Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: the rescue now has a command install_bootloader to do this magically. Just type : linux install_bootloader at the boot-prompt? Amazing. No, of course not, if your bootloader is overwritten, I don't see to whom you should pass the command linux install_bootloader :-). Hum, you're not reading MandrakeForum boyz, this is baaad. http://www.mandrakeforum.com/print.php?sid=1371 1- insert your Installation CD (or map this instruction to whatever install method you want) 2- type in F1 then rescue and Enter 3- when the boot is finished you're now (now == Cooker = Nov-2001) greated by a menu, proposing a list of actions 4- select Re-install Boot Loader 5- program will - try to guess your mountpoints (for example, if you run with a / on Raid or Loopback, just plain forget it), then will mount them - perform a set of basic sanity checks (check that /sbin/lilo is executalbe, /etc/lilo.conf is readable, /etc/mandrake-release exists and contain Mandrake) - ask for a confirmation to reinstall boot loader coming from the distro-version reported by /etc/mandrake-release 6- reboot -- Guillaume Cottenceau - http://people.mandrakesoft.com/~gc/
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Fabrice FACORAT [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: bootloader is better as we can use grub. Don't forget it ! For simplicity, the install_bootloader feature of the Rescue will always install Lilo (if /etc/lilo.conf exists at all). Lilo should be considered safer than Grub (according to Pixel, at least). -- Guillaume Cottenceau - http://people.mandrakesoft.com/~gc/
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Es schrieb Guillaume Cottenceau: For simplicity, the install_bootloader feature of the Rescue will always install Lilo (if /etc/lilo.conf exists at all). Lilo should be considered safer than Grub (according to Pixel, at least). Fine, and what does this mean to me? I am using Grub, diabled the update bootloader stuff in /etc/sysconfig and update /boot/grub/menu.lst myself. If a windoze (re-)installation (AKA reset to a solid state) overrides the MBR I am stuck, as the old lilo.conf points to non existing kernels (the 8.1 kernels do not exist any moer on my harddisk) ... That's a nice idea :-\ Do you at least try to install Grub, if the lilo.conf is not found on the system? -- _ Tschüss und bis demnächst/à bientôt, _|_|_ () * Stefan /v\ / »( )« Penguin Powered! +(m-m)--+
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Stefan Siegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Es schrieb Guillaume Cottenceau: For simplicity, the install_bootloader feature of the Rescue will always install Lilo (if /etc/lilo.conf exists at all). Lilo should be considered safer than Grub (according to Pixel, at least). Fine, and what does this mean to me? I am using Grub, diabled the update bootloader stuff in /etc/sysconfig and update /boot/grub/menu.lst myself. Me too :-). If a windoze (re-)installation (AKA reset to a solid state) overrides the MBR I am stuck, as the old lilo.conf points to non existing kernels (the 8.1 kernels do not exist any moer on my harddisk) ... That's a nice idea :-\ Me too, I no longer have a /etc/lilo.conf ; but I don't consider myself a normal user. But I think I can boot a rescue, choose use a console, mount my / and re-run the /boot/grub/install.sh without too many problems :-). Do you at least try to install Grub, if the lilo.conf is not found on the system? No (patches accepted) (thoroughly tested, not just written and sent, of course ;p). -- Guillaume Cottenceau - http://people.mandrakesoft.com/~gc/
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Guillaume Cottenceau ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: the rescue now has a command install_bootloader to do this magically. Just type : linux install_bootloader at the boot-prompt? Amazing. No, of course not, if your bootloader is overwritten, I don't see to whom you should pass the command linux install_bootloader :-). The rescue disk bootloader you dummy :P Hum, you're not reading MandrakeForum boyz, this is baaad. http://www.mandrakeforum.com/print.php?sid=1371 Hmm interesting stuff. First time I see that site. Why didn't you tell us before. It's all your fault. 1- insert your Installation CD (or map this instruction to whatever install method you want) 2- type in F1 then rescue and Enter 3- when the boot is finished you're now (now == Cooker = Nov-2001) greated by a menu, proposing a list of actions 4- select Re-install Boot Loader 5- program will - try to guess your mountpoints (for example, if you run with a / on Raid or Loopback, just plain forget it), then will mount them - perform a set of basic sanity checks (check that /sbin/lilo is executalbe, /etc/lilo.conf is readable, /etc/mandrake-release exists and contain Mandrake) - ask for a confirmation to reinstall boot loader coming from the distro-version reported by /etc/mandrake-release 6- reboot Heh you even made a menu for it. Smart. Newbs can't think very well when they are in trouble. Ok so far for my suggestion. Cya, Han.
