Re: usrmerge on root NFS will not be run automatically
On 08 Sep 2023 12:54, Marco wrote:
Warning: NFS detected, /usr/lib/usrmerge/convert-usrmerge will not be run
automatically. See #842145 for details.
Read :
- https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=842145
- https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1039522
The solution would be :
"convert-usrmerge can be run in a chroot on the NFS server"
If your NFS server is not Linux-based, carefully copy the files over a
Linux machine, chroot+convert there, then move back to the NFS server.
Make backups ;)
Can help:
https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/312218/chroot-from-freebsd-to-linux
As per the why, I don't know.
Maybe the symlink handling by NFS ?
Reading the script "/usr/lib/usrmerge/convert-usrmerge", you get the
reasons why it fails :
142 # The other cases are more complex and there are some corner
cases that
143 # we do not try to resolve automatically.
144
145 # both source and dest are links
[...]
168 # the source is a link
[...]
175 # the destination is a link
[...]
191 # both source and dest are directories
192 # this is the second most common case
You may change the script to detect where/why it fails, so edit
fatal("Both $n and /usr$n exist");
to
fatal("Both $n and /usr$n exist - err line 145");
fatal("Both $n and /usr$n exist - err line 168");
Also found this on
"https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Usr_merge#Known_Problems"; :
- "File systems that do not support RENAME_EXCHANGE such as ZFS or NFS
cannot perform live conversion (Bug 1186637)"
- "Conversion fails if there's a mount point below
(/usr)/{bin,sbin,lib,lib64}"
Good luck
--
++
zithro / Cyril
Re: Debian 12 - IPv4 blocked without fail2ban & co
I'll write my answer here as well, as the OP posted the same posts on debian-french (also top-posting ...). Some ISPs or service providers may use private IPs (RFC1918) or even APIPA for their internal routers, to spare public IPs. CG-NAT (which uses APIPAs) especially may create some weird problems. I think it's just a coincidence that the provider uses 192.168.0.2 internally and the OP host has the same address in its network. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: Sleep: out of control
On 31 Aug 2023 14:17, Tom Browder wrote: Note: The systemd "/etc/systemd/sleep.conf" file has all entries commented out. Take care, commenting may NOT be the same as disabling/setting to NO ! Each software has its own rules, but _usually_ when you comment out the lines, the app built-in defaults will be used (like openssh). Systemd behaves like that, at least that's what I observed after commenting out the NTP server lines of systemd-timesync. You should uncomment and specify NO like what Michel Verdier posted. Ofc, if the units are masked/disabled, I guess those values are not used/read. But you never know, so belts and suspenders ! -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: Debian soporte
On 30 Aug 2023 20:15, Mario Garcia wrote: Hola mi nombres mario garcia , quisiera pregutarle si una laptop con siguiente procesador snapdragon (tM 7c puedo instalar debian. ? Saludos ? This is an english list ;) If you only speak spanish, I'd recommend debian-user-spanish (or equivalents). The lists are available on: lists.debian.org You should check for compatibility on the Debian ARM pages, and maybe the Kernel ARM pages. First, find your exact architecture name (aarch64, ...), then model, etc. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: HDMI not working
On 30 Aug 2023 15:40, CL wrote: Dear all, [...] During testing of the device I note that the HDMI interface doesn't work. A lot of GOOGLE shows me that sometimes problems with the implemented GPU IRIS Xe (Alder Lake-UP3 GT2) occurs. Also some of this problems were marked as solved. But either I didn't understand this solutions or they were not proper described (at least for me). Show us what you found. Maybe the problem has been solved in a newer kernel ? If that's the case, you may try newer kernels from backports. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: Error : virHostCPUGetKVMMaxVCPUs: KVM is not supported on this platform: Function not implemented
Seems you also don't read and/or learn ... Don't top post please, it's a matter of respect. A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail? On 30 Aug 2023 10:50, Mario Marietto wrote: Not a useful suggestion for me. I'm not a coder,such as I'm not a pro system admin : this is only a hobby for me. I try to do the best I can,but I can't solve bugs for which a solution has not been found yet and that involves the writing of a piece of code. And yet you continue trying to compile (possibly) incompatible softwares from source, instead of following the user guides, and despite our warnings. You essentialy say "I want to do some complicated stuff without understanding how it works, and quick please". Have you looked for bug reports for your THREE consecutive problems ? Why not going plain Debian stable and walk from there ? Have you checked the compilation flags needed ? You don't need to be a dev to understand, just spend time reading. If distros spend a huge amount of time packaging software, it's to ensure proper compatibility between software versions, including the kernel. Dumb example : - compile kernel 4.2 - compile QEMU version 1 - compile libvirt version 9 I'm pretty sure you'll get as "strange" errors as you experienced. But those errors are not strange, it's just that code get created and deleted. If libvirt needs the function "virConnectGetDomainCapabilities()" from KVM, and the installed version of kernel/KVM does NOT ship this function, you get those kind of errors. My advice : look for people who use Linux/BSD -AND- your platform/model (Chromebook ARM). Also, if you're not ready to spend time, follow recent guides. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: door bell like sound effect
On 30 Aug 2023 04:52, gene heskett wrote:
man systemctl ; look for "timer" (in vi(m) use "/" to search) ?
$ systemctl list-timers
Tried this one ?
Maybe find the script(s) where you use this sound ?
I mean to find HOW you played this sound, ie. with which application.
With ALSA, you could have used "aplay FILE.wav", but you could also
have used xmms, audacity, VLC, mpv, etc.
tried aplay, got server dead response. htop cannot find aplay,
The application playing the sound is most probably dead when you check
for it ! Read below.
?!
I think you didn't understand what I meant.
To play a sound, there needs to be an app launching it.
So I suggested than instead of "find"ing the sound itself, you try to
"grep" the application/executable name.
Agreed this could be long, as you don't know where that sound is
played from.
And that is the problem, and why I read thru all those man pages trying
to find a way to make it log what it did. Sadly no.
So, let me show you what I was thinking about.
I show you commands which will "find" for executable files which are not
shared libraries, and for each file found, will "grep" for application
names.
This approach will not try to find the sound(s) themselves, but the
"applications which can play sounds".
First, make sure to have a list of ALL the audio apps installed on your
system. From this list, you will just need the executable NAME, not the
full path.
Examples: aplay, vlc, audacity, mplayer, mpv, ...
Then, run either the SHORT or LONG FORM of these find commands as root
(or with sudo), but add your own applications from your app list above.
Warning: commands are both on one line !
++ FIND - LONG FORM
find -P / \! -iname "*.so" -type f -executable -exec grep --color
--binary-files=without-match --with-filename --line-number -E
'aplay|vlc|audacity' '{}' \;
++ FIND - SHORT FORM
find -P / \! -iname "*.so" -type f -executable -exec grep --color -IHnE
'aplay|vlc|audacity' '{}' \;
++ APP LIST
As said above, you will have to change :
'aplay|vlc|audacity'
with the application names you have on your computer, for example :
'aplay|vlc|audacity|mpv|mplayer'
++ PARAMETERS EXPLANATIONS
-P : never follow symlinks (we going to check the whole FS, so no point)
\! -iname "*.so" : dont include shared libs
-type f : files only (no directory, etc)
-executable : executable file
-exec : run a command for each file found. Here the command is GREP,
which scans for application names inside the executable files
The grep options used are almost self-explanatory, I showed the
long form on purpose.
++ SAMPLE OUTPUT
Instead of "/", I used "/usr" :
# find -P / \! -iname "*.so" -type f -executable -exec grep --color
-IHnE 'aplay|vlc|audacity' '{}' \;
/usr/bin/rvlc:2:exec /usr/bin/vlc -I "rc" "$@"
/usr/bin/pa-info:83:'aplay -L'
/usr/bin/cvlc:2:exec /usr/bin/vlc -I "dummy" "$@"
/usr/sbin/alsa-info:110:withaplay() {
/usr/sbin/alsa-info:116:aplay -l >> $FILE 2>&1
[OUTPUT TRUNCATED]
HTH
--
++
zithro / Cyril
Re: Error : virHostCPUGetKVMMaxVCPUs: KVM is not supported on this platform: Function not implemented
On 29 Aug 2023 23:48, Mario Marietto wrote: I'm running Debian bookworm [...] No you're not. You're running a MODIFIED Debian version with a (rather old) MODIFIED kernel : $ uname -r 5.4.244-stb-cbe > [removed mostly copy/paste from old posts] Can someone give me some suggestions to fix that error ? thanks. Yes, takes me 2 minutes too : 1. open the libvirt source code folder 2. grep the functions in error to get the file names 3. open those files and find out why the functions fail 4. edit code, recompile, test 5. do (4) till the problem is not solved Also, it's nice to report the bug where you got the disk image, so others won't waste their time for the same bug. If you solved your problem, propose a patch, so others may benefit. HTH ! -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: door bell like sound effect
On 29 Aug 2023 21:55, Greg Wooledge wrote: On Tue, Aug 29, 2023 at 02:58:44PM -0400, gene heskett wrote: E: Unable to locate package pactl unicorn:~$ type pactl pactl is /usr/bin/pactl unicorn:~$ dpkg -S /usr/bin/pactl pulseaudio-utils: /usr/bin/pactl Or : $ apt-file search pactl [...] pulseaudio-utils: /usr/bin/pactl pulseaudio-utils: /usr/share/bash-completion/completions/pactl pulseaudio-utils: /usr/share/man/man1/pactl.1.gz [...] It's useful when you don't have the full path of the file. Downside, you need to install "apt-file" first. Run "apt-file update" before using it, but iirc it warns you to do it if you forget. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: door bell like sound effect
On 29 Aug 2023 18:35, gene heskett wrote: I have no known enemies left, I've outlived them all. And there is a PIR facing out that see's a 34 yo pin oak moving in the wind many times a day. What about their families ? ^^ Joke aside, trees don't produce heat themselves (AFAIK ...), so the only way is to reflect the IR from the sun. Or there is some animal walking the tree. So your PIR is either broken or way too sensitive. Some provide a sensitivity setting via a potentiometer, but YMMV. Usually, sensitivity is correlated to the range (ie. meters) of the IR sensor. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: door bell like sound effect
On 29 Aug 2023 18:19, gene heskett wrote: On 8/28/23 12:20, zithro wrote: On 28 Aug 2023 09:29, gene heskett wrote: Have you checked all the cron files and the systemd timers ? cron yes, systemd timers no, don't know how. man systemctl ; look for "timer" (in vi(m) use "/" to search) ? $ systemctl list-timers Maybe find the script(s) where you use this sound ? I mean to find HOW you played this sound, ie. with which application. With ALSA, you could have used "aplay FILE.wav", but you could also have used xmms, audacity, VLC, mpv, etc. Its usually in the middle of the night, waking me up because it is as loud as the real door bell would be. Last Saturday was unusual as it sounded off at 2:06 and 6:58 EDT. Never occurred while I'm sitting here. Most of the noises it makes are 30 db quieter. ?! I think you didn't understand what I meant. To play a sound, there needs to be an app launching it. So I suggested than instead of "find"ing the sound itself, you try to "grep" the application/executable name. Agreed this could be long, as you don't know where that sound is played from. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: Failed to acquire pid file : /var/local/run/libvirt/qemu/driver.pid
On 28 Aug 2023 21:26, Mario Marietto wrote: Anyway,I found it relevant that I have the error with the wi-fi driver in debian,but not with devuan. On Mon, Aug 28, 2023 at 9:19 PM Mario Marietto wrote: Yes.thanks. I've already asked there. The author is busy with different projects,so I tried to look for some help from different sources or the thing will take too long a time. On Mon, Aug 28, 2023 at 8:40 PM zithro wrote: On 28 Aug 2023 19:00, Christian Britz wrote: On 28.08.23, 18:44, zithro wrote: On 27 Aug 2023 12:09, Mario Marietto wrote: $ uname -a Linux chromarietto 5.4.244-stb-cbe #8 SMP PREEMPT Sat Aug 19 22:19:32 UTC 2023 armv7l GNU/Linux Is it normal to get this "old" kernel on bookworm ARM ? No 6.x versions ? This does not seem to be a Debian kernel at all. I get this on my Raspberry Pi running bookworm: $ uname -a Linux raspberrypi 6.1.0-11-arm64 #1 SMP Debian 6.1.38-4 (2023-08-08) aarch64 GNU/Linux Yes, in another post today, the OP wrote he was using : https://github.com/hexdump0815/imagebuilder/releases/download/230220-01/chromebook_snow-armv7l-bookworm.img.gz The other post is about a kernel wifi driver misbehaving (mwifiex_sdio ...). So I guess support should be asked there. There may be many differences between OP's image and a standard Debian. A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail? Also, you don't need to reply to me, reply to the list instead. It means the "To:" field should use "debian-user@lists.debian.org". As per your question : > Anyway,I found it relevant that I have the error with the wi-fi driver in > debian,but not with devuan. Do you know the exact differences between the Debian and Devuan images provided ? You should check the kernel and driver versions in the two systems. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: Failed to acquire pid file : /var/local/run/libvirt/qemu/driver.pid
On 28 Aug 2023 19:00, Christian Britz wrote: On 28.08.23, 18:44, zithro wrote: On 27 Aug 2023 12:09, Mario Marietto wrote: $ uname -a Linux chromarietto 5.4.244-stb-cbe #8 SMP PREEMPT Sat Aug 19 22:19:32 UTC 2023 armv7l GNU/Linux Is it normal to get this "old" kernel on bookworm ARM ? No 6.x versions ? This does not seem to be a Debian kernel at all. I get this on my Raspberry Pi running bookworm: $ uname -a Linux raspberrypi 6.1.0-11-arm64 #1 SMP Debian 6.1.38-4 (2023-08-08) aarch64 GNU/Linux Yes, in another post today, the OP wrote he was using : https://github.com/hexdump0815/imagebuilder/releases/download/230220-01/chromebook_snow-armv7l-bookworm.img.gz The other post is about a kernel wifi driver misbehaving (mwifiex_sdio ...). So I guess support should be asked there. There may be many differences between OP's image and a standard Debian. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: Not authorized to run synaptic
On 28 Aug 2023 18:32, Bruno Schneider wrote: Hi all, I'm running Debian Testing, using XFCE. I run synaptic package manager from a launcher I made a few years ago. After a system upgrade today, I can no longer run synaptic from the launcher. Using the command line (same command as the launcher), I got this: $ /usr/bin/synaptic-pkexec Error executing command as another user: Not authorized This incident has been reported. If I use sudo, then it works, but pkexec used to open a graphical password input to run synaptic as root, which is what I want, for opening it using the launcher. What did I break? It seems you are in the sudo group, so pkexec should work. "/usr/bin/synaptic-pkexec" is a one line shell script, a simple wrapper to "pkexec". As you're using Debian testing: - was pkexec/policykit upgraded today ? - what was updated today ? ie. read the logs in /var/log/apt/* - did you check the changelog for pkexec ? $ zcat /usr/share/doc/pkexec/changelog.Debian.gz Also, the pkexec man page says : As a result, pkexec will not by default allow you to run X11 applications as another user since the $DISPLAY and $XAUTHORITY environment variables are not set. These two variables will be retained if the org.freedesktop.policykit.exec.allow_gui annotation on an action is set to a nonempty value; this is discouraged, though, and should only be used for legacy programs. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: Failed to acquire pid file : /var/local/run/libvirt/qemu/driver.pid
On 27 Aug 2023 12:09, Mario Marietto wrote: Hello. I'm running Debian bookworm on my ARM Chromebook,model "xe303c12" and I've recompiled the kernel to enable KVM,so now my system sounds like this : If you are going to use libvirt, you could also try Xen (via packages), but I don't know if your device is supported. $ uname -a Linux chromarietto 5.4.244-stb-cbe #8 SMP PREEMPT Sat Aug 19 22:19:32 UTC 2023 armv7l GNU/Linux Is it normal to get this "old" kernel on bookworm ARM ? No 6.x versions ? $ uname -r 5.4.244-stb-cbe uname -r is already in uname -a (-a == all) ;) $ qemu-system-arm --version QEMU emulator version 5.1.0 (v5.1.0-dirty) Copyright (c) 2003-2020 Fabrice Bellard and the QEMU Project developers bookworm x86 uses QEMU v7 (1:7.2+dfsg-7+deb12u1), so same as above, why is this old version used ? I have installed libvirt 9.7.0,qemu 5.1 and virt-manager from source code with the final goal to be able to connect qemu,kvm and libvirt together to virtualize FreeBSD 13.2 for arm 32 bit. If you ask me why I've recompiled everything from source code,my answer will be complicated,but in short terms,for some unknown reason, it reports an error like this : libvirt on bookworm is 9.0.0-4 "Warning : Failed to set up UEFI / The Libvirt version does not support UEFI / Install options are limited" Look for this error message, it may be quicker and less error prone than compiling everything. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: door bell like sound effect
On 28 Aug 2023 09:29, gene heskett wrote: Greetings; odd request: Yeah, almost unreal ^^ Somewhere, for some unk reason, there is a sound file file that plays at max volume, usually around 2 AM or slightly later, that is very similar to the 40 yo doorbell in this house. A bing-bong sound that differs from the real doorbell by maybe 5hz in pitch. Wakes me up, spoiling a good nights sleep, maybe a dozen times a year an apparently random dates. Have you checked all the cron files and the systemd timers ? To aid in finding it, what extension might that file be carrying to indicate its a .snd fle, which according to grep on ls -lR's output, does not exist in the thousands of files under hundreds of random names. What if you didn't use an extension when you created the audio file ? This file that sounds exactly like my doorbell has existed on my 24/7/365.25 on main system for at least 20 years. I'd like to A. find it, B. find what condition uses it, fix the condition, or even delete it. Maybe find the script(s) where you use this sound ? I mean to find HOW you played this sound, ie. with which application. With ALSA, you could have used "aplay FILE.wav", but you could also have used xmms, audacity, VLC, mpv, etc. How can I best do that? updatedb, followed by locate door or locate bell reports nothing. locate bing ; locate bong ; locate gong ? You wrote the sound was like "bing-bong" ^^ In this case, I would recommend to use "find" as root, rather than "locate", just to prevent the fact the file could not be indexed by updatedb for whatever reason, and as root in case you put the script and/or sound in a folder only accessible by root. PS: last I used locate was on Slackware 13.37, so others may point errors in that thinking. There are now 2 different PIR based devices watching that doorbell button, which trigger on the neighbors cat walking by but remain silent when this sound jacks me up in the middle of the night. If you have ennemies, they can use a long stick to ring the bell to evade PIR detection ^^ Any help in finding this will be hugely appreciated. Cheers, Gene Heskett. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: Disk error?
On 21 Aug 2023 19:53, Tim Woodall wrote: On Mon, 21 Aug 2023, Tim Woodall wrote: On Wed, 24 Aug 2022, Tim Woodall wrote: I got this error while installing build-essential Preparing to unpack .../03-libperl5.34_5.34.0-5_arm64.deb ... Unpacking libperl5.34:arm64 (5.34.0-5) ... dpkg-deb (subprocess): decompressing archive '/tmp/apt-dpkg-install-zqY3js/03-libperl5.34_5.34.0-5_arm64.deb' (size=4015516) member 'data.tar': lzma error: compressed data is corrupt dpkg-deb: error: subprocess returned error exit status 2 dpkg: error processing archive /tmp/apt-dpkg-install-zqY3js/03-libperl5.34_5.34.0-5_arm64.deb (--unpack): cannot copy extracted data for './usr/lib/aarch64-linux-gnu/libperl.so.5.34.0' to '/usr/lib/aarch64-linux-gnu/libperl.so.5.34.0.dpkg-new': unexpected end of file or stream Am I right that this must be a local error - apt will have verified the checksum while downloading the deb? (and it worked on rerunning - the deb was in acng) I can find nothing anywhere that suggests anything has gone wrong (other than this error) but (and I'm sure it's a coincidence) since installing ACNG (on the same machine) I've been getting a number of errors similar to things like this where files appear to be corrupted but work on the next attempt. There's no SMART errors or anything like that either. Anyone got any ideas - any logging I should add to try and track down where the issue might be? Tim. Just a FYI, I've been battling this, and errors like this for almost a year. The last but one kernel upgrade seems to have fixed it. :-) I've been reverting all the changes I made trying to track it down and, touch wood, it's not come back. One of these two upgrades fixed it. (the first doesn't seem plausible) Start-Date: 2023-08-11 06:25:52 Commandline: apt-get -y upgrade Upgrade: usbip:amd64 (2.0+5.10.179-3, 2.0+5.10.179-5) End-Date: 2023-08-11 06:25:53 Start-Date: 2023-08-12 08:16:59 Commandline: apt-get -y dist-upgrade Install: linux-image-5.10.0-24-amd64:amd64 (5.10.179-5, automatic) Upgrade: linux-image-amd64:amd64 (5.10.179-3, 5.10.179-5) End-Date: 2023-08-12 08:23:07 I cannot tell which machine mattered, could be the xen host, the guest running apt, the guest running apt-cacher-ng or the one running the squid proxy. (the last two feel impossible given the symptoms above) The disk was mounted via iscsi on the xen host, so it's not quite as simple as saying apt got the right file over the network therefore it must be the guest. I'm not going to try to reproduce and track down exactly what fixed it. Tim. So I spoke too soon. Reverting the last change I made, resulting in halving the memory and leaving only one vcpu in the guest, meaning that the guest is severely loaded and I got a one bit error in a downloaded (Packages.xz) file. Some ideas : - Are the iscsi drives served by a local domU or from remote ? - Have you tried moving all the iscsi-backed drives on the local dom0 filesystem ? - Maybe the problem is with slow syncing data to source disk(s) ? (as you wrote "files appear to be corrupted but work on the next attempt"). [ I had a (somewhat similarly strange ?) problem trying to install Qubes as a domU, from an ISO served by an NFS mount from another domU, like : domU --[NFS]--> dom0 --[use ISO on NFS mount]--> Qubes domU The install failed with "Payload SHA256 digest: BAD", although the ISO file was OK (verified with sha256). When I COPIED the same ISO (ie. no re-download) from the NFS mount to the dom0 local FS (ext4), the install went fine. In both runs, the Qubes domU was using local ext4 disk images, so in my case only the source was giving errors, maybe error in transit ? I didn't try more tests to discover what was causing this. Also, it was in february 2022, so things may have changed, didn't test since. For reference, the related Qubes post, although not containing much more info: https://forum.qubes-os.org/t/installation-report-payload-digest-error-for-pkg-xen-hypervisor-2001/9644 (remove bracket stuff when replying) ] -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: Mailing list unsubscription requests and identificatio
On 12 Aug 2023 04:39, gene heskett wrote: On 8/11/23 21:10, Larry Martell wrote: Larry, whom I've known for 20 years, is only echoing. Are you really an engineer ?! No, I am not an EE, but I am a Certified Electronics Technician, a much rarer breed of cat than your run of the mill EE. We teach EE's how to get their hands dirty in the real world. Teaching them things their tenured by mistake prof's didn't. Ok, so you should follow specs and best practices, right ? Who is a random person to you? You’re new to this list, so you have no clue who is who here. Thanks Larry. Take care & stay well, both of you. The list is public since the start. But I admit my post was misleading, lacking some transition between my objections to Gene and the remainder. Gene is far from the random people I ranted about, and it doesn't take long to know he's rather a top poster, respectful and polite. Gene, if you took it personnaly, I sincerely apologize. That was really NOT my intent. -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: setting up network with a hosts file, but your way
On 12 Aug 2023 20:49, gene heskett wrote: ipv6: There is no ipv6 service within 100 miles, so I should set a /proc command to kill ipv6, so whats the official syntax? for that. I don't know if there is another method, I'll give you mine, which consists in telling the kernel to completely disable IPv6, in the kernel command line. Edit "/etc/default/grub", on the line "GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX" (or "GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT", depending on your config), add : ipv6.disable=1 Don't forget to run "update-grub", then reboot. If it worked, you will find in the syslog : "IPv6: Loaded, but administratively disabled, reboot required to enable". If you're not using GRUB, you will have to find where kernel options should be entered (also called kernel command line). -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: Mailing list unsubscription requests and identificatio
On 11 Aug 2023 23:39, gene heskett wrote: No its not Tomas, everytime ff issues an update, I have to go thru all the bs of proving I am me to my bank, and its been that way for at least a decade. With all due respect, can you stop spreading misinformation to this list ? Not only this has nothing to do with unsubscribing to the ML, but it just shows that you don't get what you're talking about. Are you really an engineer ?! This extends to : DONT FOLLOW TUTORIALS THAT WONT EXPLAIN THE **WHY** Also, I admire dedicated people on this ML ... It's only 3 months I'm following it regularly, to learn things about Debian. What did I learn ? Random people SUCK. Big time. But I guess it's the XXI century plague. People using other people's time to spare their own. Sorry for the noise, if you get that oxymoron ;) -- ++ zithro / Cyril
Re: AMD GPU hard lockups
On 03 Aug 2023 01:25, Celejar wrote: I'm not sure I understand your point: if we assume that the fact that my adapter burned indicates that my particular adapter must have been of very poor quality, than this implies that such adapters in general are not dangerous (which, as I've noted, is supported by the fact that reputable companies sell them, with no warnings that they're dangerous). You will never find in a car owner's manual that driving on pedestrians may be dangerous ;) Joke aside those companies just wanna sell products. Do the products fit you ? Read my previous email: YOU must check. To remove the confusion : your graphic card is rated at 150W, but it's the MAX power it can use, not the power it uses all the time. So, until you don't stress the GPU, those adapters will be perfectly fine. Example from a Win domU, GPU-Z reports ~40W in idle (browsing, videos, ...) for a Polaris20 GPU (AMD RX580), with a TDP of 185W. That's why you only had problems when REALLY using the GPU. For instance, let's say you built a server, but only have a RX6600 as video card, a 6 pins connector and a 6-to-8 adapter. THIS will be perfectly fine : your GPU will never exceed limits, as it will at most display a framebuffer. (To go even further : AFAIK, most graphic cards won't boot without the external PCI-E power connector plugged, but if there wasn't such "protection", as the x16 PCIe slot provides 75W, in my example above it would be perfectly fine to use the card w/o the external plug).
Follow the specs :) (was Re: AMD GPU hard lockups)
On 02 Aug 2023 23:29, Celejar wrote: > But reputable companies do produce 6-8 pin adapters, e.g.: [...] > (I just ordered the Cable Matters one.) Out of curiosity, I checked the links. Funny that "reputable companies" (I'm not attacking you, but them) don't even specify the max power rating as product specs, and when specified, it's only in users Q&A ... You also have to dig deep to get the wires size in AWG (ie: zoom on pictures ...) ! Compare that to the information you get for the PSU and the GPU ! Anyways : 1st link: "The maximum power rating for the PCIEX68ADAP is 75W" 2nd link: "Max Power Rating 150W" 3rd link: (nowhere to be found, at least quickly) 1 and 2 use AWG18 wires, and on 3 they look even thinner (can't really tell as the pic is s***). I'd eliminate the 3 from the start. No specs, no money. And either 1 or 2 is lying : same AWG, different power rating (ok, the wire style is precised nowhere : single core, threaded, etc). But we can safely assume that 150W @12V is not possible : 12.5A is out of specs. (Try "https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wire-gauges-d_419.html"; for more info on AWG, and use the formula Watts = Volts x Amperes). On 02 Aug 2023 23:37, piorunz wrote: Your GPU max TDP is 150W, meaning it will draw 75W from PCI-E slot and 75W from 8-pin cable. So the wires will work around their limits. One little power spike and kaboom. Fire, exclamation mark ; fire, exclamation mark. Joke aside, the fire hazard is real. Especially exceeding limits with low-end products, when you don't know if the materials are fire-proofed. Your 8-pin adapter must have been very poor quality. I don't know what kind of adapter it was, but adapters which make 8-pin from 6-pin, are dangerous. Better to use 2x 6-pin -> 1x 8-pin adapter to correctly assign wires to each corresponding pin. I agree, so that each wire (or group of wires) does not exceed the max current it can draw. I found two pages cleanly explaining this, both were worth a read. But don't quickly jump to conclusions, follow the flow ! https://www.cgdirector.com/gpu-power-cable-guide/ https://www.pcworld.com/article/395059/one-cable-or-two-for-powering-a-graphics-card-heres-the-answer.html -- zithro / Cyril
Re: AMD GPU hard lockups
On 02 Aug 2023 03:21, Celejar wrote: when I opened the case, sure enough, the cable feeding the GPU had burned and broken. Fortunately, I don't see damage to the system's power cable or to the GPU itself, just to the 6 pin to 8 pin PCIE adapter cable (the HP PSU has only 6 pin cables, and the GPU needs an 8 pin connection). I [...] I'm going to order another one, from a reputable company this time, and hope that it was just the cheapo implementation that was flawed, and not the whole concept of 6 pin to 8 pin adapter cables ... Cables can burn because too much current (Amps) is flowing through them. As problems only happen when gaming (or heavily using the GPU), this may be the case. I think your GPU is drawing too much current from the 6 pins PSU rail. (Are any other peripherals connected on the GPU rail ?). I'd also compare the power requirements of the GPU to the total Amps the GPU PSU rail can provide (each rail and voltage has specific specs). The difference between 6 and 8 pins can be seen like the difference of cable section between a small lamp and a computer (or a microwave). Power your computer or microwave with a lamp cable, and you'll see a nice fire. If the designers used 8 pins, my wild guess is that it has a reason ;)
Re: General question regarding SSD and harddrive
On 15 Jul 2023 02:30, Maureen L Thomas wrote: So I have been looking at new computers and most of them come with SSD's but they are so much smaller than my 2 TB computer that I am not sure what is better. I read a couple of pieces on different groups but still am not sure. SSD's are faster but them have a quarter of the room for storage. I don't use my machine for basic stuff and am not a heavy gamer. Any advice about this would be greatly appreciated. Moe It's a balance between the amount of data and what you do with it. Also, it depends on your patience ^^ Some people really hate waiting for stuff to happen on a computer, some don't care. Generally, you put your OS and programs on an SSD, so your experience is snappy: they are fast and have a low latency. Then you put your data on HDDs (rotating rust), because you don't need speed but gigas/teras. As you seem to want to buy a new computer and/or new parts, you'd install the OS on the new SDD, while keeping your old 2TB as storage.
