to the USCG format. When I went to
register it with the state, the state agency issued a new USCG compliant
HIN.

No clue how it would work in Europe, but perhaps your local registration
authority can issue a new HIN for you.

Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA

On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 9:38 AM Fred Hazzard via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Veiko, when I bought my boat the hin number on the transom was lost when
> owner had it painted in California. When I registered it in Oregon,  they
> assigned a new number that I put on the transom.   My insurance company
> accepted it with no questions.
> Fred Hazzard
> S/V Fury
> C 44
> Portland Or
>
> On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 6:17 AM Veiko Piirsalu via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> Hello
>>
>> I just bought 1982 C 30E (European version, made in Sweden)
>> Problem is, i cant find hull number (HIN) - it is not on transom, where
>> it usually is. Previous owner also did not find it and right now yacht is
>> registered without hull number. Unfortunately i cant insurance vessel
>> without hull number.
>> Any experience with this European version of C ? Maybe someone can help
>> ?
>>
>> Thank you in advance
>> Veiko from Estonia
>> ___
>>
>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
>> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
>> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>
>> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List C hull number

[Jim via CnC-List]

My C 35 has a metal stamped plate below the wheel on the pedestal showing the 
model, year and serial number.  

- Original Message -
From: Veiko Piirsalu via CnC-List 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Veiko Piirsalu 
Sent: Tue, 14 Aug 2018 09:16:35 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Stus-List C hull number

Hello

I just bought 1982 C 30E (European version, made in Sweden)
Problem is, i cant find hull number (HIN) - it is not on transom, where it
usually is. Previous owner also did not find it and right now yacht is
registered without hull number. Unfortunately i cant insurance vessel
without hull number.
Any experience with this European version of C ? Maybe someone can help ?

Thank you in advance
Veiko from Estonia


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every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
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Re: Stus-List C hull number

[Fred Hazzard via CnC-List]

Veiko, when I bought my boat the hin number on the transom was lost when
owner had it painted in California. When I registered it in Oregon,  they
assigned a new number that I put on the transom.   My insurance company
accepted it with no questions.
Fred Hazzard
S/V Fury
C 44
Portland Or

On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 6:17 AM Veiko Piirsalu via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hello
>
> I just bought 1982 C 30E (European version, made in Sweden)
> Problem is, i cant find hull number (HIN) - it is not on transom, where it
> usually is. Previous owner also did not find it and right now yacht is
> registered without hull number. Unfortunately i cant insurance vessel
> without hull number.
> Any experience with this European version of C ? Maybe someone can help ?
>
> Thank you in advance
> Veiko from Estonia
> ___
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each
> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list -
> use PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
>
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Re: Stus-List [EXTERNAL] Re: Galvanic corrosion

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

Voltage readings between what and what?


Joe Della Barba
Coquina
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Mike via 
CnC-List
Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 7:25 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Mike 
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion

Hi Alan

The readings I posted are at anchor in the Thousand Island area.  I almost 
never plug in during the cruising season.  I only use shore power to charge the 
batteries during winter layup when the solar and wind are removed, every 6 to 8 
weeks

So today I did more testing.  I disconnected the positive cable for the start 
battery and I still saw 0.02V at the prop shaft.  So I ruled out that as an 
issue.  I disconnected the battery charger and still saw voltage.  Next I took 
the wind generator out of the equation and the results were the same.  Next I 
disconnected the windlass, same results.  Next I moved inside and checked for 
voltage on the tube for the centre board pendant.  Saw 0.25 V.  I removed the 
positive cable to the house electrical panel.  Still saw voltage.

Am I doing this right.  My memory tells me that the way I’m testing might be 
creating some kind of battery but my memory might be tricking me.

Could really use some help from any electricians or corrosions specialist out 
there.


Mike
C 37 K/CB Shoal draft
Persuasion
Stormont Yacht Club

From: ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List
Sent: August 9, 2018 5:23 PM
To: C
Cc: ALAN BERGEN
Subject: Re: Stus-List Galvanic corrosion

You can use aluminum anodes in fresh water.  That's what I use.  They're 
cheaper than magnesium.

To test for stray currents, borrow a clamp on ammeter.  Then check the AC line 
supply for your boat, and for the boats in nearby slips.  The ammeter should 
read zero amps.  Use the lowest scale, as stray currents could be pretty low.  
If the reading isn't zero, some of the current is finding a return path, other 
than through the AC supply line.

Alan Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR


On Thu, Aug 9, 2018 at 6:01 AM, Mike Taylor via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
Hi Bob

I started the season with 1.5 anodes. I’m in fresh water, Lake Ontario and St. 
Lawrence river.  I believe I have the correct anodes for fresh water. I really 
don’t want to go the galvanic isolator route

Mike

On Aug 9, 2018, at 12:04 AM, Robert Boyer via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
What is the condition of your shaft zincs?

Are you in fresh water or salt water & do you have the correct zincs for the 
type of water your boats in?

Sounds like you may need a galvanic isolator...

Bob

Bob Boyer
S/V Rainy Days (1983 C Landfall 38 - Hull #230)
Blog: 
dainyrays.blogspot.com
Email: dainyr...@icloud.com
Annapolis, MD

On Aug 8, 2018, at 8:10 PM, Persuasion37 via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:

Hey folks

I’m looking for some help.  Persuasion is suffering from galvanic corrosion or 
stray current corrosion or something.  When I connect a multi meter, ground to 
engine and positive lead to various place like keel bolt, mast and through hull 
I see ~0.5V.  Today I changed out the controller on the wind generator, with 
the circuit breaker open I saw 2.4V on the battery leads.  Also the prop shaft 
was tarnished looking as well as the prop when I hauled out to do the centre 
board.

Before I call in the calvary can anyone advise me how to tackle this 
methodically and what I should look for.


Thanks in advance
Mike
PERSUASION
C 37 (k/cb) shoal draft
Long Sault
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

Stus-List C hull number

[Veiko Piirsalu via CnC-List]

Hello

I just bought 1982 C 30E (European version, made in Sweden)
Problem is, i cant find hull number (HIN) - it is not on transom, where it
usually is. Previous owner also did not find it and right now yacht is
registered without hull number. Unfortunately i cant insurance vessel
without hull number.
Any experience with this European version of C ? Maybe someone can help ?

Thank you in advance
Veiko from Estonia
___

Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use PayPal 
to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray