Re: [CTRL] CORROBORATIVE INFO FROM THE JOURNAL OF APPLIED PHYSICS

[Kris Millegan]

 -Caveat Lector-

Yes, indeed, I passed the posts on as interesting and as a response to Tony's
interview. and as to whetehr mr newman's machine works, I sure dunna know,

As always, . . .

And I would concur always, with independent verification.
Om
K

In a message dated 9/4/99 2:20:56 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

>It is NOT verified unless there is INDEPENDENT INVESTIGATION.

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

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Om

[CTRL] GWS Tuite reports

[Dave]

Title: 



Dave Hartleyhttp://www.Asheville-Computer.comhttp://www.ioa.com/~davehart
The Tuite Reports
Return to the Persian Gulf War Syndrome 
Lobby.



ChronicIllnet 
is proud to have Mr. James 
J. Tuite, III -the former congressional investigator under Senator Donald 
Riegle- continue his pursuit of determining what happened to the troops while 
deployed in the Gulf and how their exposures are tied to their present illnesses 
and those of their close family members. Mr. Tuite begins his series of reports 
with his editorial on "When Science and Politics Collide." We highly recommend 
you read these reports to understand how chemicals may be important triggers in 
the initiation of chronic illnesses. 
1.   
Abstracts 
Obtained from Iran on Medical Research Conducted After the 1980-1988 Iran-Iraq 
War 
2.  When Science and Politics 
Collide 
3.  UNITED STATES DUAL-USE 
EXPORTS TO IRAQ AND THEIR IMPACT ON THE HEALTH OF THE PERSIAN GULF WAR 
VETERANSU.S. Senate, Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs, 
SENATOR DONALD W. RIEGLE, JR., CHAIRMAN-- WEDNESDAY, MAY 25, 1994 

4.  U.S. Chemical and 
Biological Exports to Iraq and Their Possible Impact on the Health Consequences 
of the Persian Gulf War.Committee Staff Report No. 3: Chemical Warfare 
Agent Identification, Chemical Injuries, and Other Findings. 
5.  Potentiation of Agent 
Toxicity in Animals (Sheep) 
6.  PGS and Delayed Toxic 
Effects of Chemical Agent Exposure 
7.  1991 PERSIAN GULF WAR: 
DIRECT AND INDIRECT CHEMICAL WARFARE AGENT AND RELATED EXPOSURES 

8.  
Testimony - H.R. 
Govt. Reform and Oversight - Sept. 19, 1996 
9.  SELECTED REPORTS OF DIRECT 
CHEMICAL WARFARE AGENT DEPLOYMENT, EXPOSURE, OR LIMITED USE DURING AND AFTER 
OPERATION DESERT STORM 
10.   Report on the Fallout from 
the Destruction of the Iraqi Chemical Research, Production and Storage 
Facilities into Areas Occupied by US Military Personnel During the 1991 Persian 
Gulf War 
11.    Gulf War 
Syndrome: A Case for 
Mixed Chemical Agent - Biotoxin Related Exposures (September 9, 
1993)Note: This was the first official government report disclosing that US 
forces were exposed to chemical warfare agents and other hazardous compounds. 

12.   U.S. Senate Committee on 
Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs: Second Staff Report on U.S. Chemical 
and Biological Warfare-Related Dual-Use Exports to Iraq and The Possible Impact 
on the Health Consequences of the War (May 25, 1994) 



NEW 

Testimony of James J. 
Tuite, IIIto the Presidential Advisory Committee on Gulf War 
Veterans' IllnessesSalt Lake City, UtahMarch 18, 1997
Statement of James J. 
Tuite, III Before the State of Colorado Joint Senate and House 
Committee on Veterans and Military AffairsFebruary 28, 1995



NEW
Mr. 
Tuite's investigations have uncovered the exposure of Allied troops to chemical 
warfare agents. This exposure is finally being acknowledged by the Department of 
Defense. Senator Robert C. Byrd has offered amendments for the care of children 
of Gulf War vets and for indepedent research. You can read Senator Robert Byrd's 
article, "Caring for 
Some of War's Most Innocent Victims" under the Tuite Reports.



 
 

[CTRL] Fwd: [CIA-DRUGS] MadCow cattle guard

[Kris Millegan]

From: Daniel Hopsicker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

cattle guard: a closely spaced group of horizontal pipes
placed in a roadbed at fence line to prevent cattle from
escaping and yet allow vehicles free access.

dudes, i'm gonna take a month off this list to finish my book--
before it finishes me.

i'll leave y'all with this shocker:

yesterday i 'dropped in' on a prominent 'antique dealer'
in new orleans, who also happens to have been barry
seal's long-time CIA handler.

although he denied knowing seal, his protests were more
'for the record' than anything else, and he spent almost a
full hour in an upstairs office with debby seal and I.

his name is dave dixon.

in case anyone here questions how truly deep this all goes,
mr. dixon is one of the most prominent citizens of louisiana,
revered as the “father of the Louisiana Superdome.”
Usually described in the local press as ‘a French Quarter
art dealer,’ he is also the man credited with bringing
professional football to New Orleans, changing the face of
professional tennis, and being the architect of the
United States Football League.

ca-ching.

--
Daniel Hopsicker
The Drug Money Times
http://www.MadCowProd.com
"All the news that's ripped from print!"

Scandal in contemporary U.S. life is an institutionalized sociological
phenomenon.
It is not due primarily to psychopathological variables,  but is due to
the institutionalization of elite wrongdoing which has occcurred since
1963."

"Many of the scandals that have occurred in the U.S. since 1963 are
fundamentally interrelated: that is, the same people and institutions
have been involved."
 --Prof.David Simon, "Elite Deviance 6th edition

--- ONElist Sponsor 

ONElist:  your connection to like-minds and kindred spirits.

[CTRL] FW: A Message to the Militia- "Stand Down"

[Dave]

 -Caveat Lector-

forwarded

Dave Hartley
http://www.Asheville-Computer.com
http://www.ioa.com/~davehart


-Original Message-
From: Globalist Agendas
Sent: Saturday, September 04, 1999 2:11 PM
Subject: A Message to the Militia- From JJ


Waco Revelations: An Analysis
 (A message to the Patriot/Militia Movement)

 By J.J. Johnson

 No doubt many of you have been besieged by the numerous postings about
what  happened back in Mt Carmel, Texas beginning on Feb 28, 1993. This is
due in  part to sudden new information that seems to have recently come to
the
 surface. What is so surprising to me is that to most of us, these “new”
 revelations are more than six years old. It is for this reason, we
believe  something much more sinister is a foot.

 It has been said, “If we do not learn from history, we are doomed to
repeat  it”. The history of this administration shows us that when ever
information  critical to it’s integrity comes forward, it is -not long
before
something  literally “blows up”. Examples of this “Wag-the-Dog” principle
are the
 aspirin factory in Sudan, Iraq (a convenient punching bag), Kosovo, and
to some degree, the Oklahoma City bombing  - just to name a few.

 Rush Limbaugh has been stating repeatedly on his program that the end
result  of any Clinton scandal usually results in the downfall of the
accuser.
In,  this case, history has shown this to be true. Question: who are the
original  accusers in the Waco Holocaust?

 Answer: Patriots, Militia, and those who speak out against government.

 The Waco evidence now snowballing in the media does much more than
threaten  the credibility of the Justice Department. Heaven knows, it had
little
or no  credibility left, anyway. As the truth continues to leak out, it will
damage  the credibility of the so-called “watch-dog” groups, the media, and
 government as whole. Again, we have seen another article about the
 “potential threats from extremist groups at the end of the year”. Has
anyone  notice in all the hype, that this is the forth time this article has
been  printed (in different forms) this year. Those who archive these
articles who  notice that recent events (such as the assault on the Jewish
community  center) are merely “plugged in” to make the story sound more
up-to-date.

 Thus, many people think that the government has something dirty(er) up
their  sleeves. “Y2K maybe the excuse for Martial Law”, some say.
“Clinton needs  something to stay in power. Big event. Blame the Militia.
Take the guns”.
 Right?

 Let’s say this was true for a moment. There are big problems with this
 theory:

 1. There is no Militia to blame. Those not tossed in jail wisely went
to  ground, or disbanned. To date, the media has obeyed the order to keep
all  those “radicals” off the talking head shows.

 2. Gun Control Failure. If there was an attempt to disarm this country
by  years’ end, it has been a dismal failure. America is now armed to the
teeth.
 Ammo is moving off the selves faster than it can be produced. Trust in
 government is at an all time low. (Notice – no Clinton approval ratings
 recently)

 3. Military in chaos. The lynchpin of the “Iron Fist” is contemplating
the  draft because no American with half a brain wants their sons (and
daughters)
 taking up arms for this regime. They can’t even get compliance for an
 anthrax vaccine. There simply isn’t the quality personnel available to
 conduct wide-scale house-to-house gun confiscations. Foreign troop
 intervention will just make it more fun.. They are begging for pilots,
 engineers, and a few good men. We expect more than half of the enlisted
 personnel to jump ship at the drop of a hat.

 4. Financial Fears. It has been all but assured that too many folks
will  keep some extra cash around for Y2K – meaning the Fed can’t print it
out  fast enough. Add to this, the dilemma of all those Americans who didn’t
 bother to file tax returns this year, figuring there won’t be an IRS
 computer system around to find them next year.

 5. Hillary & Al. Folks, she bombing in the Empire State. “The Tree” is
 bombing nation-wide. Many of the rats (democratic loyalists) are
abandoning  ship. Hillary doesn’t take loosing well. Mark my word, Waco will
lead
to her  doorstep. (Ask Vince Foster)

 6. Russia. Forget China. They never did like us. Russia is a time-bomb
 waiting to happen. In fact, there is no Russia anymore. Yeltsin eating
his  pistol could boost his approval ratings. This once nuclear power is now
a  rogue state. And you wouldn’t believe what some people will do just for
 food. (Ask the Chinese Navy)

 Therefore, if the power-hungry-wannabees want to stay in power, they
need an  enemy – fast.

 So now we get all this Waco stuff. This from the same media that can
cover  up TWA Flight 800 right in our faces. Why now? Why all this Waco
stuff?

 As I am writing this article, this came into my mailbox (referring to
Waco):

 "…The anti-government movement, the militia, hate groups are absolutely
 going

Re: [CTRL] Fw: Waco's Little Rock Connection

[Tenorlove]

 -Caveat Lector-

--- Ric Carter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
<>

Only if you buy the orange sauce.
__
Do You Yahoo!?
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
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Om

Re: [CTRL] Fw: Should we trust the government?

[Sno0wl]

 -Caveat Lector-

YOU GO, GIRL  (A little mutual admiration never hurts :))  )


On 4 Sep 99, , Prudence wrote:

>  -Caveat Lector-
>
> In a message dated 09/02/1999 7:02:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
> << > In the face of this unprecedented attack on American citizens by
>  > agents of their own government, a deadly assault that sparked the
>  > militia movement as well as the bombing of the Federal Building in
>  > Oklahoma City, an unprecedented silence befell the press. “No one
>  > stepped forward to be the Davidians’ friend,” writes Richard Shweder,
>  > author of “Thinking Through Cultures,” in the New York Times. “The
>  > Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms spent months planning and
>  > rehearsing the largest ‘law enforcement’ operation of its 200-year
>  > history. This turned out to be a major military operation, worthy of a
>  > police state, carried out against the domestic residence of an
>  > unpopular and readily stigmatized religious community. The ACLU does
>  > not like guns, and it’s very busy, so it didn’t get involved. The
>  > religious leaders of our country do not like ‘cults,’ and the women’s
>  > movement does not like patriarchal living arrangements, so they didn’t
>  > much care. And no one wanted to seem sympathetic to ‘child abuse’ or
>  > unsympathetic to the FBI.” >>
>
> I don't know anyone who "trusts" the Government.  Trust is not important
> here.  And will you people quit baying about IMPEACHMENT.  Just what good
> does or would it do?  I'm so tired of all this basically partisan nonsense.
> Janet Reno is not fully to blame for WACO or Ruby Ridge and neither is
> Clinton.  Our nation's entire police and intelligence systems have evolved
> into a league of crazed gestapo-types, and you think impeachment would have
> an affect on that?  We have problems in this town, which is barely a hundred
> thousand.  Police officers are required who are not "too intelligent."  God
> forbid that we place authority and arms in the hands of anyone who has a high
> IQ.  The police in New York City and most other major cities are treating the
> citizens who pay their wages as a cross between preferred targets and marks
> (an old Carney term), and you want to impeach the president?  There is a lot
> here that needs to be done.  Why do our national agencies that are supposed
> to be protecting us and our interests behave like badly trained television
> swat teams?  What happened to bravery and brains?  What happeded to the low
> key and very effective presence that used to be law enforcement?  Police were
> always present, but they didn't feel obligated to shoot or beat up every
> citizen who bumped into them.   Why do they now?  There's a lot that needs to
> be done here, and I suggest that citizens start finding a way that they can
> be saved from the police and federal agencies which now seem only to be
> looking for excuses to abuse them.  It has nothing to do with Clinton or
> Reno.  It didn't start with Clinton's administration, and it won't stop with
> a Republican in the White House either.  Remember all that "LAW AND ORDER"
> you wanted?  Well to carefully recruited, not too smart folks who are now
> serving as our nation's finest.  That means, lock and load and go get em'
> Prudy
>
> DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
> ==
> CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
> screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
> and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
> frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
> spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
> gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
> be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
> nazi's need not apply.
>
> Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
> 
> Archives Available at:
> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html
>
> http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
> 
> To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
> SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
> SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Om
>


sno0wl

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. C

Re: [CTRL] 3rd World Disease In New York. Malathion To Be Sprayed.

[Sno0wl]

 -Caveat Lector-

On 4 Sep 99, , William wrote:

> Helicopters filled with Malathion, described as a "quite safe"
> insecticide, began spraying sections of College Point, Whitestone and
> Auburndale for two hours from 6:45 p.m.
>
Malathion is pretty deadly, totally toxic stuff. I think they gave major public 
warnings
and even did some evacuations when they used it in California. Do they still use it in
California? .



sno0wl

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om

[CTRL] Christian Authority to Keep and Bear Arms

[Mike & Kathy Moxley]

 -Caveat Lector-

Excerpt from the 'Christian Guide to Small Arms'
from the Gospel Plow.
http://www.frii.com./~gosplow/
--

What authority has the Christian freeman to keep and bear arms ?

The Lord Jesus Christ gave very clear instruction to His disciples in the
upper room after the Last Supper. They were to be sent on a mission, and
were to take with them certain things - moneybag, knapsack, and sword.

The Command of Christ

And He said to them, "When I sent you without money bag, knapsack, and
sandals, did you lack anything?" So they said, "Nothing." Then He said to
them, "But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a
knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one.
For I say to you that this which is written must still be accomplished in
Me: 'And He was numbered with the transgressors.' For the things concerning
Me have an end." So they said, "Lord, look, here are two swords." And He
said to them, "It is enough." -Luke 22:35-38

There are some among those who profess Christianity that advocate the
disarmament of all but the police and military. They will not be swayed by
the fact that the Constitution of the United States of America regards the
right to keep and bear arms as a pre-existent prerogative of a free people.
So be it. But then, how do they interpret our Lord's charge to buy a sword?

Most commentators take Christ at His word concerning the inoffensive
provisions:

That the situation in which Christ's apostles would find themselves after
his departure would indeed be different from what it was before follows
also from the words found in the highpriestly prayer (John 17: 11-13). From
now on these men will have to take the initiative. They will need to
cultivate courage to a degree not expected of them before. Making provision
for missionary travels, such as taking along a purse and a traveling bag,
will now be necessary. THE NEW TESTAMENT COMMENTARY; by William Hendriksen

When it comes to the sword, however, many commentators refuse to accept the
words of Christ in the same sense.

Jesus's words on acquiring a sword (v. 36) should not be taken literally;
they are a sign of the conflict and opposition which the disciples will
face. Evangelical Commentary on the Bible, Elwell; 1989 Baker

These instructions are most certainly not to be taken literally, as the
disciples at that time seemed to take them. The Layman's Bible Commentary

Some popular objections are :

The reference is to a knife (butcher, carving). The sword is real, but the
command is given only that a prophecy might be fulfilled. The sword is not
literal, but figurative. Jesus was non-violent; Christian = pacifist.

A Butcher Knife ?

Some insist that the two swords produced by the disciples in the upper room
were not swords at all, but rather knives. This argument declares that
these were two specific knives to be used in the preparation of the
Passover lamb - one to slit the lamb's throat, and the other to carve the
roasted lamb. Before this time the needs of the disciples had been supplied
by others. Their hosts would do the cutting and carving of the meat. Now
they will have to do this themselves. This argument ignors the fact that
the Passover lamb was but a foreshadow of Christ's Sacrifice, and that the
shadow passes away when the reality has come.

And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment, so
Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many... For the law, having a
shadow of the good things to come, and not the very image of the things,
can never with these same sacrifices, which they offer continually year by
year, make those who approach perfect... Previously saying, "Sacrifice and
offering, burnt offerings, and offerings for sin You did not desire, nor
had pleasure in them" (which are offered according to the law), then He
said, "Behold, I have come to do Your will, O God." He takes away the first
that He may establish the second. By that will we have been sanctified
through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. -Hebrews
9:27-10:10

Christ was not commanding His disciples to sell their garment to buy a
butcher knife. The Greek word used here is commonly used to describe the
short sword, the standard close combat weapon of the era.

>From STRONG'S EXHAUSTIVE CONCORDANCE OF THE BIBLE -

Greek 3162. machaira makh'-ahee-rah; prob. fem. of a presumed der. of Grk
3163; a knife, i.e. dirk; fig. war, judicial punishment:-sword. Greek 3163.
mache makh'-ay; from Grk 3164; a battle, i.e. (fig.) controversy:-fighting,
strive, striving.

If the knapsack and moneybag are to be taken literally, should not the
sword be treated the same? Certainly, the disciples would need courage to
face the events of the next 24 hours, but the admonition to sell one's
cloak in order to buy a sword had to do with trials to be faced beyond the
immediate future. Would the disciples need a moneybag and knapsack at
Gethsemane? At the praetorium?

Notice 

Re: [CTRL] Truth From Feds Is Hard to Find [Waco]

[Sno0wl]

 -Caveat Lector-

On 3 Sep 99, , Bard wrote:

> ruth From Feds Is Hard to Find
>
> --
> --  By Jennifer G. Hickey
> --
> -- 
>
> After years of denials, the FBI has said it used flammable tear gas during
> the siege of the Branch Davidian compound. What does that say about
> government by the people, for the people?

The Cover-Up Game is actually a stall tactic. If you can delay an investigation for 
10-50
years, then drag it through panels, studies, commissions, and courts for another quartr
of a century, all the leading players will be either retired, doddering, or dead--and 
thus
have attained their objective. The deed is done and the perpetrators get off scott 
free.
Furthermore, all those who were affected or who cared passionately about the matter
will also be dead, retired, or past caring and the general public of that future time 
will
only take note of an interesting historical curiosity. That's modern justice for ya.






sno0wl

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
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Om

[CTRL] FW: {Y2K} Canadian Army Y2K Preparations

[Dave]

 -Caveat Lector-

forwarded...

Dave Hartley
http://www.Asheville-Computer.com
http://www.ioa.com/~davehart


-Original Message-
From: Bob Olsen
Sent: Saturday, September 04, 1999 4:14 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: {Y2K} Canadian Army Y2K Preparations

  (Canadian) "Government and military officials have
  expressed confidence that disruptions caused by the
  Year 2000 computer problem will be minor, similar to
  those caused by a major winter storm."

(or maybe not?)
http://www.nationalpost.com/news.asp?f=990904/71167

   National PostSaturday, September 04, 1999

  [ ]+ Reporter Troops to be trained to use force for Y2K
problems
  [ ]+ Politics Military to help police: Possible terrorist
  [ ]+ West to East scenarios part of preparation

David Pugliese
  [ ]World  Ottawa Citizen

OTTAWA - The Canadian military will begin
  [ ]+ Postcard training this fall to use force in dealing with
  [ ]+ Observer millennium bug problems or year 2000 terrorist attacks.

The Canadian Forces will "train selected units in
   [Careerclick]the use of force in domestic operations [and]
practice armed and unarmed assistance" to
  [Special Features]law-enforcement agencies, according to documents
obtained under the Access to Information Act.

Units at Canadian Forces bases across the country
will also go through updated training to "conduct
security operations in a Year 2000 environment."

Although all Canadian Forces personnel are
trained in the use of force in combat missions,
   [Image]  operating with police agencies in Canada requires
 Search Helpspecialized training in the use of force in a
civilian setting.

 Date[GO]   One of the scenarios that military commanders put
 Rank   down on paper was how to deal with a
millennium-inspired attack in which terrorists
target electric power systems and take hostages
to use the "psychologically powerful turn of the
millennium to focus attention on their cause,"
according to the documents. In the scenario, two
unnamed provinces request the use of the
military's anti-terrorist unit to deal with the
threat.

Government and military officials have expressed
confidence that disruptions caused by the Year
2000 computer problem will be minor, similar to
those caused by a major winter storm. They have
suggested troops would be unarmed and provide
emergency aid such as was done in the 1998 ice
storm. Other documents stated that training
scenarios involving aid to civil powers should
not be included in the military's year 2000
preparations.

Defence officials did not return phone calls
about the training regime. A press release sent
in response to questions listed one year 2000
training scenario as to "assist law-enforcement
agencies with isolated incidents involving
individual (or) groups trying to take advantage
of the year 2000 transition for their own
purposes or beliefs."

In the U.S., preparations are already under way
to deal with millennium unrest. In March, Marine
Corps units started practicing their training in
crowd control and riot techniques in case of
panic.

Other military units in Canada are also getting
ready for the year 2000. The Air Force will
provide an air dispatch service to carry messages
across the country in the "rare event of a
catastrophic collapse of the civil telecom
infrastructure," according to the plans.

   Copyright © Southam Inc. All rights reserved.

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==
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screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
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be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no crede

Re: [CTRL] OPEN POLLINATED Seed sources,

[Lyn]

 -Caveat Lector-

Haven't a list handy but suggest Koanga Gardens, RD2, Maungaturoto, North
Island, New Zealand, as probably the leading collection.   Non-hybrid,
organic, open pollinated, heirloom varieties in plenty.


> -Caveat Lector-
>
>Lyn, could you please post info about NZ seed companies? I have a
>friend in NZ who would be interested. Thanks, Tenorlove
>__
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com
>
>DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
>==
>CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
>screeds are not allowed. Substanceónot soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
>and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
>frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
>spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
>gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
>be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
>nazi's need not apply.
>
>Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
>
>Archives Available at:
>http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html
>
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>
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>Om

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
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screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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Om

Re: [CTRL] U.S APEC Security Data Sent To Chicken Factory

[Lyn]

 -Caveat Lector-

Re:  APEC secure documents sent to fax machine in South Auckland
Chicken-processing factory...

Would have been about 9am NY time on Thursday, I think it was, when CNN
gave it quite a bit of coverage.   Might be on their site.   Front page of
NZ Herald, main newspaper in Auckland, earlier in week.   You could try the
site of The Press, a daily which is published in Christchurch, or maybe
National Business Review, or Radio New Zealand.

The best part was the chap at the factory saying, "I rang the US Embassy
several times and asked them to stop sending them, but couldn't get any
action out of them".

The humour of it all was a welcome relief for a city feeling depressed and
gloomy at all the thousands of APEC circus people in town (roads blocked,
no hotel rooms available, difficulties in using airport, some people
temporarily laid off work because of transport problems, some small
businesses almost unable to function, no doubt a heap of extra miniaturised
transponder implants for the more restless natives so they can be tracked
easily...)

Lyn


> -Caveat Lector-
>
>Matt,  is there an article on this?  How did you find out about this?
>
>Hilary
>
>--
>> From: Matt.S <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Subject: [CTRL] U.S APEC Security Data Sent To Chicken Factory
>> Date: Friday, September 03, 1999 12:27 AM
>>
>>  -Caveat Lector-
>>
>> Yes the boys at the Whitehouse have done it again, a small chicken
>> processing plant in Auckland had its fax machine spitting out
>confidential
>> security details of communication equipment, routes to be travelled,
>driver
>> names & probably a lot more. It was all supposed to go to the APEC
>Security
>> Control Office, but it looks like a case of, sorry wrong number. The
>chicken
>> plant workers said they would have rather had an order for chicken than
>> Clintons security arrangements,
>> what a joke, anyone for a chicken nibble, just contact the Whitehouse,
>they
>> have the fax number,
>> Matt.S
>>
>> DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
>> ==
>> CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting
>propagandic
>> screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid
>matters
>> and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and
>outright
>> frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor
>effects
>> spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
>> gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to
>readers;
>> be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
>> nazi's need not apply.
>>
>> Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
>
>DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
>==
>CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
>screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
>and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
>frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
>spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
>gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
>be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
>nazi's need not apply.
>
>Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
>
>Archives Available at:
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==
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and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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Om

[CTRL] Cyrptonym: NSA's crypto "KEY" in Microsoft's warez

[Dave]

 -Caveat Lector-

Isn't it interesting how the DOJ (Federal "Justice" Dept... "just-us" in
gov't...) seems to have quickly and completely backed off of any interest in
the MONOPOLY held by Microsoft ?
Could it have anything to do with preferential pricing (or free) software
provided to the FEDS?
I have seen a MS-Office installation CD marked "Government use only" which
required NO "CD-KEY" .. therefore, no serialization... unlike the versions
us PROLES purchase, which cannot be installed without a long string of
numbers from the little orange sticker on the back of the CD envelope...
Or could it have something to do with NSA "Trojan Horse" encryption key in
every MS operating system?
Both?  What other little surprises will come to light, one wonders?

Dave Hartley
http://www.Asheville-Computer.com
http://www.ioa.com/~davehart

*
from:
http://www.cryptonym.com/
"A demonstration program that replaces the NSA key can be found on
Cryptonym's website."
*[Comment from Dave: Unfortunately, I was unable to locate this demo
program]*


In the[Microsoft] CryptoAPI system, it was well known that Windows used
special numbers
called "cryptographic public keys" to verify the integrity of a CryptoAPI
component before using that component's services. In other words,
programmers
already knew that windows performed the calculation "component_validity =
crypto_verify(23479237498234...,crypto_component)", but no-one knew exactly
what the cryptographic key "23479237498234..." meant semantically.

Then came WindowsNT4's Service Pack 5. In this service release of software
from Microsoft, the company crucially forgot to remove the symbolic
information identifying the security components. It turns out that there are
really two keys used by Windows; the first belongs to Microsoft, and it
allows
them to securely load CryptoAPI services; the second belongs to the NSA.
That
means that the NSA can also securely load CryptoAPI services... on your
machine, and without your authorization.

The result is that it is tremendously easier for the NSA to load
unauthorized
security services on all copies of Microsoft Windows, and once these
security
services are loaded, they can effectively compromise your entire operating
system. For non-American IT managers relying on WinNT to operate highly
secure
data centers, this find is worrying. The US government is currently making
it
as difficult as possible for "strong" crypto to be used outside of the US;
that they have also installed a cryptographic back-door in the world's most
abundant operating system should send a strong message to foreign IT
managers.

There is good news among the bad, however. It turns out that there is a flaw
in the way the "crypto_verify" function is implemented. Because of the way
the
crypto verification occurs, users can easily eliminate or replace the NSA
key
from the operating system without modifying any of Microsoft's original
components. Since the NSA key is easily replaced, it means that non-US
companies are free to install "strong" crypto services into Windows, without
Microsoft's or the NSA's approval. Thus the NSA has effectively removed
export
control of "strong" crypto from Windows.

A demonstration program that replaces the NSA key can be found on
Cryptonym's website.


Dave Hartley
http://www.Asheville-Computer.com
http://www.ioa.com/~davehart

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==
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screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
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frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
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Om

Re: [CTRL] [SC] Skeptic News - Saturday #2

[Cathy Laughlan]

 -Caveat Lector-

> @ OURANUS IS URANUS IS HEAVEN! URANUS, THE KINGDOM IS AT HAND! Uranus is the
>   ruling planet of the age of Aquarius that we are now entering. As we look
>   around we see that Uranus is true to its reputation, to shake traditional
>   aspects of life & cause things to turn upside down. It's right on schedule
>   isn't it? In the Bible Jesus says, " The Kingdom of Heaven is at hand."
>   The New Testament was written in Greek and the Greek word for heaven is
>   Ouranos. Uranus. What was actually being said was, " The Kingdom Of Uranus
>   is at hand," and we are witnesses to its changing power. Keep watching.
>   http://www.hiddenmeanings.com/hidden.html#KINGDOM

Uhhh,  eh hem...  Excuse me, but Heaven may be YOUR anus, but it sure isn't
mine!  Speak for yourself, okay?

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
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Om

Re: [CTRL] [SC] Skeptic News - Saturday #2

[Ric Carter]

 -Caveat Lector-

- Original Message -
From: Cathy Laughlan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ric carter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

> > @ OURANUS IS URANUS IS HEAVEN! URANUS, THE KINGDOM IS AT HAND!
> >   http://www.hiddenmeanings.com/hidden.html#KINGDOM
>
> Uhhh,  eh hem...  Excuse me, but Heaven may be YOUR anus, but it
> sure isn't mine!  Speak for yourself, okay?

