Re: Django Generator
2010/2/13 Philippe Ombredanne : > Brice: > Very nice start. > There is a long history of similar tools and they all have a place and > a purpose. > I remember fondly of some tool that generated CRUD dbase apps from a > db schema .. that was last century ... > So carry on! Thank you. I'm focusing right now on unittest. Once forms unittest is done I will start adding new feature > Just a few notes: > - the generator page takes quite a bit of vertcal real estate: a more > compact display may be better? I'm thinking of having the field condensed on 1 line and being able to expand detail view using js. As I explained before, if you have any advice on usability/design I would be very happy to hear about them ! Once I'm done with permissions and forms, I will probably work a little more on the website itself adding a page to provide an overview of the project without having to register, a feedback tool, help section and a tutorial. > - if the goal is to provide a tool for non-developers, you may be > expose a bit too much of django internals: for instance such a user > may not care for the field types, know what a model is, etc. Yet if it > is for hand-holding django newbies you introduce many concepts that a > newbie may not know about yet. So my 2 cents would be to pick a target > user and focus on one or the other. As I see it today, only a django > user would be able to make sense of it. I agree on that but I'm not really fixed on the direction and audience for the project. I try to keep it as simple as possible, so it's not to hard to maintain and provide good and clean output. I hate those project that never works because you have to learn about it. I would like this project to generate easy to read code, with no dependencies and using django and python recommandation. My first thought was a solution to provide quickly basic models, forms and views so it give me more time to focus on fun and complex behavior. > - the license you picked seems to me a bit odd for software > http://github.com/debrice/djangogenerator/blob/master/LICENSE , you > may want to consider something more common: the same as django is > usually the simplest and best. I will investigate on this. > - some pointers on some similar tools may give you some more ideas, > google web site generator > there are many similar tools for RAILS, PHP, JSP, ASP, etc I will google that ;) > Bon courage! > Philippe Merci Philippe ! -- blog: http://www.debrice.com project: http://www.kaaloo.com http://www.djangogenerator.com linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/in/bricepleroy -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
Brice: Very nice start. There is a long history of similar tools and they all have a place and a purpose. I remember fondly of some tool that generated CRUD dbase apps from a db schema .. that was last century ... So carry on! Just a few notes: - the generator page takes quite a bit of vertcal real estate: a more compact display may be better? - if the goal is to provide a tool for non-developers, you may be expose a bit too much of django internals: for instance such a user may not care for the field types, know what a model is, etc. Yet if it is for hand-holding django newbies you introduce many concepts that a newbie may not know about yet. So my 2 cents would be to pick a target user and focus on one or the other. As I see it today, only a django user would be able to make sense of it. - the license you picked seems to me a bit odd for software http://github.com/debrice/djangogenerator/blob/master/LICENSE , you may want to consider something more common: the same as django is usually the simplest and best. - some pointers on some similar tools may give you some more ideas, google web site generator there are many similar tools for RAILS, PHP, JSP, ASP, etc Bon courage! Philippe -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
Thank you Wolf, I think you're right on the necessity of a tutorial once beta is reach. I'll try to fight against complexity but as new feature will appear that will probably become a sine qua non condition. Thank you for your support. Brice 2010/2/10 Wolf Halton : > It is a great idea, Brice. I was playing with it last night. It will > really help the beginners along. I am imagining a tutorial for your > generator that shows people how to structure a useful project and then walks > the reader through their own code to help them understand what the generator > has done for them. > > Wolf > > On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 11:55 AM, Brice Leroy wrote: >> >> Hello everybody, >> >> I woke up this morning and saw all those email and I would like to >> thank you all for all those advices and support you wrote. That >> motivates me even more to work on it. >> >> The project being in alpha stage, please keep in mind that your >> project integrity and its storage is not guaranteed and the data model >> will probably evolve a lot during the next month (I don't want to use >> south until beta) >> >> I'll will now focus and reaching the beta stage: >> - Form generator >> - View generator >> - Permissions >> - more unittest >> - PEP8 code compliant generation >> - Some pluggable (profile, registration, djangodblog, django-mailer...) >> - A user guide >> - settings.py customization >> (wow... way more things than I though...) >> >> If you have any idea concerning unit-test generation, I would be >> please to hear about it. I'm actually thinking about adding some test >> for each forms using client so it can become easy to customize. The >> direction the project is taking is a learning tool and a project fast >> start tool. >> >> Again, any idea on the tool is welcome. >> >> If you're good in layout, feel free to recommend a better one too. The >> project is advanced enough to give you an idea of what's need to be >> visible and not too much so it can be quickly modified. >> >> Atamert Ölçgen: I'll try to fix the issue with the choice field as >> nicely as possible (casting or js trick) so it doesn't break the >> usability. >> >> Thank you all again ! >> >> Brice >> -- blog: http://www.debrice.com project: http://www.kaaloo.com http://www.djangogenerator.com linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/in/bricepleroy -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
It is a great idea, Brice. I was playing with it last night. It will really help the beginners along. I am imagining a tutorial for your generator that shows people how to structure a useful project and then walks the reader through their own code to help them understand what the generator has done for them. Wolf On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 11:55 AM, Brice Leroy wrote: > Hello everybody, > > I woke up this morning and saw all those email and I would like to > thank you all for all those advices and support you wrote. That > motivates me even more to work on it. > > The project being in alpha stage, please keep in mind that your > project integrity and its storage is not guaranteed and the data model > will probably evolve a lot during the next month (I don't want to use > south until beta) > > I'll will now focus and reaching the beta stage: > - Form generator > - View generator > - Permissions > - more unittest > - PEP8 code compliant generation > - Some pluggable (profile, registration, djangodblog, django-mailer...) > - A user guide > - settings.py customization > (wow... way more things than I though...) > > If you have any idea concerning unit-test generation, I would be > please to hear about it. I'm actually thinking about adding some test > for each forms using client so it can become easy to customize. The > direction the project is taking is a learning tool and a project fast > start tool. > > Again, any idea on the tool is welcome. > > If you're good in layout, feel free to recommend a better one too. The > project is advanced enough to give you an idea of what's need to be > visible and not too much so it can be quickly modified. > > Atamert Ölçgen: I'll try to fix the issue with the choice field as > nicely as possible (casting or js trick) so it doesn't break the > usability. > > Thank you all again ! > > Brice > > -- > blog: http://www.debrice.com > project: http://www.kaaloo.com http://www.djangogenerator.com > linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/in/bricepleroy > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Django users" group. > To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en. > > -- This Apt Has Super Cow Powers - http://arrowstars.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
