Re: [discuss] New Purchaser
Catherine wrote: I purchased this product Saturday. It never downloaded. The set up downloaded, but the product itself never downloaded. I have been trying to get in touch with ANYONE!!!. You reached a volunteer run support list of OpenOffice.org. The best we can do, is point you to where you can download OpenOffice.org for free. http://www.openoffice.org. In terms of your dispute with whoever sold you the copy of OOo, you will have to contact them. In theory, they have a page that lists their street adress, along with their phone number. [If they don't they are prohibited from transacting any business with anybody who is a citizen of the state of California, a resident of the state of California, or a guest within the state of California, at the time the transaction occured.] I was sent an e-mail that said to go on: http://wwwOfficeBest Deal.com/ac9811htm to download etc, etc. I attempted to so and was unable to get onto this website. I feel that this is a rip off. Remember to file a police report stating that you were a victim of online fraud; [At least two major credit card issuers in the US have a working policy that unless criminal charges have been filed, all claims about credit card fraud are lies fabricated by the user to avoid paying their credit card debt.] I am now going to purchase word and excel because I need them for my new computer. If you do decide to purchase Microsoft Office, bear in mind that roughly 10% of brick and mortar retail sales of that product are counterfeit/pirated/unauthorized versions of MSO. If you purchase it online, the percentage is much higher. (To the point that you can safely assume that all online only vendors of MSO are selling pirated copies of MSO.) I will be contacting my credit card company and letting them know about this transaction. Contact them in _writing_. Do _not_ discuss your dispute over the phone. Send all correspondence certified mail, return receipt requested, of FedEx next Day delivery, signature required. If you send anything by fax, follow it up with snail mail. Keep track of _everything_ you have done related to this dispute. That includes printing out all email you send and receive. Also include printout of the web pages that you attempted to download the item from, and screenshots showing how the item failed to download. ( If you suspect you might be going to court, run the website through the various WC3, and a11y validators. Keep a printout of the report.) xan jonathon -- OOo can not correct for incompetence in creating documents from MSO. Furthermore,OOo can not compensate for the defective and flawed security measures used by Microsoft. As such, before using this product for exams that require faulty and defective software, ensure that you will not be unjustly penalized for the incompetence of the organization that requires the use of software that is known to be flawed, defective, bug-ridden, and fails to meet ISO file format standards. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Suggestion
Dale wrote: It would be nice if a complete contact manager were added to the OpenOffice suite. That functionality is currently available. Depending upon what is meant by complete contact manager it may or may not be implemented. IOW, it all depends upon what,and how you define complete contact manager. xan jonathon -- OOo can not correct for incompetence in creating documents from MSO. Furthermore,OOo can not compensate for the defective and flawed security measures used by Microsoft. As such, before using this product for exams that require faulty and defective software, ensure that you will not be unjustly penalized for the incompetence of the organization that requires the use of software that is known to be flawed, defective, bug-ridden, and fails to meet ISO file format standards. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] OpenOffice
André wrote: No, i do not want to create graphics via CLI or write them in the shape of an XML file.) a) It is/was easier to create RIP graphics using a text editor, than any of the supplied graphical editors. b) Try doing something that should be simple, like changing the background colour from grey to black using a graphical editor. Then do the same thing with a tool that has a CLI. - A GUI is easily discoverable, a CLI is not. easilly discoverable depends upon * What the images are of, if there is no menu; * Menu layout, if there is a menu; * What tools will interact with either the menu, or images; Try this * Throw away your mouse; * Throw away your keyboard; * Throw away your monitor; Use _any_ program that has a GU. Now explain the easilly discoverable part of a GUI. - A GUI is attractive (if done right), a CLI is not. Attractiveness Attractiveness counts for nothing when it detracts from functionality. Benjamin wrote: memorize everything as is needed to run a command line program for everything...without taking months of solid training for each one. a) Appropriate names for the functions; b) Batch files/shell scripts/whatever they are called on your OS; c) Part of using software efficiently requires learning, and memorizing every function within the program. d) That because of the inherent user hostility of GUIs, for even tolerable use, there are groups of people that have to spend 1,6000 hours tolearn the basic interface ---knowing that they will never be able to be anything more than a novice-intermediate user, because the GUI is designed to maximize inefficient, unproductive performance. Ian wrote: a GUI will for the most part slow you down. If you are a 20 wpm typist and don't know the commands you have a massive barrier to A GUI also slows down the 20 word per minute typist. xan jonathon
Re: [discuss] OpenOffice
Chris wrote: please, read that again, anything strike you as perhaps, odd? That is the starting point, when testing for Section 508 compliance. PPS: although when it comes to system recovery, there's nothing quite like bash to be able to fall back on :D Or using VI to stabilize a system that has become unstable. xan jonathon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] OpenOffice
Jacek wrote: But GUI -- is awful. A GUI interface is intrinsically user hostile,and best avoided. Any GUI is going to be awful: and dysfunctional. The only question is how dysfunctional it is going to be. Second thing is that it doesn't support automatic language recognition- Work on that started a year or so ago. I'm not sure when it will be included in OOo. There are a couple of major issues with automatic language recognition.Letter frequency analysis is not reliable, except on very large sets of writing. xan jonathon -- OOo can not correct for incompetence in creating documents from MSO. Furthermore,OOo can not compensate for the defective and flawed security measures used by Microsoft. As such, before using this product for exams that require faulty and defective software, ensure that you will not be unjustly penalized for the incompetence of the organization that requires the use of software that is known to be flawed, defective, bug-ridden, and fails to meet ISO file format standards. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Search files
Adrian wrote: I think that this job is better done by the operating system or by a program that searches across all of your data. - Copernic Desktop Search (http://www.copernic.com) or - Google Desktop Search (http://desktop.google.com) Can either of those be used on a computer that does not know what a network connection is,much less uses one? xan jonathon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] New Feature Request
Florencio wrote: a) The Wikipedia Connection marked text and OO will open Wikipedia with the definition (if any) for the selection. http://oooconv.free.fr/wikipedia/wikipedia_en.html has the macro for the Wikipedia article. I do not know what happened to the Wictionary macro--- which sounds more like what you are looking for. [My guess is that it was/is a simple modification of the Wikipedia macro.] b) The Google Connection (or ie, if you want) I have no idea what happened to that macro. http://software.newsforge.com/software/05/10/11/1949204.shtml describes how to modify the Wikipedia macro for Google,or any other search engine. c) The Image Connection Add to Insert Image option, the alternative to browse the web I am not aware of a macro that does that. Doing an image search with Google, or other Search Engine, would be a simple modification of the Search Engine macro. I don't know whether it could be further modified to insert the image. The Wikipedia, Wictionary,and Search Engine macros opened a new page with the default browser. xan jonathon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] On a Wikipedia plugin, was: New Feature Request
Marco wrote: Note that a M-W plugin for OO.o had already been requested last year: without (so far) any result. For such a plugin, yes, you'd also have How about modifying the Wikipedia macro for MW? And while I am about it, are there any other encyclopaedia, dictionary,or similar sites that somebody wants an OOo macro for? xan jonathon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] OpenOffice
Chris wrote: I'm afraid that the GUI is the way forward, while computers can talk GUIs were a step backwards, and have done nothing but ensure that accessibility issues maximize a loss of productivity for not only those with a11y issues, but the general population. beginning, a gui can actually do so much more than any CLI, which For a naive user, a GUI is marginally more productive than a CLI. For a power user, a CLI is about 1000 times more efficient than a GUI. The initial learning curve for a CLI is slightly steeper than a GUI. In either instance,most of that learning curve is nothing more than rote memorization. but it's not nearly as 'intiuitive as what MS are currently putting out there'. Microsoft's UI is intuitive only because people are familiar with it. [ I don't remember the cites,but there are several journal articles on the unintuitive nature of MS Windows versus the Unix command line with naive users.] hopefully the User eXperience project at ux.openoffice.org is a good starting point Their priority should be to make OOo fully a11y compliant. Then add the eye candy that minimizes productivity, and maximizes system resources that accomplish nothing. xan jonathon -- OOo can not correct for incompetence in creating documents from MSO. Furthermore,OOo can not compensate for the defective and flawed security measures used by Microsoft. As such, before using this product for exams that require faulty and defective software, ensure that you will not be unjustly penalized for the incompetence of the organization that requires the use of software that is known to be flawed, defective, bug-ridden, and fails to meet ISO file format standards. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] OpenOffice
Chris wrote: A GUI interface is intrinsically user hostile,and best avoided. Any GUI is going to be awful: and dysfunctional. The only question is how dysfunctional it is going to be. with that kind of attitude a lot of the stuff i see in the openoffice 'user experience' makes a lot more sense I forgot to include the trivial example. Add 1 000 colours to the colour palette of OOo, using the GUI. Add 1 000 colours to the colour palette of OOo, by editing the raw file. Which one takes less time? Which one is easier to do? I know which option I use, when I create new OOo colour palettes. To create my 16^8 colour palette for OOo, I cheated, by writing a python script to generate it for me. As I said, that is the trivial example, that clearly demonstrates the unproductive nature of a GUI. xan jonathon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Suggestion about page numbering
João Magalhães wrote: I'd suggest the following about page numbering: 1. Suppress page number / header / footer on first page Create a page style for that. 2. Start numbering at... Create a page style, and then selecting the number by using Insert New page and changing the style,along with the page number. xan jonathon -- OOo can not correct for incompetence in creating documents from MSO. Furthermore,OOo can not compensate for the defective and flawed security measures used by Microsoft. As such, before using this product for exams that require faulty and defective software, ensure that you will not be unjustly penalized for the incompetence of the organization that requires the use of software that is known to be flawed, defective, bug-ridden, and fails to meet ISO file format standards.
Re: [discuss] Vote for more pretty default colors in charts
Ingrid wrote: What about to increase the current colour of chart from 12 to 24 or 36? Where do you expect that to be used? I would rate charts with 12 I often do bar charts with 18 different fields. Duplicating six fields does confuse some clients. Then you would be free to create your own default color set with as many colors as you usually need. Would that make sense for you? Yes xan jonathon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] PROJECT MANAGEMENT
Adrian wrote: I think a good idea will be to include a open source project management tool. Maybe something similar to gantt project. Have a look at this page: http://oopm.openoffice.org/ http://oopm.openoffice.org also points to the GANTT chart macro for using CALC as a project management tool. A PERT chart macro can be found at http://www.ooomacros.org/user.php http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/OpenOffice.org_Solutions#Project_Management points to FLOSS alternatives to use until the OOo Project Management project creates a viable tool set. xan jonathon -- OOo can not correct for incompetence in creating documents from MSO. Furthermore,OOo can not compensate for the defective and flawed security measures used by Microsoft. As such, before using this product for exams that require faulty and defective software, ensure that you will not be unjustly penalized for the incompetence of the organization that requires the use of software that is known to be flawed, defective, bug-ridden, and fails to meet ISO file format standards. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[discuss] Home for colour palettes, hatching palettes and the like
All: Is there a current home for alternative colour palettes, hatching grids,and the rest of the things in /user/config? I currently am putting the ones I have found, or created, into my esnips folder: http://esnips.com/web/OOoRelatedThings If there isn't a current home, what objections would there be, for setting up a home on sourceforge? xan jonathon -- OOo can not correct for incompetence in creating documents from MSO. Furthermore,OOo can not compensate for the defective and flawed security measures used by Microsoft. As such, before using this product for exams that require faulty and defective software, ensure that you will not be unjustly penalized for the incompetence of the organization that requires the use of software that is known to be flawed, defective, bug-ridden, and fails to meet ISO file format standards. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] PROJECT MANAGEMENT
Robert wrote: As of this time, OOo does not have anything like Outlook. There used to be a contact manager database for OOo, that hooked in with a calender database. Not group shareable (though I guess you could email the database around), but it was barely adequate for an individual. With a little bit of work it _might_ have been usable by a business. I _think_ that the features that Outlook users are wanting, are the calender/contact manager functions.. For group scheduling,and calenders, a LAMP solution makes more sense. That can also be more easily integrated into Thunderbird, than OOo.[Use the Lightning extension as the scheduling/calender function. Export personal calendar to the LAMP database. Import group calendar from the LAMP database.] For group contact management, a LAMP solution should work. A macro for Calc (to send out snail mail) and possibly a custom UI, for adding/editing the contact database would be required. OH, and a way to impor tthe email addresses into Thunderbird. xan jonathon -- OOo can not correct for incompetence in creating documents from MSO. Furthermore,OOo can not compensate for the defective and flawed security measures used by Microsoft. As such, before using this product for exams that require faulty and defective software, ensure that you will not be unjustly penalized for the incompetence of the organization that requires the use of software that is known to be flawed, defective, bug-ridden, and fails to meet ISO file format standards. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Open Office sold on ebay!!
Paolo wrote: I'm writing to let you know that Open Office is sold on Ebay: It is legal/acceptable for people to sell OpenOffice.org on eBay, or any other venue that they choose to sell it on, for whatever price they choose to attempt to sell it at. [I have seen OOo with a buy it now price of US$5 000.] Whilst the OOo project would like OOo vendors to contribute a percentage of their revenue to the project, that is not mandatory. but I cannot tolerate that disonest people earn money with other people work. There are legitimate reasons for wanting to buy OOo on a CD, rather than downloading it. * One example being that it is cheaper to buy the CD, than pay for the bandwidth. * A second example would be that the CD includes paid support. [ IOW, a phone number you can call 24/7 to solve problems you have in using the program.] * A third example would be that the CD includes macros, templates, and other things that are not part of OOo. * A fourth example would be the CD that is customized for corporate use. [Dictionaries do not contain words that are vulgar, obscene, or otherwise inappropriate for a business letter.] xan jonathon -- OOo can not correct for incompetence in creating documents from MSO. Furthermore,OOo can not compensate for the defective and flawed security measures used by Microsoft. As such, before using this product for exams that require faulty and defective software, ensure that you will not be unjustly penalized for the incompetence of the organization that requires the use of software that is known to be flawed, defective, bug-ridden, and fails to meet ISO file format standards. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] dates [OT] Easter
Michael wrote: What feast of the apostles? Easter is pagan based. It is the first Sunday following the full moon, following the autumn equinox. If OO.o can calculate full moons, please tell me how. Answered on social, since it is completely off topic for this list. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] dates [OT] Easter
Lars wrote:
Calculating holidays (e.g. Easter, Passover, Ramadan, J-dagen) would be a
useful function to have in Calc. Maybe CPAN's Date::calc could be used as
OOo 1.1.5 can calculate Easter correctly for the Gegorian Calender
using the rule set of the Anglican Church. That formula is incorrect
when the Julian calender is used, or when one uses one of the ten or
so other rule sets for calculating Easter.
The formula for calculating Passover, using the rule set for
Rabbinical Judaism is relatively simple. {Once you get the monads
correct.] Calculating Passover using either the Karaite Rule set or
Samaritan Rule set is going to be, at best, a rough guestimate.
There are two different rule sets for calculating when Ramadan occurs.
Only one of them can be reduced to a formula that will work in OOo.
[There is no known formula that can have the visible new moon sighted,
before the astronomical new moon occurs. Yet that is what the rule
set used by a very influential Muslim country permits.]
It would be time consuming, but fairly simple to write a macro for
each of the rule sets for Easter, Passover, and the rest of the
religious Holy Days that change dates every year.
[Do one macro for each rule set, for each event, or one macro per
event, with the user having to select which rule set to use.]
xan
jonathon
--
Ethical conduct is a vice.
Corrupt conduct is a virtue.
Motto of Nacarima
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Re: [discuss] dates are never autoformatted correctly
Kyle wrote: personally like to write my dates .mm.dd however, as you may know Open Office Calc is VERY picky about them being one way and ONLY one That pickyness is because OOo is style dependent. Everything in OOo revolves around styles, and if you don't grok styles, you wont' be able to use OOo successfully. OTOH, once you grok styles, you'll wonder how you survived without them. Even Microsoft Office has more date options that really do work. Whenever I happen to write a date, I have my date changed, to the format mm/dd/yy not only is this one of the worst, most illogical ways for a That happens because you: * Selected the default locale to be English(USA) and * Did not change the default date format in your cell styles to something more logical. Go into your default calc template, and change the default date format to the one that you want. who use different formats everywhere, open your options to include all the date types windows supports. The last time I counted, OOo supported five different calender systems, and about 35 different formats for entering dates in those calender systems. IOW, it covers the same date formats, and calender systems as windows covers. Everytime it's changed is another time There are two known time issues with OOo calenders. It does not correctly calculate the start of the day for either the Jewish Calender, or the traditional African (Swahili) calender. Other than miscalculating the date of Easter, it works correctly with both the standard Julian Calender, and standard Gregorian Calender. [I'd file an issue here, but it gets into theology, and the feast of the Apostles. and its a big problem if I can't easily insert it. And if I'm having Spend a couple of hours learning about styles, and how to use them. The issue here is that you configured styles for one date format, and want to use a different date format. xan jonathon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] MS Office plugin?
Robin wrote: Maybe MS is trying hard to find a way to make the conversion not work as That pretty much is what one can conclude, after reading the groklaw article on the Microsoft plugin. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[discuss] ally writing systems languages for Stylist
All: The convention in Styles Formatting is for writing systems to be a sub-division of the languge. EG: Turkish (Arabic), Turkish (Latin), Turkish (Cyrrilic). For writing systems that are used mainly/exclusivly for accessibility reasons, there are two possible options: a) * language (Braile) * language (Moon) * Languge (usual writing system b) * Moon * Braille Grade 1 * Braille Grade 1.5 * Braille Grade 2.0 * Braille Grade 2.5 * Braille Grade 3 * Nemeth Code * Music Code The advantage of the first option -- language (Braille) --- is that Braille (or Moon) dictionaries can be used for each languge. The disadvantage is that the number of languages/writing systems automatically triples, if not more. The disadvantage of the second option is that it requires Braille, or Moon to either be monolingual, or no spellchecking/grammar checking be done for the second, and subsequent languages in a document. A third option would be to increase the number of user languages to 10, or more. # On a related note, should ASL be assigned as a languge without locale (as Interlingua and Esperanto), or remain totally ignored? xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Issue 69041 - ruled invalid on no known grounds
Joe wrote: I wish the problem was #$!# nonexistent or invalid, I seriously considering It ws closed as invalid since there was no report describing what the problem/issue is. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Idea: Email program
Thomas wrote: 10 apps, which are needed in the office to write calculate and communicate aand surf I'm trying to figure out what the ten applications are: Text Editor Audio Editor Music Editor Graphics Editor Video Editor CAD/CAM Editor Presentation Program Spreadsheet Database Program Accounting Program Project Mananger Instant Messenger Web Browser Email client VOIP client Comes to fifteen, all of which are used for either internal, or external communication. I'm not sure if there are multi-platform FLOSS programs for all of those functions. I could always add specialized functions within those, for more components. [Document Processing, Investment Tracking, Inventory Management, etc.] xan jonathon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Page numbering
Rick wrote: Are there plans to simply page numbering, footers, and headers? I'm not sure how they could be simplified, without turning it into something which is non-functional for anything longer than one page. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] software patents
Odec wrote: How software patents might affect the development of open source applications such as OpenOffice. At their best, patents prevent innovation. At their worst, they merely stifle competition. One factor to bear in mind: Every software patent that has ever been issued, hs been issued despite it being both obvious, and based upon prior art. That prior art can range from being merely a year old, to being several millenia old. For example, the RSA patent is based upon material in a medieval manuscript. I've forgotten which patent is taken from Vinca text. Or maybe I should just point out that the business methods of the Akkadians are being patented today. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Email Tool
Andrew wrote: Because it appears that a project hasn't been started. a) You do realize that email integration was removed from OOo, don't you? b) You do realize that LAMP + OOo + Thunderbird + Firefox + the FLOSS version of Outlook (which is no longer being developed, because contrary to the claims of the people that say they will switch from Outlook to FLOSS, when the rubber hits the rod, they people who claim they will switch from Outlook, would rather stick with Outlook, than change.) can _currently_ be deployed, xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Email Tool
Alexandro wrote: What? I didnt get that at all. Can you clear your point. I'll rewrite that. a) There is a FLOSS equivalent to Outlook --- with all of the functions of outlook --- that is no longer being developed, because people were not using it; b) That OOo + several other currently existing tools can be deployed _today_ that will give you more power and functionality than MSoffice with Outlook currently has; c) People that claim they will switch if a FLOSS equivalent exists are saying that to be polite. They are not sincere, because the equivalent currently exists; [ Other than the virri, and security problems. Both of those can be arranged, for those who really want them.] So is a priority to distinguish the need vs the attachment to a tool. I am saying that people/companies are attached to the tool. The presence or absence of the specific tool is what moves them. IOW, they want an exact clone, with all of the malfunctions of the original. or is it the integration they get with Exchange A FLOSS equivalent to Exchange currently exists; And this db is very fast (sqlite I think). SQLite could be Incorporated into OOo. A new UI would be needed. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] About Writer
Charles wrote: Good morning, I wonder if the new release of Open Office includes grammar checking in Available as an add on utility. OR should I say Add on utilities . There are roughly ten grammar checkers, which provide grammar checking for roughly fifteen different languages. However, the quality of that grammar checking range is almost able to validate first person singular nominative present pluperfect subjunctive active voice. OTOH, that is about the quality of Microsoft's grammar checking. Which is a round about way of saying that if you want a grammar checker in English, you are better off using _The King's English --- for British English, or _The elements of Style _ for American English, The Lumko Institute Work book for IsiXhosa, and the equivalents in other languages. ### For a list of which grammar checker works for which languages, hunt thru OOoForums. There is a slightly different list on the OOo website. However, the last time I looked at it, it omitted at least five grammar checkers for OOo including the commercial ones. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Suggestion
On 4/5/06, Sviatoslav Feshchenko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: similar to Microsoft Front Page for web page creation. Allready part of OOo, albeit with a different set of bugs, and annoyances thn Front Page. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Loading localization strings at runtime
Tony wrote: Is that something worth adding to a wish list for some future revision? If you want to swap language you need enough understanding of the current language to go through the following longwinded process: Does anybody know why the code used in OOo 1.1.3-ZA to switch languages was not included in OOo 2.x? [Or, for that matter, the code in Pallido Office. (?sp --- the division of Sun that made StarOffice in Thai, and English.) For those that did have that OOo 1.1.3-ZA, the way to change lnguges in Windows was: Start Program Files OOo 1.1.3 Select language At this point a screen pops up --- In English --- and you select the language you want. If OOo is running, you do have to close it, for the language change to take effect So I would want to go further and have 00o automatically configure the interface where multiple language packs are installed. Since that was possible --- and done --- using OOo 1.x and 1.1.x, it should have been possible with 2.x. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Re: OPENOFFICE CALC
Liberty wrote: Every Calculator, Spreadsheet, Compiler, and Interperter, that I've seen defines 0^0 as 1. My Texas Instruments BAII Plus calculator says that 0 * 0 = 0. MY PDA says 0 * 0 = 0. My cell phone says 0 * 0 = 0. Gnumeric says 0 * 0 = 0, and gives a page full of error messages. Excel says 0 * 0 = 0. QuatroPro says 0 * 0 = 0. Lotus 123 sys 0 * 0 = 0 xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Google Acquires Writerly
Chad wrote: I marginallized his pet project of ODF What you fail to understand is that Microsoft has lost: i) The office suite war; ii) The server war; iii) The desktop war. iv) The file format war; xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Google Acquires Writerly
Chad wrote: What you don't seem to understand is that it's not over. What you don't understand is that a war can be _lost_ before the first bullet is fired. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] supporting Engineering Notation in Calc (was: Upping a Priority )
Andrew wrote: Have that large community of users vote for it; this should raise the priority. :) I was going to show the correlation between priority and votes, but all my vote search inquiries are coming back Your query returned no results. Aargh. All of my searches are coming back with that result. ### I was going to show you the issue that at one time had the most votes, and a developer sttement that won't fix,. works for me and this issue affects very few, if any people. Of course that developer is both geographically, and linguistically challenged. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Re: [users] Re: Reveal Codes
Robin wrote: I have tried to create styles (which was easy in WP) but I keep getting lost. How does can one get lost doing [for OOo 1.1.x] Format styles Catalog select style type Select style New/modify ? where I go to change something into BOLD or underline and find that it doesn't show up as expected. Multiple attempts later I finally get it. This has happened in WP, Word and OOo. This is below the level of a style but with RC, You desperately need to take the ten hours it needs, to learn what styles are,. and another 30+ hours to unlearn all of the junk that WP claims are styles, but is not, and never will. [At best, it can be described as an imitation of the drunk looking for a quarter in the light of the streetlamp, even thou he lost the money in the creek, which is twenty blocks away.] xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Great idea for Open Office
Benjamin wrote: the first to introduce a financial accounting/payroll program that would a) Office suites and accounting packages are two different things. b) There is a macro that lets OOo open QuickBook files. [Or at least some QuickBook file formats.] Why I haven't seen this concept come become a reality What would you like to add/include that can not currently be done using OOo SQL- and Ledger. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Will Calc Match This?
Dave wrote: 1 million rows and up to 16 000 columns A fully populated worksheet of that size would require 96 768 GB RAM, just to load. 1. Assuming Calc will be able to handle M$'s perverted form of XML, will it be able to handle sheets of this size? The more pertinent question is if Excel will be able to handle a sheet that is that big. 15 625 vertical sheets 63 horizontal sheets. Total of 984 375 sheets. Calc _might_ not be able to handle it. Do you have enough RAM? Do you have a large enough hard drive? Are you using very fast chips? These are requirements that were/are the purview of supercomputers, before Beowulf clusters took center stage. 2. If not, the users list will probably be flooded with posts saying in Excel I can have this many ... blah, blah, blah. That might happen. If so, then either educate people in how to use databases, and how to use spreadsheets, or go to Plan B. Does anyone here know if any development is under way to add this capacity to Calc? This might be an interesting problem Write a function/plugin/macro that makes the user think that they are using Calc, but in fact are using the dBase clone. [Circa 1994, there was a spreadsheet for Dos, that could have an infinite number of rows, columns, and pages. The limiting factor was the amount of disk space on your system. ] Plan B Record: Cell Field zero: Cell Number Field one: Page Number Field two: Column Number Field three: Row Number Field four: Cell Value field five: Cell Value Type Field six: Cell Formula Field seven: Cell Links From. Field eight: Cell Links To. Create records as needed. Keep an index of all fields. Whilst slower than Excel, it provides for more pages, columns, and rows than Excel proposes. [And suffers from the same issue: How much RAM, and disk space does your system have.] Wondering if being able to advertise a spreadsheet that can handle 1 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 pages, with 1 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 rows, and 1 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 columns is going to win any brownie points anywhere? xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Why no Outline support in write?
Michael wrote: The navigator seems to need the use of standard styles, my enterprise use his own styles, so we continue to use Word! Navigator can be configured to use custom styles. [Note: It is limited to ten styles.] xan jonathon --
Re: [discuss] people selling OpenOffice on ebay
Ray wrote: and sell them at a reasonable price. Quoting Joel Rosenberg Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Me, I've got a standing offer to sell copies for $1.75 million. No takers yet, but I only need one . . . Quoting Chad Smith Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I sold about 6 at $100 - $150 and another 4 or 5 at $30 - $60. What I did was I put it up on eBay, and instead of starting the bidding at $.99 or $5 like most people do who sell OOo on eBay, I started the biddind at $29.99 and then I put a Buy it Now! option at $150 - several sold that way. [Chad is quoting US dollars. Joel is quoting New Zealand dollars.] I thought somebody had posted a message saying that they had sold OOo for $1500, but I can't find it. :( xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Telugu Language Support
Sree wrote: Telugu is one of the major languages, I'm not sure what you want in the way of support. Teluga can be selected as the default language, _if_ CTL language is enabled. There are two IME's that can be used for Teluga input * Indic Transliterator This macro was written by the BharateyaOOo Team with CDAC, Bangalore, India. It can be obtained from http://www.ncb.ernet.in/bharateeyaoo. It supports Hindi, Tamil, Kannada, Gujarati,Telugu, and Malayalam. Text is written in the Latin writing system. It converts that to the correct language. * Aksharamala Indic Language IME created by Aksharamala LTD. Download from http://www.aksharamala.com/index.php ITRAN support. This has support for the following languages: Assamese, Bengali, Gujurati, Gurumukhi, Hindi, Kannada, Malayalam, Marathi, Sanskrit, Tamil, Teluga, Urdu I _think_ I saw spell checkers for some of the Indus Valley languages, but I don't remember which ones. :( I don't remember if it supports Teluga numbering. If not, that can be filed as an issue. [This would be trivial to add.] There is not a Teluga user interface yet. For a Teluga language user interface, a l10n team will have to be created. You'll have to talk with the Indic OOo team about that. -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Exporting OpenOffice to IRAN
YoYo wrote: Is OpenOffice american? or is it 'countryfree'? It is developed and run by an American corporation. [Sun.] Does it really have to abide by american laws? Only in the us. Is exporting OpenOffice (or other opensource software) to IRAN restricted in any way? In theory, OOo may not be distributed to, exported to, or used by nationals of countries which are on the embargoed list. In practice, OOo has been distributed to countries on the embargoed list, and used by nationals of those countries. [Their contributions to OOo have had a mixed history.] xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Re: Short list with Pro's Cons
Chuck wrote: I think you guys may want to run some hardware diagnostics on whatever If it happened on one or two machines, you might have a point. But when it happens on machines at different Kinko's locations, half a dozen of their competitors, and assorted machines at places where I have worked, the only conclusion I can draw, is that MSO was designed for somebody who never needs to create, or edit a document. It doesn't matter what version of MSO I use, or where I use it,. I can count on corruption occurring every time I hit the 10 000 word mark. Microsoft In my experience, the most reliable things about MSo are: i) Creating document that re corrupt; ii) Giving me the Blue Screen of Death; FWIW, it doesn't matter which version of Microsoft windows, or which version of MSO I use, the results are the same. Corrupt documents, and the Blue Screen of Death. or zip software was as unreliable Did you understand what I wrote: About once a week for compressed files. Usually because of transmission glitches. The issue is _transmission_ glitches. Data that is garbled when it is transmitted from one point as binary data to another point. xan jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Re: Short list with Pro's Cons
Chuck wrote: In all seriousness, when was the last time you experienced corruption in a compressed document? About once a week for compressed files. Usually because of transmission glitches. As far as documents go, anytime I create a document with MSo, that contains 10 000 words, I can be assured that it will be corrupt, the next time I try to open it. xn jonathon -- Ethical conduct is a vice. Corrupt conduct is a virtue. Motto of Nacarima.
