Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
On Thu, 20 Dec 2007 05:49:49 +, David Pratt wrote: >It is fortunate that the CB bands can be disabled in K3 >firmware. As Eric and Wayne will agree, if any ham transmitter or kit sold commercially transmits in the CB band, it must be type certified for such use before it can be marketed. This is far more complicated than it sounds. -- 73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane ARRL Volunteer Counsel ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked! [END of THREAD]
Guys - Seriously, let's end this thread for now. 73, Eric WA6HHQ Elecraft List Moderator ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Fred (FL) wrote: Simple - it is illegal. You cannot use a HF ham rig to work in the marine bands, to work in the CB bands. Is this spelled out in the rules or is this from an interpretation of the rules? AFAIK, the issue with ham transmitters and CB radio is one of maximum output power. The solution seems a simple one. Allow transmit on the CB/marine band but, while tuned to those frequencies, the power output would be restricted to no more than the maximum allowed for that band. There could even be a menu entry that would completely disable Tx on the CB/marine band for those people worried about accidentally transmitting on the band. As long as you had the proper authorization (ie. needed licence) for the band, you would be good to go and would be operating within the legal limits for the band. -- Cheers! Kevin. http://www.ve3syb.ca/ |"What are we going to do today, Borg?" Owner of Elecraft K2 #2172 |"Same thing we always do, Pinkutus: | Try to assimilate the world!" #include | -Pinkutus & the Borg ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
SV: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Craig VK3HE wrote; >> Whats also concerning is that this decision has been made only from the perspective >> of US laws not even taking into consideration the international market. US hams seems to have an interesting relationship with CB, dating back to the time when FCC took the 27MHz band out of the 10 meters ham band to create CB. Often when I read posts by US ham ops about CB I sense a lot of controversy. In Europe the attitude among the ham community and authorities to CB is more relaxed. As a matter of fact, SM authorities have taken away the license obligation recently and re-introduced AM and SSB modes in an effort to stimulate the usage of the band. In my opinion it is really simple, if the radio has the capability and the user is allowed ownership why should the manufacturer restrict the capability? It doesn't make sense! In the free world, it is the user's responsibility to comply with his or hers license. Just my 2 (euro) cents, Merry Xmas! 73 de Björn /SM0MDG ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Guys - Let's end this thread. It is one of those that will repeat forever ;-) The K3 was primarily designed for ham band coverage with a wider general coverage receive. Its not guaranteed to TX at full power everywhere outside the ham bands when so enabled, though it should cover most MARS frequencies. We haven't even tested it for the 27 MHz CB range and don't have time to at the moment. Its full specs are only guaranteed inside the amateur radio bands. If there is a specific country where use of the rig in the CB bands is legal, we'll certainly take a look at enabling it for that country. Feel free to email us directly on this, but let's let the discussion cool on the reflector for now. :-) 73, Eric WA6HHQ _..._ ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Simple - it is illegal. You cannot use a HF ham rig to work in the marine bands, to work in the CB bands. Perhaps the FCC isn't watching all the time, but they can be directed to do so. It would be just illegal, for anyone to try to use a K3 or any FCC certified amateur HF rig to attempt to transmit in these frequency regions. That is sort of Amateur Radio 101. Fred FL Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Richard Kent wrote: > > > > Maybe there was another > answer all along we did not know it. Maybe the popularity of the CB band > has > dwindled to the point that it is not the hot spot we remember. > or maybe the FCC will give us back the 11 meter band that used to be a Ham band! yeahright ! Merry Christmas -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/CB-band-TX-I%27m-shocked%21-tp14429494p14438448.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Not me, I am CW only and never get above 28.050mHz. de Joe, aa4nn ! > Whatever happened to minding your own business. If Joe wants to open his > radio to all freqs so be it. Maybe he has a good reason. Does it affect > anyone else? No. > ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Whatever happened to minding your own business. If Joe wants to open his radio to all freqs so be it. Maybe he has a good reason. Does it affect anyone else? No. Ham Radio is starting to remind me of all the homeowner's associations that are run by older folks that have nothing better to do than get in everyone else's business because they have nothing to do. You watch your hen house and I will watch mine. If I need help from you I will be sure to ask. US Amateurs have not been tasked with being the enforcement arm of the FCC. If you are in other countries your mileage my vary. Elecraft has regulatory obligations that they must meet to be in compliance with their certification. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