Hello everybody, I woke up this morning and saw all those email and I would like to thank you all for all those advices and support you wrote. That motivates me even more to work on it. The project being in alpha stage, please keep in mind that your project integrity and its storage is not guaranteed and the data model will probably evolve a lot during the next month (I don't want to use south until beta) I'll will now focus and reaching the beta stage: - Form generator - View generator - Permissions - more unittest - PEP8 code compliant generation - Some pluggable (profile, registration, djangodblog, django-mailer...) - A user guide - settings.py customization (wow... way more things than I though...) If you have any idea concerning unit-test generation, I would be please to hear about it. I'm actually thinking about adding some test for each forms using client so it can become easy to customize. The direction the project is taking is a learning tool and a project fast start tool. Again, any idea on the tool is welcome. If you're good in layout, feel free to recommend a better one too. The project is advanced enough to give you an idea of what's need to be visible and not too much so it can be quickly modified. Atamert Ölçgen: I'll try to fix the issue with the choice field as nicely as possible (casting or js trick) so it doesn't break the usability. Thank you all again ! Brice -- blog: http://www.debrice.com project: http://www.kaaloo.com http://www.djangogenerator.com linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/in/bricepleroy -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
Love it! -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
Sorry... It is Brice... My bad. Rick On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 7:48 AM, Rick Caudill wrote: > I want to say good job Brian. I can see how this could be very useful. > > Rick > > > On Tue, Feb 9, 2010 at 2:58 PM, Brice Leroy wrote: > >> Hello everybody, >> >> I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django >> project. The goal is to provide a simple architecture that can be >> after adapted to your project. The system is in alpha stage but allows >> you to create project, model (+1 view and 1 form) and application. >> Once your project is created you can download a tar.gz with the >> complete project already build for you. >> >> It's supposed to be used with the trunk version of django. >> >> I plan to add permission, forms and view during the next 15 days. Let >> me know if you have any advice or request. >> >> The project can be found here: http://alpha.djangogenerator.com/ and >> is open to registration >> The source code is located on github: >> http://github.com/debrice/djangogenerator >> >> All the best, >> >> -- >> Brice Leroy >> http://www.debrice.com >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Django users" group. >> To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >> . >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en. >> >> > > > -- > Rick Caudill > > -- Rick Caudill -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
I want to say good job Brian. I can see how this could be very useful. Rick On Tue, Feb 9, 2010 at 2:58 PM, Brice Leroy wrote: > Hello everybody, > > I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django > project. The goal is to provide a simple architecture that can be > after adapted to your project. The system is in alpha stage but allows > you to create project, model (+1 view and 1 form) and application. > Once your project is created you can download a tar.gz with the > complete project already build for you. > > It's supposed to be used with the trunk version of django. > > I plan to add permission, forms and view during the next 15 days. Let > me know if you have any advice or request. > > The project can be found here: http://alpha.djangogenerator.com/ and > is open to registration > The source code is located on github: > http://github.com/debrice/djangogenerator > > All the best, > > -- > Brice Leroy > http://www.debrice.com > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Django users" group. > To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en. > > -- Rick Caudill -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
I'd like the option (maybe linked to profile on the webpage?) to set: * timezone * database engine On Feb 9, 10:58 pm, Brice Leroy wrote: > Hello everybody, > > I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django > project. The goal is to provide a simple architecture that can be > after adapted to your project. The system is in alpha stage but allows > you to create project, model (+1 view and 1 form) and application. > Once your project is created you can download a tar.gz with the > complete project already build for you. > > It's supposed to be used with the trunk version of django. > > I plan to add permission, forms and view during the next 15 days. Let > me know if you have any advice or request. > > The project can be found here:http://alpha.djangogenerator.com/and > is open to registration > The source code is located on github:http://github.com/debrice/djangogenerator > > All the best, > > -- > Brice Leroyhttp://www.debrice.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 6:48 PM, Atamert Ölçgen wrote: > On Tuesday 09 February 2010 22:58:32 Brice Leroy wrote: > * Please remove `auto_now` and `auto_now_add` since they're deprecated. No, they really aren't. If they were deprecated, there would be deprecation warnings in the code and documentation. Yours, Russ Magee %-) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
On Tuesday 09 February 2010 22:58:32 Brice Leroy wrote: > Hello everybody, > > I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django > project. The goal is to provide a simple architecture that can be > after adapted to your project. The system is in alpha stage but allows > you to create project, model (+1 view and 1 form) and application. > Once your project is created you can download a tar.gz with the > complete project already build for you. > > It's supposed to be used with the trunk version of django. > > I plan to add permission, forms and view during the next 15 days. Let > me know if you have any advice or request. First time I looked at this project, I thought "it's lame". But so many great ideas are bashed at first. That's what makes them great ideas. They wouldn't be so great if everyone could understand the first time. So this is a good idea, IMHO. I have just registered and played with the interface for about a minute. I didn't even bothered to see the code it generates before writing this e-mail. I think you should just continue working on it. I hope I will have some time to play with the code myself. I suggest everybody reading this to just register and give this project 5 minutes of their time: http://alpha.djangogenerator.com Small suggestions: * Please remove `auto_now` and `auto_now_add` since they're deprecated. * `choices` takes a string and it doesn't cast it to an iterable when generating code. `choices` should be a list of two-tuples in the form of (value, verbose_name). * To promote good practises generated code should follow Django coding guidelines (PEP8 and other stuff) As I said, it's really a cool project. Thanks for sharing. -- Saygılarımla, Atamert Ölçgen -+- --+ +++ www.muhuk.com mu...@jabber.org -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
OK. I have been trying it out. I have to say I like how structured everything comes out. It makes it easy to cross reference what I entered into the "Generator" site and the code it gave me. I now have a working project with some features that I can learn from. It's like having a seasoned Django programmer show me how to do it right. I already have a better understanding of what is going on and expect this to help me get up to speed with Django very fast. I learn best by example and can now try out various things and get a working set-up each time. After a while I always just rely on memory and write code directly. Not only is it something I can learn from but it does look like a more "comprehensive" startproject / startapp utility. I can see using this to create starting points for various types of projects or applications. If "Generator" gets even more advanced it could turn into a way of stockpiling my own re-usable apps that I could quickly paste together in a web interface, download the project and let the customization begin! Imagine if you could use a "Generator" like concept to set-up Pinax, Satchmo or both into a project, taking only the pieces of each you need. The whole point of those two projects is to allow me to focus on what is unique about my project and rely on them for the boilerplate code. Why not have an application that allows me to pick and choose and create the project all at the same time? Thank you Brice for the great work on this! Appreciatively, Richard On Tue, Feb 9, 2010 at 6:02 PM, Brice Leroy wrote: > Thank you Richard. > > I put most of my coding convention inside and try to respect the pep8. > > A lot of work still need to be done. But I expect to reach my goal by > the next 15 days > > Brice > > 2010/2/9 Richard Shebora : >> Actually my first thought was... What a great learning tool! >> >> How many times did I want to do something but could not find a working >> example to pick apart? I would think it would make a great way to >> show proper layout and conventions for newbies (like me). I have been >> programming in python for years but am having some trouble wrapping my >> head around the "django" paradigm. >> >> Thanks, >> Richard >> >> On Tue, Feb 9, 2010 at 5:52 PM, Frank W. Samuelson >> wrote: >>> You are something of a killjoy, Mike. >>> >>> This could grow into a really great project, where people don't even have to >>> learn programming to generate a usable django web database app. They just >>> design their app with the user friendly web interface, and it runs. It >>> could even be integrated with hosting, and people might never see the code, >>> it would just run. How many people who have web pages nowadays know HTML? >>> >>> Generate on! >>> >>> >>> On Tue, 9 Feb 2010, Mike Ramirez wrote: >>> On Tuesday 09 February 2010 13:09:08 Brice Leroy wrote: > > django-admin startproject creates an empty folder... > > startproject almost = mkdir > > This will generate your models, modelForm, views, templates, urls, and > soon customized forms and permissions > That's what the web interface does? Yes startproject gives you empty files so you can add in your own code, with the minimal funs. For me, I don't see your project as a big advantage, except maybe two minutes of time where I don't need to do things like: class MyModel(models.Model): ... I don't know, thought about your approach before, but think it's reduntant. Just because each project requires it's own data and model field attributes and form funs... And I think django already does a great job of genericizing this stuff with the code i.e. ModelFoms. I don't know how much of a real timesaver this really is. Didn't even mention tests.. Which can you auto generate? Especially if your project's outputed code isn't template driven where each user of it can change the boiler plate code with minimal or no fuss, so it can be tailored to each users needs. Like I'm able to add in my most used imports, which aren't all going to be yours or anyone elses or the same in each project. I think the minimal approach of django-admin is a much better way to do these things. With either way you still have to give the fields, options and the names, then fill in the functions you need/want. Each function that can be autogenerated is like two lines of code. I don't know if your generated code can handle a lot of choices I make, like making fields not editable in the admin, setting defaults, etc... and even if you do offer these choices, the time to use your project and code it up probably isn't much different. The big thing for me in terms of tools like this, is the ability to save time, which I don't think there is a difference bet
Re: Django Generator
On Tuesday 09 February 2010 15:51:03 Brice Leroy wrote: > 2010/2/9 Mike Ramirez : > > On Tuesday 09 February 2010 15:12:21 Brice Leroy wrote: > >> Would you eat some food not cook by a professional ? > > > > I would be very wary of a person who hasn't cooked before... The > > difference is in experience. > > it's just that I don't like those ridiculous images that shows the > world as binary. You can effectively be sure that nobody want's to > flight in an home made plane and nobody want his butcher to be his > surgeon. But in the past I painted the wall by myself, and made myself > some pretty good pasta :p > But in both cases this was only affecting you... I don't care if you shoot heroin, as long as that habit doesn't negatively affect others around you. This is the key to my argument. > >> > Because you can, doesn't mean that you should... > >> > > >> > It's this type of mentality that leads to security holes and bad web > >> > apps that hurt server performance and many different things... > >> > >> Not everybody needs to run facebook. > >> Your approach seams to be "if it's not perfect it should not be used". > >> Don't you think it's a little to extreme ? > > > > No, I may lose a bit of perspective because I don't think in terms of the > > layman, but at the same time I'm not about to get into something unless I > > know enough about it first and if that means taking classes at community > > college... That's what I do. > > > > I'm more against something like my mom putting together a website because > > she won't do the neccessary homework first. I think that without > > knowledge of what you're doing, you're doomed to fail. If webservers were > > either all VPS's with limits monitored by the host os or dedicated > > servers for each site, then I wouldn't say much on this, but virtual > > hosting is another story, where you have the potential to hurt others. > > This is the main problem here is that we think in terms of how it > > affects ourselves only. what about others? > > Actually I had that in mind. For example, the code generated for list > is using pagination to avoid mass data reading from the db. > The purpose of this tool is to go further than createproject and in > another way like being able to fork an existing project or quickly > include existing recognized pluggable. > I can see this being helpful, but I can't see it as a general hosting service installer system... That is just a very bad idea. In the end, I see this as three things, an Educational tool -- first (thanks for that pespective Richard), secondly a build tool for experienced programmers and lastly, a controlled SaaS. For me, I saw this first as a replacement for startproject which in my mind isn't perfect, but the best we have. Because I don't see how something like this can save that much time, nor am I a believer in there is only one way to code a good app, I came across negative. I don't usually have the same info or code in each project, outside of what startproject gives and refactoring, well I went over that. (Also goproject shaped my perspective as it's what I've been messing iwth mainly over the past few weeks in an effort ot learn/undertand Go). Unless you're going to go with something like wordpress.com and have it launch sites for others and you still maintain control over most of the code and that edits by users are limited... Really where they only need to deal with the frontend that's great, but even then... Experience matters (XSS and bad js can clog up browsers). I'm really wary about unknowledgeable users editting things that can mess up the site and the service. Making it easier for the laymen is like tossing free money into a crowd, sure it's a nice thing, but it has the potential for catastrophe. If that potential is removed or severly limited, I can jump on whole heartedly as a supporter. I think your plan is better as a SaaS, than to target the laymen to use django. The above is also something I think is fundamentally different from say dreamhost or webfaction adding this in to their software installers, which is where the potential for catastrophe starts to grow exponentially as users make edits that can blow things up. > >> > A bad django app made this way can hurt django's reputation. > >> > >> That's pretty severe. > > > > Maybe, but public opinion is easily swayed and django is still fighting > > against other more popular systems. > > Just to add to this, PHP is the example, it's rep is really bad, mainly because of bad programmers building bad applications. Now wp, joomla, drupal (before phpnuke and there was one more, forgot it), help this, but they all have issues that are driving users away. Mike -- PUNK ROCK!! DISCO DUCK!! BIRTH CONTROL!! signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Django Generator