Re: Wireless temperature & humidity measurement
On 14 Jul 2023 10:53, Joe wrote: On Fri, 14 Jul 2023 09:27:12 +0200 Bruno Kleinert wrote: Hello, I'm looking for a wireless way to measure temperature and humidity indoor with hardware off the shelf and software included in Debian 12 bookworm. Sensors --> Radio --> Receiver --> Any typical PC interface, e.g., USB, Ethernet. I don't need a visual interface, but plan to process measured values in shell scripts. Do you have any hardware recommendations and can you share experience? I use DS18B20 chips (1-wire protocol, nice for long distances cabling) and some BME280s or MPL3115A2, plugged on Raspberry Pies. The DS18B20 can be directly manipulated via sysfs, while the BMEs and the MPL3115A2 need a software library to interpret the sensors output (I use Adafruit's one, in python). A cron script records the values in a CSV, which I've linked in the apache folder so remote hosts can access the data file (trying to display a graph from 5 sensors values on a full year time period is a no go on a Raspi B v3). I've also created 2 webpages, one to quickly display the last X values (tail -n X), one to display a pretty graph, depending on some web form parameters (source host, from day X to Y, last week, etc). I'm using jpgraph, a PHP graph lib (free for personal use), to display nice curves. If you're not a web dev, you could also use OoO Calc or Excel to build the graphs from the CSV files. As you want wireless, I'd recommend a Raspi zero as it has BT+wifi built-in, a clock (kind of), an IP stack, a webserver, etc. Of course an Arduino is simpler, but requires a bit more work (and maybe money) : no built-in storage, no built-in comms, no date/time. But ok, you don't need local storage or a clock/time if only sending values to another host, the remote host can set the time before recording. Although if you operate on batteries, an Arduino would be the best choice, as it requires a lot less energy. Another choice could be a Raspberry Pi Pico, but that's closest to an Arduino than to a Raspi (ie. no OS). But if I'm not mistaken, the advantage of the Pico is that it has built-in BT+wifi (I've not tested it, only read about it). In all cases, you could also turn the wireless chip(s) off till not sending data, or even go to (deep) sleep mode between polls (IIRC Arduino/Pico only). and a bit of PHP to make a 7-day graph web page of T and H. Boot script to set up the serial port and initiate logging on reboot. Joe, out of curiosity, what are you using to display the graphs ? If you didn't read above, I'm using jpgraph, a PHP lib.
Re: OT: Pedantic, yet wrong
On 23 Jun 2023 17:56, Fred wrote: Or you could try Devuan which is Debian without systemd. I did, when I didn't know Debian still had sysv. But since you can do it on Debian directly, I don't see the point now. Maybe more polished packages, ie. no surprises like "if you install this package, I'll remove sysv" ? I admit I didn't use Devuan a lot, so can't really compare.
Re: OT: Pedantic, yet wrong
On 23 Jun 2023 16:41, mick.crane wrote: On 2023-06-23 11:58, Nicolas George wrote: Andy Smith (12023-06-23): It seemed fine the way it was. The only reason why I didn't answer is that I don't know anything about removing systemd! Me I know just a little about it, enough to know that discussion with people who want to remove it but are not already capable of doing it by themselves is a waste of time. It's a subjective thing. It is what it is but I do feel warmth towards those try to make it work without systemd. it's not particularly logical. mick Yes, init freedom is subjective, it's like using Firefox or Chrome. It's not a matter of logic ; ) I have some Debians with sysvinit, some with systemd, both work. Switching from systemd to sysv following the Debian wiki page was painless, although I mostly did it on "small hosts", with not much packages installed. Maybe installs with many packages are harder to manage ? Because you have to be careful during package management, some commands would propose to remove sysv and install systemd instead ! I guess not all packages are "sysv aware" (or rather non-systemd aware). I suggest non-systemd init users (sysv, rc,...) to use --dry-run and --no-install-recommends during package management, it can help. But for the OP, who iirc asked if he should switch to sysv -before- or -after- the bookworm update, I have no idea. I updated sysv- and systemd-based Debians from bullseye to bookworm without problems, but didn't try the switch since, from a bookworm host. YMMV !
Re: Debian freezes when power cable plugged
On 21 Jun 2023 17:48, Zakaria Farhati wrote: Hello, I have installed Debian 12 for a couple of weeks, 2 days ago, I noticed that when I plug the power cable, the system/desktop does not respond and freezes for 1 min. What should I do to solve this issue? The first thing is to check logs for related entries : # dmesg # vi /var/log/syslog and if using systemd # journalctl You may pipe to grep -i "power" to filter results, but it may filter useful ones.
Re: Code of conduct reminder.
On 21 Jun 2023 17:52, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: Since "shocking", "disrespect" and "vulgarity" are pretty subjective measures (they are still very legitimate, though), it would be nice and constructive if you gave people the chance to understand what you are taking issue with. Otherwise, we have no way to try to adjust our behaviour. I think it's concerning the thread "How to stop systemd or whatever does,to always tries to check and fix disk errors".
Re: package managers problem
On 20 Jun 2023 18:21, Charles Curley wrote: On Tue, 20 Jun 2023 16:52:47 +0200 Anders Andersson wrote: I'm running Gnome. Maybe synaptic is not compatible with xfce? Nope. I have synaptic running here with xfce4 on Bullseye. synaptic0.90.2 amd64 xfce4 4.16all Correct me if I'm wrong, but last I tried synaptic manually (on XFCE), I had to use pkexec and NOT sudo. It doesn't start from a root xterm either. This remark is for Gene, who only uses variations of "sudo". $ which synaptic-pkexec /usr/bin/synaptic-pkexec $ /usr/bin/synaptic-pkexec "synaptic-pkexec" is what's needed if not using the distro-provided shortcut. Here, the shortcut in XFCE under "System -> Synaptic package manager" effectively launches "synaptic-pkexec". synaptic-pkexec is a shell script containing: pkexec "/usr/sbin/synaptic" "$@" Another note, if you use pkexec directly, this won't work : $ pkexec synaptic Cannot run program synaptic: No such file or directory But this is OK $ pkexec /usr/sbin/synaptic
Re: Apache logs and systemd
On 14 Jun 2023 19:30, Tom Browder wrote: I’ve been running httpd for many years, long before systemd came along. Somewhere in the various upgrades over the years I lost the old rotating logs. Now I would like to initiate the rotating logs again. Can I do that with systemd somehow? Isn't that the job of "logrotate" ? Maybe it's related to the rsyslog changes ? From bullseye on, the package "rsyslog" is not mandatory anymore, and from bookworm, it's not even installed by default, but not disabled. You don't tell which Debian version you're using rn, but if bookworm, there is some info in bookworm release notes about rsyslog : 5.1.7 https://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/release-notes/ch-information.en.html#changes-to-system-logging 5.1.9 https://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/release-notes/ch-information.en.html#rsyslog-creates-fewer-logfiles And maybe 5.1.8 : https://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/release-notes/ch-information.en.html#rsyslog-timestamp-change-affects-logcheck
Re: A hypervisor for a headless server?
On 02 Jun 2023 17:34, Mario Marietto wrote: Excuse me,but there is something within your argumentation that I don't like and I want to express what it is. Let's take Linux as an example of what I want to say. Linux is well known to be an OS that can be installed on the old machines,helping the people that can't buy a new computer to surf the net and to do the basic things that they couldn't do using a more complete and modern PC built with new hardware components. And this is a linux quality that everyone loves and one of the reasons why Linux is growing faster on the market. I think that everyone likes this,right ? So,why the same logic can't be applied to those software tools that go in the same direction,to those tools that help the users to have those functions that those old computers cannot give to them anymore ? Here it seems there is a contradiction. You may argue that developing for a small number of old computers isn't worth trying. But,first of all,I think that there are a LOT of old PCs in the world,since poor people aren't only a niche. We could discuss,anyway, how to reach the right amount of money to pay the developers. I'm thinking of opening a crowdfunding campaign for example. Or any other method to have the money that I can't imagine now. To do a project like this is socially accepted and helps to work on the perception of the users that computer science is something that they can use to develop their life in a good way. Maybe by helping one of those poor children,we are contributing to educate someone that in the future will make great things for humanity. I think that using the old relation that there is between costs and benefits is not applicable in every kind of situation. There are already a lot of people who work on projects that they like,but that they have a low social impact. Why not to work on a project that aims to extend the functions of an old PC. And what's better than using two operating systems on a single old pc? My old pc has 2 measly cpu's, I used one for the host and the other for linux emulated with bhyve and the performance was decent. Is there something that's more useful and generous than this kind of project ? ? Look at Xen history, you'll see that it started mid 2000s. And then, why not vmm, openBSD's virtual machines ?
Re: A hypervisor for a headless server?
On 02 Jun 2023 14:31, Michael Stone wrote: I don't recommend xen for new projects. It has more pieces and tends to be more fragile than qemu+kvm, for no real benefits these days. (IMO) Define "more pieces" and "more fragile" ? It has a really low TCB and still used by amazon for their cloud. I would recommend Xen. It's better security-wise than KVM, is ultra stable, and easy to use. I run Linuxes, BSDs and Windows as domUs (PCI passthrough, etc). Plus it doesn't pull hundreds of dependencies. You don't even need qemu if running fully virtualized guests (PV/PVH).
Re: GPT backup table, was Re: virtualisation
On 26 May 2023 11:47, Thomas Schmitt wrote: Hi, mick.crane wrote: root@pumpkin:~# fdisk -l /dev/sda Disk /dev/sda: 223.57 GiB, 240057409536 bytes, 468862128 sectors ... Disklabel type: dos ... Device Boot Start End Sectors Size Id Type /dev/sda1 * 2048 466862079 466860032 222.6G 83 Linux /dev/sda2 466864126 468860927 1996802 975M 5 Extended /dev/sda5 466864128 468860927 1996800 975M 82 Linux swap / Solaris Michael wrote: as i interpret this, the disk in questions has a dos partition table... Indeed. (And as mick.crane already noticed, it is a bit awkward to create an extended partiton 2 only to fill it nearly up with logical partition 5. I wonder what entity decided to do so.) IIRC, DOS types are limited to 4 "primary" partitions (or 2 ?), but extended partitions have no such limit, and can contain any number of others. Back in the (DOS/w95) days, you would usually create one primary and one extended, and populate the extended with as many partitions as you want. This way was used to avoid making mistakes : how many primary partitions do I have in the "root" table ? It's from memory, so 30 years old ^^
Re: thunderbird missing arrows for scrolling through list of email messages
On 05 May 2023 18:07, Lee wrote:
On 5/4/23, zithro wrote:
I think you also need
user_pref("widget.gtk.overlay-scrollbars.enabled", false);
and this is also nice
user_pref("widget.non-native-theme.scrollbar.size.override", 20);
I tried them all, but now there's a simple GUI option (see my other post
in this thread) ! \o/
PS: no I won't write a theme ^^
But I may check how to edit one. You know how ?
I think vim is really nice :)
But that's probably not what you want to know
Ahah, indeed, but thanks for the laugh ^^
From there I can select the Chicago95 theme as any user and if there's
anything I don't like I can, once I figure out wtf needs to be changed
(which can be a non-trivial task for me), make the change.
That was my point, wtf needs to be changed ?! ^^
I checked some themes in /usr/share/themes and ... well, I'll use my
theme as it is !
Re: thunderbird missing arrows for scrolling through list of email messages
On 25 Apr 2023 16:46, charlie derr wrote: Greetings fine free software people. A number of years ago, the little arrows at the top and bottom of the scrollbar to the right of my "message list" view in thunderbird (I'm currently using debian stable) disappeared [...] Any clue whether it's possible to regain that older (and for me, very useful!) functionality There is now the option in Firefox and Thunderbird to FORCE the display of scrolling bars ! Thunderbird : Settings -> General -> Scrolling -> Always show scrollbars Firefox : Settings -> General -> Browsing -> Always show scrollbars \o/
Re: iptables reject with TCP RST
On 14 May 2023 02:36, Tom Reed wrote: $ telnet 193.106.250.xx 587 Trying 193.106.250.xx... telnet: Unable to connect to remote host: Connection timed out Run wireshark/dumpcap or tcpdump on the client to check if you get the TCP reset packet. You can also run it server-side, to see if the server ever sends it.
Re: relevance of packages in repositories
On 09 May 2023 23:21, Andy Smith wrote: Hello, On Tue, May 09, 2023 at 05:40:18AM +0200, zithro wrote: In short, zero time taken. For a comparatively large response. Almost as if that was their goal (trolling)! Cheers, Andy Well he's using 225 chars, me 424, it's only ~ the double ;) And now I have a template for noobs like him \o/ Plus, if he's never answering back, I'll have an addition to my direct-to-trash filter, so I'll never loose time again for him.