-Original Message- Before Eric Stops this thread, This is a point I have wondered about for a long time. In the US, it has been illegal to use CB frequencies since the late 70's. To the hams this mean that transverters had only 2 Mhz to work with (28-30mhz) as an IF. This means that a 6 meter transverter had to be crystaled 50-52 or 52-54. The same is true for the other bands that are 4 Mhz wide also. I have often wondered if the FCC would allow an "IF" radio to be built that covers either 26-30 Mhz or 28-32 Mhz to allow tranverters access to both small signal and FM ends of the band. Maybe this is a point that we have been to afraid to ask (with good reason, the FCC scared me well). Maybe there was another answer all along we did not know it. Maybe the popularity of the CB band has dwindled to the point that it is not the hot spot we remember. Still scared Richard Kent WD8AJG K2 5296 ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
David Pratt wrote: In a recent message Goody K3NG <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >>I'm not in favor of breaking the law, but I think the chances of running into the FCC today are slim to none. If you don't identify with your ham callsign while using a ham rig on FRS or CB frequencies, it's unlikely anyone, even the FCC will know a difference, or even care. >It is the tendency these days for radio amateurs of all nations to self-regulate. So let us do just that and use equipment which is legal. A CB transceiver can be bought for just a few $, so let's act responsibly and keep the hobbies separate without complicating the issue any further. It is fortunate that the CB bands can be disabled in K3 firmware. My point is not that the K3 should be a CB transceiver, nor am I encouraging someone to use it regularly on CB bands or "combine the hobbies". The point is it would be prudent to have the capability there if you need it. I'm not disputing that in normal situations "legal" CB transceivers are cheap and readily available. The reality is in abnormal situations (i.e. emergencies) they're not readily available. It doesn't matter to me if I'm stuck in the middle of nowhere that Walmart is selling CBs for $15, I don't have a Walmart that I can get to. It doesn't matter that I own a cheap CB if it happens to be at my house if I'm a hundred miles away. While we can preach with blue skies that everyone should be prepared and carry a CB, the fact of the matter is that we can't carry in our vehicles or on our person at every moment every possible tool needed in an emergency. CB disabled on the K3 is like the little saw removed on a Swiss Army knife. Jim Cundiff KB3GFC wrote: >If you can afford $3K for a radio and have the time and desire to volunteer, spend a hundred bucks and buy the CB if you want to TX there! It's not about the money. If it was, anyone could buy a ham rig already on the market cheaper than the K3 that can TX in the CB band and amateur bands. In summary (to the group), it seems the point of this no-TX-in-the-CB band "feature" isn't to keep law-abiding amateurs legal, it's to keep non-hams from using it for a glorified CB. As I've mentioned earlier, the price point, appearance, marketing, and features of the K3 take this so far out of the law-breaking CBer demographic, it's silly to think there would be widespread use of K3s on CB bands in areas where it was illegal. The potential benefits of having CB TX available far outweigh the risks. Not to get mellowdramatic, but it seems often in amateur radio today, we've thrown out common sense and practical reality for legalistic and/or idealistic principles. That is what several of the arguments here are doing. Everyone (in the US) should keep a paper copy of Part 95 and 97 with them for emergencies -- it makes a good fire starter. 73 K3NG Goody -- Blog: http://thek3ngreport.blogspot.com/ ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
I'm just a dumb ole country boy that somehow wound up in a big city. A few thoughts on this subject, in no particular order, would be as follows. 1. Plan before acting. 2. Use the right tool for the job. 3. Count to 10 before diving into something. 