Re: D vs Rust
On Saturday, 30 January 2016 at 20:48:01 UTC, bearophile wrote: Hello bearophile, In Ada you can be productive if you use it for the purposes it was invented for, but most times you don't write that kind of code. I miss some Ada features, and I've missed the strictness of the Ada compiler that catches lot of bugs, but for most things today I prefer a more modern languages. For quite some time I was looking at Ada as potential language to write multi-platform desktop application, but, being the big language which requires lot of time and energy to invest into learning/mastering it, I, somehow, feel reluctant seeing that there is practically no open-source community around Ada, no truly open-source compile -- what would happen if AdaCore would simply pull the plug since I do not believe there are enough people capable to maintain/develop FSF GNAT, so I'd appreciate if you can write few words about Ada vs D hoping that the latter it one you are recommending for new (gui) projects? I simply hope that D can provide me with most/all the features I'd expect from the language like Ada, but but even more modern features, more choices when it comes to developing GUI desktop app, more compiler choices, better tooling and, of course, much bigger community of open-source enthusiasts. Sincerely, Gour
Re: DQuick a GUI Library (prototype)
On Thu, 29 Aug 2013 19:08:09 +0200 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: > Anyway, as a simple GUI library it might even be worth wrapping. But I > think the DQuick devs and D programmers want something much more. Based on what I've seen, Tk-8.6 is quite good and available *today*, while DQuick is still prototype only. Sincerely, Gour -- The work of a man who is unattached to the modes of material nature and who is fully situated in transcendental knowledge merges entirely into transcendence. http://www.atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810
Re: Why I chose D over Ada and Eiffel
On Thu, 29 Aug 2013 16:13:06 +0200 "John Colvin" wrote: > just something I whipped up in a few mins: [...] Thanks. So, it's possible, but (maybe) it's not as elegant. Sincerely, Gour -- A person is said to be established in self-realization and is called a yogī [or mystic] when he is fully satisfied by virtue of acquired knowledge and realization. Such a person is situated in transcendence and is self-controlled. He sees everything — whether it be pebbles, stones or gold — as the same. http://www.atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810
Re: Why I chose D over Ada and Eiffel
On Sun, 25 Aug 2013 17:06:27 +0200 "bearophile" wrote: > Probably working even more you can make the D entry a bit more > statically safe (eventually you could reach the level of Ada code) but > the amount of work and code becomes excessive, and the resulting D > code becomes unnatural, and rather not idiomatic. Still considering whether to focus on Ada or D for my project, I wonder if D can do stuff like (from wikipedia page): type Day_type is range1 .. 31; type Month_type is range1 .. 12; type Year_type is range 1800 .. 2100; type Hours is mod 24; type Weekday is (Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday); type Date is record Day : Day_type; Month : Month_type; Year : Year_type; end record; subtype Working_Hours is Hours range 0 .. 12; subtype Working_Day is Weekday range Monday .. Friday; Work_Load: constant array(Working_Day) of Working_Hours := (Friday => 6, Monday => 4, others => 10); and ensure type-safety for such custom types? Sincerely, Gour -- You have a right to perform your prescribed duty, but you are not entitled to the fruits of action. Never consider yourself the cause of the results of your activities, and never be attached to not doing your duty. http://www.atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810
Re: Why I chose D over Ada and Eiffel
On Fri, 23 Aug 2013 15:35:19 +0200 "Ramon" wrote: > If GUI is very important to you it might also be useful to look > at a small GUI (like lus'a IUP) and tinker along the lines of how > this would, could, and should be done in D and at how it was > actually done e.g. with the gtk binding. I explored that path - see e.g.: http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.lib.iup.user/368 so it's a no got for multi-platform app with required i18n support. > I hope you'll enjoy D as much as I'm beginning to do ;) Let's see... Sincerely, Gour -- For him who has conquered the mind, the mind is the best of friends; but for one who has failed to do so, his mind will remain the greatest enemy. http://www.atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810
Re: DQuick a GUI Library (prototype)
On Tue, 20 Aug 2013 23:22:45 +0200 "Flamaros" wrote: > I want to share a short presentation of the project I am working > on with friends. It's a prototype of a GUI library written in D. The state of GI bindings in D was the main reason I gave up idea to use D for writing multi-platform GUI app in this nice language. Gtk(D) does not look good on anything which is non-Linux and the state of the GTK support on both Mac OS X & Windows is pretty poor. There are no Qt bindings and nothing, afaik, happened from the attempt to provide wx bindings, so your project might provide some light at the end of the tunnel giving hope to use D as 'general programming language'. Wishing you all the best! Sincerely, Gour -- In the material world, one who is unaffected by whatever good or evil he may obtain, neither praising it nor despising it, is firmly fixed in perfect knowledge. http://www.atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810
Re: Why I chose D over Ada and Eiffel
On Mon, 19 Aug 2013 22:18:04 +0200 "Ramon" wrote: > Sorry, this is a long and big post. But then, so too is my way > that led me here; long, big, troublesome. And I thought that my > (probably not everyday) set of needs and experiences might be > interesting or useful for some others, too. Thank you very much for this post. I was considering to use D for quite some time for multi-platform gui project, but was not satisfied with the state of its GUI bindings (only gtkd although someone was working on wx bindings, but, afaik, nothing happened) as well as non-stability of the language itself. That led me to research and try some other languages, starting with OCaml, then explored .NET/Mono platform and languages like F# (even Cobra). On the other end of the spectrum I've tried some obscure ones like Nimrod and finally considered Ada as the most robust/safe option with decent options for GUI (GTK & Qt). Your post and another thread 'DQuick a GUI Library (prototype)' makes me optimistic that it would be possible to use D as the 'general programming language' sutiable for writing GUI apps as well. Sincerely, Gour -- A person who is not disturbed by the incessant flow of desires — that enter like rivers into the ocean, which is ever being filled but is always still — can alone achieve peace, and not the man who strives to satisfy such desires. http://www.atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810
Re: [OT] Good^H^H^H^HAcceptable NG/email client?
On Wed, 25 Jul 2012 03:27:30 -0400 Nick Sabalausky wrote: > Thanks for the tip (I didn't know you could set up an external editor > for Claws), although...ummm...how to put this without reigniting the > age-old editor wars...Let's just say I'm not really much of a vi kinda > guy ;) Ok, use Emacs then. ;) The point is that vim (and Emacs) have support for 'mail' filetype which is not the case for e.g. Geany & SublimeText2 which I diched for that reason since they're not capable to replace my current Claws' external editor. > I guess I could find a different external editor, but it would be > nice to have a more "proper" (well, "traditional" or "mainstream" I > guess) email editing window, with the to/cc/bcc lines, subject line, > attachments, address book, etc. Well, Vim (or Emacs) are used *just* for composing body text, the rest you do within Claws. Sincerely, Gour -- In this endeavor there is no loss or diminution, and a little advancement on this path can protect one from the most dangerous type of fear. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [OT] Good^H^H^H^HAcceptable NG/email client?
