Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[tomas]

On Wed, Sep 06, 2023 at 11:28:03AM +0100, debian-u...@howorth.org.uk wrote:
> Charles Curley  wrote:

[...]

> > E.g. gaining root privileges with "su" vs. "su -i".
> 
> Isn't -i a sudo option rather than an su option?

Yes:

  tomas@trotzki:~$ su -i
  su: invalid option -- 'i'
  Try 'su --help' for more information.

Cheers
-- 
t


signature.asc
Description: PGP signature

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[debian-user]

Charles Curley  wrote:
> On Tue, 5 Sep 2023 19:47:00 +
> "Andrew M.A. Cater"  wrote:
> 
> > At this point, you are not root and so dpkg -i complains.  
> 
> Actually she is root (the # in the prompt, and the username@host at
> the beginning of the prompt, assuming she hasn't played with her
> prompts). What she does not have, apparently, is ldconfig or
> start-stop-daemon in her path, as dpkg diagnosed at the end of that
> message. This is likely due to gaining root privileges without
> setting the path correctly.
> 
> E.g. gaining root privileges with "su" vs. "su -i".

Isn't -i a sudo option rather than an su option?

> Sorry to nitpick, but I hope the OP is will read this and, I hope,
> learn from it.

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Max Nikulin]

On 06/09/2023 05:32, Maureen L Thomas wrote:
02:00.0 Network controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8821CE 
802.11ac PCIe Wireless Network Adapter


Does it mean that your Intel wifi card is a USB one?


dpkg-query --show firmware-iwlwifi

but it is not found



root@debiandesktop-4:/home/maureen/Debian# dpkg -i 
firmware-iwlwifi_20210315-3_all.deb
dpkg: warning: 'ldconfig' not found in PATH or not executable


Perhaps you do not need to download deb files manually. Ensure that your 
/etc/apt/sources.list contains the non-free-firmware repository and try 
as root


apt update
apt install firmware-iwlwifi

however you may need a newer file than packaged for bookworm.

Exact messages (e.g. from "journalctl -b") output may help to solve your 
issue.

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Max Nikulin]

On 06/09/2023 10:12, Michel Verdier wrote:

On 2023-09-05, Charles Curley wrote:


E.g. gaining root privileges with "su" vs. "su -i".


You mean vs "su -" or "su -l" or "su --login" :)


Or "sudo -i" ("sudo --login")

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Michel Verdier]

On 2023-09-05, Charles Curley wrote:

> E.g. gaining root privileges with "su" vs. "su -i".

You mean vs "su -" or "su -l" or "su --login" :)

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Michel Verdier]

On 2023-09-05, Greg Wooledge wrote:

> You used "su" to become root, I believe.  Unfortunately, beginning
> with Debian 9, "su" with no arguments and no configuration doesn't
> behave the way it used to behave.  Specifically, it no longer sets the
> PATH variable properly.  And so you get the above results.
>
> See  for the options
> available to you.  If you wish to continue using su, I strongly recommend
> creating a /etc/default/su file.

I have no /etc/default/su and never need one. According to the man page
su also reads /etc/login.defs. To get root env she only needs to use:
"su -"

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Charles Curley]

On Tue, 5 Sep 2023 18:32:08 -0400
Maureen L Thomas  wrote:

> 02:00.0 Network controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8821CE 
> 802.11ac PCIe Wireless Network Adapter

Bingo. Here's the vendor's information:

https://www.realtek.com/en/products/communications-network-ics/item/rtl8821ce

With Realtek, the firmware required, if any, is in the non-free
firmware package firmware-realtek. Since you say that wifi is working, I
suspect you already have that package installed.

-- 
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Greg Wooledge]

On Tue, Sep 05, 2023 at 06:32:08PM -0400, Maureen L Thomas wrote:
> Here it is and no mention of the wifi.
> 
> ~$ lspci
[...]
> 02:00.0 Network controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8821CE
> 802.11ac PCIe Wireless Network Adapter

It's right there. ^^  See, it says "Wireless" and "Network".  That's
what wifi is.

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Charles Curley]

On Tue, 5 Sep 2023 18:16:54 -0400
Maureen L Thomas  wrote:

> so what you are saying is I should have used su -i and not just su.

Correct.

> 
> also I downloaded the file for Bookworm, I did not use the one from
> SID.

Ah, OK.

-- 
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Maureen L Thomas]

Here it is and no mention of the wifi.

~$ lspci
00:00.0 Host bridge: Intel Corporation 8th Gen Core 4-core Desktop 
Processor Host Bridge/DRAM Registers [Coffee Lake S] (rev 08)
00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation CoffeeLake-S GT2 
[UHD Graphics 630]
00:14.0 USB controller: Intel Corporation 200 Series/Z370 Chipset Family 
USB 3.0 xHCI Controller
00:14.2 Signal processing controller: Intel Corporation 200 Series PCH 
Thermal Subsystem
00:16.0 Communication controller: Intel Corporation 200 Series PCH CSME 
HECI #1
00:17.0 SATA controller: Intel Corporation 200 Series PCH SATA 
controller [AHCI mode]
00:1c.0 PCI bridge: Intel Corporation 200 Series PCH PCI Express Root 
Port #6 (rev f0)
00:1c.6 PCI bridge: Intel Corporation 200 Series PCH PCI Express Root 
Port #7 (rev f0)

00:1f.0 ISA bridge: Intel Corporation Device a2cc
00:1f.2 Memory controller: Intel Corporation 200 Series/Z370 Chipset 
Family Power Management Controller

00:1f.3 Audio device: Intel Corporation 200 Series PCH HD Audio
00:1f.4 SMBus: Intel Corporation 200 Series/Z370 Chipset Family SMBus 
Controller
01:00.0 Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. 
RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet Controller (rev 0c)
02:00.0 Network controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8821CE 
802.11ac PCIe Wireless Network Adapter


On 9/5/23 4:46 PM, Charles Curley wrote:

On Tue, 5 Sep 2023 15:43:25 -0400
Maureen L Thomas  wrote:


I ran it and got

dpkg-query --show firmware-iwlwifi

but it is not found

Ah. Thank you. Now we need to know if you actually need it. Run lspci,
and look over the output for likely keywords: wifi, wireless, 802.11,
etc. On the laptop I am using right now, I get, among other things:

charles@jhegaala:~$ lspci
…
03:00.0 Network controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8188CE
802.11b/g/n WiFi Adapter (rev 01)
…
charles@jhegaala:~$

We need more information on that entry. So in this case,

lspci -vv -s 03:00.0

where the 03:00.0 is taken from the line in the first lspci output. The
last two lines give us the kernel driver in use, in this case
rtl8192ce. So now we look to see what the boot output has to say. As
root:

root@jhegaala:~# dmesg | grep -i rtl8192ce
[516377.908430] rtl8192ce: Chip Version ID: B_CHIP_88C
[516377.918406] rtl8192ce: Using firmware rtlwifi/rtl8192cfw.bin
[516377.922599] rtl8192ce :03:00.0: firmware: direct-loading firmware 
rtlwifi/rtl8192cfw.bin
[516377.948234] rtl8192ce :03:00.0 wlp3s0: renamed from wlan0
[516399.434298] rtl8192ce: Chip Version ID: B_CHIP_88C
…
root@jhegaala:~#

So now we know that the driver is successfully loading the proper
firmware. You may have a line like that, or you may have a line
indicating that it tried to load firmware but failed. If it failed, you
now at least know the name of the firmware file it wants.

This is a Realtek device, your output should look similar.

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Maureen L Thomas]

so what you are saying is I should have used su -i and not just su.

also I downloaded the file for Bookworm, I did not use the one from SID.

On 9/5/23 4:21 PM, Charles Curley wrote:

On Tue, 5 Sep 2023 19:47:00 +
"Andrew M.A. Cater"  wrote:


At this point, you are not root and so dpkg -i complains.

Actually she is root (the # in the prompt, and the username@host at the
beginning of the prompt, assuming she hasn't played with her prompts).
What she does not have, apparently, is ldconfig or start-stop-daemon in
her path, as dpkg diagnosed at the end of that message. This is likely
due to gaining root privileges without setting the path correctly.

E.g. gaining root privileges with "su" vs. "su -i".

Sorry to nitpick, but I hope the OP is will read this and, I hope,
learn from it.

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Greg Wooledge]

On Tue, Sep 05, 2023 at 10:59:06PM +0100, piorunz wrote:
> On 05/09/2023 05:23, Maureen L Thomas wrote:
> > I tied su and then apt-install and that didn't
> > work.
> 
> 1. Yo logged to root incorrectly. Anyway, I suggest to never use root
> account for anything. Use sudo.

That's one valid solution.  Configuring su by creating an /etc/default/su
file is another.  There are more correct answers besides these, too.
 has a list of some, but
it's still not complete (and never will be).  Be creative!

I find it disheartening to call what Maureen did "incorrect", when she's
just doing the standard thing that used to work for decades before Debian
broke it.

I would call Debian's release of a util-linux package with an unconfigured
su(1) incorrect instead.  But apparently the Debian maintainers don't
see things the way I see them.  And now it's been 3 full releases since
the behavior changed, and it's still broken, so clearly Debian isn't
going to fix it.  That means it's up to us, the users, to fix it on all
of our systems instead.

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[piorunz]

On 05/09/2023 05:23, Maureen L Thomas wrote:

I keep getting messages that it is not installed.


Where? Show exact error.


  So I went on line and
found a link but it was for Sid.  I have bookworm.  I did not use it but
I downloaded the one for bookworm, at least I think I did.  It is in a
folder marked Debian.  I have tried every witch way to install it but am
at a complete loss.