4. Use your common sense before using anything else. 5. Do what has to be done. Now it seems to me those all apply to the discussion at hand. If one is fortunate enough to afford a K3 and giving enough to volunteer as part of an organized disaster team most likely they also can afford to buy a $39 family radio and a $69 CB. Both would be good items to have and fall under 1 and 2. If on the other hand someone just happens to run around with a nice K3 as their mobile radio of choice and just happens to come across a true life and death emergency, calling for help on CB or other frequencies with it would seem to fall under 4 and 5. The problem seems to me to be a decided lack of ammo for number 4 in far too many cases. Just some old country boy thoughts on the subject. -- 73 K5LDB -- Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Good morning all, I just had to reply to this thread. First let me say that I MEAN NO DISRESPECT TO ANYONE! JUST MY OPINIONS! Speaking as the past ARES EC for Baltimore, I see no reason to TX on out of band freqs. My group trained on several occasions with a REACT (the CB equivalent to ARES/RACES) operator co-stationed with us. The scenarios called for mobile REACT ops to patrol their area, and on finding a problem, calling their person at our site. That person would relay, in person, to my op and they would put the info out on VHF to the EOC or whoever. This worked great! It never fails to amuse me that grown men (_Not just this list or hobby_, but in everything I have been involved with) will spend a bazillion dollars for a top of the line piece of gear and then try to nickel and dime their way through all the accessories. If you can afford $3K for a radio and have the time and desire to volunteer, spend a hundred bucks and buy the CB if you want to TX there! Then spend another hundred and buy a good pelican case to transport it! No, I am not affiliated in any way with Pelican. I have known of one of their boxes bouncing out of the back of a utility company truck doing 60 mph on I-95! A customer retrieved it and called us. The box was not even damaged as to needing replacement! and the instrument was unaffected! I wouldn't put my $3k rig in anything else! Having said all that, remember that the rules say that IF in a true life threatening situation, you may use whatever means at your disposal to summon help! I MEAN NO DISRESPECT TO ANYONE! JUST MY OPINIONS! Thank you for allowing me to exercise my soapbox! I will now slip back into the shadows and enjoy this list, wishing all on the list a Merry Christmas and Happy new year. 73 In His service, Jim Cundiff KB3GFC ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
On Thu, 2007-12-20 at 17:15 +1100, Shaun Oliver wrote: > I quite agree. even the vaunted yaesu ft817 with a few jumper > modifications can be made for general coverage tx. > shaun. the FT817 can have general coverage TX enabled and have it's region changed by software alone. A firmware reset restores the region set by the hardware jumpers 73 Brendan EI6IZ -- Don‘t complain. Nobody will understand. Or care. And certainly don‘t try to fix the situation yourself. It‘s dangerous. Leave it to a highly untrained, unqualified, expendable professional. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Whats also concerning is that this decision has been made only from the perspective of US laws not even taking into consideration the international market. In Australia there is a legal 27mhz marine band that is monitored and has full legal status just as the VHF FM marine band does. Its use is probably bigger than the VHF marine band which has strict regulations and channel occupation usage rules. So if i am not legally allowed to use a non type accepted radio on 12 mhz marine why would 27 mhz be any different and be singled out? I am still breaking the law! In many places in the Pacific 27 mhz CB has become the equivalent of the bush telephone. When you cruise or sail you can order fuel, supplies or even call the doctor to the other side of the Island on 27 mhz. The decision in many ways is hypocritical especially when you consider that the K3 is not type accepted for Marine HF use, nor is it NTIA certified for MARS. However i am sure many will be used on these frequencies. I would be more concerned about breaking NTIA rules than FCC 27mhz rules. If you were applying the law impartially you would not allow any out of band TX while the radio has no legal status except on the ham bands. Craig VK3HE --- Goody K3NG <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I don't see a problem with CB transmit capabilities. > In fact, I think > it should be configurable by the end user. Let me > explain. > > Recently our county has been getting its act > together in regards to > Emcomm, so we've been doing drills and educational > programs at > meetings. As an amateur, you need to be prepared to > communicate on > non-ham frequencies, like FRS or CB. Sometimes in a > disaster situation > you may need to communicate with non-hams who are > only equipped with FRS > or CB. One prime example of this in a drill we did > was a trucker coming > in to deliver supplies to a shelter. We needed to > "talk in" the driver > to the shelter over CB. > > As far as "soiling" your K3, look at it this way; > you'll probably have > the sweetest, cleanest sounding AM signal on the CB > band :-) Yea, I > know it's not type accepted for use in CB/Part 95, > but neither are the > thousands of amplifiers and "specially tuned" chrome > monsters you see on > eBay each day. Also, any CBer wanting a hot signal > isn't going to buy > an Elecraft K3. For much less money they can buy > one of those garbage > rigs and a "six pill" amp with more so-called "talk > power". > > All my rigs are modified for "DC to daylight" > transmit. Do I ever use > it? No, but it's good to know that if I'm ever put > in the situation I > can fire up communications on most any band in a > heartbeat. Sure, I can > wreak havoc on any band as well with my equipment > and its expanded > functionality, but that's why we're licensed > amateurs.we know not to > do that stuff and we have the know how and > motivation to use our powers > for good, not evil > > 73 > Goody > K3NG > > Ken Kopp wrote: > > Eric's reply (below) reads as if the K3 will TX in > the 27 mHz > > CB band as built. Surely no self-respecting > Elecraft owner > > would soil his radio by transmitting in the CB > band! The > > radio should self-destruct if a user attempted to > transmit > > there. > > > > It should -always- block CB band transmit. I don't > know of a > > legitimate reason for a K3 to transmit on 27 Mhz > anywhere > > in the world. > > > > Say it isn't so, please > > > > > > > -- > Blog: http://thek3ngreport.blogspot.com/ > > ___ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Hi Michael, wondering if there is any RF design considerations that would restrict or limit transmission within its operating frequencies extremes. The bandpasses, I would assume. They appear to be fairly narrow. vy 73 de toby ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
On Wed, 19 Dec 2007, Mike Fatchett W0MU wrote: Or better yet a list of those that were fined or sanction for attempting to assist in an emergency. In my nearly 30 years as a ham I can't ever recall someone getting in trouble for trying to help. Based on my own experience with regulators and enforcers on federal, state and local levels, the phrase "No good deed goes unpunished" comes to mind. 73 k3hrn Thom,EIEIO Email, Internet, Electronic Information Officer www.baltimorehon.com/Home of the Baltimore Lexicon www.tlchost.net/hosting/ Web Hosting as low as 3.49/month ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
I quite agree. even the vaunted yaesu ft817 with a few jumper modifications can be made for general coverage tx. shaun. On 20/12/2007 4:49 PM, the old scribe known as David Pratt was able to impart this pearl of wisdom: In a recent message Goody K3NG <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes I'm not in favor of breaking the law, but I think the chances of running into the FCC today are slim to none. If you don't identify with your ham callsign while using a ham rig on FRS or CB frequencies, it's unlikely anyone, even the FCC will know a difference, or even care. It is the tendency these days for radio amateurs of all nations to self-regulate. So let us do just that and use equipment which is legal. A CB transceiver can be bought for just a few $, so let's act responsibly and keep the hobbies separate without complicating the issue any further. It is fortunate that the CB bands can be disabled in K3 firmware. 73 de David G4DMP ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com __ NOD32 2735 (20071220) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
In a recent message Goody K3NG <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes I'm not in favor of breaking the law, but I think the chances of running into the FCC today are slim to none. If you don't identify with your ham callsign while using a ham rig on FRS or CB frequencies, it's unlikely anyone, even the FCC will know a difference, or even care. It is the tendency these days for radio amateurs of all nations to self-regulate. So let us do just that and use equipment which is legal. A CB transceiver can be bought for just a few $, so let's act responsibly and keep the hobbies separate without complicating the issue any further. It is fortunate that the CB bands can be disabled in K3 firmware. 73 de David G4DMP ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Here on the Oregon coast where hurricane force winds are a regular event several times each winter, our community emergency team relies on Amateur radio, CB and "Family Radio" for communications. However, I'd not want to combine them into one rig. That would prevent simultaneous use by several people, some of whom may not be Ham licensees. The "family radio" units provide family-to-family communications throughout our community of between 50 and 100 homes. The range - a few houses in each direction in this heavily wooded area a few hundred feet from the Pacific Ocean - is perfect to avoid excessive QRM and confusion but enough to check on neighbors and relay a call for help if needed. Those same radios take to the streets in the hands of members of the community take to guide fire, ambulance or other emergency vehicles to their destination along our winding roads at any time, or if we're cut off to road access and have an emergency, to coordinate setting up the markers for Coast Guard helicopter landing area. CB units in vehicles back up the family radios if more range. My HF and VHF Ham rigs are an essential back up in case all phone service is lost. The Ham rigs focus on that need, leaving CB and family radio units for local chores. Serving alongside non-ham neighbors with their CBs and family radios gives me a chance to show off Ham radio to new recruits who are already interested in communications technology. Ron AC7AC ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
