Re: [Elecraft] K2 Filter settings

2015-03-03 Thread Don Wilhelm

Gareth,

Since you are using DM780, yes you can see the 100 Hz subcarrier.  I 
usually use the Spectrogram 'scope display and that subcarrier is there 
but it is a low amplitude and becomes lost in low frequency 'trash' 
like any 60 Hz noise in the computer soundcard and the zero frequency spur.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 3/3/2015 2:29 AM, M5KVK - Gareth wrote:

Thanks Don
Since sending that email, I'd come across Wayne's article on the mechanics of 
CAL FIL. That opened my eyes to something I'd read, but clearly not absorbed: 
i.e. when a modified BFO is saved, the K2 re-calculates the value of VCO needed 
to obtain the same AF tone as before. Although the audio moves moves when the 
BFO is adjusted, once the BFO is saved, the tone goes back to where it was (or 
within 20Hz anyway).

One thing though. Unless it's just my KSB2 filter, you can still see WWV's 
100Hz sub-carrier on DM780 when the filter skirts are set as you suggest. It's 
very low, but DM780 has a high dynamic range and the carrier is just visible.

Gareth, M5KVK
Sent from my iPad


On 3 Mar 2015, at 02:11, Don Wilhelm w3...@embarqmail.com wrote:

Gareth,

That is NOT correct.

You must do things in order and all will work out properly.
First, the 100 Hz WWV subcarrier should be outside the passband of the SSB 
filters, so it will have a very low amplitude.
It is better to use the alternating 500 and 600 Hz as well as the 'on the 
minute' tone at 1000Hz to determine the correct tuning of WWV.  The tone at 2 
minutes after the hour is 440Hz.

If your SSB OP1 (or FL1 if no KSB2) filter passbands are not properly aligned, 
do an initial alignment of the LSB and USB filters so the filter passband low 
frequency slope -5dB point is at 300 Hz (use Spectrogram to observe the 
passband position).

Once the SSB FL1 filter is adjusted, then receive WWV and use the Spectrogram 
(or other audio spectrum analyzer) to properly tune the WWV transmitted tones.  
Once tuned properly, lock the VFO to prevent moving the VFO knob.

With WWV properly tuned, set to CAL FCTR and alternate the internal counter 
probe between TP2 and TP1 while adjusting Control Board C22.  Since all WWV 
transmissions are on '000.000 kHz boundaries, all you need to do is observe the 
4 low order digits in the CAL FCTR display and you do not have to do the 
subtraction in every case.

Once C22 is properly adjusted, put the counter probe in TP1 and run CAL PLL.
When CAL PLL finishes, then go to CAL FIL.
Even though the FL1 passband has been previously set, you must still change the 
BFO settings.  Move them up one DAC count and back down to where they were 
before.
Then adjust the BFOs for SSB FL2 thru FL4.  I set the low frequency slope of 
FL2 at 350Hz, FL3 at 400Hz, and FL4 at 500Hz.
Adjust the BFOs for the CW filters (and RTTY filters if you have them enabled) 
to properly position the filter passbands.  If they were set correctly before, 
move them by one DAC step and back again - this is to force the BFO frequencies 
to be recorded into EEPROM with the current 4MHz reference frequency.

After those steps, re-check the WWV tuning.  It should be correct within 20 Hz. 
 The BFO DAC steps are approximately 20 Hz wide, so you may see a shift in the 
tuning by that amount.  If it is greater than 20 Hz, re-do the entire procedure 
from the beginning.

I do this procedure more than 3 times a week on K2 repairs, and it always works.

73,
Don W3FPR


On 3/2/2015 11:11 AM, Gareth - M5KVK wrote:
I realise this is close to becoming an obsession, but I really want to
understand what's going on.

Once I'd gone through my modified version of Wayne's process for adjusting
the VCO (i.e. adjusting the VFO to have the WWV 100Hz sub-carrier on
100Hz), I realised that this applied only to LSB FIL1. As soon as I
switched to FIL2, the sub-carrier moved and I needed to use CAL FIL to
adjust it back.

Also, if you want to move the position of the filter in the audio spectrum
(e.g. to change where the skirts are), and thus change the BFO; you need to
run Wayne's process again.

Is that right?

73, Gareth - M5KVK
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Help: 

Re: [Elecraft] K2 Filter settings

2015-03-02 Thread Don Wilhelm

Gareth,

That is NOT correct.