I knew *somebody* would construe this.

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==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
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Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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Re: [CTRL] The Bomb that gave Clinton victory

[Sno0wl]

 -Caveat Lector-

On 4 Sep 99, , Bill wrote:

> These are not idle questions.  A family that lost two children in
>  the day-care center has accused the Justice Department of a
>  cover-up.  After conducting their own private investigation for
>  the past 18 months Glenn and Cathy Wilburn have amassed evidence
>  suggesting that the government had prior knowledge of the bombing
>  -- and negligently failed to stop it...
>
>  The Wilburns, and their daughter Eyde Smith, have now taken their
>  case to the Oklahoma courts.  In a civil lawsuit they have named
>  two men -- Michael Brescia and a former German army officer,
>  Andreas Strassmeir -- as alleged accomplices of McVeigh.  They have
>  accused the Justice Department of failing to pursue all the
>  conspirators because one or more of them were federal informants
>  who had penetrated the bombing ring.

I think in the time that has since elapsed, the Wilburns either dropped or were
unsuccessful with their suit. I seem to remember them making "excuses" which
suggested that they were overwhelmed or pressured and, finding they could make no
headway, decided they had to "get on with their lives."

I believe that the two men mentioned above were connected to the same
"white supremacist" group that Buford Fowler--the LA Jewish Center shooter--was
traced to.

My memory could be faulty but my attention was flagged and it seemed to me that
there was a link here that someone could follow.



sno0wl

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frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
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Re: [CTRL] Fw: Should we trust the government?

[K]

 -Caveat Lector-

On 4 Sep 99, at 13:59, Prudence L. Kuhn wrote:

>  -Caveat Lector-
>
> In a message dated 09/04/1999 12:46:05 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
> <<
>  Hmmm.  Well, it might put a kink in rumored plans of Emperor
>  William to remain in the White House after 2000. >>
>
> And that will take care of the people slaughtered the next time our
> federal agencies decide to "control a situation."  Prudy
>
>

Red herring!   Changing the topic of discussion hardly counts as an
argument against a claim.


Kathleen


"When dictatorship is a fact, revolution becomes a right." -- Victor Marie Hugo

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==
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screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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Re: [CTRL] What really is NLP?

[Jean Staffen]

 -Caveat Lector-

According to a friend of mine who studied NLP, with an eye to setting up a
practice, it was devised by the CIA as a means of "interrogation".
Neurolinguistic Programming is a variant on mind control techniques in that
it installs "alters" to carry out certain tasks and "anchors" or trigger
words to evoke certain programmed behavior. It was first used in the private
sector to enable salesmen to determine their customers' archilles heels.
NLP is a nasty, mind-messing bit of business that began and remains in the
very worst hands. Gregory Bateson did the seminal work on the NLP process.

Jean

--
At 09:36 PM 9/4/99 -0500, Gus Delao wrote:
> -Caveat Lector-
>
>-Original Message-
>> From: Wayne Skews [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
>> Sent: Thursday, September 02, 1999 12:38 AM
>> To: Ncnculture-L (E-mail)
>> Subject: RE: Aphorism 210 and mental symptoms
>>
>>
>> >" in all cases of disease ...the state of the
>> patient's
>> >disposition is to be particularly noted ." . In
>> 211 he states, "... the
>> >state of the DISPOSITION of the patient often
>> chiefly determines",
>>
>> sounds like NLP ..and if you can change your
>> dispostion (state) then
>> it must affect or change a whole bunch of other
>> things.
>> Wayne
>
>By the way, does anybody knows what really NLP is?
>Is it just another kind of mental control? Or is it
>more spiritual and truly healing?
>
>Thanks,
>Gustavo.
>_
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Obtenga su dirección de correo-e gratis @yahoo.com
>en http://correo.espanol.yahoo.com
>
>DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
>==
>CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
>screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
>and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
>frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
>spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
>gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
>be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
>nazi's need not apply.
>
>Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
>
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>
>

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==
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and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
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Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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Re: [CTRL] [SC] Skeptic News - Saturday #1

[Cathy Laughlan]

 -Caveat Lector-

> # FINALLY, AN EDUCATIONAL INSTITUTION DEDICATED TO CRITICAL THINKING. The
>   Center for Inquiry Institute, where students study pragmatism, critical
>   inquiry, psychology of belief, other courses aimed at making them critical
>   thinkers. All institutions of higher learning should offer courses like
>   this. http://www.healthcentral.com/drdean/DeanFullTextTopics.cfm?ID=16305
>
> : Would universal critical thinking mark the doom of religion, creationism,
> advertising? What do you believe? Are you a sucker, an easy mark, a target?

Hah!  Don't you believe it!  I've been to The Center for Inquiry.   It is an
organized  arm of CSIOP...full of zealots.  It is like the Kingdom Hall of
atheists.  I went to their Halloween thing...  All they did was pass out
literature on superstitions, force people to walk under ladders and break
mirrors.  Kind of felt like some kind of encounter therapy group...minus the
pillows, ya know?  I expect next they will be going door to door on Saturday
mornings selling subscriptions to their magazine, The Skeptical Inquirer,
preaching the coming of the Darwinian kingdom...

You might be interested to know that the head of this little group at SUNY
Buffalo is the same guy who wrote the Humanist Manifesto.  I guess he's a
Trotsky-wanna-be.  To his chagrin, he's a philosophy professor there.  Need I
say more?  These guys will go to any length to get somebody to take their
courses and retain tenure...

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==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
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[CTRL] FDA "Dental Plaque Subcommittee" meeting on... SLS and Triclosan ?!

[Dave]

 -Caveat Lector-

"FDA regets it was unable to publish this notice 15 days prior to this
meeting of the "Dental Plaque Subcommittee of the Nonprescription Drugs
Advisory Committee"
"Agenda"  "review the ingredients TRICLOSAN" (agent orange derivative)
"sodium lauryl sulfate"

source: Federal Register / Vol. 63, No. 225 / Monday, November 23, 1998 /
NOTICES  64723
http://www.fda.gov/cder/fdama/fedreg/pcnoa.pdf
text excerpt:
http://www.fda.gov/ohrms/dockets/98fr/112398d.txt

Dare one speculate on the purview of the "Dental Placque" subcommittee over
SLS and TRICLOSAN?!

Brings immediately to mind the massive 50 year disinformation program on
FLUORIDATION, doesn't it?
It appears that TRICLOSAN and SLS are being used in toothpaste.
SLS is present in nearly EVERY non-"health food store-type"  Shampoo.
TRICLOSAN is present in the vast majority of soaps marketed as
"antibacterial" - also in dishwashing products.
EPA claims that SLS is present in "fruit juices."

Sodium Lauryl Sulfate (SLS) and Sodium Laureth Sulfate (SLES): Used as
detergents and surfactants, these closely  related compounds are found in
car wash soaps, garage floor cleaners and engine degreasers, yet are even
more widely  used as major ingredients in cosmetics, toothpaste, hair
conditioners, and about 90% of all shampoos and products that foam.
According to Dr. Keith Green, Ph.D., D.Sc., of the Medical College of
Georgia, SLS denatures proteins of the eye tissues, impairing development
permanently. Because it is absorbed through the skin, it does not have to
enter the eye directly.
Moreover, The Journal of the American College of Toxicology states: Sodium
Lauryle Sulfate (SLS) impairs proper structural formation of young eyes and
causes permanent eye damage. SLS causes eye irritation, is linked to
cataracts, and delays healing of corneal tissue. Other research has
indicated SLS may be damaging to the immune system, especially within the
skin. "Skin layers may separate and inflame due to its protein-denaturing
properties."
One of  the most dangerous of all ingredients in personal care products,
research shows that "SLS when combined with other chemicals can be
transformed into nitrosamines, a potent class of  carcinogens that cause the
body to absorb nitrates at higher levels than eating nitrate-contaminated
food."
According to the American College of Toxicology report, SLS stays  in the
body for up to five days.
Other studies show that SLS easily penetrates the skin and enters and
maintains residual levels in the heart, liver, the lungs, and the brain.

Triclosan: The latest rage in the arsenal of antibacterial chemicals,
included in detergents, dish washing liquids, soaps, deodorants, cosmetics,
lotions, creams, and even toothpaste.
The EPA registers triclosan as a pesticide, giving it high  scores as a risk
to both human health and the environment, and the USP recently proposed a
new monograph for its specific testing. Triclosan is a chlorinated aromatic,
similar in molecular structure and chemical formulation to some of
the most toxic chemicals on earth: dioxins, PCBs and Agent Orange. Its
manufacturing process may produce dioxin, a powerful hormone-disrupting
chemical with toxic effects in the parts per trillion: one drop in 300
Olympic-size swimming  pools! Hormone disrupters pose enormous long-term
chronic health risks because they interfere with the way hormones perform.
Triclosan is a  chlorophenol, a class of chemicals suspected of causing
cancer in humans. Externally, it causes skin irritations, but since
"...phenol can temporarily deactivate the sensory nerve endings...contact
with it often causes little or no pain." Internally, it can lead to cold
sweats, circulatory collapse, convulsions, coma, and death. Stored in body
fat, it can accumulate to toxic levels, damaging the liver, kidneys and
lungs, and can cause  paralysis, sterillty, suppresssion of immune function,
brain hemorrhages, decreased fertility and sexuall function, heart problems,
and coma.
 Boston-based microbiologist Laura McMurray and colleagues at the Tufts
University School of  Medicine say that "triclosan is capable of forcing the
emergence of 'superbugs' that it cannot kill. And experiments have shown
that it may not be the all-out germ killer scientists once thought it
was...Using triclosan daily in the home -- in products ranging from
children's soaps to toothpaste to 'germ-free' cutting boards -- may be
unwise."
http://www.healthybiz2000.com/skin_care.htm


"Since there are many compounds in the toothpastes, it is often not clear,
which product causes which adverse reaction. Almost any compound may provoke
an adverse reaction in the oral cavity or on perioral surrounding. Most of
the described reactions are presented in case reports, only a few controlled
studies are reported. Screeing the literature (to the seventeenies) shows
the following toxic/allergic reactions:
 oral desquamation (erythema, sloughing, mucosal ulceration),
 cheilitis,
 peri

[CTRL] What really is NLP?

[Gus Delao]

 -Caveat Lector-

-Original Message-
> From: Wayne Skews [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Thursday, September 02, 1999 12:38 AM
> To: Ncnculture-L (E-mail)
> Subject: RE: Aphorism 210 and mental symptoms
>
>
> >" in all cases of disease ...the state of the
> patient's
> >disposition is to be particularly noted ." . In
> 211 he states, "... the
> >state of the DISPOSITION of the patient often
> chiefly determines",
>
> sounds like NLP ..and if you can change your
> dispostion (state) then
> it must affect or change a whole bunch of other
> things.
> Wayne

By the way, does anybody knows what really NLP is?
Is it just another kind of mental control? Or is it
more spiritual and truly healing?

Thanks,
Gustavo.
_
Do You Yahoo!?
Obtenga su dirección de correo-e gratis @yahoo.com
en http://correo.espanol.yahoo.com

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om

[CTRL] Excerpt from "Sinister Twilight"

[Jean Staffen]

 -Caveat Lector-


Here's what Ron Cole says in "Sinister Twilight."  (This background is
necessary to understand the insufficiency of the warrant).

Origination of the Investigation

Late in May of 1992, Chief Deputy Sheriff Daniel Weyenberg of the McLennan
County Sheriff's Department contacted the Austin office of the Bureau of
Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms (ATF).  Deputy Sheriff Weyenberg was suspicious
abut various UPS boxes that had been received at the Mag Bag, a building
that was used by the Branch Davidians and David Koresh to receive packages
and mail.  According to Weyenberg, the Mag Bag had received shipments of
"military type surplus items" such as practice grenades.

Weyenberg further spiced up the story by explaining to the ATF, that David
Koresh had been arrested for attempted murder in the George Roden Shootout
in 1987.  He explained that Koresh and his friends had been caught wearing
camouflage and face paint, which was a total fabrication.  Weyenberg also
explained how he had seen the Branch Davidians constructing a huge bomb
shelter next to the main building on Mt. Carmel.  This "bomb shelter" was of
course the tornado shelters that were a part of the new construction plan
along with the swimming pool.  In reality, the tornado shelters had wooden
roofs and were to have been covered with abut one foot of dirt.  They would
not have been able to support the weight of a car, let alone any sort of
bomb!  This reality, however, escaped Deputy Sheriff Weyenberg.

As a result of this information presented to the ATF, Special Agent Davy
Aguilera, with the help of the Assistant U.S. Attorney in Waco, Bill
Johnson, began inquiries into the activities of David Koresh and those
living at Mt. Carmel.  By June 9, 1992, an investigation was officially
opened by ATF although no new evidence had surfaced other than the word of
Weyenberg.

On June 15, Aguilera presented his information, or lack of it, to the
Special Agent in charge of the Austin ATF office, Philip Chojnacki.
Chojnacki classified the investigation as "routine" which meant that
Aguilera did not have to keep his superiors advised of the case.  According
to the Treasury Department's investigation of the ATF that was released in
October of 1993, however, the investigation was classified "sensitive."
Such a classification would require that the higher levels in ATF would have
t be kept informed of the case throughout the investigation.  The Treasury
Department must have taken Chojnacki at his word, and never bothered to
check the records.  The initial Report of Investigation, written by Agent
Aguilera and signed by Agent Chojnacki, is classified "routine" as of July
23, 1992.  Aguilera was given a free reign to do what he pleased.

Aguilera set out to obtain invoices from the companies that did business
with David Koresh.  Olympic Arms, makers of the AR-15 and AR-15 components,
cooperated fully with the ATF.  Nessard Gun Parts also cooperated fully with
Aguilera and presented ATF with invoices of parts ordered by the Mag Bag or
David Koresh.  It was discovered that 60 AR-15 magazines and several AR-15
upper receivers were ordered from Nessard Gun Parts.  Later on, Olympic Arms
provided Aguilera with a complete list of the parts ordered.  The Mag Bag
had ordered 106 AR-15 upper receivers including barrels.  At about this
time, the friend of a local gun dealer told Aguilera that his dealer friend
had bragged about selling a "bunch" of AK-47s (semi-auto) to David Koresh.
One month into the investigation, and there was still no sign of illegal
activity.  Just the same, the investigation pressed on.

Agent Aguilera soon discovered that the Mag Bag had received a shipment of
black powder.  This was considered by Aguilera to be an explosive that
constituted evidence that someone at Mt. Carmel was constructing bombs or
live hand grenades.  However, black powder is sold in sporting goods stores
across the U.S. for use in ammunition reloading, and it was for that purpose
that the black powder was purchased.  In any case, black powder is a poor
explosive because it has a slow burn time.

The ATF also discovered that there was a lathe and a milling machine located
in Mt. Carmel.  It was believed that these common metal working tools
constituted evidence that machine guns were being manufactured!  A lathe
would have the capability to produce a gun barrel, although it would not be
able to rifle it, and a milling machine could produce a variety of parts
from rough metal castings.  However, it would be extremely difficult to
build a working gun of any kind with these two tools, not to mention a safe
one.  Since most machine guns include large stamped parts, including the
receivers, and Mt. Carmel did not boast one of these large, expensive,
stamping machines, they would have been unable to build the machine guns
Agent Aguilera so often mentioned.  The machines could have been used to
produce flash 

[CTRL] Fw: SNET: Martial Law

[Nicky Molloy]

 -Caveat Lector-

-Original Message-
From: David Gould <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Date: Friday, 3 September 1999 4:17
Subject: SNET: Martial Law



->  SNETNEWS  Mailing List

Go here for the LINKS:
http://members.tripod.com/Montalk/doomed.htm

Facts, Rumors, and Speculations

   Montalk 9-1-99

At least three truck drivers were escorted mid July by security on
separate occasions while
carrying secretive cargo to three cities: Dallas, Texas; New Orleans,
Louisiana; and Fort Knox,
Tennessee. One trucker, with military experience, arrived at his
destination in New Orleans -- a
police station. There, he decided to peek at what cargo he had been
hauling, which had been
taken to the basement of the police station. In the basement, a cavity
was being filled with cement
or concrete, and within the cavity the driver identified a nuclear
device being burried. Such a
device would be hidden, and nearly impossible to disarm if time were
short. The other two cities
likely had nuclear devices within them also, and since the three
truckers couldn't possibly have
been the only ones to experience this, there could be numerous other
bombs in America's major
cities. New Orleans is several feet below sea level, meaning a nuclear
explosion there could break
the levees and flood the entire city. Why so many bombs? The NWO seeks
both control through
martial law and population reduction; the two go hand in hand since
smaller populations are easier
to control. (source: honest friend)

In an article, suitcase nukes were said to have been shipped into the US
mid-July, confirming the
last paragraph, and placed in major eastern coastal cities, due to be
detonated between Sept 9
and 14.(source: link)

A National Guard member mentioned he and many others were ordered to be
in Tennessee Sept
14, to remain there indefinitely. The reason for the order was withheld
from those going there.
(source: friend)

Some militias have been predicting since early this year of martial law
in September to October,
and have been arming heavily in preparation.

Blue "martial law" signs have appeared in some large cities, whose
characteristics do not indicate
any other possibile use. (source: link)

Along I-94 from Minnesota to Milwaukee, many light military trucks were
seen
traveling east-bound early August of this year. A few rest stops closed
along the way
had also been observed. At one rest stop, two rows of military vehicles
(jeeps), more
than a dozen in each row, were parked on both sides of the closed rest
stop. No men,
civilian or military, were seen in the vicinity. (source: personal
friend)

In southern US, possibly Texas, more rest stops had been seen closed
down early this year. It is
confirmed that at least one of these rest stops has a freshly-poured
helicopter pad behind it, out of
sight from drivers passing by.

Photographs have been taken of schoolbuses painted white with UN decal.
(source: link)

A friend complained the tops of his school's buses were painted white
already, while in service of
transporting students.

The federal government has ordered 25 million bodybags.

The federal government has ordered excessively massive amounts of
fencing.

Marines have been conducting Urban Warrior exercises, and live fire
raids on unsuspecting
neighborhoods. They have done training exercises involving assault
tactics in urban environments,
riot suppression, and insurgent elimination, tasks typically found in
martial law situations.

Marines have also practiced blocking freeways, something necessary in
keeping roads clear of
civilian traffic and allowing military or supply vehicles free access.
This is necessary during martial
law or Y2k times.

Since at least February, chemtrails have been sighted all over America,
and in Europe, too.
Samples of residue were found to contain bacteria typical of biological
warfare and ethylene
dibromide, a jet additive and carcinogen. This may be the first agent of
a double agent spraying,
whereby the first creates an innocent disease such as cough or
pneumonia, but activation of the
agent's more potent effects comes at a later time. Millions could die as
a result...unless they get a
vaccine from the govt, but having to give up their freedom and
sovereignty first.

Military personel have been given the anthrax vaccine lest they face
court marshall and
dishonorable discharge. In a civil war, much of the US military would be
opposed to martial law
or any suppression of the population due to the high concentration of
patriots within the military.
By giving them a vaccine with at timed biological agent, the US military
could die off by the
thousands when the time comes. In place of the perished officers would
come foreign troops,
most of whom are already here. These foreign troops would have no
inhibition to fire upon the
American citizen.

Much military surplus, such as machine guns, helicopters, etc...have
been given to local law
enforcement agencies around the country. There has also 

[CTRL] Alien probe discovered masked as asteroid

[Nicky Molloy]

 -Caveat Lector-

Alien probe discovered masked as asteroid




Here is HARD EVIDENCE and possibly proof, procured by Jeff Rense of
Sightings.com, that an asteroidal object, 1991VG, is an object of
non-human origin, displaying an artificial flight pattern based only in
gravitational effect, is in fact an ET device.
And of course, the government knows all about it.



http://www.sightings.com/ufo4/spcraft.htm

Mike Wagner


-

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om

Re: [CTRL] Scientific "Heresy"

[earthman]

 -Caveat Lector-

Maybe this may help
Peter


Punctuated versus Gradual


http://www.monmouth.com/~bcornet/pictures.htm

We are about to go on a Journey. All Aboard
http://sites.netscape.net/gsussnzl/homepage
- Original Message -
From: Bob Stokes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, September 04, 1999 5:19 AM
Subject: Re: [CTRL] Scientific "Heresy"


> -Caveat Lector-
>
> In a message dated 99-09-03 12:00:39 EDT, Ric Carter writes:
>
> << Anti-evolutionism is a Chinese-sponsored plot to destroy US
>  science education and productivity.  Creationists are dupes
>  of a foreign power, pawns of Chinese agents, manipulated by
>  forces beyond their control.  Bother.  >>
>
>  You have mentioned this "Chinese Connection" before, but have, so
far,
> offered no supporting material or factors that connect China with
> creationists.  Red China is anti-Christian/Moslem/Buddist/religion if
> anything, Communism wants only one religion, that of the State as with any
> Statist form of government.  Science does not work on Darwinism alone.
> Pro-Evolutionists are knowwn for their humor (hoaxes) ... Is this a troll?
>
> Regards,
> Bob Stokes
>
> DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
> ==
> CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting
propagandic
> screeds are not allowed. Substance-not soapboxing!  These are sordid
matters
> and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and
outright
> frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor
effects
> spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
> gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to
readers;
> be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
> nazi's need not apply.
>
> Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
> 
> Archives Available at:
> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html
>
> http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
> 
> To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
> SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
> SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Om
>
>

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om

Re: [CTRL] U.S APEC Security Data Sent To Chicken Factory

[earthman]

 -Caveat Lector-

Yep it is true alright.

I live in Auckland and it was in the NZ Herald with a photo of the chicken
factory owner .
I did look in the NZ Herald online but I can not locate any reference to it
?
Why not I ask myself tee hee

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nzherald99/index.cfm

Peter

We are about to go on a Journey. All Aboard
http://sites.netscape.net/gsussnzl/homepage
- Original Message -
From: Hilary A. Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, September 04, 1999 4:01 AM
Subject: Re: [CTRL] U.S APEC Security Data Sent To Chicken Factory


> -Caveat Lector-
>
> Matt,  is there an article on this?  How did you find out about this?
>
> Hilary
>
> --
> > From: Matt.S <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: [CTRL] U.S APEC Security Data Sent To Chicken Factory
> > Date: Friday, September 03, 1999 12:27 AM
> >
> >  -Caveat Lector-
> >
> > Yes the boys at the Whitehouse have done it again, a small chicken
> > processing plant in Auckland had its fax machine spitting out
> confidential
> > security details of communication equipment, routes to be travelled,
> driver
> > names & probably a lot more. It was all supposed to go to the APEC
> Security
> > Control Office, but it looks like a case of, sorry wrong number. The
> chicken
> > plant workers said they would have rather had an order for chicken than
> > Clintons security arrangements,
> > what a joke, anyone for a chicken nibble, just contact the Whitehouse,
> they
> > have the fax number,
> > Matt.S
> >
> > DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
> > ==
> > CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting
> propagandic
> > screeds are not allowed. Substance-not soapboxing!  These are sordid
> matters
> > and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and
> outright
> > frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor
> effects
> > spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said,
CTRL
> > gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to
> readers;
> > be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial
and
> > nazi's need not apply.
> >
> > Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
>
> DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
> ==
> CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting
propagandic
> screeds are not allowed. Substance-not soapboxing!  These are sordid
matters
> and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and
outright
> frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor
effects
> spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
> gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to
readers;
> be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
> nazi's need not apply.
>
> Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
> 
> Archives Available at:
> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html
>
> http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
> 
> To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
> SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
> SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Om
>
>

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om

Re: [CTRL] OPEN POLLINATED Seed sources, many links. Just say NO: "terminator" / Genetic Engineered

[earthman]

Title: 



Thanks DaveA great pair
Peter
We are about to go on a Journey. All Aboardhttp://sites.netscape.net/gsussnzl/homepage

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Dave 
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  Sent: Friday, September 03, 1999 9:27 
  PM
  Subject: [CTRL] OPEN POLLINATED Seed 
  sources, many links. Just say NO: "terminator" / Genetic Engineered
     OHJ Online, the Restoration Directory: 
  D. Landreth Seed Co.Since 1784, America's oldest seed company. Extended 
  30-day credit toGeorge Washington and sold to Thomas Jefferson, James 
  Monroe, andother historical greats. Available coast to coast, wholesale 
  and retail.Free price list. Catalog, $2 http://www.oldhousejournal.com/rdir/09510.asp 

   Eastern Native Seed Conservancy, 
  Heirloomseeds, seed catalogueHeirloom seeds from Eastern Native Seed 
  Conservanchttp://www.berkshire.net/ensc 
  Seeds Trust High Altitude Gardens 
  International Seed SavingInstituteSeedshttp://www.seedsave.org/
  Star-Telegram.Com | 
  NewsOnline Service Provider of Dallas and Fort Worth and the Homepage 
  ofthe Fort Worth Star-Telegrahttp://www.virtualtexan.com/news/doc/1047/1:HOME4/1:HOME4021999.html 
   GO Network: Heirloom gardeningLearn 
  how to pick the perfect wine, design a garden, find a caterer. http://www.go.com/WebDir/Good_Life/Hobbies/Gardening/Heirloom_gardening
    Select Seeds -- Antique 
  FlowersFragrant, hardy, easy-to-grow heirloom flowers transform any 
  gardeninto a colorful, sweet-scented paradise for you, butterflies, and 
  bird http://www.selectseeds.com/
    The M.V.H.S. Antique 
  Heirloom Seed ProjectThe M.V.H.S. Antique Seed Project. We save heirloom 
  and distributethem to the public that will give them a good home http://shakespeare.mvhs.sad40.k12.me.us/ss 
    GO Network: Heirloom 
  gardeningLearn how to pick the perfect wine, design a garden, find a 
  caterer. http://games.go.com/WebDir/Good_Life/Hobbies/Gardening/Heirloom_gardening
    Seeds Blum Home 
  PageSeeds Blum is a seed company with open pollinated and heirloom 
  seedsfor home gardeners. We aim to preserve genetic diversity in food 
  plants.We work with small seed savers to offer gourmet vegetables, 
  ediblehttp://www.seedsblum.com/ 
   The Virtual GardenerA home garden 
  magazine for gardens and gardeners. Heirloom seedsgarden books children's 
  books. Helping you make the perfect choices forall your home gardening 
  needs. Archived information on proper treeplanting, pruning, potted plants 
  and much m http://www.gardenmag.com/vegigard 
   Re: Seeds - Many heirloom seeds - Free 
  SeedsRe: Seeds - Many heirloom seeds - Free Seeds [ Follow Ups ] [ 
  PostFollowup ] [ EXOTIC_SEEDS Newsgroup ] Posted by marlene Bocash 
  onOctober 06, 1998 at 09:44:45: In Reply to: Re: Seeds - Many 
  heirloomseeds - Free Seeds posted by Donna E. Trainor. http://www.aitcom.com/newsgroups/EXOTIC_SEEDS/3455.htm 
   Growing Heirloom SeedsGrowing 
  Heirloom Seed Heirloom seed is simply Non-Hybrid seed. Thatmeans that you 
  can expect to plant these seeds, harvest the matureseed that the 
  vegetables and fruit produce, and re-plant those seeds toget another plant 
  that is going to be.. http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Hills/9684/heirloom.html 
   CuisineNet Digest: Heirloom 
  SeedsHeirloom Seeds http://match.cuisinenet.com/digest/ingred/heirloom.shtml 
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  Christina Waters To begin collecting and growing your ownheirloom seeds, 
  contact the following companies http://metroactive.com/papers/cruz/09.05.96/produce2-9636.html
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[CTRL] Apex firepower

[earthman]

 -Caveat Lector-

I hope they remember we are nuke free too  :(

Peter

"I think that you could categorise [New Zealand] as a target of opportunity.
Here, as in many other countries, there is a clear danger of targets being
chosen."

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nzherald99/story.cfm?theClassification=search&theS
toryID=3231

By Eugene Bingham
The top United States criminal investigator says Apec leaders will be well
protected in New Zealand with or without a law change giving foreign agents
the right to carry guns.

Judge Louis Freeh, director of the Federal Bureau of Investigation,
yesterday reviewed security preparations for this year's meeting of Asia
Pacific Economic Cooperation leaders.

At the same time, a parliamentary committee was considering legislation to
boost the firepower of overseas bodyguards.

After meeting the Prime Minister, Jenny Shipley, Judge Freeh said he would
not comment on whether the right to bear arms was necessary.

"What I am confident about is that the 21 heads of state who will be here
... will be well protected.

"As to that particular legislation, Parliament will reach the appropriate
conclusion."

While he was happy with the security plans so far, he said New Zealand had
to be on guard.

"I think that you could categorise [New Zealand] as a target of opportunity.
Here, as in many other countries, there is a clear danger of targets being
chosen."

Judge Freeh also met the Police Commissioner, Peter Doone, and the head of
the Security Intelligence Service, Don McIver.

Mr Doone said the police were keen for the legislation to be passed.

"We saw the need to have a framework to be able to consider the individual
threats to individual delegations and to ensure that between the internal
police and those delegations we had every security aspect covered," said Mr
Doone.

Mrs Shipley said she had been glad to discuss Apec security arrangements
with Judge Freeh.

"I certainly sought his advice on international terrorism risks."

Pictured: FBI director Judge Louis Freeh, surrounded by security agents as
he left the Beehive. HERALD PICTURE / MARK MITCHELL



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DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
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Om

[CTRL] Apex blues

[earthman]

 -Caveat Lector-

 I got this from another list.
Who smells a rat?

Peter

i left my desk for 48 hours, and the next thing i hear is that the malaysian
PM has announced that he will not be attending APEC,
citing a busy schedule...

simultaneously, he has announced an east Asia economic meeting for Asian
countries excluding USA, and that he will be attending this
forum...

sounds like he is playing political games again


We are about to go on a Journey. All Aboard
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DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

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Om

[CTRL] Mi c trol

[earthman]

 -Caveat Lector-

From: "Dana Redding" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

>I have been chatting with a victim who is not able to have access
>to the internet and wants to know any possible purpose programmed
>dreams might have. Any and all information would be appreciated.

I do not exactly know what you are searching for
but I recently got a URL about the Project MONARCH.
Its a whole book online and its very detailed.
Strip away the Illumiaty conspiracy and you got
a receipe how to build MPD/DID "slaves".

http://mercury.spaceports.com/~persewen/table_of_contents.htm

Robert

http://www.morethanconquerors.simplenet.com/MCF/victm-hm.htm#Born
http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/Tryptamines/Lysergic/acid_dreams1.html
http://www.drugtext.org/psychedelics/marks.htm
http://www.angelfire.com/or/mctrl/
http://www.visitations.com/mindcontrol/intro.htm
http://www.dc.peachnet.edu/~shale/ -> Human Experimentation
http://www.au.af.mil/au/2025/volume3/chap03/v3c3-1.htm





We are about to go on a Journey. All Aboard
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DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

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Om

[CTRL] How "Uncle Sam"Turned into a "Big Brother

[earthman]

 -Caveat Lector-

FROM PHOENIX, ARIZONA

All 137 earlier Special Truth in Media Global Watch Bulletins on NATO's
Kosovo War and "Peace" can also be seen at our Web site:
www.truthinmedia.org, along with numerous photos and other memorable
images.  The Kosovo TiM GW Bulletins are now divided into two sections:
NATO's War (106 issues) and NATO's "Peace" (33 issues).

Issue S99-138, "Peace" 33
--
August 24, 1999

3. A Sobering Message to Truthmongers Around the World: How "Uncle Sam"
Turned into a "Big Brother"

PHOENIX, Aug. 24 - And now, here's an epilogue to the story behind the
above "Venik" story.  And it has nothing to do with Serbia.  It has to do
with how Uncle Sam's criminal reincarnation, the Clinton administration,
tried to shut down the dissemination of God's truth during NATO's war on
Serbia, and turned itself into a Big Brother reincarnate.

At least two U.S. Internet providers not only had tried to, but actually
did, shut down the "Venik" Web sites.  At the U.S. government urging, the
"Venik" insists.  Because he told the truth about NATO's aggression on
Serbia.  Here are copies of some of the correspondence which TiM exchanged
with "Venik" during the course of trying to verify his existence and
credibility. You can judge for yourself whom to believe - the "Venik," or
the "Big Brother:"

VENIK: "I am reading your TiM newsletter about the situation in Yugoslavia
with great interest every time. During NATO's aggression against
Yugoslavia, the (TiM) newsletter provided a lot of particularly interesting
information that would otherwise have escaped my attention.

I did my best during NATO's aggression to maintain an accurate record of
NATO combat losses and military tactics. My Web site (Venik's Aviation
Page) had on the average about 3,000 visitors every day from Yugoslavia
alone.  Which, I guess is not bad for a personal home page.

Several months ago I received a strange letter from the webmaster of
Cybercities - my former Web space provider - who explained that he was
forced by the government to close my page. I moved my site to XOOM, where it
existed until several days ago when I received a similar letter for
XOOM's webmaster.

Knowing that your newsletter targets the audience which may be interested
in the kind of information presented on my Web site, I decided to contact
you with a request to include the new address (below) of my page in your
newsletter."

Asked by TiM who ordered his ISPs to shut down his Web site, "Venik"
replied:

"Apparently, it was the US government. It appears that I probably deleted
the e-mail from XOOM's webmaster, but I still have the one I got from the
Cybercities, which is a Web space provider based in Flagstaff, Arizona.
Their Web site is www.cybercities.com

Recently they re-designed their web page and removed any info about their
location. But on their old web site the address was: Cybercities.com; 2532
Borth 4th St. #301; Flagstaff, AZ, 86004

Here is the e-mail I received from the Webmaster of Cybercities on May 26,
1999. Subject line: Anti-American Pages; sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

"Dear Madam - Sir,

We recently got some governmental complaints about your web page on our
server concerning the topic: Aircraft used and lost in Yugoslavia. You
know, that our policy is, and always will be, to obtain  the free speech on
the internet.

But, as you might know, our server is located in the U.S. , so we cannot
provide any topics, that collide with federal laws of the U.S.. And
according to one of these laws, no company inside the U.S. is allowed to
supply any hostile country, this concerns ALSO (due to the email we got)
YOUR web page.

So we please you to rearrange your web site the way it does not show the
numbers and locations where the Yugoslavian side assume NATO planes got
down (If it is true or not I do not care) or we have to shut down your
web page.

Sorry ?about that [EMAIL PROTECTED]"

To be honest, at first I assumed that this was somebody's practical joke,
so I checked the source code of the e-mail and, to my surprise, it did come
from Cybercities. On the very same day Cybercities disabled my account and
erased all of my files. That was it. Somebody must have really spooked
them. Cybercities did not reply to any of my e-mails regarding the
termination of my Web site."
---
TiM Ed.: Welcome to the Big Brother's (not Uncle Sam's) United States of
America.

NOTE: To cancel the e-mail editions of our reports, just reply REMOVE or
UNSUBSCRIBE, followed by the e-mail address at which you're receiving them.

Bob Djurdjevic
TRUTH IN MEDIA
Phoenix, Arizona
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]



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DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, 

Re: [CTRL] Fw: WACO: Joyce Riley on Art Bell 9/2/99

[Howard R. Davis III]

 -Caveat Lector-

It seems to me that it is very possible that this charge is a form of
disinformation. I don't know of any proof of this being asserted previous to
this. The video of the fire starting at Waco showed a grardual build up of
flames. I doubt if that would have happened if even one missle had been
fired from a helicopter. Besides, why would they have to fire from a
helicopter and make a big show? They could have started the fire with
flash/bangs, as they probably did.
   How would such disinformation work? Get people hollering about something
that is easily proven false, then claiming that you have answered your
critics while ignoring the true charges.
Howard Davis

--
>From: Sean McDougal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Subject: [CTRL] Fw: WACO: Joyce Riley on Art Bell 9/2/99
>Date: Sat, Sep 4, 1999, 2:11 PM
>

>  -Caveat Lector-
>
> Original Message Follows
> From: Jon Roland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: undisclosed-recipients:;
> Subject: Fw: WACO: Joyce Riley on Art Bell 9/2/99
> Date: Sat, 4 Sep 1999 00:26:01 -0500 (CDT)
>
> - Begin forwarded message --
>
> To listen to the discussion of Waco by Joyce Riley on Art Bell,
> download the
> program.
>
> Click to listen: http://ww2.broadcast.com/artbell/abell/9909/ab0902.ram
>
> Pertinent parts begin at approximately 2 hours, six minutes (2:06) into the
> program.  To fastforward to this point in the program, just move the clip
> position indicator with your mouse until the time indicator reads somewhere
> close to 2:06:00.0
>
> Rough transcript beginning at above time (not proofread or spell-checked):
>
> ART BELL:  All kinds of information breaking about Waco, just all kinds.
> I know you have new, as yet unheard by anybody information about Waco.
> What can you tell us?
>
> JOYCE RILEY:  Well, let me preface this by saying the purpose for this
> person coming forward with the information was that he is a sick Gulf
> War veteran, and we had a long discussion about the secrets of the
> Gulf War illness and the cover-up involved there, and I said, "Just like
> Waco, there needs to be the exposure of the truth about Waco."  And
> he said, "I know about Waco."  And I said, "How do you know about
> Waco?"  And he said, "I know more than I wish I knew.  I was stationed
> at Fort Hood and we were the unit that provided the Apache attack
> helicopters."
>
> You can imagine how startled I was to hear that there were Apache
> attack helicopters, because an Apache is not even armed in the United
> States.  It's never armed because it is nothing but a helicopter for war.
> It's --
>
> ART:  An Apache, actually, was probably the most efficient killing
> machine in the Gulf War, so efficient that the images were hidden from
> the American people.  The Apache is an incredible war machine.  People
> have no idea how devastating the fire power from that helicopter can be.
>
> JOYCE:  Oh, it is.  It looks like a preying mantis.  It is the helicopter
> that
> has the wheels on it.  And if you were to ever see one, it is just -- it's
> very formidable.  And in talking with this Gulf War veteran, and part of the
> reason I'm saying this today is because of his -- for his protection,
> because
> Texas Rangers have become involved in this since I talked with you, Art,
> so I'm not at liberty to identify some of the things that I was going to
> say.
> But I did get a phone call from Dick DeGuerin today, which the attorney
> for the Branch Dividians, and I can assure you that this information that
> he gave coincides with what he already knew and speculated.
>
> But let me just say that this Gulf War veteran, after we talked about this,
> I said, "You know you have a responsibility to come forward, because if
> we want people to tell the truth about Gulf War illness, if we want
> the people to come out of the Pentagon and out of the corners in the
> back alleys and admit to what has gone on there, we're going to have to
> tell what we know."  So he has come forward.  He is a destitute, if you
> will, Gulf War veteran who has no purpose in doing this other than the
> world needs to know the truth, and it is time that we quit harboring
> these secrets under the name of military adventure or military action.
> What he told me is that while he was stationed at Fort Hood at the
> F227 Aviation Apache Attack Squadron, that they armed the Apache
> helicopters to go in to Waco.
>
> ART:  They armed them.
>
> JOYCE:  They armed them.  Now understanding that if what we say is
> true here today, this is the most devastating information to come across,
> because this puts the liability and the accountability all the way up to
> the president, for arming a helicopter for a war situation within the
> United States, basically violating the Posse Commitatus Act.
>
> ART:  Absolutely.
>
> JOYCE:  So, when he described this operation, I asked him what they
> armed the helicopters with.
>
> ART:  Good.  And what did he say?
>
> JOYCE:  He said

Re: [CTRL] CORROBORATIVE INFO FROM THE JOURNAL OF APPLIED PHYSICS

[ASu2431426]

 -Caveat Lector-

It is NOT verified unless there is INDEPENDENT INVESTIGATION.

Newman has been citing these journals for years.  You can cite all you want.

You have zilch until it is done INDEPENDENTLY

AS

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

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Om

Re: [CTRL] CORROBORATIVE INFO FROM THE JOURNAL OF APPLIED PHYSICS

[Ric Carter]

 -Caveat Lector-

> CORROBORATIVE INFO FROM THE JOURNAL OF APPLIED PHYSICS
>
> IT HAS COME TO OUR ATTENTION THAT A RESEARCH REPORT PUBLISHED IN THE
> JOURNAL OF APPLIED PHYSICS (Volume 77, Issue 11, June 1, 1995, pages
> 6015-6020) PUBLISHED BY THE AMERICAN INSTITUTE OF PHYSICS, FURTHER
> VALIDATES THE PIONEERING WORK OF INVENTOR JOSPEPH NEWMAN.

Validating Newman's claim that his device produces more energy than
it consumes is simple.  No meters or calculation are necessary.

1) Connect a power source to the Newman device input.
2) Connect a light bulb to the Newman device output.
3) Connect the Newman device output to its input.
4) Start the Newman device.
5) Disconnect the power source.
6) Watch it for a few weeks.

If the Newman device can power itself and the light bulb for a
significant period, Newman's claim can be considered as verified.

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

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Om

Re: [CTRL] Fw: Waco's Little Rock Connection

[Ric Carter]

 -Caveat Lector-

- Original Message -
From: Bill <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Ric Carter wrote:
> > From: Theodor Parada, MD <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >
> > > When it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's a duck!!
> >
> > Or it's an alien in a duck suit.
>
> If an alien in a duck suit doesn't bite your ass is it still real?

Bite the (alleged) duck's ass and see.  Verify, verify, verify...

  Ric "heading down to the duckpond, jaws twitching" Carter

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
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Om

[CTRL] Skeptic News - Saturday #3

[ric carter]

 -Caveat Lector-

SkeptiNews 990904c - - - - - - - - - - - All The News That's Fit To Question

: Passages starting with ':' are editorial comments to provoke discussion.
: Nothing contained herein is ever endorsed for truth, accuracy or meaning.
: No inconsistencies were expunged during the production of this bulletin.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

# Deadly, Insect-Borne Virus Hits New York. An unprecedented outbreak of
  mosquito-borne encephalitis has hit New York City, claiming at least one
  life and making more than 30 other people sick. Run for your life! Flee!
  Flee! http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/19990904/sc/health_newyork_1.html

: What is your favorite insect-borne disease? Have you created any insect-
vectored diseases lately? Can bugs infect us with an engineered virus that
will boost intelligence, extend life, render us susceptible to mind control?
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

@ Delusional & Somatoform Disorders: An Evolutionary Hypothesis.  Delusional
  & Somatoform Disorders (DD, SD) may be psychological adaptations, evolved
  to mitigate the dangerous consequences of social exclusion & ostracism. In
  the same way that fever is a healthy reaction to infection, such disorders
  are actually healthy reactions to extreme social threats like ostracism:
  when we lived in small, kin-based groups, DD and SD would have functioned
  to combat social exclusion by closely mimicking conditions, like external
  threats or illness, where fellow group members were likely to cooperate
  and provide assistance. http://www.sscf.ucsb.edu/~hagen/dd.html

: Are you delusional? Are you obvious? Has anyone come to your assistance?
Did you go nuts by being ostracized, ridiculed, abducted/implanted, doped?
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

# Mining the Genome. (TechRev) The Human Genome Project piles up Everests of
  data. But getting new drugs out of it requires sophisticated software to
  sniff out patterns - one of the most crucial tasks of the hot field known
  as bioinformatics. http://www.techreview.com/articles/oct99/regalado.htm

: What's your favorite genetic pattern? Have you replicated it in any crop
circles yet? Is music encoded in your genes? Have you listened to y'r genes?
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

@ TRAJECTORY OF THE SUN. In the Book of Revelation, Jesus Christ refers to
  himself as the Amen (Rev 3:14. ) Amen Ra is the name of the Egyptian Sun
  God. The life of Jesus duplicates the trajectory of the Sun. Coming down
  from Aries the Ram (The Highest Point), Crucified on the constellation
  "The Southern Cross" on Dec. 21st, entombed in the bowels of the earth, 3
  days and 3 nights on Dec, 22, 23 & 24 (Winter Solstice), Born Again on Dec
  25th. Out of the constellation Virgo (The Virgin) returning to the highest
  point Aries ( Spring Equinox), in the northern sky sitting at the right
  hand (Eastern Sky) and summer comes. In addition, in the Bible, Jesus dies
  and there is an eclipse and he rises at Sun Rise and his day is Sun Day.
  He is the Sun God. http://www.hiddenmeanings.com/hidden.html#TRAJECTORY

: Do you worship the sun? Does the sun worship you? How about other suns? Do
all stars have associated deities? Do they talk with each other? Are they a
gang, a committee, a disputatious mob, a clusterfuck, a conspiracy, a band?
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

# Russian Space Junk or Major UFO Event? Although a rash of UFO sightings
  reported recently would seem to be evidence of a major wave of unexplained
  paranormal activity, at least one researcher has warned investigators to
  check their facts before jumping to conclusions. Not that anyone bothers
  with verification anyway... http://www.space.com/area51/sep_sighting.html

: To which conclusions do you prefer to jump? Do you jump head-first, feet-
first, sideways, rolled up in a ball, randomly? Are Space Junkies better or
worse than other junkies? Are you spaced? Should you be? Do aliens laugh??
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

# Gravity Measured by Dropping Atoms. Galileo once dropped stones from the
  Leaning Tower of Pisa to show that objects of different sizes fall at the
  same rate under Earth's gravity. More than 400 years later, researchers
  say they got the same result by dropping atoms. The findings confirm that
  the rate at which something falls is independent of its mass - whether it
  be an atom or chunk of glass used in modern experiments or a rock dropped
  from a tilting building in Italy. Jump off the roof and see for yourself.
  http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/19990827/sc/dropping_atoms_2.html

@ AntiGravity Propulsion Experiments. A number of experiments have been per-
  formed over the last several years, which have seemingly shown some form
  of gravity control or closely related phenomena. A practical AntiGravity
  propulsion system? http://members.tripod.com/~antigravitypower/exper.html

: Does gravity work for you? Have you built any antigravity devices lately?
Do they work? Have you dropped anything la

Re: [CTRL] five cases link

[Smart News]

 -Caveat Lector-

Sorry, I sent the wrong link yesterday. This is the correct link for the THE
LAW and MIND CONTROL - A LOOK AT THE LAW AND GOVERMENT MIND CONTROL
THROUGH FIVE CASES

Sincerely,   Neil Brick

http://members.aol.com/smartnews/fivecases.htm

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
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and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
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Om

[CTRL] Skeptic News - Saturday #2

[ric carter]

said was, " The Kingdom Of Uranus
  is at hand," and we are witnesses to its changing power. Keep watching.
  http://www.hiddenmeanings.com/hidden.html#KINGDOM

: Does Uranus upset you, shake you up, turn you upside down? Are you ready
for the Kingdom of Uranus? Do you worship Uranus? Does Uranus worship you?
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

SkeptiBriefs:

# Dinosaur Find In Canada's North. Researchers say they have found dinosaur
  footprints believed to be over 65 million years old in Canada's north.
  http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/19990904/sc/canada_dinosaurs_1.html

# Latest Ozone Hole Weaker Than '98. The "ozone hole" over the Antarctic is
  expected to grow this year to around twice the size of Europe, but it is
  weaker than last year because polar winds have eased. Have a nice tan.
  http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/19990901/sc/un_ozone_layer_1.html

# US Space Shuttle Fleet Grounded. NASA's fleet of space shuttles, grounded
  as inspectors inch their way thru trouble-plagued wiring on each orbiter,
  will not carry out further missions until mid-October at the earliest.
  http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/19990904/sc/space_shuttle_1.html

# Experts Search for Water in Space. Having found water in a 4.5 billion-
  year-old meteorite, NASA scientists are searching for more that may have
  been overlooked in other space rocks. Perrier is bidding on the franchise.
  http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/19990827/sc/meteorite_water_1.html
# Also: Scientists Examine Meteorite Water
  http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/19990827/sc/space_water_2.html
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

  "We're all on the road to Eternity
   Stuck in the breakdown lane to Eternity
   Just a little ways more to Eternity-eee..."
   http://www.sonic.net/~ric/music/mysongs4.htm#eter

* http://skepticon.da.ru (updated) * ICQ# 19633976 * FAX: 603-415-3736
* email INFO or SUBSCRIBE SKEPTICHAT to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
* SkeptiChat/SkeptiNews archives: http://skeptifiles.da.ru (belated)
* Fringe * Science * Faith * Sex/Drugs * UFO/PSI/Y2K * Conspiracy *

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
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Om

[CTRL] NEWMAN SUPPRESSED TECHNOLOGY.

[ASu2431426]

 -Caveat Lector-

The world has been waiting for decades for NEWMAN to allow independent
verification of his technology  The key is INDEPENDENT VERIFICATION..

We have recommended for years in FTIR that Newman take his technologydown to
the University of Arizona  Engineering  Department for evaluation..

Until this is done the Newman technology  cannot be described as "suppressed"
and there is NO conspiracy, except in Joseph Newmans mind/

In fact the National Institute of Standards did run tests.  The results were
negative..


ANTONY  C SUTTON  FUTURE TECHNOLOGY INTELLIGENCE REPORT

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
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Om

[CTRL] Fwd: UNDERNEWS Sep 4

[William Shannon]

UNDERNEWS
Sam Smith
September 4, 1999
The Progressive Review
1739 Conn. Ave. NW Washington  DC 20009
202-232-5544 Fax: 202-234-6222

E-MAIL: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
INDEX: http://prorev.com
RECENT UNDERNEWS: http://prorev.com/indexa.htm
TODAY'S HEADLINE NEWS: http://prorev.com/altnews.htm
THE REVIEW FORUM: http://prorev.com/letters.com
DONATIONS AND ORDER FORM: http://prorev.com/order3.htm
UNSUBSCRIBE: Reply with 'unsubscribe' in the subject line.

For a free subscription to our e-mail updates send your postal address with
zip code. Copyright 1999, The Progressive Review. Matter  not independently
copyrighted may be reprinted provided TPR is paid your normal reprint fees,
if any, and is given proper credit.

Because of its quantity, TPR's mail is not always answered, but it is always
read. The editor is cheered or remorseful as appropriate and posts some of
the more interesting messages at http://prorev.com/letters.htm

--

EDITOR RETURNS TO SCENE OF CRIME

Your editor is now back in town after an interesting ride aboard the
Bridgeport-Port Jefferson ferry during which he, his wife, and a crew member
were trapped for 40 minutes inside a hot, unventilated, 5x8 steel box
parading as an elevator. We were eventually freed by a force of a large crow
bar. Long Island has never looked so good.

BRITISH COCAINE USE SOARS

OBSERVER, LONDON: Cocaine has become Britain's fastest growing
"recreational" drug among 20-years-olds, according to results published by
the British Crime Survey. For the first time, the survey, which is based on
interviews with 10,000 people, shows that a majority of the population - 52
% - says they have experimented with illegal drugs at least once. The number
of 20-24 year olds who admit using cocaine in the last year has more than
doubled   The Home Office survey also reveals that smoking cannabis
continues to prove extremely popular with the young, with an increase from
25% to 29% between 1996 and 1998 of those under 30 who say they have used it
in the last year  The official survey confirms that drug abuse is
relatively uncommon among adults and is generally confined to a short period
of experimentation in the mid to late-teens.

PROZAC DANGER

GUARDIAN, LONDON: Prozac, the anti-depressant taken by millions, was known
by its manufacturers as a possible cause of agitation leading to suicidal
tendencies as long ago as 1978, according to documents released in the US
civil courts  The Eli Lilly papers, which chronicle the company's
concerns over the restless state of mind of some patients during clinical
trials, were produced during a case in Hawaii, the first of some 200 in the
US alleging links between Prozac, violence and suicide, to have come to a
verdict. The case concerned a couple who retired to Hawaii from California
in 1989. Finding it hard to adjust to the changes in his life, Bill Forsyth
saw a doctor and was prescribed Prozac for a mixed depressive anxiety
disorder. At first Mr. Forsyth said he felt marvelous, but within two days
he was imploring his son and wife to get him into a psychiatric hospital.
Soon after he returned home, he stabbed his wife June to death and impaled
himself on a kitchen knife  The family's lawyers argued in court that
Eli Lilly had known for years that patients on Prozac, which was launched in
1988, could suddenly become akathisic - a strange, restless and agitated
state of mind in which they can get compulsions to commit violence on other
people and themselves [The lawyers] cited internal minutes from the Prozac
development team in August 1978 which ran: "There have been a fairly large
number of reports of adverse reactions... Another depressed patient
developed psychosis... Akathisia and restlessness were reported in some
patients."

The authorities in Germany, considering Eli Lilly's application for a
license in 1984, were concerned. "During the treatment with the preparation
[Prozac], 16 suicide attempts were made, two of these with success. As
patients with a risk of suicide were excluded from the studies, it is
probable this high proportion can be attributed to an action of the
preparation." Prozac now carries a warning in Germany of a risk of suicide.

MORE STORIES FROM THE GUARDIAN AND OBSERVER
http://www.prorev.com/altnews.htm

WACO MASSACRE

THE OKLAHOMAN: It was April 1994, a year after the Branch Davidian standoff
ended in disaster, when Bob Ricks had his chance to quiz Attorney General
Janet Reno. He had finished his job as chief FBI spokesman during the 51-day
siege outside Waco, Texas, but it still bothered him that the Justice
Department later ordered agents, he said, not to speak about the operation.
Reno was in Oklahoma City to promote a congressional crime bill and met with
employees of the local FBI office. "I said, 'You probably don't realize it,
but in the Midwest, Waco is still extremely a big deal out here, and it's
the subject of much conversation. As you know

Re: [CTRL] Fw: Waco's Little Rock Connection

[Bill]

 -Caveat Lector-

Yeah they were 3 of the 50 or so mysterious deaths
surrounding Clintons immediate administration...he is a
remoreseless killer as they all are...when people become
assets of the world banking industry through a paper money
swindle/debtors society, then overpopulation is encouraged
as a means to profit...this includes drastic depopulation
through wars and all that.  Your point is well taken here.
Thanks...B

"Theodor Parada, MD" wrote:
>
>  -Caveat Lector-
>
> Does anyone recall that 3 of the 4 ATF agents that were assigned to Billie
> Boy Clinton during his presidential campaign in 92, died in the waco
> raid!!! what a coincidence! When it walks like a duck, and quacks like
> a duck, it's a duck!!
>
>  Waco's Little Rock connection
> > > September 3, 1999
> > > Joseph Farah
> > >
> > > Finally, there's some finger-pointing going on in the executive branch of the
> > > federal government over the exterminations of more than 70 men, women
> > > and children at the Branch Davidian church in Waco in 1993.
> > >
> > > It's about time. This is progress. But we won't be any closer to holding the
> > > guilty accountable until the White House connections are fully explored.
> > > There's ample reason to believe Bill Clinton was working behind the scenes
> > > on engineering the initial Waco raid even before he became president.
> > >
> > > One of the original witnesses against the Branch Davidians was Bill Buford,
> > > the agent in charge of the Little Rock, Ark., branch of the Bureau of Alcohol,
> > > Tobacco and Firearms. Buford was, also, according to Arkansas sources,
> > > a friend of Bill. The Waco case was apparently very important to Buford as
> > > an affidavit states he was working on New Year's Day calling former Branch
> > > Davidians seeking to find evidence of sexual abuse.
> > >
> > > My friend and colleague, Andy Beal, who first explored the Little Rock
> > > connection to Waco, asks a good question: What was the resident agent
> > > in charge of the Little Rock office of the BATF doing investigating a sex abuse
> > > case in Texas? Is sex abuse BATF's jurisdiction? Is Texas under the jurisdiction
> > > of the BATF's Arkansas office?
> > >
> > > Documents show Buford is noted as one of two "senior raid planners." He
> > > was also one of the BATF agents wounded during the Feb. 28 assault, but
> > > he is perhaps the only BATF agent to be visited in the hospital by none other
> > > than top Treasury Department official Roger Altman.
> > >
> > > Altman was the long-time "Friend of Bill" appointed to be deputy secretary
> > > of the Treasury and chief executive officer of the Resolution Trust Corporation.
> > > He resigned in August 1994 due to his interference in the Whitewater 
>investigation.
> > > At the time of the Waco raid, Roger Altman was the second highest-ranking
> > > official at the Department of the Treasury. The BATF is a bureau within the
> > > Treasury Department.
> > >
> > > Is it not possible -- is it not likely, knowing what we know about the character
> > > of the Clinton administration today -- that the Clinton transition team was
> > > involved in the planning of the initial raid on Waco even before taking power?
> > > Remember, Vincent Foster's wife claimed he blamed himself for the deaths
> > > in Waco. Webster Hubbell, who became the point man between the Justice
> > > Department and White House during the siege, was also instrumental in
> > > that transition to power. Then there's Altman and Buford.
> > >
> > > Foster, Hubbell, Altman and Buford were all in Little Rock leading up to the
> > > inauguration. Clinton takes power Jan. 20, 1993. One month later, the BATF
> > > stages the largest and most dramatic raid in its history -- videotaped in living
> > > color in anticipation of its success in subduing religious non-conformists in
> > > possession of illegal guns.
> > >
> > > The injustice and illegality of the initial raid has still never been fully 
>examined.
> > > Today the focus is on how and why the remaining occupants of the church
> > > building were exterminated in a fire. Yet, the equally puzzling question of why
> > > a dynamic and violent entry was necessary to serve a search warrant on
> > > David Koresh shortly after he went target shooting with officers of the BATF.
> > > The local sheriff offered to serve the warrant at the general store to avoid any
> > > confrontation. There was simply no need for all the deadly theatrics of the
> > > initial raid.
> > >
> > > The only reasonable explanation seems to be the one proffered by the
> > > documentary, "Waco: Rules of Engagement," which postulates that the
> > > raid was intended as a public relations effort by the BATF and a commercial
> > > for stricter gun control enforcement.
> > >
> > > There are many unanswered questions when it comes to Waco. But maybe
> > > now it's time to start asking some of the unasked questions.
> > >
> > > What was the involvement in Waco planning of key C

Re: [CTRL] Fw: Should we trust the government?

[Bill]

 -Caveat Lector-

It all makes perfect sense, expressed in dollars and cents,
pounds shillings and pence...

Moslem or Christian, Mullah or Pope, Preacher or Poet, who
was it wrote: Give any one species too much rope and they'll
f*** it UP?
Roger Waters
Amused to Death
What God WantsGod Gets.  God help us all.
B

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>  -Caveat Lector-
>
> The short answer to this is; "Fuck no."
> Having said that, a bigger question begs to be asked.  How can anyone even
> ask the question in the first place?
> How many times do you have to be lied to, beaten, have your rights violated,
> be taxed to death, be consigned to prison for using your constitutional
> rights, be set up, have your door busted in at 2:00 AM to take your "drugs",
> have pyrotechnic grenades thrown at you and your family and friends, be
> denied the exercise of your religious rights, be stopped and searched just
> 'cause your black, be subject to police beatings, and etc., before you
> finally have to say enough is enough, point made?
>
> DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
> ==
> CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
> screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
> and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
> frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
> spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
> gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
> be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
> nazi's need not apply.
>
> Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
> 
> Archives Available at:
> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html
>
> http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
> 
> To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
> SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
> SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Om

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
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SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om

Re: [CTRL] GI Cop/Paramilitary/MC

[Jabr 333]

 -Caveat Lector-

This article on paramilitary elements in police departments interested me a
great deal -- I wish the author had published it in a credible news source
like a known newspaper.  And I would like to know more about her sources.  As
I ran into -- without initially knowledge about -- a Canadian
(Toronto-London-Detroit) paramilitary unit back in 1992 -- in New England.
This group and its "Arian" members (strange group of men I will say and other
creatures possibly) had "police" and U.S. Washington DC connections
throughout the entire eastern seaboard.  And they traveled frequently from
city to city in the U.S. staging stalking wars with new weapons on
individuals who were targeted.  They wound up targeting me -- as well as at
least one other pretty woman from Manhattan.  Their crime turf was Long
Island, Manhattan, NJ, upper NY state, some of PA and DC.  They also
traveled, in a pack via cars, throughout the SW into Mexico and Central
America -- ostensibly going after "drug" lord people.  They took JOBS, like
hit jobs on people -- usually individuals -- I understood later -- and they
acted like middle men -- between connections to get people.  This way the
trail was harder to prosecute and target them.  Plus, the police everywhere,
appeared to bow to their presence.  These men would laugh about police and
how they covered their tracks.

People so targeted with mind control tactics, implants and surveillance
strategies need to consider that an element which may be actually staging the
assaults is probably paramilitary.  These groups are not a joke.  They are
extremely violent.  And they are probably the main arm of the U.S. govt in
using people in black projects.  And they know how to make money on people
who are targeted by other groups too.

I have accused one of the leaders of this paramilitary group in court of
staging the stalking violence on me.  But, these men have carte blanche in
the U.S. as far as setting these scenarios up on people -- realize.  They
accept gifts for payments often not money.  They can't be easily prosecuted
outside of the U.S. -- so the U.S. citizenry are their prey.  And easy prey
at that.

Last, what the paramilitary guys are actually DOING is another question with
the black projects.  Because it isn't just hit jobs on individuals that they
get away with.  They are tied into some very bizarre projects with the CIA
and probably with pimps - and it is NOT your garden variety situation of drug
selling.  Some very bizarre new technologies, possibly new means of travel,
transportation, and transformation of species may be involved in this thing.
I am convinced that they are using wind tunnel, vortexes -- for transport or
somethin' -- or that the govt is and that mind control victim's residences
are probably part of this scheme.


Judith







In a message dated 9/1/99 8:15:01 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

> Subj:   [CTRL] GI Cop
>  Date:9/1/99 8:15:01 PM Eastern Daylight Time
>  From:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Alamaine Ratliff)
>  Sender:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Conspiracy Theory Research List)
>  Reply-to:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Conspiracy
Theory Research List)
>  To:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>   -Caveat Lector-
>
>  From cato.or/pubs/briefs/bp-050es.html
>
>  <  get it >>
>
>  > Briefing Paper No. 50August 26, 1999
>  > 
>  >
>  >
>  > Warrior Cops
>  > The Ominous Growth of Paramilitarism in
>  > American Police Departments
>  >
>  > by Diane Cecilia Weber
>  >
>  > Diane Cecilia Weber is a Virginia writer on law enforcement and criminal
>  > justice.
>  >
>  > Executive Summary
>  >
>  >
>  > Over the past 20 years Congress has encouraged the U.S. military to
supply
>  > intelligence, equipment, and training to civilian police. That
> encouragement has
>  > spawned a culture of paramilitarism in American law enforcement.
>  >
>  > The 1980s and 1990s have seen marked changes in the number of state and
> local
>  > paramilitary units, in their mission and deployment, and in their
tactical
>  > armament. According to a recent academic survey, nearly 90 percent of
the
> police
>  > departments surveyed in cities with populations over 50,000 had
> paramilitary
>  > units, as did 70 percent of the departments surveyed in communities with
>  > populations under 50,000. The Pentagon has been equipping those units
with
>  > M-16s, armored personnel carriers, and grenade launchers. The police
>  > paramilitary units also conduct training exercises with active duty Army
> Rangers
>  > and Navy SEALs.
>  >
>  > State and local police departments are increasingly accepting the
military
> as a
>  > model for their behavior and outlook. The sharing of training and
> technology is
>  > producing a shared mindset. The problem is that the mindset of the
soldier
> is
>  > simply not appropriate for the civilian police officer. Police officers
> confront
>  > not an “enemy” but individuals who are protected by the Bill of Rights.
>  > Conf

[CTRL] NOW: WACO HEARINGS ON C-SPAN (fwd)

[MICHAEL SPITZER]

 -Caveat Lector-

Channel 350 (CSP-1) on DSS is airing the congressional hearing on
WAKO from 7/26/95 from 10:00 to 3:45 California time today
(9/4/99). Talking are the FBI & ATF.

=
 Kadosh, Kadosh, Kadosh, YHVH, TZEVAOT

  FROM THE DESK OF:<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  *Mike Spitzer* <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

   The Best Way To Destroy Enemies Is To Change Them To Friends
   Shalom, A Salaam Aleikum, and to all, A Good Day.
=

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om

Re: [CTRL] Waco Spin

[Bill]

 -Caveat Lector-

What is a lawful inquiry?  Does it have anything to do with
this?

All the State Codes are exactly what their titles indicate
them to be:
codes. They are written by and for those of the ruling
system, in the system's language, with loaded meanings, for
self-serving and
fraudulent purposes. All federal and state courts are
private commercial
bankruptcy tribunals collecting from the citizens (assets)
to pay on the Chapter 11 reorganization brought about by
bankrupting the US through the paper-money banking-swindle.
Codes are the private "law" used in the bankruptcy
tribunals. As codes, they must be deciphered, which is the
function of special decoders called "attorneys." who write
the codes (all of which, in the US, are copyrighted
private law owned by foreign corporations, mostly British,
such as Lord
Thompson of the Thompson Group, Montreal) and are the only
persons authorized to cross the bar and "practice" the
private commercial maze of deliberate deceit falsely called
"law." ...


Sean McDougal wrote:
>
>  -Caveat Lector-
>
> Original Message Follows
> From: William Shannon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> You want WACO SPIN???
> How about Koresh was a pedophile, a Christian KOOK, and a fella' who REFUSED
> a lawful inquiry...
> let us not deify this douche-bag...he's not worthy!
>
> --
> sounds personaleither you had a hands on role in the case, or you knew
> Koresh personally, or you are spewing cow puckey.
>
> which is it?
>
> __
> Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
>
> DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
> ==
> CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
> screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
> and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
> frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
> spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
> gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
> be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
> nazi's need not apply.
>
> Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
> 
> Archives Available at:
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DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

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Om

Re: [CTRL] Fw: Waco's Little Rock Connection

[Bill]

 -Caveat Lector-

If an alien in a duck suit doesn't bite your ass is it still
real?

Ric Carter wrote:
>
>  -Caveat Lector-
>
> - Original Message -
> From: Theodor Parada, MD <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> > When it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's a duck!!
>
> Or it's an alien in a duck suit.
>
> DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
> ==
> CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
> screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
> and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
> frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
> spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
> gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
> be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
> nazi's need not apply.
>
> Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
> 
> Archives Available at:
> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html
>
> http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
> 
> To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
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>
> To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
> SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Om

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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[CTRL] Fwd: CORROBORATIVE INFO FROM THE JOURNAL OF APPLIED PHYSICS

[Kris Millegan]

CORROBORATIVE INFO FROM THE JOURNAL OF APPLIED PHYSICS

IT HAS COME TO OUR ATTENTION THAT A RESEARCH REPORT PUBLISHED IN THE
JOURNAL OF APPLIED PHYSICS (Volume 77, Issue 11, June 1, 1995, pages
6015-6020) PUBLISHED BY THE AMERICAN INSTITUTE OF PHYSICS, FURTHER
VALIDATES THE PIONEERING WORK OF INVENTOR JOSPEPH NEWMAN.

TITLE:
Increased Voltage Phenomenon in a Resonance Circuit of Unconventional
Magnetic Configuration

PREFACE:
The behavior of an ICR (inductance-capacitance-resistance) circuit with a
moveable ferromagnetic core is discussed.  The core is attracted by a
magnetic field generated by an electric current resulting from the
discharge of a capacitor in the closed ICR circuit.  An unusual increase in
recharge voltage, which was dependent on the magnetic configuration of the
coil, was observed.  This voltage increase does not conform to the
mathematical simulation of the system.  The possibility that a positive
electromotive force was involved in this effect is discussed.

--
The following is a particularly interesting statement from this article:
--

"Generally speaking, it is expected that the total recharge voltage will
decrease because this system produces mechanical output as the core moves.
However, through a series of experiments, it was discovered that results
depend on the magnetic configuration of the coils used in the circuit.  In
other words, for a certain kind of magnetic field, the opposite result
could occur --- an increase in the average current and recharge voltage. To
confirm the above observations, an experiment was conducted, which is
described in this article."

--
The following was one of the final conclusions presented in this article:
--

"It can be postulated that the complex movement of magnetic flux generates
a positive EMF, but the cause of the voltage increase is not clear."

--

Through his research over the past 30 years and as demonstrated in his
numerous experiments and working prototypes, Joseph Newman has presented a
comprehensive explanation for the cause of the "voltage increase" described
in the above article.  I urge the reader to locate a copy of this research
article from the Journal of Applied Physics, published by the American
Institute of Physics, and review it for yourself.

THE ENERGY MACHINE OF JOSEPH NEWMAN
11445 East Via Linda, No. 416
Scottsdale, Arizona 85259
(480) 657-3722


email:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]



"I cannot conceive curved lines of force without the conditions of a
physical existence in that intermediate space."  --- MICHAEL FARADAY

[CTRL] Fwd: A NEW PARADIGM, Part II of II.

[Kris Millegan]

A NEW PARADIGM, Part II of II.

Now, what does Fleming's Rule state?

Fleming's Rule states:  "If the fingers of the right hand are placed around
a current-carrying wire so that the thumb points in the direction of the
conventional current, the fingers will point in the direction of the
magnetic field."

Great.  This is a convenient "rule."  It is a corroborable-by-observation
"rule."  Great.  Electrical engineers are aware (presumably) of this Rule.

But accepting the limited paradigm of the Rule does not answer the more
fundamental question:  What *MECHANICALLY* causes the Rule to be true?

This is the more fundamental question that occupied Joseph Newman's mind
during the 1960s.  He sought an honest answer to this more fundamental
question as to what is the *MECHANICAL* cause of Fleming's Rule.  He could
not find an answer to this question in any of the books that he read on
electromagnetics and electrical engineering.  Yet he believed it was
absolutely essential to answer this question, if he was to progress in a
deeper understanding of the fundamental *MECHANICAL* nature of
(electro)magnetic fields [per Faraday's and Maxwell's statements above].

It was about this time in his studies that he began studying the GYROSCOPE.
He had heard that the "gyroscope" was a stabilizer, but did not know much
more about its nature.  As a hobby, he began mechanically working with
gyroscopes and children's bicycles (he converted the bicycle of a
neighbor's son to a clutch system to better enable it to perform
"wheelies") --- so he began to acquire a first-hand understanding of the
behavior of GYROSCOPES.

At one point in this process, he _instantly_ had an answer to the question
that had "boggled his mind" for so long:  he _instantly_ knew that those
"somethings" in that magnetic field surrounding Faraday's Generator
individually behaved as miniature "GYROSCOPES."

Many related concepts then began to "click" in him mind.  It was then that
his real insights into the _mechanical_ nature of (electro)magnetic fields
began to generate a new paradigm concerning such fields.

As he explains in detail in Chapter Two of his book:
[Note: I will endeavor to describe only in words what is graphically and
with words depicted step-by-step in the book.]

1-A) If one has North and South ends of magnets facing one another with a
gap between them (as in Faraday's Generator), if one moves a conductor DOWN
at a right angle to the magnetic field, the CURRENT FLOW MOVES LEFT.
(Figure 11-A)

1-B) If one applies a downward force to the axis of a spinning gyroscope,
it will pivot at a right angle to the force (in this case of Figure 11-A1)
it will PIVOT LEFT.  Now imagine that this gyroscope has a forward motion
at the speed of light as well as spins at the speed of light.

2-A) If one has North and South ends of magnets facing one another with a
gap between them (as in Faraday's Generator), if one moves a conductor UP
at a right angle to the magnetic field, the CURRENT FLOW MOVES RIGHT.
(Figure 11-B)

2-B) If one applies a upward force to the axis of a spinning gyroscope, it
will pivot at a right angle to the force (in this case of Figure 11-B1) it
will PIVOT RIGHT and opposite to the case of 1-B above.  Now imagine that
this gyroscope has a forward motion at the speed of light as well as spins
at the speed of light.

3-A) Now flip the above-described magnets over 180 degrees:
If one has a South and North magnet facing one another with a gap between
them (as in Faraday's Generator), if one moves a conductor DOWN at a right
angle to the magnetic field, the CURRENT FLOW MOVES RIGHT and opposite to
that of case 1-A even though the force direction is the same. (Figure 11-C)

3-B) Now flip the above-described gyroscope over 180 degrees:
If one applies a downward force to the axis of a spinning gyroscope, it
will pivot at a right angle to the force (in this case of Figure 11-C1) it
will PIVOT RIGHT and opposite to the case of 1-B above even though the
force direction is the same.  Now imagine that this gyroscope has a forward
motion at the speed of light as well as spins at the speed of light.

4-A) With the magnets in the same position as 3-A,
If one has a South and North magnet facing one another with a gap between
them (as in Faraday's Generator), if one moves a conductor UP at a right
angle to the magnetic field, the CURRENT FLOW MOVES LEFT and opposite to
that of case 2-A even though the force directon is the same. (Figure 11-D)

4-B) With the gyroscope in the same position as 3-B,
If one applies a upward force to the axis of a spinning gyroscope, it will
pivot at a right angle to the force (in this case of Figure 11-D1) it will
PIVOT LEFT and opposite to the case of 2-B above even though the force
direction is the same.  Now imagine that this gyroscope has a forward
motion at the speed of light as well as spins at the speed of light.

5-A) With the magnets in the same position as 3-A,
Move the conductor vigorously "up" and "down" through

[CTRL] Fwd: A NEW PARADIGM, Part I of II.

[Kris Millegan]

A NEW PARADIGM, Part I of II.

As a young man, Joseph Newman _did_ question "certain things (that) have
unequivocally been observed to be so" --- after all, this is one of the
principal ways in which new scientific understandings of the universe can
occur, by questioning "the accepted explanations" of a given paradigm.

I will pose the following three questions:

1) Why is it that one can move a conductor in one hand physically through
the magnetic field of Faraday's Generator, and the (electro)magnetic field
'propagates along the conductor' somewhat faster than the original movement
of the conductor (held in your hand) through the magnetic field?

2) How would you mechanically and fundamentally explain Fleming's Rule?

3) How would you mechanically and fundamentally explain Magnetic Attraction
and Repulsion?

Question No. 1:

Joseph Newman was raised as a "hard-nosed country boy" (to employ the
colloquialism) --- as such, he did _NOT_ believe in getting "something for
nothing" . sometimes referred to as "perpetual motion."  His mind
instinctively rebelled against such a notion.

Yet, when he observed that one's motion (slow) of one's hand holding a
conductor wire and moving it through a magnetic field (in a particular
orientation) produces an electric field (very fast) along the same
conductor, this superficially appeared to him to be a case of one obtaining
"something (very fast) for nothing (slow)."  He refused to believe this
could be the case since he did not believe in "perpetual motion."  He chose
to investigate further.

Through his studies it became obvious that "something" was ALREADY moving
(very fast) in that (electro)magnetic field, and this (very fast)
"something" was simply being DEFLECTED onto the conductor as it moved
(slowly) through the magnetic field.

This conclusion answered his first question.  If he has the attitude of
some conventionally-educated scientists he would just leave it at that and
be satisfied.

He opted to question further.

What was the precise nature of this "something"?

Also, this question:  does this "something" have a MECHANICAL nature?

Well two of the greatest minds of the last 200 years believed that it DID.

Their names:

Michael Faraday (the mechanical genius)   and

James Clerk Maxwell (the mathematical genius)

I believe I can say that Joseph Newman would prefer to "stand on the
shoulders" of these two great men rather than operationally accept the
status quo and "lounge on the postulations of some conventionally-educated,
present-day scientists."

[I should add that there are certainly those in the teaching profession who
are indeed exceptions to the above -- such teachers who are truly curious,
rational, and intellectually honest.]

And what did these two men state?:

Well, Michael Faraday wrote:

"I cannot conceive curved lines of force without the conditions of a
PHYSICAL existence in that intermediate space."  --- MICHAEL FARADAY

and

"How few understand the PHYSICAL lines of force!  They will not see them,
yet all the researches on the subject tend to confirm the views I put forth
many years since.  Thompson of Glasgow seems almost the only one who
acknowledges them.  He is perhaps the nearest to understanding what I
meant.  I am content to wait convinced as I am of the truth of my views."
--- MICHAEL FARADAY

And what does James Clerk Maxwell have to say on this subject:

"In speaking of the Energy of the field, however, I wish to be understood
LITERALLY.  All energy is the same as MECHANICAL ENERGY, whether it exists
in the form of motion or in that of elasticity, or in any other form.  The
energy in electromagnetic phenomena is _MECHANICAL_ energy."
--- JAMES CLERK MAXWELL

That's a pretty strong, rather unequivocal statement on the part of James
Clerk Maxwell.  And just so, no one might later misinterpret his remarks,
he added, with _EMPHASIS_:  "I WISH TO BE UNDERSTOOD _LITERALLY_"

Literally.

Well, literally in my book means _LITERALLY_.

And what is James Clerk Maxwell _literally_ saying about the nature of the
energy of the field:  that ALL --- ALL --- ENERGY is the __SAME__ as
*MECHANICAL ENERGY*...that all such energy in ELECTROMAGNETIC PHENOMENA
is *MECHANICAL* ENERGY.

As physicist Dr. Roger Hastings wrote regarding Maxwell's emphasis on the
*MECHANICAL* nature of energy:

"This is stated in no uncertain terms in Maxwell's book "A Dynamical Theory
of the Electromagnetic Field."  In fact, Maxwell used a dynamical model to
derive his famous equations.  This fact has all but been lost in current
books on electromagnetic theory.  The quantity which Maxwell called
"electromagnetic momentum" is now referred to as the "vector potential."

And in a reference to the work of Richard Feyman, physicist Robert Matherne
wrote:

"While reading my Commemorative Issue of The Feynman Lectures on Physics by
Feynman, Leighton, and Sands, published by the Add

[CTRL] Fwd: THE SPECIAL REPORT (Part B)

[Kris Millegan]

THE SPECIAL REPORT (Part B)

I submit the following from a Letter to the Editor of the Mobile Press Register:

"Never having met, talked with, nor had financial dealings with Joseph
Newman, I read his book, The Energy Machine of Joseph Newman.  After 30
years in the electrical profession I felt eminently qualified to debunk his
claim to a device that generated more energy than it consumes.  In the
second chapter, I sat up in bed and shouted, 'He's got it!'"
   --- Patrick McLain, EE, Mobile, Alabama


I don't wish to dampen Mr. McLain's enthusiasm for this technology and,
although his comments are well-intentioned, Mr. McLain is laboring under
the superficial conclusion that Joseph Newman's motor "generates more
energy than it consumes."  This is simply not the case.  In fact, the motor
does generate greater external energy output than external energy input
[EEO>EEI]. This technology does not violate the Law of Conservation of
Matter and Energy.  On the contrary -- this technology further corroborates
the Laws of Thermodynamics, i.e., the only way one will achieve the
internal production of energy within the system is by supplying the system
with high voltage (and low current) to align the copper atoms in the coil.

Joseph Newman supplies an external electrical stimulus to his coil (and
special commutator system) that generates the magnetic field containing the
gyroscopic particles (matter in motion). This external electrical stimulus
takes the form of high voltage -- and the higher the better until maximum
atom alignment of the coil is achieved.  At the same time the current is
kept as low as possible to minimize resistance; thereby the Newman motor
always runs "cool."  The externally applied high voltage is not "consumed"
by the system -- it operates in the same manner as the hydraulic system in
an automobile.  The reservoir of brake fluid is not "used up" but supplies
a continual hydraulic pressure to the automobile's brake system.  In a
similar fashion the high input voltage (and low current) acts as an
electrical 'hydraulic' pressure to continually realign the atoms within the
motor's copper coil.  The continual collapse and expansion of the copper
coil's magnetic field creates the mechanical torque of the motor.  (The
special commutator system achieves this continual collapse and expansion of
the magnetic field.)

The net increase of external electrical energy from the system directly
comes from the energy produced internally within the copper coil.  This net
energy is greater than the small amount of current originally inputed into
the system along with the high voltage.  In the final analysis where is the
excess energy coming from?  Answer:  from the atoms of the copper coil
within the motor/generator.

Dr. Roger Hastings, a physicist who has worked extensively with Joseph
Newman over a number of years, has calculated that this system is so
conversion efficient that it may take decades (or far longer) to be able to
measure any appreciable mass loss in the coil.



This brings me to a discussion of efficiency.  If Joseph Newman's
motor/generator system is viewed as a whole -- considering both external
energy and internal energy -- then the total energy output for the system
is EQUAL to the total external and internal energy input combined.



Such a process is fully in accordance with the First Law of Thermodynamics!
When the system is viewed as a whole, it is imprecise to say that the
Newman motor/generator simply "produces more than it consumes."  However,
it is correct to say that "the external energy output is greater than the
external energy input" -- an external energy input considered independently
of the large internal energy produced by the Newman motor/generator.

In other words, the revolutionary nature of this system is the fact that
Joseph Newman has discovered a new electromagnetic principle of nature and
has innovated a technology capable of converting matter (copper coil) into
energy (in accordance with E=mc^2) via a highly efficient electromagnetic
reaction rather than an inefficient fission reaction.

Those who state that "one can never build a device which exceeds 100%
efficiency" do not understand the nature of the phenomenal efficiencies (in
excess of 800%) produced by the Newman motor/generator.

Such a statement demonstrates an inability to distinguish between
CONVERSION efficiency and PRODUCTION efficiency.  To state that Joseph
Newman's motor/generator is 8.2 production efficient, i.e., that it
produces over eight times as much external energy output as external energy
input, is different from stating that the invention approaches 100%
conversion efficiency, i.e., that it converts the internal mass of the
copper coil into energy in accordance with E=mc^2.  The former process
involves production efficiency and the latter process involves conversion
efficiency.  These two diffe

[CTRL] Fwd: THE SPECIAL REPORT (Part A)

[Kris Millegan]

THE SPECIAL REPORT (Part A)

THE FOLLOWING IS A SPECIAL REPORT CONCERNING THE TECHNOLOGY OF JOSEPH NEWMAN


"A new scientific truth does not triumph by convincing its opponents and
making them see the light, but rather because its opponents eventually die,
and a new generation grows up that is familiar with it."  --  MAX PLANCK


What I am going to suggest to you in this Special Report is more than
simply 'a genuine improvement in electrical technology,' but rather a
significant paradigm shift which may challenge some of the fundamental
beliefs held today in electrical theory.  While I don't know you
personally, I am hoping that you, the reader, possess the gift of
intellectual honesty, i.e., a willingness to look at the facts regardless
of one's predispositions and/or prejudices.

My personal background is history and science, and I have devoted the past
twenty years to studying the history of physics -- especially with regard
to invention and the great difficulties major innovators have had in
presenting their achievements to society.  In many instances the history of
physics (science) has taught me that "the greater the innovation -- the
greater the resistance."  This is very unfortunate for the progress of
humanity.

I am hoping that the independence of your thinking will give you the
freedom to view a new technology, a new paradigm -- with the
open-mindedness and intellectual honesty of Planck's 'new generation.'

Allow me to present to you a sterling example of "intellectual dishonesty":
this brief story involves a young upstart thinker by the name of Galileo
Galilei and a most distinguished Professor of Philosophy at Padua
University by the name of Cesare Cremonini.  One may ask today, "Who is
Cesare Cremonini?"  Yet four hundred years ago, Cremonini was the
well-known and famous professor and Galileo Galilei was a virtually unknown
original thinker.

Once upon a time (so the story goes), this young thinker Galileo claimed to
have discovered "mountains on the moon" by virtue of the utilization of a
new tool called the telescope.  Naively believing that other thinkers and
professors would welcome this discovery, Galileo invited professor
Cremonini to view these moon mountains for himself through the telescope.

Cremonini chided Galileo for his insanity since, as everyone knows, "the
moon cannot contain protuberances or blemishes since Aristotle has said
that the moon is a perfect sphere."  Galileo replied, "I don't care what
Aristotle said, simply come look through my telescope and see for
yourself."  "No, Galileo, my young friend," responded Cremonini, "I KNOW
that there are no mountains on the moon."  Professor Cremonini then opened
the book of Aristotle to the appropriate page and 'proved' that Galileo
could not possibly be correct.

But Galileo was insistent.  "If you just look through the telescope you
will see that Aristotle was incorrect," he said to Cremonini.  Then
Professor Cremonini responded by saying, "No Galileo, I will NOT look
through that confounded tube of yours.  But IF I did look and if I DID see
mountains on the moon, then I would know that you have simply enchanted
me."  This, dear reader, is intellectual dishonesty.



I am asking you, the reader, in this Special Report to be willing to "look
through the tube."  And the "tube" here represents a new understanding of
electromagnetism.



You may ask, "How could this be so?"  One may maintain that in a
post-Faraday electrical society, everything that can be known about
electromagnetism is known.  In response to this position, I ask that you
consider the quotation of Charles H. Duell, Director of the Patent Office
in 1899:

"Everything that can be invented has been invented."

But before I present an introduction to the new technology in question,
permit me to introduce its inventor -- Joseph W. Newman.  [In my study of
the history of science, I have discovered a passion for biography, i.e., by
knowing something of the inventor one acquires a much greater depth,
richness and appreciation for the significance of the innovation.  In
addition, biographies allow the reader to learn something of the personal
struggles of the great thinkers and inventors of history.]

Who is Joseph Newman?  He is an original thinker who has educated himself
over the past forty years in physics, chemistry, astronomy and many other
areas which have intrigued him.  The focus of his life has become his work
in electromagnetics which he began developing over thirty years ago.  And
he is not a starry-eyed theoretician.  Since he has made his living by
inventing, he has discovered a need to remain grounded in reality, in
practical applications of his concepts.



These quotations are from scientists who have endorsed Joseph Newman's work:

"The future of the human race may be dramatically uplifted by the
large-scale, commercia

[CTRL] Fwd: Kosovo Conspiracy Theory/USS Gonzalez Status

[Kris Millegan]

The following website has alternative theory about Kosovo:

http://www.truthinmedia.org/Kosovo/Peace/ps38.html

===
Per the Internet rumors of early June 1999 that the USS Gonzalez was hit and
perhaps even sunk during the Yugoslavian War:

The USS Gonzalez website has been down from May 1999 until sometime over the
past week.  It is now working again.   The dates on the website pages are
Pre- and early Yugoslovian war, circa March 1999. When I went to the
website, for the first time,  I recieved a defense department warning page
before entering the site.  The title page for the site shows a rather eery
ghosted view of the ship in an unseemly and unnatural picture.   The title
for the page is "BEYOND THE CALL" which implies men who went beyond the call
of duty.   This is odd for a brand new ship that merely fires tomahawk
missiles at onshore targets, as very few abnormal and 'beyond the call'
duties are required.   Unless the crew was exposed to harm in some way.  This
would be the type of Website one would put up for 'signaling' without saying
what really happened.

My premise is that if this ship was truly hit during the Yugoslavian War, and
if there were heavy casualties,  then this is further proof that a ship's
crew can be silenced.

We have heard over and over again from Pro-Navy pundits that if the Navy were
involved in the cause of TWA 800, that one could not silence a whole ship's
crew.

Furthermore, if the USS Gonzalez DDG 66 were hit, it also may provide
evidence that the Navy needs to overhaul and rethink their strategy for using
Aegis Missile Destroyers in littoral warfare environments.They are
dangerously vulnerable for a technology that was designed during the darkness
of the Cold War.   Further cover-up of this vulnerability for political and
financial reasons may mean that our men and women who serve in harms way may
be very vulnerable to attack during the next conflict.

For further detailed information regarding the USS Gonzalez,  do an LSoft
Flight 800 search of my postings on this matter several months ago.

Best Regards,

Marshall Houston
Dallas, Texas

http://www.spear.navy.mil/ships/ddg66/

USS GONZALEZ (DDG66)
"BEYOND THE CALL"

USS GONZALEZ (DDG 66) Mailing Address:
USS GONZALEZ (DDG 66)
FPO AE 09570-1284
24-Hour Careline:  1-800-890-0548

E-MAIL Addresses:
Commanding Officer:   CDR Joseph W. Murphy
Executive Officer:LCDR Yvette C. BrownWahler
Command Master Chief: EMCM(SW) Mark D. Groomes
Approved by CDR J. W. MurphyLast Updated: 02/03/99
==
USS Gonzalez News Release Directory URL:

http://www.spear.navy.mil/ships/ddg66/press_release.htm
News Release Directory

News Releases

2/17/99
A Day in the Life
1/21/99
After A Relaxing Stay In Gibraltar, Gonzalez Sailors Set Sail
1/14/99
USS GONZALEZ (DDG 66) Trans-Atlantic Crossing
1/20/99
USS GONZALEZ (DDG 66) Visits Gibraltar, United Kingdom

USS GONZALEZ (DDG 66)
URL: http://www.spear.navy.mil/ships/ddg66/
Revised: March 11, 1999.
==
The USS Gonzalez was launched on February 18, 1995 and commissioned after TWA
800 in October 1996:
===
http://www.usosouthtexas.com/gonzalez.htm

The Medal of Honor Posthumously to Sgt. Alfredo Gonzalez Silver
Medallion History was made during October, 1996 at Naval Station
Ingleside, Texas when the United States Navy commissioned the USS
Gonzalez (DDG 66), and Arleigh Burke Class, guided missile destroyer.
Equipped with AEGIS weapons system and the most technologically advance
weaponry, the DDG is one of the Navy's most effective ships. Launched at
Bath Iron Works on 18 February 1995, USS Gonzalez is named in honor of
Sergeant Alfredo Gonzalez, USMC, a native of Edinburg, TX.

[CTRL] Fwd: FACTS CONCERNING THE TECHNOLOGY OF JOSEPH NEWMAN

[Kris Millegan]

FACTS CONCERNING THE TECHNOLOGY OF JOSEPH NEWMAN

1)  Over 30 experts -- physicists, nuclear engineers, electrical
engineers/technicians -- have tested Joseph Newman's energy machine (also
known as the Newman Motor/Generator) and have signed Affidavits that it
performs as indicated.

2)  Dr. Roger Hastings (Principal Physicist with Unisys) has conducted
hundreds of hours of testing on Joseph Newman's Motor/Generator and has
signed Affidavits attesting to the operability of the Newman
Motor/Generator.  Dr. Hastings states:  "The future of the human race may
be dramatically uplifted by the large scale commercial development of this
invention."  In addition, Robert J. Matherne, a physicist from Entergy
Corp, (and who was instrumental in the development of the nuclear power
plant at Taft, Louisiana), has also attested to the significance of this
new technology.

3)  Joseph Newman has constructed many operational prototypes of his
technology over the years, ranging in size from 4 pounds to 15,000 pounds.

4)  The energy machine will totally decentralize our access to energy and
will have a profound socio-economic impact upon our civilization.  The
energy generated by this machine is harmless, non-polluting, and will
replace ALL present forms of energy generation.  With the energy machine,
every consumer could make a one-time purchase of a unit that could be
installed in one's backyard and virtually unplug themselves from local
utility companies.  The energy machine could also be utilized to power all
air, land, and sea vehicles and would elminiate the polluting effects
caused by the internal combustion engine.

5)  Joseph Newman has published a book entitled THE ENERGY MACHINE OF
JOSEPH NEWMAN in which he discloses all of his theories and the technical
processes relating to the construction of his energy machine.  It is
important to Joseph Newman that this knowledge be preserved and
disseminated.

6)  Joseph Newman has been working on his concepts for over 30 years.  He
submitted his Technical Process to the U.S. Patent Office several years
before he constructed the first operational prototype of his energy
machine.

7)  The energy machine is a physical embodiment of Joseph Newman's
Technical Process. Joseph Newman hopes that someone with the requisite
ability will use his MECHANICAL innovations to formulate a MATHEMATICAL
extrapolation.  Such an accomplishment would be similiar to the manner in
which Michael Faraday's MECHANICAL work led to mathematical theories
developed by James Clerk Maxwell.  [Although Michael Faraday was
mathematically illiterate (his own words), he was a MECHANICAL genius.]

8)  The theories of Joseph Newman also represent a precise, mechanical
explanation of the phenomena of magnetism (not otherwise currently
understood) and the principle of "action at a distance."  When one
understands the nature of the energy discovered by Joseph Newman, then one
can understand how it would be possible to build a technical application
capable of harnessing such mechanical motion (energy).  As Maxwell
explicitly stated:  "The energy in electromagnetic phenomena is MECHANICAL
ENERGY" and consists of "matter in motion."  Joseph Newman describes the
fundamental mechanical essence of a magnetic field as a massergy having a
"gyroscopic spin."  This gyroscopic action is fundamental to understanding
the mechanical nature of electromagnetism.

9)  Technically-speaking, what Joseph Newman teaches is that one's goal in
the construction of one of his operational Motor/Generators is "to have the
LEAST amount of current input to create the GREATEST amount of atomic
domain alignment within the material of the conductor, thereby causing the
GREATEST magnetic field to be created."

10)  The energy machine of Joseph Newman is far more efficient than
conventional nuclear energy and does not release any harmful radiation or
emission.  This invention can be used to power the home, industry, or to
produce electrical energy for flight at a small fraction of today's cost.
As Joseph Newman states:  "The finished prototype of what I teach will
drastically change the world for the good of humanity, more so than any
invention before this time."

11)  Joseph Newman has developed a precise and fundamental mechanical
explanation for both magnetic attraction and repulsion as well as Fleming's
Rule.  An understanding of this explanation is what originally led him over
thirty years ago to began to truly understand the mechanical essence of
(electro)magnetic fields and enabled him to create an innovative technology
capable of harnessing the energy contained within these fields.


For additional information:

Joseph Newman Publishing Company
11445 East Via Linda, No. 416
Scottsdale, Arizona 85259
(480) 657-3722


THE ENERGY MACHINE OF JOSEPH NEWMAN
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Websites: http://www.josephnewman.com
  http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/6087
  http://www.angelfire.com/biz/Newman/index.html
  http://ho

[CTRL] Fwd: Suppressed technology

[Kris Millegan]

Dear Mr. Millegan,

I enjoyed reading your interview of Anthony Sutton.

Of particular note was the following passage:

KM - Do you believe that there has been suppression of technology? Has
it been major or minor?

AS - Yes there has been suppression but its going to be impossible to
suppress the new emerging paradigm.

With respect to the above, I will be forwarding you documentation which you
may find of interest.

In the opinion of one Congressman:

"This is the greatest conspiracy against any human being in the history of
the world."

The A&E Network featured a special report about the injustices against this
individual in a program entitled "Conspiracies".

Sincerely,

Evan Soule'
Director of Information
THE ENERGY MACHINE OF JOSEPH NEWMAN
11445 East Via Linda, No. 416
Scottsdale, Arizona 85259
(480) 657-3722

www.josephnewman.com


Nikola Tesla once wrote:

  "The day when we shall know exactly what electricity is,
  will chronicle an event  probably greater than any other
  recorded in the human race."

* IMAGINE a  civilization  with  an  access  to  virtually
  unlimited  energy . . .

* IMAGINE an energy source that is abundant,  inexpensive,
  and environmentally-friendly . . .

* IMAGINE a stable  and  durable  alternative to oil, gas,
  coal, and nuclear . . .

* IMAGINE an  electromagnetic  Motor which runs "cool" and
  harnesses  the  elemental  forces  of  the  universe  in
  complete accord with the 1st Law of Thermodynamics . . .

* IMAGINE  such  a  Motor  powering  the  world  --- every
  automobile, appliance,  home,  farm,  factory, ship, and
  plane, at a FRACTION of the present cost of energy . . .

* IMAGINE  such  a Motor  enabling us to someday reach the
  stars - safely and inexpensively . . .

  Such a technology now exists.

Re: [CTRL] When GPS meets cell phones

[Bill]

 -Caveat Lector-

They will also track with high altitude planes and satellite
by sensors a mark has EATEN...meaning they can and do feed
people stuff by which they can be tracked, and they will
take sometimes as much as $10,000.00 of your tax dollars AN
HOUR to do it...most times they are simply trying to cover
something up that can get them in trouble personally, due
their despotic outlook, and so all this surveillance is just
a case of people purchasing their own chains...tax revolt is
all that will get it I think...big time.

"Prudence L. Kuhn" wrote:
>
>  -Caveat Lector-
>
> In a message dated 09/03/1999 11:08:47 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
> << > useless: The police had no idea where Wilson was calling from, and
>  > neither did she. They spent the better part of the next 24 hours
>  > searching in vain, combing the town block by block while precious time
>  > ticked away. A new technology which would have told police precisely
>  > where Wilson was hadn’t arrived in time to help.
>
>  Several years ago, Dean Koontz wrote a novel where the hero is tracked by
> GPS by
>  through the deserts of the SW by the evil gummint that wants to stop him.
>  "Dark Rivers of the Heart"? >>
>
> Yes, and I'll bet the police will spend a lot more time on the kind of thing
> Koontz was describing than on searching for kidnap victims.  Prudy
>
> DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
> ==
> CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
> screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
> and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
> frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
> spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
> gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
> be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
> nazi's need not apply.
>
> Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.
> 
> Archives Available at:
> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html
>
> http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
> 
> To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
> SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
> SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Om

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om

Re: [CTRL] [InTheShadows] Skeptic News - Friday #2

[Ric Carter]

 -Caveat Lector-

- Original Message -
From: Hilary A. Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

> > # N.Z. Chicken Processing Plant Owner Fax-Bombed by U.S Security.
> > WELLINGTON... http://news.excite.com/news/r/990903/09/odd-chicken
> > http://news.excite.com/photo/img/r/life/clinton/chicken/19990903/sin99
> >
> > : Whose security systems have you penetrated? Is it easy to hack
> > systems so that they propagate confidential communications across
> > the Net? Is it fun??
>
> Ric, Ric, Ric  Aoi, these amateur researchers!  Clinton, being the
> sensitive, insightful person that he is, has obviously realized that
> chickens, are in fact, a higher life form.  I strongly suspect that the
> sending of national security files to chickens in New Zealand is a covert
> operation, no doubt with a nifty name like: Feathered Friends Unite, the
> Lone Chic, or even, The Egg.  I don't know about you, but my confidence
> in the current administration is mounting...

Sensitivity has nothing to do with it.  Recall that one of Clinton's
major backers has always been Tyson Foods, the US chicken empire.  He
has long, deep links to chicken processors in North America.  Tyson
obviously intends to extend its reach worldwide, hence the contact
with and attempted takeover of the NZ chicken plant.  Watch for other
events at chicken processors around the planet in the near future.

One World, One Egg!!

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om

[CTRL] What DID happen to Itavia Flight 870?

[William Shannon]

 -Caveat Lector-

Italy indicts 10 over '80 jetliner crash
Old suspicions of missile attack, cover-up revived



 By Tom Hundley
Tribune Foreign Correspondent
September 4, 1999
ROME -- Itavia Airline's Flight 870 from Bologna to Palermo was already two
hours late when it took off at 6:08 on a balmy June evening in 1980.

Less than an hour into the flight, the jetliner, a DC-9 with 81 passengers
and crew aboard, disappeared from radar screens. Its last message from the
pilot to ground control was a routine, "We're about to start our descent."

The next day, rescue teams found the wreckage scattered over a wide area of
the Tyrrhenian Sea near the island of Ustica, about 50 miles off the northern
coast of Sicily. There were no survivors.

For 19 years, the cause of the crash has remained unresolved, shrouded in
conspiracy theories and cover-ups. Now a new chapter in the mystery of Flight
870 is being written.

The Italian government this week indicted four retired Italian air force
generals and six senior military intelligence officers for treason, charging
them with conspiring to keep silent and destroying evidence of the true cause
of the tragedy.

It appears that the most likely and long-suspected explanation--that the
plane was caught in a crossfire between NATO warplanes, possibly
American-piloted, and Libyan aircraft--will finally have its day in court.

The wide area over which the crash debris and the bodies were spread led
investigators to conclude almost immediately that there had been some kind of
explosion.

A bomb was one possibility, but no group or person came forward to claim
responsibility. Perhaps some mechanical malfunction had caused the explosion.
Investigators pursued that theory for a while but came up empty.

Within a few months, a new theory emerged: The plane had been shot down by a
missile, possibly two missiles. The Italian military and NATO denied any
involvement.

Bolstering that theory was the discovery, three weeks after the incident, of
a Libyan MiG-21 that had crashed into a remote Calabrian mountainside about
200 miles from where the DC-9 went down.

The initial autopsy report indicated the Libyan pilot had died several weeks
before. But that report was overruled by a military investigation, which
concluded that the pilot had died of heart attack the day he was found and
that this was the cause of the crash. The body was quickly shipped back to
Libya.

On the night of the Ustica crash, the alarm for the missing airliner was
first sounded by an Italian air defense radar station in Sicily, but when
investigators sought the radar tracking tape they found that the crucial
segment recording the last eight minutes of the ill-fated flight had been
"unfortunately" erased.

Italy's military secrecy act blocked further investigation.

There were other signs of a cover-up. The Italian government made no serious
effort to recover the wreckage from the sea floor until 1986, six years after
the crash, when about 90 percent of the aircraft was brought up. By that
time, parts of the wreckage recovered immediately after the crash had
disappeared. Meanwhile, Itavia, a privately owned domestic carrier, went
bankrupt.

Pressured by relatives of the victims, one special commission after another
looked into the matter, only to run into a stone wall of official obfuscation.

The most persuasive evidence came from the U.S. National Transportation
Safety Board and Britain's Royal Armament Research and Development
Establishment. Based on a study of the wreckage and radar data obtained from
civil air authorities, both agencies concluded that the DC-9 had been blown
out of the sky by a missile. The agencies ruled out the possibility of a bomb
on the plane.

Those findings were published in 1986 and they triggered a new panel of
experts to look into the Ustica crash. Three years later, the panel concluded
that, indeed, the DC-9 had been hit by a missile. A few months later, two of
the panel's five experts changed their minds and said it was a bomb.

That's when Rome magistrate Rosario Priore took over the case. Ten years
later, with the help of another panel of experts, he has produced a
3,000-page report concluding that the DC-9 was caught "in a warlike scenario"
as NATO and Libyan jets skirmished over the Mediterranean.

For Daria Bonfietti, an Italian parliamentarian who lost a brother in the
crash, the findings represented a measure of vindication after a long
struggle.

"In our country 81 innocent people lost their lives and little by little this
event was forgotten. Today this long chapter can be closed," said Bonfietti,
who heads the Ustica Victims Association.

She said that Italy's NATO allies had withheld critical information and that
getting to the truth was "above all a matter of national dignity."

The most likely scenario, according to the report, is that a plane from one
side or the other tried to use the civilian jet as a shield to hide from
enemy radar. Several warplanes from each side

[CTRL] NSA Embedded in Software? .

[Jabr 333]

 -Caveat Lector-

New York Time's Article

September 4, 1999


A Mysterious Component Roils Microsoft
By JOHN MARKOFF
AN FRANCISCO -- A cryptographer for a Canadian software firm, dissecting a
piece of Microsoft security software, made an unexpected find: an element in
the Windows operating system labeled "NSAKey."

When his discovery was made known on his company's Web site Friday, it set
off a firestorm of Orwellian visions in Internet discussion groups.

--
--
Sidebar
For Programmers, a Link to Spy Agency Seemed Likely
(September 4, 1999)
--
--



Was the buried software component, as the cryptographer surmised, a Trojan
horse that gave the National Security Agency a hidden back door into the
world's computers? Or was it merely a Microsoft programmer's remarkably bad
choice of language in a software system designed to protect electronic
communications and commerce?

Microsoft executives insisted that there was no Big Brother feature in the
software. "The big answer is that these charges are completely false," said
Scott Culp, a security product manager at Microsoft.

And the National Security Agency, which gathers electronic signal
intelligence worldwide and is responsible for the security of the
Government's computers, issued a terse three-sentence news release distancing
itself from the controversy, saying, "Questions about specific products
should be addressed to the company."

Microsoft officials acknowledged that the episode was in any case a black eye
for the world's largest software publisher.

"We're going to pay and pay and pay for this," said one of the company's
security experts, who spoke on the grounds that he not be identified.

In recent months Microsoft has become a lightning rod for criticism of its
products' security and has had to deal with several gaffes, including the
discovery last week of a security flaw that exposed the e-mail of users of
its Hotmail service.

--
--

Rumors of a door for U.S. access to the world's computers.

--
--




The latest uproar was set off by Andrew Fernandes, a mathematician in
Research Triangle Park, N.C., who is chief scientist of the Cryptonym
Corporation, a small Canadian software firm that is developing computer
security products.

Fernandes first presented his findings at a technical meeting last month in
Southern California, but word did not spread more broadly until today, when a
news release was posted on the Cryptonym Web site.

In a telephone interview, Fernandes said he had made his discovery while
exploring and trying to replicate the security software in Microsoft's
Windows and Windows NT operating systems.

The operating systems make use of a key -- a large number -- to authenticate
software components, providing confidence that a component is correctly
identified and has not been tampered with. For example, when new encryption
functions are added for security, the key verifies that they comply with
Government regulations.

Cryptographers had previously noted the existence of a second key whose use
they could not account for. What Fernandes found in the program was an
identifying tag, disguised in earlier versions. And the label was "NSAKey."

The discovery shocked him, Fernandes said, adding, "It doesn't make any sense
why they would put in a second key."

He concluded that the key represented a serious security flaw that would
leave Microsoft's operating system vulnerable to intrusion. "The result is
that it is tremendously easier for the N.S.A. to load unauthorized security
services on all copies of Microsoft Windows, and once these security services
are loaded, they can effectively compromise your entire operating system,"
his news release asserted.

But at Microsoft, Culp said the key labeled NSAKey was a backup permitting
Microsoft to authenticate encryption components if the first key was damaged.
And he said the name was simply unfortunate.





--
--
Related Articles
Microsoft Discloses Flaws in Office 2000 Software
(August 20, 1999)

Software Makers Scramble to Address Security Flaw
(August 3, 1999)

Microsoft and Compaq Admit Vulnerability to Security Flaws
(July 31, 1999)

Security Flaw Is Discovered in Several Unix Programs
(July 26, 1999)

Companies That Ignore Online Security Are Risking Customers
(May 3, 1999)


--
--

 Because the key insures compliance with Federal export laws, and the
National Security Agency is the authority responsible for reviewing software
and hardware products intended for foreign use, the component has been
referred to colloquially at Microsoft as t

[CTRL] Fwd: WTO (Seattle) and the CIA

[Sean McDougal]

 -Caveat Lector-

Original Message Follows
From: MichaelP <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: undisclosed-recipients:;
Subject: WTO (Seattle) and the CIA
Date: Sat, 4 Sep 1999 00:18:56 -0500 (CDT)

Again I'm playing catch-up - I posted the report about the CIA's National
Intelligence Council "rehearsing" for the WTO meeting in Seattle. I still
haven't seen a copy of the original Financial Times' report but the
following implies that the CIA has more than just "law-and-order"
interest in that event.

And again it's worth noting that the agenda at Seattle is about world
trade, subjects like the environment, health, education, sustainability
and human rights are peripheral.
  Cheers
  MichaelP


World Socialist Web Site
http://www.wsws.org/articles/1999/aug1999/wto-a18_prn.shtml

As WTO prepares for "Millennium Round"  World trade conflicts intensify

By Nick Beams 18 August 1999

An article published in the Financial Times last Saturday on some recent
activities of the US Central Intelligence Agency has cast a revealing
light on the tensions between the major capitalist powers as they prepare
for the ministerial meeting of the World Trade Organisation to be held in
Seattle in November to set the agenda for global trade negotiations in the
so-called Millennium Round.

Entitled "CIA rehearses for sleepless night in Seattle", it reported that
earlier this month the National Intelligence Council, which reports to CIA
director George Tenet on potential threats to US national security, had
held a mock WTO conference in Washington in order to prepare for the
November meeting.

A CIA spokesman said the exercise had been undertaken to "prepare
policymakers" for the meeting and that the agency "routinely" held such
conferences "in order to help sharpen the level of debate about important
issues."

According to the report: "Delegates to the mini conference included a wide
range of intelligence officers, former senior trade officials, academics
and others. Many are understood to have played the parts of
representatives of other countries - in particular of traditional trade
rivals such as the EU and Japan - to try and simulate what kinds of debate
and disagreements might be heard in November."

It noted that while the CIA was widely rumoured to have stolen the
position papers of the French delegation towards the conclusion of the
so-called Uruguay Round of global trade negotiations in 1993, "the
decision to give such prominence to the forthcoming ministerial meeting
appears to mark a new departure for US intelligence."

Preparations for the WTO meeting have been underway for several months
amid growing reports of deep divisions between the major economic blocs.
Last Monday, for example, the Australian Financial Review reported that
the tabling of policy positions by WTO members had "exposed a startling
absence of consensus on the content of the negotiating round". While there
was agreement of the need to include agriculture and services, there was
"little common ground", particularly among the major countries on the rest
of the agenda.

The EU and Japan are believed to be in favour of the development of global
rules on investment and competition policy. But the US is opposed to such
a wide agenda fearing that it could take years to reach such broad
agreement, thereby holding up the adoption of specific policies to open up
markets in services, agriculture and industrial products.

Even before the talks get underway, this year has already seen the
eruption of a bitter conflict between the US and the EU over agricultural
policies with the US imposing punitive duties under WTO rules in
retaliation for the refusal of the EU to abide by rulings on the imports
of banana and hormone-treated beef.

But the beef and banana wars may well turn out to be just the preliminary
skirmishes for a even bigger conflict over the issue of genetically
modified foods, for which the EU decided to suspend authorisation in June
until a new system of safety standards could be agreed upon.

Issuing his first major policy statement since taking up the post of US
ambassador to the EU in July, Richard Morningstar warned that Europe and
America are heading for a $1 billion trade war if the EU persisted in its
opposition.

In a biannual Letter from Brussels, Morningstar, who previously held the
position of Special Adviser to the President on Caspian Basin energy, said
that "politics and demagoguery have completely taken over the regulatory
process" in regard to EU policy on genetically modified foods.

"Particularly in the UK, the media has learnt to love a good food safety
scare, and the public debate all too often is dominated by scare stories
and nightmare scenarios without any scientific basis. Until the EU can
credibly separate science-based risk assessment and regulations from the
political process the outlook for resolution of this issue is bleak."

There was a danger that the EU was over-reacting to the Belgian dioxin
food scare and was moving to i

[CTRL] Joyce Riley on Art Bell 9/2/99

[ASu2431426]

 -Caveat Lector-

HERE IT IS AGAIN .. 'there was no legal search warrant"

We have been asking around for 5/6 years   "..where is the search warrant"  ?

Any attorneys out there want to comment ?  This was an illegal armed assault
by the military and law enforcement on American citizens.

ANTONY C SUTTON

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om

[CTRL] Fw: WACO: Joyce Riley on Art Bell 9/2/99

[Sean McDougal]

 -Caveat Lector-

Original Message Follows
From: Jon Roland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: undisclosed-recipients:;
Subject: Fw: WACO: Joyce Riley on Art Bell 9/2/99
Date: Sat, 4 Sep 1999 00:26:01 -0500 (CDT)

- Begin forwarded message --

To listen to the discussion of Waco by Joyce Riley on Art Bell,
download the
program.

Click to listen: http://ww2.broadcast.com/artbell/abell/9909/ab0902.ram

Pertinent parts begin at approximately 2 hours, six minutes (2:06) into the
program.  To fastforward to this point in the program, just move the clip
position indicator with your mouse until the time indicator reads somewhere
close to 2:06:00.0

Rough transcript beginning at above time (not proofread or spell-checked):

ART BELL:  All kinds of information breaking about Waco, just all kinds.
I know you have new, as yet unheard by anybody information about Waco.
What can you tell us?

JOYCE RILEY:  Well, let me preface this by saying the purpose for this
person coming forward with the information was that he is a sick Gulf
War veteran, and we had a long discussion about the secrets of the
Gulf War illness and the cover-up involved there, and I said, "Just like
Waco, there needs to be the exposure of the truth about Waco."  And
he said, "I know about Waco."  And I said, "How do you know about
Waco?"  And he said, "I know more than I wish I knew.  I was stationed
at Fort Hood and we were the unit that provided the Apache attack
helicopters."

You can imagine how startled I was to hear that there were Apache
attack helicopters, because an Apache is not even armed in the United
States.  It's never armed because it is nothing but a helicopter for war.
It's --

ART:  An Apache, actually, was probably the most efficient killing
machine in the Gulf War, so efficient that the images were hidden from
the American people.  The Apache is an incredible war machine.  People
have no idea how devastating the fire power from that helicopter can be.

JOYCE:  Oh, it is.  It looks like a preying mantis.  It is the helicopter
that
has the wheels on it.  And if you were to ever see one, it is just -- it's
very formidable.  And in talking with this Gulf War veteran, and part of the
reason I'm saying this today is because of his -- for his protection,
because
Texas Rangers have become involved in this since I talked with you, Art,
so I'm not at liberty to identify some of the things that I was going to
say.
But I did get a phone call from Dick DeGuerin today, which the attorney
for the Branch Dividians, and I can assure you that this information that
he gave coincides with what he already knew and speculated.

But let me just say that this Gulf War veteran, after we talked about this,
I said, "You know you have a responsibility to come forward, because if
we want people to tell the truth about Gulf War illness, if we want
the people to come out of the Pentagon and out of the corners in the
back alleys and admit to what has gone on there, we're going to have to
tell what we know."  So he has come forward.  He is a destitute, if you
will, Gulf War veteran who has no purpose in doing this other than the
world needs to know the truth, and it is time that we quit harboring
these secrets under the name of military adventure or military action.
What he told me is that while he was stationed at Fort Hood at the
F227 Aviation Apache Attack Squadron, that they armed the Apache
helicopters to go in to Waco.

ART:  They armed them.

JOYCE:  They armed them.  Now understanding that if what we say is
true here today, this is the most devastating information to come across,
because this puts the liability and the accountability all the way up to
the president, for arming a helicopter for a war situation within the
United States, basically violating the Posse Commitatus Act.

ART:  Absolutely.

JOYCE:  So, when he described this operation, I asked him what they
armed the helicopters with.

ART:  Good.  And what did he say?

JOYCE:  He said they armed them -- there were 20 helicopters that took
turns going back and forth between Ft. Hood and Waco, which is a
5-minute flight or a 20-minute drive -- 30-minute drive.  They were
supported by the 3rd Armored Division.  They armed these helicopters
with eight Hellfire missiles, which to the person that may not know a
Hellfire, it can go through an M-1 tank and it explodes into a fireball.
There was a belly gun with an M-60 armor-piercing 20-millimeter cannon.
The round pod(?) contained, 50 on each side, air-to-ground 122-millimeter
rockets.  There were also air-to-ground two Devor(?) Sidewinder missiles
loaded on each helicopter.  Those are the -- the Sidewinder missiles are
the ones that are on the wings of the F-16.  There were two Apaches at
all times at Waco.  There were eight -- there were Blackhawk helicopters,
2 to 4 of those, with eight per -- eight individuals per Blackhawk, and
there were Humvees that were there.  He also said there were Delta
Forces.  He does not want to say the uni

Re: [CTRL] Fw: Should we trust the government?

[Prudence L. Kuhn]

 -Caveat Lector-

In a message dated 09/04/1999 12:46:05 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

<<
 Hmmm.  Well, it might put a kink in rumored plans of Emperor
 William to remain in the White House after 2000. >>

And that will take care of the people slaughtered the next time our federal
agencies decide to "control a situation."  Prudy

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
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Re: [CTRL] Waco's Wacko.

[Sean McDougal]

 -Caveat Lector-

Original Message Follows
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Waco's Wacko.
Date: Sat, 4 Sep 1999 10:23:08 EDT

Responding off-list again, don't wish to air this using my alotted
posts...you can and will do what you want.


You wrote-YOU, on the other hand, don't seem to
need this multitude of questions answered in order to KNOW that everything
the FBI has said on this case just HAS to be true.


---I don't KNOW that everything the feds say regarding Waco is true...and
methinks you are extrapolating my comments out of context.
Maybe the feds were overzealous but why are you and your ilk coddling the
kook??
==
i respond:
there is nothing but ashes to coddle.  as far as my "ilk," i am only
responsible for my own actions and words.  i am not responsible for what
anyone else does or says.
==
Is he not responsible for his predicament?
==
i respond:
as much as anyone is responsible for being the target of a media event.
==
Didn't he refuse to surrender?
==
i respond:
no he did not.  i was one of the few, seemingly, that actually paid
attention to the coverage as it happened and i specifically recall CNN
reporting that Koresh said he would come out if he could address the nation
first.  obviously, he felt he would be misrepresented if not allowed to
represent himself.  also, he tried to have the phone lines re-hooked up so
as to talk and his requests were refused.
==
Wasn't he
porking the little girls in his cult?
==
i respond:
no more than Loretta Lynn was "porked" when she got married.  no one came
after her husband with tanks.
==
His character is at issue here...and his character is aberrant, to say the
least..

Bill.
==
i respond:
the media could easily portray YOU as aberrant merely by being on a
conspiracy list.

__
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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[CTRL] "FEMA's X-File" Now Online With FOIA Documents

[(Charles Overbeck)]

 -Caveat Lector-

September 4, 1999 -- FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE


Emergency Public Affairs: "FEMA's X-Files" Revealed On-line

The Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) has long been at the center of
speculation about secret government plans for martial law.  When the movie
"X-Files: Fight the Future" touched on the topic, a FEMA official
disseminated a special public affairs guidance on how to respond to such
allegations.

Why the unusual p.r. measure? Get the full story, along with internal FEMA
documents obtained through the Freedom of Information Act, in an on-line
feature produced by Dossier:

http://www.parascope.com/ds/articles/femaXfile.htm

The papers open a window into the exclusive realm of government emergency
public affairs planning and demonstrate the dilemmas of officials in a
democracy who insist, on the one hand, that they have nothing to hide, and on
the other that they cannot discuss certain sensitive matters.  They are
published here for the first time.
___

Dossier is an on-line archive of declassified documents on covert operations
and political scandals.  Published since May 1996, the collection is updated
frequently with newly released records from the CIA, the Pentagon, the State
Department and other government agencies.  Dossier, on-line at
http://www.parascope.com/dossier.htm, is a section of the ParaScope Web site
(http://www.parascope.com/).

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
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Om

Re: [CTRL] When GPS meets cell phones

[Prudence L. Kuhn]

 -Caveat Lector-

In a message dated 09/03/1999 11:08:47 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

<< > useless: The police had no idea where Wilson was calling from, and
 > neither did she. They spent the better part of the next 24 hours
 > searching in vain, combing the town block by block while precious time
 > ticked away. A new technology which would have told police precisely
 > where Wilson was hadn’t arrived in time to help.

 Several years ago, Dean Koontz wrote a novel where the hero is tracked by
GPS by
 through the deserts of the SW by the evil gummint that wants to stop him.
 "Dark Rivers of the Heart"? >>

Yes, and I'll bet the police will spend a lot more time on the kind of thing
Koontz was describing than on searching for kidnap victims.  Prudy

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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Om

[CTRL] Skeptic News - Saturday #1

[ric carter]

?ID=16294

: Do you have any extra organs? Would you sell them, rent them, lease them?
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

SkeptiLinks:

@ Waco-Rama: http://www.dallasmorningnews.com/specials/waco/
@ We may have to think the unthinkable about HIV and AIDS:
  http://www.newscientist.com/ns/19990904/editorial.html

# Visions of China: http://www.cnn.com/china
# Crystalball: China's political future:
  http://cnn.com/SPECIALS/1999/china.50/50.beyond/political.overview/
# Chinese Art Today:
  http://cnn.com/SPECIALS/1999/china.50/inside.china/art.overview/

@ Lyghtforce Homoeopathy email list: http://www.lyghtforce.com/homeo.html
@ Homeo-list's e-zine: http://www.lyghtforce.com/HomeopathyOnLine/index.html
@ Hahnemannian Homoeopathy & Cyberspace Academy: http://www.simillimum.com

# COST OVERRUNS PROMPT OVERHAUL OF LASER PROGRAM -  hundreds of millions
  over budget: http://cnn.com/US/9909/04/laser.costs.ap/index.html
@ WACO: The Rules of Engagement - "The Original Raid Was Publicity Stunt"
  http://www.reagan.com/HotTopics.main/HotMike/document-9.23.1997.4.html
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

  "I am the person who pulled the toy gun on David Horowitz in Burbank,
   California, on the LIVE set of KNBC TV and forced him to read a state-
   ment about how the CIA and ALIENS had replaced my family and friends
   with clones.  It is the ABSOLUTE TRUTH, and I have the evidence to
   back it up in a court of law!" --Gary Stollman

* http://skepticon.da.ru (updated) * ICQ# 19633976 * FAX: 603-415-3736
* email INFO or SUBSCRIBE SKEPTICHAT to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
* (sorry, I can't answer all email - but thanks for your feedback)
* SkeptiChat/SkeptiNews archives: http://skeptifiles.da.ru (belated)
* Fringe * Science * Faith * Sex/Drugs * UFO/PSI/Y2K * Conspiracy *

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
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Om

[CTRL] [Fwd: [freedomfight] Citizens Against UFO Secrecy - Press Release]

[Bill]

 -Caveat Lector-

Cliff Hume wrote:
>
> The April-May issue of  NEXUS magazine published an article,  The
> WingMakers, which goes into great detail about aliens living amongst us.
> Much more is covered on the internet at 
>
> Popular Mechanics, another of the many Council on Foreign Relations
> publications with the CFR bias, has a female alien on the cover of their
> July, 1999 issue, and informs us that the universe may be teeming with
> exotic life-forms.
>
> This month of September, 1999, the The Readers Digest with the same CFR
> socialist, one world government bias is sporting an article on aliens. Time,
> Life and other CFR publications usually lead the pack, so it is possible
> that they have already covered this ground. All of the CFR publications have
> been prepped to frighten us into their New World Order, and the alien thing
> was set up by a think-tank traced back to a study released in 1966 called
> Report from Iron Mountain. The study was commissioned three years previously
> by the Department of Defense under Defense Secretary, Robert S. McNamara
> (CFR). The former Canadian, CFR member, John Kenneth Galbraith inadvertently
> let the cat out of the bag and the Insiders have been trying to cover that
> boo-boo ever since.
>
> G. Edward Griffin's 608 page, The Creature from Jekyll Island at
> www.realityzone.com will tell you all that you need to know about money,
> banking, collusion, and many other extremely important things you should
> know before the year 2000 is hustled in. It might have a lot to do with
> saving your freedom or even saving your life.
>
> Report From Iron Mountain is covered on pages 516, 518, 521, 523-5, 533,
> 556, 558 and 560. Y2K was designed as a helper situation to create the chaos
> and confusion necessary to separate the uninformed and misinformed American
> people from what little freedom they once enjoyed. The sports, soaps, movie
> and other spaced out fans, if still in slumber land over the next four
> months are going to be in for a very rude awakening. Their criminal
> government has some very big plans in store for them - if they can pull it
> off. They intend to because they have spent hundreds and hundreds of
> billions of dollars for their scheming, planning and conniving, and they
> don't want all of those bad people on the internet throwing their game.
>
> Yours truly,
>
> Cliff Hume
>
> At 01:42 PM 9/1/99 -0700, you wrote:
> >http://caus.org/ca090199.htm
> >
> >--> WIDTH="85%" VALIGN="TOP">
> >
> >FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
> >
> >
> >
> >CITIZENS GROUP HAS UNDENIABLE EVIDENCE OF "ET" INVASION AND
> >SUES FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AND ARIZONA FOR PROTECTION
> >
> >
> >SEPTEMBER 1, 1999
> >
> >
> >PHOENIX -- In a continuing effort to end government secrecy surrounding
> >UFOs and contact with a non-human intelligence, Arizona attorney Peter A.
> >Gersten filed papers today in U.S. District Court requiring the Federal
> >government to protect the residents of Arizona from a "clandestine
> >invasion."
> >
> >Gersten, the Executive Director of the Phoenix-based Citizens
> >Against UFO Secrecy, Inc. (CAUS), had filed an earlier lawsuit under the
> >Freedom of Information Act on January 22, 1999 against the Department of
> >Defense (DOD).
> >
> >Today's precedent-setting legal initiative comes under Article IV,
> >Section 4 of the U.S. Constitution, which requires the federal government
> >to protect each of the fifty states against invasion.
> >
> >CAUS is an Arizona activist organization dedicated to ending the
> >secrecy surrounding Earth's contact with an "extraterrestrial intelligence."
> >The organization, Gersten said, sent letters to the country's 50
> >Governors as well as Secretary of Defense William Cohen and Attorney General
> >Janet Reno requesting they take immediate action to protect United States
> >citizens against these intruders.  Only three governors have replied.
> >
> >"It's outrageous that this threat is continually ignored," Gersten
> >stated.  "I can prove in a court of law, and beyond a reasonable doubt, that
> >we are in contact with another form of intelligence.  More importantly,
> >one aspect of this contact poses a threat to our safety."
> >
> >"Arizona will be a test case," Gersten said.  He cites the reported crash
> >of an "unusual" craft in Paradise Valley in 1947, the Travis Walton
> >disappearance in Snowflake in 1975, the infamous "Phoenix lights" seen
> >throughout the state in 1997 and countless other reports during the past 52
> >years. "Arizona is definitely a targeted area for the clandestine
> >intruders," Gersten believes.
> >
> >The CAUS legal papers contend that the intruders are conducting
> >nonconsensual physical acts including abductions, sexual abuse, assaults and
> >unlawful imprisonment upon the citizens of the United States.
> >
> >CAUS is asking the federal court in Phoenix to compel both the
> >Federal government and the State of Arizona to ini

Re: [CTRL] Fw: Should we trust the government?

[K]

 -Caveat Lector-

On 4 Sep 99, at 11:19, Prudence L. Kuhn wrote:

>  -Caveat Lector-
>
> In a message dated 09/02/1999 7:02:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>

Actually, I was forwarding an article written and published
elsewhere.
> << > In the face of this unprecedented attack on American citizens by
>  > agents of their own government, a deadly assault that sparked the >
>  militia movement as well as the bombing of the Federal Building in >
>  Oklahoma City, an unprecedented silence befell the press. “No one >
>  stepped forward to be the Davidians’ friend,” writes Richard Shweder,
>  > author of “Thinking Through Cultures,” in the New York Times. “The
>  > Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms spent months planning and >
>  rehearsing the largest ‘law enforcement’ operation of its 200-year >
>  history. This turned out to be a major military operation, worthy of
>  a > police state, carried out against the domestic residence of an >
>  unpopular and readily stigmatized religious community. The ACLU does
>  > not like guns, and it’s very busy, so it didn’t get involved. The >
>  religious leaders of our country do not like ‘cults,’ and the women’s
>  > movement does not like patriarchal living arrangements, so they
>  didn’t > much care. And no one wanted to seem sympathetic to ‘child
>  abuse’ or > unsympathetic to the FBI.” >>
>
snip

> Trust is not
> important here.  And will you people quit baying about IMPEACHMENT.

Likely not, at least as long as the first amendment remains intact.


> Just what good does or would it do?

Hmmm.  Well, it might put a kink in rumored plans of Emperor
William to remain in the White House after 2000.

Kathleen

"A large section of the intelligentsia seems wholly devoid of
intelligence." -- G. K. Chesterton

"A paranoid is a man who knows a little of what's going on." --
William Burroughs

"Dictators ride to and fro upon tigers which they dare not dismount.
And the tigers are getting hungry." -- Winston Churchill

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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Re: [CTRL] Toward the Total State

[Bill]

 -Caveat Lector-

What about the ultimate Hegellian depravity of the likes of
the Bush Crime Family?  Looks like someones wearing
blinders...

Bill Richer wrote:
>
>  -Caveat Lector-
>
> Toward the Total State
> by William Norman Grigg
>
> Has the left won America’s culture war? Some observers, including political
> organizer Paul Weyrich (who c

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

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[CTRL] Natural Capitalism in action.

[Nurev Ind Research]

 -Caveat Lector-

/** labr.global: 360.0 **/
** Topic: Creating 'natural' capitalism In Russia **
** Written  3:03 PM  Sep  2, 1999 by [EMAIL PROTECTED] in cdp:labr.global
**
 << Creating 'natural' capitalism

By William Pfaff

THOSE who doubt the power of ideas will learn something from a report
on the former Soviet Union and Eastern Europe issued by the UN
Development Programme, the world's largest agency for multilateral
development cooperation. The report, possibly the harshest ever issued
by a UN authority, says that the Western-led effort to transform the
former Soviet bloc's economies by wholesale privatization has plunged
more than 100 million people into dire poverty and stripped millions
more of any form of economic security.

This was done on the advice of the Western community of professional
economists in universities, international agencies and governments.
True, there were arguments among he professionals for or against "big
bang" privatization - doing it all at once and leaving the survivors to
sink or swim. But few, if any, among the economists argued that the
Soviet-style state and its industry should be carefully dismantled in
stages, with empirical attention to the consequences, above all the
consequences for the public.

The Western economics profession was at the time, and largely remains,
committed to its own version of the romantic fallacy, which is at least
five centuries old and concerns the "natural" perfection of man, whom
society allegedly corrupts. They believed that humans are natural
capitalists. By destroying socialist obstacles to capitalism in Eastern
Europe and the former Soviet Union as rapidly as possible, they
believed that people would spontaneously respond by creating capitalist
prosperity.

Alan Greenspan himself has admitted that he (or "we," as he says)
assumed that communism's collapse "would automatically establish a free
market entrepreneurial system." He assumed that capitalism was "human
nature." It turned out, he says, to be "not nature at all, but
culture." Culture is not the economists' department.

What was created was a disaster, the equivalent for that region, as The
Times of London has said, of the Great Depression. Anton Kruiderink,
the UNDP's regional director for Europe and the former Soviet Union,
quotes World Bank figures in his foreword to the report.

In 1989, 14 million people in the former Soviet block lived on less
than the equivalent of $4 per day. During the first five years after
communism's collapse, that population figure rose to around 147
million.  There are exceptions to the traumatic destabilization of
society that followed in Russia. Poland and Slovenia are in good shape
today, but they were advanced societies before World War II. So were
the Czech Republic, Hungary and the Baltic states, which the UNDP says
have made noticeable progress.

As for the rest of the region, life expectancy has fallen by four years
or more. Tuberculosis and diseases linked to malnutrition are back on a
large scale, as is suicide. Social structures - including educational
systems, which in Soviet times were among the few real assets of the
region - have been devastated.

Education is essential to any hope people have of climbing out of this
pit. The transfer of state assets to robber capitalists, generating a
black economy, has devastated tax collection and the ability of
governments to reconstruct what has been destroyed.  The findings of
the UNDP report can surprise no one who has read the newspapers during
the last decade or followed the Western debate over policy for Russia
and the former Soviet bloc states. Yet the sheer scale of the disaster
must shake even those who criticized the policy from the start.

The West has been implicated in another way than simply by giving bad
advice. There were more reports last week of suspected Russian criminal
money-laundering through Western financial institutions, this time
through what had been considered the eminently respectable Bank of New
York. The sums cited in the investigation are $10 billion since early
last year, $4.2 billion alone through a single account from last
October to March 1999. Ten billion is half the total that the
International Monetary Fund has loaned Russia over the entire period
since 1992.

The power of ideas is great, above all when they are bad ideas. Yet
there is very little that can be done about intellectual fashion, or to
loosen the grip of politically favoured ideologies. The one principle
that can and should be defended in making public policy is to do as
little harm as possible. One cannot govern with entirely clean hands.
(That, as France's Charles Peguy observed many years ago, would mean
with no hands.) But governments should not recklessly press on
beleaguered foreign societies "reform" programmes that clearly will do
much harm in the short term, when

the justification for those programmes is the contested and unproved
theory that miracles will take place in 

[CTRL] No News is no news.

[Nurev Ind Research]

 -Caveat Lector-

"The News That Didn't Make the News", Original Sources, Sep 01 Sorting
Out Facts From a Barrage of Government Distortion and Half-truths
By: Mary Mostert
--
Yesterday I received an e-mail entitled "Untold Stories of U.S./NATO's
War and U.S. Media Complacency" by Peter Phillips, director of "Project
Censored" at Sonoma State University in California, which said in
part:

"The mainstream media in the United States were aware that the Pentagon
and NATO were releasing biased and false information regarding the war
in Kosovo yet they continued to pass on the information to the American
public as if it were gospel," the report began. " '...the media were
once more asked to sort out a few kernels of facts from a barrage of
distortions and half-truths from government information
manipulators...baloney-ladened military briefings in Brussels...cryptic
shows at the Pentagon,' reports Senior correspondent for Newsday's
Washington Bureau, Patrick Sloyan. Writing in June's American
Journalism Review, Sloyan went on to describe how the elite of U.S.
media complained to President Clinton, but failed to use their power to
challenge the government.

"That the U.S. Military and NATO kept the American public propagandized
and ignorant about the our most recent war is a well known fact among
mainstream correspondents. Foremost in the undercovered or ignored
categories, but widely covered in Europe, were: extensive civilian
deaths (2,000+);

massive damage to non-military civilian facilities in Serbia; the use
of illegal cluster bombs and depleted uranium munitions; Devastating
environmental pollution was created by the bombing and burning of
refineries and chemical plants. "The deliberate destruction of public
utilities left many Serbians without power, water and heating. Yet the
Pentagon persisted in saying they were attacking only legitimate
military targets. How could all of this massive civilian destruction
just be collateral damage? Why was a public television station
considered a legitimate military target? "According to the London Daily
Telegraph of July 22, 1999, 'NATO's bombing campaign against Yugoslavia
had almost no military effect on the regime of President Milosevic.'"
It did, however, bring diplomatic ties among NATO partners to the near
breaking point." Of course, if you had been reading my columns during
the past seven months you WOULD have read all those stories while they
were actually news. So, " If news suppression were common in the United
States, one might expect that efforts to identify and publicize the
most important overlooked stories would receive scant attention from
major news outlets."

Will this report and recently published book, "Censored 1999: The News
That Didn't Make the News" receive any publicity from the media it
scolds? Of course not. The story of WHY the media is doing such a poor
job, although often a topic of conversation on talk shows and among
reporters, will not be the subject of a serious analysis at the TV
networks or the large corporate entities which have a big investment in
trying to corner the "news" markets.

Phillips observed: "A review of the top 25 censored stories of last
year suggests that foreign affairs and corporate misdeeds were the most
consistent areas of neglect. In part, this may be explained by
corporate takeovers of the three main television networks by outside
industries beginning in the 1980s, with resultant newsroom layoffs,
closing of foreign news bureaus and potential conflicts of interest."
Actually, I have a different explanation. I think the problem is more
basic. It appears to me that the majority of those reporting and
writing "news"

simply do not understand what news is and how to find it. As I pointed
out during the bombing, some of the top "reporters" in the industry
were assigned to NATO headquarters in Brussels to "report" the story of
NATO bombing Yugoslavia by waiting for Jamie Shea's daily press
conference and press releases. He was obviously simply pulling figures
out the air at times and regurgitating propaganda from the KLA about
what was supposedly happening to the Yugoslav army - destruction of its
airforce, 10,000 killed, most of his tanks destroyed, etc. At one point
he said to the gathered top reporters that Albanian women in refugee
camps had "given birth to 100,000 babies" - obviously the fault of the
indicted "war criminal" in Belgrade - Slobadan Milosevic. The figures
was reported worldwide without question - and not a soul (except me)
questioned how 200,000-300,000 women who fled Kosovo could have
possibly given birth to 100,000 babies in a little more than 2 months.
Shea and the White House talked on CNN daily about "100,000" missing
and killed "Albanians" and "mass graves" containing "hundreds" of
tortured and murdered Albanians. Yet, there were almost NO reporters on
the ground in Yugoslavia and the ones that WERE there were reporting no
signs of thousands of bod

[CTRL] Fw: [apfn] Waco's Little Rock connection + Clinton's Waco Connection

[Lloyd Miller]

 -Caveat Lector-

POSTED APFN MESSAGE BOARD:
[apfn] Waco's Little Rock connection + Clinton's Waco Connection
http://www.insidetheweb.com/mbs.cgi/mb77532

Waco's Little Rock connection By Joseph Farah
World Net Daily. Sept 3 1999
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/bluesky_btl/19990903_xcbtl_wacos_litt.shtml


Finally, there's some finger-pointing going on in the
executive branch of the federal government over the
exterminations of more than 70 men, women and children
at the Branch Davidian church in Waco in 1993.

It's about time. This is progress. But we won't be any
closer to holding the guilty accountable until the White
House connections are fully explored. There's ample reason
to believe Bill Clinton was working behind the scenes on
engineering the initial Waco raid even before he became
president.

One of the original witnesses against the Branch Davidians
was Bill Buford, the agent in charge of the Little Rock, Ark.,
branch of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms.
Buford was, also, according to Arkansas sources, a friend of
Bill. The Waco case was apparently very important to Buford
as an affidavit states he was working on New Year's Day calling
former Branch Davidians seeking to find evidence of sexual
abuse.

My friend and colleague, Andy Beal, who first explored the
Little Rock connection to Waco, asks a good question:
What was the resident agent in charge of the Little Rock
office of the BATF doing investigating a sex abuse case in
Texas? Is ex abuse BATF's jurisdiction? Is Texas under the
jurisdiction of the BATF's Arkansas office?

Documents show Buford is noted as one of two "senior raid
planners." He was also one of the BATF agents wounded
during the Feb. 28 assault, but he is perhaps the only BATF
agent to be visited in the hospital by none other than top
Treasury Department official Roger Altman.

Altman was the long-time "Friend of Bill" appointed to be
deputy secretary of the Treasury and chief executive
officer of the Resolution Trust Corporation. He resigned in
August 1994 due to his interference in the Whitewater
investigation. At the time of the Waco raid, Roger Altman
was the second highest-ranking official at the Department
of the Treasury. The BATF is a bureau within the Treasury
Department.

Is it not possible -- is it not likely, knowing what we know
about the character of the Clinton administration today -- that
the Clinton transition team was involved in the planning of the
initial raid on Waco even before taking power? Remember,
Vincent Foster's wife claimed he blamed himself for the deaths
in Waco. Webster Hubbell, who became the point man between
the Justice Department and White House during the siege, was
also instrumental in that transition to power. Then there's
Altman and Buford.

Foster, Hubbell, Altman and Buford were all in Little Rock
leading up to the inauguration. Clinton takes power Jan. 20,
1993. One month later, the BATF stages the largest and most
dramatic raid in its history -- videotaped in living color in
anticipation of its success in subduing religious
non-conformists in possession of illegal guns.

The injustice and illegality of the initial raid has still
never been fully examined. Today the focus is on how and why
the remaining occupants of the church building were exterminated
in a fire. Yet, the equally puzzling question of why a dynamic
and violent entry was necessary to serve a search warrant on
David Koresh shortly after he went target shooting with
officers of the BATF. The local sheriff offered to serve the
warrant at the general store to avoid any confrontation. There
was simply no need for all the deadly theatrics of the initial raid.

The only reasonable explanation seems to be the one proffered
by the documentary, "Waco: Rules of Engagement," which
postulates that the raid was intended as a public relations effort
by the BATF and a commercial for stricter gun control
enforcement.

There are many unanswered questions when it comes to Waco.
But maybe now it's time to start asking some of the unasked
questions.

What was the involvement in Waco planning of key Clinton
White House officials even before they took power? Was the
Waco raid, in fact, cooked up as a publicity and political stunt
by an incoming administration itching for drama and action? Is
it possible that Clinton and his cronies bear even more
responsibility than any of us imagine for this deadly
escapade?


   A daily radio broadcast adaptation of Joseph Farah's
commentaries can be heard at http://www.ktkz.com/

_


"THE CLINTON CONNECTION"

Justice Department investigation should target UT campus
http://net.cs.utexas.edu/users/boyer/fp/texan-970317.html

   Clayton Vernon  TEXAN COLUMNIST

According to The New York Times, former UT System Regents Chairman
Bernard
Rapoport hired Webster Hubbell for a joint venture with the Riady 

[CTRL] Because it works!!! Carville in Mexico.

[Nurev Ind Research]

 -Caveat Lector-

Exporting the American method of political control.
PR- Real mind control.
It worked in Russia, and installed Yeltsin.
It worked in Israel, and got rid of Netanyahu.
Now it's Mexico's turn to get an American puppet government
installed by popular election.

Only idiots vote for an elite which takes their money and
screws them over, and over. They don't need the threat of
violence to keep the reins of power. They just need morons
to rubber stamp pre-chosen candidates again and again.

It works so well in the USA, that the elites of other countries
are importing America's mind control experts to manipulate their
" democratic process."

Joshua2

==
Wednesday September 1 1:17 AM ET
High-Paid U.S. Political Gurus Enliven Mexico Race
By Michael Christie

-
MEXICO CITY (Reuters) - Mexican politicians are turning to expensive
U.S. political consultants as they battle for the 2000 presidential
nomination of the world's longest-ruling party.

Tabasco state Gov. Roberto Madrazo is being helped by high-powered
advisers Penn, Schoen & Burland, while former interior minister
Francisco Labastida has approached heavyweight James Carville ahead of
the Institutional Revolutionary Party's (PRI's) first primary in
November.

``The (Madrazo) campaign is Mexican, but we have experience and
expertise that we can bring to it, Doug Schoen of Penn, Schoen &
Burland told Reuters by telephone Tuesday.

Charging at least $10,000 a day, or retainers of $50,000 a month,
according to industry sources, U.S. political advisers have gone
global.

Penn, Schoen & Burland has taken part in campaigning in up to 50
countries in the past 20 years, Schoen said.

Carville -- the man who came up with ``Its the economy, stupid, for the
Clinton campaign in the 1992 U.S. presidential race -- helped new
Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Barak to victory in May, having done the
same for British Prime Minister Tony Blair in 1997.

Carville was unavailable for comment, his office said.

Jennifer Laszlo, a Washington-based political consultant not involved
in the Mexican elections, said U.S. advisers had been in demand for
several years.

``But its started to explode, she said. ``We are so far ahead of
everybody else were at the cutting edge because we spend so much money
and never stop having elections.  The U.S. influence is coming across
loud and clear in Mexico's PRI primary campaign, which marks the first
time in the party's 70 years in power that it has put its choice of
presidential candidate to a democratic vote.

Madrazo's campaign has broken all the rules, replacing the usually
staid television spots of traditional Mexican politics with witty and
provocative criticism of his main rival.

Labastida personally has not yet hit back.

But observers note that a vehement personal attack on Madrazo by
Labastida's campaign coordinator, Esteban Moctezuma, who compared the
controversial governor to Adolf Hitler, coincided with a visit to
Mexico City by Carville.

Schoen, working in partnership with consultant Zev Furst, was careful
not to take credit for Madrazo's campaign, which has catapulted him
from upstart to serious contender.

He said the successful spots were the product of the ''creative
genius'' of Mexican publicist Carlos Alazraki, who knew how to strike a
chord with the Mexican people. ``My sense is that the Mexican people
deeply want change, Schoen said.

Help from the north is not to everybody's liking, especially when it
brings with it the big money and adversarial politics of U.S.

electioneering.

``What weve seen is the hard-hitting, no-holds-barred political use of
the media. Thats entirely unusual for Mexican politics, said Mexican
consultant Andres Rozental, adding: ``I think Mexico is probably worse
off for it, especially when it involves an enormous reliance on money.
But the influence of U.S. advisers in Latin America may be doing more
than just spicing up campaign spots. It may also be encouraging a
profound cultural transformation, some say.

Laszlo said Latin American politics had traditionally been decided ``by
an oligarchy, a bunch of affluent men, who set policies from the top
down. U.S. advisers may be persuading their clients to listen to what
the people want.

``This completely changes everything. The message replaces the party as
the most important element, she said.

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. 

Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Lined up for final approach-JFK Jr

[John Szocik]

 -Caveat Lector-

Sorry for the late response. What I believe happened was someone was
monitoring his radio transmissions to the airport,after hearing the last
call, they realized how close he was to the airport and the subsequent
landing. So it was at that moment,(after the call) they needed to bring down
the plane. If they waited just alittle longer, the plane would have been that
much closer to land, which would have made the recovery so much easier.This
also would have afforded the pubic access to the crash site, being so close
to shore. This is something they just could not afford to happen. Too many
people would have seen the remains of the wreckage if not the bodies. This
would make it impossible for them to put their "spin" on the sequence of
events, as well as the aftermath.
JOHN

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

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Om

Re: [CTRL] WACO- THE BIG QUESTION

[Prudence L. Kuhn]

 -Caveat Lector-

In a message dated 09/02/1999 11:08:58 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

<< Koresh WAS a pedophile, no question about that, >>

I don't know if there is any proof of that anywhere, although I heard it
bruted about a good deal.  Where is the proof published?  Prudy

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

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Om

[CTRL] Fwd: Honduran workers tear-gassed, beaten

[Prudence L. Kuhn]

Labor Alerts: a free service of Campaign for Labor Rights
To subscribe or unsubscribe, write to <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>.
Web site: 
Phone: (541) 344-5410 Fax: (541) 431-0523
Membership/newsletter: Send $35.00 to Campaign for Labor Rights, 1247 "E"
Street SE, Washington, DC 20003. Sample newsletter available on request.