I tied su and then apt-install and that didn't
work.


1. Yo logged to root incorrectly. Anyway, I suggest to never use root
account for anything. Use sudo.
2. Do not install packages from sid or from the Internet. Use only apt
install from matching Debian Bookworm repository.


Dummy me I was not in the Debian file so I redid it while I was
in the Debian file.


What you mean by being *in Debian file*?


Still will not install.  I know the answer is
probably very simple but for the life of me I have forgotten how to do
it.  Is it important or can I ignore it.


Well..


I do have wifi.


If everything is working... Why you are trying to destroy your system then?

--
With kindest regards, Piotr.

⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ Debian - The universal operating system
⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ https://www.debian.org/
⠈⠳⣄

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Charles Curley]

On Tue, 5 Sep 2023 15:43:25 -0400
Maureen L Thomas  wrote:

> I ran it and got
> 
> dpkg-query --show firmware-iwlwifi
> 
> but it is not found

Ah. Thank you. Now we need to know if you actually need it. Run lspci,
and look over the output for likely keywords: wifi, wireless, 802.11,
etc. On the laptop I am using right now, I get, among other things:

charles@jhegaala:~$ lspci
…
03:00.0 Network controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8188CE
802.11b/g/n WiFi Adapter (rev 01)
…
charles@jhegaala:~$

We need more information on that entry. So in this case, 

lspci -vv -s 03:00.0

where the 03:00.0 is taken from the line in the first lspci output. The
last two lines give us the kernel driver in use, in this case
rtl8192ce. So now we look to see what the boot output has to say. As
root:

root@jhegaala:~# dmesg | grep -i rtl8192ce
[516377.908430] rtl8192ce: Chip Version ID: B_CHIP_88C
[516377.918406] rtl8192ce: Using firmware rtlwifi/rtl8192cfw.bin
[516377.922599] rtl8192ce :03:00.0: firmware: direct-loading firmware 
rtlwifi/rtl8192cfw.bin
[516377.948234] rtl8192ce :03:00.0 wlp3s0: renamed from wlan0
[516399.434298] rtl8192ce: Chip Version ID: B_CHIP_88C
…
root@jhegaala:~#

So now we know that the driver is successfully loading the proper
firmware. You may have a line like that, or you may have a line
indicating that it tried to load firmware but failed. If it failed, you
now at least know the name of the firmware file it wants.

This is a Realtek device, your output should look similar.

-- 
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Greg Wooledge]

On Tue, Sep 05, 2023 at 03:39:59PM -0400, Maureen L Thomas wrote:
> This is what I did and the errors it produced.
> 
> root@debiandesktop-4:/home/maureen/Debian# dpkg -i
> firmware-iwlwifi_20210315-3_all.deb
> dpkg: warning: 'ldconfig' not found in PATH or not executable
> dpkg: warning: 'start-stop-daemon' not found in PATH or not executable
> dpkg: error: 2 expected programs not found in PATH or not executable
> Note: root's PATH should usually contain /usr/local/sbin, /usr/sbin and
> /sbin

You used "su" to become root, I believe.  Unfortunately, beginning
with Debian 9, "su" with no arguments and no configuration doesn't
behave the way it used to behave.  Specifically, it no longer sets the
PATH variable properly.  And so you get the above results.

See  for the options
available to you.  If you wish to continue using su, I strongly recommend
creating a /etc/default/su file.

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Charles Curley]

On Tue, 5 Sep 2023 19:47:00 +
"Andrew M.A. Cater"  wrote:

> At this point, you are not root and so dpkg -i complains.

Actually she is root (the # in the prompt, and the username@host at the
beginning of the prompt, assuming she hasn't played with her prompts).
What she does not have, apparently, is ldconfig or start-stop-daemon in
her path, as dpkg diagnosed at the end of that message. This is likely
due to gaining root privileges without setting the path correctly.

E.g. gaining root privileges with "su" vs. "su -i".

Sorry to nitpick, but I hope the OP is will read this and, I hope,
learn from it.


-- 
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Andrew M.A. Cater]

On Tue, Sep 05, 2023 at 03:39:59PM -0400, Maureen L Thomas wrote:
> This is what I did and the errors it produced.
> 
> root@debiandesktop-4:/home/maureen/Debian# dpkg -i
> firmware-iwlwifi_20210315-3_all.deb
> dpkg: warning: 'ldconfig' not found in PATH or not executable
> dpkg: warning: 'start-stop-daemon' not found in PATH or not executable
> dpkg: error: 2 expected programs not found in PATH or not executable
> Note: root's PATH should usually contain /usr/local/sbin, /usr/sbin and
> /sbin
> 

At this point, you are not root and so dpkg -i complains.

Assuming that you have an Intel wifi chipset and previously had iwlwifi
installed, there's probably no need to install a non-free-firmware package
from sid just to get iwlwifi versions that absolutely match the error message
that prompted you to go looking for a newer version.

In general: firmware doesn't change *that* often and an older iwlwifi 
verion will just carry on working until there's a new one to replace it.

DontBreakDebian - mixing distribution versions is hard and can lead to
significant problems.

All the very best, as ever,

Andy Cater
> On 9/5/23 1:40 AM, jeremy ardley wrote:
> > 
> > On 5/9/23 12:23, Maureen L Thomas wrote:
> > >   I have tried every witch way to install it but am at a complete loss.
> > 
> > 
> > Assuming you downloaded a deb file, the usual mechansim is
> > 
> > sudo dpkg - i .deb
> > 
> > sudo apt --fix-broken install
> > 

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Maureen L Thomas]

I ran it and got

dpkg-query --show firmware-iwlwifi

but it is not found


On 9/5/23 11:12 AM, Charles Curley wrote:

On Tue, 5 Sep 2023 00:23:49 -0400
Maureen L Thomas  wrote:


I keep getting messages that [iwlwifi_20230515-3] is not installed. …
Is it important or can I ignore it[?]  I do have wifi.

What leads you to think you need it? Please show us the exact error
message.

iwlwifi refers to certain Intel wireless peripherals, wifi and
bluetooth. If you have working wifi and bluetooth, you may not need it.
The package in question is firmware-iwlwifi, and it is available in
various versions for buster through sid.

Do you already have that package installed? Run

dpkg-query --show firmware-iwlwifi

If that shows nothing, it is not installed; if it shows the name and
other information, it is installed.

Furthermore, if the specific file is for sid, and you are not using
sid, installing that file may cause compatibility problems.

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Maureen L Thomas]

This is what I did and the errors it produced.

root@debiandesktop-4:/home/maureen/Debian# dpkg -i 
firmware-iwlwifi_20210315-3_all.deb

dpkg: warning: 'ldconfig' not found in PATH or not executable
dpkg: warning: 'start-stop-daemon' not found in PATH or not executable
dpkg: error: 2 expected programs not found in PATH or not executable
Note: root's PATH should usually contain /usr/local/sbin, /usr/sbin and 
/sbin


On 9/5/23 1:40 AM, jeremy ardley wrote:


On 5/9/23 12:23, Maureen L Thomas wrote:

  I have tried every witch way to install it but am at a complete loss.



Assuming you downloaded a deb file, the usual mechansim is

sudo dpkg - i .deb

sudo apt --fix-broken install

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Maureen L Thomas]

Yes it is a .deb file and I tried the sudo dpkg -i but did not do the 
apt  --fix-broken install  I will try using both and see what happens.



On 9/5/23 1:40 AM, jeremy ardley wrote:


On 5/9/23 12:23, Maureen L Thomas wrote:

  I have tried every witch way to install it but am at a complete loss.



Assuming you downloaded a deb file, the usual mechansim is

sudo dpkg - i .deb

sudo apt --fix-broken install

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[David Wright]

On Tue 05 Sep 2023 at 09:12:58 (-0600), Charles Curley wrote:
> On Tue, 5 Sep 2023 00:23:49 -0400 Maureen L Thomas wrote:
> 
> > I keep getting messages that [iwlwifi_20230515-3] is not installed. …
> > Is it important or can I ignore it[?]  I do have wifi.

It might help if you write a little more carefully.
"I do have wifi" might mean "I know this PC has wifi
as I've used it before, but it doesn't work now", or
it could mean "I have wifi and it's working OK".

> What leads you to think you need it? Please show us the exact error
> message.
> 
> iwlwifi refers to certain Intel wireless peripherals, wifi and
> bluetooth. If you have working wifi and bluetooth, you may not need it.
> The package in question is firmware-iwlwifi, and it is available in
> various versions for buster through sid.

(Bluetooth might require intel/ibt-… firmware.)

> Do you already have that package installed? Run
> 
> dpkg-query --show firmware-iwlwifi
> 
> If that shows nothing, it is not installed; if it shows the name and
> other information, it is installed.
> 
> Furthermore, if the specific file is for sid, and you are not using
> sid, installing that file may cause compatibility problems.

It seems unlikely as there are rarely any dependencies involved.
The newer packages usually have more blob versions, but the blob
that the user requires should be identical to those contained in
older packages.

Cheers,
David.

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Charles Curley]

On Tue, 5 Sep 2023 00:23:49 -0400
Maureen L Thomas  wrote:

> I keep getting messages that [iwlwifi_20230515-3] is not installed. …
> Is it important or can I ignore it[?]  I do have wifi.

What leads you to think you need it? Please show us the exact error
message.

iwlwifi refers to certain Intel wireless peripherals, wifi and
bluetooth. If you have working wifi and bluetooth, you may not need it.
The package in question is firmware-iwlwifi, and it is available in
various versions for buster through sid.

Do you already have that package installed? Run

dpkg-query --show firmware-iwlwifi

If that shows nothing, it is not installed; if it shows the name and
other information, it is installed.

Furthermore, if the specific file is for sid, and you are not using
sid, installing that file may cause compatibility problems.

-- 
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Greg Wooledge]

On Tue, Sep 05, 2023 at 01:40:55PM +0800, jeremy ardley wrote:
> 
> On 5/9/23 12:23, Maureen L Thomas wrote:
> >   I have tried every witch way to install it but am at a complete loss.
> 
> 
> Assuming you downloaded a deb file, the usual mechansim is
> 
> sudo dpkg - i .deb
> 
> sudo apt --fix-broken install

That's the old way.  The newer way is:

sudo apt install ./.deb

The leading ./ is required.  The pathname must begin with "/" or "./"
or "../", or else apt assumes you're typing a package name.

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Timothy M Butterworth]

On Tue, Sep 5, 2023 at 3:55 AM Maureen L Thomas 
wrote:

> I keep getting messages that it is not installed.  So I went on line and
> found a link but it was for Sid.  I have bookworm.  I did not use it but I
> downloaded the one for bookworm, at least I think I did.  It is in a folder
> marked Debian.  I have tried every witch way to install it but am at a
> complete loss.  I tied su and then apt-install and that didn't work.  Dummy
> me I was not in the Debian file so I redid it while I was in the Debian
> file.  Still will not install.  I know the answer is probably very simple
> but for the life of me I have forgotten how to do it.  Is it important or
> can I ignore it.  I do have wifi.
>
> Grany Moe Again.
>

What error message do you get when you try to install it?

try "cd" to the directory the package is in then run "apt install
./PackageName"


-- 
⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ Debian - The universal operating system
⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ https://www.debian.org/
⠈⠳⣄⠀⠀

Re: just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[jeremy ardley]

On 5/9/23 12:23, Maureen L Thomas wrote:

  I have tried every witch way to install it but am at a complete loss.



Assuming you downloaded a deb file, the usual mechansim is

sudo dpkg - i .deb

sudo apt --fix-broken install

just a question about the iwlwifi_20230515-3 file

[Maureen L Thomas]

I keep getting messages that it is not installed.  So I went on line and 
found a link but it was for Sid.  I have bookworm.  I did not use it but 
I downloaded the one for bookworm, at least I think I did.  It is in a 
folder marked Debian.  I have tried every witch way to install it but am 
at a complete loss.  I tied su and then apt-install and that didn't 
work.  Dummy me I was not in the Debian file so I redid it while I was 
in the Debian file.  Still will not install.  I know the answer is 
probably very simple but for the life of me I have forgotten how to do 
it.  Is it important or can I ignore it.  I do have wifi.


Grany Moe Again.

Re: OT: Just a question - building live systems for arm on intel machines?

[tomas]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Wed, Jun 21, 2017 at 04:11:32PM +0200, Hans wrote:
> Am Mittwoch, 21. Juni 2017, 16:01:31 CEST schrieb to...@tuxteam.de:
> Hi Tomas,
> 
> thanks for this quick response. Well, I just do not want to compile something 
> (however, I believe, some binary packages do this at installing, don't 
> they?), 
> just unpack packages to a chroot.
> 
> But you may be right: The live-build scripts and the packages might interact 
> with the base structure. And this will give bad answers. I did not think of 
> this. So I understand: Bad idea! :)

Well, not necessarily. Case by case basis. And with multiarch[1][2], Debian
has at least set the basis to have libraries for different architectures
living peacefully side by side.

(my installation has x86_64 and i386 packages and no war :-)

So the packaging part is no problem.

(Sometimes Debian takes a while to solve something. But the solutions
tend to be... beautiful :-)

[1] https://wiki.debian.org/Multiarch
[2] https://wiki.debian.org/Multiarch/HOWTO

Cheers
- -- tomás
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAllKg6MACgkQBcgs9XrR2kakAgCfcdmYVHo0mdD62MJdJxiaehdn
Zy4An1dOsecVMBhbvTc+o4Avk/Vb5TOG
=rV50
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

Re: OT: Just a question - building live systems for arm on intel machines?

[Hans]

Am Mittwoch, 21. Juni 2017, 16:01:31 CEST schrieb to...@tuxteam.de:
Hi Tomas,

thanks for this quick response. Well, I just do not want to compile something 
(however, I believe, some binary packages do this at installing, don't they?), 
just unpack packages to a chroot.

But you may be right: The live-build scripts and the packages might interact 
with the base structure. And this will give bad answers. I did not think of 
this. So I understand: Bad idea! :)

Thanks again for the fast response. It makes things much clearer.

Best

Hans
> All this is subsumed under the moniker "cross build". And the short
> answer is that yes, in principle it is possible (a decent C compiler,
> for example, supports cross compiling, etc.).
> 
> In practice, though, things become... "interesting". For example,
> what do you do if your build's "configure" interrogates your
> system? Your system will give the wrong answers! So the build
> system has to offer a way to provide pre-packaged answers ("yes,
> this is an ARM with a hardware floating point unit" or whatever,
> instead of the more comfortable "go find out for yourself").
> 
> And then, when the thing is built and you say "make test"? Do
> you have an emulator around?
> 
> To get you started on how Debian tries to tackle that, see
> 
>   https://wiki.debian.org/CrossBuildPackagingGuidelines
> 
> So the answer is... for some packages it works, for some not. It
> depends among other things on the build system.
> 
> Cheers
> -- tomás

Re: OT: Just a question - building live systems for arm on intel machines?

[tomas]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Wed, Jun 21, 2017 at 03:49:16PM +0200, Hans wrote:
> Hi folks, 
> 
> sorry, to ask here, but I do not know where to ask else.
> 
> Just a question: Is it possible, to build live-file systems with live-build 
> for 
> arm64 cpu's on an intel based system like i386 or amd64?

[...]

All this is subsumed under the moniker "cross build". And the short
answer is that yes, in principle it is possible (a decent C compiler,
for example, supports cross compiling, etc.).

In practice, though, things become... "interesting". For example,
what do you do if your build's "configure" interrogates your
system? Your system will give the wrong answers! So the build
system has to offer a way to provide pre-packaged answers ("yes,
this is an ARM with a hardware floating point unit" or whatever,
instead of the more comfortable "go find out for yourself").

And then, when the thing is built and you say "make test"? Do
you have an emulator around?

To get you started on how Debian tries to tackle that, see

  https://wiki.debian.org/CrossBuildPackagingGuidelines

So the answer is... for some packages it works, for some not. It
depends among other things on the build system.

Cheers
- -- tomás
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAllKfDsACgkQBcgs9XrR2kYy0ACfdw9bWW0nG75gWlcv4DFZ37qB
6UsAnRpgWLcDD8NpZIGCRjLxJORYdxE4
=QfsT
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

OT: Just a question - building live systems for arm on intel machines?

[Hans]

Hi folks, 

sorry, to ask here, but I do not know where to ask else.

Just a question: Is it possible, to build live-file systems with live-build for 
arm64 cpu's on an intel based system like i386 or amd64?

And can I build amd64 live-file systems on an i386 system?

And vice versa, is it possible, to build amd64/i386 live-file systems on an 
arm64 system (i.e. building amd64 kali livefile on a Raspberry Pi)?

I searched the web, but found no clear answer to that and think, someone 
experienced might can give me just a short answer.

Thanks for any feedback.

Best regards

Hans

Re: Just a question...........

[Andrei POPESCU]

On Vi, 21 iun 13, 17:09:51, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> 
> Any recommendation for a Torrent client? 

I'm currently using transmission-daemon everywhere, mostly because it 
runs as a daemon :)

I've had good results with rtorrent, but it's not easy to configure/use. 

Ktorrent is a very versatile GUI application, but it was slower than 
rtorrent on the same torrent. Didn't bother investigating why because I 
was migrating away from a GUI application anyway.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser
Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers:
http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Just a question...........

[theartloy]

On 21/06/2013 16:51, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> I don't run Debian at the moment and btdownload* seems to be something
> very hidden.

Sorry, replied-to-sender-only! Repost to list. Keyboard shortcuts >.<

http://packages.debian.org/search?searchon=contents&keywords=btdownloadcurses&mode=filename&suite=stable&arch=any 



It is in both the bittornado and bittorrent packages. Take your pick :)

regards,
theartloy


--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org

Archive: http://lists.debian.org/51c47964.6040...@zoho.com

Re: Just a question...........

[staticsafe]

On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 05:09:51PM +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> On Fri, 2013-06-21 at 17:44 +0300, Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> > On Vi, 21 iun 13, 16:32:33, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> > > 
> > > Seriously, are there serious, legal torrents for something that is
> > > available by ftp/http/s too, so that we can do comparisons?
> > 
> > Debian images.
> 
> Thank you, that's a good idea.
> 
> http://www.debian.org/CD/torrent-cd/
> http://www.debian.org/CD/http-ftp/
> 
> Any recommendation for a Torrent client? For downloads from http/ftp I
> usually use wget and sometimes Firefox instead.
> 

rtorrent, if you are looking for something on the CLI.

http://libtorrent.rakshasa.no/rtorrent/rtorrent.1.html
http://libtorrent.rakshasa.no/wiki/RTorrentUserGuide
-- 
staticsafe
O< ascii ribbon campaign - stop html mail - www.asciiribbon.org
Please don't top post.
Please don't CC! I'm subscribed to whatever list I just posted on.


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130621160149.ga26...@uriel.asininetech.com

Re: Just a question...........

[Ralf Mardorf]

On Fri, 2013-06-21 at 11:28 -0400, Carl Fink wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 05:09:51PM +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> 
> > Any recommendation for a Torrent client? For downloads from http/ftp I
> > usually use wget and sometimes Firefox instead.
> 
> I always use btdownloadcurses. Minimal overhead.

I don't run Debian at the moment and btdownload* seems to be something
very hidden.


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1371829890.691.122.camel@archlinux

Re: Just a question...........

[Rob Owens]

- Original Message -
> From: "Ralf Mardorf" 

> Any recommendation for a Torrent client? For downloads from http/ftp
> I
> usually use wget and sometimes Firefox instead.
> 
Transmission is pretty easy to get started with.  I can't comment on whether 
it's faster or slower than others.

-Rob


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: 
http://lists.debian.org/335117798.34508307.1371828808676.javamail.r...@ptd.net

Re: Just a question...........

[Carl Fink]

On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 05:09:51PM +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote:

> Any recommendation for a Torrent client? For downloads from http/ftp I
> usually use wget and sometimes Firefox instead.

I always use btdownloadcurses. Minimal overhead.
-- 
Carl Fink   nitpick...@nitpicking.com 

Read my blog at blog.nitpicking.com.  Reviews!  Observations!
Stupid mistakes you can correct!


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130621152842.ga28...@panix.com

Re: Just a question...........

[Ralf Mardorf]

On Fri, 2013-06-21 at 10:56 -0400, Rob Owens wrote:
> archive.org -- those are available via direct download and bittorrent.
> But I've noticed that some of the torrents are poorly seeded or not
> seeded at all.

Interesting website :), thank you.



-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1371828032.691.117.camel@archlinux

Re: Just a question...........

[Ralf Mardorf]

On Fri, 2013-06-21 at 17:44 +0300, Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> On Vi, 21 iun 13, 16:32:33, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> > 
> > Seriously, are there serious, legal torrents for something that is
> > available by ftp/http/s too, so that we can do comparisons?
> 
> Debian images.

Thank you, that's a good idea.

http://www.debian.org/CD/torrent-cd/
http://www.debian.org/CD/http-ftp/

Any recommendation for a Torrent client? For downloads from http/ftp I
usually use wget and sometimes Firefox instead.


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1371827391.691.116.camel@archlinux

Re: Just a question...........

[Andrei POPESCU]

On Vi, 21 iun 13, 16:32:33, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> 
> Seriously, are there serious, legal torrents for something that is
> available by ftp/http/s too, so that we can do comparisons?

Debian images.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser
Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers:
http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Just a question...........

[Rob Owens]

- Original Message -
> From: "Ralf Mardorf" 
> Seriously, are there serious, legal torrents for something that is
> available by ftp/http/s too, so that we can do comparisons?
> 

Linux ISOs -- Debian and CentOS at the very least.  In my experience, these 
torrents download very fast.

Also, check out the live music collection on archive.org -- those are available 
via direct download and bittorrent.  But I've noticed that some of the torrents 
are poorly seeded or not seeded at all.

-Rob


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: 
http://lists.debian.org/1499951226.34481870.1371826575456.javamail.r...@ptd.net

Re: Just a question...........

[Ralf Mardorf]

On Fri, 2013-06-21 at 16:48 +0300, Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> - bittorrent client (some clients are able to download the same torrent 
>   much faster)

So you perhaps can name some clients that are slow and others that are
fast? I seldom use BitTorrent, but sometimes and have tested several
clients, without noticing a big difference, excepted from the provided
options, such as faking the IP.

> - phase of the moon, etc.

I like obscure phenomenons :D, btw. I experienced poltergeist effects,
but no poltergeists was that kind, that he/she/it does something while
I'm watching :D, seemingly poltergeists are cowards ;). It's likely that
not the gravitation of the moon opened a drawer, neither it's likely
that a poltergeist did it, I guess a spy from the NSA did, when I leaved
the kitchen for a short toilet visit, so there wasn't time to close the
drawer, the spy had to escape, before I was back. Now the USA does know
how many teaspoons I own.

> Also bittorrent can stress your system in interesting ways (e.g. it 
> generates a lot of I/O) and requires decent networking stack and 
> hardware.

If you do something were those resources are very important, than you
can notice unwanted side effects for nearly everything, perhaps not for
echo "hallo world". IMO real-time audio still is a textbook example for
hypersensitivity, but I suspect using a torrent client would allow even
to do an audio/MIDI production at the same time, however I prefer not to
do this. Theoretically, if you set up rules, for the audio example the
torrent client should experienced issues, not the audio production, but
in reality we still have phases of the moon and nobody does know what
secrets are caused by dark matter.

Seriously, are there serious, legal torrents for something that is
available by ftp/http/s too, so that we can do comparisons?

Regards,
Ralf


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1371825153.691.100.camel@archlinux

Re: Just a question...........

[Andrei POPESCU]

On Jo, 20 iun 13, 09:18:29, Conrad Nelson wrote:
> (I have never in all my time seen a single torrent beat the speeds of 
> straight up downloading.)

I have. I my experience it may depend on:

- bittorrent client (some clients are able to download the same torrent 
  much faster)
- seeder/leecher counts and ratio (obvious)
- where these seeders/leechers are (i.e. it helps if some of them are in 
  the same country or even connected to the same ISP, for obvious 
  reasons)
- how your ISP handles bittorent (some ISPs here even advertise good 
  bittorrent speeds)
- phase of the moon, etc.

Also bittorrent can stress your system in interesting ways (e.g. it 
generates a lot of I/O) and requires decent networking stack and 
hardware.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser
Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers:
http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Just a question...........

[Andrei POPESCU]

On Jo, 20 iun 13, 23:22:23, Chris Bannister wrote:
> 
> I think I remember reading about a discussion of implementing a system
> where apt-get only downloads the changes to files. It wouldn't suprise
> me if something like this was implemented at some point way down the
> track.

apt-cache show debdelta

I actually have it installed, but I always forget to run 
debdelta-upgrade between update and upgrade.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser
Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers:
http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic


signature.asc
Description: Digital signature

Re: Just a question...........

[Steven Post]

On Thu, 2013-06-20 at 14:43 -0400, Rob Owens wrote:
> - Original Message -
> > From: "Conrad Nelson" 
> > 
> > I think the number one reason why Linux package management via
> > Torrent
> > never took off is because it is frankly an incredibly terrible idea.
> > 
> > Look, peer-to-peer is a great idea on paper, but it has several huge
> > strikes against it:
> > 
> > 1. ISPs hate P2P even for legitimate uses, so if a Linux distro would
> > go
> > torrent on package managers those behind draconian ISPs will be out
> > of
> > luck, leading to less users.
> > 
> Good point.  It would have to be optional so users whose ISPs block
> BitTorrent could still access the standard repos.
> 
> > 2. EVERY package will become subject to the "popularity contest"
> > problem
> > in peer to peer. You'll likely have no problem installing common
> > apps,
> > but if you like to use something more specialized or obscure but
> > still
> > tracked in the official repository, you'll be lucky to get a decent
> > speed at all, to say nothing about the possibility you'll NEVER get
> > the
> > package. This is why torrents are fast in theory but dreadfully slow
> > in
> > practice (I have never in all my time seen a single torrent beat the
> > speeds of straight up downloading.)
> > 
> Seems like this could be avoided if the existing repos simply seeded 
> every file that they host.  Then you could always get the files via
> BitTorrent even if no other regular users were seeding.  Unless I'm
> missing something, torrent download speed could not be any slower than
> direct download speed, with the exception of the extra time it takes
> to contact the tracker and locate peers.
> 

There is also the possibility to do the same as Blizzard with its
updater. They use bittorrent, but as a 'fallback' they use http, there
is also a thing called 'http seeding' or 'web seeding' [1], not sure if
they use that or some other solution to offer the http download.

This means users that have their connections throttled when using
bittorrent can still get full speed over http. Imagine all mirrors being
part of the same swarm and most/all of them have a tracker (registered
with Debian so they are available transparently to the user), they have
less strain as a lot of bandwidth can be provided by others and users
are still certain of fast downloads (some faster than before if their
pipe allows it).

This is still a benefit even if people don't seed to the 1:1 ratio, but
just while they are downloading.
Downside is the added overhead of course, a 100 KB package on it's own
will not benefit from this (think a security update in some random small
package), but upgrades between versions (6.0 to 7.x or 7.0 to 7.1) might
benefit greatly.

I thinks it's an interesting idea, but I'm not sure if it's an
improvement when considering the complete picture.
I think delta's might be a better idea in the shorter term. Some other
distributions already do this.

Regards,
Steven

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BitTorrent#Web_seeding


signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part

Re: Just a question...........

[Ralf Mardorf]

PPS: And won't downloading and uploading at the same time slow it down
too compared to just downloading?


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1371756986.644.77.camel@archlinux

Re: Just a question...........

[Ralf Mardorf]

> On Thu, 2013-06-20 at 14:43 -0400, Rob Owens wrote:
> > Seems like this could be avoided if the existing repos simply seeded 
> > every file that they host.  Then you could always get the files via
> > BitTorrent even if no other regular users were seeding.  Unless I'm
> > missing something, torrent download speed could not be any slower than
> > direct download speed,

PS:

> with the exception of the extra time it takes
> > to contact the tracker and locate peers.


How exactly does a torrent work? I guess you assume that all leechers
would get the same % of download from the original server + some % from
other seeders, but does a torrent client know something like an original
server ;)? This must be managed in some way and might slow it down.


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1371756847.644.76.camel@archlinux

Re: Just a question...........

[Ralf Mardorf]

On Thu, 2013-06-20 at 14:43 -0400, Rob Owens wrote:
> Seems like this could be avoided if the existing repos simply seeded 
> every file that they host.  Then you could always get the files via
> BitTorrent even if no other regular users were seeding.  Unless I'm
> missing something, torrent download speed could not be any slower than
> direct download speed, with the exception of the extra time it takes
> to contact the tracker and locate peers.

You can't compare 20 users downloading from ftp, http/s with 20 users
seeding and leeching a torrent at the same time. Theoretically the
torrent should be faster, but in practise this seldom or never happens.
I suspect that the handling of seeders, leechers and trackers, IOW the
sync, will slow it down. I might be mistaken. However, imagine you
should leech a part of the download from some people seeding, with a
terrible low bandwidth. Some seeders could get on and off line and this
must be handled too etc. pp.. Perhaps somebody with knowledge could
explain why I and at least another one from this list experienced
torrents as slower than a direct download. For sure it's less important
for those who download with a low bandwidth, but many of us for sure
have very fast DSL connections, even if those connections might not be
as fast as the ISP does claim.


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1371756505.644.72.camel@archlinux

Re: Just a question...........

[Rob Owens]

- Original Message -
> From: "Conrad Nelson" 
> 
> I think the number one reason why Linux package management via
> Torrent
> never took off is because it is frankly an incredibly terrible idea.
> 
> Look, peer-to-peer is a great idea on paper, but it has several huge
> strikes against it:
> 
> 1. ISPs hate P2P even for legitimate uses, so if a Linux distro would
> go
> torrent on package managers those behind draconian ISPs will be out
> of
> luck, leading to less users.
> 
Good point.  It would have to be optional so users whose ISPs block
BitTorrent could still access the standard repos.

> 2. EVERY package will become subject to the "popularity contest"
> problem
> in peer to peer. You'll likely have no problem installing common
> apps,
> but if you like to use something more specialized or obscure but
> still
> tracked in the official repository, you'll be lucky to get a decent
> speed at all, to say nothing about the possibility you'll NEVER get
> the
> package. This is why torrents are fast in theory but dreadfully slow
> in
> practice (I have never in all my time seen a single torrent beat the
> speeds of straight up downloading.)
> 
Seems like this could be avoided if the existing repos simply seeded 
every file that they host.  Then you could always get the files via
BitTorrent even if no other regular users were seeding.  Unless I'm
missing something, torrent download speed could not be any slower than
direct download speed, with the exception of the extra time it takes
to contact the tracker and locate peers.

-Rob


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: 
http://lists.debian.org/1292127528.33975942.1371753782116.javamail.r...@ptd.net

Re: Just a question...........

[Ralf Mardorf]

On Thu, 2013-06-20 at 15:55 +0100, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> On Thursday 20 June 2013 15:18:29 Conrad Nelson wrote:
> > (I have never in all my time seen a single torrent beat the
> > speeds of straight up downloading.)
> 
> I have never had one take as long.  Torrent wins every time on time.  And 
> generally, where there is a Torrent available, there is also a straight 
> download.

Until now I experienced the same as Conrad experienced. Perhaps I
sometimes had good luck when downloading small files by torrent and I'm
not aware that the download was faster, but usually it takes much, much
longer and sometimes torrents aren't seeded completely.

When downloading a torrent we've got the duty to seed the torrent, even
after it is downloaded, at least we should do it, as long as there isn't
a sane ratio.

I like the idea of torrents and they are useful, but they aren't useful
for package downloads. Btw. most torrents I've seen are illegal uploads,
I can't remember when I used a torrent the last time.

How should the package database, checksums and security keys be
downloaded, when packages are downloaded by torrent? By torrent too? If
so, wouldn't it be a security risk?

Regards,
Ralf


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1371741536.644.11.camel@archlinux

Re: Just a question...........

[Lisi Reisz]

On Thursday 20 June 2013 15:18:29 Conrad Nelson wrote:
> (I have never in all my time seen a single torrent beat the
> speeds of straight up downloading.)

I have never had one take as long.  Torrent wins every time on time.  And 
generally, where there is a Torrent available, there is also a straight 
download.

Lisi


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/201306201555.44611.lisi.re...@gmail.com

Re: Just a question...........

[Conrad Nelson]

On 06/20/2013 06:22 AM, Chris Bannister wrote:

On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 03:19:25PM +1000, Charlie wrote:

I don't know enough about this hope someone can help:

My ISP CEO suggests that this address is BitTorrent:

http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib

Is that correct?

No, he is confused.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BitTorrent
http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/7792

There are no trackers involved with apt-get, although it would be a far
more efficient method (bandwidth wise). The downside is that you
probably wouldn't be able to update/upgrade your laptop at your local
library etc. because they tend to block BitTorrent traffic.

I think I remember reading about a discussion of implementing a system
where apt-get only downloads the changes to files. It wouldn't suprise
me if something like this was implemented at some point way down the
track.

I think the number one reason why Linux package management via Torrent 
never took off is because it is frankly an incredibly terrible idea.


Look, peer-to-peer is a great idea on paper, but it has several huge 
strikes against it:


1. ISPs hate P2P even for legitimate uses, so if a Linux distro would go 
torrent on package managers those behind draconian ISPs will be out of 
luck, leading to less users.


2. EVERY package will become subject to the "popularity contest" problem 
in peer to peer. You'll likely have no problem installing common apps, 
but if you like to use something more specialized or obscure but still 
tracked in the official repository, you'll be lucky to get a decent 
speed at all, to say nothing about the possibility you'll NEVER get the 
package. This is why torrents are fast in theory but dreadfully slow in 
practice (I have never in all my time seen a single torrent beat the 
speeds of straight up downloading.)


3. It's efficient bandwidth only on the PROVIDER'S servers. Torrents are 
notorious for gobbling up download bandwidth on actual people 
downloading. I don't want to slow my entire network to a crawl just 
downloading a kernel, thank you.


4. You're labeled a leecher just because you don't want to spend several 
hours UPLOADING a package that took you upwards of half an hour to get 
in the first place. If I were to install Debian via torrent I'd be 
spending MONTHS clogging up my upward channels trying to get to a 1.0 
ratio I'll never achieve because I'll be updating packages still.


Now, I do like the idea of updates being BINARY PATCHES to the packages 
installed. The downside being that if you need to fall back to an older 
version you might be out of luck if simply unpatching won't work.



--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org

Archive: http://lists.debian.org/51c30f35.1060...@marupa.net

Re: Just a question...........

[黃健毅]

Have you tried netselect-apt (I think that's the name), which
determines your fastest Debian mirror and builds a sources file for
you containing the fastest mirror?

On 20 June 2013 14:12, Charlie  wrote:
>  On Thu, 20 Jun 2013 09:02:39 -0400 (EDT) "Rob Owens row...@ptd.net"
>  sent this:
>
> >- Original Message -
>>> From: "Charlie" 
>>>
>>> I don't know enough about this hope someone can help:
>>>
>>> My ISP CEO suggests that this address is BitTorrent:
>>> http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib
>>>
>>> Is that correct?
>>>
>>As others have already said:  no, that is not correct.
>>
>>Your ISP CEO seems a little confused here.  That is a Debian
>>mirror.  Debian ISO images can be downloaded from many mirrors,
>>although I don't see them available on this particular one.
>>Debian ISO images can also be downloaded using BitTorrent.  Of
>>course, the fact that you download something using BitTorrent
>>doesn't make it illegal -- it is simply a file sharing protocol.
>>Debian ISO images are legal to download via HTTP, FTP,
>>BitTorrent, Jigdo, and so on.
>>
>>When I speak of "legal", I'm of course assuming sane laws.
>>Debian is given away for free, so it makes no sense to outlaw
>>one method of obtaining it while other methods remain legal.
>>
>>-Rob
>
> Thanks Rob,
>
> I have informed him of his misconception. I think he may have been
> grasping at straws in his attempt to justify my low Internet speed in
> trying to do a Wheezy update during the day, but better during the
> night/early morning.
>
> Thank you,
> Charlie
> --
> Registered Linux User:- 329524
> ***
>
> To succeed in the world it is not enough to be stupid, you must
> also be well-mannered. ...Voltaire
>
> ***
>
> Debian GNU/Linux - just the best way to create magic
>
> -
>
>
> --
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org
> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
> Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130620231256.1f827fda@nomad
>


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: 
http://lists.debian.org/cag0rmd5dfe3o9yp-pghvhrn-st49kc8fhndxyvhcgcint8y...@mail.gmail.com

Re: Just a question...........

[Charlie]

 On Thu, 20 Jun 2013 09:02:39 -0400 (EDT) "Rob Owens row...@ptd.net"
 sent this:

>- Original Message -
>> From: "Charlie" 
>> 
>> I don't know enough about this hope someone can help:
>>
>> My ISP CEO suggests that this address is BitTorrent:
>> http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib
>> 
>> Is that correct?
>> 
>As others have already said:  no, that is not correct.
>
>Your ISP CEO seems a little confused here.  That is a Debian 
>mirror.  Debian ISO images can be downloaded from many mirrors,
>although I don't see them available on this particular one.  
>Debian ISO images can also be downloaded using BitTorrent.  Of
>course, the fact that you download something using BitTorrent
>doesn't make it illegal -- it is simply a file sharing protocol.
>Debian ISO images are legal to download via HTTP, FTP, 
>BitTorrent, Jigdo, and so on.
>
>When I speak of "legal", I'm of course assuming sane laws.
>Debian is given away for free, so it makes no sense to outlaw
>one method of obtaining it while other methods remain legal.
>
>-Rob

Thanks Rob,

I have informed him of his misconception. I think he may have been
grasping at straws in his attempt to justify my low Internet speed in
trying to do a Wheezy update during the day, but better during the
night/early morning.