Re: [discuss] Re: Official request for rectification of Mr. Andrew Brown's article
Jacqueleine wrote: Please remember that we are all *real* people on the other end of these It would be really nice if the people responding to things filed in Issuezilla acted the same way. [The comments in the comma as decimal separator issues are just one example.] xan jonathon -- This is our sandbox and if we want to throw sand we can
Re: [discuss] Re: Official request for rectification of Mr. Andrew Brown's article
Enrique wrote: Currently, my impression is that the only channel to OOo developers is isuezilla reporting and votes. I came to the conclusion that votes for issues don't count about two years ago. The issue with the second or third highest number of votes had several comments from developers to the effect that they were not going to bother implementing this feature, because it was required by so few people. [I don't remember which feature it was for, but it was one which only a linguistically challenged person would not see as an issue.] xan jonathon -- This is our sandbox and if we want to throw sand we can
Re: [discuss] Re: Re: Re: Email vital for Desktop Linux adoption, prime role available for OOo
Chadf wrote: Care to give any evidence at all that this happened? Personal experience. xan jonathon
Re: [discuss] Re: Re: Re: Email vital for Desktop Linux adoption, prime role available for OOo
Chad wrote: This is not, however, anything close to what MS did. What Microsoft did do, was go to second, third, and fourth tier vendors and say: Pay us $100 for every system you sell that does _NOT_) contain an operating system. Pay us $200 for every system you sell that contains the operating system of a competitor. If a vendor failed to adhere to that, then the vendor was shut down, and all assets went to Microsoft. Want to explain the difference between that, and paying protection money to the local mafioso? xan jonathon -- This is our sandbox and if we want to throw sand we can
Re: [discuss] Google jamming open and office ?
Lars wrote: I get the distinct feeling that its marketing or lobbying team is trying to dilute or confuse the phrase open office in the same way they tried with the initials RMS For people on Gmail, take look at the sponsored links (right hand side of the page) for the OOo lists. [I've got two adds offering MSO for free, one suggesting that OOo is bloatware, and to use MSO instead. One for weboffice. Related pages --- which are not paid for --- are Microsoft press releases.) xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Re: a more complete office suite
Rod wrote: Without an email/pim component many will do just that. It's called MSO. Is that what you really want? Just what functionality does MSO + Outlook offer, that can not be replicated by using OOo + FireFox + ThunderBird + SunBird + the appropriate templates? I have yet to hear a call for a Tetris component, music composition, or audio editing, for instance. I've seen requests for all three of those on various OOo lists. Somebody did write a macro to play Tetris within OOo. [Now wondering what would happen if somebody were to toss the python audio editing modules into OOo source code.] A good case could be made that open-source development is the most unfocused, Since there is no centralized location of closed source projects, you don't see all the junk that they don't produce. so *suggesting* that OOo should somehow integrate an email/calendar/pim, preferably by cooperating with the Mozilla project, is actually quite conservative. Probably the simplest in the short/medium term. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Re: a more complete office suite
Chad wrote: (5) OOo can already do it if you write this macro, hack this code, download this patch, compile this completely unrelated program, build this bridge in Perl, and it only works on Linux -- plus it's not gonna work exactly like you think it should.. (NOTE: #5 is an exaggeration to prove a point, That is _not_ an exaggeration, if you want to edit PDFs in OOo. Kinda like what happened with Base. The argument against Base was slightly different. For starters, OOo 1.x included a dBase clone, and had (some) hooks for SQL interactivity. The big issue was which SQL database implementation was going to be Incorporated into OOo. ** _If_ the hooks for an email client are included in OOo, then the questions are: i) Can a bridge to an existing email client be written? or ii) is it better to compile an existing email client into OOo? However, if what people mean by outlook is _not_ an email client, but a calendar function, or a PIM, then solution is much different: To wit: i) Find/replace/update the dBase templates, and document how to use them. ii) Document how to read/write/edit data in _thisPIM_ using OOo. [Where thisPIM is a PIM. Write one document for every known PIM.] iii) Document how to read/write/edit data in _thisCalenderFunction_ using OOo. [Where ThisCalenderFunction is a Calendar. Write one document for every known Calendar.] xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] a more complete office suite
Rigel wrote: An office suite typicaly includes e-mail, an address book, and schedule, as well as a project management application, which hasn't been mentioned. The only one of those items that can not be done within OOo 1.0.3 is email. Unfortuntly, the templates for project mangement and scheduling for OOo seem to have disappeared. :( xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Re: a more complete office suite
Chad wrote: Google has, from the beginning, stated their goal is to Don't be evil. And to this point, they aren't. When you have a chance, start apply Forensic Lingusitic Analysis to Google's statements. Doing so will make it patently obvious that they re doing some nefarious things. Providing links into Thunderbird would be different than, say, providing links into AOL's email. You are right here. [I'm not sure that's a real place, but you get my point.] It used to be. The It takes away choice argument is pretty old with me. Depending upon how an email is incorproted into OOo, it may, or may not limit choice. With the way Base is integrated, one can still use MySQL SQLite, etc. Adding hooks into Thunderbird (which, to me, seems to be the easiest route) or creating an ODF based OOo email client with calendaring and address book, would only enhance OpenOffice.org, and not detract from it. It probably is better to configure Thunderbird/SunBird to read/write ODF than create a new OOo mail client. [Especially if the email hooks are allredy prt of the OOo base code.] xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] a more complete office suite
Chad wrote: Why? - WHY? Because it makes *SENSE* to, that's why. It makes absolutely no sense to include an email client in an office suite. spell-checker should draw from the same list of words. That is what elm is for. It makes sense that since email is mostly words, and text documents are mostly words, the interface should be similiar, if not identical. But email and docuemtns are two completly different crittters. They might have words in common, but that is _all_ they have in common. It makes much more sense for OOo to be functionally equivalent to a Dekstop Publishing Program, than to be functinally equivalent to an email client. contact information (Names, emails, addresses, phone numbers, birthdays, relationships, Those datapoints belong in a databse. How many email client can reaed a _true_ database --- something thaty can be created and edited using SQL? For these, and I am sure dozens of other reasons, How many email clients can read MySQL, Oracle, FireBird, SQLite or similar databases? it makes sense to have an email client as a part of your office suite, whether that suite is How can it make sense to include something, which is incapable of using the tools it _needs_ to perform its function? xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] thanks, quick question
Timothy wrote: whether or not this is completely legal. It is legal to use. You can also sell, or give away as many copies as you want to. xan joanthon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Request to unsusbscribe (or at least ignore) Chad
Marco wrote: objective data, with a determination that can only be explained by: 1) serious mental disability, or 2) deliberate trolling 3) He still hopes to become a stand up comic. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] japanese input
Pble wrote: 1) I believe it would be relatively simple to add a function that automatically fills in the This is one of those functions that is much more difficult than it looks. 2) Japanese companies often use a single or a few kanji..ncased in a circle, Use Draw to create the appropriate graphic. Toss the graphic into your OOoClipArt Gallery, for future use. 3) have writer integrated with an online open source English-Japanese Japanese-English diction nay such as that of Jim Breen's of Monash University. That is merely grunt work. Option # 1: Convert the source data into OOoVocabulary format. Option # 2: Write a new translation macro; 4)Add japanese to supported languages using complex text layout You can currently create Japanese documents with the writing direction either vertical, or horizontal. [Both L2R R2L.] xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Re: Mixed language text spellchecking question
Cono wrote: No, you just need ONE extra style for each extra language. Read my previous message. What you recommend in that message works only if the document hs _one_ pragraph style. The moment you need two or more paragraph styles, that hve multi-lingual text in them, you need a chrcter style for each language. [Not to mention paragraph, numbering and maybe even page styles that are language specific.] chnge color for on the screen, if you like. That is a good arguement in fvor of using styles. But it has virtually zero applicability on the practical world. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Re: Mixed language text spellchecking question
Shoshannah wrote: should be able to handle mixed language documents transparently, Set the default Western language to English, and default CTL language to Hebrew. I don't remember if different fonts re required. [I use different fonts, purely becuase I think that David looks better than Lucida Sans Unicode for Hebrew.] That _usually_ automtically switches languages for me. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Re: Mixed language text spellchecking question
Nicolas wrote: - and I may be wrong there, but can you apply multiple character styles to the same word Each character in a word can have a different character style. A character may only have one character style and one paragraph style, though. Separating language from styles would permit : - syncing the language with input method (what this user asked) - displaying the current language so users can actually know what I had a macro that did that.[I don't remember if it just showed the western language, or if it showed the CTL OR CKJ language if either of the latter was being used.] - and a lot of other cool language-management enhancements (language-specific word count, highlighting of a specific language when you want a native speaker to check these parts, etc), which are not possible right now when language is hidden in styles Those are currently doable, if somebody spends the time writing the appropriate macros. If you don't create a very simple style that only specifies language, there is bound to be bad juju interaction with formatting. Create a parallel style for every language. This ends up with a number of styles, but it keeps the formatting straight. [Just don't save your document in RTF.] Also if you go through styles that means users will have to set up what style to apply with what input every time they change documents That is what templates are for. Or just add all 10 000 styles you have created to your default template. Nicolas wrote: From a pure UI POW what most users expect is a dropdown control with a language list in the toolbar (like for styles, but strictly limited to language), and a key accel to quickly switch between the languages Andrew Brown wrote: This could surely be cludged around with an addin. Your proposed kludge is fairly simple: i) Duplicate the current cell/paragraph/character style. ii) Change the language to the new language; iii) Save new character style. and iv) Hope that the user remembers that they have already created a character style with the language that they want to use. [If they don't their style sheet will be littered with styles that they created as one shot uses. Search/Replace can't search for character styles, to clean that mess up.] Nicolas wrote: but I don't feel we are making any sense to the styling camp. Essentially, the choices are: i) Include language as a style attribute; ii) Include style as a language attribute; Both approaches have their good points, and their bad points. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Multiple character styles (was: Re: Mixed language text spellchecking question)
Giuseppe wrote: you can't have multiple character styles for the same text Is this really? Depends upon what is meant by can't have multiple character styles in the same text. I've written documents where I liberally tossed Greek, Hebrew, Latin, Chinese, and Afrikaans together into the same sentence. I've also had each letter in a word in a different color by using different character style for each letter. Now if you want pink Russian, followed by a purple Russian chracter, you can do that, but have to create a pink Russian character style and a purple Russian character style. Coming from WordPerfect, WordPerfect is based on text streaming, so style effects can be cumulative. OOo is based on objects, so style effects are not cumulative. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Re: OpenOffice.org 2.0 - How to install multiple UI-Languages?
GRS wrote: With 2.0 you can install language packs for those languages you need. This assumes that they exist, of cource. They don't appear to exist for windows. Please check the various native language pages to see what they have. And that ignores the l10n projects that do not hve native lnguage pages on OpenOffice.org. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Re: Re: Re: re: Massachussetts registered voters
Chad wrote: What he said was a functional sentence, but it just didn't make sense in context. What he wrote makes perfect sense. What it means is not congruent with what he thought it meant. doesn't mean I should try to translate his English emails into English! I realize that you lack the ability to translate English into English. But that is a fairly easy skill to acquire --- but only if the individual who desires to acquire that skill spends time in libraries --- a function that you have admitted you have no intention of ever doing. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Re: Re: Re: re: Massachussetts registered voters
Daniel wrote: Jonathon and I inmediately realized that there was an error I didn't realize that what he wrote was not what he meant, until he rewrote it. Though it did cross my mind to wonder why anybody would mention psychosocial dynamics and applied philosophy to Chad, when he has demonstrated a marked inability to grasp rudimentary logic. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Re: re: Massachussetts registered voters
Chad wrote: I never had a single problem other than fonts transfer files from one to The only time I successfully transfer documents between MSOffice97, MSOffice2K and MSOfficeXP, is when I rewrite the entire 500 page document either from scratch, or transcribing the printout. In every case MSOffice has failed to correctly read the file that was created using a different version of MSOffice. Font issues were the least of them. Entire markup formating gets demolished in the switch. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Re: re: Massachussetts registered voters
Nicols wrote: Home users like Chad do not realise the budgets corporations are ready to extend on standardisation, because even if the sums are pharaonic At times I think Chad does mortgage closings, where the idea of uniform file formats is an alien, and strange thing. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Feature in Lotus WordPro
Mark wrote: in essence, an underline function that is only as long as the text. Sounds like you want:CTRLF12 Paragraph styles Underlining Then check the check box Individual Words. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards?
Re: [discuss] Google - no thanks
Laurent wrote: i already did it using OOoWikipedia Well it is not Google completeness, It wouldn't take much to changer the OOoWikipedia macro to a G-OOogle macro. IIRC, all it requires is a simple change of the URL that is called. Off topic question: Are there _any_ search engines that provide _relevent_ results within the first 30 pages of a search? [The way Google did, circa 1998] Chad wrote: You conspiracy theory nutjobs need to get a life - seriously. Google supplies surveillance data to a number of illegitimate regimes, who perpetuate rape, pillage, and death on the inhabitants of the territory who oppose those regimes. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Google - no thanks
Chad wrote: Google does not do those things. That is very wishful thinking on your part. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Google - no thanks
Justin wrote: How about a button for integration with Wikipedia's sister project http://en.wiktionary.org/ a dictionary wiki which seems a natural fit Once upon a time, a wikionary macro for OOo was available. However, I couldn't find it when I went hunting for it two or so months ago, and a request on one of the OOo lists failed to provide any leads as to where in cyberspace it was hidden. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Office 12 interview
Daniel wrote: Incidentally, he doesn't really enter into a lot of detail about why it whould be so difficult. He just says it's very difficult. It is difficult for microsoft, becuase they would have to implement it correctly. And that means that they have to fix all of the bugs that cause documents created in MSO 2003 to be incompatible with MSO 2003. *** Another quote from the rticle: #It used to be that the format was something that you changed every single release and nobody thought about it. Now, what people are saying is, We don't mind change, we like change, but we want it to have very specific value propositions. I do not know _any_ business that likes to change their file formats, simply because the software programmer made a whimsical decision to change file formats. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] English GUI (not American)
Chris wrote: There does not appear to be a English English version of OO, Look for the English (UK) version. I have both OOo 1.1.4 English (UK) and OOo 1.9.130 English (UK) installed on my system. [What I'd really like is English (ZA)] it would be a major 'selling' point for OO (as it is for Linux) if it had a proper English interface. (It is a major issue educationally.) I At least one Linux distribution also comes in an English (UK) flavour. [Now wondering why translate.org,za doesn't provide an English (ZA) flavour of Linux, or OOo.] would be willing to 'translate' a list of American words if it were a simple matter. Pootle makes it fairly easy to do the translations. The downside is that you either need a good Internet connection, or have it installed locally on high powered system. [Minimum RAM requirements: 1 GB. Minimum hard disk requirements: 5 GB. Athalon (or better) Chip rated at 2.5+GHrz. (Celeron chips are totally inadequate for the job.) xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Re: Beyond 2.0
Chad wrote: To stay current (read *AHEAD* of Microsoft) we need a functional, working, easy-to-use, standards-compliant, WYSIWYG HTML editor. Upgraading the HTML output to HTML 4.01 + CSS 1.0 would be a good start. But we could get rid of the useless ones like ` and ~ . The tilde is significant for modem connections, and some websites on a LAMP platform. soon (and it's already started happening) you'll be able to make up your own keyboard layout. On Linux, that ability hs been around since around 1990. I don't remember when that ability first became available on Windows. If you are refering to programable keyboards with 128 keys, those have been available for at least a decade. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Grammar Checker missing
On 9/16/05, Mr susserj wrote: Without a grammar checker similar to WordPerfect or Word it is not useful to me. Is there any reason why you haven't installed a grammar checker for OOo, since you think one is needed? xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Office Writer
On 9/19/05, Sweet Coffee wrote: Are there any add-ons available that will do grammer checking in OOo. Grammar Checking The end user must download and install the grammar checker. An Gramadóir An Gramadóir is a Perl based grammar checker. More information is obtainable from http://borel.slu.edu/gramadoir/index.html CoGrOO CoGrOO is being rewritten in Python. The prior version worked, but could not be integrated into the OOo API. This is still pre-alpha. More information can be obtained from http://www.pcs.usp.br/cgi-bin/jkinoshi/cogroo/experimente.cgi Cymraeg Cymraeg is a commercial grammar checker for Welsh. A demo of it can be obtained from http://www.bangor.ac.uk/ar/cb/cymraeg/demo_meddalwedd.php Language Tool Language Tool is a Java based grammar checker. More information is obtainable from http://tkltrans.sourceforge.net/ and http://www.danielnaber.de/. I'm missing at least one grammar checker for OOo. [I'll list it in the updated version of _OOo in a Multi-Lingual Environment_, which I hope to put by the end of the month.] xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] selling open office
On 9/10/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why is this ok? The LPGL does not prohibit commercial distribution. Which means tht anybody who desires to, can sell OOo, at whtever price s/he obtain for it. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] grammar
CP Hennessy wrote: open the same document as OOo 1.9.128. Well I hope that you've open a bug report with a sample document. I haven't had the time to create a non-proprietary document that has the same characteristics. I'll probably run into doing a rewrite of _OOo in Multi-Lingual Environment_. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Office Writer
Amy wrote: it does not recognize numerals in the spell check. User configurable option. It also does not detect repeated words, punctuation marks The grammar checker usually picks that up. or extra spaces. User configurable option. Also, there is not a grammar checker or at least there is not in the English version. You have to add that yourself. It may be a good place to start for developing a grammar check. I'm not sure what the advantage of having five different grammar checkers for OOo is. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] grammar
On 9/10/05, CPHennessy wrote: You should find that OOo2.0 will be much faster. You can now download and test a beta of version 2 from http://openoffice.org With the doucments I work with, OOo 1.1.5 takes about an hour less to open the same document as OOo 1.9.128. I'm still trying to figure out in wht respect OOo 2Beta is faster than OOo 1.1.x. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Text Direction Suggestions Questions
Ranger Lacy wrote: make ANY text or language or font bi-directional. OOo 1.1.3 Use _Draw_ with FontWorks as your text editor. Boustrophedon capabilities. The current workaround is to setup a L2R and R2L styles. At the end of each line, hit enter, and it _should_ wrap correctly. Adding/deleting/editing text on a line is a major PITA. Note: This does not work, if you use Rongo-Rongo, or languages with the same boustrophedon qualities. I desire to help put this language into the environment. Last time I checked there were 10 000+ conlangs, of which, maybe ten, were spoken by more than a hundred people. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Online usage?
Daniel wrote: unusual. OpenOffice takes up 268 MB on my system. My OOo 1.1.5 English (UK) directory: 164 MB / 2 181 Files / 133 Folders My OOo 1.1.4 English(UK) directory: 333 MB / 2 316 Files / 128 Folders My OOo 1.1.3-ZA directory: 453 MB / 4 395 Files / 258 Folders My OOo 1.9.125 English(US) directory: 355 MB / 3 277 Files / 323 Folders In theory, they all contain the same dictionaries, and other customizations. I _think_ it my OOo 1.1.2 (Japanese) directory, which after I added my normal customizations, was 600+ MB in size. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Open Office Question
James wrote: 1. Will Open Office save a .pdf file and/or does it work in conjunction Saves/creates a PDF on your own. No need for acrobat. called Solver that allows and creates various fitting parameters. Data Dataplot is the function I think youa re looking for. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Re: To Close for Comfort?
Bruce wrote: If you're going to use autocomplete successfully, you have to train it. The only way to train it, is to turn it off. Klagelieder Klagovisorna Matteus Matthaeus Matthäus Tit Tite Tito Titu Zec Zech Zecha Zechar Zechari For a couple of examples where autocomplete wants to use the wrong word. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Re: Peter, and other volunteers, please stop duplicate messages, was: Greetings
Mrco wrote: Yes. I am seriously proposing to look, or at least put a request on the web pages, for somebody who can do it. I suggested something based on subject and sender, so it would work in i), iv), v) and vi). You conveniently ignored the critical thing in my message. Post the procmail recipe that you think does what you claim can be done. I have also already answered about how the subject-less messages should be treated. It's much easier: just discard all of them, Ah, so you go for the let us prove that we are a big faceless corporation who does not care about you, because we have more money in the bank the the gross national product of the country you live in approach. At some point you have to be realistic about how meaningful some effort is and draw the line. High touch solutions are not easy high tech solutions. The _correct_ way to win hearts and minds, is to use High Touch methods. In other words, there are humans who check all messages from unsubscribed addresses to block spam? But a lot of spam comes without subject, just like a lot of real questions from unsubscribed users. a) Less than 1% of the spam I get t this account has no subject line. I'm guessing that more than 1% of the messages on the various OOo lists I am subscribed to have no subject line. b) I suspect that a Bayes f(?sp) filter could detect/eliminate more spam than relying on the lack of a subject line. So, what do the moderators do? I am not a moderator on any OOo list. I have run mailing lists in the past, and currently moderate a couple on yahoogroups. I don't have to open and read the messages on the lists I currently moderate, or used to run, to know if they were spam or not. [When I open them, my only question is how much editing I will have to do.] So, summing up, probably procmail *could* work even with (some) Could is not the same as does. So post those procmail recipes. I, for one, am waiting to see your alleged solution. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Re: Peter, and other volunteers, please stop duplicate messages, was: Greetings
Marco wrote: You conveniently ignored the critical thing in my message. which would be, if I may ask? The procmail recipes. Without them, your entire thesis is invalid. With them, it probably is still invalid. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Eurasian Native-Lang Groupe
Peter wrote: There is no such thing as Eurasian Language Group. It does not exist. a) Would Variant Cyrillic writing systems group be meaningful to anybody but grammatologists? It is slightly more accurate, since all of the language groups that are currently part of that project, do, or did at one point in time, use the Cyrillic writing system, or a variant thereof. b) All language group creations are artificial. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Text Color Changing in Writer
Zachery wrote: However, I have been unable to make the modified template (i.e. _textRed) reappear in the Stylist character menu after saving the template, File Templates Save File Templates Organize Find the file you just saved, then select it to be the default template. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] 1.15rc v 2 beta
Andrew wrote: why is it still being developed with 2 so near completion? a) It is a bug fix of 1.1.4. b) It looks like the 2.0 beta has been knocked back another month or two; c) 1.1.5 was originally scheduled for release in April, or May. [It was also going to be simultaneous with, or after the 2.0 release.] xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Re: Why I had to switch back to MS Word
Bruce wrote: OpenOffice.org 1.1 gives you everything you'd expect in office software. So what do you expect in an Office Suite: i) Database functionality; ii) Spreadsheet functionality;; iii) Word Processing functionality; iv) Graphics functionality; v) Contact Management functionality; vi) Project Management functionality. vii) Presentation creation/editing; Some have also argued for inclusion of the following: viii) Email read/write/send ix) Accounting functionality; x) Scheduling functionality Look at MSOffice Small Business Edition: i) Database: Neither included, nor kludges available. Must buy and install Access or other database program; ii) Spreadsheet: included; iii) Word Processing: Included; iv) Graphics functionality: Included v) Contact management: Requires Outlook to be installed. vi) Project management: Neither included, nor kludges available. Must buy and install Project Manager or other software vii) Presentation: Neither included, nor kludges available. Must buy and install Presentation Manager or other software. viii) Email: Requires installation of Outlook. ix) Accounting: Neither included, nor kludges available. Requires installation of Money, or other accounting program. x) Scheduling: Neither included, nor kludges available. Can somebody explain why MSoffice Small Business Edition qualifies as an office suite, since it leaves out so many things that an office suite is expected to have. OOo 1.1.x i) Database functionality; Included ii) Spreadsheet functionality;; Included iii) Word Processing functionality; Included iv) Graphics functionality; Included v) Contact Management functionality; Template used to be available. Recommendation is to use SunBird. vi) Project Management functionality. Template used to be available. Recommendation is to use another program for project management. vii) Presentation creation/editing; Included viii) Email read/write/send. Neither included, nor kludges available.Install Thunderbird ix) Accounting functionality; Templates are available. Recommendation is to use SQL Ledger. x) Scheduling: Templates used to be available. Recommendation to use project management software. Of those, the only one that OOo can not do is email. Three other programs are recommended, instead of using OOo. OOo 2.0 is in the same situation as OOo 1.1.x. If you're used to using other office suites - such as Microsoft Office - you'll be completely at home with OpenOffice.org 1.1. This refers to ease of use. If one knows how to use one office suite, one can easilly learn to use another office suite --- in this instance OOo. could be taken as a statement that OOo is a clone of MSO. Following that logic, MSoffice is a clone of GeoWorks, and Lotus SmartSuite is a clone of AppleWorks. we don't have all the features and we're not thinking of implement them You are confusing functionality with specific features. it's bug for bug compatible*, it's not going to be a wholly viable product. In taht case MSOffice doesn't fit your needs either. Or did you not know that different versions of MSOfficeXP have different bugs? [The same thing is also true of MSoffice97, MSOffice, and MSOffice98.] xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Re: translation option on OpenOffice 2.0
Lisa wrote: purchased the software and I have a paper that was written for grad Email it to me,. Do you just want the text in an emai, or a PDF? xan joanthon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Re: Re: Thinking OOo - Work efficient with text
Robin wrote: reveal codes is much more useful. a) There is a reveal codes macro for the Write and Calc components of OOo 1.1.x. I haven't tested to see if they also work with the beta version of OOo 2.0. b) It is not as useful for OOo as for WP, because of fundamental differences in how styles are defined, and used. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] translation option on OpenOffice 2.0
Steph wrote: the ability to convert or translate document from one Language to Another . i) Which of the translation addons did you install? ii) Which of the glossaries for that translation addon did you install? I have to go too the web. That sounds like you installed a CAT, instead of a MAT. Did you want a CAT or a MAT? make the translation feature better. If you have suggestions, the author of the tools that you installed would like to know what they are. AFAIK, _none_ of them subscribe to either of the lists that you sent this message to. xan jonathon -- Does your Office Suite conform to ISO Standards? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Lingua Latina
Graham wrote: Cool, perhaps you could explain how, for Stardocks benefit. The OP didn't give their operating system. Without that, odds are that the instructions I write won't apply. xan jonathon -- A Fork requires: Seven systems with: 1+ GHz Processors 2+ GB RAM 0.25 TB Hard drive space - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Lingua Latina
Stardock wrote: create an easier way to put macrons over vowels? Easier than what? I can type them directly from my keyboard. xan jonathon -- A Fork requires: Seven systems with: 1+ GHz Processors 2+ GB RAM 0.25 TB Hard drive space - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Open Office Binder
Craig wrote: One of the most powerful features of Microsoft Office was the Binder. I never saw the point of Binder , and apparently many people don't, since Microsoft dropped support of it a couple of versions ago. This allowed multiple documents to be stored in a single container for easy swapping, storage and organization. Would a) put all of the documents in the same folder; b) zipping the folder up; c) Exchanging that zip archive suffice? With one application open on my task bar, I had quick access to dozens of documents Do you want all of those documents: a) Open at the same time? b) Just listed in the history button? or Something else? xan jonathon -- A Fork requires: Seven systems with: 1+ GHz Processors 2+ GB RAM 0.25 TB Hard drive space - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Tedious?
Marq wrote: I just started using Open Office two weeks ago, but since it hasn't got Dutch spelling I had to reassign these files to Word. a) Install the Dutch dictionary. [Use DictOOo for 1.1.x. For 1.9.x, it is a selection off of Files. b) Change, or create language specific styles [ paragraph, numbering, character, and maybe page. ] xan jonathon -- A Fork requires: Seven systems with: 1+ GHz Processors 2+ GB RAM 0.25 TB Hard drive space - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Grammar Checker
Bill wrote: Is there a grammar checker that will work with OO? Four of them: One considers itself to be alpha/pre-alpha; One considers itself to be beta; One considers itself to be commercially viable; One considers itself to be pre-alpha One considers that calling it pre-alpha gives it a degree of stability that it lacks; Is there a plan for it to be in future versions? What language --- some languages currently have grammar checkers in alpha, or beta, that are better than microsoft's. xan jonathon -- A Fork requires: Seven systems with: 1+ GHz Processors 2+ GB RAM 0.25 TB Hard drive space - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Odd...
Daniel wrote: What's g17n? Proof that I can't spell four letter words. It should be G11N -- Globalization. what's v17n? v11n : Versification xan jonathon -- A Fork requires: Seven systems with: 1+ GHz Processors 2+ GB RAM 0.25 TB Hard drive space - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Re: HBS WK: Who will win Microsoft or Linux?
Wesley wrote: And BIND is a niche product? Ever tried to buy BIND, or equivalant at Frye's? xan jonathon -- A Fork requires: Seven systems with: 1+ GHz Processors 2+ GB RAM 0.25 TB Hard drive space - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Re: HBS WK: Who will win Microsoft or Linux?
Chuck wrote: My point is that OSS will never be more than a small niche compared to commercial software. It is such a small niche that microsoft has announced that they have lost, and will continue to lose market share in the desktop, and office suite, due to FLOSS products. free = piece of crap, expensive equals great software with great support. Perceptions rule. Microsoft has admitted that without FUD, they will lose market share faster than they have been. OSS has been available for years to fill many needs and yet it never garners more than 1-2% of the market. Market share measurements of FLOSS have never been reliable. I haven't looked at any market share data recently, but the last time I did, Linux BSD were the OS of choice for servers. Linux had a 20% market share on desktops. OOo had a 10% market share in office suites. Firefox/Thunderbird/Mozilla had between a 5% and 10% market share. You would do well to remember what the most popular and most used browser, and email client at One Microsoft Way is. They are all superior to their commercial counterparts but are no where near replacing them in the market. a) FLOSS is barely past the stage of being just good enough. EG: Calc is nowhere near the equal of Excel, for heavy number crunchers. [The people who spend $1K+ for a spreadsheet template.] For most people, OOo is just good enough. b) FLOSS suffers from a distinct lack of good, effective marketing. Firefox is better than MIE, but it (Firefox) suffers from an extreme lack of marketing to Joe Sixpack. xan jonathon -- A Fork requires: Seven systems with: 1+ GHz Processors 2+ GB RAM 0.25 TB Hard drive space - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [discuss] Spreadsheet feature
Jan wrote: the lack of an ability to select a range of cells to be used for error bars when graphing results. Can you provide a more comprehensive explanation of what you want? And maybe put up a webpge that shows a couple of examples of it. xan jonathon -- A Fork requires: Seven systems with: 1+ GHz Processors 2+ GB RAM 0.25 TB Hard drive space - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