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
le sam 01-12-2001 à 05:05, Han a écrit : Vox ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Is this the end of the discussion? Mmmmit's probably the greatest idea the mandrake team has had since the creation of diskdrake...I have only one nitpicking to do...the name is hell long :) Couldn't we get it to be something like lilo install instead of linux install_bootloader? Specially for those of us who are in a non-english-speaking country, where we need to spell all of that over the phone...it's gonna take a hell of a long time :) (tho yes, I realize, it's a lot faster than telling local newbies to go to the LUG's website and follow the instructions for getting lilo back in place that we have there) linux install_lilo bootloader is better as we can use grub. Don't forget it ! -- http://perso.wanadoo.fr/linux_wizard/index.html - Comedy, like Medicine, was never meant to be practiced by the general public.
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
On Fri Nov 30, 2001 at 09:11:34PM +0600, Mark D'voo wrote: Following irc sometime and a often reoccuring theme is that windows removes lilo and the newbs can't get linux back again. There is a very easy sollution to this problem. I have been using it for quite some time now and It allways works and the recovery is allways straightforward. Much easier than any conventional solution. 1) Install lilo on the linux partition. 2) Install GAG as the bootmanager. Gag is : GPL, braindead-easy, good looking, easy to recover. I think it would be a good idea if we install Mandrake like that. Much more newbie friendly. Why not just tell people to make boot floppies like they're supposed to? =) Then it's just: boot from floppy as root run /sbin/lilo -v i don't have a floppy drive, floppy is the devil In that case, using GAG will do you no good either as if it gets wiped from the MBR, you're still screwed. At least you can boot from a CD-ROM, do the chroot, and still run lilo. -- vdanen (at) mandrakesoft.com, OpenPGP key available on www.keyserver.net 1024D/FE6F2AFD 88D8 0D23 8D4B 3407 5BD7 66F9 2043 D0E5 FE6F 2AFD Current Linux kernel 2.4.8-34.1mdk uptime: 12 days 8 hours 58 minutes. msg48499/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
On Sat Dec 01, 2001 at 05:15:10AM +0100, Han wrote: Following irc sometime and a often reoccuring theme is that windows removes lilo and the newbs can't get linux back again. There is a very easy sollution to this problem. I have been using it for quite some time now and It allways works and the recovery is allways straightforward. Much easier than any conventional solution. 1) Install lilo on the linux partition. 2) Install GAG as the bootmanager. Gag is : GPL, braindead-easy, good looking, easy to recover. I think it would be a good idea if we install Mandrake like that. Much more newbie friendly. Why not just tell people to make boot floppies like they're supposed to? =) Then it's just: Yeah they are braindead and stupid, but you might lose that floppy. It is a unique floppy that you more or less have to update with every kernel update. And you have bad luck if it fails. I've never had to update my boot disks and they work fine... If the gag floppy fails you can go anywere to make a new one. Ok, this is the one benefit then. boot from floppy as root run /sbin/lilo -v viola, next reboot you're fine. I don't see the point of another boot manager. We already have one. The difference between a bootmanager and a bootloader. Is relatively inconsequential, no? =) -- vdanen (at) mandrakesoft.com, OpenPGP key available on www.keyserver.net 1024D/FE6F2AFD 88D8 0D23 8D4B 3407 5BD7 66F9 2043 D0E5 FE6F 2AFD Current Linux kernel 2.4.8-34.1mdk uptime: 12 days 9 hours 0 minutes. msg48500/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Vincent Danen ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Yeah they are braindead and stupid, but you might lose that floppy. It is a unique floppy that you more or less have to update with every kernel update. And you have bad luck if it fails. I've never had to update my boot disks and they work fine... You never had a problem. If the gag floppy fails you can go anywere