HONDURAS: WORKERS TEAR-GASSED, BEATEN
posted September 1, 1999

[This alert was prepared by the U.S./Labor Education in the Americas Project
(US/LEAP): (773) 262-6502, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>.]

In this alert:
Honduran sweatshop workers tear-gassed, beaten
Background
Action requests
Contact information form

Note from Campaign for Labor Rights: The action request in this alert is a
HIGH PRIORITY. The crisis at Kimi underscores the importance of developing a
variety of rapid-response mechanisms. If your local organization has not yet
filled out our contact information form (at the end of this alert), please
do so today.

<><><><><>
HONDURAN WORKERS TEAR-GASSED AND BEATEN WHILE SUPPORTING STRIKING KIMI WORKERS

Workers from neighboring maquila (assembly-for-export) factories who refused
to go to work in a stirring show of solidarity for striking workers at the
Kimi factory in Continental Park in Honduras were tear-gassed and beaten
Monday morning, August 30 by anti-riot police. Many workers were taken to
local hospitals in nearby San Pedro Sula.

As of Monday afternoon, the situation was calm and remained so on Tuesday,
August 31. On Wednesday, at the urging of the Kimi workers, the other
workers in the park returned to work.

The confrontation took place following a weekend blockade of Continental
Park gates by Kimi workers, who were protesting Kimi management's refusal to
respect the collective bargaining negotiated by the Kimi union, SITRAKIMIH,
earlier this year. It is the only collective bargaining agreement in the
eight-factory Continental Park.

Kimi is a long-time supplier for JC Penney. Other U.S. companies sourcing
from Continental Park include The Gap, Phillips-Van Heusen, Kohl's,
Dayton-Hudson, Salant, Gear for Sports and American Eagle.

Kimi workers had shut the park down on Friday and Saturday, August 27/28, by
blocking entrances. They dispersed later in the weekend. When they returned
on Monday, riot police were lined up in front of the gates to allow workers
to enter the industrial park. But in an act of widespread solidarity, most
workers refused to enter the park, even though Kimi workers encouraged them
to do so. A representative from a local radio station then arrived and
reportedly used a megaphone to lead the workers in chants. Without
provocation, police then attacked the workers with tear gas and clubs.

Kimi management met with the union on Monday evening but demanded that the
union's leadership be removed as a condition for negotiations. A second
meeting on Tuesday, August 31 again produced no progress, with Kimi saying
that other maquila operators in the park are threatening to close their
plants if the Kimi union leadership returns. Removal of the union leadership
would be tantamount to destroying the union, and the workers have rejected
this demand. The negotiations have been convened by the Honduran Labor
Ministry and are being observed by the Honduran Maquila Association.

Earlier, on Saturday, August 28, owners of the other maquilas operating in
the park published an ad in the newspaper owned by Continental Park owner
and presidential candidate Jaime Rosenthal warning that the Kimi conflict
was threatening the future of the park and blaming outside agitators and
foreigners for a potential loss of jobs. The ad came in response to the
park's shutdown the previous day and was a clear attempt to threaten park
workers not to support the Kimi workers This attempt failed miserably when
workers refused to enter the park Monday morning despite police escort.

Workers at Continental Park are becoming increasingly militant in supporting
efforts to improve conditions and wages by forming unions. On August 16,
workers at a second factory in the park, Yoo Yang, filed an application for
union recognition. Maquila operators in the park, most of whom are Korean,
are no doubt nervous about the growing efforts by workers in the park to
exercise their basic right to organize.

The union at Kimi, SITRAKIMIH, is affiliated to the International Textile,
Garment and Leather Workers Federation, an international trade secretariat
of apparel unions which, along with UNITE, has been providing on-going
support to the union.

<><><><><>
BACKGROUND

Earlier this year the SITRAKIMIH union won the only collective bargaining
agreement in Continental Park after a two-and-a-half year struggle. But a
month later park owner Rosenthal refused to renew Kimi's lease, reportedly
telling Honduran TV he would never allow a union in his industrial park.
Kimi management then announced it would close the factory in the Park and
relocate at a distance too far for most workers. [See CLR alert posted June
21, 19

Re: [CTRL] (Fwd) Release: Congressional Criminals

[Prudence L. Kuhn]

 -Caveat Lector-

In a message dated 09/02/1999 7:42:20 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

<< WASHINGTON, DC -- A new investigation reveals an
 astonishingly large number of wife-beaters, drunks, shoplifters,
 check-bouncers, business failures, and drug abusers in the U.S. House and
 Senate -- which ought to make Americans think carefully before turning to
 Washington, DC for moral leadership, >>

Anybody ever know anyone who turned to Washington, DC for moral leadership?
Prudy

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
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[CTRL] 3rd World Disease In New York. Malathion To Be Sprayed.

[William Shannon]

 -Caveat Lector-

CITY ON ALERT AS PESTS
SPREAD DEADLY VIRUS

 By DAVID SEIFMAN

New York Post.

--
--

 The city launched an unprecedented war against mosquitoes in northern Queens
yesterday after 24 people were stricken with bug-borne encephalitis - and two
of them died.

Mayor Giuliani urged New Yorkers not to panic, as officials identified the
dead as an 80-year-old man and an 87-year-old woman. The Queens residents
died Tuesday and Thursday, respectively, at Flushing Hospital.

Officials said the man was the first confirmed death in New York City from
St. Louis Encephalitis, a rare but potentially fatal disease of the central
nervous system.

The disease is believed to have killed the woman, too, but officials said
they're awaiting lab results before saying so definitively.

"Obviously, it's easy to say to people don't panic - they shouldn't," said
Mayor Giuliani at a press conference with health and emergency personnel
outside marshy Powell's Cove, believed to be an epicenter of the mosquito
explosion.

"We'll do everything we can to wipe out the mosquito population."

Officials emphasized that the chances of being bitten by the Culex pipiens
mosquito - the only one that carries the virus - were slim. And most of those
who are bitten will develop no symptoms, said Dr. Neal Cohen, the city's
health commissioner.

The virus cannot be transmitted person to person.

"Approximately one out of 300 mosquito bites of an infected mosquito - and
the number of infected mosquitoes is likely to be very small relative to the
overall mosquito population" - will result in transmittal of the disease,
said Cohen.

But Giuliani cautioned, "It can be very, very dangerous, particularly for
people over 60."

Taking no chances, officials mobilized for a type of health emergency more
common to leafy suburbs and Southern swamps than the nation's largest city.

Helicopters filled with Malathion, described as a "quite safe" insecticide,
began spraying sections of College Point, Whitestone and Auburndale for two
hours from 6:45 p.m.

Wide-scale street spraying was planned for today.

More than 250 workers fanned out across a 4-square-mile area, distributing
leaflets about St. Louis Encephalitis and 17,000 cans of insect repellent.

Consumer Affairs Commissioner Jules Polonetsky declared insect and mosquito
repellent in short supply and invoked his emergency power to prohibit
price-gouging on the remaining stock.

"If you can, stay in," Giuliani urged residents in the affected
neighborhoods.

"If you have to go out, wear long-sleeve shirts, pants, socks. Don't wear
shorts."

After spraying himself, the mayor also recommended that residents obtain bug
sprays that contain no more than 30 percent DEET, a powerful insecticide.

Jerry Hauer, director of the mayor's Office of Emergency Management, called
on homeowners to clear their properties of any standing water - breeding
grounds for the biting bugs.

"Even something as small as a flowerpot which has a little dish holding
water," said Hauer. "Mosquitoes are known to breed in that as well."

Giuliani said the city first became aware of a potential health problem about
10 days ago. But he said the Centers for Disease Control didn't confirm it as
St. Louis Encephalitis until 2:30 p.m. yesterday.

The mayor said the stricken include three residents of The Bronx, who live
across from Powell's Cove, and a lower Manhattan man who works in Whitestone.

Ironically, the outbreak occurred in a year of near-drought, when many
traditionally mosquito-ridden areas have been reporting a bite-free summer.

But people living near Powell's Cove say they've been driven batty by
mosquitoes for years.

Bob Dandrea, 41, an engineer who lives on 11th Avenue off 138th Street, said
his family has to sleep under mosquito nets.

"My dog, when she goes out of the house, she comes right back in," said
Dandrea. "This is the first year I've had to brush [the mosquitoes off] my
dog before she comes in."

"They seem to cling to you more," said Richard Reilly, vice president of the
Taxpayers Association of College Point. "As soon as the rain comes, they come
out and they're very aggressive."

Vickey Lanzellotto, who also lives across from Powell's Cove, said the city
stopped spraying the wetlands about 10 years ago because the insecticide
being used turned out to be poisonous.

Dr. Annie Fine, an epidemiologist with the city Health Department, said that
mosquitoes had never posed a health threat here before.

"We have never had a serious outbreak like this as a mosquito-borne illness
in New York City. So there's no health reason we needed to spray for
mosquitoes," she said.

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outrigh

[CTRL] ::: The Marketing of Martian Memetics :::

[Kris Millegan]

 -Caveat Lector-

from alt.conspiracy
-
As always, Caveat Lector.
Om
K
-
::: The Marketing of Martian
Memetics :::
-
Subject: ::: The Marketing of Martian Memetics :::
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Brother Blue)
Date: Fri, 03 September 1999 01:43 PM EDT
Message-id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

::: The Marketing of Martian Memetics :::

[excerpts from _CIA's Role in the Study of UFOs_, 1947-90,
 by Gerald K. Haines]

[...]

"According to [then DCI Walter Bedell] Smith, it was CIA's
responsibility by statute to coordinate the intelligence effort
required to solve the problem.  Smith also wanted to know what
use could be made of the UFO phenomenon in connection with US
*PSYCHOLOGICAL WARFARE* efforts."

[...]

"The Air Force rejected the theories that the sightings involved
US or Soviet secret weapons development or that they involved
'men from Mars'; there was no evidence to support these concepts.
The Air Force briefers sought to explain these UFO reports as
the misinterpretation of known objects or little understood
natural phenomena.  Air Force and CIA officials agreed that
outside knowledge of Agency interest in UFOs would make the
problem more serious.  This concealment of CIA interest
contributed greatly to later charges of a CIA conspiracy and
coverup."

[...]

"The CIA Study Group also searched the Soviet press for UFO
reports, but found none, causing the group to conclude that
the absence of reports had to have been the result of deliberate
Soviet Government policy.  The group also envisioned the USSR's
possible use of UFOs as a *PSYCHOLOGICAL WARFARE* tool."

[...]

"At the same time, pressure was building for the release of the
Robertson panel report on UFOs.  In 1956, Edward Ruppelt, former
head of the Air Force BLUE BOOK [i.e. B:.B:.] project, publicly
revealed the existence of the panel.  A best-selling book by
UFOlogist Donald Keyhoe, a retired Marine Corps major, advocated
release of all government information relating to UFOs.  Civilian
UFO groups such as the National Investigations Committee on Aerial
Phenomena (NICAP) and the Aerial Phenomena Research Organization
(APRO) immediately pushed for release of the Robertson panel
report.  Under pressure, the Air Force approached CIA for
permission to declassify and release the report.  Despite such
pressure, Philip Strong, Deputy Assistant Director of OSI, refused
to declassify the report and declined to disclose CIA sponsorship
of the panel.  As an alternative, the Agency prepared a sanitized
version of the report which deleted any reference to CIA and
avoided mention of any *PSYCHOLOGICAL WARFARE* potential in the UFO
controversy."

[...]

"In the early 1960s, Keyhoe, Davidson, and other UFOlogists
maintained their assault on the Agency for release of UFO
information.  Davidson now claimed that CIA 'was solely
responsible for creating the Flying Saucer furor as a tool
for cold war *PSYCHOLOGICAL WARFARE* since 1951.'"

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

[A recently declassified (FOIA) and highly relevant CIA document.]

[dated 1952]

Central Intelligence Agency, Washington 25, D.C.

Office of the Director

Memorandum to: Director, Psychological Strategy Board

Subject: Flying Saucers

I am today transmitting to the National Security Council
a proposal (TAB A) in which it is concluded that the problems
connected with unidentified flying objects appear to have
implications for *PSYCHOLOGICAL WARFARE* as well as for
intelligence and operations.

The background for this view is presented in some detail in TAB B.

I suggest that we discuss as an early board meeting the possible
offensive or defensive utilization of these phenomena for
*PSYCHOLOGICAL WARFARE* purposes.

Walter B. Smith
Director

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

[commentary on the Pentacle Memorandum by the ineffable Dr. Vallee]

27 April 1993

Barry Greenwood
JUST CAUSE

Dear Barry:

Thank you for sending me your thoughtful commentary about the
Pentacle document.  I do agree with you on one point: the
significance of the memo comes, in part, from what it does not
say.  In particular, it makes no reference to any recovered UFO
hardware, at Roswell or elsewhere, or to alien bodies.  The
greater significance of what it does say will slowly emerge in
coming years as the overall implications come to light.  Let me
draw your attention to three specific points.

Project Twinkle and other observational efforts by the military,
which you mention in an effort to show that Pentacle was only
dusting off an old idea, were purely passive projects.  In sharp
contrast the Pentacle proposal goes far beyond anything mentioned
before.  It daringly states that "many different types of aerial
activity should be SECRETLY AND PURPOSEFULLY SCHEDULED WITHIN
THE AREA (my emphasis)." It is difficult to be more clear.  We
are not talking simply about setting up observing stations and
cameras.  We are talking about large-scale, covert simulation 

Re: [CTRL] Fw: Should we trust the government?

[Prudence L. Kuhn]

 -Caveat Lector-

In a message dated 09/02/1999 7:02:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

<< > In the face of this unprecedented attack on American citizens by
 > agents of their own government, a deadly assault that sparked the
 > militia movement as well as the bombing of the Federal Building in
 > Oklahoma City, an unprecedented silence befell the press. “No one
 > stepped forward to be the Davidians’ friend,” writes Richard Shweder,
 > author of “Thinking Through Cultures,” in the New York Times. “The
 > Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms spent months planning and
 > rehearsing the largest ‘law enforcement’ operation of its 200-year
 > history. This turned out to be a major military operation, worthy of a
 > police state, carried out against the domestic residence of an
 > unpopular and readily stigmatized religious community. The ACLU does
 > not like guns, and it’s very busy, so it didn’t get involved. The
 > religious leaders of our country do not like ‘cults,’ and the women’s
 > movement does not like patriarchal living arrangements, so they didn’t
 > much care. And no one wanted to seem sympathetic to ‘child abuse’ or
 > unsympathetic to the FBI.” >>

I don't know anyone who "trusts" the Government.  Trust is not important
here.  And will you people quit baying about IMPEACHMENT.  Just what good
does or would it do?  I'm so tired of all this basically partisan nonsense.
Janet Reno is not fully to blame for WACO or Ruby Ridge and neither is
Clinton.  Our nation's entire police and intelligence systems have evolved
into a league of crazed gestapo-types, and you think impeachment would have
an affect on that?  We have problems in this town, which is barely a hundred
thousand.  Police officers are required who are not "too intelligent."  God
forbid that we place authority and arms in the hands of anyone who has a high
IQ.  The police in New York City and most other major cities are treating the
citizens who pay their wages as a cross between preferred targets and marks
(an old Carney term), and you want to impeach the president?  There is a lot
here that needs to be done.  Why do our national agencies that are supposed
to be protecting us and our interests behave like badly trained television
swat teams?  What happened to bravery and brains?  What happeded to the low
key and very effective presence that used to be law enforcement?  Police were
always present, but they didn't feel obligated to shoot or beat up every
citizen who bumped into them.   Why do they now?  There's a lot that needs to
be done here, and I suggest that citizens start finding a way that they can
be saved from the police and federal agencies which now seem only to be
looking for excuses to abuse them.  It has nothing to do with Clinton or
Reno.  It didn't start with Clinton's administration, and it won't stop with
a Republican in the White House either.  Remember all that "LAW AND ORDER"
you wanted?  Well to carefully recruited, not too smart folks who are now
serving as our nation's finest.  That means, lock and load and go get em'
Prudy

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

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[CTRL] Fwd: The Week Online with DRCNet, Issue #106

[Kris Millegan]

 
The Week Online with DRCNet, Issue #106 -- September 3, 1999
   A Publication of the Drug Reform Coordination Network

 PLEASE COPY AND DISTRIBUTE 

(To sign off this list, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] with the
 line "signoff drc-natl" in the body of the message, or
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance.  To subscribe to
 this list, visit .)

This issue can be also be read on our web site at
.



TABLE OF CONTENTS

1. California Governor Offers to Sign Revised Needle
   Exchange Bill
   http://www.drcnet.org/wol/106.html#ab518

2. CASA Study Finds Marijuana Easier for Teens to Get Than
   Beer
   http://www.drcnet.org/wol/106.html#casastudy

3. Doctor Sanctioned for Undertreating Patients' Pain
   http://www.drcnet.org/wol/106.html#painsanctions

4. Los Angeles Police Forcibly Enter Home, Kill Grandfather
   in Raid
   http://www.drcnet.org/wol/106.html#badraid

5. News in Brief
   http://www.drcnet.org/wol/106.html#newsbriefs

6. Swiss Government Promises Marijuana Decriminalization
   http://www.drcnet.org/wol/106.html#swissdecrim

7. ACLU Report Urges Businesses to Rethink Employee Drug
   Testing
   http://www.drcnet.org/wol/106.html#aclureport

8. Media Alert:  Print and Screen
   http://www.drcnet.org/wol/106.html#printandscreen



1. California Governor Offers to Sign Revised Needle
   Exchange Bill

After threatening to veto AB 518, a needle exchange bill 
passed by both houses of the California legislature, Gov. 
Gray Davis has offered to sign a compromise bill that allows 
communities to authorize needle exchange programs, but only 
by issuing emergency orders that must be renewed every two 
weeks.  Davis' shift follows calls from elected officials of 
both parties, including Los Angeles Mayor Richard Riordan, a 
Republican, and 21 members of California's Congressional 
delegation, in an open letter organized by U.S. Rep. Nancy 
Pelosi.  AB 518 was sponsored by Assemblymember Kerry 
Mazzoni, who represents Marin County, one of the 
jurisdictions that issues emergency orders to protect the 
local needle exchange.  The original bill required local 
authorization of needle exchange programs, but did not 
require the biweekly emergency orders.

In a statement issued on Wednesday, 9/1, Pat Christen, 
Executive Director of the San Francisco AIDS Foundation, 
said, "It is deeply discouraging that a compromise was 
necessary given the lives at stake, the overwhelming 
scientific evidence and the polling data in support of 
needle exchange.  Nevertheless, the compromise is clearly a 
step in the right direction, consistent with our agency's 
harm reduction approach to HIV prevention."  SFAF operates 
the HIV Prevention Point needle exchange, the largest such 
program in the country, which provides over 2.1 million 
syringes annually, to over 5,000 people.

Many communities, however, have shied away from needle 
exchange programs, due to the legal ambiguity of local 
official support vs. state law that makes provision of 
syringes without a prescription a misdemeanor.  SFAF Public 
Policy Director Regina Arag¢n said, "Our hope is that, once 
[AB 518 is] enacted, additional communities across the state 
will take advantage of these legal protections."

Because the exact language of the compromise has not been 
finalized, it is not yet possible to assess the likely 
impact on communities that wish to offer needle exchange.

(See http://www.drcnet.org/wol/105.html#nepsupport for 
results of the recent Field Institute survey and 
http://www.drcnet.org/wol/104.html#caldelegation for 
additional background information on AB 518.  Visit Syringe 
Exchange Resources Online at http://www.projectsero.org for 
much more about the needle exchange issue.)



2. CASA Study Finds Marijuana Easier for Teens to Get Than
   Beer

Joe Califano's Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse 
released results this week of a survey that asked 2,000 
teens and 1,000 parents about attitudes and opinions on 
drugs and drug use.  Among the least surprising, if most 
trumpeted results are findings that teens who have stable 
relationships with both parents are less likely to use drugs 
than those who describe their intra-familial relationships 
as antagonistic.

Bonnie Ross, a high school prevention, resource and 
intervention counselor in Oregon, told The Week Online that 
the issue of kids' parental relationships as a risk factor 
for substance abuse was a no-brainer.

"How much did they spend to do that survey?" she asked.  
"That conclusion would be a pretty obvious one for anyone 
who works with kids who use or abuse drugs.  The money for 
that survey would have been better spent on resources for 
these kids.  Stable connections, whether it be with parents, 
educators, coaches, any caring adult, really, serve as an 
anchor.  Kids who feel disconnected and adrift in the wo

[CTRL] Dallas Morning News Waco News Archive

[Lucio Benedetto]

 -Caveat Lector-

The Dallas Morning News has links to all recent and related Waco siege
stories at the following URL:

http://www.dallasmorningnews.com/specials/waco/

Cheers,

Lucio
http://memebers.tripod.com/gonzolinks
Bringing you the best of the broadband apocalypse

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
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Om

[CTRL] ATF attempts to block search for [Waco] siege evidence

[Lucio Benedetto]

 -Caveat Lector-

ATF attempts to block search for siege evidence
Judge acts to let Rangers look for tear-gas shell
09/04/99
http://www.dallasmorningnews.com/specials/waco/0904waco1evidence.htm

By Lee Hancock / The Dallas Morning News

A federal judge was forced to intervene Friday after the federal Bureau of
Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms tried to block Texas Rangers from searching a
Waco storage facility for evidence that pyrotechnic devices were fired at
the Branch Davidian complex.

The brief skirmish came as FBI officials in Washington released the second
of two newly discovered aerial videotapes that include conversations between
FBI commanders about the use of combustible tear-gas canisters.

On the tape, which runs from 7:57 a.m. to just before 9:30 a.m. on the final
day of the siege, agents report that "military gas" fired at an underground
bunker adjacent to the compound had failed to penetrate its target.

In other developments Friday, law enforcement officials provided The Dallas
Morning News more details of what the FBI had denied for six years until
recently - that military-issue tear-gas canisters were used in the April 19,
1993, assault near Waco.

For instance:

* FBI officials said last week they discovered a Feb. 15, 1996, internal
memo acknowledging the use of "two or three military gas rounds" during the
siege among files of the agency's general counsel's office.

A federal official who spoke on condition of anonymity said Friday that the
memo stated that no military tear gas was fired directly at the compound
because of "the potential for causing a fire."

The FBI had prepared the memo in response to questions raised by U.S.
Justice Department lawyers defending a wrongful-death lawsuit filed by
Branch Davidians and their families.

* A General Accounting Office report on military assistance at the siege
found that FBI agents had obtained 50 40 mm "illumination rounds," or
flares, and 250 40 mm "high explosive" rounds from the U.S. Army for use
during the standoff.

All of the rounds can be fired with the hand-held M-79 grenade launchers
that FBI agents used to send tear-gas rounds into the compound, according to
the report, which was released last week.

Illumination rounds were used by FBI teams to burn down the cabin hideout of
white supremacist Robert Matthews after he shot and wounded one FBI agent
and engaged in a gunbattle with others in 1984.

Reason for rounds

When asked Friday about the need for such devices during the Branch Davidian
siege, an FBI official said the illumination rounds were probably sought
from the military because "we had people sneaking in [to the compound] at
night, and we had people trying to sneak out.

"But why they had the H-E [high explosive] rounds, I don't know," said the
official, who spoke on the condition he would not be named.

Cult leader David Koresh and about 80 followers died during a fire that
broke out after noon on April 19, 1993, at the end of a 51-day standoff with
the FBI. The siege began Feb. 28, 1993, with a deadly shootout as federal
agents tried to arrest Mr. Koresh on weapons charges.

The government's admission that pyrotechnic devices were used came only
after a former FBI official told The News that two military CS tear-gas
grenades had been fired at the bunker. The FBI has said the canisters did
not cause the blaze.

Attorney General Janet Reno told reporters Friday that she had expressly
ordered the FBI not to use pyrotechnic devices of any kind when she approved
their plan to assault the Branch Davidian compound with tanks and tear gas.

"What I asked for were assurances - and I received assurances - that we
would not use incendiary devices or pyrotechnic means of delivering
incendiary devices. And I made no distinction between any part of the
compound," she said.

Infrared tapes

U.S. marshals dispatched by the Justice Department found aerial infrared
videotapes spanning the first hours of the early-morning assault at the FBI
offices in Quantico, Va.

A tape released Thursday captured a radio transmission in which the FBI's
Hostage Rescue Team commander, Richard M. Rogers, granted permission for an
agent to fire military tear-gas rounds at the bunker.

The tape released Friday includes transmissions of agents saying the
military canisters fired from a Bradley fighting vehicle didn't get into the
bunker. "The military gas did not penetrate that bunker. . . . It bounced
off," a male voice says at 8:08 a.m.

Texas Rangers began uncovering evidence that pyrotechnic tear-gas rounds
were used by the FBI almost a month before the latest disclosures. The
Rangers were brought in when the Branch Davidian standoff began, and they
were asked by the Justice Department to keep all of the key evidence from
the resulting criminal investigations and trials.

This summer, the Rangers began an inquiry to try to resolve questions about
unidentified shell casings and projectiles in their evidence lockers.

They have identified one of the shel

[CTRL] hillary for prez

[M Shrum]

 -Caveat Lector-

Sorry, Friend! you got it backwards: HILLARY is the one running the
country. Bill is merely her puppet/spokesman!
--
Michael & The Outlawlady
The Joshua Files
http://members.spree.com/education/2302410/

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Om

[CTRL] Rebel Without a Cause: Dennis Hopper, now 63

[Bard]

 -Caveat Lector-

ISSUE 1562 Saturday 4 September 1999
Fit to be tamed

Dennis Hopper has put behind him four wives and addictions to both alcohol
and drugs. Now 63 and married to a woman half his age, he is taking care of
business again, making three films a year, building up his art collection
and planning a worldwide exhibition of his photographs. By Jessica de
Rothschild
DRIVING down the LA highway isn't quite what it used to be. For one thing,
there is the infamous traffic, slowly snaking through the afternoon heat.
For another, the aggressive urban sprawl has resulted in a surfeit of ugly
shopping malls, fast-food diners and high-rise apartment blocks that appear
incongruous in a town obsessed by appearances. Sandwiched between the
freeway and the sea is Venice. Traditionally home to artists and artisans,
it too has suffered the curse of gentrification. But although the small
shops and quirky bars are increasingly under threat from the developers, it
still has a reputation as a hotbed of creative talent and hippie ideals.
Normally, movie stars prefer to live in Beverly Hills or Bel Air, in large
mansions with Gone with the Wind-style staircases, but Dennis Hopper isn't a
normal movie star and Venice, with all its diversity, suits him perfectly.


Dennis Hopper with his wife Victoria Cane Duffy at the Cannes Film Festival
in 1997

Hopper lives with his fifth wife, the actress Victoria Duffy Hopper, in a
building that looks like a large silver church, a couple of blocks back from
the beach. Flanked by a white picket-fence, the building seems to shoot out
of the ground like a rocket, and apart from a large door set in the
corrugated iron facade, there is nothing to suggest that anyone lives there.
It is, in fact, a studio designed by Frank Gehry which, along with two other
buildings, combines to make an extensive network of walkways and spaces that
are crammed to the rafters with canvases.

Hopper is in his office with one of his assistants, checking a seemingly
endless list of paintings that have been catalogued for insurance purposes.
Dressed in a baseball cap and golfing trousers, he wears a deep tan and is
palpably relaxed. The famous gravelly voice which has made numerous
audiences squirm is in reality soft and courteous. Nevertheless, that famous
'it' factor, the thing that propels you from waiting at tables to front row
at the Oscars, is at full force. Andy Warhol painted the icons of his time.
Dennis Hopper is one of the survivors.

It is incredible to think that Hopper, now 63, has been involved in the film
industry for more than 40 years. Not just because longevity is so rare in an
industry which is notorious for its rapid turnover of 'talent', but because
Hopper's well-documented addiction to drugs and alcohol kept him away from
the Hollywood mainstream for nearly 15 years. Sober and drug-free since
1983, he now makes an average of three films a year, often in the
independent sector.

His staying-power means that the teenagers who first saw him in Rebel
Without a Cause with James Dean and as the drugged-out anti-hero in the 1969
film Easy Rider are probably the parents of the whole new generation of fans
who were won over by his roles in True Romance and Speed. Along the way he
has garnered one Oscar nomination in 1986 for Hoosiers, as a former
basketball star who is enlisted to coach the local team, and a reputation
for playing some of the most terrifying criminals and madmen on film. But it
is for Easy Rider that Hopper will be remembered, the film that along with
Warren Beatty's Bonnie and Clyde changed the face of modern cinema.

What is not as widely known about Dennis Hopper is that as well as actor and
director, he is a photographer, painter and a major modern art collector
with more than 200 works in his collection. You only have to look around the
house to see the evidence. In one room, which houses a small screening
theatre, there are hundreds of black and white photographs stacked against a
wall, waiting to be catalogued for Hopper's retrospective exhibition, which
will be shown around the world next year. In another room several partitions
slide in and out of the wall, all hung with different works and displayed
according to mood. Downstairs, even the strange indoor garage which opens on
to the sitting-room is filled with portraits, and upstairs the man himself
is the subject of a 1971 Warhol that hangs next to the fireplace.