You must do things in order and all will work out properly.
First, the 100 Hz WWV subcarrier should be outside the passband of the 
SSB filters, so it will have a very low amplitude.
It is better to use the alternating 500 and 600 Hz as well as the 'on 
the minute' tone at 1000Hz to determine the correct tuning of WWV.  The 
tone at 2 minutes after the hour is 440Hz.


If your SSB OP1 (or FL1 if no KSB2) filter passbands are not properly 
aligned, do an initial alignment of the LSB and USB filters so the 
filter passband low frequency slope -5dB point is at 300 Hz (use 
Spectrogram to observe the passband position).


Once the SSB FL1 filter is adjusted, then receive WWV and use the 
Spectrogram (or other audio spectrum analyzer) to properly tune the WWV 
transmitted tones.  Once tuned properly, lock the VFO to prevent moving 
the VFO knob.


With WWV properly tuned, set to CAL FCTR and alternate the internal 
counter probe between TP2 and TP1 while adjusting Control Board C22.  
Since all WWV transmissions are on '000.000 kHz boundaries, all you need 
to do is observe the 4 low order digits in the CAL FCTR display and you 
do not have to do the subtraction in every case.


Once C22 is properly adjusted, put the counter probe in TP1 and run CAL PLL.
When CAL PLL finishes, then go to CAL FIL.
Even though the FL1 passband has been previously set, you must still 
change the BFO settings.  Move them up one DAC count and back down to 
where they were before.
Then adjust the BFOs for SSB FL2 thru FL4.  I set the low frequency 
slope of FL2 at 350Hz, FL3 at 400Hz, and FL4 at 500Hz.
Adjust the BFOs for the CW filters (and RTTY filters if you have them 
enabled) to properly position the filter passbands.  If they were set 
correctly before, move them by one DAC step and back again - this is to 
force the BFO frequencies to be recorded into EEPROM with the current 
4MHz reference frequency.


After those steps, re-check the WWV tuning.  It should be correct within 
20 Hz.  The BFO DAC steps are approximately 20 Hz wide, so you may see a 
shift in the tuning by that amount.  If it is greater than 20 Hz, re-do 
the entire procedure from the beginning.


I do this procedure more than 3 times a week on K2 repairs, and it 
always works.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 3/2/2015 11:11 AM, Gareth - M5KVK wrote:

I realise this is close to becoming an obsession, but I really want to
understand what's going on.

Once I'd gone through my modified version of Wayne's process for adjusting
the VCO (i.e. adjusting the VFO to have the WWV 100Hz sub-carrier on
100Hz), I realised that this applied only to LSB FIL1. As soon as I
switched to FIL2, the sub-carrier moved and I needed to use CAL FIL to
adjust it back.

Also, if you want to move the position of the filter in the audio spectrum
(e.g. to change where the skirts are), and thus change the BFO; you need to
run Wayne's process again.

Is that right?

73, Gareth - M5KVK
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Re: [Elecraft] K2 Filter settings

2015-03-02 Thread M5KVK - Gareth
Thanks Don
Since sending that email, I'd come across Wayne's article on the mechanics of 
CAL FIL. That opened my eyes to something I'd read, but clearly not absorbed: 
i.e. when a modified BFO is saved, the K2 re-calculates the value of VCO needed 
to obtain the same AF tone as before. Although the audio moves moves when the 
BFO is adjusted, once the BFO is saved, the tone goes back to where it was (or 
within 20Hz anyway).

One thing though. Unless it's just my KSB2 filter, you can still see WWV's 
100Hz sub-carrier on DM780 when the filter skirts are set as you suggest. It's 
very low, but DM780 has a high dynamic range and the carrier is just visible. 

Gareth, M5KVK
Sent from my iPad

 On 3 Mar 2015, at 02:11, Don Wilhelm w3...@embarqmail.com wrote:
 
 Gareth,
 
 That is NOT correct.
 
 You must do things in order and all will work out properly.
 First, the 100 Hz WWV subcarrier should be outside the passband of the SSB 
 filters, so it will have a very low amplitude.
 It is better to use the alternating 500 and 600 Hz as well as the 'on the 
 minute' tone at 1000Hz to determine the correct tuning of WWV.  The tone at 2 
 minutes after the hour is 440Hz.
 
 If your SSB OP1 (or FL1 if no KSB2) filter passbands are not properly 
 aligned, do an initial alignment of the LSB and USB filters so the filter 
 passband low frequency slope -5dB point is at 300 Hz (use Spectrogram to 
 observe the passband position).
 