Thank you,
Charlie
-- 
Registered Linux User:- 329524
***

To succeed in the world it is not enough to be stupid, you must
also be well-mannered. ...Voltaire

***

Debian GNU/Linux - just the best way to create magic

-


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130620231256.1f827fda@nomad

Re: Just a question...........

[Rob Owens]

- Original Message -
> From: "Charlie" 
> 
> I don't know enough about this hope someone can help:
>
> My ISP CEO suggests that this address is BitTorrent:
> http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib
> 
> Is that correct?
> 
As others have already said:  no, that is not correct.

Your ISP CEO seems a little confused here.  That is a Debian 
mirror.  Debian ISO images can be downloaded from many mirrors,
although I don't see them available on this particular one.  
Debian ISO images can also be downloaded using BitTorrent.  Of
course, the fact that you download something using BitTorrent
doesn't make it illegal -- it is simply a file sharing protocol.
Debian ISO images are legal to download via HTTP, FTP, 
BitTorrent, Jigdo, and so on.

When I speak of "legal", I'm of course assuming sane laws.
Debian is given away for free, so it makes no sense to outlaw
one method of obtaining it while other methods remain legal.

-Rob


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: 
http://lists.debian.org/408520048.33720969.1371733359966.javamail.r...@ptd.net

Re: Just a question...........

[Charlie]

 On Thu, 20 Jun 2013 23:22:23 +1200 "Chris Bannister
 cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz" sent this:

>On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 03:19:25PM +1000, Charlie wrote:
>> 
>> I don't know enough about this hope someone can help:
>>
>> My ISP CEO suggests that this address is BitTorrent:
>> http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib
>>
>> Is that correct?
>
>No, he is confused.
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BitTorrent
>http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/7792
>
>There are no trackers involved with apt-get, although it would be a far
>more efficient method (bandwidth wise). The downside is that you
>probably wouldn't be able to update/upgrade your laptop at your local
>library etc. because they tend to block BitTorrent traffic.
>
>I think I remember reading about a discussion of implementing a system
>where apt-get only downloads the changes to files. It wouldn't suprise
>me if something like this was implemented at some point way down the
>track.
>
>-- 
>"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people
>who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the 
>oppressing." --- Malcolm X

Thanks for the links and the extra information, Chris.

Charlie
-- 
Registered Linux User:- 329524
***

To be worn out is to be renewed. ..Lao-tzu

***

Debian GNU/Linux - just the best way to create magic

-


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130620212934.2c365bdd@nomad

Re: Just a question...........

[Chris Bannister]

On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 03:19:25PM +1000, Charlie wrote:
> 
> I don't know enough about this hope someone can help:
>
> My ISP CEO suggests that this address is BitTorrent:
> http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib
>
> Is that correct?

No, he is confused.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BitTorrent
http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/7792

There are no trackers involved with apt-get, although it would be a far
more efficient method (bandwidth wise). The downside is that you
probably wouldn't be able to update/upgrade your laptop at your local
library etc. because they tend to block BitTorrent traffic.

I think I remember reading about a discussion of implementing a system
where apt-get only downloads the changes to files. It wouldn't suprise
me if something like this was implemented at some point way down the
track.

-- 
"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people
who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the 
oppressing." --- Malcolm X


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2013062011.GG15403@tal

Re: Just a question...........

[Charlie]

 On Wed, 19 Jun 2013 23:59:18 -0700 "Alan Ianson agian...@gmail.com"
 sent this:

>On Thu, 20 Jun 2013 15:19:25 +1000
>Charlie wrote:
>
>> 
>> I don't know enough about this hope someone can help:
>>
>> My ISP CEO suggests that this address is BitTorrent:
>> http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib
>> 
>> Is that correct?
>
>No, that is a debian mirror. :)
>

Thanks Alan.

-- 
Registered Linux User:- 329524
***

Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn
out, shouting "...holy shit...what a ride!" -- anon

***

Debian GNU/Linux - just the best way to create magic

-


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130620173252.30057aa4@nomad

Re: Just a question...........

[Charlie]

 On Thu, 20 Jun 2013 08:44:56 +0200 "Ralf Mardorf
 ralf.mard...@alice-dsl.net" sent this:

>On Thu, 2013-06-20 at 15:19 +1000, Charlie wrote:
>> I don't know enough about this hope someone can help:
>>
>> My ISP CEO suggests that this address is BitTorrent:
>> http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib
>> 
>> Is that correct?
>
>This isn't a torrent!

Thank You
  
Didn't think it was, but didn't know, now I do.
-- 
Registered Linux User:- 329524
***

Facts do not cease to exist because they are
ignored. . Aldous Huxley

***

Debian GNU/Linux - just the best way to create magic

-


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130620172826.2d1471d4@nomad

Re: Just a question...........

[Alan Ianson]

On Thu, 20 Jun 2013 15:19:25 +1000
Charlie wrote:

> 
> I don't know enough about this hope someone can help:
>
> My ISP CEO suggests that this address is BitTorrent:
> http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib
> 
> Is that correct?

No, that is a debian mirror. :)


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130619235918.6b31c...@debian.ok.shawcable.net

Re: Just a question...........

[Ralf Mardorf]

On Thu, 2013-06-20 at 15:19 +1000, Charlie wrote:
> I don't know enough about this hope someone can help:
>
> My ISP CEO suggests that this address is BitTorrent:
> http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib
> 
> Is that correct?

This isn't a torrent!


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1371710696.6069.24.camel@archlinux

Just a question...........

[Charlie]

I don't know enough about this hope someone can help:
   
My ISP CEO suggests that this address is BitTorrent:
http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib

Is that correct?

TIA
Charlie
-- 
Registered Linux User:- 329524
***

Anything is good, even perfect if enjoyed without comparing it
to anything else.  anon

***

Debian GNU/Linux - just the best way to create magic

-


-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130620151925.6f1a2437@nomad

Re: Just a question

[Karsten M. Self]

on Fri, Aug 31, 2001 at 11:53:57AM -0400, Brian Stults ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 
wrote:
> >>BTW what does [ sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/" ] accomplish?  I'm just
> >>grooving on one liners lately and am curious.  It seems like -
> >>awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd is all you need to spit out the full
> >>names.
> >>
> >Not quite the same thing:
> >
> >$ awk -F : '/karsten/ {print $5}' /etc/passwd
> >Karsten M. Self,,,
> >
> >
> >$ awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
> >Karsten M. Self
> >
> 
> 
> Or, if you only know awk...
> 
> awk -F : '/Brian/ {print $5}' /etc/passwd | awk -F , '{print $1}'

...or:

awk -F : '/karsten/ {print substr($5,1,index($5,",")-1)}' /etc/passwd

...in one process.

-- 
Karsten M. Self   http://kmself.home.netcom.com/
 What part of "Gestalt" don't you understand? There is no K5 cabal
  http://gestalt-system.sourceforge.net/   http://www.kuro5hin.org
   Free Dmitry! Boycott Adobe! Repeal the DMCA!http://www.freesklyarov.org
Geek for Hirehttp://kmself.home.netcom.com/resume.html


pgpVdYK0SVQdD.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: Just a question

[Brian Stults]

BTW what does [ sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/" ] accomplish?  I'm just
grooving on one liners lately and am curious.  It seems like -
awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd is all you need to spit out the full
names.


Not quite the same thing:

   $ awk -F : '/karsten/ {print $5}' /etc/passwd
   Karsten M. Self,,,

   
   $ awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"

   Karsten M. Self




Or, if you only know awk...

awk -F : '/Brian/ {print $5}' /etc/passwd | awk -F , '{print $1}'

The former looks much cooler, though. :-)

--
Brian J. Stults
Department of Sociology
University of Florida
Box 117330
Gainesville, Florida 32611-7330
phone:  (352) 392-0265 x286
fax:(352) 392-6568
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Just a question

[Cliff Sarginson]

On Fri, Aug 31, 2001 at 08:07:01AM -0500, ktb wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 10:51:12PM -0700, Karsten M. Self wrote:
> > on Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 11:09:07PM -0500, ktb ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> > > On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 08:45:29PM -0700, Vineet Kumar wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > * Brian Schramm ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [010830 19:41]:
> > > > > Is there a way that I can take a passwd file and compare the full 
> > > > > name data 
> > > > > in it to the email ldap server and give a a list of what it finds and 
> > > > > what it 
> > > > > misses?  I am doing this manually but with the number of users that 
> > > > > there are 
> > > > > involved it is going to be really time consuming.
> > > > 
> > > > I don't really know what I'm talking about, but this should probably
> > > > help you get started:
> > > > 
> > > > awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
> > > > 
> > > > That will give you a list of just the full names. Pipe that into
> > > > something else that will look each one up in the directory service.
> > > > 
> > > > Not a complete answer, but it's a start...
> > > 
> > > BTW what does [ sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/" ] accomplish?  I'm just
> > > grooving on one liners lately and am curious.  It seems like -
> > > awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd is all you need to spit out the full
> > > names.
> > 
> > Not quite the same thing:
> > 
> > $ awk -F : '/karsten/ {print $5}' /etc/passwd
> > Karsten M. Self,,,
> > 
> > 
> > $ awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
> > Karsten M. Self
> > 
> > In the original pattern:
> > 
> > sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
> > 
> > We have:
> > 
> >   -e:   expression to evaluate.
> >   s:create a substitution using the following pattern.
> >   / start of expression
> >   ^ beginning of line (actually, beginning of fifth field
> >   \(start a substitution
> >   [^,]* match zero or more instances of any character other than ','
> >   \)end substitution
> >   .*$   match to end of line
> >   / end of expression
> >   \1replace with contents of first substitution (the \([^,]*\)
> > pattern)
> >   / end expression
> > 
> > sed is for people who think Perl's too easy to understand.