'I've been married five times, so very often the collection stays with the
last wife,' Hopper laughs, lighting a massive cigar, probably one of the few
vices left that he is allowed to indulge in. 'But a lot of the paintings
have ended up in museums or in various universities around the United
States.'

Hopper's first collection, which he started in 1961, went to his first wife,
Brooke Hayward (the daughter of producer Leland Hayward), when their
eight-year marriage fell apart. It had included Warhol's first Campbell's
Soup tin painting - which he bought fo

Re: [CTRL] WACO Spin

[Sean McDougal]

 -Caveat Lector-

Original Message Follows
From: William Shannon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

You want WACO SPIN???
How about Koresh was a pedophile, a Christian KOOK, and a fella' who REFUSED
a lawful inquiry...
let us not deify this douche-bag...he's not worthy!

--I
responded:
sounds personaleither you had a hands on role in the case, or you knew
Koresh personally, or you are spewing cow puckey.

which is it?
--
William Shannon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said [in a personal email not sent to
the list]:


It's no more personal than those who choose to deify the guy. No role in the
case, didn't know the kook...as for spewing "cow puckey", if giving educated
opinion qualifies...I guess so...I wonder though, is it only "cow puckey"
when YOU don't agree with the stated opinion?
--
I say:
I believe that questions remain unanswered.  With the FBI's stance being
constantly contradicted by the evidence, often forcing them to pubicly
backtrack, something smells fishy.  I have not made up my mind because so
many questions remain unanswered.  YOU, on the other hand, don't seem to
need this multitude of questions answered in order to KNOW that everything
the FBI has said on this case just HAS to be true.  I do not purport to know
what happened.  YOU do.  So unless you had a hands on role in the case [in
which case I urge you to share what you know], you either knew Koresh and
have something personal against him [in which case I urge you to share what
you know] or you are spewing python poopoo.

So which is it?

__
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
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Om

[CTRL] Fw: RITALIN & NAZISM

[Lloyd Miller]

 -Caveat Lector-

From: Ian Goddard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


A question of ethics...

ARGUMENTATION PURPORTING THAT THE
LONG-TERM COMPULSORY USE OF RITALIN
BY CHILDREN VIOLATES ANTI-NAZI LAW:

The Nuremberg Code was written to
protect All People from the types
of crimes against humanity committed
by the Nazi regime. The Nuremberg Code
states that in medical experimentation
"voluntary consent of the human subject
is absolutely essential." The Code also
states that such consent must be obtained
"without the intervention of any element
of force, fraud, deceit, duress, over-
reaching, or other ulterior form of
constraint or coercion..." [1]

Let's observe how the long-term use of
Ritalin by children (given to millions
of kids to make them more obedient in
school) can violate the Nuremberg Code:

LONG-TERM RITALIN SAFETY & EFFICACY
IN CHILDREN IS STILL EXPERIMENTAL

The manufacturer of Ritalin (Novartis)
states in their current package insert:

 "Sufficient data on safety and efficacy
 of long-term use of Ritalin in children
 are not yet available. ... Long-term
 effects of Ritalin in children have
 not been well established." (1998)

This means that long-term use of Ritalin in
children is still in the experimental stage
and conforms to the definition of "medical
experiment": a tentative medical procedure.
Furthermore, data is gathered by the FDA on
adverse effects of approved drugs in order
to monitor for potential health hazards,
which constitutes an ongoing drug experiment
in which all drug-using patients are subjects,
which is a major part of the long-term data.

Long-term use in children is also ALWAYS
a test, or experiment, per child to see
if Ritalin continues to suppress or begins
to cause other forms of harm to the child.
(Research suggests that long-term Ritalin
use could be associated with brain atrophy,
psychiatric disorders, and stunted growth.
It should also be noted that in medical
research the phrase "long-term" can mean
anywhere from three weeks to three years.)

RITALIN USE BY KIDS IS INHERENTLY COERCIVE

As Peter Breggin, MD, has established, [2]
many-to-most children don't like and don't
want to take Ritalin. This indicates that
children are being coerced to take Ritalin.

Even if a child offers no resistance, the
conditions for obtaining consent stipulated
in the Nuremberg Code can still be violated
by the very nature of a child's powerless
subordination to the rule of adults, which
clearly constitutes an "element of force."
(An aside: the Nuremberg Code also states
that a subject must "have legal capacity
to give consent," which no child has).

ERGO: since long-term Ritalin use by children
is experimental, and since it always will be
experimental for each individual, if Ritalin
use by a child is coerced, however subtle that
coercion may be, this constitutes involuntary
human experimentation that is a violation of
the Nuremburg Code, and as such, it constitutes
a crime against humanity. Millions of children
in US schools are likely victims of such Nazism.
   _
   [1] The Nuremberg Code (see requirement number 1):
   http://www.med.nus.edu.sg/phar/sgcpp/nuremburg.htm
   [2] "Talking Back To Ritalin," Peter Breggin, MD.
   See chapter 5 "'They Never Like The Medication'"
   http://www.breggin.com/prbbooks.html or library
   Side Effects of Ritalin Everyone Should Know:
   http://www.breggin.com/ritalinbkexcerpt.html
   This article on Ritalin will be posted here:
   http://www.erols.com/igoddard/nazi-rit.htm

   -- copyright 1999 Ian Williams Goddard --


GODDARD'S JOURNAL: http://www.erols.com/igoddard/journal.htm


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Re: [CTRL] WACO- THE BIG QUESTION (Time For The Truth)

[YnrChyldzWyld]

 -Caveat Lector-

From: William Shannon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Koresh WAS a pedophile, no question about that,

Actually, there's a very BIG question about that allegation...it was
thoroughly investigated by the State of Texas before the feds got
involved, and all the charges were deemed without basis...

It was shortly after Texas made that decision that the feds decided to
get involved


> but WHY didn't he and the
> rest of his "Branch DavIdiots" comply with the fed's???

Why should they?  I suggest you read the Bill of Rights...


> Why barricade yourself inside a "compound"

They weren't 'barricaded' until the feds decided to illegally invade...


> If any of us refused a lawful request

WAS it lawful?


> If everything was so legit (not his offspring though) why not air these
> things in public???

Get a copy of the December 1993 issue of Bible Review...in it, the
editors of the magazine have an article detailing their attempts to talk
to Koresh, and hear what he had to say...at first, the feds welcomed
their help, but after Clinton took office, the editors of BR found the
feds less and less willing to listen to them, finally revealing that the
feds completely ignored their recommendations to hold off, at least until
after Passover and Easter...when Koresh was supposed to have his final
treatise finished...for some reason the feds seemed intent on NOT having
whatever Koresh wrote in that be let out to the public (Koresh was going
to release it to the editors of BY for publication)

The article is very critical of the feds, and the way they handled the
situation...

There has been a document that has circulated on the Internet purporting
to be Koresh's last document, his interpretation of the Seventh Seal...
but according to the editors of BR, the feds grabbed this diskette when
it was attempted to be snuck out of the compound, and apparantly they've
never let it go...so I suspect that the document that has circulated
onthe Internet is either a forgery, or a 3rd party's guess as to what
Koresh put in there...


> In a court where reporters would be there, maybe even CourtTV!

Which wasn't in existence, or at least in a very limited market, in 1993.

You believe everything you see on TV?  Especially orchestrated televised
courtroom melodramas, where every action and statement is later
interpreted for us by the blowdried blowhards who know who butters their
bread?


June ;-)

*===*
 If we listened to our intellect, we'd never have a love affair.  We'd
 never have a friendship.  We'd never go into business, because we'd be
 cynical.  Well, that's nonsense.  You've got to jump off cliffs all the
 time and build your wings on the way down.

   ---Ray Bradbury
*===*
*---*
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[CTRL] Waco Spin

[Sean McDougal]

 -Caveat Lector-

Original Message Follows
From: William Shannon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

You want WACO SPIN???
How about Koresh was a pedophile, a Christian KOOK, and a fella' who REFUSED
a lawful inquiry...
let us not deify this douche-bag...he's not worthy!

--
sounds personaleither you had a hands on role in the case, or you knew
Koresh personally, or you are spewing cow puckey.

which is it?

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==
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and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

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Re: [CTRL] Marshals Acting on Reno's Orders Seize F.B.I. Tape

[Sean McDougal]

 -Caveat Lector-

<< Myron Marlin, a Justice Department spokesman, said tonight that the
Justice Department did not learn of the tape's existence until today. "The
F.B.I. informed the department that it had come across the material in
Quantico, Va.," he said. "On learning of the discovery of the material,
senior officials of the Justice Department immediately directed the marshals
to take possession of and inventory the materials at the
F.B.I.'sheadquarters." >>

I am more than a little suspicious of anything that the FBI informs ANYONE
of, ESPECIALLY regarding the Mt. Carmel massacre.  Are we to believe that
the FBI is handing over evidence that could damn them to hell?

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==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
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Re: [CTRL] (Fwd) More on Hillary for prez

[Tenorlove]

 -Caveat Lector-

--- lfaith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
<>

Out to STUD?
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DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
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Re: [CTRL] OPEN POLLINATED Seed sources,

[Tenorlove]

 -Caveat Lector-

Lyn, could you please post info about NZ seed companies? I have a
friend in NZ who would be interested. Thanks, Tenorlove
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DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
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Re: [CTRL] Earthquake In Illinois

[William Shannon]

 -Caveat Lector-

In a message dated 9/4/99 1:38:05 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:

<< Us downstaters elect a bumpkin?  Let's look at the numbers.  Chicago, Cook
 County and the collar counties contain the majority of the state's
population.
 Unless your people up there don't vote, where even the dead vote, I find it
hard
 to see us electing anyone.
  >>

Well, I AM talking about Fitzgerald...he's a rich moron who certainly doesn't
deserve his senate seat. Ya' see, CMB won Chicago, idiot Fitzgerald took
everywhere else, in a way YOU folk elected him...thanks for nothing!

Bill.

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
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screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
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[CTRL] Waco Documentary Changes Views of the Disaters

[Richard Sampson]

 -Caveat Lector-

http://www.reagan.com/HotTopics.main/HotMike/document-9.23.1997.4.html

THE REAGAN INFORMATION
 INTERCHANGE

 WACO: The Rules
 of Engagement -
 "No Doubt the
 Original Raid Was
 Publicity Stunt"

Waco Documentary Changes Views of the Disaters

 September 19, 1997

 A documentary directed and edited by William
 Gazecki. Running time: 135 minutes. No MPAA
 rating (scenes of violence and corpses; unsuitable
 for younger viewers).

 BY ROGER EBERT, Of Chicago Sun Times

 Like many news-drenched Americans, I paid
 only casual attention to the standoff at Waco,
 Texas, between the Branch Davidians and two
 agencies of the federal government. I came away
 with the vague impression that the "cult,'' as it
 was always styled, was a group of gun-toting
 crackpots, that they killed several U.S. agents,
 refused to negotiate and finally shot themselves
 and burned down their "compound'' after the
 feds tried to end the siege peacefully with tear
 gas.

 Watching William Gazecki's remarkable
 documentary "Waco: The Rules of Engagement,''
 I am more inclined to use the words "religion''
 than "cult,'' and "church center'' than
 "compound.'' Yes, the Branch Davidians had
 some strange beliefs, but no weirder than those
 held by many other religions. And it is pretty
 clear, on the basis of this film, that the original
 raid was staged as a publicity stunt, and the final
 raid was a government riot--a tragedy caused by
 uniformed boys with toys.

 Of course I am aware that "Waco'' argues its
 point of view, and that there is no doubt another
 case to be made. What is remarkable, watching
 the film, is to realize that the federal case has not
 been made. Evidence has been "lost,'' files and
 reports have "disappeared,'' tapes have been
 returned blank, participants have not testified
 and the "crime scene,'' as a Texas Ranger
 indignantly testifies, was not preserved for
 investigation, but razed to the ground by the
 FBI--presumably to destroy evidence.

 The film is persuasive because:

1. It presents testimony from both sides, and
shies away from cheap shots. We feel we are
seeing a fair attempt to deal with facts.

2. Those who attack the government are not
simply lawyers for the Branch Davidians or
muckraking authors (although they are
represented) but also solid middle-American
types like the county sheriff, the district
Texas Rangers, the FBI photographer on the
scene, and the man who developed and
patented some of the equipment used by the
FBI itself to film devastating footage that
appears to show its agents firing into the
buildings--even though the FBI insists it did
not fire a single shot.

3. The eyes of the witnesses. We all have
built-in truth detectors, and although it is
certainly possible for us to be deceived, there
is a human instinct that is hard to fool. Those
who argue against the government in this
film seem to be telling the truth, and their
eyes seem to reflect inner visions of what
they believe happened, or saw happen. Most
of the government defenders, including an
FBI spokesman and Attorney General Janet
Reno, seem to be following rehearsed scripts
and repeating cant phrases. Reno comes
across particularly badly: Either she was
misled by the FBI and her aides, or she was
completely out of touch with what was
happening.

 If the film is to be believed, the Branch Davidians
 were a harmless if controversial group of
 religious zealots, their beliefs stretching back
 many decades, who were singled out for
 attention by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and
 Firearms for offenses, real or contrived,
 involving the possession of firearms--which is far
 from illegal in Texas. The ATF hoped by raiding
 the group to repair its tarnished image. And
 when four of itsagents, and several Davidians,
 were killed in a misguided raid, they played
 cover-up and turned the case over to the FBI,
 which mishandled it even more spectacularly.

 What is clear, no matter which side you believe,
 is that during the final deadly FBI raid on the
 buildings, a toxic and flammable gas was
 pumped into the compound even though women
 and children were inside. "Tear gas'' sounds
 innocent, but this type of gas could undergo a
 chemical transformation intocyanide, and there is
 a pitiful shot of an 8-year-old child's body bent
 double, backward, by the muscular contractions
 caused by cyanide.

 What comes through strongly is the sense that
 the attackers were "boys with toys.'' The film
   

[CTRL] ATF Agents Accused of Threatening Witness

[Richard Sampson]

 -Caveat Lector-

http://www.reagan.com/HotTopics.main/HotMike/document-8.6.1997.3.html

 ATF Agents
 Accused of
 Threatening
 Witness to
 Suppress Evidence
 of Davidians
 Legal Gun
 Business

 JUSTICE
 DEPARTMENT
 INVESTIGATING KORESH'S GUN
 DEALER'S CHARGES AGAINST ATF
 AGENTS

 From: Carol Moore - Waco Justice Committee

 After ATF's brutal February 28, 1993 attack on
 the Davidians, Henry McMahon, David Koresh's
 gun dealer, would have happily told the FBI and
 the press that the Davidians' large purchases
 were for legitimate business purposes and not
 part of some nefarious cultist gun plot. That is
 why on March 1, 1993 ATF agents spirited him
 and his girlfriend Karen Kilpatrick away from
 their new home in Florida, claiming Davidians
 were coming to kill them. Once ATF got them to
 McMahon's father's in Oregon, ATF agents
 threatened to destroy McMahon's gun business if
 he spoke out. McMahon recorded the calls. ATF
 brought them back to Texas a few weeks later
 and ATF agents Davy Aguilera and Dale
 Littleton threatened to have them prosecuted for
 conspiracy if they did not waive their rights and
 speak to agents. Littleton pushed Kilpatrick up
 against a wall. This is certainly worse than what
 the FBI did to Richard Jewell!

 McMahon and Kilpatrick originally spoke with
 the NRA, which later lost interest in their case,
 and they could not raise enough money to file a
 civil suit against ATF and its agents within the
 statute of limitations. They contacted Senator
 Spector who was going to call them for hearings
 last fall against ATF. He then canceled the
 hearings because ATF was doing such a "good
 job" investigating church burnings.

 However, Spector did support McMahon and
 Kilpatrick when they filed a complaint with the
 Department of Justice (through their local
 prosecutors) against the ATF agents. They
 recently were interviewed by the FBI and have
 been told by Justice Department attorneys they
 have a very prosecutable case against the ATF
 agents. In fact, the case may go before a grand
 jury.

 Unfortunately, the Washington and major press
 have not yet picked up on this story, something
 sure to make the always-reluctant Justice
 Department find some excuse for not bring this
 abuse of citizens' rights to a grand jury. So feel
 free to get this story out to whatever press you
 know. Have them contact me for the McMahon's
 phone number. They are happy to tell their story.

 (Note: McMahon and Kirkpatrick have a web
 page ( www.dmi.net/waco/) but no e-mail
 address. Also note: McMahon likes to correct the
 oft-made assertion he was a Class III gun dealer
 in the state of Texas, which he was not. He was
 previously a Class Dealer in another state.)

--
---
NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material is
distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior
interest in receiving this information for non-profit research and
educational purposes only. For more information go to:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml
---

DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
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[CTRL] Film producer says flash-bangs may have started fire at Mount Carmel

[Richard Sampson]

 -Caveat Lector-

http://www.accesswaco.com/auto/feed/news/local/1999/09/03/936404068.21703.0065.0446.html

Film producer says flash-bangs may have started fire at Mount Carmel

 By MARK ENGLAND Tribune-Herald staff writer

 A film producer claims an evidence log put together by
 the Texas Department of Public Safety shows that
 flash-bangs were found near three spots where the
 fires that destroyed Mount Carmel are thought to have
 originated.

 Flash-bangs are concussion devices meant to startle
 and contain a small amount of pyrotechnics.

 Mike McNulty — apparently the only outsider to view
 the evidence stored for the upcoming civil lawsuit filed
 by surviving Davidians against the government —
 thinks the public is paying too much attention to the
 furor over military tear gas, which is an incendiary
 device, being used on bunkers located away from the
 rambling wooden structure that housed David Koresh
 and his followers.

 "I'm telling you, those two projectiles didn't start the
 fire," said McNulty, one of the producers of "Waco:
 Rules of Engagement." "Other devices may have. We
 should be talking about those."

 Earlier this year, McNulty was given access to the
 Davidian evidence held in Austin by Assistant United
 States Attorney Bill Johnston of Waco. McNulty said
 the flash-bangs were mislabeled as silencers or
 suppressors. Anyone looking at an inventory of the
 evidence wouldn't know any flash-bangs had been
 found inside Mount Carmel, he said.

 "We found six of these in the evidence chain,"
 McNulty said. "Two of those were found outside the
 building. Four were found inside the building — three
 at the points of origin of the fire."

 His declaration is based on an evidence log put
 together by DPS detailing where each piece of
 evidence was found, McNulty said. Also, arson
 investigators chosen by the FBI determined that the
 fire that killed Koresh and 75 followers started
 simultaneously in three places.

 DPS officials declined to comment on McNulty's
 assertion since the evidence is now technically in the
 custody of U.S. District Judge Walter S. Smith Jr. of
 Waco.

 Smith ordered the U.S. Marshals Service to take
 custody of the evidence, although it has yet to be
 transferred.

 FBI spokesman Tron Brekke said no flash-bangs
 were used on the day of the Davidian fire, April 19,
 1993. The Justice Department report on "the events
 at Waco" notes that flash-bangs were used
 periodically during the siege. Agents tossed
 flash-bangs toward Davidians who stepped outside
 Mount Camel on several occasions, according to the
 report.

 Brekke said he wouldn't be surprised to learn that
 flash-bangs were found inside Mount Carmel.

 "Fifty-something days before there had been an
 assault by the ATF, if you'll remember," Brekke said.
 "There are all kinds of possibilities ... I'm not surprised
 that they were found somewhere inside. No."

 Brekke said the FBI still believes the Davidians
 started the fire.

 Government bugs inside Mount Carmel picked up
 voices yelling, "Start the fire," and "The fire is lit,"
 among other things. Surviving Davidians, though,
 claimed tanks rumbling into their residence knocked
 over lanterns.

 How flammable are flash-bangs?

 Tony Cooper, a University of Texas-Dallas professor
 and law enforcement consultant, said flash-bangs
 have the potential to start a fire.

 "They're called stun grenades," Cooper said. "They're
 designed to produce a shock wave, which is
 supposed to have an inhibiting effect against those it's
 used on. They're used to attack hijackers aboard
 aircrafts, for example. Anything of an explosive nature,
 if it comes in contact with materials with a propensity
 to go up in flames, can act as a kind of detonating
 agent."

 

Re: [CTRL] WACO- THE BIG QUESTION

[William Shannon]

 -Caveat Lector-

In a message dated 9/3/99 10:35:39 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

<< so you  admit that our government has declared war upon the people it is
sworn to protect?  interesting. >>


Uhh, no. Where do I admit this??


<>

No, I believe that in this case Koresh and Co. have become a useful, though
misguided, symbol for anti-government extremists to rally behind. I'm very
openminded, but neither blind nor stupid.

[CTRL] ATF attempts to block search for siege evidence

[Richard Sampson]

 -Caveat Lector-

http://www.dallasnews.com/specials/waco/0904waco1evidence.htm

ATF attempts to block search for siege evidence

 Judge acts to let Rangers look for
 tear-gas shell

 09/04/99

 By Lee Hancock / The Dallas Morning News

 A federal judge was forced to intervene
 Friday after the federal Bureau of Alcohol,
 Tobacco and Firearms tried to block Texas
 Rangers from searching a Waco storage
 facility for evidence that pyrotechnic
 devices were fired at the Branch Davidian
 complex.

 The brief skirmish came as FBI officials in
 Washington released the second of two
 newly discovered aerial videotapes that
 include conversations between FBI
 commanders about the use of combustible
 tear-gas canisters.

 On the tape, which runs from 7:57 a.m. to
 just before 9:30 a.m. on the final day of the
 siege, agents report that "military gas"
 fired at an underground bunker adjacent to
 the compound had failed to penetrate its
 target.

 In other developments Friday, law
 enforcement officials provided The Dallas
 Morning News more details of what the
 FBI had denied for six years until recently -
 that military-issue tear-gas canisters were
 used in the April 19, 1993, assault near
 Waco.

 For instance:

 * FBI officials said last week they
 discovered a Feb. 15, 1996, internal memo
 acknowledging the use of "two or three
 military gas rounds" during the siege
 among files of the agency's general
 counsel's office.

 A federal official who spoke on condition
 of anonymity said Friday that the memo
 stated that no military tear gas was fired
 directly at the compound because of "the
 potential for causing a fire."

 The FBI had prepared the memo in
 response to questions raised by U.S. Justice
 Department lawyers defending a
 wrongful-death lawsuit filed by Branch
 Davidians and their families.

 * A General Accounting Office report on
 military assistance at the siege found that
 FBI agents had obtained 50 40 mm
 "illumination rounds," or flares, and 250 40
 mm "high explosive" rounds from the U.S.
 Army for use during the standoff.

 All of the rounds can be fired with the
 hand-held M-79 grenade launchers that FBI
 agents used to send tear-gas rounds into
 the compound, according to the report,
 which was released last week.

 Illumination rounds were used by FBI
 teams to burn down the cabin hideout of
 white supremacist Robert Matthews after
 he shot and wounded one FBI agent and
 engaged in a gunbattle with others in 1984.

 Reason for rounds

 When asked Friday about the need for such
 devices during the Branch Davidian siege,
 an FBI official said the illumination rounds
 were probably sought from the military
 because "we had people sneaking in [to the
 compound] at night, and we had people
 trying to sneak out.

 "But why they had the H-E [high explosive]
 rounds, I don't know," said the official,
 who spoke on the condition he would not
 be named.

 Cult leader David Koresh and about 80
 followers died during a fire that broke out
 after noon on April 19, 1993, at the end of a
 51-day standoff with the FBI. The siege
 began Feb. 28, 1993, with a deadly
 shootout as federal agents tried to arrest
 Mr. Koresh on weapons charges.

 The government's admission that
 pyrotechnic devices were used came only
 after a former FBI official told The News
 that two military CS tear-gas grenades had
 been fired at the bunker. The FBI has said
 the canisters did not cause the blaze.

 Attorney General Janet Reno told reporters
 Friday that she had expressly ordered the
 FBI not to use pyrotechnic devices of any
 kind when she approved their plan to
 assault the Branch Davidian compound
 with tanks and tear gas.

 "What I asked for were assurances - and I
 received assurances - that we would not
 use incendiary devices or pyrotechnic
 means of delivering in

Re: [CTRL] Give back the church bells

[lfaith]

 -Caveat Lector-

Bob-
I was considering dropping out of this listserve. But this one posting makes
it worth staying on!! It makes the 18,000 messages worth it!!

This is one damm good piece of information!! This posting deserves a sign
saying READ ME!! It is shocking and sickening, but no surprise any more. The
United States has been stolen right out from under our noses. We each
passing generation, it goes further and further under. When will we see what
is happening?!

Crimes never go unnoticed, do they? The fact that they took the bells, ha!
The sword is now turned inward, they set in motion their downfall.

-Original Message-
From: Conspiracy Theory Research List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On
Behalf Of Bob Stokes
Sent: Friday, September 03, 1999 11:36 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [CTRL] Give back the church bells


 -Caveat Lector-

www.WorldNetDaily.com
FRIDAY SEPTEMBER 03 1999

Give back the church bells
Llewellyn H. Rockwell, Jr.

As long as we're on the subject, let's talk about another U.S. government
attack on a church.

One hundred years ago, during its war on Spain, the U.S. invaded the
Philippines, sprayed bullets far and wide, and put the entire country under
martial law. The result was costly for the U.S. -- it created a habit of
imperialist aggression that is still with us today. And it was also costly
for the Philippines: an entire generation suffered from the violence
associated with a brutal occupation, or the resulting disease and political
turmoil.

Now to the church. In Balangiga, the U.S. Army made slaves of the residents
and turned the place into a work camp. With indefatigable spirit, the local
residents decided not to take it anymore. Church bells of the local Catholic
parish began to ring, signaling a revolt, and 45 U.S. soldiers died. In
response, the American commander gave orders to murder "everyone in sight,"
which they promptly did. The result: as many as 50,000 dead Filipinos, among
whom were women and children.

A bit on the disproportionate side perhaps? Indeed, but like the FBI at
Waco, the U.S. military in the Philippines had only one end in mind: total
victory. Adding insult to massacre, the U.S. Army then stole the church
bells and took them to Warren Air Force base in Cheyenne, Wyo., where they
hang today. But now the parish in the Philippines wants them back, as a
symbol that all this is just ancient history. They even rebuilt the belfry
at the parish in anticipation of the bells' return.

But as we've seen in the Waco case, the U.S. government is notoriously
unwilling to admit error, particularly bloody, egregious error. Hence, so
far, the bells are not forthcoming, despite the attempt on the part of many
groups to intervene and put an end to the parading of religious objects as
war loot. No, instead Congress has passed a resolution forbidding the return
of war booty without its authorization.

In case you think the Filipinos are making an unjust demand, consider the
context. There was no justification for either the U.S. presence in the
Philippines or the violence with which the U.S. carried it out. At stake was
little more than a militarized trade dispute between Spain and the U.S.,
while Cuba, Puerto Rico, Guam, and the Philippines were caught in the
crossfire.

An American officer testified in a letter to the Philadelphia Ledger on Nov.
11, 1901: "Our men have been relentless, have killed to exterminate men,
women, and children, prisoners and captives, active insurgents and suspected
people, from lads of ten up, an idea prevailing that the Filipino was little
better than a dog."

And this gentlemen was writing in defense of the war!

Or consider this letter written before the invasion by another officer:
"There is no use in mincing words We exterminated the American Indians,
and I guess most of us are proud of it, or, at least believe that the end
justified the means; and we must have no scruples about exterminating this
other race standing in the way of progress and enlightenment, if it is
necessary."

Neither was this merely the attitude of a few recalcitrant soldiers. Using
religion as his cover, President William McKinley later justified his
behavior in similar terms. As he told a delegation of Methodist clergymen:

"I went down on my knees and prayed to Almighty God for light and guidance
... and one night late it came to me this way We could not leave (the
Philippines) to themselves -- they were unfit for self-government -- and
they would soon have anarchy and misrule over there worse than Spain's was.
... There was nothing left for us to do but take them all and educate the
Filipinos, and uplift and Christianize them."

Recall that the Philippines was largely Catholic, which the Protestant
ruling elite in this country did not consider to be a Christian religion.
And what better way to treat these supposed non-Christians than to starve
and kill them? In a similar way, the Branch Davidians were considered to be
a dangerous and uncivil

Re: [CTRL] (Fwd) More on Hillary for prez

[lfaith]

 -Caveat Lector-

In light of Bill being the puppet president for the controlling elite- this
posting deserves the chuckle of the day award!!! thanks for making me
smile!! this is cute! Hilary the puppet of the puppet.

No I think when Bill is out of there, they are kind of done with him. He is
out to pasture... He is like the tissue president that he is. He is
expendable.

-Original Message-
From: Conspiracy Theory Research List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On
Behalf Of John Szocik
Sent: Thursday, September 02, 1999 12:23 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [CTRL] (Fwd) More on Hillary for prez


 -Caveat Lector-

God help this country if by some miraculous chain of events Hillary was
elected President.  she would be a "puppet" for the office while Bill
continued on with running the country from behind the scenes.
Who the hell do they think they are fooling?!

Pay attention America; please do not let this become a reality!!

JOHN

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screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
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DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic
screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing!  These are sordid matters
and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright
frauds is used politically  by different groups with major and minor effects
spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL
gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers;
be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and
nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html

http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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