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
On 09 May 2023 18:06, Vincent Lefevre wrote: On 2023-05-05 15:04:27 +0200, zithro wrote: journalctl after GUI LOGOFF [...] May 05 14:09:14 debzit sshd[14246]: Received disconnect from IP.IP.IP.IP port 38524:11: disconnected by user "disconnected by user": Doesn't this mean that it is the client that did the disconnection (for whatever reason)? I dunno, but it happens when the server-side logoff is requested from X ... Can't see the relation : how can a server X logoff send a request to the ssh command on the client ?!?! However I just tried, I killed an ssh session from the server, didn't get the "disconnect" message in logs. Although I don't know if killing (via SIGTERM) is equivalent to what whatever the system uses to close the ssh sessions when my problem is happening. This is the message I observe when I disconnect the ssh session from the client (with "~.") instead of terminating the program (e.g. shell) on the server side. Same here for normal exits, or I think so ? I use Ctrl-D to close ssh sessions, "~." does not work, I get "bash: command not found". [...] May 05 14:09:14 debzit sshd[14113]: Received disconnect from IP.IP.IP.IP port 38512:11: disconnected by user [...] Ditto. Yep, as it's just another ssh session started the exact same way than the others ;) Starting the ssh session with "ssh -vvv" might help to find the reason. Yes, need to test that too ...
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
On 09 May 2023 17:47, Vincent Lefevre wrote: Hi, On 2023-05-04 21:07:17 +0200, zithro wrote: Here is what happens chronologically : 1. I start various SSH connections to a host, some normal, some with X forwarding, like that: "ssh user@host" and "ssh -X -n user@host GUI_APP" (like firejail firefox, firejail thunderbird, etc). There's no user connected under X yet, only the greeter is displayed. 2. using VNC or rdesktop, I then log on to X on the machine, do some stuff, then hit "log off" from the desktop menu. Immediately, ALL the previous SSH connections started in step 1 get closed, hence all the shells and the GUI apps (firefox, etc) ! I have a similar setup (I also use lightdm and systemd) and do the same kind of thing, but I haven't noticed any such issue. Damn, now I wanna know the differences between our setups ^^ Do you also have several DE installed (but not running concurrently) ? BTW, you should also try GNU Screen to see if you have the same issue with it (this could help debugging). Do you mean trying "ssh u@h screen" ? Never tried screen with GUI apps, does that work ? More precisely, I have 2 machines: one at home and one at my lab. At home, I have an almost persistent X session (I log out only when I need), and from it I ssh to my machine at my lab and keep this ssh session open also almost persistently. At my lab, I log in when I arrive and always log out when I leave, but this never affects the ssh session I have at home. Note also that I normally also have a GNU Screen running on both machines (but not always). In any case, the X login/logout via lightdm at my lab never affects ssh and GNU Screen. Dammit (although happy for you ^^). User lingering is disabled on both machines. And no changes to logind.conf at my lab (KillUserProcesses is "no" by default). As said in other posts, dunno how user lingering is configured on my setups. Tried to grep "linger" in /etc (on server), only found references to SElinux. logind.conf also has "#KillUserProcesses=no". Can it be declared elsewhere, ie. outside of /etc ? I never use the -X ssh option, but I use X11 forwarding by default (ForwardX11 yes), so I suppose that this is equivalent to -X. No, AFAIK "ForwardX11 yes" is just to *allow* X11 forwarding, not to enable it on all ssh connections. Ie. running "ssh u@h GUI_APP" without "-X" does not provide the DISPLAY var, and so fails running GUI_APP with "Unable to init server: Could not connect: Connection refused". Do you use "UsePAM yes" in sshd_config (server-side option only) ? Thanks for your input, it confirms it's a problem in my config, not in the software.
Re: virt-manager guest does not start anymore after upgrade to bookworm / opengl is not available
On 07 May 2023 16:41, Rainer Dorsch wrote:
Hello,
after upgrading to bookworm, my windows guest does not start anymore, but
throws an error message:
Fehler beim Starten der Domain: internal error: qemu unexpectedly closed the
monitor: 2023-05-07T14:27:35.862395Z qemu-system-x86_64: -device
{"driver":"virtio-vga-gl","id":"video0","max_outputs":1,"bus":"pcie.
0","addr":"0x1"}: opengl is not available
>
[snip]
>
I configured a virtio video device, if I remove 3D acceleration, the guest
starts w/o a problem.
Can anybody tell what broke in the 3D acceleration during the upgrade?
Any hint or advice is welcome :-)
I'm no QEMU/openGL expert, but are you sure the "virtio-vga-gl" device
is still supported ? Maybe you need another one ?
(I vaguely remember having a problem with an audio device which wasn't
supported anymore).
Re: relevance of packages in repositories
On 07 May 2023 12:14, Дмитрий wrote: the stable version of Neodim 9.0 in debian 12 is the SEVENTH version, and in order to get the current version, you need to drag something like Homebrew, it really pisses you off and pushes you away from using the distribution Ahah this post ! ^^ For future posters, this is a perfect example of how NOT to post ! He's lucky others have answered. An evasive subject. No politeness. An wrong/approximate package name. No real question, just ranting. In short, zero time taken. Please fart once before posting next time, you may feel better, and less look like a fool ... I think I found OP's problem, he's infected with the PEBCAK virus.
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
On 06 May 2023 07:07, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: On Sat, May 06, 2023 at 10:24:52AM +0700, Max Nikulin wrote: Thanks both for the pointers, will report back with results
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
On 05 May 2023 19:14, Max Nikulin wrote: Does it happen for newly created user with no customization? Never tried ! I recommended to do it just for a case that you added something to init files for the "zithro" user. AFAIK I didn't customize a lot, as I'm rarely logging to X. But it won't hurt trying ! Will do and report back
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
On 06 May 2023 06:45, David Wright wrote: *I login to VC1 and startx for an Xserver* I think that's why you don't have my problem, your user is always logged in, even when you close X. Is the greeter just deferring the ssh command until you login? Nope, they work without X "direct" login. I even rarely login to X before ssh-ing. So I suppose the difference is that when I kill my Xserver, I'm returned to VC1, but not logged off. The question I'll not ask is why do you logoff? Or maybe I will. Ahah ^^ (and yes for your logoff, as said above). Yeah, I could as well keep the X login open till I close all ssh sessions, but it's using ressources for nothing. Except NOT logging in X (which I rarely do), the quickest fix would be to remove systemd altogether, it's only there because it's Debian's defaults. I just dunno if it's as easy on my setup than on non-X+DE/DM, where it's kinda easy.
Re: disk usage for /usr/lib on bullseye
On 03 May 2023 18:22, Curt wrote: You really don't have to tread dangerous waters (or rather wade into them, unless your Jesus) because you can simulate without root privileges. curty@einstein:~$ apt -s purge NOTE: This is only a simulation! Quick nitpicking. Even if "-s" is easily remembered as Simulate, there's also the equivalent long option : "--dry-run". Ok, it's longer to type
Re: Wi-Fi broken on Dell E6520, Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6205 AGN, Debian 11.7 Xfce
On 05 May 2023 15:46, Charles Curley wrote: On Fri, 5 May 2023 12:29:53 +0200 zithro wrote: That would be nice for them to tell you what THEY consider a valid MAC addr, as I don't think Debian produces MACs with z or x in it ... Maybe they check against a valid manufacturer (which is the 1st half of the MAC addr, iirc called OUI) ? See the Debian package ieee-data. ieee-data, another discovery today \o/ But note that in my sentence, "THEY" did refer to the Ubiquity AP the OP was using, *not* Debian or NM. I'm curious if the Xen OUI is valid for them (00:16:3e:nn:nn:nn). It appears to be. root@freeman:~# grep 16:3e /var/lib/arpwatch/ethercodes.db 0:16:3e Xensource, Inc. Again, them == Ubiquity AP ;) Xen recommends using its OUI on vifs, but does not enforce it, in part for the reasons you wrote in your other post.
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
On 05 May 2023 16:10, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: I have now full logs of before/after GUI logon/logoff, I posted them in the other post. Will try to make sense of it with this lead ... after a needed break ^^ I saved that for a look during weekend, now I'm supposed to fix an update of... forget it :) Hmmm, don't put my logs on the interwebs ! Wait, what did I do ... Damn it, too late ! ;) Joke aside, that's a nice thing to even think about, even if you don't do it in the end. Happy update fixing then, but would be nice to know what the problem is, in case we have it too ? I don't know whether there's a way to tell the DE to leave the user session dbus alone when it was already running at start. Don't even know what you mean, so to do it ... ^^ Too long to explain. But that might explain also why I dislike that stuff. The first sentence, damn, that's now two times you do it to me ! (I'm just messing with you, no anger there ;) Even if, to be totally honest, as much as this time I totally understand your POV, the 1st time I was really disappointed). I agree about the last sentence though, always KISS ! ^^ (KISS without a comma, for those who know what I'm talking about) Nicolas Boileau said : Ce que l’on conçoit bien s’énonce clairement, Et les mots pour le dire arrivent aisément [ What we conceive well is clearly stated, And the words to say it come easily. /other translation/ Whatever is well conceived is clearly said, And the words to say it flow with ease ]
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
On 05 May 2023 14:11, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: On Fri, May 05, 2023 at 01:58:55PM +0200, zithro wrote: On 05 May 2023 06:32, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: dbus is a candidate. Let me explain: I have a funny setup -- no systemd, no dbus (still, Debian buster, and X). I'm on bullseye, I know how to switch back to old init, but have no clue about Dbus (kinda a Linux-GUI-with-systemd noob). Which DE/DM you using ? I'm on MATE but also would like to get rid of many "gvfs-*" stuff. systemctl masking is not enough and filling logs with errors. No DE, just a window manager (fvwm2). Isn't that fluxbox ? That's the GUI I used on Slackware. Simple, lean, efficient ! Ah, quick search showed me that no, from the derivatives tree image of fvwm2 on wikipedia. may be wrong. But I'm a bit fed up with GUIs right now. Well, systemd rather ! Anyways, back to console fun. At some point in time, the browser (firefox) brought in dbus via some dependencies. Annoyed, I killed dbus -- and poof, all browser instances were gone. Another thing I might try. But no clue what's the relation between dbus and firefox. Also, I'm running FF in firejail. Most applications use it to store their app preferences (just as a transport to the store backend, typically some gsettings-thingy). But they may use it to start other applications, etc. No idea what firefox is messing with it (but it seems to run without currently, nevertheless). If I inhibit dbus from starting, the browsers run fine without it. My hunch is that they keep an open socket conection to the dbus and die on SIGPIPE or some such. Again, curious how to get rid of dbus, if it's not really useful. That depends on your needs. There are some things which will refuse working right away because dbus is deeply built into how they work (Bluez, for one: they use dbus like someone else would use a shared lib). So if you use bluetooth devices, you'll have to make do with dbus, I fear. Good to know, another thing to look for ... But no need for bluetooth on this machine, it's a domU \o/ So yes, if all those apps are sharing "the" session dbus, possibly started by whoever came first *and* the logout takes the session dbus down, this might be an explanation. Again, dunno, after domU boot I usually first login via SSH, and on rare occasions I login via GUI/VNC, and then ... boom. One thing you could try is to see whether, after starting one of those programs which get taken down, the user session dbus is running (and wasn't before). See what happens when you log out (does it disappear?). Then try killing it "by hand" and see whether the same happens. I have now full logs of before/after GUI logon/logoff, I posted them in the other post. Will try to make sense of it with this lead ... after a needed break ^^ I don't know whether there's a way to tell the DE to leave the user session dbus alone when it was already running at start. Don't even know what you mean, so to do it ... ^^ Those DEs behave as if the computer were theirs, not yours ;-) Aaaand I *hate* that too ! Now don't ask me why I try to avoid that ;-) If only I knew beforehand ^^ :-) Not funny ... for me ^^ (joking) Cheers Thanks again
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