Roflmao...
Cliff

Re: Just a question

[ktb]

On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 10:51:12PM -0700, Karsten M. Self wrote:
> on Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 11:09:07PM -0500, ktb ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> > On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 08:45:29PM -0700, Vineet Kumar wrote:
> > > 
> > > * Brian Schramm ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [010830 19:41]:
> > > > Is there a way that I can take a passwd file and compare the full name 
> > > > data 
> > > > in it to the email ldap server and give a a list of what it finds and 
> > > > what it 
> > > > misses?  I am doing this manually but with the number of users that 
> > > > there are 
> > > > involved it is going to be really time consuming.
> > > 
> > > I don't really know what I'm talking about, but this should probably
> > > help you get started:
> > > 
> > > awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
> > > 
> > > That will give you a list of just the full names. Pipe that into
> > > something else that will look each one up in the directory service.
> > > 
> > > Not a complete answer, but it's a start...
> > 
> > BTW what does [ sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/" ] accomplish?  I'm just
> > grooving on one liners lately and am curious.  It seems like -
> > awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd is all you need to spit out the full
> > names.
> 
> Not quite the same thing:
> 
> $ awk -F : '/karsten/ {print $5}' /etc/passwd
> Karsten M. Self,,,
> 
> 
> $ awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
> Karsten M. Self
> 
> In the original pattern:
> 
> sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
> 
> We have:
> 
>   -e: expression to evaluate.
>   s:  create a substitution using the following pattern.
>   /   start of expression
>   ^   beginning of line (actually, beginning of fifth field
>   \(  start a substitution
>   [^,]* match zero or more instances of any character other than ','
>   \)  end substitution
>   .*$ match to end of line
>   /   end of expression
>   \1  replace with contents of first substitution (the \([^,]*\)
> pattern)
>   /   end expression
> 
> sed is for people who think Perl's too easy to understand.

Thanks for the nice explanation:)  What was confusing me is the two
/etc/passwd files I ran the various commands against, non of them had
and ','s' in them.  I just tried my progeny box here at work and see
fully what the sed expression is used for.
kent

Re: Just a question

[Karsten M. Self]

on Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 11:09:07PM -0500, ktb ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 08:45:29PM -0700, Vineet Kumar wrote:
> > 
> > * Brian Schramm ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [010830 19:41]:
> > > Is there a way that I can take a passwd file and compare the full name 
> > > data 
> > > in it to the email ldap server and give a a list of what it finds and 
> > > what it 
> > > misses?  I am doing this manually but with the number of users that there 
> > > are 
> > > involved it is going to be really time consuming.
> > 
> > I don't really know what I'm talking about, but this should probably
> > help you get started:
> > 
> > awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
> > 
> > That will give you a list of just the full names. Pipe that into
> > something else that will look each one up in the directory service.
> > 
> > Not a complete answer, but it's a start...
> 
> BTW what does [ sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/" ] accomplish?  I'm just
> grooving on one liners lately and am curious.  It seems like -
> awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd is all you need to spit out the full
> names.

Not quite the same thing:

$ awk -F : '/karsten/ {print $5}' /etc/passwd
Karsten M. Self,,,


$ awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
Karsten M. Self

In the original pattern:

sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"

We have:

  -e:   expression to evaluate.
  s:create a substitution using the following pattern.
  / start of expression
  ^ beginning of line (actually, beginning of fifth field
  \(start a substitution
  [^,]* match zero or more instances of any character other than ','
  \)end substitution
  .*$   match to end of line
  / end of expression
  \1replace with contents of first substitution (the \([^,]*\)
pattern)
  / end expression

sed is for people who think Perl's too easy to understand.

-- 
Karsten M. Self   http://kmself.home.netcom.com/
 What part of "Gestalt" don't you understand? There is no K5 cabal
  http://gestalt-system.sourceforge.net/   http://www.kuro5hin.org
   Free Dmitry! Boycott Adobe! Repeal the DMCA!http://www.freesklyarov.org
Geek for Hirehttp://kmself.home.netcom.com/resume.html


pgp8cxTGGsTLN.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: Just a question

[Vineet Kumar]

* ktb ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [010830 21:14]:
> On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 08:45:29PM -0700, Vineet Kumar wrote:
> > 
> > * Brian Schramm ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [010830 19:41]:
> > > Is there a way that I can take a passwd file and compare the full name 
> > > data 
> > > in it to the email ldap server and give a a list of what it finds and 
> > > what it 
> > > misses?  I am doing this manually but with the number of users that there 
> > > are 
> > > involved it is going to be really time consuming.
> > 
> > I don't really know what I'm talking about, but this should probably
> > help you get started:
> > 
> > awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
> > 
> > That will give you a list of just the full names. Pipe that into
> > something else that will look each one up in the directory service.
> > 
> > Not a complete answer, but it's a start...
> 
> BTW what does [ sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/" ] accomplish?  I'm just
> grooving on one liners lately and am curious.  It seems like -
> awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd is all you need to spit out the full
> names.

That will print out the full GECOS field. The sed part strips out
everything but what's before the first comma (leaving just the name).


-- 
Vineet   http://www.anti-dmca.org
Unauthorized use of this .sig may constitute violation of US law.
Qba\'g gernq ba zr\!  |tr 'a-zA-Z' 'n-za-mN-ZA-M'


pgpnwGnszqW6V.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: Just a question

[ktb]

On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 08:45:29PM -0700, Vineet Kumar wrote:
> 
> * Brian Schramm ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [010830 19:41]:
> > Is there a way that I can take a passwd file and compare the full name data 
> > in it to the email ldap server and give a a list of what it finds and what 
> > it 
> > misses?  I am doing this manually but with the number of users that there 
> > are 
> > involved it is going to be really time consuming.
> 
> I don't really know what I'm talking about, but this should probably
> help you get started:
> 
> awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
> 
> That will give you a list of just the full names. Pipe that into
> something else that will look each one up in the directory service.
> 
> Not a complete answer, but it's a start...

BTW what does [ sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/" ] accomplish?  I'm just
grooving on one liners lately and am curious.  It seems like -
awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd is all you need to spit out the full
names.
Thanks,
kent

Re: Just a question

[ktb]

On Thu, Aug 30, 2001 at 08:45:29PM -0700, Vineet Kumar wrote:
> 
> * Brian Schramm ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [010830 19:41]:
> > Is there a way that I can take a passwd file and compare the full name data 
> > in it to the email ldap server and give a a list of what it finds and what 
> > it 
> > misses?  I am doing this manually but with the number of users that there 
> > are 
> > involved it is going to be really time consuming.
> 
> I don't really know what I'm talking about, but this should probably
> help you get started:
> 
> awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"
> 
> That will give you a list of just the full names. Pipe that into
> something else that will look each one up in the directory service.
> 
> Not a complete answer, but it's a start...
> 

Or -
$ cat /etc/passwd | cut -d : -f 5
:)
kent

Re: Just a question

[Vineet Kumar]

* Brian Schramm ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [010830 19:41]:
> Is there a way that I can take a passwd file and compare the full name data 
> in it to the email ldap server and give a a list of what it finds and what it 
> misses?  I am doing this manually but with the number of users that there are 
> involved it is going to be really time consuming.

I don't really know what I'm talking about, but this should probably
help you get started:

awk -F : '{print $5}' /etc/passwd | sed -e "s/^\([^,]*\).*$/\1/"

That will give you a list of just the full names. Pipe that into
something else that will look each one up in the directory service.

Not a complete answer, but it's a start...

-- 
Vineet   http://www.anti-dmca.org
Unauthorized use of this .sig may constitute violation of US law.
Qba\'g gernq ba zr\!  |tr 'a-zA-Z' 'n-za-mN-ZA-M'


pgpIpSYw1Kwln.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Just a question

[Brian Schramm]

Is there a way that I can take a passwd file and compare the full name data 
in it to the email ldap server and give a a list of what it finds and what it 
misses?  I am doing this manually but with the number of users that there are 
involved it is going to be really time consuming.

I know this may not be the best place to post this but it is the only group 
that I know that may have the answer.