 Once the SSB FL1 filter is adjusted, then receive WWV and use the Spectrogram 
 (or other audio spectrum analyzer) to properly tune the WWV transmitted 
 tones.  Once tuned properly, lock the VFO to prevent moving the VFO knob.
 
 With WWV properly tuned, set to CAL FCTR and alternate the internal counter 
 probe between TP2 and TP1 while adjusting Control Board C22.  Since all WWV 
 transmissions are on '000.000 kHz boundaries, all you need to do is observe 
 the 4 low order digits in the CAL FCTR display and you do not have to do the 
 subtraction in every case.
 
 Once C22 is properly adjusted, put the counter probe in TP1 and run CAL PLL.
 When CAL PLL finishes, then go to CAL FIL.
 Even though the FL1 passband has been previously set, you must still change 
 the BFO settings.  Move them up one DAC count and back down to where they 
 were before.
 Then adjust the BFOs for SSB FL2 thru FL4.  I set the low frequency slope of 
 FL2 at 350Hz, FL3 at 400Hz, and FL4 at 500Hz.
 Adjust the BFOs for the CW filters (and RTTY filters if you have them 
 enabled) to properly position the filter passbands.  If they were set 
 correctly before, move them by one DAC step and back again - this is to force 
 the BFO frequencies to be recorded into EEPROM with the current 4MHz 
 reference frequency.
 
 After those steps, re-check the WWV tuning.  It should be correct within 20 
 Hz.  The BFO DAC steps are approximately 20 Hz wide, so you may see a shift 
 in the tuning by that amount.  If it is greater than 20 Hz, re-do the entire 
 procedure from the beginning.
 
 I do this procedure more than 3 times a week on K2 repairs, and it always 
 works.
 
 73,
 Don W3FPR
 
 On 3/2/2015 11:11 AM, Gareth - M5KVK wrote:
 I realise this is close to becoming an obsession, but I really want to
 understand what's going on.
 
 Once I'd gone through my modified version of Wayne's process for adjusting
 the VCO (i.e. adjusting the VFO to have the WWV 100Hz sub-carrier on
 100Hz), I realised that this applied only to LSB FIL1. As soon as I
 switched to FIL2, the sub-carrier moved and I needed to use CAL FIL to
 adjust it back.
 
 Also, if you want to move the position of the filter in the audio spectrum
 (e.g. to change where the skirts are), and thus change the BFO; you need to
 run Wayne's process again.
 
 Is that right?
 
 73, Gareth - M5KVK
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[Elecraft] K2 Filter settings

2015-03-02 Thread Gareth - M5KVK
I realise this is close to becoming an obsession, but I really want to
understand what's going on.

Once I'd gone through my modified version of Wayne's process for adjusting
the VCO (i.e. adjusting the VFO to have the WWV 100Hz sub-carrier on
100Hz), I realised that this applied only to LSB FIL1. As soon as I
switched to FIL2, the sub-carrier moved and I needed to use CAL FIL to
adjust it back.

Also, if you want to move the position of the filter in the audio spectrum
(e.g. to change where the skirts are), and thus change the BFO; you need to
run Wayne's process again.

Is that right?

73, Gareth - M5KVK
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Re: [Elecraft] K2 Filter settings

2015-03-02 Thread Matt Maguire
Unfortunately the shift in dial calibration between filter settings is due to 
the limited resolution of the DAC converters that control the BFO. It is a 
design compromise, not much you can do about it.

If you adjust the reference oscillator, eg. by using Wayne’s procedure, then 
you need to run the CAL PLL and CAL FIL procedures again to update the firmware 
parameters. So, if you modify the filter settings such as the skirt positions, 
don’t run Wayne’s process again, or you’ll need to repeat the CAL PLL/CAL FIL 
procedures.

-- 
73 de Matt VK2RQ

On 3 March 2015 at 3:11:58 am, Gareth - M5KVK (m5...@m5kvk.org) wrote:

I realise this is close to becoming an obsession, but I really want to  
understand what's going on.  

Once I'd gone through my modified version of Wayne's process for adjusting  
the VCO (i.e. adjusting the VFO to have the WWV 100Hz sub-carrier on  
100Hz), I realised that this applied only to LSB FIL1. As soon as I  
switched to FIL2, the sub-carrier moved and I needed to use CAL FIL to  
adjust it back.  