So, previous post was BEFORE logging in into GUI via VNC. Now, I have outputs from after GUI LOGIN and after GUI LOGOFF. I've removed the maximum of useless lines (audio, GUI apps, gvfs stuff, etc), but tried to keep the most about systemd and dbus, as I'm clueless about what you wanna read ... This post is a facking mess ! Sorry for the "encyclopedia" ... On 05 May 2023 04:13, Max Nikulin wrote: Have you inspected journalctl output (as root) around the "log off" moment? journalctl after GUI LOGIN May 05 14:04:45 debzit lightdm[23289]: gkr-pam: unable to locate daemon control file May 05 14:04:45 debzit lightdm[23289]: gkr-pam: stashed password to try later in open session May 05 14:04:45 debzit systemd[1]: Stopping Session c2 of user lightdm. May 05 14:04:45 debzit lightdm[14038]: pam_unix(lightdm-greeter:session): session closed for user lightdm May 05 14:04:45 debzit systemd[1]: session-c2.scope: Succeeded. May 05 14:04:45 debzit systemd[1]: Stopped Session c2 of user lightdm. May 05 14:04:45 debzit systemd[1]: session-c2.scope: Consumed 12.947s CPU time. May 05 14:04:45 debzit lightdm[23289]: pam_unix(lightdm:session): session opened for user zithro(uid=1000) by (uid=0) May 05 14:04:45 debzit systemd-logind[480]: Removed session c2. May 05 14:04:45 debzit systemd-logind[480]: New session 154 of user zithro. May 05 14:04:45 debzit systemd[1]: Started Session 154 of user zithro. May 05 14:04:45 debzit rtkit-daemon[479]: Supervising 7 threads of 3 processes of 1 users. May 05 14:04:45 debzit pulseaudio[14058]: After module unload, module 'module-null-sink' was still loaded! May 05 14:04:45 debzit systemd[14042]: pulseaudio.service: Succeeded. May 05 14:04:45 debzit dbus-daemon[13960]: [session uid=1000 pid=13960] Activating service name='org.freedesktop.portal.IBus' requested by ':1.23' (uid=1000 pid=23375 comm="/usr/bin/ibus-daemon --daemonize --xim ") May 05 14:04:45 debzit dbus-daemon[13960]: [session uid=1000 pid=13960] Successfully activated service 'org.freedesktop.portal.IBus' May 05 14:04:45 debzit at-spi-bus-launcher[23376]: dbus-daemon[23376]: Activating service name='org.a11y.atspi.Registry' requested by ':1.1' (uid=1000 pid=23383 comm="/usr/libexec/ibus-ui-gtk3 ") May 05 14:04:45 debzit dbus-daemon[13960]: [session uid=1000 pid=13960] Activating via systemd: service name='org.freedesktop.portal.Desktop' unit='xdg-desktop-portal.service' requested by ':1.31' (uid=1000 pid=23384 comm="/usr/libexec/ibus-extension-gtk3 ") May 05 14:04:46 debzit systemd[711]: Starting Portal service... May 05 14:04:46 debzit at-spi-bus-launcher[23376]: dbus-daemon[23376]: Successfully activated service 'org.a11y.atspi.Registry' May 05 14:04:46 debzit at-spi-bus-launcher[23407]: SpiRegistry daemon is running with well-known name - org.a11y.atspi.Registry May 05 14:04:46 debzit dbus-daemon[13960]: [session uid=1000 pid=13960] Activating via systemd: service name='org.freedesktop.impl.portal.desktop.gtk' unit='xdg-desktop-portal-gtk.service' requested by ':1.33' (uid=1000 pid=23408 comm="/usr/libexec/xdg-desktop-portal ") May 05 14:04:46 debzit systemd[711]: Starting Portal service (GTK+/GNOME implementation)... May 05 14:04:46 debzit dbus-daemon[13960]: [session uid=1000 pid=13960] Activating service name='ca.desrt.dconf' requested by ':1.34' (uid=1000 pid=23414 comm="/usr/libexec/xdg-desktop-portal-gtk ") May 05 14:04:46 debzit dbus-daemon[13960]: [session uid=1000 pid=13960] Successfully activated service 'ca.desrt.dconf' May 05 14:04:46 debzit dbus-daemon[13960]: [session uid=1000 pid=13960] Successfully activated service 'org.freedesktop.impl.portal.desktop.gtk' May 05 14:04:46 debzit systemd[711]: Started Portal service (GTK+/GNOME implementation). May 05 14:04:46 debzit dbus-daemon[13960]: [session uid=1000 pid=13960] Activating service name='org.freedesktop.secrets' requested by ':1.33' (uid=1000 pid=23408 comm="/usr/libexec/xdg-desktop-portal ") May 05 14:04:46 debzit dbus-daemon[13960]: [session uid=1000 pid=13960] Successfully activated service 'org.freedesktop.secrets' May 05 14:04:46 debzit dbus-daemon[13960]: [session uid=1000 pid=13960] Successfully activated service 'org.freedesktop.portal.Desktop' May 05 14:04:46 debzit systemd[711]: Started Portal service. May 05 14:04:46 debzit x-session-manager[23299]: WARNING: Unable to find provider '' of required component 'dock' May 05 14:04:46 debzit gnome-keyring-daemon[23296]: The Secret Service was already initialized May 05 14:04:46 debzit dbus-daemon[471
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
On 05 May 2023 07:33, David wrote: On Thu, 4 May 2023 at 19:07, zithro wrote: this is a rather strange problem, I hope the title is explicit enough. Subject: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X Yeah, I meant title==subject, I was hoping it was clear enough for everyone. Why did you copy it ? ^^ That sounds like what is documented here, with the solution at the end: $ apt show dbus-user-session Package: dbus-user-session Version: 1.12.24-0+deb11u1 [... some output snipped for brevity ...] Description: simple interprocess messaging system (systemd --user integration) D-Bus is a message bus, used for sending messages between applications. Conceptually, it fits somewhere in between raw sockets and CORBA in terms of complexity. . On systemd systems, this package opts in to the session model in which a user's session starts the first time they log in, and does not end until all their login sessions have ended. This model merges all parallel non-graphical login sessions (text mode, ssh, cron, etc.), and up to one graphical session, into a single "user-session" or "super-session" within which all background D-Bus services are shared. . Multiple graphical sessions per user are not currently supported in this mode; as a result, it is particularly suitable for gdm, which responds to requests to open a parallel graphical session by switching to the existing graphical session and unlocking it. . To retain dbus' traditional session semantics, in which login sessions are artificially isolated from each other, remove this package and install dbus-x11 instead. [...] Will keep that under the elbow, but it *seems* a systemd problem (see other posts, like the ycombinator link, first post is exactly my problem). Thanks
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
On 05 May 2023 06:32, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: dbus is a candidate. Let me explain: I have a funny setup -- no systemd, no dbus (still, Debian buster, and X). I'm on bullseye, I know how to switch back to old init, but have no clue about Dbus (kinda a Linux-GUI-with-systemd noob). Which DE/DM you using ? I'm on MATE but also would like to get rid of many "gvfs-*" stuff. systemctl masking is not enough and filling logs with errors. At some point in time, the browser (firefox) brought in dbus via some dependencies. Annoyed, I killed dbus -- and poof, all browser instances were gone. Another thing I might try. But no clue what's the relation between dbus and firefox. Also, I'm running FF in firejail. If I inhibit dbus from starting, the browsers run fine without it. My hunch is that they keep an open socket conection to the dbus and die on SIGPIPE or some such. Again, curious how to get rid of dbus, if it's not really useful. So yes, if all those apps are sharing "the" session dbus, possibly started by whoever came first *and* the logout takes the session dbus down, this might be an explanation. Again, dunno, after domU boot I usually first login via SSH, and on rare occasions I login via GUI/VNC, and then ... boom. Now don't ask me why I try to avoid that ;-) If only I knew beforehand ^^ Cheers Thanks
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
On 05 May 2023 05:30, David Wright wrote: Isn't it this issue? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19023885 Looks like it, yes ! I'm afraid I can't replicate the problem, though, as I don't have a "log off" button or menu entry. That might suggest that the problem is in something I don't run, like the DE or DM. (I assume we're all using systemd.) Yes, I'm using systemd. When I run multiple jobs through multiple ssh commands, I find they're in different scopes, eg: 0::/user.slice/user-1000.slice/session-229.scope 0::/user.slice/user-1000.slice/session-230.scope (To see the slice and scope, add cgroup to your ps command. Add it as the last option, or its output might get truncated.) When you've logged in to X, what slice/scopes do you see for X and the processes you previously started? Are they all the same? I've posted the results of this in the reply to Max Nikulin along the others commands he told me to run. But yeah they run as different scopes. I think I've read that the way to get round this (or "go with the flow") is to run the earlier processes as user services under systemd, but I've not tried it. I'm a systemd noob, don't really know what you talking about ^^ Better switch to a better init system, I still fail to see how systemd is helping me, I only had problems with it. I'm a long time Slackware user, so I can compare inits. /rant off Cheers, David. Thanks
Re: Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
On 05 May 2023 04:13, Max Nikulin wrote: On 05/05/2023 02:07, zithro wrote: 2. using VNC or rdesktop, I then log on to X on the machine, do some stuff, then hit "log off" from the desktop menu. Immediately, ALL the previous SSH connections started in step 1 get closed, hence all the shells and the GUI apps (firefox, etc) ! Have you inspected journalctl output (as root) around the "log off" moment? Will do, but it's such a PITA ... A wild guess is that it might be force close of systemd user session, however it should not happen. Try to compare systemd-cgls (user .slice and .scope), "loginctl list-users", "loginctl list-sessions" on each step. I'm a systemd noob, don't really know what you talking about ^^ But seems like the culprit. Ran those commands (fucking auto pager though, way to break scrolling ... another fail) So *before* logging in X via VNC : # systemd-cgls --no-pager Control group /: -.slice ├─user.slice │ ├─user-112.slice │ │ ├─session-c2.scope │ │ │ ├─14038 lightdm --session-child 16 19 │ │ │ └─14060 /usr/sbin/lightdm-gtk-greeter │ │ └─user@112.service … │ │ ├─app.slice [snipped unrelated] │ │ │ ├─at-spi-dbus-bus.service │ │ │ │ ├─14078 /usr/libexec/at-spi-bus-launcher │ │ │ │ ├─14083 /usr/bin/dbus-daemon --config-file=/usr/share/defaults/at-spi2/accessibility.conf --nofork --print-addr… │ │ │ │ └─14102 /usr/libexec/at-spi2-registryd --use-gnome-session │ │ │ └─dbus.service │ │ │ └─14061 /usr/bin/dbus-daemon --session --address=systemd: --nofork --nopidfile --systemd-activation --syslog-on… │ │ └─init.scope │ │ ├─14042 /lib/systemd/systemd --user │ │ └─14043 (sd-pam) │ ├─user-0.slice │ │ ├─session-147.scope │ │ │ ├─22477 sshd: root@pts/2 │ │ │ ├─22483 -bash │ │ │ └─22725 systemd-cgls --no-pager │ │ ├─session-148.scope │ │ │ ├─22495 sshd: root@pts/3 │ │ │ ├─22501 -bash │ │ │ └─22521 htop │ │ ├─session-151.scope │ │ │ ├─22645 sshd: root@pts/5 │ │ │ └─22651 -bash │ │ ├─session-145.scope │ │ │ ├─22440 sshd: root@pts/1 │ │ │ ├─22462 -bash │ │ │ └─22634 journalctl --no-pager -b 0 --follow │ │ └─user@0.service … │ │ └─init.scope │ │ ├─22443 /lib/systemd/systemd --user │ │ └─22444 (sd-pam) │ └─user-1000.slice │ ├─user@1000.service … │ │ ├─app.slice │ │ │ ├─xdg-permission-store.service │ │ │ │ └─14334 /usr/libexec/xdg-permission-store │ │ │ ├─xdg-document-portal.service │ │ │ │ ├─14331 /usr/libexec/xdg-document-portal │ │ │ │ └─14339 fusermount -o rw,nosuid,nodev,fsname=portal,auto_unmount,subtype=portal -- /run/user/1000/doc │ │ │ ├─pulseaudio.service │ │ │ │ └─14031 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --daemonize=no --log-target=journal │ │ │ ├─gvfs-daemon.service │ │ │ │ └─14302 /usr/libexec/gvfsd │ │ │ ├─at-spi-dbus-bus.service │ │ │ │ └─14508 /usr/libexec/at-spi-bus-launcher │ │ │ ├─pipewire.service │ │ │ │ ├─752 /usr/bin/pipewire │ │ │ │ └─756 /usr/bin/pipewire-media-session │ │ │ └─dbus.service │ │ │ └─13960 /usr/bin/dbus-daemon --session --address=systemd: --nofork --nopidfile --systemd-activation --syslog-on… │ │ └─init.scope │ │ ├─711 /lib/systemd/systemd --user │ │ └─724 (sd-pam) │ ├─session-111.scope │ │ ├─14107 sshd: zithro [priv] │ │ ├─14113 sshd: zithro@notty │ │ ├─14114 firejail firefox -p junk -no-remote │ │ ├─14117 /usr/bin/xdg-dbus-proxy --fd=4 --args=5 │ │ ├─14119 firejail firefox -p junk -no-remote │ │ ├─14128 firefox-esr -p junk -no-remote [snipped all threads] │ ├─session-141.scope │ │ ├─21925 sshd: zithro [priv] │ │ ├─21931 sshd: zithro@pts/0 │ │ └─21932 ssh zithro@otherhost │ ├─session-112.scope │ │ ├─14239 sshd: zithro [priv] │ │ ├─14246 sshd: zithro@notty │ │ ├─14247 firejail thunderbird │ │ ├─14250 firejail thunderbird │ │ ├─14259 /usr/lib/thunderbird/thunderbird │ └─session-149.scope │ ├─22606 sshd: zithro [priv] │ ├─22612 sshd: zithro@pts/4 │ └─22613 -bash ├─init.scope │ └─1 /sbin/init └─system.slice ├─dbus.service │ └─471 /usr/bin/dbus-daemon --system --address=systemd: --nofork --nopidfile --systemd-activation --syslog-only [snipped rest of slice] # loginctl list-sessions SESSION UID USERSEAT TTY 111 1000 zithro 112 1000 zithro 141 1000 zithropts/0 1450 root 1470 root 1480 root 149 1000 zithropts/4 1510 root c2 112 lightdm seat0 9 sessions listed. # loginctl list-users UID USER 0 root 112 lightdm 1000 zithro 3 users listed. To keep this answer humanly readable, I will post the results of previous commands after GUI login and after GUI logoff in another answer ... Perhaps it may be related to user D-Bus sessions, however I would expect that ssh GUI app has its own bus created by dbus-launch. Dunno exactly how to report this. In the firefox firejail there's "xdg-dbus-proxy", but not in the thunderbird firejail. # ps -eo pid,user,args,cgroup | grep
Re: thunderbird missing arrows for scrolling through list of email messages
On 05 May 2023 12:20, dmacdoug wrote: Well, it appears to me that all Mozilla products have the same problem and for Firefox there is a theme add on named "Custom Scollbars" made by Wesley Branton which allows to change the color of the scrollbar and to make limited changes to the width but does not restore the arrows. He has been asked about it and says that it is not possible to do more without changes by the developers. IIRC, it is a problem since the GTK2/GTK3 fix. If many users pile on a bug report maybe the devs would move ... This theme is not available for either Thunderbird or Filezilla and I can't find any theme for either of those which does anything similar. Filezilla can use mozilla themes ?
Re: Wi-Fi broken on Dell E6520, Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6205 AGN, Debian 11.7 Xfce
On 05 May 2023 06:08, David Christensen wrote:
On 5/4/23 19:52, David Christensen wrote:
That said, Wi-Fi does not work with my Ubuiquitti Networks UniFi setup
-- it doesn't like the MAC address.
A further problem -- Debian is changing the MAC address of the Wi-Fi
adapter ("MAC address spoofing", a security "feature") to MAC addresses
that my networking equipment (Ubiquiti Networks UniFi) detects as invalid:
"This field must be a valid MAC address"
That would be nice for them to tell you what THEY consider a valid MAC
addr, as I don't think Debian produces MACs with z or x in it ...
Maybe they check against a valid manufacturer (which is the 1st half of
the MAC addr, iirc called OUI) ?
I'm curious if the Xen OUI is valid for them (00:16:3e:nn:nn:nn).
Re: Wi-Fi broken on Dell E6520, Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6205 AGN, Debian 11.7 Xfce
On 05 May 2023 04:52, David Christensen wrote: I was going to surf eBay and find another Wi-Fi card, but then I had one last idea -- double-checking the the CMOS/NVRAM settings via Setup. I cut the settings down to the bare minimum for Wi-Fi: Settings + Wireless + Wireless Switch | WWAN unchecked | WLAN checked | Bluetooth unchecked + Wireless Device Enable WWAN unchecked WLAN checked Bluetooth unchecked -> Apply -> Exit Wow, good job, didn't think about the firmware. For info, what were the settings BEFORE you changed them ? I know the machine has Wi-Fi and it does not have WWAN. I don't know if the Wi-Fi card includes Bluetooth. But, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it'. Don't touch anything, and look up your card on the net ;) If you don't use it now, maybe you'll need it one day, and you may have forgotten you disabled it in the FW. Damn infernal computers and networks... Too easy, not funny ^^
Re: Need some advice please.
