Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
That's rather a stretch. It's the equivalent of saying that updating your K3 firmware to the latest approved release in the middle of a contest will hurt your score. It's the timing of the action that kills, not the action itself. The moral to that anecdote isn't the one you think it is. Dave AB7E On 5/22/2012 7:53 AM, Lu Romero wrote: > When this machine > decided to update itself right before the noon news, it > brought the ENTIRE automation system down with it. > > Moral of the story: Windows Updates can kill you. > > Lu - w4lt- > K3 #3192 > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
My apologies, I read the digest and was not aware that the discussion subject was closed. Sorry for the bandwidth. -lu-w4lt- __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
While I agree with almost all of this polemic, I disagree totally with the "Moral of the story" videre licet if one is foolish enough to let a functional (and therefore invaluable) collection of software be at the mercy of the cloud (any cloud!) by not having a local bit image backup at hand, then one gets what one deserves, e.g. Swiss cheese for feet.Even in as narrow a domain as the software for Elecraft boxes, the designers have made careful provision for users to have backups on hand (LOCAL files of operational software). It is vitally important to practice "safe sectors." A bit image backup takes only a few minutes, and can be made on an auxiliary hard drive or a jump drive. This operating philosophy has been known since dust was invented, and is not the last refuge of a paranoid person, only a means to protect oneself. John Ragle -- W1ZI = On 5/22/2012 10:53 AM, Lu Romero wrote: > Moral of the story: Windows Updates can kill you. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Some "final" comments while watching this thread progress: I agree with Lyle... SDR does not mean "processing by PC". Our K3's and KX3's are fully qualified Software Defined Radios with processing on embedded processors. Sort of like what Flex is looking to build now. It doesnt matter where the code runs, folks, just because it doesnt run on external Intel silicon does not mean it aint an SDR! The Embedded Systems approach is a safer path than trusting your device (perhipheral?) to the vagarities of personal computer OS and hardware "progress". At least you have SOME control of the environment! Professional applications have to be more resilient to the whims of software and hardware changes that will rear their ugly heads at the worst possible times. The big push for Elecraft to embrace USB instead of serial comms comes directly to mind... RS232 is well defined and robust. I certainly do not want to be left to the whims of USB driver code with my computer to radio comms. I get enough of this stuff at work to have to deal with it when Im trying to relax on the radio. $200 a year for a $8k software based product is a bit steep for a "hobby" product. Frankly, this fee is very much a high profit margin fee. An ex employer of mine used to charge 20% of the undiscounted price of an entire system on a yearly basis, and this fee was around 30% of the profit for the entire division. They demanded this early on in the product cycle because the product was the only one of the many in the industry that actually worked right. Sadly for them, the competition got better and in about 5 years, that profit completely vaporized. All support costs money; but you have to be reasonable about it. Being in that business myself, reliability is key, not the latest fun thing from some software developer. My new employer (I will join them in July) still runs their broadcast transcode processes using MS Server 2003. Why? Because they know all the bugs in it, and they dont know the bugs in Server 2010 yet. When it has to run 24x7x365, the devil you know is better than the devil you dont know. Windows updates! Larry Phipps, being a broadcast engineer, understands this scary thing. Tell you a quick horror story about Windows Update. A local station in Pittsburgh installed a new whiz-bang automated news production system to automate their newscast production a few years ago. Where they would employ 15 people in the making of this program, now with the "automation", they only needed 5 to do an even fancier show! The system ran on Windows machines. It was installed and worked wonderfully; the customer was very happy. The factory installation engineer (a personal friend of mine) personally turned off all the Windows Update settings on the many machines that comprised this system, and admonished the station engineering folks to leave this feature turned off, which they did. The system ran perfectly for several months until one day, the entire system collapsed, relegating the noon and 5pm newscasts to being performed with news cameras hastily set up in the station parking lot. Upon investigation of the problem by my friend after a hurried trip to the station, it was found that a station IT guy had turned on Windows Update on one of the newsroom computer interface machines. When this machine decided to update itself right before the noon news, it brought the ENTIRE automation system down with it. Moral of the story: Windows Updates can kill you. Lu - w4lt- K3 #3192 - Message: 18 Date: Mon, 21 May 2012 19:56:20 -0400 From: Don Wilhelm Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Message-ID: <4fbad624.3000...@embarqmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed If you want an extended example of the PC implementation of SDR, take a look at LP-PAN. That is an "SDR converter" (for receive only) to take the IF of a receiver and convert it to I/Q signals which can be further processed in a panadapter display on a personal computer. One of the things Larry Phipps emphasizes is that once you get everything working, do NOT allow Windows to update. While supposedly, Windows updates are good for security situations, it is known that such updates will "upset the applecart" with the SDR handling software. I bring this example in to point out the dependency that SDR systems that use a personal computer have on the operating system which can change from day to day. The embedded processor does not have that exposure, and IMHO is much better because it is more stable. The downloadable firmware for the K3 and KX3 definitely put those radios into the SDR arena. I certainly hope Elecraft does not begin to charge $200 a year for firmware (and technical) support. Yes, charging for upgrades within the software community is not unknown, and I do
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? end of thread
Guys, we are -way- exceeding the posting volume limit for a single topic - which is certainly overloading many readers. Let's wind this topic down at this time. 73, Eric Elecraft List Modulator www.elecraft.com _..._ On May 21, 2012, at 8:47 PM, Rick Bates wrote: > With an ability to plug directly (wirelessly?) into the Internet (some > security required) for control, audio and IF/P3 output. > > Others attempt it, only Elecraft can do it right. > > Then add smartphone/pad apps, for digital modes as well as voice, a complete > remote station in one box, just add antenna(s) and power; and/or use it as > your home station. > > Add a built in audio streamer so others can hear; alert you to rare DX... > > Best of everything, that's what we want/need! :-D > > That's Wayne/Eric's problem, how do they top what they've already > accomplished so well? (Kudos) > > Geesh, it WAS a long day today; back into my hole. > > Rick wa6nhc > > -Original Message- > From: John KLim > > Hi all, > > Suggestion for the K4 double the number of filters on the radio. > > All flames to me. > > 73 ES CUL DE N3KHK > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
With an ability to plug directly (wirelessly?) into the Internet (some security required) for control, audio and IF/P3 output. Others attempt it, only Elecraft can do it right. Then add smartphone/pad apps, for digital modes as well as voice, a complete remote station in one box, just add antenna(s) and power; and/or use it as your home station. Add a built in audio streamer so others can hear; alert you to rare DX... Best of everything, that's what we want/need! :-D That's Wayne/Eric's problem, how do they top what they've already accomplished so well? (Kudos) Geesh, it WAS a long day today; back into my hole. Rick wa6nhc -Original Message- From: John KLim Hi all, Suggestion for the K4 double the number of filters on the radio. All flames to me. 73 ES CUL DE N3KHK __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Thats good let me know if you need a test bed to try it :) Happy to be a beta tester! Cheers Simon Check out more information on the world 50 MHz and Up : www.zl4plm.com > From: n...@elecraft.com > To: gm4...@hotmail.com > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > Date: Mon, 21 May 2012 20:30:10 -0700 > > Definitely. It's at the top of our K3 list now that we've gotten over > that pesky AGC problem. > > Wayne > > On May 21, 2012, at 8:23 PM, Simon Lewis wrote: > > > Wayne, > > > > with the K3 firmware updated and the KX3 out will you now have some > > time for someone to look at the frequency jumping in the ref locked > > internal 144 transverter ? > > > > this is still the most annoying bug for a weak signal operator - to > > the extent it makes me not use the int trv at all for JT65 > > > > I know some of the other weak sig ops have asked for this to be > > looked at as well > > > > Thanks > > Simon ZL4PLM > > > > > > > > Check out more information on the world 50 MHz and Up : www.zl4plm.com > > > > > > > From: n...