Also, if you want to move the position of the filter in the audio spectrum  
(e.g. to change where the skirts are), and thus change the BFO; you need to  
run Wayne's process again.  

Is that right?  

73, Gareth - M5KVK  
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[Elecraft] K2 Filter settings

2007-03-16 Thread Nick Henwood
Thrilled to get my K2 working on 7 MHz receive but I seem to have a problem 
with filter settings.
Everything has checked out according to the book - no problems at all (even my 
home-wound coils seem to work!!)
I have set up the filters exactly according to pages 88 and 89. On Filter 1 the 
rx sounds great - plenty of gain, clean signals. On the other 3 filters it 
sounds like I am listening through a dense fog - I can tell the bandwidth is 
far narrower than F1 but signals are weak and it sounds as if the filters are 
overlapping each other (if you know what I mean). I have checked settings again 
and all look OK. Does anyone recognise this problem please? I am reluctant to 
proceed until I have sorted it out.
73 Nick G3RWF
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[Elecraft] K2 Filter settings - More

2007-03-16 Thread Ken Kopp

And the Spectrogram marker you've set to your preferred
CW note (offset) will enable you to center the passbands
on that frequency

73! Ken Kopp - K0PP
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: [Elecraft] K2 Filter settings

2007-03-16 Thread Jeff Kinzli N6GQ

I'll be the third to chime in on how useful the spectrogram method of
aligning filters is. The first time around (without spectogram) I
noticed similar results as you did, then I did the spectrogram
alignment and it got *much* better, but it still wasn't right. Third
time, it got even better. I'll be doing it again this weekend I think,
it's somewhat of an art but it's also gratifying to see how much of a
change it really can make.

As Don said, you can do this anytime, no cause for concern at this point.

73,

Jeff N6GQ

On 3/16/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Nick,

I wholeheartedly second this.  I followed the manual and noticed the same thing 
you did.  When I hooked up Spectrogram I could clearly see that the narrower 
filters were off center.  I adjusted while watching the Spectrogram screen and 
things sound *much* better.

Craig AC6NN


-- Original message --
From: Don Wilhelm [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Nick,

 Sometimes the filters (particularly the narrower ones) do not respond well
 to the initial numbers in the manual because the filter center may be
 shifted a bit due to the particular set of matched crystals supplied.  I
 don't think you have a problem.

 There is a solution, and that is called 'Spectrogram', which will provide a
 visual display of the filter shape and positioning on a computer screen.
 Download the last freeware version (5.17) of Spectrogram from www.n0ss.net
 and look at the instructions for using it on Tom's website or the Builder's
 Resource page of the Elecraft website.

 You could let the filter alignemnt wait until you have the rest of the K2
 built and the KSB2 (if you added that) installed and then you can do a
 complete dial calibration and filter alignment.  Instructions for doing that
 are on my website http://w3fpr.qrpradio.com

 73,
 Don W3FPR

  -Original Message-

 
  Thrilled to get my K2 working on 7 MHz receive but I seem to have
  a problem with filter settings.
  Everything has checked out according to the book - no problems at
  all (even my home-wound coils seem to work!!)
  I have set up the filters exactly according to pages 88 and 89.
  On Filter 1 the rx sounds great - plenty of gain, clean signals.
  On the other 3 filters it sounds like I am listening through a
  dense fog - I can tell the bandwidth is far narrower than F1 but
  signals are weak and it sounds as if the filters are overlapping
  each other (if you know what I mean). I have checked settings
  again and all look OK. Does anyone recognise this problem please?
  I am reluctant to proceed until I have sorted it out.
  73 Nick G3RWF
 
 --
 No virus found in this outgoing message.
 Checked by AVG Free Edition.
 Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.11/723 - Release Date: 3/15/2007
 11:27 AM

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Re: [Elecraft] K2 Filter settings

2007-03-16 Thread Curt Milton
Nick

you did not say if you are receiving CW or SSB (i presume likely SSB since it 
is more BW dependant in fidelity).  

if you dont have the SSB adaptor installed, all the filters may be a little bit 
narrower than many HF rigs.  when/if you add this board you will have an even 
higher fidelity SSB receive signal.  

if you get some decrease in intelligiability with narrower BW, no reason for 
alarm yet.  I suggest also listening to both USB and LSB to see if you hear a 
difference.  