On Wed, 25 Jul 2012 00:12:23 -0400 Nick Sabalausky wrote: > Anyone know of a NG/email client, available on Win (preferably cross > platform - I do want to switch to Lin eventually) that isn't shit? I use Claws-mail for many years with (g)vim as external editor and it works great. Using gvim "+set ft=mail" -f %s line to configure external text editor in Preferences. Vim completely annihilates your points 1) & 2). Sincerely, Gour -- As a strong wind sweeps away a boat on the water, even one of the roaming senses on which the mind focuses can carry away a man's intelligence. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: wxD bindings
On Fri, 8 Jun 2012 00:49:37 +0200 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: > I'll see about that. I'm not sure if doxygen works on C libraries, if > it does then it's doable. Since now I support POD types there's > nothing from stopping the generator to work on C libraries. If/when you publish something, are you going to announce it in the 'announce' list 'cause I'll unsubscribe from the rest? For the moment, I'm postponing my intended usage of D and going (back) to Python, but would like to know if/when something is changing GUI-wise within D community... Sincerely, Gour -- Bewildered by the modes of material nature, the ignorant fully engage themselves in material activities and become attached. But the wise should not unsettle them, although these duties are inferior due to the performers' lack of knowledge. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: wxD bindings
On Mon, 28 May 2012 19:55:09 +0200 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: Dear Andrej, thank you very much for your response... > I was busy doing another rewrite of my codebase since it was getting > rather large and too specific for wxwidgets (lots and lots of doxygen > workarounds). Doxygen files for handwritten interfaces are full of > missing information so this wasn't going anywhere (I've made about 65 > fixes myself but this was already getting tiring Yeah, I was following wx Trac for some time. :-) > So right now I'm writing a generic C++ wrapper generator, not specific > to wxwidgets. Will it be usable for C libs as well? > I can still extract type info from doxygen xml (as long > as the xml was generated from actual header files unlike in > wxwidgets), but I've also added support for gccxml (the cvs version is > mostly up-to-date and it actually works for wxWidgets). I should be > able to add support for clang later on, by outputting its typeinfo to > xml. It sounds very good. > Since I've made the codegen generic enough it should be possible to > output swig interface files instead of directly generating code. I'll > experiment with this once I'm done with my own codegen feature. Interesting...I'm really curious to try it out. > Anyway I really have no idea whether I'll have wxWidgets bindings any > time soon but I think I'll put the code generator online in a few > weeks. Thank you very much. > Work is still in progress, need more time! Do you envision that your generator could be used for something like Qt as well? (Personally, I'm more inclined to wxWidgets due to its native look, but D is really starving with stable & maintained GUI bindings.) Sincerely, Gour -- From anger, complete delusion arises, and from delusion bewilderment of memory. When memory is bewildered, intelligence is lost, and when intelligence is lost one falls down again into the material pool. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: GitHub for Windows
On Fri, 25 May 2012 10:42:09 -0400 "Nick Sabalausky" wrote: > ??? Of *course* most Win7 users like Win7 better, the ones who don't > are XP users. Likewise, I can confidently say that a high majority of > users for XP like the old interface better than Win7. So I don't see > what that really means. > > But what I think *is* significant is that XP *continues* to be nearly > half the Windows market. If MS did such an _objectively_ good job on > Win7, then why did it create such a huge, lasting division among > Windows users? Here is something to make you a day. ;) http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/05/no-cost-desktop-software-development-is-dead-on-windows-8/ & http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/u3pqj/microsoft_pulling_free_development_tools_for/ Sincerely, Gour -- From wherever the mind wanders due to its flickering and unsteady nature, one must certainly withdraw it and bring it back under the control of the self. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: wxD bindings
On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:09:54 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: Hello Andrej, > They have a tool called ifacecheck which compares the xml files > generated by doxygen to the ones generated by using gccxml. I've used > gccxml before. I haven't used ifacecheck yet but I'll give it a run. just wonder if there are any news in regard to wxD bindings project? Sincerely, Gour -- Even if you are considered to be the most sinful of all sinners, when you are situated in the boat of transcendental knowledge you will be able to cross over the ocean of miseries. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: SCons, Linking and D
On Fri, 11 May 2012 10:06:52 +0200 Jacob Carlborg wrote: > Both GDC (gdmd) and LDC (ldmd) ship with a wrapper script that > emulates the DMD command lines. Is it really required for GDC & LDC to emulate DMD's command line or those scripts serve as poor-man's crutches only? Sincerely, Gour -- While contemplating the objects of the senses, a person develops attachment for them, and from such attachment lust develops, and from lust anger arises. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: SCons D support
On Thu, 10 May 2012 19:35:02 +0200 "David Nadlinger" wrote: > LDC packages unfortunately are in a sorry state right now – the > easiest way to get a working, up-to-date installation is probably > to just build it from Git (CMake required). The compiler binary > for D2 produced is called ldc2. Let me say that ldc is in the official 'community' repo of Archlinux. :-) Sincerely, Gour -- Perform your prescribed duty, for doing so is better than not working. One cannot even maintain one's physical body without work. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Lack of open source shown as negative part of D on Dr. Dobbs
On Thu, 10 May 2012 00:42:26 -0400 "Nick Sabalausky" wrote: > LDC would need to get their Windows support into a usable state for > that to happen. Last I checked (admittedly awhile ago), there didn't > seem to be any movement in that direction. I heard 3.1 is improving things and that should be soon... Sincerely, Gour -- As the embodied soul continuously passes, in this body, from boyhood to youth to old age, the soul similarly passes into another body at death. A sober person is not bewildered by such a change. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: An observation
On Tue, 01 May 2012 15:46:56 +0100 Russel Winder wrote: > This list often has threads that go to 300-400 contributions or more. > After about 20-25 contributions the topic completely changes and is > often completely unrelated to the subject. Quite quickly I think > TL;DR and so simply delete all future messages on that thread even > though this means more than likely missing good contributions. The > mis-match of subject and topic of the contained contribution is > impossible to deal with, so I think why bother? If people would > change the subject field and/or switch to a new thread with a new > subject, it would enable much easier appreciation of the content, and > hence more likely contribution. Very true. I also have to ignore such threads consuming too much time. Interestingly, the same point was today mentioned on #d and my observation is that among all the mailing lists which I follow (via Gmane), only wxwidgets-devel archive (which, btw, contains every comment from the tracker) is close in size to d.D. (wx-devel ~135K messages since year 2000 and d.D has ~160K messages since 2004). Sincerely, Gour -- It is far better to discharge one's prescribed duties, even though faultily, than another's duties perfectly. Destruction in the course of performing one's own duty is better than engaging in another's duties, for to follow another's path is dangerous. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: The Downfall of Imperative Programming
On Thu, 12 Apr 2012 15:14:37 +0200 "bearophile" wrote: > Haskell contains some ideas worth copying even in non-functional > languages (or in mixed languages as D). What do you miss in D from Haskell? Sincerely, Gour -- To deliver the pious and to annihilate the miscreants, as well as to reestablish the principles of religion, I Myself appear, millennium after millennium. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: The Downfall of Imperative Programming
On Thu, 12 Apr 2012 23:04:16 +1200 James Miller wrote: > I wish I could love Haskell, and for pure computer science, it's fine, > amazing even, but for real-world programming, it just doesn't cut it. > The concepts are too difficult and not explained well enough, code > rapidly becomes unreadable unless you maintain super-human discipline > and broken code is difficult to fix. I'm glad I'm not the only one arriving at the same conclusion. Sincerely, Gour -- To deliver the pious and to annihilate the miscreants, as well as to reestablish the principles of religion, I Myself appear, millennium after millennium. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: The Downfall of Imperative Programming
On Tue, 10 Apr 2012 21:02:03 +0100 Russel Winder wrote: > Hummm... the really core issue is whether the language supports tail > call optimization. Functional programming languages demand it, C, > C++, Java, Go, Python definitely don't have it, D... Isn't it because they have to use recursion instead of iteration? Sincerely, Gour -- As the ignorant perform their duties with attachment to results, the learned may similarly act, but without attachment, for the sake of leading people on the right path. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: The Downfall of Imperative Programming
On Tue, 10 Apr 2012 20:13:45 +0100 Russel Winder wrote: > The biggest problems with monads are that most imperative programmers > think they are some massive high magic that is incomprehensible to > mere mortals, and most functional programmers think they are simple > and that they understand them. Indeed. > If you get higher order functions, currying and partial evaluation, > then monads come naturally (*). I believe I got HoFs, currying & partial evolution, but maybe I was missing (*) In any case, as it is often said, I got a feeling that despite its potential cleanliness, the real-world Haskell code was not so readable. By deploying some coding discipline, we tend to believe that D can serve well as FP-language for the masses. :-) Sincerely, Gour -- When your intelligence has passed out of the dense forest of delusion, you shall become indifferent to all that has been heard and all that is to be heard. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: The Downfall of Imperative Programming
On Tue, 10 Apr 2012 20:19:13 +0200 "Paulo Pinto" wrote: > My favourite FP language is Haskell, but I doubt most "code > monkeys" will ever be able to grasp it, while impure ones are more > approachable in enterprise environments. That's right...I tried with Haskell, liked its syntax a lot, but was not sure I really grokked monads. Moreover, I lost few potential contributors because of insisting on Haskell. Now, I hope to get some of the FP features by using Haskell and have easier time not to think about unsafePerformIO & co. :-) Sincerely, Gour -- The senses, the mind and the intelligence are the sitting places of this lust. Through them lust covers the real knowledge of the living entity and bewilders him. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: The Downfall of Imperative Programming
On Tue, 10 Apr 2012 19:01:07 +0200 "bls" wrote: > GTK Then, D is better even in that regard. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- Whenever and wherever there is a decline in religious practice, O descendant of Bharata, and a predominant rise of irreligion — at that time I descend Myself. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: The Downfall of Imperative Programming
On Tue, 10 Apr 2012 18:06:37 +0200 Paulo Pinto wrote: > Scala, Clojure and Ocaml also do have quite industry support already. How does the GUI world of Ocaml look like? Sincerely, Gour -- According to the three modes of material nature and the work associated with them, the four divisions of human society are created by Me. And although I am the creator of this system, you should know that I am yet the nondoer, being unchangeable. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: The Downfall of Imperative Programming
On Mon, 09 Apr 2012 22:28:01 +0200 Mirko Pilger wrote: > i guess this might be of interest to some. Yes, it is...and I wonder if D's FP features are good enough? Author mentions D, but says:"...This is all good, but not enough..." Sincerely, Gour -- Everyone is forced to act helplessly according to the qualities he has acquired from the modes of material nature; therefore no one can refrain from doing something, not even for a moment. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D projects list
On Fri, 06 Apr 2012 13:24:35 +0400 Denis Shelomovskij wrote: > Why? I didn't say anything about TCP/IP - it can remain for a while :) Ahh, OK. ;) > And desktops now aren't in satisfactory state too. Documents are > zipped XML-files, Really? I use AsciiDoc/LaTeX/LyX for documents and those which are in XML (Gnucash, GNumeric,..) are unzipped: :-) Sincerely, Gour -- But a person free from all attachment and aversion and able to control his senses through regulative principles of freedom can obtain the complete mercy of the Lord. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D projects list
On Fri, 06 Apr 2012 12:34:09 +0400 Denis Shelomovskij wrote: > Because I believes HTML should die with all present web browsers and > JS. And XML because of its frighten overuse. And all slow and buggy > web apps. > And adobe Flash of course should also die. Interesting...but I just wonder what should remain alive? Back to the desktop only? Sincerely, Gour (not liking XML, JS, Flash...) -- Whenever and wherever there is a decline in religious practice, O descendant of Bharata, and a predominant rise of irreligion — at that time I descend Myself. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: IDE Support for D
On Fri, 06 Apr 2012 09:34:02 +0200 "Bernard Helyer" wrote: > Mono-D is my go to IDE. It supports completion and debugging, and > is cross-platform. Yeah, it looks nice, but I've managed to stay mono-free on my machine. :-) Sincerely, Gour -- Bewildered by the modes of material nature, the ignorant fully engage themselves in material activities and become attached. But the wise should not unsettle them, although these duties are inferior due to the performers' lack of knowledge. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: IDE Support for D
On Fri, 06 Apr 2012 06:20:27 +0200 "Maxim" wrote: > I prefer to use Codeblocks and i guess Visual D would be good on > Windows. Has D support for Codeblocks improved somewhat recently? Otherwise, I'm considering to use Geany and/or buy SublimeText2. Sincerely, Gour -- Even the intelligent are bewildered in determining what is action and what is inaction. Now I shall explain to you what action is, knowing which you shall be liberated from all misfortune. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D for a Qt developer
On Sun, 01 Apr 2012 12:12:43 +0200 "Davita" wrote: > Well, that's what i'm talking about. D is such a wonderful > language that it should scream on different forums and sites such > as stackoverflow or codeproject, but instead it's very quite, > passive. And I think this is due to the lack of quality > development tools. :( Well, Andrej is heavily working on new wxD...that's definitely something for C++, although not necessarily, Qt developer. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- There is no work that affects Me; nor do I aspire for the fruits of action. One who understands this truth about Me also does not become entangled in the fruitive reactions of work. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: How to use D for cross platform development?
On Thu, 29 Mar 2012 21:03:05 +0200 "Bennie Copeland" wrote: > Thanks for your help. My primary use case is to provide a native > look and feel GUI on the Mac. So, to the extent of creating the > interface using Cocoa and tying it back to the core code written > in D. Have you considered using wxD? New version on which Andrej is working at the moment will support wx-2.9.x/3.0 for which there is new Cocoa port. Sincerely, Gour -- There is no work that affects Me; nor do I aspire for the fruits of action. One who understands this truth about Me also does not become entangled in the fruitive reactions of work. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Premake support for D
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 13:57:50 +1100 Andrew Gough wrote: Hello Andrew, > The fork supports DMD, GDC, and LDC - but only for D2, and currently > only for (g)make. If anyone would like to add support for other > toolchains (MSVC/VisualD, Code::Blocks etc) that would be fantastic. I'm very happy seeing the prospect of having D support in premake which looks very clean and being of declarative nature. Now I wonder how difficult is to add support for other toolchains and asked about it on the mailing list where Jason replied with: "I did try to abstract out common functions between the C++ and C# support. The more data points I have to work with, the easier it will be to identify the areas that need more abstraction (and what it should look like)." Does adding such support involve only Lua skills? > I have successfully built my own projects and druntime/phobos with it > in the past, so I know it can work. I plan to start playing with it as soon as I finish some other non-D related tasks. Thank you for working on it. Sincerely, Gour -- But for one who takes pleasure in the self, whose human life is one of self-realization, and who is satisfied in the self only, fully satiated — for him there is no duty. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Ddoc as general documentation tool
On Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:55:40 -0500 Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: > DDoc has two main assets: (a) it understands D structures, e.g. you > can use it to document D APIs, and (b) it highlights D code nicely. Yeah, that's anticpated usage of it. > More specialized tools that have a focus on document formatting have > naturally an advantage over DDoc for general-purpose documentation. After some research, it seems that the best is to use Ddoc for documenting our code and library, while leaving the rest to the specialized tool (we're heading towards AsciiDoc). Sincerely, Gour -- What is night for all beings is the time of awakening for the self-controlled; and the time of awakening for all beings is night for the introspective sage. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Understanding Templates: why can't anybody do it?
On Sun, 18 Mar 2012 11:04:45 +0100 Paulo Pinto wrote: > Enterprise software? Not here, we'll write open-source project. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- All living bodies subsist on food grains, which are produced from rains. Rains are produced by performance of yajña [sacrifice], and yajña is born of prescribed duties. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Ddoc as general documentation tool (was Re: DDoc and logically structured HTML)
On Sun, 11 Mar 2012 01:08:20 + Stewart Gordon wrote: > Has anybody else got further with getting logical HTML out of DDoc? > Have you been using DDoc to generate some internal format and then > some other program to turn it into HTML, or what? Excuse me for jumping into the thread, but I hope it's relevant... I wonder whether you can recommend using Ddoc for writing general-purpose documentation like user's manual for e.g. application written in D which has to be split into logical parts (chapters, sections,...) as well as use hyperlinking, addding pictures, tables etc.? Or do you believe it's better to use more specialized tool like reST markup with Sphinx, AsciiDoc, LaTeX/LyX...? Let me add that we'd like to have nice HTML output which can be invoked within application itself as well as quaility output in the form of PDF file. Sincerely, Gour -- One who is not connected with the Supreme can have neither transcendental intelligence nor a steady mind, without which there is no possibility of peace. And how can there be any happiness without peace? http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: SCons support for D
On Mon, 19 Mar 2012 11:21:41 +0200 Manu wrote: > Can I see your changes anywhere? I have a premake based project > infrastructure that I'd like to incorporate some D code into. https://bitbucket.org/goughy/premake-dev-d Sincerely, Gour -- One is understood to be in full knowledge whose every endeavor is devoid of desire for sense gratification. He is said by sages to be a worker for whom the reactions of work have been burned up by the fire of perfect knowledge. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Understanding Templates: why can't anybody do it?
On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 15:39:53 -0700 "H. S. Teoh" wrote: > I don't think you can discard OOP entirely. It still has its place > IMO. When you need runtime polymorphism, OOP is still the best tool > for the job. Hmm, if we want to write more FP-like type-safe code, I wonder how much we'd need runtime polymorphism at all? Sincerely, Gour -- Never was there a time when I did not exist, nor you, nor all these kings; nor in the future shall any of us cease to be. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Understanding Templates: why can't anybody do it?
On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 21:29:18 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: > I had no idea what templates were when I started using D, and I > thought I would never need to use them either. But now I use them > extensively. They really become a natural tool in programming. They're > so nice to use that I never have to reach for the big fat OOP monster, > I can just write simple procedural code and use templates when I need > some flexibility. Thank you for this paragraph. ;) I also consider to write procedural/functional code in my project and leave OOP behind, so it's nice to know that templates are the way to go. Sincerely, Gour -- The work of a man who is unattached to the modes of material nature and who is fully situated in transcendental knowledge merges entirely into transcendence. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: automated C++ binding generation.. Booost D, NO , Not us. SIMD is more important.
On Sat, 17 Mar 2012 02:29:26 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: > Sorry for the long wait. Turns out I was *extremely* wrong about this. > Generating the D side turned out to be a hell of a lot more work then > I initially thought (mostly due to C++ and D type incompatibilities > and scoping issues). Huh, Murphy in action? > So now I'm starting to work on wxc generation again. Once that's done, > I have to test linking between wxd and wxc. Then, I have to fix any > runtime segfaults I might run into (there's bound to be a few codegen > issues). Once I have a few wxD samples working on the major platforms, > I'll release an alpha of wxD (+ the codegenerator) and then we can > start testing the library more thoroughly before any official release. Although we're still swamped into non-D computer issues, we'll find the time to be tester of your alpha release. Thank you, again, for your hard work! Sincerely, Gour -- O chastiser of the enemy, the sacrifice performed in knowledge is better than the mere sacrifice of material possessions. After all, O son of Pṛthā, all sacrifices of work culminate in transcendental knowledge. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Roadmap (was Re: Breaking backwards compatiblity)
On Fri, 09 Mar 2012 14:32:58 -0800 Walter Bright wrote: Dear Walter, > This is why we need to have a VERY high bar for breaking changes. I agree with your statement above, but, personally, not having legacy D code to take care about I'm leaving it to more expertt users here to discuss, but I'm more concerned with another thing and that is roadmap. It would be nice if D would have some kind of roadmap with several milestones so that users can have some rough (it's not required that milestones are carved in stone) idea when to expect that some things will be fixed and/or new features added/implemented. Sincerely, Gour` -- As the embodied soul continuously passes, in this body, from boyhood to youth to old age, the soul similarly passes into another body at death. A sober person is not bewildered by such a change. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: NNTP rules, news.digitalmars.com sucks
On Wed, 7 Mar 2012 07:59:10 -0800 "H. S. Teoh" wrote: > ROTFLMAO!!! That would certainly be the day, when D forums can lay > claims to being the largest NNTP community online. That would be when > D takes over the world. :D Well, at the moment digitalmars.D is the biggest newsgroup (number of messages) which I follow with wxwidgets-devel being the 2nd one. Sincerely, Gour -- All the liberated souls in ancient times acted with this understanding of My transcendental nature. Therefore you should perform your duty, following in their footsteps. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: NNTP rules, news.digitalmars.com sucks
On Tue, 06 Mar 2012 11:30:00 +0100 "Vladimir Panteleev" wrote: > That only means you don't post enough ;) OK, I'll try to improve. ;) > (An alternative explanation might be that your client might be > placing the message in the outbox and retrying automatically in > the background.) Claws informs me when not being able to post and when it puts message in a queue. Sincerely, Gour -- Thus the wise living entity's pure consciousness becomes covered by his eternal enemy in the form of lust, which is never satisfied and which burns like fire. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: NNTP rules, news.digitalmars.com sucks
On Mon, 05 Mar 2012 17:33:24 -0500 "Steven Schveighoffer" wrote: > Is this a common problem with news servers? Is there some way to fix > this? I regularly post to news groups from my mailer (Claws) and never had a single problem like you quoted above. Sincerely, Gour -- Those persons who execute their duties according to My injunctions and who follow this teaching faithfully, without envy, become free from the bondage of fruitive actions. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: A better way to manage discussions?
On Sun, 4 Mar 2012 09:04:33 -0800 "H. S. Teoh" wrote: > But that's just me... most people don't agree with that. :-) Do they agree with you or not, the fact is that forum software cannot approach functionality of email/nntp. Sincerely, Gour -- There are principles to regulate attachment and aversion pertaining to the senses and their objects. One should not come under the control of such attachment and aversion, because they are stumbling blocks on the path of self-realization. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Poll of the week: main OS and compiler
On Thu, 01 Mar 2012 21:26:59 +0100 Jacob Carlborg wrote: > Why bundle Linux and FreeBSD in one option? To make it harder for Windows to win. :-} Sincerely, Gour -- The spirit soul bewildered by the influence of false ego thinks himself the doer of activities that are in actuality carried out by the three modes of material nature. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: FP in D (today)
On Thu, 23 Feb 2012 10:45:38 -0800 Walter Bright wrote: > The main issue with FP in D today is it needs to be pervasively used > in Phobos. A large part of Phobos should be marked as pure, but is > not, making it difficult to use Phobos from FP code. Heh, that's interesting... > For example, Object.opEquals should be pure, nothrow, @safe. This is scheduled for the next release? > The inheriting purity thing helps significantly with that. Good...we're enthusiastic to put FP's in D on the severe test...hoping to use D as 'the world's most practical FP language'. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- But those who, out of envy, disregard these teachings and do not follow them are to be considered bereft of all knowledge, befooled, and ruined in their endeavors for perfection. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
FP in D (today)
Hello! After posting about "how to resolve "object-relational impedance mismatch" using D" dilemma, I did some more homework and today finally (after being advised in sqlite group) went through The Vietnam of Computer Science (http://blogs.tedneward.com/2006/06/26/The+Vietnam+Of+Computer+Science.aspx) which confirmed that for our application the best course of action is to forget about any attempt to fix mismtach between relational and object-oriented model by using ORM and to simply skip OOP code in our application and focus more towards FP. Interestingly enough, here is intriguing sentence in the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Functional_programming article stating: "Among imperative programming languages, the D programming language's solid support for functional programming stands out." so I'm curious if anyone more experienced with using FP paradigm in D can comment what works nicely and is there anything important missing in today's implementation of D? Sincerely, Gour -- Everyone is forced to act helplessly according to the qualities he has acquired from the modes of material nature; therefore no one can refrain from doing something, not even for a moment. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: how to resolve "object-relational impedance mismatch" using D
On Wed, 22 Feb 2012 19:46:59 +0100 "Kagamin" wrote: > Application spec is one thing, ORM spec is another. Sure. Considering that there are no ORM for D, afaik, I'm interested what would be wise to do in D, in a genaral case when one has relational data model: a) usee OOP in D and try to write/use some ORM to solve impedance problem b) use relational model and (probably) just write procedural code c) attempt to write more FP code which might be better marriage between relational model and the code or d) something else? If you believe that the answer is too dependant on the application spec, I might provide it, but wanted to spare the audience from many possibly not relevant details. Sincerely, Gour -- Therefore, without being attached to the fruits of activities, one should act as a matter of duty, for by working without attachment one attains the Supreme. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
how to resolve "object-relational impedance mismatch" using D
Hello! We're considering what would be the optimal way way to resolve "object-relational impedance mismatch" problem in our application which we would like to write using D language. Considering it's planned to be multi-platform desktop GUI app and have extensive research capabilities available for learning & studying purposes - it means to be able to put queries against the whole database of available data - we are thinking that using embedded database - sqlite3 - as application's natural storage format would be a nice fit. Sqlite3 offers robust format available for multiple platforms. Moreover, having RDBMS could greatly simplify the code handling all kinds of queries againsta the data which would be required to write otherwise. Otoh, here we come to the well-known "object-relational impedance mismatch" problem and wonder how to resolve it, iow.: a) we are not aware of any ORM available for D, so using relational data model + D with its OOP paradigm, means to resolve the mismatch by hand by writing required ORM b) use relational model "as it is", leave OOP (in D) behind, but we wonder whether such approach makes sense in the language which is higher-level than C. (E.g. Fossil SCM written in C uses sqlite3 as storage format.) c) several papers/posts which we read before and recently (like "Functional-Relational Impedance Match" Eric Meijer's The Confessions of a Used Programming Language Salesman) tend to suggest that using relational data model goes better with FP languages or that the latters can overcome the above mismatch problem better, which would lead to putting D's FP capabilites to extreme or d) something else? I can provide more details about the nature of the problem or application's specification if required, but we also wonder how to resolve it in general using D which advertises as "offers classic polymorphism, value semantics, functional style, generics, generative programing, contract programming, and more — all harmoniously integrated"? Sincerely, Gour -- One who restrains his senses, keeping them under full control, and fixes his consciousness upon Me, is known as a man of steady intelligence. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: automated C++ binding generation.. Booost D, NO , Not us. SIMD is more important.
On Wed, 15 Feb 2012 15:53:32 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: > 55 left. This is the harder part now since most of these left are > interface mismatches and not codegenerator bugs. As you can see I've > started filing reports with patches: All glory to you! I see that you're pushing constant stream of tickets to wx's Trac and many of them are even getting fixed. It seems that at the end, besides getting wxC & wxD, that even wxWidgets project itself will be greatly benefitted. My heartfelt gratitude for your work, Andrej. Sincerely, Gour -- One who is not connected with the Supreme can have neither transcendental intelligence nor a steady mind, without which there is no possibility of peace. And how can there be any happiness without peace? http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
wxD bindings (was Re: automated C++ binding generation.. Booost D, NO , Not us. SIMD is more important.)
On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 20:45:06 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: > 542 classes are successfully generated (and buildable). 132+ are left > to go. Great! > I've ran into a few issues where the interface files (from which the > xml is built) are not in sync with the code. So there might be missing > types definitions, or wrong types in methods, etc. But these can be > worked around by adding extra type definitions in the generator (IOW > there's no need to manually touch the .cpp files by hand). I saw your messages in wx-dev and wonder what will be the way to keep those files in sync or, at least, detect there are inconsistencies? > So wxc won't be done by this week, but it's progressing pretty good so > far. Stay tuned.. All the best!! Sincerely, Gour -- Whatever action a great man performs, common men follow. And whatever standards he sets by exemplary acts, all the world pursues. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: automated C++ binding generation.. Booost D, NO , Not us. SIMD is more important.
On Mon, 6 Feb 2012 12:06:44 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: > I'm working on this around the clock. If everything goes ok I might > have the wxc wrapper done by the end of the week, but I'm not making > any promises. Thank you very much for your efforts!! > I'd ask for a little bit of patience! Thanks. :) No problem. We've all the patience of the world. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- The spirit soul bewildered by the influence of false ego thinks himself the doer of activities that are in actuality carried out by the three modes of material nature. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Opinion of February 2012
On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 17:17:28 -0500 "Nick Sabalausky" wrote: > I thought Git was supposed to be able to intelligently handle > moved/renamed files? So shouldn't fixing those pull requests amount > to "pull, possibly fix merge conflicts, push" just like with any > other upstream change? I thought the same and believe that Hg can do it properly. Sincerely, Gour -- One who is not connected with the Supreme can have neither transcendental intelligence nor a steady mind, without which there is no possibility of peace. And how can there be any happiness without peace? http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: indent style for D
On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 12:21:35 +0100 Alex Rønne Petersen wrote: > Phobos generally uses 4-space indentation. That is mentioned in the style-guide, but I'm curious about bracing, iow, GNUstyle, K&R, ANSI...? Sincerely, Gour -- The working senses are superior to dull matter; mind is higher than the senses; intelligence is still higher than the mind; and he [the soul] is even higher than the intelligence. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
indent style for D
Hello! It was mentioned in #D that gdc will probably adapt its code to GNU code style and I wonder, seeing no recemmendation in http://www.d-programming-language.org/dstyle.html in regard to indent-style, can someone shed some light what is recommended practice for it within D community? Sincerely, Gour -- What is night for all beings is the time of awakening for the self-controlled; and the time of awakening for all beings is night for the introspective sage. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: automated C++ binding generation.. Booost D, NO , Not us. SIMD is more important.
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 16:12:57 +0100 Jacob Carlborg wrote: > That doesn't stop others to work on DWT :) Of course, but we don't need new forces joining & forking. Sincerely, Gour -- As fire is covered by smoke, as a mirror is covered by dust, or as the embryo is covered by the womb, the living entity is similarly covered by different degrees of this lust. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: automated C++ binding generation.. Booost D, NO , Not us. SIMD is more important.
On Sat, 28 Jan 2012 12:14:12 +0100 equi...@atw.hu wrote: > I just wonder dwt(http://www.dsource.org/projects/dwt) is not good > enough? Well, I prefer wx over SWT and besides that, Jacob said he has other & higher priorities at the moment besides working on DWT. Sincerely, Gour -- While contemplating the objects of the senses, a person develops attachment for them, and from such attachment lust develops, and from lust anger arises. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: automated C++ binding generation.. Booost D, NO , Not us. SIMD is more important.
On Fri, 27 Jan 2012 10:29:43 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: > I appreciate the enthusiasm, but I think it should be toned down a > bit. At this stage this work is pretty insignificant compared to all > the work on e.g. improving DMD. I'm aware that the folks working on improving/fixing DMD is doing terrific job, but in one sense this is kind of work that new D user could take as granted based on the premise that 'it should just work as described in e.g. TDPL'. Otoh, your work is extending usability of D to be used for writing real-world GUI applications and we cannot say how many people may abandon the idea to use D just by seeing the present state of many half-baked GUI bindings *before* even stumbling upon some DMD bugs. Let's not forget that today the language itself does not mean much without 'batteries included' and the whole ecosystem inckluding IDE/editors suppor, build systems etc. So, I would not minimize the fact to get stable/actively_developed/easily_maintained bindings for native multi-platform GUI toolkit. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- All living bodies subsist on food grains, which are produced from rains. Rains are produced by performance of yajña [sacrifice], and yajña is born of prescribed duties. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: automated C++ binding generation.. Booost D, NO , Not us. SIMD is more important.
On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 23:18:10 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: > Anyway, the XML parsing script is done and I've verified it has the > same output as the php script. This thing parsed about 1400 xml files, > so I don't see any issues with parsing doxygen xml files with a > lightweight xml lib, at least not for wxWidgets. The next step is to > port the generator scripts. I'll make updates as progress continues. Andrej, you're the bearer of the best D-news these days. Congrats!!! Sincerely, Gour -- One who is not disturbed in mind even amidst the threefold miseries or elated when there is happiness, and who is free from attachment, fear and anger, is called a sage of steady mind. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: DStep
On Thu, 26 Jan 2012 07:19:27 -0800 bls wrote: > Sorry for my ignorance but why should one use DStep instead of htod > in order to port plain vanilla C headers ? I have to admit that I > haven't tried DStep yet. Excuse me for my ignorance about DStep, but htod is Windows-only. Sincerely, Gour -- A person who has given up all desires for sense gratification, who lives free from desires, who has given up all sense of proprietorship and is devoid of false ego — he alone can attain real peace. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: automated C++ binding generation.. Booost D, NO , Not us. SIMD is more important.
On Wed, 25 Jan 2012 22:38:58 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: Hello Andrej, > Yesterday I've started working on xml parsing instead (using Vladimir > Panteelev's xml library) and now I have a full script that parses wx > doxygen files in pretty much the same way as the wxPhp script > (although the syntax is much nicer to work with). You're my hero!!! > I'm now in the process of testing the entire output to verify that > I've parsed the xml files correctly and loaded all the info in the > same way as wxPhp's xml script (basically I'm going to do some printf > diffs). I am swamped with some other work with these days, but when you'll have something to share, I'd like to help by, at least, some testing. > Once that is done I can begin working on porting the source_maker > script (obviously I can skip the Json part altogether since I have the > structures in memory already). Thanks to you, it looks as D community could get nice bindings to do real GUI programming, thank you very much. Sincerely, Gour -- As fire is covered by smoke, as a mirror is covered by dust, or as the embryo is covered by the womb, the living entity is similarly covered by different degrees of this lust. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: automated C++ binding generation.. Booost D, NO , Not us. SIMD is more important.
On Wed, 25 Jan 2012 11:26:34 -0800 bls wrote: > wxWidgets in 2.9.3 has closed the gap to QT. (webkit, f.i.) The > documentation is also very close to what QT has to offer thanks to > Doxygen. Let's hope 3.0 will polish it even further. > I wonder how much sense it would make to port the PHP > parser/codegenerator source (wxPHP) into python. You mean instead of porting to D (work done by Andrej)? > At least it should result in : More readable code, xml instead of > shitty json intermediate output for the D codegerator. For what would you use XML output? > Of couse I would be nice to use D. But the XML files are simply to > big to do DOM parsing. XPATH is required. I believe that our needs for DOM/XPATH parsing are not so big. :-) > Last thing. BCDGEN is using libxml2 to generate D code. and BCDGen > was the tool to created the libxml2 wrapper. Eat your own Dog food. Whatever tool can be made to help bind wx would be great...and considering there are some bindings for Sqlite3 (which, anyway, shoould not be too hard), we'd be satisfied to plunge into D project. :-) Finally, I hope that those of us interested to see active wxD project will be be smart-enough working together to overcome NiH syndrome. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- Whatever action a great man performs, common men follow. And whatever standards he sets by exemplary acts, all the world pursues. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: automated C++ binding generation.. Booost D, NO , Not us. SIMD is more important.
On Wed, 25 Jan 2012 10:44:43 -0800 bls wrote: > Unfortunately I am not a student anymore instead I am a unhappy tax > payer. Same here. > To fulfill my Job I need GUI,RIA(WEB), Database and XML(SOAP) > support. I need GUI & Database support, but not for the job, but for a kind-of hobby (open-source) project. > In other words the D language is already offering more than we > need,could be an option, but the library situation is a disaster. /mer nods > wxWidgets. Do you really care about wrapped vs native library ? I don't. > Do you think that the D community will ever be able to create a > wxWidgets comparable native D lib. while not being able to spend some > time in creating a binding generator ? i Not soon. > I would be glad to have such bindings ! After researching a lot, I believe that wxWidgets is the best solution for multi-platform development and I'll try to help as much as possible those people trying to make it happen. Sinvcerely, Gour -- A self-realized man has no purpose to fulfill in the discharge of his prescribed duties, nor has he any reason not to perform such work. Nor has he any need to depend on any other living being. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: binding tool for C libs
On Wed, 25 Jan 2012 02:27:24 +0400 Denis Shelomovskij wrote: > Anyway, looks like that isn't the problem I'm trying to solve. I > don't accenting on parsing C code (it's done in Function.__ctor and > is obvious). The problem is to generate fast wrapper when we already > know full function signature. OK. C2Hs wants to solve problem of writing bindings for C libraries by avoiding to learn some new IDL and provide all the tools in hosted langauge (Haskell) by offering some hooks to tailor higher-level API for bindings taking advantage of hosted language (e.g. GC instead of doing manual memory allocation). I also believe that just wrapping C library and using C API is not enough if we want to take advantage of e.g. SafeD's features. Sincerely, -- But those who, out of envy, disregard these teachings and do not follow them are to be considered bereft of all knowledge, befooled, and ruined in their endeavors for perfection. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: A modest proposal
On Mon, 23 Jan 2012 19:52:27 -0700 Brad Anderson wrote: > Jonathan, Swiftly closing them is causing real pain for some of us. > Certainly he could fix them and keep a log of the ones he fixed then > actually close, say, 3 a day on bugzilla so it wouldn't be so noisy. My suggestion is that Walter & co. should write a simple app which would parse IRC logs in the past few years and anaylize what are the critical hours in the channel when there is traffic peak and then to adjust their time of closing bugs appropriately. Maybe, some pre-message could be generated by bot to warn in advance all the IRC users that "we expect that in 5minutes the channel will be bombed by the flood of closing bug reports, so it's a good time to make a short break (toilet, snack, light drink...)". Of course we know that without introducing penalty fees for those who break the rule, nothing can really happen... Sincerely, Gour -- A self-realized man has no purpose to fulfill in the discharge of his prescribed duties, nor has he any reason not to perform such work. Nor has he any need to depend on any other living being. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: binding tool for C libs
On Mon, 23 Jan 2012 20:49:09 +0100 Jacob Carlborg wrote: > Yes, Clang handles C, C++, Objective-C and Objective-C++. That would be life-saver for language-bindings developers!! Sincerely, Gour -- There are principles to regulate attachment and aversion pertaining to the senses and their objects. One should not come under the control of such attachment and aversion, because they are stumbling blocks on the path of self-realization. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: binding tool for C libs
On Mon, 23 Jan 2012 15:32:10 +0100 Jacob Carlborg wrote: > I think the best idea is to create a tool that generates bindings > using Clang. That's also what I'm slowly working on. Could Clang be used for both C & C++ bindings? Sincerely, Gour -- Those persons who execute their duties according to My injunctions and who follow this teaching faithfully, without envy, become free from the bondage of fruitive actions. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: binding tool for C libs
On Sun, 22 Jan 2012 22:03:08 +0400 Denis Shelomovskij wrote: > I'm finishing a fast (I just don't see a faster way) and garbage-free > CTFE-capable wrapper. But it requires IDL to be written for every C > function. I'm curious if you have read the following paper: http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~chak/papers/Cha99b.html describing C2Hs tool used to provide bindings for C libraries for Haskell? From the abstract: "The tool obtains information about the C data type definitions and function signatures by analysing the C header files of the library. It uses this information to compute the missing details in the template of a Haskell module that implements a Haskell binding to the C library. Hooks embedded in the binding file signal where, which, and how C objects are accessed from Haskell. The Haskell code in the binding file determines Haskell type signatures and marshaling details. The approach is lightweight and does not require an extra interface description language." Sincerely, Gour -- The senses, the mind and the intelligence are the sitting places of this lust. Through them lust covers the real knowledge of the living entity and bewilders him. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: binding tool for C libs
On Sun, 22 Jan 2012 22:03:08 +0400 Denis Shelomovskij wrote: > I'm finishing a fast (I just don't see a faster way) and garbage-free > CTFE-capable wrapper. But it requires IDL to be written for every C > function. Interesting...otoh, I found out that htod tool is out being available for Windows only. :-( Will take a look at your tool as well as at SWIG. Our Bindings needs for C are quite modest... Sincerely, Gour -- But a person free from all attachment and aversion and able to control his senses through regulative principles of freedom can obtain the complete mercy of the Lord. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: wxWidgets doxygen binding creation.
On Sun, 22 Jan 2012 19:38:42 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: > The php generator creates a C API that's built into a DLL and a php > OOP wrapper. It looks as wonderful base to build upon it in 'phase-2'. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- One who is not connected with the Supreme can have neither transcendental intelligence nor a steady mind, without which there is no possibility of peace. And how can there be any happiness without peace? http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: wxWidgets doxygen binding creation.
On Sun, 22 Jan 2012 20:00:06 +0100 torhu wrote: > It's also a great benefit to be able to rely on wxWidgets' available > examples and documentation, which might outweigh most benefits you > can get by improving or D-ifying the API. Adding more convenient > ways of doing things on top of the existing API should be fine, > though. I believe it's possible to D-ify C++ API so that it's still easy to consult original wx docs as well as have nice higher-level API. At least, it is possible in e.g. wxhaskell... Sincerely, Gour -- It is far better to discharge one's prescribed duties, even though faultily, than another's duties perfectly. Destruction in the course of performing one's own duty is better than engaging in another's duties, for to follow another's path is dangerous. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: wxWidgets doxygen binding creation.
On Sat, 21 Jan 2012 22:29:51 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: Hello Andrej, > I'm porting the JSON scripts first. There are already JSON dumps that > the php script makes, so I'd like to take advantage of that. Making a > 1to1 port is crucial so I don't introduce any bugs (that php scripts > creates 500_000 lines of php!). Then I could start tweaking with the > code generator functions to see how D code can be generated instead of > php code. What do you think or feel, in general, is this approach doable and can produce good-quality wxD bindings? Using Doxygen output, probably takes care of wrapping C API only, while there would still be work to produce higher-level bindings in the sporit of D language, right? Sincerely, Gour -- But a person free from all attachment and aversion and able to control his senses through regulative principles of freedom can obtain the complete mercy of the Lord. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
binding tool for C libs
Hello! We have a need to bind smaller to medium-size C library and would like to provide more D-ish or higher-level bindings than just wrapper over C code. E.g. the C function looks like: int swe_calc_ut ( double tjd_ut, int ipl, int iflag, double* xx, char* serr) and we would like to e.g. use exception to handle errors instead of checking return value and fill 'char* serr' or store the result of 6-field 'double* xx' array in some data structure etc. Afaics, htod is more suitable for just wrapping C code, so I wonder if there is something else you can recommend besides SWIG? Sincerely, Gour -- The working senses are superior to dull matter; mind is higher than the senses; intelligence is still higher than the mind; and he [the soul] is even higher than the intelligence. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: wxWidgets doxygen binding creation.
On Fri, 20 Jan 2012 22:09:48 +0100 Andrej Mitrovic wrote: > I began porting those php scripts to D since yesterday. They are well > documented and modularized so I think it's worth having a go at it. > Oddly enough I've cloned the wxPhp svn repo yesterday without even > knowing they've just merged these new changes in at the same time. Thank you for this work...I must admit I wasn't eve naware there is wxPhp project since this thread today. > You've mentioned those python swig generators. I don't know the state > of those, but I really doubt that SWIG support for D is mature enough > for such a huge project. Still, it would be worth exploring that route, right?...and ask for more D support? > Additionally wxPython uses SWIG, and SWIG > supports Python for many years now, but even so the wxPython author > wants to move away from SWIG and use doxygen or some other alternative > instead. See: http://wiki.wxpython.org/ProjectPhoenix/ProjectGoals I > also took a look at wxPython's SWIG interface files and it's *a lot* > of code and workarounds. Yeah, that's true. Robert wants to use SIP and he told me there is lot of hand-written code for SWIG. However, let's not forget that wxPython is also,afaik, offering higher-level (aka Pythonic) interface to wx, so I bet we would like to have same with wxD, right? > So I'm trying to port those php scripts and see if it's usable for D. > When I have some scripts done I'll put them on github somewhere. Thank you very much! > Of course I'm not stopping anyone else from doing the same.. At the moment, I do not have much time to do anything with (wx)D, even not much with computers, but we hope it will change in a few weeks. Sincerely, Gour -- As a strong wind sweeps away a boat on the water, even one of the roaming senses on which the mind focuses can carry away a man's intelligence. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: wxWidgets good news
On Fri, 20 Jan 2012 06:10:20 -0800 bls wrote: > Which wxWidget Version ? > IMO at least 2.9x to avoid the UNICODE - non UNICODE stress. Probably > 2.9.4 is the best choice (doxygen wise) which will arrive AFAIK in > February. I agree. > How to setup the project ? just the modified Python scripts and some > docs? Dunno. wxD is now at github, so there is possibility to fork it...personally I prefer hg over git, but can try to use hg-git for the sake of wxD. :-) Sincerely, Gour -- Bewildered by the modes of material nature, the ignorant fully engage themselves in material activities and become attached. But the wise should not unsettle them, although these duties are inferior due to the performers' lack of knowledge. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: wxWidgets good news
On Fri, 20 Jan 2012 03:24:19 -0800 bls wrote: > Hi, it seems that the idea of using doxygen xml output to generate D > bindings was not that bad. I am pretty happy to see that exactly this > happens in wxWidgets 2.9.4, Thank you very much for the news!! > Generating C functional wrappers is already pretty cool, but the > fantastic news is SWIG output! As you may have noticed, SWIG has D > support. Means : No need to manually re-create C++ classes in D. Let's see how it would influence wxD. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- Those who are on this path are resolute in purpose, and their aim is one. O beloved child of the Kurus, the intelligence of those who are irresolute is many-branched. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Biggest Issue with D - Definition and Versioning
On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 16:41:28 -0800 "Adam Wilson" wrote: > Harsh as it sounds I'd ignore them, what they are really asking for > is for you to stop working on everything else and work on their > feature. Doing that is planning to fail. Right. Workers are out at the construction site and although they are capable to build big scycrapers, there is need to provide basic facilities for them in order they can start doing useful work. Then when they prove that it's possible to build something useful, more investments can be made to extend the scope. At the moment, D is to risky to invest in it for commercial agents, so open-source projects seems to be nice fit. For a long time, GHC was practically the only serious project done (not 100% in Haskell (later Darcs appeared on the scene), what we have to show as written in D2? As mentioned in another thread, D with its features for paralleism, FP-stuff etc. *could be* very attractive as general programming language suitable for those imperative programmers which cannot easily grok monads and wants to take advantage of their multi-core CPUs idling at the moment. So, as Adam wrote, let's provide rounded feature set which works so that, at least, (open-source) projects can write D2 code today, possibly without too much sacrifice. :-) Sincerely, Gour -- A person who has given up all desires for sense gratification, who lives free from desires, who has given up all sense of proprietorship and is devoid of false ego — he alone can attain real peace. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Biggest Issue with D - Definition and Versioning
On Mon, 16 Jan 2012 20:32:40 -0800 Walter Bright wrote: > Your other ideas are well considered, but I have to take issue with > this one. OK. > 4. I think we've had great success using Github and allowing anyone > to fork & fix & publish. I apologize for my (poor) attempt to illustrate Adrei's "Otherwise, we must show people that we are serious about finishing the core language implementation, that we make promises that we are able to keep, and that we make plans that we follow even in the broadest strokes." and my post was in no way trying to minimize community work when handling bug reports. At the end, I never submitted even the single bug report, so it wouldn't be fair to criticize it. My example was just meant to show what might be the result when one feels that developers are not behind their product in a sense that one 'cannot count on the project' which was supposed to be continuation on my "we always get the feedback it's not safe investment of our time & energy and it would be better to use something else, either C(++), Java, Scala, Python etc." So, I highly admire the work of all members within D community giving something valuable for free, but being interested in success of D, I wanted to share my experience I have when trying to advocate using of D for real (open-source) projects *today*. I'll try to be more sensitive next time... Sincerely, Gour -- What is night for all beings is the time of awakening for the self-controlled; and the time of awakening for all beings is night for the introspective sage. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Biggest Issue with D - Definition and Versioning
On Sun, 15 Jan 2012 15:57:27 -0500 "Nick Sabalausky" wrote: > It doesn't matter if *you've* identified game dev as a market you > care about: D *is already* a gamedev language. And gamedev is already > an *ideal* audience for D to target. Then it would be nice if the gamedev industry could identify D as gamedev language as well and pour some $s, €s...to support/speed up development, but I wonder why it does not happen. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- Bewildered by the modes of material nature, the ignorant fully engage themselves in material activities and become attached. But the wise should not unsettle them, although these duties are inferior due to the performers' lack of knowledge. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Biggest Issue with D - Definition and Versioning
On Sun, 15 Jan 2012 18:23:38 -0600 Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: > Again: if D is a hobby we have, all's great. Otherwise, we must show > people that we are serious about finishing the core language > implementation, that we make promises that we are able to keep, and > that we make plans that we follow even in the broadest strokes. If we > want to play with the big boys, we need to change the way we approach > planning and organization quite drastically. Thank you Andrei for this post...it's the essence of the problem!! Playing with compiler & language features, running some (artificial) benchmarks to compare with other languages etc. is nice for a hobby project and may attract hobby programmers, but making language & 8its ecoysstem attractive for serious projects is not so easy. Whenever we mention D as the language for our project, we always get the feedback it's not safe investment of our time & energy and it would be better to use something else, either C(++), Java, Scala, Python etc. Recently I was evaluating one CMS written in one popular Python framework and after reporting bug which makes it unusable for even simple page layout, hearing nothing from the developer and then seeing it's fixed after more than two months, it was not difficult to abandon idea to base our sites on such a product. This is one of the comments I got in Oct '10 when asking at SO: "Based on this i lost all hope that D has enough developers to be a save language pick for a company doing a larger mission critical application. You will fight with the tool chain and even pray to go back to C++ often." I know that many things improved in D, but the question remains how much the public opinion is channging? (I know that users still speak about lighttpd leaking memory, and it's not easy to get rid of it.) Sincerely, Gour -- The working senses are superior to dull matter; mind is higher than the senses; intelligence is still higher than the mind; and he [the soul] is even higher than the intelligence. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Biggest Issue with D - Definition and Versioning
On Sat, 14 Jan 2012 21:31:14 -0600 Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: > In the latter case: > > 1. SIMD is not the top of the list. Two weeks ago it wasn't _on_ the > list. Now it's like the last 'copter outta Saigon. > > 2. We haven't identified game designers as a core market, and one > that's more important than e.g. general purpose programmers who need > the like of working qualifiers, multithreading, and shared libraries. > > 3. There was never a promise or even a mention that we'll deliver > SIMD. We virtually promise we deliver threads and expressive > qualifiers, and there's still work to do on that. > > 4. There was broad agreement that the main foci going forward would > be quality, expressive qualifiers, shared libraries, Phobos work, and > publicizing the language. We can't work with and publicize D's > awesome concurrency design if parts of it aren't implemented. > > 5. The SIMD work has _zero_ acceleration on existing code; it only > allows experts to write non-portable code that uses SIMD > instructions. Updating to the next release of dmd has zero > SIMD-related benefit to statistically our entire user base. Very nicely put together. Thank you for that. > Walter and I spend hours on the phone discussing strategies and > tactics to make D more successful. And then comes this binge. Doing > anything on SIMD now is a mistake that I am sorry I was unable to > stop. About the only thing that's good about it all is that it'll be > over soon. It looks as some of the GTD wisdom to choose the rigt NextActions would be beneficial in D community. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- Everyone is forced to act helplessly according to the qualities he has acquired from the modes of material nature; therefore no one can refrain from doing something, not even for a moment. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: wxC & wxD (aka: let's work together with wxhaskell project)
On Thu, 12 Jan 2012 20:24:20 +0100 Gerrit Wichert wrote: > i think wxC is a very special 'binding' that can work as a basic > layer for multiple language 'bindings'. > As such the optimal solution would be if there is only one wxC that > is part of wxWidgets itself. > The natural choice for the build system is then wxWidgets own build > system. So it would be more easy > to keep it in sync with WxWidgets. Developers of all language > bindings can unite their forces on it. > Maybe even wxWidgets core developers would like to care for keeping > it in sync if it is not to much work. > Sharing wxWidgets build system, wxC can be build on the same target > platforms as wxWidgets. I agree with you and quoted your reply along with adding some more stuff to the post. > btw. does wxD currently build for you? Yes. > I got some trouble with deprecated typedef and others on my linux box. > But i've just finished fixing it and DMD 2.057actually successfully > builds the little testing app i'm developing to become more > acquainted with D. I did open some issues and Anders fixed some stuff in order to build it. > https://github.com/gwichert/wxd > > I woud like to get some feedback on this before making a pull request. I'll try along with building some samples, but quite busy these days with other stuff. Thank you for your input and interest in wxD. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- Those persons who execute their duties according to My injunctions and who follow this teaching faithfully, without envy, become free from the bondage of fruitive actions. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
wxC & wxD (aka: let's work together with wxhaskell project)
Hello, yesterday I read a post informing us about the progress of wxhaskell project preparing itself for upcoming wxWidgets-3.0 release. One of the interesting thing from the post (http://wewantarock.wordpress.com/2012/01/11/wxhaskell-and-wxwidgets-2-9/) is the following: "The C wrapper for wxWidgets has been moved into a separate project, wxC and built as a shared library" and I believe it could be interesting as the basis to provide future wxD bindings. I have asked about it and here is the reply from one of the main wxhaskell developers: "This is actually the subject of some debate within the wxHaskell community, and I am in the process of writing a separate blog entry covering some of the issues. wxC is certainly a reasonable basis for a wxWidgets wrapper for other languages (it exposes a straightforward C interface and builds as a DLL/.so/.dylib). The build system is presently rather Haskell-centric, which might put off other language communities, but if you did a ‘cabal install wxc’, you would get a DLL you could use with most any other language. Similarly, if you can read plain C header files, you should be able to use the wxC library (I’m no D expert, but everything I have read suggest that D can do this quite easily). If there was enough interest from Non-Haskellers in joint development and maintenance of wxC, then I think we would be comfortable moving to a more, err, inclusive build system, but while the main contribution comes from Haskellers it is harder to justify such a move. Some time back, Eric took control of the moribund wxC project at Sourceforge. We could use this as the basis for such a project." (See comments in the above referenced URL.) What do you think about it? Sincerely, Gour -- Everyone is forced to act helplessly according to the qualities he has acquired from the modes of material nature; therefore no one can refrain from doing something, not even for a moment. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Discussion about D at a C++ forum
On Mon, 09 Jan 2012 09:28:11 -0500 dsimcha wrote: > Pure command line/console. Thank you. Sincerely, Gour -- As a strong wind sweeps away a boat on the water, even one of the roaming senses on which the mind focuses can carry away a man's intelligence. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Discussion about D at a C++ forum
On Sun, 08 Jan 2012 19:26:15 -0500 dsimcha wrote: > As someone who does performance-critical scientific work in D, this > comment is absolutely **wrong** because you only need to avoid the GC > in the most performance-critical/realtime parts of your code, i.e. > where you should be avoiding any dynamic allocation, GC or not. Considering we'd need to do some work for our project involving number crunching in the form of producing several libs to be (later) used by GUI part of the app, I'm curious to know do you use ncurses or just plain console output for your UI? I'm askin considering to start work on non-GUI part of the project and just have simple UI to test results and along with that work try to improve GUI situation in the D's ecosystem. > Bottom line: D doesn't give you a free lunch but it does give you a > cheaper lunch than C, C++ or even a combination of C/C++ and Python. That's vey nice to hear from someone like yourself. We did small research about possible alternatives for D by looking at Scala & Clojure, but understood we don't get much in terms of GUIs, but only lose otherwise. Last consideration was C#/Mono, but, again, not much to gain and more to lose, so we'll stay with D, try to write non-GUI parts and later (hopefully) sell D as overall language of the projet. Sincerely, Gour -- Never was there a time when I did not exist, nor you, nor all these kings; nor in the future shall any of us cease to be. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Happy New Year in 2012....
On Tue, 03 Jan 2012 15:09:19 +0100 simendsjo wrote: > And Norway - Happy New Year! Greetings from non-EU Croatia! Sincerely, Gour -- The devotees of the Lord are released from all kinds of sins because they eat food which is offered first for sacrifice. Others, who prepare food for personal sense enjoyment, verily eat only sin. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: The God Language
On Tue, 03 Jan 2012 08:31:33 +0100 Timon Gehr wrote: > I meant he can invent a task he will never be able to solve. ;) Nah...those are just side-effects, iow. noise. :-D Sincerely, Gour -- But those who, out of envy, disregard these teachings and do not follow them are to be considered bereft of all knowledge, befooled, and ruined in their endeavors for perfection. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: The God Language
On Mon, 02 Jan 2012 23:29:17 +0100 Timon Gehr wrote: > God cannot be omnipotent. If he was, he could invent a task he cannot > solve. Wrong. He is not static, but dynamic, so He can invent a task he cannot solve, but in the next moment he can solve it. ;) Sincerely, Gour -- When your intelligence has passed out of the dense forest of delusion, you shall become indifferent to all that has been heard and all that is to be heard. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: SCons support for D
On Tue, 3 Jan 2012 14:37:36 +1000 Danni Coy wrote: > Premake has good support for cross compilation - Which makes it > possible to use it to build executables for game consoles for > instance. CMake can't really do this (with some ugly hacks you can > On the other hand Premake doesn't handle installation on > a Linux/BSD system really at all - It's hard to reccomend it for > doing normal desktop application development on these platforms. What do you mean? Premake is meta tool and the build is delegated to other native tools, afaict, or do you miss 'make install' target? Sincerely, Gour -- Those who are on this path are resolute in purpose, and their aim is one. O beloved child of the Kurus, the intelligence of those who are irresolute is many-branched. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Database developer's gentle view on D.
On Sun, 1 Jan 2012 02:22:59 -0600 Jimmy Cao wrote: > GUI library for Windows. Pretty easy to use. Thank you, but not interesting for us looking for multi-platform library. Sincerely, Gour -- Those persons who execute their duties according to My injunctions and who follow this teaching faithfully, without envy, become free from the bondage of fruitive actions. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Database developer's gentle view on D.
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 20:28:43 -0800 bls wrote: > A Database independent, ORM based library module is not even matter of > discussion. That's a pity. That would be nice, indeed. > Well for us Windoze is the only interesting Desktop platform. > A _reasonable_ GUI is not available yet.(D-GUI looks pretty > good,though) What is D-GUI, gtkD or DWT? Sincerely, Gour -- As a strong wind sweeps away a boat on the water, even one of the roaming senses on which the mind focuses can carry away a man's intelligence. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: The God Language
On Thu, 29 Dec 2011 04:15:27 -0600 Caligo wrote: > This is somewhat of a serious question: If there is a God (I'm not > saying there isn't, and I'm not saying there is), There is. ;) > It would be hard for us mortals to imagine, but would it resemble a > functional programming language more or something else? Just answer the following question: Are we mortals the result of pure function or just side-effect? Sincerely, Gour -- There are principles to regulate attachment and aversion pertaining to the senses and their objects. One should not come under the control of such attachment and aversion, because they are stumbling blocks on the path of self-realization. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
D branding (was Re: D1 to be discontinued on December 31, 2012)
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 18:18:24 -0600 Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: > We need to contract D's brand. People who consider D need to > contemplate one crisp and coherent offer. Mine would be to write general-purpose multi-platform GUI application, but it seems it's dependant on other offerings. Moreover, I'll help/work on some GUI bindings and build-tool support (either/both pushing Cmake & premake upstream). Sincerely, Gour -- But a person free from all attachment and aversion and able to control his senses through regulative principles of freedom can obtain the complete mercy of the Lord. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D1 to be discontinued on December 31, 2012
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 17:52:48 -0600 Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: > It is reasonable to expect that people with an interest in D have had > all chances to see it and sufficient channels to chime in. Sure. It is unreasonable that someone should knock on every D1 user out here, asking about their opinion. The project is open-source, there are no paying customers buying D1 support, so pls. move and spare (electronic) ink. I'm not favoring democracy, but competency...Let those who know better decide and let me do that what I can the best. Sincerely, Gour -- Never was there a time when I did not exist, nor you, nor all these kings; nor in the future shall any of us cease to be. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D1 to be discontinued on December 31, 2012
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 16:42:26 -0800 Walter Bright wrote: > Right. And we make D2 work or we fail completely. Please, make it work! Sincerely, Gour -- As a strong wind sweeps away a boat on the water, even one of the roaming senses on which the mind focuses can carry away a man's intelligence. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D1 to be discontinued on December 31, 2012
On Thu, 15 Dec 2011 10:37:58 +0100 Stephan wrote: > Why is it not ? I am using it regularly. Ok it is broken now since > the new release... but b4 How are you, in general, satisfied with DWT2? How it compares with qt/wx/gtk+ ? Sincerely, Gour -- As the embodied soul continuously passes, in this body, from boyhood to youth to old age, the soul similarly passes into another body at death. A sober person is not bewildered by such a change. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D1 to be discontinued on December 31, 2012
On Wed, 14 Dec 2011 11:15:58 +0100 Jacob Carlborg wrote: > I don't know if all of them are successful but important: Tango, DWT, > Minid, Orange, Not to say those are not important, but there are, afaict, falling in the category of D1's ecosystem, not end-user apps. Otoh Tango is ported to D2, Minid has moved to Croc, while DWT & Orange have D2 ports. > DVM, don't know about that one, but > xfbuild to mention a few. is revived with a D2 port. So, it looks that most of the stuff is ported to D2 and therefore not a great loss. Sincerely, Gour -- It is far better to discharge one's prescribed duties, even though faultily, than another's duties perfectly. Destruction in the course of performing one's own duty is better than engaging in another's duties, for to follow another's path is dangerous. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D1 to be discontinued on December 31, 2012
On Wed, 14 Dec 2011 09:45:51 +0100 Jacob Carlborg wrote: > The few times I've contributed to the compiler I've sent a patch or a > pull request and the end result is that nothing happens. If I'm lucky > I get a few comments, I answer them and then nothing. Heh, then fork it. ;) Well, the situation is that resources in D are still not everwhelming and every bit spent on D1, means less time for D2. Moreover, D2 brings features which makes embracing D much more compelling. OK, I was not here in the time of D1, but seeing D1's feature list, I wouldn't think it is so special to invest in learning & using it. Another thing is I believe that Walter didn't delve in designing new language in order to be used for small hobby projects. Can you give me a list of some successful open-source projects written in D1 and/or some proprietary ones? Is there demand of paying support for D1? If not and if Walter prefers spending time on D2, I really do not understand why there is so much whining about it. If D1 wants to keep it, they're, afaict, free to do it. Is there anyone who can prevent Walter to write a post saying: "I'm fed up with D community being busy with faultfinding all the time, not being grateful for the time & effort I'm putting into it, so from TODAY I'm quitting all the work on D1 & D2 and will focus on designing new X language?" I remember him from Zortech C++ compiler which was my *first* commercial package I bought and remembering the set of manuals coming along in a greyish hard box, I was thrilled with all support I got...same with updates. Now he is working for free... Sincerely, Gour -- The spirit soul bewildered by the influence of false ego thinks himself the doer of activities that are in actuality carried out by the three modes of material nature. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D1 to be discontinued on December 31, 2012
On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 21:52:59 +0100 Jacob Carlborg wrote: > Yeah, I noticed that. I'm still using D1. I usually don't have time > to try all beta versions or releases for that matter. Your making > solid improvements in every release and I'm grateful for that. > I apologize if I haven't shown any gratitude. I'd say it's not just question of 'showing gratitude', but how many people are contributing fixes to D1? Why would Walter be obliged to (mostly) single-handedly supported something he is not much interested in? Compiler is free, everyone can contribute if they like...it's (almost) like in many other open-source projects... Sincerely, Gour -- Never was there a time when I did not exist, nor you, nor all these kings; nor in the future shall any of us cease to be. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: D1 to be discontinued on December 31, 2012
On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 16:57:11 -0600 Andrei Alexandrescu wrote: > It's difficult to work on something you don't believe in. Yes, we > could keep D1 on artificial life support until we retire, but to what > end? None. Nobody pays for D1 support... I did use one of package managers on my Linux distro and one day the following appeared in the forums: "Hello xyz users. I just wanted you to know I am not going to work on foobar anymore...If you like foobar and want to keep it going start hacking on it..." Iow, there was no 1-year-ahead announcement...and reaction from people were like: "Thanks for the heads-up and thanks for all the great work :-)" So, let's leave people to work on that which they like to work on and that has future. Sincerely, Gour -- When your intelligence has passed out of the dense forest of delusion, you shall become indifferent to all that has been heard and all that is to be heard. http://atmarama.net | Hlapicina (Croatia) | GPG: 52B5C810 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