@elecraft.com > > > To: li...@subich.com > > > Date: Mon, 21 May 2012 19:48:44 -0700 > > > CC: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > > > > > > Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > > > > > > > looking forward to the next "high performance" offering from > > > > Elecraft. > > > > > > You can take your K3 to the next level just by putting rev 4.51 > > > firmware on it. > > > > > > No charge. > > > > > > Wayne > > > > > > > > > __ > > > Elecraft mailing list > > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > > > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Wayne, with the K3 firmware updated and the KX3 out will you now have some time for someone to look at the frequency jumping in the ref locked internal 144 transverter ? this is still the most annoying bug for a weak signal operator - to the extent it makes me not use the int trv at all for JT65 I know some of the other weak sig ops have asked for this to be looked at as well Thanks Simon ZL4PLM Check out more information on the world 50 MHz and Up : www.zl4plm.com > From: n...@elecraft.com > To: li...@subich.com > Date: Mon, 21 May 2012 19:48:44 -0700 > CC: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > > Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > > > looking forward to the next "high performance" offering from > > Elecraft. > > You can take your K3 to the next level just by putting rev 4.51 > firmware on it. > > No charge. > > Wayne > > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
OK, talked me into it also. How do you point the software to the beta sight? On May 21, 2012 10:00 PM, "Fred Jensen" wrote: > On 5/21/2012 7:48 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: > > Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > > > >> looking forward to the next "high performance" offering from > >> Elecraft. > > > > You can take your K3 to the next level just by putting rev 4.51 > > firmware on it. > > > > No charge. > > I usually hold off on the beta's, I'm really not that technically > inclined any more, I try to let others vet things for me, but I have now > heard from 4 of my good friends whose technical skills I trust that this > is a good rev. I think I'll do it tomorrow when I have the time. > > 73, > > Fred K6DGW > - Northern California Contest Club > - CU in the 2012 Cal QSO Party 6-7 Oct 2012 > - www.cqp.org > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
On 5/21/2012 7:48 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: > Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > >> looking forward to the next "high performance" offering from >> Elecraft. > > You can take your K3 to the next level just by putting rev 4.51 > firmware on it. > > No charge. I usually hold off on the beta's, I'm really not that technically inclined any more, I try to let others vet things for me, but I have now heard from 4 of my good friends whose technical skills I trust that this is a good rev. I think I'll do it tomorrow when I have the time. 73, Fred K6DGW - Northern California Contest Club - CU in the 2012 Cal QSO Party 6-7 Oct 2012 - www.cqp.org __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Hi all, Suggestion for the K4 double the number of filters on the radio. All flames to me. 73 ES CUL DE N3KHK === John R. Klim II ARRL LM, AMSAT LM 10-10: 68135 30MDG: 1820 QSL: LoTW, Bureau, Direct, eQSL as a courtesy -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Wayne Burdick Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 10:49 PM To: Joe Subich, W4TV Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > looking forward to the next "high performance" offering from > Elecraft. You can take your K3 to the next level just by putting rev 4.51 firmware on it. No charge. Wayne __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > looking forward to the next "high performance" offering from > Elecraft. You can take your K3 to the next level just by putting rev 4.51 firmware on it. No charge. Wayne __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 7:12 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: > And in case anyone was wondering, there will never, ever, be an annual > Elecraft tech-support charge. > ...just one of many favorable outgrowths of having thought through very carefully the right combination of business model + technology model. SDR via an outboard PC is a beguiling idea, but maybe impossible to commercialize. The KX3 so far appears (at least IMHO) to be the perfect blend of what works electronically and what works in the market. Tony KT0NY -- http://www.isb.edu/faculty/facultydir.aspx?ddlFaculty=352 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Difficult to see... Always in motion, is the future. -Yoda > That is good news ... and an outstanding reason to eschew the new Flex > offerings. However, I am looking forward to the next "high performance" > offering from Elecraft. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