do download spectrogram and the application note at the Elecraft site (and/or 
use instructions at other's websites).  it takes just an audio cable from your 
K2 audion output into your PC soundcard.  software settings may take some 
patience to get them set up, but you will be rewarded by 'seeing' your filters. 
 and for fun you will likely check out your other rigs!  

enjoy your K2 build!  73, curt


- Original Message 
From: Nick Henwood [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 6:20:04 AM
Subject: [Elecraft] K2 Filter settings


Thrilled to get my K2 working on 7 MHz receive but I seem to have a problem 
with filter settings.
Everything has checked out according to the book - no problems at all (even my 
home-wound coils seem to work!!)
I have set up the filters exactly according to pages 88 and 89. On Filter 1 the 
rx sounds great - plenty of gain, clean signals. On the other 3 filters it 
sounds like I am listening through a dense fog - I can tell the bandwidth is 
far narrower than F1 but signals are weak and it sounds as if the filters are 
overlapping each other (if you know what I mean). I have checked settings again 
and all look OK. Does anyone recognise this problem please? I am reluctant to 
proceed until I have sorted it out.
73 Nick G3RWF
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Now that's room service!  Choose from over 150,000 hotels
in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.
http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097
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[Elecraft] K2 Filter Settings MS Access Database

2005-08-03 Thread gehringc
Please excuse me as this is a repeat of a previous post requesting assistance 
for a Database Application that will record and store K2 Filter Settings.  I 
got a reply back from Andre Koopman PA0AKV.  Andre was working on a VB.net 
program that reads and stores the K2 filter settings in an MS Access DB format. 
 Andre sent me a reply in Dutch and my Dutch is pretty weak.  I inadvertently 
deleted the email before I copied Andre's email address.  So if you see this 
email Andre or if someone has his email address I would appreciate hearing 
about his progress on his VB.net program.
73, KI4DGH
Chuck G.

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Re: [Elecraft] K2 Filter Settings MS Access Database

2005-08-03 Thread Tony Fegan VE3QF

Hi Chuck,

   I did see your original post and I believe the program that you are 
looking for is K2Z by Tony Wells G7IGG. You can find it on the 
Elecraft website: http://www.elecraft.com/ . Click on K2 Software.


   PA0AKV's e-mail is pa0akv(at)noord.bart.nl (according to QRZ.com)

   73
  Tony Fegan VE3QF

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


Please excuse me as this is a repeat of a previous post requesting assistance 
for a Database Application that will record and store K2 Filter Settings.  I 
got a reply back from Andre Koopman PA0AKV.  Andre was working on a VB.net 
program that reads and stores the K2 filter settings in an MS Access DB format. 
 Andre sent me a reply in Dutch and my Dutch is pretty weak.  I inadvertently 
deleted the email before I copied Andre's email address.  So if you see this 
email Andre or if someone has his email address I would appreciate hearing 
about his progress on his VB.net program.
73, KI4DGH
Chuck G.
 



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Re: [Elecraft] K2 Filter Settings MS Access Database

2005-08-03 Thread James T. Jim Rogers, W4ATK
The hotlinks on the Elecraft website for K2Z are no longer valid it
appears.


73 Jim W4ATK
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Re: [Elecraft] K2 Filter Settings MS Access Database

2005-08-03 Thread Ken K3IU
Unfortunately, the links to K2Z on the Elecraft website no longer 
work and Tony passed away a while back.

73,
Ken K3IU
~~
At 02:42 PM 8/3/2005, you wrote:

Hi Chuck,

   I did see your original post and I believe the program that you 
are looking for is K2Z by Tony Wells G7IGG. You can find it on 
the Elecraft website: http://www.elecraft.com/ . Click on K2 Software.


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Re: [Elecraft] K2 Filter Settings MS Access Database

2005-08-03 Thread Leigh L. Klotz, Jr.
I was able to obtain K2Z both the program and the documentation from 
archive.org.

Unfortunately, the source code does not appear to be available.

I'd be happy to provide the files I got to anyone who needs them; I 
haven't tried it, though.


Leigh / WA5ZNU

Ken K3IU wrote:

Unfortunately, the links to K2Z on the Elecraft website no longer work 
and Tony passed away a while back.

73,
Ken K3IU
~~
At 02:42 PM 8/3/2005, you wrote:


Hi Chuck,

   I did see your original post and I believe the program that you 
are looking for is K2Z by Tony Wells G7IGG. You can find it on the 
Elecraft website: http://www.elecraft.com/ . Click on K2 Software.




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