2010/2/9 Mike Ramirez : > On Tuesday 09 February 2010 15:12:21 Brice Leroy wrote: >> Would you eat some food not cook by a professional ? >> > > I would be very wary of a person who hasn't cooked before... The difference is > in experience. it's just that I don't like those ridiculous images that shows the world as binary. You can effectively be sure that nobody want's to flight in an home made plane and nobody want his butcher to be his surgeon. But in the past I painted the wall by myself, and made myself some pretty good pasta :p > >> > Because you can, doesn't mean that you should... >> > >> > It's this type of mentality that leads to security holes and bad web apps >> > that hurt server performance and many different things... >> >> Not everybody needs to run facebook. >> Your approach seams to be "if it's not perfect it should not be used". >> Don't you think it's a little to extreme ? >> > > No, I may lose a bit of perspective because I don't think in terms of the > layman, but at the same time I'm not about to get into something unless I know > enough about it first and if that means taking classes at community college... > That's what I do. > > I'm more against something like my mom putting together a website because she > won't do the neccessary homework first. I think that without knowledge of what > you're doing, you're doomed to fail. If webservers were either all VPS's with > limits monitored by the host os or dedicated servers for each site, then I > wouldn't say much on this, but virtual hosting is another story, where you > have the potential to hurt others. This is the main problem here is that we > think in terms of how it affects ourselves only. what about others? Actually I had that in mind. For example, the code generated for list is using pagination to avoid mass data reading from the db. The purpose of this tool is to go further than createproject and in another way like being able to fork an existing project or quickly include existing recognized pluggable. > >> > A bad django app made this way can hurt django's reputation. >> >> That's pretty severe. >> > > Maybe, but public opinion is easily swayed and django is still fighting > against other more popular systems. > > Mike > -- blog: http://www.debrice.com project: http://www.kaaloo.com http://www.djangogenerator.com linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/in/bricepleroy -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
On Tuesday 09 February 2010 15:12:21 Brice Leroy wrote: > Would you eat some food not cook by a professional ? > I would be very wary of a person who hasn't cooked before... The difference is in experience. > > Because you can, doesn't mean that you should... > > > > It's this type of mentality that leads to security holes and bad web apps > > that hurt server performance and many different things... > > Not everybody needs to run facebook. > Your approach seams to be "if it's not perfect it should not be used". > Don't you think it's a little to extreme ? > No, I may lose a bit of perspective because I don't think in terms of the layman, but at the same time I'm not about to get into something unless I know enough about it first and if that means taking classes at community college... That's what I do. I'm more against something like my mom putting together a website because she won't do the neccessary homework first. I think that without knowledge of what you're doing, you're doomed to fail. If webservers were either all VPS's with limits monitored by the host os or dedicated servers for each site, then I wouldn't say much on this, but virtual hosting is another story, where you have the potential to hurt others. This is the main problem here is that we think in terms of how it affects ourselves only. what about others? > > A bad django app made this way can hurt django's reputation. > > That's pretty severe. > Maybe, but public opinion is easily swayed and django is still fighting against other more popular systems. Mike -- Big M, Little M, many mumbling mice Are making midnight music in the moonlight, Mighty nice! signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Django Generator
2010/2/9 Mike Ramirez : > On Tuesday 09 February 2010 14:52:00 Frank W. Samuelson wrote: >> You are something of a killjoy, Mike. >> >> This could grow into a really great project, where people >> don't even have to learn programming to generate a usable >> django web database app. > > Isn't this what existing django-apps are for? > >> They just design their app with >> the user friendly web interface, and it runs. > >> It could even >> be integrated with hosting, and people might never see >> the code, it would just run. > > This is possible, but I would rather have an installer that installs apps that > are already made by good programmers who know what they are doing. > >> How many people who have web >> pages nowadays know HTML? > > And I don't agree/like this, if you don't want to learn html, higher a > professional. > > would you drive a car built by a guy who has never driven, much less fixed a > car because he was able to put one together from a kit? Would you eat some food not cook by a professional ? > > Because you can, doesn't mean that you should... > > It's this type of mentality that leads to security holes and bad web apps that > hurt server performance and many different things... Not everybody needs to run facebook. Your approach seams to be "if it's not perfect it should not be used". Don't you think it's a little to extreme ? > > A bad django app made this way can hurt django's reputation. That's pretty severe. > > Mike > -- > Machine Always Crashes, If Not, The Operating System Hangs (MACINTOSH) > -- Topic on #Linux > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
On Tuesday 09 February 2010 14:57:26 Richard Shebora wrote: > Actually my first thought was... What a great learning tool! > > How many times did I want to do something but could not find a working > example to pick apart? I would think it would make a great way to > show proper layout and conventions for newbies (like me). I have been > programming in python for years but am having some trouble wrapping my > head around the "django" paradigm. > I have to agree with this, I think it fits this niche perfectly. Mike -- A public debt is a kind of anchor in the storm; but if the anchor be too heavy for the vessel, she will be sunk by that very weight which was intended for her preservation. -- Colton signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Django Generator
On Tuesday 09 February 2010 14:52:00 Frank W. Samuelson wrote: > You are something of a killjoy, Mike. > > This could grow into a really great project, where people > don't even have to learn programming to generate a usable > django web database app. Isn't this what existing django-apps are for? > They just design their app with > the user friendly web interface, and it runs. > It could even > be integrated with hosting, and people might never see > the code, it would just run. This is possible, but I would rather have an installer that installs apps that are already made by good programmers who know what they are doing. > How many people who have web > pages nowadays know HTML? And I don't agree/like this, if you don't want to learn html, higher a professional. would you drive a car built by a guy who has never driven, much less fixed a car because he was able to put one together from a kit? Because you can, doesn't mean that you should... It's this type of mentality that leads to security holes and bad web apps that hurt server performance and many different things... A bad django app made this way can hurt django's reputation. Mike -- Machine Always Crashes, If Not, The Operating System Hangs (MACINTOSH) -- Topic on #Linux signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Django Generator