On Dec 19, 2007 1:52 PM, Ken Kopp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Eric's reply (below) reads as if the K3 will TX in the 27 mHz > CB band as built. Surely no self-respecting Elecraft owner I was wondering, my understanding is that this transmit limitation is a firmware based restriction, so _in theory_ the K3's RF components could transmit from 1.8 - 50 MHz (minus the IF frequency)? I am just wondering if there is any RF design considerations that would restrict or limit transmission within its operating frequencies extremes. -Michael, VE3TIX ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
I'm not in favor of breaking the law, but I think the chances of running into the FCC today are slim to none. If you don't identify with your ham callsign while using a ham rig on FRS or CB frequencies, it's unlikely anyone, even the FCC will know a difference, or even care. The FCC can't even enforce Part 95 today, except for the occasional bust of Joe's Radio Shop selling souped up CBs and amps. And if you look at their recent "creative" interpretation of harmful interference in Part 15 in regards to BPL it would appear that the FCC is taking a more liberal approach to the rules. Today's FCC is more concerned with Janet Jackson and figuring out how to maintain telco monopolies, but I digress :-) I think the only time the FCC would ever know about an occurrence of a ham using a ham rig out of band during an emergency would be if another ham reported them to the FCC. One would have to ask what the true motives are of someone doing this. I do carry an FRS and CB radio in my communications go kit, but if either of them don't work for any reason during an event, I won't hesitate to use one of my ham rigs. If the FCC has lost its last vestige of common sense and wants to fine me, I'll turn in my license as it's no longer worth my time and effort to volunteer my services. I'm disappointed the K3 won't transmit on its entire receive range. We're amateur radio operators, not toddlers trying to get into the cabinet under the sink. Phil Kane wrote: On Wed, 19 Dec 2007 18:12:05 -0500, Goody K3NG wrote: Recently our county has been getting its act together in regards to Emcomm, so we've been doing drills and educational programs at meetings. As an amateur, you need to be prepared to communicate on non-ham frequencies, like FRS or CB. Sometimes in a disaster situation you may need to communicate with non-hams who are only equipped with FRS or CB. One prime example of this in a drill we did was a trucker coming in to deliver supplies to a shelter. We needed to "talk in" the driver to the shelter over CB. And what excuse are you going to rely on if the FCC declares that the "out-of-band" communication did not meet the very specific and narrow "window" permitting "any frequency, any power"? When I was on the FCC enforcement staff I served on severalv investigations of such situations, and although you may feel that given the same facts there was no other choice, none of the "out-of-band" situations was found to meet the requirements. The answer to the "CB/FRS" problem? Use the proper radios. All of our comm centers and EOCs have them - they are very cheap. Plan ahead. It's your license on the line, as well as seizure and forfeiture of your radio equipment. 'Nuff said. -- Blog: http://thek3ngreport.blogspot.com/ ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Eric, please read your message (below), not for what you probably meant to say, but for what the words actually say. It tells the reader that "high power TX in the CB band " is always blocked, and doesn't say "TX in the CB band is blocked". Your wording clearly indicates that it only blocks "high power TX in the CB band". I'm guilty of taking your posting literally, and from reading the reply postings I'm not the only one who assumes the K3 will transmit on 27 mHz. After the fact, I -DID- check mine ... it doesn't. (:-)) 73! Ken Kopp - K0PP Hi Ken - My email said exactly the opposite :-) The K3 -always- blocks TX in the CB band (except out the 0 dBm transverter port.) 73, Eric WA6HHQ - Original Message - From: Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft To: David Ferrington, M0XDF Cc: Elecraft Reflector Sent: Wednesday, 19 December, 2007 16:54 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [K3] #174 band limits Please note that the K3 -always- blocks high power TX in the CB band, regardless of what is programmed in for band TX limits. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Or better yet a list of those that were fined or sanction for attempting to assist in an emergency. In my nearly 30 years as a ham I can't ever recall someone getting in trouble for trying to help. On 12/19/07 6:45 PM, "Thom LaCosta" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, 19 Dec 2007, Phil Kane wrote: > >> >> And what excuse are you going to rely on if the FCC declares that >> the "out-of-band" communication did not meet the very specific >> and narrow "window" permitting "any frequency, any power"? > > Based on your professional expertise and history, it might be valuable to give > us all some concrete examples of situations that satisfy the very specific and > narrow window. > > > Thom,EIEIO > Email, Internet, Electronic Information Officer > > www.baltimorehon.com/Home of the Baltimore Lexicon > www.tlchost.net/hosting/ Web Hosting as low as 3.49/month > ___ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
On Wed, 19 Dec 2007, Phil Kane wrote: And what excuse are you going to rely on if the FCC declares that the "out-of-band" communication did not meet the very specific and narrow "window" permitting "any frequency, any power"? Based on your professional expertise and history, it might be valuable to give us all some concrete examples of situations that satisfy the very specific and narrow window. Thom,EIEIO Email, Internet, Electronic Information Officer www.baltimorehon.com/Home of the Baltimore Lexicon www.tlchost.net/hosting/ Web Hosting as low as 3.49/month ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
On Wed, 19 Dec 2007 18:12:05 -0500, Goody K3NG wrote: > Recently our county has been getting its act together in regards > to Emcomm, so we've been doing drills and educational programs at > meetings. As an amateur, you need to be prepared to communicate > on non-ham frequencies, like FRS or CB. Sometimes in a disaster > situation you may need to communicate with non-hams who are only > equipped with FRS or CB. One prime example of this in a drill we > did was a trucker coming in to deliver supplies to a shelter. We > needed to "talk in" the driver to the shelter over CB. And what excuse are you going to rely on if the FCC declares that the "out-of-band" communication did not meet the very specific and narrow "window" permitting "any frequency, any power"? When I was on the FCC enforcement staff I served on several investigations of such situations, and although you may feel that given the same facts there was no other choice, none of the "out-of-band" situations was found to meet the requirements. The answer to the "CB/FRS" problem? Use the proper radios. All of our comm centers and EOCs have them - they are very cheap. Plan ahead. It's your license on the line, as well as seizure and forfeiture of your radio equipment. 'Nuff said. -- 73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane Elecraft K2/100 s/n 5402 ARRL Volunteer Counsel Member, Washington County, OR Emergency Communications Team for ARES/RACES and HEARTNET ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
On Thu, 20 Dec 2007, KBG Luxford wrote: The local Radio Frequency Authority took a sensible attitude. A ham rig is not "type approved" for the CB frequency, but the Department apparently took the view that the regulations never envisioned that type of emergency need, and that the preservation of life was paramount. Egads...common sense instead of knee-jerks? Thom,EIEIO Email, Internet, Electronic Information Officer www.baltimorehon.com/Home of the Baltimore Lexicon www.tlchost.net/hosting/ Web Hosting as low as 3.49/month ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
There has been at least one case of emergency in the Oz outback where the ability to transmit on a CB frequency by a ham has brought a welcome response. The local Radio Frequency Authority took a sensible attitude. A ham rig is not "type approved" for the CB frequency, but the Department apparently took the view that the regulations never envisioned that type of emergency need, and that the preservation of life was paramount. 73 Kevin VK3DAP / ZL2DAP ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Amen Ed KD3Y > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:elecraft- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Goody K3NG > Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2007 6:12 PM > To: Elecraft List > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked! > > I don't see a problem with CB transmit capabilities. In fact, I think > it should be configurable by the end user. Let me explain. > > Recently our county has been getting its act together in regards to > Emcomm, so we've been doing drills and educational programs at > meetings. As an amateur, you need to be prepared to communicate on > non-ham frequencies, like FRS or CB. Sometimes in a disaster situation > you may need to communicate with non-hams who are only equipped with FRS > or CB. One prime example of this in a drill we did was a trucker coming > in to deliver supplies to a shelter. We needed to "talk in" the driver > to the shelter over CB. > > As far as "soiling" your K3, look at it this way; you'll probably have > the sweetest, cleanest sounding AM signal on the CB band :-) Yea, I > know it's not type accepted for use in CB/Part 95, but neither are the > thousands of amplifiers and "specially tuned" chrome monsters you see on > eBay each day. Also, any CBer wanting a hot signal isn't going to buy > an Elecraft K3. For much less money they can buy one of those garbage > rigs and a "six pill" amp with more so-called "talk power". > > All my rigs are modified for "DC to daylight" transmit. Do I ever use > it? No, but it's good to know that if I'm ever put in the situation I > can fire up communications on most any band in a heartbeat. Sure, I can > wreak havoc on any band as well with my equipment and its expanded > functionality, but that's why we're licensed amateurs.we know not to > do that stuff and we have the know how and motivation to use our powers > for good, not evil > > 73 > Goody > K3NG > > Ken Kopp wrote: > > Eric's reply (below) reads as if the K3 will TX in the 27 mHz > > CB band as built. Surely no self-respecting Elecraft owner > > would soil his radio by transmitting in the CB band! The > > radio should self-destruct if a user attempted to transmit > > there. > > > > It should -always- block CB band transmit. I don't know of a > > legitimate reason for a K3 to transmit on 27 Mhz anywhere > > in the world. > > > > Say it isn't so, please > > > > > > > -- > Blog: http://thek3ngreport.blogspot.com/ > > ___ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
I don't see a problem with CB transmit capabilities. In fact, I think it should be configurable by the end user. Let me explain. Recently our county has been getting its act together in regards to Emcomm, so we've been doing drills and educational programs at meetings. As an amateur, you need to be prepared to communicate on non-ham frequencies, like FRS or CB. Sometimes in a disaster situation you may need to communicate with non-hams who are only equipped with FRS or CB. One prime example of this in a drill we did was a trucker coming in to deliver supplies to a shelter. We needed to "talk in" the driver to the shelter over CB. As far as "soiling" your K3, look at it this way; you'll probably have the sweetest, cleanest sounding AM signal on the CB band :-) Yea, I know it's not type accepted for use in CB/Part 95, but neither are the thousands of amplifiers and "specially tuned" chrome monsters you see on eBay each day. Also, any CBer wanting a hot signal isn't going to buy an Elecraft K3. For much less money they can buy one of those garbage rigs and a "six pill" amp with more so-called "talk power". All my rigs are modified for "DC to daylight" transmit. Do I ever use it? No, but it's good to know that if I'm ever put in the situation I can fire up communications on most any band in a heartbeat. Sure, I can wreak havoc on any band as well with my equipment and its expanded functionality, but that's why we're licensed amateurs.we know not to do that stuff and we have the know how and motivation to use our powers for good, not evil 73 Goody K3NG Ken Kopp wrote: Eric's reply (below) reads as if the K3 will TX in the 27 mHz CB band as built. Surely no self-respecting Elecraft owner would soil his radio by transmitting in the CB band! The radio should self-destruct if a user attempted to transmit there. It should -always- block CB band transmit. I don't know of a legitimate reason for a K3 to transmit on 27 Mhz anywhere in the world. Say it isn't so, please -- Blog: http://thek3ngreport.blogspot.com/ ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
At 01:52 PM 12/19/2007, Ken Kopp wrote: Eric's reply (below) reads as if the K3 will TX in the 27 mHz CB band as built. Surely no self-respecting Elecraft owner would soil his radio by transmitting in the CB band! Aw come onit's a matter of law, not self respectand the radio can't get soiled b transmitting anywhere The radio should self-destruct if a user attempted to transmit there. Ah, I see...it was humorous post, wasn't it? Thom ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Hi Ken - My email said exactly the opposite :-) The K3 -always- blocks TX in the CB band (except out the 0 dBm transverter port.) 73, Eric WA6HHQ Ken Kopp wrote: Eric's reply (below) reads as if the K3 will TX in the 27 mHz CB band as built. Surely no self-respecting Elecraft owner would soil his radio by transmitting in the CB band! The radio should self-destruct if a user attempted to transmit there. It should -always- block CB band transmit. I don't know of a legitimate reason for a K3 to transmit on 27 Mhz anywhere in the world. Say it isn't so, please Ken Kopp - K0PP [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft To: David Ferrington, M0XDF Cc: Elecraft Reflector Sent: Wednesday, 19 December, 2007 16:54 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [K3] #174 band limits Please note that the K3 -always- blocks high power TX in the CB band, regardless of what is programmed in for band TX limits. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] CB band TX? - I'm shocked!
Eric's reply (below) reads as if the K3 will TX in the 27 mHz CB band as built. Surely no self-respecting Elecraft owner would soil his radio by transmitting in the CB band! The radio should self-destruct if a user attempted to transmit there. It should -always- block CB band transmit. I don't know of a legitimate reason for a K3 to transmit on 27 Mhz anywhere in the world. Say it isn't so, please Ken Kopp - K0PP [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft To: David Ferrington, M0XDF Cc: Elecraft Reflector Sent: Wednesday, 19 December, 2007 16:54 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [K3] #174 band limits Please note that the K3 -always- blocks high power TX in the CB band, regardless of what is programmed in for band TX limits. 73, Eric WA6HHQ David Ferrington, M0XDF wrote: "Opening" the rig up, as you put it, would be unwise as it would enable you to operate high power CB. Now you wouldn't want to do that, would you? ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