to make a new one. Ok, this is the one benefit then. boot from floppy as root run /sbin/lilo -v viola, next reboot you're fine. I don't see the point of another boot manager. We already have one. The difference between a bootmanager and a bootloader. Is relatively inconsequential, no? =) This _does_ have consequenses. You can put lilo at the safest place possible. You don not have to fear it is being overrun by anything else. Nor do you have to fear it will damage anything else. Lots of people I have helped told me they loved the solution. The first time people install linux is not the right moment for them to tell them to read man lilo and man lilo.conf. Cya, Han. msg48503/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
So sprach »Han« am 2001-11-30 um 10:21:25 +0100 : 2) Install GAG as the bootmanager. URL? Alexander Skwar -- How to quote: http://learn.to/quote (german) http://quote.6x.to (english) Homepage: http://www.iso-top.de | Jabber: [EMAIL PROTECTED] iso-top.de - Die günstige Art an Linux Distributionen zu kommen Uptime: 7 days 3 hours 33 minutes
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Alexander Skwar ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: So sprach »Han« am 2001-11-30 um 10:21:25 +0100 : 2) Install GAG as the bootmanager. URL? http://raster.cibermillennium.com/gageng.htm Sorry :) http://quote.6x.to (english) http://www.geocities.com/nnqweb/nquote.html Cya, Han.
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Pixel ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Following irc sometime and a often reoccuring theme is that windows removes lilo and the newbs can't get linux back again. [...] 2) Install GAG as the bootmanager. Gag is : GPL, braindead-easy, good looking, easy to recover. in what way is gag easier to recover Well gag is stand alone. If the bootsector is destroyed by that unnamed OS all you have to do is get a gag floppy and in 2 minutes you are up and running again. Just say were the linux partition is and install it on the hd again and thats it. If you do the same thing with lilo and you have no bootfloppy you have to do an upgrade or use the rescue disk and chroot. And all in the console. Very hard for newbs. Cya, Han.
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Pixel ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: ^- wrote ;) If you do the same thing with lilo and you have no bootfloppy you have to do an upgrade or use the rescue disk and chroot. And all in the console. Very hard for newbs. the rescue now has a command install_bootloader to do this magically. Just type : linux install_bootloader at the boot-prompt? Amazing. http://www.linux-mandrake.com/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/gi/rescue/install_bootloader Is this the end of the discussion? Cya, Han.
RE: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:cooker-owner@linux- mandrake.com] On Behalf Of Han Sent: Friday, November 30, 2001 4:52 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems. Pixel ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Following irc sometime and a often reoccuring theme is that windows removes lilo and the newbs can't get linux back again. [...] 2) Install GAG as the bootmanager. Gag is : GPL, braindead-easy, good looking, easy to recover. in what way is gag easier to recover Well gag is stand alone. If the bootsector is destroyed by that unnamed OS all you have to do is get a gag floppy and in 2 minutes you are up and running again. Just say were the linux partition is and install it on the hd again and thats it. If you do the same thing with lilo and you have no bootfloppy you have to do an upgrade or use the rescue disk and chroot. And all in the console. Very hard for newbs. And if you have no gag floppy? Show me the difference - I must create floppy in advance in both cases.
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Borsenkow Andrej ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: And if you have no gag floppy? Show me the difference - I must create floppy in advance in both cases. Goto the website, get the image, make a floppy. Remeber, not everybody can boot from cd, much more people can boot from floppy. Cya, Han.