On 05 May 2023 08:29, Michel Verdier wrote: Le 5 mai 2023 zithro a écrit : If on USB/external drive, preferably format the drive so it can be read on multiple OS. So prefer FAT32/exFAT, and avoid ext4, ZFS, NTFS, APFS, etc. As I don't need to restore debian on windows I choose to format my external drive with xfs on encrypted partition I agree that for normal use cases, you can do whatever is easier and practical for you ! You could as well create a blank disk image file, mount it as a loop device, format as encrypted xfs (or better, encrypted zfs), unmount and finally copy (dd or zfs-send) the image file on whatever medium you want. (I don't know much about xfs, but zfs has advantages for this purpose: snapshots, encryption, variable block size, ACLs, zfs-send directly to a file, etc). But, my point was that backups must be accessible at all times, covering the most use cases possible. So it means up to the most critical emergency situations, when you don't have a system at hand that can read a particular filesystem, but you must read/extract the data from your backup. Hence choosing the most universal FS.
Re: Need some advice please.
On 05 May 2023 03:12, Byung-Hee HWANG wrote: Usually i do backup into Google Drive (with only very important files). So if system is crash, i go to re-install entire after format. I hope you encrypt your data, and you have a good internet connection ! The easiest and fastest way to backup is on DVD/USB/external drive, so that you can restore offline. (Ok ok, some internet connections are faster than a DVD/USB/ext drive !) If on USB/external drive, preferably format the drive so it can be read on multiple OS. So prefer FAT32/exFAT, and avoid ext4, ZFS, NTFS, APFS, etc. Follow the "3-2-1 rule" : "The 3-2-1 rule [...] states that there should be at least *3 copies* of the data, stored on *2 different types of storage* media, and *one copy should be kept offsite*, in a remote location (this can include cloud storage)" Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backup
Re: Need some advice please.
On 05 May 2023 03:02, Maureen L Thomas wrote:> I need to start writing down everything I do so I don't forget again. This is one of the best advice you can follow, and don't think it's because of your age ! We ALL forget stuff we only do once in a while, and not only with computers ... Just remember where your notes are, and that they must be saved on different media ;)
Re: Wi-Fi broken on Dell E6520, Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6205 AGN, Debian 11.7 Xfce
On 05 May 2023 01:55, David Christensen wrote: Try Enable Wi-Fi a couple three more times -- nope Try Debian 9 -- nope. Try Windows 7 Pro -- nope. It looks like I have a dead Wi-Fi adapter. Or a dead Wifi killswitch (the physical radio button) ? Last thought, don't you have : - a mechanical ON/OFF button (I mean like on your walls for the lights) - AND a Fn+keyboard key combo to toggle Wifi (enable/disable) ? On my old Thinkpad, I have both, whereas on a newer model I only have the Fn+key combo. Thank you for the help. :-) Np, sorry for your loss ^^
Re: Need some advice please.
On 05 May 2023 01:03, Maureen L Thomas wrote: Ok so I cannot download any files to fix my /var section. I have a 2 TB seagate that has a USB 3 cord to it. I do not have an open USB port so I plugged it in to my USB hub thingy and it got shut down. It is no longer usable. So the question is I have a HDMI spot open on the computer and if I find a USB adapter to HDMI and plug it in will that work. I looked and there are many different kinds and most are about monitors. I don't want to blow up my seagate or my computer but am at a loss as to which way to go. I plan on using the sea gate to back up my home partition and then install 11.6 on the computer and use the seagate as a back up. Any ideas would be of great help. HDMI is for monitors, not for USB devices. Some USB ports can be used as display ports, but the opposite won't work. There are no USB to HDMI adapters for your use case. Is your USB hub self-powered (ie. via a power adapter), or is it only using USB ? Same for the seagate, does it only have a USB port, no power adapter ? Also, can't you remove the USB hub to plug the Seagate directly to the computer ? Do you have another computer and/or disk drive ? PS: I didn't follow your previous posts as enough users were helping, please gimme the name and/or URL so I can read it
Re: Wi-Fi broken on Dell E6520, Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6205 AGN, Debian 11.7 Xfce
On 05 May 2023 00:24, David Christensen wrote: # ls -l /var/lib/systemd/rfkill total 12 -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 2 May 4 12:15 pci-:03:00.0:wlan -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 2 May 24 2022 pci-:0b:00.0:wlan -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 2 May 4 13:04 platform-dell-laptop:wlan Strange, looks like you have two wlan NICs ? Oh, maybe it's the bluetooth module. Dunno, wireless sucks anyways ^^ So, to determine the correct WLAN adapter run both : lspci -s 03:00.0 lspci -s 0b:00.0 So, there are three (3) files matching the description offered by Christoph Brinkhaus, and they all contain "0\n". This is strange, he indicated that 0 is for normal ops, and 1 for blocked. # systemctl --status rfkill systemctl: unrecognized option '--status' My bad, it's # systemctl status rfkill Is the rfkill *module* loaded ? # lsmod | grep rfkill # lsmod | grep rfkill rfkill 32768 4 dell_laptop,dell_rbtn,cfg80211 Good, it's loaded. And there's a hint, the module "dell_rbtn", which should mean dell radio button. Is the rfkill *tool* installed ? # dpkg -l "*rfkill*" dpkg-query: no packages found matching *rfkill* If not, install it # apt install rfkill You did not install it :p
Re: Wi-Fi broken on Dell E6520, Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6205 AGN, Debian 11.7 Xfce
On 04 May 2023 23:26, David Christensen wrote: On 5/4/23 13:36, Christoph Brinkhaus wrote: Am Thu, May 04, 2023 at 01:14:12PM -0700 schrieb David Christensen: [ 80.070510] iwlwifi :03:00.0: reporting RF_KILL (radio disabled) [ 80.070571] iwlwifi :03:00.0: RF_KILL bit toggled to disable radio. This indicates rfkill is effectively blocking the wlan: "radio disabled" There is a directory /var/lib/systemd/rfkill/ which holds a file named by the Wi-Fi device. Here it is pci-:04:00.0:wlan. The content is just a 0 for normal operation or 1 for Wi-Fi off which means RF_Kill. Please check that file on your system and replace a possible 1 by a 0. There is no /var/lib/systemd directory on the laptop: Maybe it's elsewhere in /var ? $ find /var -type d -name rfkill Or in sysfs : $ find /sys -type d -name rfkill Else, look everywhere ^^ Things to check : Check the status via systemctl (didn't know there was a service): # systemctl --status rfkill Is the rfkill *module* loaded ? # lsmod | grep rfkill If nothing, try loading the module : # modprobe rfkill Is the rfkill *tool* installed ? # dpkg -l "*rfkill*" If not, install it # apt install rfkill
Re: Buster / Google Remote Desktop
On 29 Apr 2023 05:31, Gareth Evans wrote: It seems Google Remote Desktop, a Chrome extension, does not work properly with Buster + Mate. I haven't tried with Bullseye, which is not an option in the environment concerned due to CUPS bugs, but in Buster there is about 5 seconds of remote-mouse-movement then no more. Does anyone know of a way to fix this, or any other approach that might work through a mobile broadband router (at the 'controlled' end) where there is no option to fwd ports? Thanks, Gareth Teamviewer ? https://www.teamviewer.com/en-us/download/linux/
Re: thunderbird missing arrows for scrolling through list of email messages
On 04 May 2023 22:10, Dan Ritter wrote: zithro wrote: On 04 May 2023 21:38, Dan Ritter wrote: It's not hidden, it's part of the theme. You can install and change themes -- look for packages with the keyword gtk theme, and in XFCE's settings manager, it's under appearance/style. Well, I'm currently using "Greybird-dark" (so not the default). But it seems there's no GUI to alter the theme itself. I looked in Appearance, Window Manager/Style, Window Manager/Advanced, Window Manager/Tweaks and even in the Settings Editor (read almost all keys/values), and found nowhere a possibility to alter the arrows. Maybe I overlooked something ? It's under Appearance as "Style" for me. -dsr- Same, but I personaly find "Window Manager/Style" better, as it allows changing a few settings.
Re: thunderbird missing arrows for scrolling through list of email messages
On 04 May 2023 22:11, Dan Ritter wrote: zithro wrote: Well, I'm currently using "Greybird-dark" (so not the default). But it seems there's no GUI to alter the theme itself. Right, you have to select a different theme. Or write your own. -dsr- Well, I just tried half of the stock themes, and some themes show the arrows, some don't, but ... it depends on the applications ! As the OP reported, neither Thunderbird nor Firefox display the arrows, whereas editors, xterm or file managers do ... So I guess the problem is REALLY in the Mozilla apps. I opened about:config in Firefox (didn't find it in TB), typed "scrollbar" and played with some settings. "widget.non-native-theme.gtk.scrollbar.allow-buttons" seemed promising, but has no effect, even with skins displaying the arrows in other apps. From what I read it's a problem with GTK2/3. PS: no I won't write a theme ^^ But I may check how to edit one. You know how ?
Re: thunderbird missing arrows for scrolling through list of email messages
On 04 May 2023 21:38, Dan Ritter wrote: zithro wrote: On 28 Apr 2023 00:58, dmacdoug wrote: On Tue, Apr 25, 2023 at 02:46:38PM +, charlie derr wrote: A number of years ago, the little arrows at the top and bottom of the scrollbar to the right of my "message list" view in thunderbird (I'm currently using debian stable) disappeared. [snip] Or is it a desktop skin problem ? On XFCE too, there are no more "lil arrows" anywhere, just the bars. Nothing in settings, even the manual ones. But maybe if you ask on the XFCE forum, there is a hidden value to create ? It's not hidden, it's part of the theme. You can install and change themes -- look for packages with the keyword gtk theme, and in XFCE's settings manager, it's under appearance/style. -dsr- Well, I'm currently using "Greybird-dark" (so not the default). But it seems there's no GUI to alter the theme itself. I looked in Appearance, Window Manager/Style, Window Manager/Advanced, Window Manager/Tweaks and even in the Settings Editor (read almost all keys/values), and found nowhere a possibility to alter the arrows. Maybe I overlooked something ? Also, if I remember correctly from previous searches, some settings are only available via "xfconf-query" (like deprecated or new ones).
Re: repeat of previous question that has gone unanswered several times.
On 01 May 2023 14:53, Brian wrote: On Mon 01 May 2023 at 13:41:10 +0200, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: On Mon, May 01, 2023 at 09:37:59AM +0200, john doe wrote: [...] Please refrain from polluting the list when you do not get an answer. I think repeating a question after a while doesn't count as "polluting". That's what debian-user is for, after all. Indeed. Persistaence has a place and may pay off. Indeed, it seems it has paid off, as it works now for Gene ! The Brian-Gene exchanges are now set in stone, and can now serve as a step-by-step debug guide for CUPS. I'm glad Gene followed suggestions this time, right Gene ? ;) Although I was afraid when I saw : *** WARNING: Detected another IPv4 mDNS stack running on this host. This makes mDNS unreliable and is thus not> Is that expected at 1st avahi start ? Second question: is that possible to use CUPS/printing without avahi ?
Logging off an X session closes all ssh -X connections started previously from outside X
Hi all, this is a rather strange problem, I hope the title is explicit enough. Here is what happens chronologically : 1. I start various SSH connections to a host, some normal, some with X forwarding, like that: "ssh user@host" and "ssh -X -n user@host GUI_APP" (like firejail firefox, firejail thunderbird, etc). There's no user connected under X yet, only the greeter is displayed. 2. using VNC or rdesktop, I then log on to X on the machine, do some stuff, then hit "log off" from the desktop menu. Immediately, ALL the previous SSH connections started in step 1 get closed, hence all the shells and the GUI apps (firefox, etc) ! Everything is done using the same local and remote users (same UID but different names). sshd is the parent process of all my remote SSH sessions. I don't get how apps and shells NOT started via the X session, moreover previously to its creation, are closed when the X session closes, what's happening here ?! As the outcome is the same with VNC and rdesktop, I guess the problem is lying in the OS. Could it be related to logind ? Or an SSH(d) setting ? Both systems are Debian 11/bullseye stable with X(org). The client is running XFCE (but has MATE installed), the remote server is only running MATE (no other DE installed). It happens since at least a year. Ideas anyone ? Have a nice evening, zithro
Re: thunderbird missing arrows for scrolling through list of email messages
On 28 Apr 2023 00:58, dmacdoug wrote: On Tue, Apr 25, 2023 at 02:46:38PM +, charlie derr wrote: Greetings fine free software people. A number of years ago, the little arrows at the top and bottom of the scrollbar to the right of my "message list" view in thunderbird (I'm currently using debian stable) disappeared. [snip] I've been waiting and hoping you'd get an answer, because I have exactly the same problem and I haven't found a solution. [snip] I've been thinking of movng from T-bird to something else like Claws Mail to solve the problem but haven't gotten around to it since I usually use Mutt and only use T-bird on occasions when it's necessary to use a GUI interface. Yeah, I hate it too when they remove stuff for ... what purpose again ? Who knows. Progress, design, w/e ? As it seems a problem in the desktop/window manager, I'm not sure changing the software will change anything. Or is it a desktop skin problem ? On XFCE too, there are no more "lil arrows" anywhere, just the bars. Nothing in settings, even the manual ones. But maybe if you ask on the XFCE forum, there is a hidden value to create ? Also, maybe try running the Windows Thunderbird version under WINE, and it would display the arrows ? I've not used WINE in a long time, so it's a wild guess. However, on MATE, it seems the arrows are there !
Re: Email bodies not show anymore in Evolution Email
On 04 May 2023 17:40, Tixy wrote: On Thu, 2023-05-04 at 12:07 +0200, Christoph Pleger wrote: Hello, I have had just the same problem. I think it is caused by the last security upgrade by unattended-upgrades of these packages: gir1.2-javascriptcoregtk-4.0 gir1.2-webkit2-4.0 libjavascriptcoregtk-4.0-18 libwebkit2gtk-4.0-37 Ah, thank you very much for that information. In the meanwhile, I found that there is already a bug report available at Debian about that. That's good, because I too can only read email by hitting Ctrl-U to view the source. A recent email from the Debian security team confirms this (Advisory DSA-5396-2) : "The webkit2gtk update released as 5396-1 introduced a compatibility problem that caused Evolution to display e-mail incorrectly. Evolution has been updated to solve this issue. For the stable distribution (bullseye), this problem has been fixed in version 3.38.3-1+deb11u2."
Re: What settings should be used for VM?
On 04 May 2023 14:42, Igor Korot wrote: Hi, I am trying install Debian Buster on the VirtualBox as a guest. I set the VM to use HostOnly network with DHCP enabled, but when I ran the installer it failed to auto-configure the network. How do I solve it? Thank you. P.S.: I need python 2, therefore trying to use older version. Host-only network is only useful to allow network communications between the host and the guest, but not to the outside (local network, internet, etc). It's like an isolated bridge. You can also put several VMs on this bridge so they can communicate together. Do you need internet access on this VM for your python developments ? Because if not, just download a full version (DVD ?) of the installer and then do everything offline. If you need internet, you will have to use NAT, but you got the pointer already.
Re: Segfaults after upgrade to Debian 11.7 on virtualized systems with AMD Ryzen CPU
On 02 May 2023 00:19, NetValue Operations Centre wrote: Good thinking, trying that. I worked through some of the cpu features, and when removing the line: the test VM on 5.10.0-22-amd64 booted successfully. https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/x86/protection-keys.txt "Memory Protection Keys provides a mechanism for enforcing page-based protections" "The kernel will send a SIGSEGV in both cases, but si_code will be set to SEGV_PKERR when violating protection keys versus SEGV_ACCERR when the plain mprotect() permissions are violated." So, sounds like a memory protection system which can result in seg faults. AFAICT the host system is running just fine with PKU feature on hosts running either 5.10.0-21-amd64 or 5.10.0-22-amd64, and the host kernel doesn't seem to affect the guest's behaviour either, only if the guest is running 5.10.0-22-amd64 with PKU passed through. I don't know the best bug tracker to create a ticket in would be... https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/linux-image-5.10.0-22-amd64 ? Regards, I have a "similar" problem on a Xen dom0, using a Ryzen 1700x. Xen dom0 won't boot with the new "5.10.0-22-amd64" kernel, but using "5.10.0-21-amd64" works. I don't have a serial console to read the full output, the last visible line is "dom0 has 2 vCPUs". So it happens during the creation of dom0. With a working kernel (so "5.10.0-21-amd64"), the next lines read: (XEN) Initial low memory virq threshold set at 0x4000 pages. (XEN) Scrubbing Free RAM in background So, as you said, it seems related to some "memory handling/protection system". But I didn't have any problem updating the Debian domUs to the new kernel, while using the old one in dom0. PS: if I'm not mistaken, the equivalent of Xen CPU attribution for VMs in KVM is "host-passthrough", maybe try that in your VM configs ?
Re: Mailing list usage questions
On 13 Apr 2023 01:15, Dan Ritter wrote: zithro wrote: On 12 Apr 2023 22:15, Greg Wooledge wrote: RFCs are there for having a common ground, right ? Sort of. At various meetings, a grad student was "volunteered" to take notes. Not quite certain of how accurately he had transcribed things, he typed up "Request For Comments" at the top and sent around copies. The student was Jon Postel, right ? (RIP dude, you did us good !) Since then, the IETF RFC Editor has established that some RFCs are for noting what people are doing, some are for making proposals, and some are "standards track" which are expected to have compatible implementations. I guess I wrongly think RFC are standards, whereas it's only a "work in common" ? But isn't the IETF "standardizing" protocols ? I mean it in ISO terms. (playword by chance ^^). If I'm not wrong, RFC compliance may even be required in some areas (via contracts). That might happen, but it wouldn't be a great idea from a legal standpoint: RFCs are often ambiguous in surprising ways. Oh, good to know. Do you have an example at hand ? (I admit my memory lost the info about which RFC compliance I talked about. Maybe some TCP/IP related stuff, and/or related to comms in space ? Or was it "just compliance" but not in legal terms ? Really don't remember). Like should I ignore all those non-standards stuff when setting it ? Or should I handle them in the config ? The surprising thing about the Internet is how well it works, considering how many different interpretations people have committed into code. Be conservative in what you send, be liberal in what you receive ? (: (the infamous Jon Postel quote, may be inaccurate as extracted from memory) So I just use the usual software (postfix/dovecot), and should be good to go ? No fear of loosing mails, either sending or receiving ? (I'm only talking about the protocols themselves, not things like DNSBL, spamhaus, etc).
Re: Mailing list usage questions
On 12 Apr 2023 22:15, Greg Wooledge wrote: On Wed, Apr 12, 2023 at 10:04:42PM +0200, zithro wrote: So it seems that, despite (incomplete?) standards, each provider (in the whole mail chain, MUA, MTA, etc) "does what he wants" ? Why do you sound surprised? This is how everything works. Everything. I tend to agree AND disagree about "everything" ^^ [Reminds me of the discussion about categorization which happened on this ML a few days ago, about perl iirc ; ) ] RFCs are there for having a common ground, right ? If I'm not wrong, RFC compliance may even be required in some areas (via contracts). Are you referring to "extending standards w/o making it a standard" (read: intellectual property and market advantage) ? Or something else ? Because now we're at it, I am trying to understand the caveats of the whole mail system stuff. Setting it up for a local/personal network was easy, but it's another beast when getting public (IMHO). Like should I ignore all those non-standards stuff when setting it ? Or should I handle them in the config ?
Re: SQUASHFS error: Unable to read fragment cache entry ...
On 12 Apr 2023 19:51, Albretch Mueller wrote: I always use a Debian live DVD while exposed. The thing is that in order to squeeze every minute of attention I possibly can I tend to: a) just close the lid of my laptop b) while keeping the DVD player attached to the laptop c) then, reopen it and continue. That way I avoid like 5 minutes of configuration time. Not always, but most of the times I start getting those kinds of errors. Basically, I need to be able to close my laptop and pack it up while I am going from point A to B and then take it out and continue. How do you guys to that? I mean, "you guys who must use live DVD" ;-) Any helpful tip would be appreciated! lbrtchx I would use Qubes OS, but it's not a straight forward experience ; ) Plus your hardware must be : - recent, as Qubes is kinda CPU/memory hungry - supported, as you need to use sleep modes It is not really an answer to your particular bug though.
Re: Mailing list usage questions
On 12 Apr 2023 19:20, John Hasler wrote:
zithro writes:
To not have to handle issues with security or availability of an own
mail server.
I use pobox.com's paid service. Email is their business. I run Postfix
locally using the Pobox server as a smarthost and use Fetchmail to
download my mail every five minutes. Best of both worlds, and I have my
own domain so that I can easily relocate to another service with minimal
disruption. I don't want to rely on a promotional giveaway from an
advertising agency for an important service like email.
I totally get your point, after all Google is the biggest advertising
company.
And I admit I hate using it with personal/private emails.
But *only* considering public mailing list, I fail to understand how it
is a problem (I'm also not using the webmail version).
And thanks for sharing how you're using mail services.
Google's engineers are way better than me ; )
Perhaps, but Google is an advertising agency and they are giving away the
service you are using. The revenue per user that they get by extracting
marketable data from their user's emails has to be slim, and that has to
pay those engineers. How is their support? How quickly do they respond
to trouble reports?
And, of course, you have no contract with Google.
True, I'm only using their free tier offer ("free for personal use").
I don't want to act like I promote google, but their support is
reactive, even for "free" users like me.
This summer, I failed to realize there was a change in their product.
You had to "transfer" your account to still use the free tier, before a
date, or else you'd loose the service for good (i was shaking a bit ^^).
A month after the due date, I kindly asked them if they could still
"keep me" and transfer the service to the "new free offer".
A day after, mails were working again.
Ok, I agree that some of their policies are invasive to say the least.
But it's the price to pay for convenience.
In this world, except air, what's *really* free ? ^^
Take Youtube for example.
Everyone is happy that it exists, yet who is paying for it ?
From what I've read, Youtube is (was?) loosing money.
Ads are, unfortunately, a necessary evil those days.
I'm not saying I like this business model though, but, again,
it's convenient.
Re: Mailing list usage questions
[Note: I snipped everything for easier read, and replied to the most recent email] Thank you all for your constructive answers ! This was a really interesting read. So it seems that, despite (incomplete?) standards, each provider (in the whole mail chain, MUA, MTA, etc) "does what he wants" ?
Re: Mailing list usage questions
On 12 Apr 2023 19:56, to...@tuxteam.de wrote:
On Wed, Apr 12, 2023 at 06:40:45PM +0200, zithro wrote:
[...]
But they don't work for you.
Well, in a sense, yes, and freely ^^
You don't want to be convinced
No, that's not how life works. How pretentious is that sentence ...
Nonetheless, I'm still curious about your thoughts.
Talking is the number one prerogative of security services.
With, and especially with, your ennemies ! ("The gatekeepers" movie)
[...]
Ah ah, this answer ... "I know but I'll keep it for myself". Very nice !
BTW, security by obscurity is a delusion.
Zuboff, Shoshana (2019).
The Age of Surveillance Capitalism: The Fight for a
Human Future at the New Frontier of Power.
London: Profile Books.
ISBN 978-1-78125-685-5 [1]
If only you were less cryptic I could answer.
Please don't and let's put this to rest.
It's a public mailing list.
A place to *discuss*.
A place to *exchange knowledge*.
I care and listen about knowledge and opinions from *anyone*.
It does not mean I agree or disagree with them.
In this post, you're only posting opinions (rather aggressively and
pretentiously), but zero knowledge or technical information which can
help or inform other people.
Thanks for the book though, will take a look. Is it like a technical
1984 ("Big Brother") ?
Also, if someone knows what he's talking about, I'd be glad to
read it. I mean technical or non-technical facts -and- opinions.
Sharing is caring.
Peace.
Re: Mailing list usage questions
On 12 Apr 2023 18:12, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: On Wed, Apr 12, 2023 at 06:00:25PM +0200, zithro wrote: On 12 Apr 2023 11:21, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: On Wed, Apr 12, 2023 at 08:23:23AM +0100, Brad Rogers wrote: On Tue, 11 Apr 2023 21:08:51 + "Andrew M.A. Cater" wrote: Hello Andrew, If you are subscribed to the mailing list and you post, you should see a copy turn up in your mailing list mails Unless your email provider is google, or somebody covertly using google. Now why would you want to do that? Cheers To not have to handle issues with security or availability of an own mail server. Google's engineers are way better than me ; ) But they don't work for you. Well, in a sense, yes, and freely ^^ Concerning *security* only, so *not privacy*, I trust them way more than any random sysadmin in his den, including me (who followed security courses). I suggest reading some of Mitnick's books, and how he had fun with some AT&T servers. Comparing entire security teams with an enthousiast is ... out of this world. What's the problem letting Google or w/e email service reading emails from a *public* mailing list ? If you don't understand the problems I think I won't be able to explain them to you. There's good literature out there. Ah ah, this answer ... "I know but I'll keep it for myself". Very nice ! BTW, security by obscurity is a delusion. If only you were less cryptic I could answer. The mails in my mailbox contain the exact same data as can be found on "lists.debian.org". They're both mirrors. So AI training works the same, if that's what you're implying.
Re: Mailing list usage questions
On 12 Apr 2023 11:21, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: On Wed, Apr 12, 2023 at 08:23:23AM +0100, Brad Rogers wrote: On Tue, 11 Apr 2023 21:08:51 + "Andrew M.A. Cater" wrote: Hello Andrew, If you are subscribed to the mailing list and you post, you should see a copy turn up in your mailing list mails Unless your email provider is google, or somebody covertly using google. Now why would you want to do that? Cheers To not have to handle issues with security or availability of an own mail server. Google's engineers are way better than me ; ) What's the problem letting Google or w/e email service reading emails from a *public* mailing list ?
Re: Mailing list usage questions
On 12 Apr 2023 13:54, Byung-Hee HWANG wrote: If you are subscribed to the mailing list and you post, you should see a copy turn up in your mailing list mails Unless your email provider is google, or somebody covertly using google. Now why would you want to do that? I have experience. Gmail eat one message if that is duplicated. Thanks, that's what's happening ! So you just move your own emails from "Sent" to the "ML folder" ?
Re: Mailing list usage questions
On 12 Apr 2023 04:12, The Wanderer wrote: Some mail services apparently treat this "discard incoming messages that look like duplicates of ones you already have a copy of" behavior as a feature; Gmail is the best-known example. That has problems when (as with this mailing list) the incoming copy is not identical to the one that was sent, even though it has the same Message-ID, but AFAIK they don't seem to care. Thanks for the details ! This is exactly what's happening.
Re: how to change default nameserver?
On 11 Apr 2023 22:28, gene heskett wrote: On 4/11/23 13:36, Andrew M.A. Cater wrote: There are a bunch of cups manpages: there are lots of documents online. The people recommending you avahi/bonjour/zeroconf are recommending it because it works - for them and for 99.9% of people. And its both a lockin for apple, and denies the feature the printer maker puts into his product. And I'm purist enough to object the both. For future readers : this is plain wrong. This is a perfect example of "assuming without knowing". It's a bit like saying "TCP/IP was invented for the DARPA, and I'm a pacifist, so screw it" (note it's only a metaphor). A simple web search is enough to understand what a *protocol* is, and what those particular protocols/software suites are, and are for. Approximation : it's like an automatic enhanced DHCP protocol. As Andrew says, it works for 99.9% of the users, and is recommended to people who : - don't know how to configure things, or - don't want to configure manually, or - don't care how things work But of course, and contrary to my metaphor about TCP/IP, avahi/bonjour/zeroconf is NOT required when you know what you are doing and/or you follow usual best practices. It's an helper protocol, not a required one. And as every protocol, you are tied to how the vendors implement them.
Re: how to change default nameserver?
On 11 Apr 2023 22:18, Greg Wooledge wrote:
On Tue, Apr 11, 2023 at 09:56:05PM +0200, zithro wrote:
Do you know when resolv.conf started appearing ?
I guess after TCP/IP got invented ?
The wikipedia page does not mention it.
<https://man.openbsd.org/resolv.conf> says it first appeared in 4.3BSD.
I can neither confirm nor deny this, but it does match my *belief* that
BSD did it first, and then System V copied it. It's a bit before my time,
though.
THIS was a fun rabbit hole to enter ^^
From "https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Unix";
Perhaps the most important aspect of the BSD development effort was the
addition of TCP/IP network code to the mainstream Unix kernel.
[...] The network code found in these releases is the ancestor of much
TCP/IP network code in use today, including code that was *later*
released in AT&T System V UNIX.
So your belief was right. BSD before SysV !
"http://gunkies.org/wiki/4BSD";
4 BSD does *NOT* include any TCP/IP networking
"http://gunkies.org/wiki/4.2_BSD";
4.2 BSD follows the betas of 4.1a & 4.1b. 4.2 BSD Is special
because it incorporates the first versions of BSD TCP/IP
Let's see. I downloaded the source code of 4.2 and 4.3BSD from The Unix
Heritage Society (https://www.tuhs.org/Archive/Distributions/UCB/)
--
$ grep -R "resolv.conf"
4.3BSD/lib/libc/net/res_init.c:char*conffile = "/etc/resolv.conf";
4.3BSD/lib/libc/net/res_init.c:printf("MAXNS
reached, reading resolv.conf\n");
4.3BSD/etc/named/tools/ns.lookup/man/nslookup.l:(Default = value in
/etc/resolv.conf, abbreviation = do)
4.3BSD/etc/named/tools/ns.lookup/man/nslookup.l:/etc/resolv.conf initial
domain name and name server addresses.
--
So it's not in 4.2, and appeared in 4.3.
Fun one "https://github.com/dank101/4.2BSD/blob/master/include/netdb.h"; :
/*
* Assumption here is that a network number
* fits in 32 bits -- probably a poor one.
*/
Ok, out of the hole now ^^
Re: Mailing list usage questions
On 11 Apr 2023 22:39, Tom Furie wrote: In the headers of every mail on debian lists are some "List-*" headers. In there you can find an address and subject to get help on list commands etc. (At least, I assume it still works. I haven't used it in a long time and didn't bother to check before writing this reply.) Yes, I'm using those headers to sort all the MLs I'm subscribed to. I already sent "help" to the ML but it did not provide any hints. Hence my question here ; )
Re: how to change default nameserver?
On 11 Apr 2023 22:18, Greg Wooledge wrote: On Tue, Apr 11, 2023 at 09:56:05PM +0200, zithro wrote: Do you know when resolv.conf started appearing ? I guess after TCP/IP got invented ? The wikipedia page does not mention it. <https://man.openbsd.org/resolv.conf> says it first appeared in 4.3BSD. I can neither confirm nor deny this, but it does match my *belief* that BSD did it first, and then System V copied it. It's a bit before my time, though. Thanks for the hints ! I then dug a bit more, found a github which has the sources for very old BSDs ! https://github.com/dank101?tab=repositories The README suggests (IMHO) that previous versions already had TCP/IP working. In the 4.3BSD-Reno, there is no resolv.conf by default in /etc (but a namedb). But I found a man page (https://github.com/dank101/4.3BSD-Reno/blob/master/share/doc/smm/11.named/resolv.conf). Inside, there's a comment : @(#)resolv.conf 6.2 (Berkeley) 2/29/88 Funny, it's already the true and loved syntax we use today ! domain Berkeley\fB.\fPEdu nameserver 128\fB.\fP32\fB.\fP0\fB.\fP4 nameserver 128\fB.\fP32\fB.\fP0\fB.\fP10 (I just don't know what the gibberish chars mean, I guess it's some TeX/groff syntax ?) I'll dig more into the repositories and let you know ; ) (2BSD had none, but it only has source code, more later)
Mailing list usage questions
Hello all, I have two questions about the Debians ML usage. 1. when subscribing, the confirmation message says "By default, copies of your own submissions will be returned." What is the meaning of "default" and "returned" here ? I understand that I should get my own replies. But I never get them. Should I simply add a rule to move my sent mails from "Sent" to my ML folder ? 2. Is there some kind of interface to manage my subscriptions ? From what I read the (new?) system is not using "majordomo" anymore. On majordomo you could set a few options on a web page. Does it exist here as well ?
Re: update-initramfs
I thought : - you can install as many kernel packages as you want, whether built or downloaded - updates don't automatically remove old kernels/initrd by default So I wonder, why handling it manually ? What is the advantage, except for adding -confusion- ?
Re: how to change default nameserver?
On 11 Apr 2023 13:25, Greg Wooledge wrote: >> On 11 Apr 2023 08:55, Richard Hector wrote: Well, it's not in resolver(5) (which is for resolv.conf) on Red Hat 5.0.5. It wasn't in the man page from Red Hat 5.2 when I checked in 2017, either. Thanks for the history digging ! Do you know when resolv.conf started appearing ? I guess after TCP/IP got invented ? The wikipedia page does not mention it.
Re: how to change default nameserver?
On 11 Apr 2023 19:09, gene heskett wrote: On 4/11/23 10:04, zithro wrote: On 11 Apr 2023 04:56, gene heskett wrote: On 4/10/23 16:53, zithro wrote: Why can't you follow others advice, hell, if you don't trust us, even the perfectly correct and up-to-date manpages ? After reading the posts of others, I'm more and more thinking your simply a troll (or a RedHat fanatic wasting Debian helpers time for no reason) ... That is an insult. I bailed out of fedora 15 years ago, tired to being an always sick lab rat for redhat. [...] Because you answer what you want, I'll re-ask : "Why can't you follow others advice, hell, if you don't trust us, even the perfectly correct and up-to-date manpages ?" Because you answer what you want, I'll re-ask : "Why can't you follow others advice, hell, if you don't trust us, even the perfectly correct and up-to-date manpages ?" If you don't know who Mike Sweet is, why are you hassling me? I don't need to know who he is. Now I know, thanks, but it changes nothing. And if Sweet is REALLY your friend, why not asking him ? There's 25 years of history to computing before Linus released his his linux Computer history started WAY before that. Keeping networking working on linux has been an art, not a science. Debatable. The Debian way is one of the easiest. But funny, only happens to you, among the zillions Debian-based installs. Still can't see the problem ? looking at one of my buster machines. /etc/network/interfaces has this: What about your resolv.conf ? So ATM I have no clue what I did because I've forgotten whatever I did One of the best advice I've learnt from experienced sysadmins is : "always take notes of what you're doing". The other one being "RTFM". [...] I can't ask cups, my posts to the cups list are apparently routed to /dev/null [...] If you react like here, maybe you've been banned from there ? Again, contact the list owners, don't ASSUME stuff. [...] so I come here for help and all this dirty laundry gets drug out again. And again. And again. While the question I asked is very carefully ignored. Unreal. Really ?! Who exactly is ignoring what ?! Again, FOR THE FOURTH TIME : "Why can't you follow others advice, hell, if you don't trust us, even the perfectly correct and up-to-date manpages ?" Others have warned me. I tried despite their warnings ... I get to the same point as them : it's pointless to try to help someone who does NOT follow advices. I guess I'm done here.
Re: how to change default nameserver?
On 11 Apr 2023 00:28, Andy Smith wrote: Hello, On Tue, Apr 11, 2023 at 12:04:24AM +0200, zithro wrote: So, I got curious about his claim Well you can't say you haven't been warned. This rabbit hole goes very deep and the bottom will not contain the answers you seek! Cheers, Andy Ahah, I dunno if in this case I'd like to eat the red pill ^^
Re: update-initramfs
On 11 Apr 2023 16:43, Marc Auslander wrote: On 4/11/2023 9:30 AM, zithro wrote: The solution is in "man update-initramfs" : update-initramfs -c -k $KERNEL_VERSION -c creates a new initramfs -k specifies the version of the kernel This breaks when package update tries to update-initramfs. My copies have the kernel version in their names - with -knowngood appended. Breaks how ? In Bullseye you have to remove old kernels/initrd manually (with for example apt autoremove) I just checked some logs and it also worked like this in Buster You can keep as many versions as you want. Also, I found this old post on this very ML: On Thu, Dec 13, 2007 at 09:54:49PM -0500, Marc Auslander wrote: > The problem is operator (that's me) stupidity. > > I have an overloaded find so I can say find foo and have it mean > find . -name foo -print > > mkinitramfs uses find . | cpio to build the initrd.img >
Re: how to change default nameserver?
On 11 Apr 2023 04:56, gene heskett wrote: On 4/10/23 16:53, zithro wrote: Why can't you follow others advice, hell, if you don't trust us, even the perfectly correct and up-to-date manpages ? After reading the posts of others, I'm more and more thinking your simply a troll (or a RedHat fanatic wasting Debian helpers time for no reason) ... That is an insult. I bailed out of fedora 15 years ago, tired to being an always sick lab rat for redhat. [...] Because you answer what you want, I'll re-ask : "Why can't you follow others advice, hell, if you don't trust us, even the perfectly correct and up-to-date manpages ?" Maybe it's a bug in CUPS or w/e soft you're using. Try to find other people having this, or report it as a bug. Not possible. Michael and I have known each other since the '80's when he was a starving college student. I'll just let it go at that. ?! First, who's Michael, second, even if it's your friend, you won't fill a bug because of that ? What if it's really a bug, and other people have the same one ?
Re: update-initramfs
On 11 Apr 2023 02:17, Marc Auslander wrote: I'm on Buster. In /boot I keep a copy of the current working linux named by appending -knowngood to the four files. My idea is that if an update fails, I have a recent working linux. This is different from vmlinuz.old which is the previous kernel version. The updates in question are not to the kernel but to initrd.image of course. In addition to what David wrote, why are you not using the backup facility of initramfs instead of doing it manually ? $ cat /etc/initramfs-tools/update-initramfs.conf [...] # # backup_initramfs [ yes | no ] # # Default is no # If set to no leaves no .bak backup files. backup_initramfs=yes [...] Suddenly, update-initramfs insists in trying to first update initrd.-knowngood which of course fails because there are no underling file with that name. This never happened in the past, AFAIK. Once it fails it gives up. There seems no way to force update-initramfs to update the right kernel. Ideas? RTFM ? :) The solution is in "man update-initramfs" : update-initramfs -c -k $KERNEL_VERSION -c creates a new initramfs -k specifies the version of the kernel
Re: how to change default nameserver?
On 10 Apr 2023 22:58, Greg Wooledge wrote: On Mon, Apr 10, 2023 at 10:53:41PM +0200, zithro wrote: Why can't you follow others advice, hell, if you don't trust us, even the perfectly correct and up-to-date manpages ? After reading the posts of others, I'm more and more thinking your simply a troll (or a RedHat fanatic wasting Debian helpers time for no reason) ... My take is that he's confused, not trolling. I've never seen any evidence that he's intentionally making false statements. He seems to believe what he's saying. Well, I don't know what's the worst ... And honestly, when you're genuinely confused, you believe and follow the advice of the ones who know ... The weird and frustrating part is that nothing we do or offer seems to break through the confusion. So, I got curious about his claim : "that change to resolv.conf adding the search line [search hosts, nameserver] has been required since red hat 5.0 in 1998". (The bracket addition is mine) I'm not using RHEl-based systems a lot so I may be wrong, and there's not a lot of material left from the 1998 web, but the resolv.conf file *looks* identical in RHEL-based systems, at least nowadays. I quickly browsed a few RH help pages about resolv.conf, but couldn't find his claim. I then searched for "search hosts, nameserver" on search engines (-with- the quotes, to only get full-match results). Either I get no results or ... wait for it ... it *ONLY* gives me results where Gene posted ! So Gene, can you tell us where you read this ? If you didn't read it somewhere, are you using it because : - it always has been in your config files, which you created at a time you didn't really know what you were doing, - or you followed advice from someone who claimed he knew, - or it was in a wrongly pre-configured system and you blindly copied the stanza ?
Re: how to change default nameserver?
On 4/10/23 13:30, Greg Wooledge wrote: Up to the resolv.conf, that is exactly what I do. But that change to resolv.conf adding the search line has been required since red hat 5.0 in 1998. until bullseye. Just last week I found it is not needed in an armbian bullseye install. What ?! Red Hat ?! I hope it's a writing mistake, and that you know that the system config is not handled the same way in RedHat and Debian ? Why can't you follow others advice, hell, if you don't trust us, even the perfectly correct and up-to-date manpages ? After reading the posts of others, I'm more and more thinking your simply a troll (or a RedHat fanatic wasting Debian helpers time for no reason) ... Now, if I could figure out why printers, shared om this bullseye machine work perfectly when accessed by a buster machine, but cannot be seen by any other bullseye machine here, debian or armbian. My logs show an auth failure but all are DefaultAthorization Basic. And turning on debugging doesn't tell me anything more useful. Like why... I've managed to get 1 armbian machine trying to connect, but my logs are huge cuz it tries every 11 seconds Maybe it's a bug in CUPS or w/e soft you're using. Try to find other people having this, or report it as a bug. I think you should try avahi/bonjour, also known as *zeroconf*. Maybe it will better handle your network than yourself ... Sorry to be so harsh, but no one can help someone who does not want to be helped.
Re: questions about cron.daily
On 10 Apr 2023 03:23, David Wright wrote: On Sun 09 Apr 2023 at 21:48:22 (+0200), zithro wrote: IOW, while I run crontab -e on bookworm, inside my emacs session, I want a subshell to run crontab -l, but the latter has to run on bullseye in order to pick up the old crontab. I'm not sure how I would do that. Try running : ssh user@bullseye crontab -l It will locally list the crontab from remote user "user". Note I've never used emacs, so dunno if ssh is allowed ! In case it's not clear, bullseye and bookworm are Debian distribution codenames, not hostnames. In case it's not clear, to distinguish hosts in help messages, it's easy to refer to a host using its distro/codename. I have no idea how you name your hosts, nor is it useful for the conversation. I thought you could do the name translation by yourself. I can't edit my crontab on a newly installed bookworm system while simultaneously listing my old crontab on the old bullseye system on the same computer. The machine is set up to dual boot (currently bullseye and buster), but not simultaneously! Missed that information. So it's even easier. Mount the /var partition of bullseye on bookworm. Go to /MOUNTPOINT/var/spool/cron/crontabs Done.
Re: how to change default nameserver?
On 09 Apr 2023 17:20, Greg Wooledge wrote: Welcome to the Gene Heskett show, starring Gene Heskett. We've told Gene that his configuration is wrong *so* many times, over *so* many years. There are very many, very long, threads dedicated to trying to help Gene get his network configuration to a sane state. I recommend not trying again, but it's up to you. Maybe you'll succeed where everyone else has failed... I doubt it, but I can't rule it out. Ahah ^^ As confucius said : "Experience is a lantern that you carry on your back and that only lights up the path you have traveled", but thanks for the advice !