Thanks for your time

-- 
Brian Schramm

919-871-6466
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

RE: just a question

[Simon Law]

Nero does it quite well.  You can find instructions on how to use it (and
other burners) at cdimage.debian.org

-Original Message-
From: Geoff [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2000 9:43 PM
To: Robert J. Zdebiak
Cc: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: just a question


well by your email program... your using windoze... ok have you got Easy CD
Creator? Ok in both version 3.5 and 4 go to FILE... then CREATE CD FROM
DISK IMAGE. By default it looks for CIF files ...use the drop-down box and
chose ISO image files ...then just browse and find where you saved the ISO
image and then it should write normally...
NERO can do it as well but I haven't discovered how yet...
Cheers Geoff


At 07:11 pm 12/08/00 -0600, you wrote:
>   I have downloaded the iso images from an ftp server  on the net and was
>just curios as of how to burn them on to a cd.. please help.. : )
A Real Newbie
Geoff
New Zealand



--
Unsubscribe?  mail -s unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] <
/dev/null

Re: just a question

[Geoff]

well by your email program... your using windoze... ok have you got Easy CD
Creator? Ok in both version 3.5 and 4 go to FILE... then CREATE CD FROM
DISK IMAGE. By default it looks for CIF files ...use the drop-down box and
chose ISO image files ...then just browse and find where you saved the ISO
image and then it should write normally... 
NERO can do it as well but I haven't discovered how yet...
Cheers Geoff


At 07:11 pm 12/08/00 -0600, you wrote:
>   I have downloaded the iso images from an ftp server  on the net and was
>just curios as of how to burn them on to a cd.. please help.. : )   
A Real Newbie
Geoff 
New Zealand

just a question

[Robert J. Zdebiak]

I have downloaded the iso images from an ftp server 
on the net and was just curios as of how to burn them on to a cd..
please help.. : )
 

Re: Just a Question???

[Kent West]

Kent West wrote:
> 
> Gustavo Minari wrote:
> >
> > May I have some problems using:
> >
> > Video: SiS 6326
> > Modem: LT Win Modem #2
> > Sound: Sound Blaster AudioPCI 64V
> > Printer: Epson Stylus Color II
> > Scanner: Avision - Model: AV260C
> >
> > With your Linux package
> >
> > Please send your response!!!
> >
> > I´m waiting!!!
> >
> > Gustavo Minari

Here's a site that might be of help to you concerning the LT WinModem:
http://www.close.u-net.com/ltmodem.html

Concerning the SiS 6326 video card, according to the XFree86 site at
http://www.xfree86.org/3.3.5/README3.html, this chipset is supported.
Here's a page that might be of help:
http://www.driver-forum.com/graphics/198.html

Concerning the sound card: The Hardware-HOWTO at
http://metalab.unc.edu/pub/Linux/docs/HOWTO/Hardware-HOWTO indicates
that the "Ensoniq AudioPCI (ES1371)" and "Ensoniq AudioPCI /
SoundBlaster PCI (ES1370)" cards are supported in Linux. Whether this
has any bearing on your SoundBlaster AudioPCI 64V or not, I can't tell.

The same web site
(http://metalab.unc.edu/pub/Linux/docs/HOWTO/Hardware-HOWTO) indicates
that your Epson Stylus II is also supported.

According to the site at
http://www.rene.rebe.myokay.net/avision/index.html, it appears that
there is at least partial support of the Avision AV630cs scanner.
Whether that helps you with the AV260C or not, I can't tell.

I know that this frustrates you to not have definitive information, but
maybe it'll at least give you a little help.

Re: Just a Question???

[Jeronimo Pellegrini]

:: On Sat, 27 May 2000 15:53:56 -0500, Kent West <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

> However, concerning the "LT Win Modem #2": winmodems are so named
> because they are designed to work with Microsoft Windows. Except in rare
> cases, they won't work with Linux, or OS/2, or Be, or DOS, or anything
> else that the manufacturer is too lazy/cheap to support.

I think there has been some work on that... You may want to check
http://www.linmodems.org/ but of course, even if you manage to make the modem
work, the CPU will still have to do whaat is supposed to be the
modem's job... :-/

Anyway, I think PC-Tel and Lucent released linux drivers for their
winmodems, Im not sure.

Just one more thing: the original poster is brazilian. Unfortunately,
there are cities in Brazil where you simply can't find a real
modem for sale. :-(  Part of the hardware produced in other countries
is imported, and only part of it. Nobody cares about the rest. They
want to sell things that they're sure lots of people will buy, and
that of course includes cheap winmodems... ("If I'm selling a US$15
winmodem, why would I bother to import expensive real modems tht
nobody will buy anyway?"). Nice, eh? Not only we have to pay local
phone calls per minute, we're also stuck with winmodems. :-/

J.

-- 
Jeronimo Pellegrini
Institute of Computing - Unicamp - Brazil
http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~jeronimo
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Just a Question???

[Kent West]

Gustavo Minari wrote:
> 
> May I have some problems using:
> 
> Video: SiS 6326
> Modem: LT Win Modem #2
> Sound: Sound Blaster AudioPCI 64V
> Printer: Epson Stylus Color II
> Scanner: Avision - Model: AV260C
> 
> With your Linux package
> 
> Please send your response!!!
> 
> I´m waiting!!!
> 
> Gustavo Minari

By the phrase "your Linux package", I assume you mean the "Debian/GNU
Linux distribution, which is composed of thousands of packages". If you
mean a specific package in the Debian distro, you'll need to be more
precise.

Unless someone on the list has specific experience with any of your
hardware, you'll probably want to do a web search for "linux hardware
compatibility" to find a list of hardware that works with Linux. For
example, here's one such site:
http://www.linuxdoc.org/HOWTO/Hardware-HOWTO.html. Hopefully someone on
this list can address your specific concerns, which might be more
valuable to you than finding limited info in a Hardware-HOWTO.
Unfortunately, I can not.

However, concerning the "LT Win Modem #2": winmodems are so named
because they are designed to work with Microsoft Windows. Except in rare
cases, they won't work with Linux, or OS/2, or Be, or DOS, or anything
else that the manufacturer is too lazy/cheap to support. Winmodems are
not real modems; they expect the computer's CPU to do the
MODulating/DEModulating, which both ties up your CPU's time and requires
manufacturer-supplied drivers. Few manufacturers of winmodems have shown
much interest in providing the drivers for Linux, or in providing the
information necessary for the Linux community to write their own
drivers. In my opinion, winmodems are a fraud perpetrated upon the
unsuspecting computer-using market, and should be avoided. Even if you
have a great-working winmodem today, when the next release of MS-Windows
comes out (Win2003, etc), and your winmodem manufacturer has gone
belly-up or has offended Microsoft in some way, your winmodem has just
become a doorstop. Of course, that doesn't help you, who already has a
winmodem. (Forgive me for ranting; I despise win-hardware, including
winprinters.)

There has been some limited success in getting a few
winmodems/winprinters to work with Linux. As said earlier, hopefully
someone on this list can be of more help than my anti-winhardware
ranting.

Just a Question???

[Gustavo Minari]

May I have some problems using:

Video: SiS 6326
Modem: LT Win Modem #2
Sound: Sound Blaster AudioPCI 64V
Printer: Epson Stylus Color II
Scanner: Avision - Model: AV260C

With your Linux package

Please send your response!!!

I´m waiting!!!

Gustavo Minari

Debian Potato Installation (No real problems, just a question)

[Almer. S. Tigelaar.]

Hello,

Recently I installed Debian Potato (frozen) on my PC.
I have another PC on which I want to install Debian Potato aswell.

My question :
Can I put the packages in /var/cache/apt/archives
on a CD and then specify that as the place to get the packages
from when installing Debian Potato on the other PC?

I imagine this must be possible somehow, it would save me a lot of
download time.

Yours,

Almer. S. Tigelaar.

Re: Just a Question

[Matthew Dalton]

Well, now I've seen it all... never mind newbie questions about Debian,
but newbie questions about Windows? On a Linux mailing list?

Not to mention the liberal use of the word 'download' :/

Where do these people even get the debian-user mailing list email
address from?

> Mason wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> I have recently installed the Super Disk onto my computer.  Recently,
> I have gone to download items onto it and it hasn't been and option in
> the files that I can download into.  So I wnt to the "My Computer"
> icon on my screen and it isn't in there anymore.  It is still in my
> Windows Explorer, but I can't access it anymore.  I have repeatedly
> downloaded the driver onto to my computer just for it to tell me that
> it already exists.  I download it anyway just to get the icon where I
> can download info onto it.  If U could please tell me what the problem
> is or simply that it isn't a problem with the Super Disk so I can find
> someone who knows more about computers thanI do to make it accessible
> for me.  Thanks a lot if U have the answer for me!

Just a Question

[Mason]

Hello,
I have recently installed the Super Disk onto my 
computer.  Recently, I have gone to download items onto it and it hasn't 
been and option in the files that I can download into.  So I wnt to the "My 
Computer" icon on my screen and it isn't in there anymore.  It is still in 
my Windows Explorer, but I can't access it anymore.  I have repeatedly 
downloaded the driver onto to my computer just for it to tell me that it already 
exists.  I download it anyway just to get the icon where I can download 
info onto it.  If U could please tell me what the problem is or simply that 
it isn't a problem with the Super Disk so I can find someone who knows more 
about computers thanI do to make it accessible for me.  Thanks a lot if U 
have the answer for me!

Just a Question..

[msaavedr]

Salut les amis , je suis un Chilien etudiant et amis des ordinateurs et 
IRC (internet Relay Chat) je voudrais seulement savoir si vous connaisais
a Weck ;).. soy chileno y quiero saber si conocen al Weck de IRC

Soy conocido como TheRazor en IRC y me dedico a visitar sites y ftp's
etc etc... bueno solo queria saber si podria participar en zero.org
desde Chile colaborando en lo que quieran aqui tienen un amigo.
Solo queria saber si Uds. pueden facilitarme el acceso a su red linux
prestandome una cuenta , necesito saber mas sobre linux estoy recien
comenzando a estudiarlo pero en UNIX no hay problemas..
Bueno esperando una pronta respuesta se despide de Uds. Mauricio
Saludos a Canada bro! jejejejeje
Des amities!!! 


--
TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word "unsubscribe" to
[EMAIL PROTECTED] . 
Trouble?  e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .