Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Interesting because I've been asked by quite a few people to add Hell to DM780 - which I have done, so expect some Hell activity this year. In general I agree that we possibly have far too many modes, for the beginner it's no easy to know what's what. At least PSK / RTTY is a good starting point. And real SSTV - that's very active although not a true digital mode. Simon HB9DRV -- From: Andrew O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] Maybe it is because I am getting irritated because of the pinched nerve in my neck, I'm thinking maybe I have just had enough of the plethora of digital modes. Yes, it is K3UK saying that...the bloke that is always trying varying modes.
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
I'm a begginer, licenced this year. I do not think that we have too many mode. And the massive usage of psk31 is not a beginer problem. It's the opposite. We have too many old ham that just want a contact and a QSL. And they use the most commonly used mode, psk31. I have absolutly no interest in contact and QSL. Well, no interest, but i need a contact to test the mode, talk about it, improve the transmission if needed. And not just sharing macro-QSO. The only times i was able to really test, experiment, on air was with exotic mode. Anytime i tried to chat (technical) in psk31 i got the usual k thx bye macro. But never had this problem using Feld Hell. The problem is between chair and keyboard, nothing else. -- F4FQM 2008/4/21, Simon Brown (Laptop) [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Interesting because I've been asked by quite a few people to add Hell to DM780 - which I have done, so expect some Hell activity this year. In general I agree that we possibly have far too many modes, for the beginner it's no easy to know what's what. At least PSK / RTTY is a good starting point. And real SSTV - that's very active although not a true digital mode. Simon HB9DRV -- From: Andrew O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] Maybe it is because I am getting irritated because of the pinched nerve in my neck, I'm thinking maybe I have just had enough of the plethora of digital modes. Yes, it is K3UK saying that...the bloke that is always trying varying modes. -- -- Kerunix Flan Laurent Laborde
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
HI... For a newbie you're being just a tad bit too judgemental in wielding such a broad brush. I've been licensed over 50 years and can assure you that there's much more to this hobby than simple robotic contact exchanges for a post card in MANY Oldsters thinking. That said, too many exotic modes is an opinion that has as much value as your broad brush statement chastizing Hams who have nurtured this hobby long before you came along. Have fun with this stuff. You've surely got a lot better equipment and modes and technology available than in times past, that's for sure. But, to be well-rounded in the hobby, you should remember there's more to it than just tinkering, testing, technical exploration, and such. There's the human aspect. Hams are Ambassadors-Without- Portfolio; always have been. It comes with the territory and tradition. Those stations who just want your info exahange are not just oldsters but rather, of all ages and nationalities. If you don't explore this, you'll be no different than an Engineer who lacks studies in the Humanities and the Arts. Quite shallow and socially limited. OH...BTW, welcome. You've got some exciting stuff in store for you, if you keep an open mind and let yourself explore. However, perhaps you'll find 50 years passing by before you know it and find yourself being confronted by a newbie then who's telling YOU that you're out of date. Howard W6IDS Richmond, IN - Original Message - From: Laurent Laborde [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 6:56 AM Subject: Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ? I'm a begginer, licenced this year. I do not think that we have too many mode. And the massive usage of psk31 is not a beginer problem. It's the opposite. We have too many old ham that just want a contact and a QSL. And they use the most commonly used mode, psk31. I have absolutly no interest in contact and QSL. Well, no interest, but i need a contact to test the mode, talk about it, improve the transmission if needed. And not just sharing macro-QSO. The only times i was able to really test, experiment, on air was with exotic mode. Anytime i tried to chat (technical) in psk31 i got the usual k thx bye macro. But never had this problem using Feld Hell. The problem is between chair and keyboard, nothing else. -- SNIP SNIP
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
On Sunday 20 April 2008 05:03:27 am Laurent Laborde wrote: Hello, i have exactly the same problem. PSK31 is a good mode, but i'm tired of PSK31 only QSO. I try to use exoctic mode only. All flavors of Hellschreiber, Throb, Ale, Olivia, ALE, Stanag, Packet, ... It can take MANY hours to get a single reply in MFSK16 while there is a lot of psk31 around. Frustrating and boring ... It's all about sharing stupid paper QSL or contesting ... I don't think that's it at all. I think PSK-31 is popular because there are distinct locations to find it. -- In order to ensure a safe police state; the right of the people to keep and bear arms must be infringed.
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Hello Jeff, example - SSTV, I've spent hours runnng MultiPSK trying to figure out which variation of SSTV a signal is only to be rewarded with nothing. If you are synchronized, Multipsk must automatically detect the SSTV mode either with the SSTV code or by assessing the type of SSTV format. There is a Multipsk Yahoo group for mutual help between users. However for SSTV, you have also the king of the SSTV soft which name is MMSSTV. It is a specialized soft. You must download it. All analog SSTV modes are present (except SSTV with MFSK16). 73 Patrick - Original Message - From: Jeff Moore To: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 8:17 PM Subject: Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ? Rick, My interests are similar to yours, ie, effective emergency comms, and just trying out all the different modes. I have two main issues: 1. Being brand new to digital modes, I find it rather difficult to tell what mode I'm seeing on the waterfall. I recognize PSK, RTTY, MFSK16 (now), but after that I'm lost. Also, often times, I'm running software that doesn't go beyond the basic modes, so by the time I can get sw up and running that may be able to decode that exotic trace on the waterfall, the signal is gone! 2. Log keeping, I don't want to have 10 different log files, I want to have one. I use DXKeeper and WinWarbler and MultiPSK will interface to it, but I also run HRD/DM780, NBEMS, MixW, and several others that don't. But I have to wonder if it utlimately comes down to item 1. above. Hams (and people in general) stick with what they're familiar with. A good example - SSTV, I've spent hours runnng MultiPSK trying to figure out which variation of SSTV a signal is only to be rewarded with nothing. I've pretty much given up on SSTV for that reason. I keep plugging away at the rest of the digimodes, because I occasionally have success at decoding some exotic signal. And the real reward is finding someone in a QSO that wants to try other modes! Jeff -- KE7ACY CN94 - Original Message - From: Rick I have been concerned for some time about the lack of interest in the new modes, even though some of us try and promote them. Very few hams have any interest in digital modes to begin with. About half the hams here in the U.S. can not operate below 10 meters since you need at least a General Class license, and the great majority of General and higher class licensees do not ever operate, nor do they have any interest in operating digital modes, particularly keyboard digital modes on HF. Not only because it is not interesting to them, but many of them do not have typing skills. Because my interests are a bit narrower than most of you with a focus on accurate message capability particularly what works for practical emergency communication, there are exceedingly few who have the slightest interest in this. I sent out a request for some testing of these modes to a two county area. I have received responses back from just a couple of hams who I already knew had interest in this and have done a few tests in the past and one ham outside the two county area who monitors the list. That is very telling! [snip] .
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Hello to all, But never had this problem using Feld Hell. The fun side of Hell modes (as fuzzy modes) is that you are obliged to investigate your brain on the decoding. On that sense, it is a bit as CW (in easier than CW however). The best Hell mode is for me FM Hell (which might be called MSK Hell in fact). However, the advantage of Feld Hell is that you could use a CW transceiver (as it is an On-Off mode). 73 Patrick - Original Message - From: Laurent Laborde To: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ? I'm a begginer, licenced this year. I do not think that we have too many mode. And the massive usage of psk31 is not a beginer problem. It's the opposite. We have too many old ham that just want a contact and a QSL. And they use the most commonly used mode, psk31. I have absolutly no interest in contact and QSL. Well, no interest, but i need a contact to test the mode, talk about it, improve the transmission if needed. And not just sharing macro-QSO. The only times i was able to really test, experiment, on air was with exotic mode. Anytime i tried to chat (technical) in psk31 i got the usual k thx bye macro. But never had this problem using Feld Hell. The problem is between chair and keyboard, nothing else. -- F4FQM 2008/4/21, Simon Brown (Laptop) [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Interesting because I've been asked by quite a few people to add Hell to DM780 - which I have done, so expect some Hell activity this year. In general I agree that we possibly have far too many modes, for the beginner it's no easy to know what's what. At least PSK / RTTY is a good starting point. And real SSTV - that's very active although not a true digital mode. Simon HB9DRV -- From: Andrew O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] Maybe it is because I am getting irritated because of the pinched nerve in my neck, I'm thinking maybe I have just had enough of the plethora of digital modes. Yes, it is K3UK saying that...the bloke that is always trying varying modes. -- -- Kerunix Flan Laurent Laborde
RE: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Attributing PSK31's dominance to the inertial nature of its users is both incorrect and counterproductive. Its demonstrably incorrect because those very same users adopted PSK31 quite rapidly; its counterproductive because it leads to the erroneous conclusion that we should stop trying to develop a better alternative. Why has PSK31 been so successful? Because it combines several important attributes: 1. it requires only a soundcard and a simple soundcard-to-radio interface 2. its bandwidth is narrow enough to make panoramic reception and multi-signal decoding attractive and useful in a typical transceiver's 3 kHz passband 3. AFC makes it easy to tune and stay tuned 4. its fast enough (the failure of PSK63 to gain traction is instructive) 5. many different implementations are available, allowing users to choose the user interface and ecosystem they like best 6. decoded information is available in text form, facilitating station automation In seeking to displace PSK31 with a better alternative, a good place to start is to consider PSK31's weaknesses: A. no error detection/correction B. simplex C. can't convey files (messages, pictures, documents, etc.) Addressing one or more of these weaknesses without compromising on the 6 important attributes would likely produce a winner, IMHO. 73, Dave, AA6YQ -Original Message- From: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Laurent Laborde Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 6:57 AM To: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ? I'm a begginer, licenced this year. I do not think that we have too many mode. And the massive usage of psk31 is not a beginer problem. It's the opposite. We have too many old ham that just want a contact and a QSL. And they use the most commonly used mode, psk31. I have absolutly no interest in contact and QSL. Well, no interest, but i need a contact to test the mode, talk about it, improve the transmission if needed. And not just sharing macro-QSO. The only times i was able to really test, experiment, on air was with exotic mode. Anytime i tried to chat (technical) in psk31 i got the usual k thx bye macro. But never had this problem using Feld Hell. The problem is between chair and keyboard, nothing else. -- F4FQM 2008/4/21, Simon Brown (Laptop) [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Interesting because I've been asked by quite a few people to add Hell to DM780 - which I have done, so expect some Hell activity this year. In general I agree that we possibly have far too many modes, for the beginner it's no easy to know what's what. At least PSK / RTTY is a good starting point. And real SSTV - that's very active although not a true digital mode. Simon HB9DRV -- From: Andrew O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED] Maybe it is because I am getting irritated because of the pinched nerve in my neck, I'm thinking maybe I have just had enough of the plethora of digital modes. Yes, it is K3UK saying that...the bloke that is always trying varying modes. -- -- Kerunix Flan Laurent Laborde
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Hi Andy, Sorry about your pinched nerve, but all the (exotic) modes are great. Perhaps there is a natural selection of well known modes as a common starting point. Perhaps over time modes that are extremely robust under different conditions I've used both MixW and MultiPSK but still takes time to figure out a mode sometimes. I have noticed that will in a QSO with some odd mode I will see others calling CQ in what looks to be the same mode on one side or the other of the QSO. Or that when finishing a QSO, one of us will get a call in that mode. But perhaps not everyone uses a program with as many mode options thus is unable to answer. The club I am in, the Vienna Wireless Society of Vienna VA runs a digital net. We cycled through all the modes we could find to get one we could all use and works for both near and far on 80m. And were thinking to start that cycle over again with the newly minted modes. Anyway, wanted to chime in that with the anarchy of ham radio seems not possible to try to reduce the number of modes in use. 73, Tom n4zpt Andrew O'Brien wrote: Maybe it is because I am getting irritated because of the pinched nerve in my neck, I'm thinking maybe I have just had enough of the plethora of digital modes. Yes, it is K3UK saying that...the bloke that is always trying varying modes. I tried calling CQ numerous times in the TARA Skirming using various exotic modes, but ZERO respondents. No one answered Olivia CQ's, no one answered DominoEX CQ's, no Hell, and even no MFSK16 ! The only three modes that produced a response were PSK31, PSK63 and RTTY. Several months ago, I saw Dave AA6YQ make some comment about Winwabler not adding additional modes because (paraphrasing) RTTY and PSK31/63 are effective and the others too under utilized to warrant inclusion. While I have really enjoyed many experimental modes and had lots of fun testing, I think if I added up the time I have spent endlessly trawling the digital bands without results, I could have built a few more antennae, or added a few thousand more QSO via other modes. Heck, my CW could be even more practiced. So, for the next few months I am going to detox, and consolidate around the following modes. PSK31/63 (125/250 on VHF/UHF) RTTY MEPT-WSPR (passive operations) Narrow SSTV/Digital SSTV HF JT65A ALE 400 Time to put MFSK16,Hell, standard ALE, Olivia , Contestia, RTTYM, DominoEX , etc, in to the virtual junk-box. They can join their counsins from the non-virtual world...Betamax ,8 track tapes, and cassettes. All good applications, but no one uses 'em anymore. Andy K3UK Announce your digital presence via our Interactive Sked Page at http://www.obriensweb.com/sked Check our other Yahoo Groups http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dxlist/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/contesting http://groups.yahoo.com/group/themixwgroup Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Hello, i have exactly the same problem. PSK31 is a good mode, but i'm tired of PSK31 only QSO. I try to use exoctic mode only. All flavors of Hellschreiber, Throb, Ale, Olivia, ALE, Stanag, Packet, ... It can take MANY hours to get a single reply in MFSK16 while there is a lot of psk31 around. Frustrating and boring ... It's all about sharing stupid paper QSL or contesting ... -- F4FQM 2008/4/20, Andrew O'Brien [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Maybe it is because I am getting irritated because of the pinched nerve in my neck, I'm thinking maybe I have just had enough of the plethora of digital modes. Yes, it is K3UK saying that...the bloke that is always trying varying modes. I tried calling CQ numerous times in the TARA Skirming using various exotic modes, but ZERO respondents. No one answered Olivia CQ's, no one answered DominoEX CQ's, no Hell, and even no MFSK16 ! The only three modes that produced a response were PSK31, PSK63 and RTTY. Several months ago, I saw Dave AA6YQ make some comment about Winwabler not adding additional modes because (paraphrasing) RTTY and PSK31/63 are effective and the others too under utilized to warrant inclusion. While I have really enjoyed many experimental modes and had lots of fun testing, I think if I added up the time I have spent endlessly trawling the digital bands without results, I could have built a few more antennae, or added a few thousand more QSO via other modes. Heck, my CW could be even more practiced. So, for the next few months I am going to detox, and consolidate around the following modes. PSK31/63 (125/250 on VHF/UHF) RTTY MEPT-WSPR (passive operations) Narrow SSTV/Digital SSTV HF JT65A ALE 400 Time to put MFSK16,Hell, standard ALE, Olivia , Contestia, RTTYM, DominoEX , etc, in to the virtual junk-box. They can join their counsins from the non-virtual world...Betamax ,8 track tapes, and cassettes. All good applications, but no one uses 'em anymore. -- F4FQM Kerunix Flan Laurent Laborde
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Jose, after I wrote the first Chip 64 help file and published it, there was a few weeks of activity but it has been dead for the past couple of years. Olivia is perhaps my favourite but hard to find anyone, and when you do it is the guy you talked to the last time you heard a Olivia signal. Andy. r I have never found Domino any better than Olivia. So, I would keep Olivia, MFSK16 and Hell. BTW, did Chip 64 ever get any use ? 73, Jose, CO2JA -- Andy K3UK www.obriensweb.com (QSL via N2RJ)
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
I have been concerned for some time about the lack of interest in the new modes, even though some of us try and promote them. Very few hams have any interest in digital modes to begin with. About half the hams here in the U.S. can not operate below 10 meters since you need at least a General Class license, and the great majority of General and higher class licensees do not ever operate, nor do they have any interest in operating digital modes, particularly keyboard digital modes on HF. Not only because it is not interesting to them, but many of them do not have typing skills. Because my interests are a bit narrower than most of you with a focus on accurate message capability particularly what works for practical emergency communication, there are exceedingly few who have the slightest interest in this. I sent out a request for some testing of these modes to a two county area. I have received responses back from just a couple of hams who I already knew had interest in this and have done a few tests in the past and one ham outside the two county area who monitors the list. That is very telling! Going back to about 1980, when I was relicensed as a ham, I found RTTY (both HF and VHF) to be interesting and built some simple TU equipment. But when Amtor and later Pactor and Clover II became available, I never wanted to go back to receiving scrambled, incorrect data. Circumstances caused me to discontinue all digital modes in the mid to late 1990's when I put all my resources into a defective HAL product, which as returned and ended any further interest in proprietary modes. Then when the sound card modes became available, we had a sea change in digital operation and I found it quite interesting. The newer modes often do not offer enough difference from PSK31, the first sound card mode, for most users. They want a narrow, casual, easy to tune, understandable modulation and they are not as concerned about accuracy, errors, resistance to interference, doppler, etc. The two modes I least like to operate today are RTTY and PSK31. Too many errors, inability to handle weak and changing conditions on HF and I would rather use newer technology that works better, especially the ARQ modes. But almost no one else wants to do this unless we make a sked to be on a certain mode on a certain frequency at a certain time. That is OK for initial testing, but is not acceptable for most of us who want to throw out a CQ and get a response within a reasonable short time. We can do that on most any open band and get results with SSB phone and CW. I have watched Andy's sked pages and there are often huge gaps in time from the last post for the digital modes. But go to the SKCC list and there much more activity, often from the past few minutes. And that is a special subset of CW! Again that tells you what hams are interested in and just is not digital modes. The modes that I find the most enjoyable and most practical are MFSK16 for narrow, good speed for keyboarding, deep into the noise capabilities, even though not an ARQ mode. Of course it can be ARQ with NBEMS. Then FAE400 due to the superior quasi-duplex ARQ capabilities that work fairly well down into the noise with memory ARQ (I still wonder how well it works against Pactor but I have no equipment to do a comparison). And finally, maybe the faster Olivia modes, if they are at least 30 wpm. Anything slower and I find it frustrating and impractical. But that is just my perspective and others will have very different goals and interests. 73, Rick, KV9U Andrew O'Brien wrote: I tried calling CQ numerous times in the TARA Skirming using various exotic modes, but ZERO respondents. No one answered Olivia CQ's, no one answered DominoEX CQ's, no Hell, and even no MFSK16 ! The only three modes that produced a response were PSK31, PSK63 and RTTY. Several months ago, I saw Dave AA6YQ make some comment about Winwabler not adding additional modes because (paraphrasing) RTTY and PSK31/63 are effective and the others too under utilized to warrant inclusion. While I have really enjoyed many experimental modes and had lots of fun testing, I think if I added up the time I have spent endlessly trawling the digital bands without results, I could have built a few more antennae, or added a few thousand more QSO via other modes. Heck, my CW could be even more practiced. So, for the next few months I am going to detox, and consolidate around the following modes. PSK31/63 (125/250 on VHF/UHF) RTTY MEPT-WSPR (passive operations) Narrow SSTV/Digital SSTV HF JT65A ALE 400 Time to put MFSK16,Hell, standard ALE, Olivia , Contestia, RTTYM, DominoEX , etc, in to the virtual junk-box. They can join their counsins from the non-virtual world...Betamax ,8 track tapes, and cassettes. All good applications, but no one uses 'em anymore. Andy K3UK
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
I had thought that CHIP64 was basically an experimental mode with little practical value until it was pointed out to me that at least one Digital Net uses it in Virginia. I have monitored their transmissions a few times, even though it is on a NVIS frequency and I am at a quite distant location. While I can not copy their transmissions 100% since it is not an ARQ mode, it does get through quite well. It is a high 300 baud speed using a sort of spread spectrum and they find it works better than many other modes against lightning static. I would like to test that out when we get some really bad summertime condx here in Wisconsin. 73, Rick, KV9U Andrew O'Brien wrote: Jose, after I wrote the first Chip 64 help file and published it, there was a few weeks of activity but it has been dead for the past couple of years. Olivia is perhaps my favourite but hard to find anyone, and when you do it is the guy you talked to the last time you heard a Olivia signal. Andy.
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Well, I see it is not Olivia's fault, but people's conservadurism not trying the newer modes. As it has been said before, most people on PSK31 uses ONLY PSK31, and very few of the most restless attempts other modes. I believe that there is another ongoing revolution on beaconing with WSPR. As I said in another posting, it is the power of deep space communications, based on heavy coding, coming down to earth. Peter Martinez did the first step when devising varicode, Pawel carried it further ahead with Olivia using Walsh codes, and now Joe carries it farther ahead to a point that had never been reached so far in ham communications. 73, Jose, CO2JA --- Andrew O'Brien wrote: Jose, after I wrote the first Chip 64 help file and published it, there was a few weeks of activity but it has been dead for the past couple of years. Olivia is perhaps my favourite but hard to find anyone, and when you do it is the guy you talked to the last time you heard a Olivia signal. Andy. r I have never found Domino any better than Olivia. So, I would keep Olivia, MFSK16 and Hell. BTW, did Chip 64 ever get any use ? 73, Jose, CO2JA -- MSc. Ing. Jose Angel Amador Fundora Profesor Auxiliar Departamento de Telecomunicaciones Facultad de Ingenieria Electrica, CUJAE Calle 114 #11901 e/ 119 y 127 Marianao 19390, Ciudad de la Habana, Cuba Tel: (53 7) 266-3445 Email: amador at electrica.cujae.edu.cu
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Rick, My interests are similar to yours, ie, effective emergency comms, and just trying out all the different modes. I have two main issues: 1. Being brand new to digital modes, I find it rather difficult to tell what mode I'm seeing on the waterfall. I recognize PSK, RTTY, MFSK16 (now), but after that I'm lost. Also, often times, I'm running software that doesn't go beyond the basic modes, so by the time I can get sw up and running that may be able to decode that exotic trace on the waterfall, the signal is gone! 2. Log keeping, I don't want to have 10 different log files, I want to have one. I use DXKeeper and WinWarbler and MultiPSK will interface to it, but I also run HRD/DM780, NBEMS, MixW, and several others that don't. But I have to wonder if it utlimately comes down to item 1. above. Hams (and people in general) stick with what they're familiar with. A good example - SSTV, I've spent hours runnng MultiPSK trying to figure out which variation of SSTV a signal is only to be rewarded with nothing. I've pretty much given up on SSTV for that reason. I keep plugging away at the rest of the digimodes, because I occasionally have success at decoding some exotic signal. And the real reward is finding someone in a QSO that wants to try other modes! Jeff -- KE7ACY CN94 - Original Message - From: Rick I have been concerned for some time about the lack of interest in the new modes, even though some of us try and promote them. Very few hams have any interest in digital modes to begin with. About half the hams here in the U.S. can not operate below 10 meters since you need at least a General Class license, and the great majority of General and higher class licensees do not ever operate, nor do they have any interest in operating digital modes, particularly keyboard digital modes on HF. Not only because it is not interesting to them, but many of them do not have typing skills. Because my interests are a bit narrower than most of you with a focus on accurate message capability particularly what works for practical emergency communication, there are exceedingly few who have the slightest interest in this. I sent out a request for some testing of these modes to a two county area. I have received responses back from just a couple of hams who I already knew had interest in this and have done a few tests in the past and one ham outside the two county area who monitors the list. That is very telling! [snip] .
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Hi Jeff, I can tell some of the modes on the waterfall, but then again many are not really discernable. By combining the sound of the mode with the appearance on the waterfall, you can get better at it. Bandwidth is one factor, the relative number of tones, certain spacing, etc., all help to determine it. I just asked about the log problem on the DXLab group since I suspect many of us have this problem. I rarely have logged anything over the years as I don't have a strong interest in collecting awards and have lost most logs that were on programs that I did not back up. My goal now is to try and limit the number of programs that I use, and combine things on DXLabs DXKeeper program, which is one of the main programs in the DX Lab Suite of programs. I don't have much interest in SST, particularly the analog form, but have sometimes copied the modes just to see how it is done. Most of the programs will automatically detect an analog mode won't they? The digital SSTV modes seem to be quite automatic since it detects many parameters including callsigns. 73, Rick, KV9U Jeff Moore wrote: Rick, My interests are similar to yours, ie, effective emergency comms, and just trying out all the different modes. I have two main issues: 1. Being brand new to digital modes, I find it rather difficult to tell what mode I'm seeing on the waterfall. I recognize PSK, RTTY, MFSK16 (now), but after that I'm lost. Also, often times, I'm running software that doesn't go beyond the basic modes, so by the time I can get sw up and running that may be able to decode that exotic trace on the waterfall, the signal is gone! 2. Log keeping, I don't want to have 10 different log files, I want to have one. I use DXKeeper and WinWarbler and MultiPSK will interface to it, but I also run HRD/DM780, NBEMS, MixW, and several others that don't. But I have to wonder if it utlimately comes down to item 1. above. Hams (and people in general) stick with what they're familiar with. A good example - SSTV, I've spent hours runnng MultiPSK trying to figure out which variation of SSTV a signal is only to be rewarded with nothing. I've pretty much given up on SSTV for that reason. I keep plugging away at the rest of the digimodes, because I occasionally have success at decoding some exotic signal. And the real reward is finding someone in a QSO that wants to try other modes! Jeff -- KE7ACY CN94 - Original Message - *From:* Rick mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] I have been concerned for some time about the lack of interest in the new modes, even though some of us try and promote them. Very few hams have any interest in digital modes to begin with. About half the hams here in the U.S. can not operate below 10 meters since you need at least a General Class license, and the great majority of General and higher class licensees do not ever operate, nor do they have any interest in operating digital modes, particularly keyboard digital modes on HF. Not only because it is not interesting to them, but many of them do not have typing skills. Because my interests are a bit narrower than most of you with a focus on accurate message capability particularly what works for practical emergency communication, there are exceedingly few who have the slightest interest in this. I sent out a request for some testing of these modes to a two county area. I have received responses back from just a couple of hams who I already knew had interest in this and have done a few tests in the past and one ham outside the two county area who monitors the list. That is very telling! [snip] . No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.2/1387 - Release Date: 4/19/2008 11:31 AM
[digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Maybe it is because I am getting irritated because of the pinched nerve in my neck, I'm thinking maybe I have just had enough of the plethora of digital modes. Yes, it is K3UK saying that...the bloke that is always trying varying modes. I tried calling CQ numerous times in the TARA Skirming using various exotic modes, but ZERO respondents. No one answered Olivia CQ's, no one answered DominoEX CQ's, no Hell, and even no MFSK16 ! The only three modes that produced a response were PSK31, PSK63 and RTTY. Several months ago, I saw Dave AA6YQ make some comment about Winwabler not adding additional modes because (paraphrasing) RTTY and PSK31/63 are effective and the others too under utilized to warrant inclusion. While I have really enjoyed many experimental modes and had lots of fun testing, I think if I added up the time I have spent endlessly trawling the digital bands without results, I could have built a few more antennae, or added a few thousand more QSO via other modes. Heck, my CW could be even more practiced. So, for the next few months I am going to detox, and consolidate around the following modes. PSK31/63 (125/250 on VHF/UHF) RTTY MEPT-WSPR (passive operations) Narrow SSTV/Digital SSTV HF JT65A ALE 400 Time to put MFSK16,Hell, standard ALE, Olivia , Contestia, RTTYM, DominoEX , etc, in to the virtual junk-box. They can join their counsins from the non-virtual world...Betamax ,8 track tapes, and cassettes. All good applications, but no one uses 'em anymore. Andy K3UK
Re: [digitalradio] Multiple Digital Modes: Time to get rid of most ?
Time to put MFSK16,Hell, standard ALE, Olivia , Contestia, RTTYM, DominoEX , etc, in to the virtual junk-box. They can join their counsins from the non-virtual world...Betamax ,8 track tapes, and cassettes. All good applications, but no one uses 'em anymore. Andy K3UK Between Olivia, Contestia, RTTYM, I would keep Olivia. MFSK16 may be useful for image transfereven when I prefer Olivia. Hell is different enough to keep as a living fossil. May be fun at times, and would allow a very simple TX. A simple CW transmitter might work. I have never found Domino any better than Olivia. So, I would keep Olivia, MFSK16 and Hell. BTW, did Chip 64 ever get any use ? 73, Jose, CO2JA