Thank you Richard. I put most of my coding convention inside and try to respect the pep8. A lot of work still need to be done. But I expect to reach my goal by the next 15 days Brice 2010/2/9 Richard Shebora : > Actually my first thought was... What a great learning tool! > > How many times did I want to do something but could not find a working > example to pick apart? I would think it would make a great way to > show proper layout and conventions for newbies (like me). I have been > programming in python for years but am having some trouble wrapping my > head around the "django" paradigm. > > Thanks, > Richard > > On Tue, Feb 9, 2010 at 5:52 PM, Frank W. Samuelson > wrote: >> You are something of a killjoy, Mike. >> >> This could grow into a really great project, where people don't even have to >> learn programming to generate a usable django web database app. They just >> design their app with the user friendly web interface, and it runs. It >> could even be integrated with hosting, and people might never see the code, >> it would just run. How many people who have web pages nowadays know HTML? >> >> Generate on! >> >> >> On Tue, 9 Feb 2010, Mike Ramirez wrote: >> >>> On Tuesday 09 February 2010 13:09:08 Brice Leroy wrote: django-admin startproject creates an empty folder... startproject almost = mkdir This will generate your models, modelForm, views, templates, urls, and soon customized forms and permissions >>> >>> That's what the web interface does? >>> >>> Yes startproject gives you empty files so you can add in your own code, >>> with >>> the minimal funs. >>> >>> For me, I don't see your project as a big advantage, except maybe two >>> minutes >>> of time where I don't need to do things like: >>> >>> class MyModel(models.Model): >>> ... >>> >>> >>> I don't know, thought about your approach before, but think it's >>> reduntant. >>> Just because each project requires it's own data and model field >>> attributes >>> and form funs... And I think django already does a great job of >>> genericizing >>> this stuff with the code i.e. ModelFoms. I don't know how much of a real >>> timesaver this really is. Didn't even mention tests.. Which can you auto >>> generate? >>> >>> Especially if your project's outputed code isn't template driven where >>> each >>> user of it can change the boiler plate code with minimal or no fuss, so it >>> can >>> be tailored to each users needs. Like I'm able to add in my most used >>> imports, which aren't all going to be yours or anyone elses or the same in >>> each project. >>> >>> I think the minimal approach of django-admin is a much better way to do >>> these >>> things. With either way you still have to give the fields, options and the >>> names, then fill in the functions you need/want. Each function that can be >>> autogenerated is like two lines of code. >>> >>> I don't know if your generated code can handle a lot of choices I make, >>> like >>> making fields not editable in the admin, setting defaults, etc... and even >>> if >>> you do offer these choices, the time to use your project and code it up >>> probably isn't much different. >>> >>> The big thing for me in terms of tools like this, is the ability to save >>> time, >>> which I don't think there is a difference between what django-admin has >>> and >>> your project. Because either way I need to still fill in the fields, the >>> type >>> of field it is, etc.. and typeing IntegerField() isn't faster than >>> selecting >>> from a drop down box. >>> >>> Tho the importing of existing models maybe interesting for refactoring, >>> Tho I >>> just cp oldversion newversion and make the changes. >>> >>> I still have a large feeling I'm going to editting what your project >>> outputs >>> (blame this on things like UML). When I would just rather write it once >>> and >>> forget it. >>> >>> I also love building development tools, I'm just finishing up something >>> like >>> this for Go. Where it'll generate a project directory tree of your Go >>> files >>> (either a package or command, with Makefiels, readme, etc.. all template >>> driven so you can edit the boilerplate code to be what you want) it'll be >>> released in a few more days when I finish cleaning up the default >>> templates >>> and a few optimizations. If you want to see what I mean, I don't mind >>> sending >>> it today. Just know there are a lot of mistakes in the templates and still >>> looking at a few tweaks and playing with usability. >>> >>> But in the end, I think the time saved with yours is going to be minimal I >>> believe unless your can guess what model fields I need and what options >>> they >>> are it's not saving that much time (maybe 30 minutes?). Otherwise, I think >>> that altering django-admin startporject to be template driven is a better >>> idea >>> than this. Sorry for being negative, but without negativity how can we be >>> challenged and grow? >>> >>> Mike >>> I'll add a copy
Re: Django Generator
Wow... Thank you Frank. I really appreciate. That could be new direction that I didn't really think of. I will finish the permission, form and view integration and keep in mind to stay minimalistic. For now, if you have django source installed you just need to - download the targz file - run ./manage syncdb - run ./manage runserver and it should work. 2010/2/9 Frank W. Samuelson : > You are something of a killjoy, Mike. > > This could grow into a really great project, where people don't even have to > learn programming to generate a usable django web database app. They just > design their app with the user friendly web interface, and it runs. It > could even be integrated with hosting, and people might never see the code, > it would just run. How many people who have web pages nowadays know HTML? > > Generate on! > > > On Tue, 9 Feb 2010, Mike Ramirez wrote: > >> On Tuesday 09 February 2010 13:09:08 Brice Leroy wrote: >>> >>> django-admin startproject creates an empty folder... >>> >>> startproject almost = mkdir >>> >>> This will generate your models, modelForm, views, templates, urls, and >>> soon customized forms and permissions >>> >> >> That's what the web interface does? >> >> Yes startproject gives you empty files so you can add in your own code, >> with >> the minimal funs. >> >> For me, I don't see your project as a big advantage, except maybe two >> minutes >> of time where I don't need to do things like: >> >> class MyModel(models.Model): >> ... >> >> >> I don't know, thought about your approach before, but think it's >> reduntant. >> Just because each project requires it's own data and model field >> attributes >> and form funs... And I think django already does a great job of >> genericizing >> this stuff with the code i.e. ModelFoms. I don't know how much of a real >> timesaver this really is. Didn't even mention tests.. Which can you auto >> generate? >> >> Especially if your project's outputed code isn't template driven where >> each >> user of it can change the boiler plate code with minimal or no fuss, so it >> can >> be tailored to each users needs. Like I'm able to add in my most used >> imports, which aren't all going to be yours or anyone elses or the same in >> each project. >> >> I think the minimal approach of django-admin is a much better way to do >> these >> things. With either way you still have to give the fields, options and the >> names, then fill in the functions you need/want. Each function that can be >> autogenerated is like two lines of code. >> >> I don't know if your generated code can handle a lot of choices I make, >> like >> making fields not editable in the admin, setting defaults, etc... and even >> if >> you do offer these choices, the time to use your project and code it up >> probably isn't much different. >> >> The big thing for me in terms of tools like this, is the ability to save >> time, >> which I don't think there is a difference between what django-admin has >> and >> your project. Because either way I need to still fill in the fields, the >> type >> of field it is, etc.. and typeing IntegerField() isn't faster than >> selecting >> from a drop down box. >> >> Tho the importing of existing models maybe interesting for refactoring, >> Tho I >> just cp oldversion newversion and make the changes. >> >> I still have a large feeling I'm going to editting what your project >> outputs >> (blame this on things like UML). When I would just rather write it once >> and >> forget it. >> >> I also love building development tools, I'm just finishing up something >> like >> this for Go. Where it'll generate a project directory tree of your Go >> files >> (either a package or command, with Makefiels, readme, etc.. all template >> driven so you can edit the boilerplate code to be what you want) it'll be >> released in a few more days when I finish cleaning up the default >> templates >> and a few optimizations. If you want to see what I mean, I don't mind >> sending >> it today. Just know there are a lot of mistakes in the templates and still >> looking at a few tweaks and playing with usability. >> >> But in the end, I think the time saved with yours is going to be minimal I >> believe unless your can guess what model fields I need and what options >> they >> are it's not saving that much time (maybe 30 minutes?). Otherwise, I think >> that altering django-admin startporject to be template driven is a better >> idea >> than this. Sorry for being negative, but without negativity how can we be >> challenged and grow? >> >> Mike >> >>> I'll add a copy project so you can extend an existing model if you >>> have a big production pace of common project model. >>> >>> 2010/2/9 Mike Ramirez : On Tuesday 09 February 2010 12:58:32 Brice Leroy wrote: > > Hello everybody, > > I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django > project. The goal is to provide a simple architecture that can be > after adapted to your p
Re: Django Generator
Actually my first thought was... What a great learning tool! How many times did I want to do something but could not find a working example to pick apart? I would think it would make a great way to show proper layout and conventions for newbies (like me). I have been programming in python for years but am having some trouble wrapping my head around the "django" paradigm. Thanks, Richard On Tue, Feb 9, 2010 at 5:52 PM, Frank W. Samuelson wrote: > You are something of a killjoy, Mike. > > This could grow into a really great project, where people don't even have to > learn programming to generate a usable django web database app. They just > design their app with the user friendly web interface, and it runs. It > could even be integrated with hosting, and people might never see the code, > it would just run. How many people who have web pages nowadays know HTML? > > Generate on! > > > On Tue, 9 Feb 2010, Mike Ramirez wrote: > >> On Tuesday 09 February 2010 13:09:08 Brice Leroy wrote: >>> >>> django-admin startproject creates an empty folder... >>> >>> startproject almost = mkdir >>> >>> This will generate your models, modelForm, views, templates, urls, and >>> soon customized forms and permissions >>> >> >> That's what the web interface does? >> >> Yes startproject gives you empty files so you can add in your own code, >> with >> the minimal funs. >> >> For me, I don't see your project as a big advantage, except maybe two >> minutes >> of time where I don't need to do things like: >> >> class MyModel(models.Model): >> ... >> >> >> I don't know, thought about your approach before, but think it's >> reduntant. >> Just because each project requires it's own data and model field >> attributes >> and form funs... And I think django already does a great job of >> genericizing >> this stuff with the code i.e. ModelFoms. I don't know how much of a real >> timesaver this really is. Didn't even mention tests.. Which can you auto >> generate? >> >> Especially if your project's outputed code isn't template driven where >> each >> user of it can change the boiler plate code with minimal or no fuss, so it >> can >> be tailored to each users needs. Like I'm able to add in my most used >> imports, which aren't all going to be yours or anyone elses or the same in >> each project. >> >> I think the minimal approach of django-admin is a much better way to do >> these >> things. With either way you still have to give the fields, options and the >> names, then fill in the functions you need/want. Each function that can be >> autogenerated is like two lines of code. >> >> I don't know if your generated code can handle a lot of choices I make, >> like >> making fields not editable in the admin, setting defaults, etc... and even >> if >> you do offer these choices, the time to use your project and code it up >> probably isn't much different. >> >> The big thing for me in terms of tools like this, is the ability to save >> time, >> which I don't think there is a difference between what django-admin has >> and >> your project. Because either way I need to still fill in the fields, the >> type >> of field it is, etc.. and typeing IntegerField() isn't faster than >> selecting >> from a drop down box. >> >> Tho the importing of existing models maybe interesting for refactoring, >> Tho I >> just cp oldversion newversion and make the changes. >> >> I still have a large feeling I'm going to editting what your project >> outputs >> (blame this on things like UML). When I would just rather write it once >> and >> forget it. >> >> I also love building development tools, I'm just finishing up something >> like >> this for Go. Where it'll generate a project directory tree of your Go >> files >> (either a package or command, with Makefiels, readme, etc.. all template >> driven so you can edit the boilerplate code to be what you want) it'll be >> released in a few more days when I finish cleaning up the default >> templates >> and a few optimizations. If you want to see what I mean, I don't mind >> sending >> it today. Just know there are a lot of mistakes in the templates and still >> looking at a few tweaks and playing with usability. >> >> But in the end, I think the time saved with yours is going to be minimal I >> believe unless your can guess what model fields I need and what options >> they >> are it's not saving that much time (maybe 30 minutes?). Otherwise, I think >> that altering django-admin startporject to be template driven is a better >> idea >> than this. Sorry for being negative, but without negativity how can we be >> challenged and grow? >> >> Mike >> >>> I'll add a copy project so you can extend an existing model if you >>> have a big production pace of common project model. >>> >>> 2010/2/9 Mike Ramirez : On Tuesday 09 February 2010 12:58:32 Brice Leroy wrote: > > Hello everybody, > > I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django > project. The goal is to provi
Re: Django Generator
You are something of a killjoy, Mike. This could grow into a really great project, where people don't even have to learn programming to generate a usable django web database app. They just design their app with the user friendly web interface, and it runs. It could even be integrated with hosting, and people might never see the code, it would just run. How many people who have web pages nowadays know HTML? Generate on! On Tue, 9 Feb 2010, Mike Ramirez wrote: On Tuesday 09 February 2010 13:09:08 Brice Leroy wrote: django-admin startproject creates an empty folder... startproject almost = mkdir This will generate your models, modelForm, views, templates, urls, and soon customized forms and permissions That's what the web interface does? Yes startproject gives you empty files so you can add in your own code, with the minimal funs. For me, I don't see your project as a big advantage, except maybe two minutes of time where I don't need to do things like: class MyModel(models.Model): ... I don't know, thought about your approach before, but think it's reduntant. Just because each project requires it's own data and model field attributes and form funs... And I think django already does a great job of genericizing this stuff with the code i.e. ModelFoms. I don't know how much of a real timesaver this really is. Didn't even mention tests.. Which can you auto generate? Especially if your project's outputed code isn't template driven where each user of it can change the boiler plate code with minimal or no fuss, so it can be tailored to each users needs. Like I'm able to add in my most used imports, which aren't all going to be yours or anyone elses or the same in each project. I think the minimal approach of django-admin is a much better way to do these things. With either way you still have to give the fields, options and the names, then fill in the functions you need/want. Each function that can be autogenerated is like two lines of code. I don't know if your generated code can handle a lot of choices I make, like making fields not editable in the admin, setting defaults, etc... and even if you do offer these choices, the time to use your project and code it up probably isn't much different. The big thing for me in terms of tools like this, is the ability to save time, which I don't think there is a difference between what django-admin has and your project. Because either way I need to still fill in the fields, the type of field it is, etc.. and typeing IntegerField() isn't faster than selecting from a drop down box. Tho the importing of existing models maybe interesting for refactoring, Tho I just cp oldversion newversion and make the changes. I still have a large feeling I'm going to editting what your project outputs (blame this on things like UML). When I would just rather write it once and forget it. I also love building development tools, I'm just finishing up something like this for Go. Where it'll generate a project directory tree of your Go files (either a package or command, with Makefiels, readme, etc.. all template driven so you can edit the boilerplate code to be what you want) it'll be released in a few more days when I finish cleaning up the default templates and a few optimizations. If you want to see what I mean, I don't mind sending it today. Just know there are a lot of mistakes in the templates and still looking at a few tweaks and playing with usability. But in the end, I think the time saved with yours is going to be minimal I believe unless your can guess what model fields I need and what options they are it's not saving that much time (maybe 30 minutes?). Otherwise, I think that altering django-admin startporject to be template driven is a better idea than this. Sorry for being negative, but without negativity how can we be challenged and grow? Mike I'll add a copy project so you can extend an existing model if you have a big production pace of common project model. 2010/2/9 Mike Ramirez : On Tuesday 09 February 2010 12:58:32 Brice Leroy wrote: Hello everybody, I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django project. The goal is to provide a simple architecture that can be after adapted to your project. The system is in alpha stage but allows you to create project, model (+1 view and 1 form) and application. Once your project is created you can download a tar.gz with the complete project already build for you. It's supposed to be used with the trunk version of django. I plan to add permission, forms and view during the next 15 days. Let me know if you have any advice or request. The project can be found here: http://alpha.djangogenerator.com/ and is open to registration The source code is located on github: http://github.com/debrice/djangogenerator All the best, -- Brice Leroy http://www.debrice.com how is this different than `django-admin startproject` ? Mike -- Overconfidence breeds error when we take for grante
Re: Django Generator
On Tuesday 09 February 2010 14:26:16 Brice Leroy wrote: > > The big thing for me in terms of tools like this, is the ability to save > > time, which I don't think there is a difference between what django-admin > > has and your project. Because either way I need to still fill in the > > fields, the type of field it is, etc.. and typeing IntegerField() isn't > > faster than selecting from a drop down box. > > I cannot really argue with you on that. If you can please try it first. > I just don't see how it can work, without me entering the data/info I need, which I don't see as better/faster than me just coding it up from the files provided by django-admin. I'll try it when I start a new project, but sorry that's not this week or month. Which is why I asked originally how it's different from django-admin. > > I also love building development tools, I'm just finishing up something > > like this for Go. Where it'll generate a project directory tree of your > > Go files (either a package or command, with Makefiels, readme, etc.. all > > template driven so you can edit the boilerplate code to be what you want) > > it'll be released in a few more days when I finish cleaning up the > > default templates and a few optimizations. If you want to see what I > > mean, I don't mind sending it today. Just know there are a lot of > > mistakes in the templates and still looking at a few tweaks and playing > > with usability. > > I would like to see it. that would probably give me some ideas > It's attached. Mike -- Given a choice between grief and nothing, I'd choose grief. -- William Faulkner goproject.tar.gz Description: application/compressed-tar signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Django Generator
2010/2/9 Mike Ramirez : > On Tuesday 09 February 2010 13:09:08 Brice Leroy wrote: >> django-admin startproject creates an empty folder... >> >> startproject almost = mkdir >> >> This will generate your models, modelForm, views, templates, urls, and >> soon customized forms and permissions >> > > That's what the web interface does? > > Yes startproject gives you empty files so you can add in your own code, with > the minimal funs. > > For me, I don't see your project as a big advantage, except maybe two minutes > of time where I don't need to do things like: > > class MyModel(models.Model): > ... > > > I don't know, thought about your approach before, but think it's reduntant. > Just because each project requires it's own data and model field attributes > and form funs... And I think django already does a great job of genericizing It does provide you a skeleton that you're supposed to adapt. I wanted it to be as simple as possible. > this stuff with the code i.e. ModelFoms. I don't know how much of a real > timesaver this really is. Didn't even mention tests.. Which can you auto > generate? Doesn't make so much sense to me to generate test > > Especially if your project's outputed code isn't template driven where each > user of it can change the boiler plate code with minimal or no fuss, so it can > be tailored to each users needs. Like I'm able to add in my most used > imports, which aren't all going to be yours or anyone elses or the same in > each project. I though about it (adding profile, css framework, JS framework...), but doesn't have yet a good idea on how to integrate it right now... and it doesn't feet my first goal which is to quickly create a working project structure that can be easily extended. > > I think the minimal approach of django-admin is a much better way to do these > things. With either way you still have to give the fields, options and the > names, then fill in the functions you need/want. Each function that can be > autogenerated is like two lines of code. > I don't know if your generated code can handle a lot of choices I make, like > making fields not editable in the admin, setting defaults, etc... and even if > you do offer these choices, the time to use your project and code it up > probably isn't much different. > > The big thing for me in terms of tools like this, is the ability to save time, > which I don't think there is a difference between what django-admin has and > your project. Because either way I need to still fill in the fields, the type > of field it is, etc.. and typeing IntegerField() isn't faster than selecting > from a drop down box. I cannot really argue with you on that. If you can please try it first. > > Tho the importing of existing models maybe interesting for refactoring, Tho I > just cp oldversion newversion and make the changes. > > I still have a large feeling I'm going to editting what your project outputs > (blame this on things like UML). When I would just rather write it once and > forget it. > > I also love building development tools, I'm just finishing up something like > this for Go. Where it'll generate a project directory tree of your Go files > (either a package or command, with Makefiels, readme, etc.. all template > driven so you can edit the boilerplate code to be what you want) it'll be > released in a few more days when I finish cleaning up the default templates > and a few optimizations. If you want to see what I mean, I don't mind sending > it today. Just know there are a lot of mistakes in the templates and still > looking at a few tweaks and playing with usability. I would like to see it. that would probably give me some ideas > But in the end, I think the time saved with yours is going to be minimal I > believe unless your can guess what model fields I need and what options they > are it's not saving that much time (maybe 30 minutes?). Otherwise, I think > that altering django-admin startporject to be template driven is a better idea > than this. Sorry for being negative, but without negativity how can we be > challenged and grow? You can be negative but it's hard to take some of your arguments when obviously you didn't try it :p Otherwise I appreciate your argumentation on some points. It's true that optimizing the existent is often the best practice. This more another approach in the spirit of perfectionists with deadlines ( it's far from the perfection ). Thank you Mike > Mike > >> I'll add a copy project so you can extend an existing model if you >> have a big production pace of common project model. >> >> 2010/2/9 Mike Ramirez : >> > On Tuesday 09 February 2010 12:58:32 Brice Leroy wrote: >> >> Hello everybody, >> >> >> >> I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django >> >> project. The goal is to provide a simple architecture that can be >> >> after adapted to your project. The system is in alpha stage but allows >> >> you to create project, model (+1 view and 1 form) and application.
Re: Django Generator
On Tuesday 09 February 2010 13:09:08 Brice Leroy wrote: > django-admin startproject creates an empty folder... > > startproject almost = mkdir > > This will generate your models, modelForm, views, templates, urls, and > soon customized forms and permissions > That's what the web interface does? Yes startproject gives you empty files so you can add in your own code, with the minimal funs. For me, I don't see your project as a big advantage, except maybe two minutes of time where I don't need to do things like: class MyModel(models.Model): ... I don't know, thought about your approach before, but think it's reduntant. Just because each project requires it's own data and model field attributes and form funs... And I think django already does a great job of genericizing this stuff with the code i.e. ModelFoms. I don't know how much of a real timesaver this really is. Didn't even mention tests.. Which can you auto generate? Especially if your project's outputed code isn't template driven where each user of it can change the boiler plate code with minimal or no fuss, so it can be tailored to each users needs. Like I'm able to add in my most used imports, which aren't all going to be yours or anyone elses or the same in each project. I think the minimal approach of django-admin is a much better way to do these things. With either way you still have to give the fields, options and the names, then fill in the functions you need/want. Each function that can be autogenerated is like two lines of code. I don't know if your generated code can handle a lot of choices I make, like making fields not editable in the admin, setting defaults, etc... and even if you do offer these choices, the time to use your project and code it up probably isn't much different. The big thing for me in terms of tools like this, is the ability to save time, which I don't think there is a difference between what django-admin has and your project. Because either way I need to still fill in the fields, the type of field it is, etc.. and typeing IntegerField() isn't faster than selecting from a drop down box. Tho the importing of existing models maybe interesting for refactoring, Tho I just cp oldversion newversion and make the changes. I still have a large feeling I'm going to editting what your project outputs (blame this on things like UML). When I would just rather write it once and forget it. I also love building development tools, I'm just finishing up something like this for Go. Where it'll generate a project directory tree of your Go files (either a package or command, with Makefiels, readme, etc.. all template driven so you can edit the boilerplate code to be what you want) it'll be released in a few more days when I finish cleaning up the default templates and a few optimizations. If you want to see what I mean, I don't mind sending it today. Just know there are a lot of mistakes in the templates and still looking at a few tweaks and playing with usability. But in the end, I think the time saved with yours is going to be minimal I believe unless your can guess what model fields I need and what options they are it's not saving that much time (maybe 30 minutes?). Otherwise, I think that altering django-admin startporject to be template driven is a better idea than this. Sorry for being negative, but without negativity how can we be challenged and grow? Mike > I'll add a copy project so you can extend an existing model if you > have a big production pace of common project model. > > 2010/2/9 Mike Ramirez : > > On Tuesday 09 February 2010 12:58:32 Brice Leroy wrote: > >> Hello everybody, > >> > >> I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django > >> project. The goal is to provide a simple architecture that can be > >> after adapted to your project. The system is in alpha stage but allows > >> you to create project, model (+1 view and 1 form) and application. > >> Once your project is created you can download a tar.gz with the > >> complete project already build for you. > >> > >> It's supposed to be used with the trunk version of django. > >> > >> I plan to add permission, forms and view during the next 15 days. Let > >> me know if you have any advice or request. > >> > >> The project can be found here: http://alpha.djangogenerator.com/ and > >> is open to registration > >> The source code is located on github: > >> http://github.com/debrice/djangogenerator > >> > >> All the best, > >> > >> -- > >> Brice Leroy > >> http://www.debrice.com > > > > how is this different than `django-admin startproject` ? > > > > Mike > > -- > > Overconfidence breeds error when we take for granted that the game will > > continue on its normal course; when we fail to provide for an unusually > > powerful resource -- a check, a sacrifice, a stalemate. Afterwards the > > victim may wail, `But who could have dreamt of such an idiotic-looking > > move?' -- Fred Reinfeld, "The
Re: Django Generator
django-admin startproject creates an empty folder... startproject almost = mkdir This will generate your models, modelForm, views, templates, urls, and soon customized forms and permissions I'll add a copy project so you can extend an existing model if you have a big production pace of common project model. 2010/2/9 Mike Ramirez : > On Tuesday 09 February 2010 12:58:32 Brice Leroy wrote: >> Hello everybody, >> >> I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django >> project. The goal is to provide a simple architecture that can be >> after adapted to your project. The system is in alpha stage but allows >> you to create project, model (+1 view and 1 form) and application. >> Once your project is created you can download a tar.gz with the >> complete project already build for you. >> >> It's supposed to be used with the trunk version of django. >> >> I plan to add permission, forms and view during the next 15 days. Let >> me know if you have any advice or request. >> >> The project can be found here: http://alpha.djangogenerator.com/ and >> is open to registration >> The source code is located on github: >> http://github.com/debrice/djangogenerator >> >> All the best, >> >> -- >> Brice Leroy >> http://www.debrice.com >> > > how is this different than `django-admin startproject` ? > > Mike > -- > Overconfidence breeds error when we take for granted that the game will > continue on its normal course; when we fail to provide for an unusually > powerful resource -- a check, a sacrifice, a stalemate. Afterwards the > victim may wail, `But who could have dreamt of such an idiotic-looking move?' > -- Fred Reinfeld, "The Complete Chess Course" > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
Re: Django Generator
On Tuesday 09 February 2010 12:58:32 Brice Leroy wrote: > Hello everybody, > > I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django > project. The goal is to provide a simple architecture that can be > after adapted to your project. The system is in alpha stage but allows > you to create project, model (+1 view and 1 form) and application. > Once your project is created you can download a tar.gz with the > complete project already build for you. > > It's supposed to be used with the trunk version of django. > > I plan to add permission, forms and view during the next 15 days. Let > me know if you have any advice or request. > > The project can be found here: http://alpha.djangogenerator.com/ and > is open to registration > The source code is located on github: > http://github.com/debrice/djangogenerator > > All the best, > > -- > Brice Leroy > http://www.debrice.com > how is this different than `django-admin startproject` ? Mike -- Overconfidence breeds error when we take for granted that the game will continue on its normal course; when we fail to provide for an unusually powerful resource -- a check, a sacrifice, a stalemate. Afterwards the victim may wail, `But who could have dreamt of such an idiotic-looking move?' -- Fred Reinfeld, "The Complete Chess Course" signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Django Generator
Hello everybody, I've been working for a week on this idea of a generator for django project. The goal is to provide a simple architecture that can be after adapted to your project. The system is in alpha stage but allows you to create project, model (+1 view and 1 form) and application. Once your project is created you can download a tar.gz with the complete project already build for you. It's supposed to be used with the trunk version of django. I plan to add permission, forms and view during the next 15 days. Let me know if you have any advice or request. The project can be found here: http://alpha.djangogenerator.com/ and is open to registration The source code is located on github: http://github.com/debrice/djangogenerator All the best, -- Brice Leroy http://www.debrice.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Django users" group. To post to this group, send email to django-us...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to django-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/django-users?hl=en.