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Pixel ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: ^- wrote ;) If you do the same thing with lilo and you have no bootfloppy you have to do an upgrade or use the rescue disk and chroot. And all in the console. Very hard for newbs. the rescue now has a command install_bootloader to do this magically. Just type : linux install_bootloader at the boot-prompt? Amazing. http://www.linux-mandrake.com/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/gi/rescue/install_bootloader Is this the end of the discussion? Mmmmit's probably the greatest idea the mandrake team has had since the creation of diskdrake...I have only one nitpicking to do...the name is hell long :) Couldn't we get it to be something like lilo install instead of linux install_bootloader? Specially for those of us who are in a non-english-speaking country, where we need to spell all of that over the phone...it's gonna take a hell of a long time :) (tho yes, I realize, it's a lot faster than telling local newbies to go to the LUG's website and follow the instructions for getting lilo back in place that we have there) Vox -- Pain is the gift of the gods, and I'm the one they chose as their messenger For info on safety in the BDSM lifestyle http://www.the-vox.com Think of the Linux community as a niche economy isolated by its beliefs. Kind of like the Amish, except that our religion requires us to use _higher_ technology than everyone else. -- Donald B. Marti Jr. Vox populi, vox deii
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
On Fri Nov 30, 2001 at 10:21:25AM +0100, Han wrote: Following irc sometime and a often reoccuring theme is that windows removes lilo and the newbs can't get linux back again. There is a very easy sollution to this problem. I have been using it for quite some time now and It allways works and the recovery is allways straightforward. Much easier than any conventional solution. 1) Install lilo on the linux partition. 2) Install GAG as the bootmanager. Gag is : GPL, braindead-easy, good looking, easy to recover. I think it would be a good idea if we install Mandrake like that. Much more newbie friendly. Why not just tell people to make boot floppies like they're supposed to? =) Then it's just: boot from floppy as root run /sbin/lilo -v viola, next reboot you're fine. I don't see the point of another boot manager. We already have one. -- vdanen (at) mandrakesoft.com, OpenPGP key available on www.keyserver.net 1024D/FE6F2AFD 88D8 0D23 8D4B 3407 5BD7 66F9 2043 D0E5 FE6F 2AFD Current Linux kernel 2.4.8-34.1mdk uptime: 10 days 22 hours 17 minutes. msg48444/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
On Fri Nov 30, 2001 at 02:52:08PM +0100, Han wrote: 2) Install GAG as the bootmanager. Gag is : GPL, braindead-easy, good looking, easy to recover. in what way is gag easier to recover Well gag is stand alone. If the bootsector is destroyed by that unnamed OS all you have to do is get a gag floppy and in 2 minutes you are up and running again. Just say were the linux partition is and install it on the hd again and thats it. If you do the same thing with lilo and you have no bootfloppy you have to do an upgrade or use the rescue disk and chroot. And all in the console. Very hard for newbs. hehehe... ok, you assume it easy for newbies to have a gag boot floppy but hard for them to have a regular linux boot floppy which they get asked to create during installation? I don't get it. -- vdanen (at) mandrakesoft.com, OpenPGP key available on www.keyserver.net 1024D/FE6F2AFD 88D8 0D23 8D4B 3407 5BD7 66F9 2043 D0E5 FE6F 2AFD Current Linux kernel 2.4.8-34.1mdk uptime: 10 days 22 hours 18 minutes. msg48445/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
On Saturday 01 December 2001 02:45, you wrote: On Fri Nov 30, 2001 at 10:21:25AM +0100, Han wrote: Following irc sometime and a often reoccuring theme is that windows removes lilo and the newbs can't get linux back again. There is a very easy sollution to this problem. I have been using it for quite some time now and It allways works and the recovery is allways straightforward. Much easier than any conventional solution. 1) Install lilo on the linux partition. 2) Install GAG as the bootmanager. Gag is : GPL, braindead-easy, good looking, easy to recover. I think it would be a good idea if we install Mandrake like that. Much more newbie friendly. Why not just tell people to make boot floppies like they're supposed to? =) Then it's just: boot from floppy as root run /sbin/lilo -v i don't have a floppy drive, floppy is the devil viola, next reboot you're fine. I don't see the point of another boot manager. We already have one. -- 9:11pm up 4:53, 0 users, load average: 1.18, 1.13, 1.04
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Vox ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Is this the end of the discussion? Mmmmit's probably the greatest idea the mandrake team has had since the creation of diskdrake...I have only one nitpicking to do...the name is hell long :) Couldn't we get it to be something like lilo install instead of linux install_bootloader? Specially for those of us who are in a non-english-speaking country, where we need to spell all of that over the phone...it's gonna take a hell of a long time :) (tho yes, I realize, it's a lot faster than telling local newbies to go to the LUG's website and follow the instructions for getting lilo back in place that we have there) linux install_lilo Cya, Han.
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Vincent Danen ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Fri Nov 30, 2001 at 10:21:25AM +0100, Han wrote: Following irc sometime and a often reoccuring theme is that windows removes lilo and the newbs can't get linux back again. There is a very easy sollution to this problem. I have been using it for quite some time now and It allways works and the recovery is allways straightforward. Much easier than any conventional solution. 1) Install lilo on the linux partition. 2) Install GAG as the bootmanager. Gag is : GPL, braindead-easy, good looking, easy to recover. I think it would be a good idea if we install Mandrake like that. Much more newbie friendly. Why not just tell people to make boot floppies like they're supposed to? =) Then it's just: Yeah they are braindead and stupid, but you might lose that floppy. It is a unique floppy that you more or less have to update with every kernel update. And you have bad luck if it fails. If the gag floppy fails you can go anywere to make a new one. boot from floppy as root run /sbin/lilo -v viola, next reboot you're fine. I don't see the point of another boot manager. We already have one. The difference between a bootmanager and a bootloader. Cya, Han.
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
1) is this in 8.0, 8.1?, or just cooker for 8.2 when its released? 2) Documentation? 3) How does it find the bootable partition(s)? - is it automated, asks questions or depends on the user knowing where his partition is? Boot disks are ok if you have an up to date one ... Having been through this (for some reason MOST Mandrake installs fail to make a boot disk for me - this includes 8.1) and I have to manually create one afterwards. During a failed 8.0 install, with no bootdisk I had to resort to the CD rescue image and manually try to sort it out - what a timeconsuming, messy operation that was (luckily I had another installation where I could look up help files etc). Certainly had the windows people in stitches over how primitive this aspect of Linux is when it doesnt work! Mind you, if I'd some decent hints at the time it would have been easier! BillK On Sat, 2001-12-01 at 12:05, Han wrote: Vox ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Is this the end of the discussion? Mmmmit's probably the greatest idea the mandrake team has had since the creation of diskdrake...I have only one nitpicking to do...the name is hell long :) Couldn't we get it to be something like lilo install instead of linux install_bootloader? Specially for those of us who are in a non-english-speaking country, where we need to spell all of that over the phone...it's gonna take a hell of a long time :) (tho yes, I realize, it's a lot faster than telling local newbies to go to the LUG's website and follow the instructions for getting lilo back in place that we have there) linux install_lilo Cya, Han.
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Following irc sometime and a often reoccuring theme is that windows removes lilo and the newbs can't get linux back again. [...] 2) Install GAG as the bootmanager. Gag is : GPL, braindead-easy, good looking, easy to recover. in what way is gag easier to recover
Re: [Cooker] Ton of newbies running into lilo problems.
Han [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: If you do the same thing with lilo and you have no bootfloppy you have to do an upgrade or use the rescue disk and chroot. And all in the console. Very hard for newbs. the rescue now has a command install_bootloader to do this magically.