On 5/21/2012 8:12 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote: > And in case anyone was wondering, there will never, ever, be an annual > Elecraft tech-support charge. That is good news ... and an outstanding reason to eschew the new Flex offerings. However, I am looking forward to the next "high performance" offering from Elecraft. 73, ... Joe, W4TV __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
And in case anyone was wondering, there will never, ever, be an annual Elecraft tech-support charge. Wayne Lyle Johnson wrote: > "Software defined" does not mean "PC-based". The K3 and KX3 are > absolutely software defined radios. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
If you want an extended example of the PC implementation of SDR, take a look at LP-PAN. That is an "SDR converter" (for receive only) to take the IF of a receiver and convert it to I/Q signals which can be further processed in a panadapter display on a personal computer. One of the things Larry Phipps emphasizes is that once you get everything working, do NOT allow Windows to update. While supposedly, Windows updates are good for security situations, it is known that such updates will "upset the applecart" with the SDR handling software. I bring this example in to point out the dependency that SDR systems that use a personal computer have on the operating system which can change from day to day. The embedded processor does not have that exposure, and IMHO is much better because it is more stable. The downloadable firmware for the K3 and KX3 definitely put those radios into the SDR arena. I certainly hope Elecraft does not begin to charge $200 a year for firmware (and technical) support. Yes, charging for upgrades within the software community is not unknown, and I do not begrudge Carl N4PY for doing that - he has an excellent product, but $200 a year seem a bit "steep" - Carl charges $35 per year - a big difference. 73, Don W3FPR On 5/21/2012 7:37 PM, Tony Estep wrote: > On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 5:50 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote: > >> .An SDR can be implemented by means of software in a personal computer >> *OR* embedded computing device > > >> other SDRs are moving toward the embedded processor approach >> because it does away with obsolescence due to changes in personal >> computers... > == > Don is right on. The old notion of what constitutes an SDR is no longer > meaningful, and leads only to confusion. > > The embedded processor approach does a lot of good things, but not > everything. > > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Why is it that the off-topic threads are the ones that go on forever? Dave Hachadorian, K6LL Yuma, Arizona . __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
"Software defined" does not mean "PC-based". The K3 and KX3 are absolutely software defined radios. 73, Lyle KK7P __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 5:50 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote: > > .An SDR can be implemented by means of software in a personal computer > *OR* embedded computing device > other SDRs are moving toward the embedded processor approach > because it does away with obsolescence due to changes in personal > computers... == Don is right on. The old notion of what constitutes an SDR is no longer meaningful, and leads only to confusion. The embedded processor approach does a lot of good things, but not everything. It eliminates the miserable experience of having a piece of SDR software that gobbles up the resources of the company trying to get it to run correctly, and then trying to adapt and re-adapt it to ever-changing PC hosts. However, as long as an outboard PC is required, the SDR business model is perilous both for manufacturer and customer. >From the customer's point of view, the danger is obvious. When updates to the outboard client are needed, they have to come from somewhere. What if there is nobody to supply them? Your radio made by Collins, Hallicrafters, Hammarlund, E.F. Johnson, National, etc. etc. will still work. But your software made by Lotus, or Wordstar, or Zilog, or Spinnaker, will not. And from the manufacturer's point of view, the tension between trying to advance your technology and trying to not alienate your installed user base and damage your credibility creates a narrow path. As the Bhudda said, "To perceive and to follow the Middle Way is perhaps the most difficult thing... like walking on the razor's edge." Tony KT0NY -- http://www.isb.edu/faculty/facultydir.aspx?ddlFaculty=352 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Yes the lower price is for the 6500 transceiver (not receiver) ; FLEX-6500 Limited Edition Pre-Order Deposit Only - Total Introductory Price: $3999 (deposit $1200) The FLEX-6500™ Signature Series transceiver is based on a new hardware architecture and SmartSDR software platform. This hardware uses Digital Down Conversion (DDC) to convert from RF to digital and Digital Up Conversion (DUC) to convert from Digital to RF. The FLEX-6500 uses a single Spectral Capture Unit (SCU) for the RF to digital conversion and an ultra high performance on-board signal processing and control system to perform demodulation and modulation, filtering, and audio stream management. The result is incredible receiver dynamic range and received signal clarity. The FLEX-6500 model transceiver utilizes a single SCU for reception from 0.33 to 77 MHz and the ability to create up to 4 full featured independent SLICE RECEIVERS. Optimized preselector filters can be selected for the ham bands for greater out of band rejection. SmartSDR is the ecosystem of the radio platform. It organizes all the signal processing power in the radios into an advanced radio fabric. SmartSDR understands the capabilities of each SCU and how to harness its power. It also comprises of the presentation layer or GUI client that the user interacts with. The FLEX-6500 utilizes an Ethernet connection for high-speed driverless access to the graphical user interface (GUI). The FLEX-6500 provides continuous duty 100W output across the entire 160-6m band. The FLEX-6500 also includes an automatic antenna tuner (ATU) capable of tuning antennas over 10:1 range (3:1 on 160m and 6m). For more technical information on the FLEX-6000 series of software defined radios, just download the FLEX-6000 Product Brochure. -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/OT-Dayton-new-hf-rigs-tp7556201p7556257.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Of course, this new direction by Flex in software begs the question of whether they will continue to support and improve the existing PowerSDR software. I'd hate to think that my Flex-1500 that's less than a year old will never change for the better. Of course, that question may have been asked and answered on the Flex list, so I'll go over there and not perpetuate this OT discussion. 72/73 de Jim - AD6CW On 5/21/2012 3:37 PM, "Carl, KØTNT" wrote: > There is no charge from Flex for software with the original purchase. > The $199 per year covers software upgrades AND technical support. > Somewhat the same approach as the new owners of Ham Radio Deluxe, and > the same program Carl Moreschi, N4PY, has been running for many years > now with his computer software controls for many rigs including the K3. > The DDC approach isn't something that Flex just thought up last week. > They have been doing this for quite some time in sales to commercial and > military customers so I think a lot of initial bugs have probably been > dealt with. Altho the "introductory price" is pretty staggering. > OTOH I am one of the "abandoned" SDR1000 crowd. When I first got one > (used unit by a trade) many years ago, it was exciting with lots of new > inputs, features, upgrades, bug fixes, new GUI skins, etc. Sometimes > updates per week. But then when they brought out the 5000 series, the > SDR1000 pioneers such as me got dumped by the side of the road. > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
> Since last year, the Mac Mini has a ... "Since last year" is the operative phrase ... my Mic Minis (about three years old) do not have a second video output and no option to add any. However, this isn't specifically about the Mac Mini. I could named any of several netbook and/or small Windows based laptops that have no external monitor support but I wanted to also highlight that Flex do not support OS-X or LINUX in any way ... even in the new PowerRX. Good Luck controlling the Flex 6500 or 6700 from your iPAD or iPHONE! 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/21/2012 6:34 PM, Sebastian, W4AS wrote: > Joe, without getting into a 'my OS is better than yours' discussion, you will > have to tell my Mac Mini that it only has one video output. Since last year, > the Mac Mini has a standard HDMI port, as well as a ThunderBolt port > (developed by Intel) where you can use an inexpensive adaptor to convert it > for VGA, DVI or HDMI. Add 8 gigs of RAM, and this cheap little i5 machine > works great! > > 73 de Sebastian, W4AS > > > > On May 21, 2012, at 5:23 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > >> >> Terry, >> >>> Your second assumption brings up a valid point, but not the intended >>> one. Yes, a Mac Mini probably won't work well. >> >> My point there was the lack of multiple monitor support - Apple is a >> closed system and the Mac Mini has only one video output. > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Sebastian, Your "as we have known it" phrase is telling - I think that attitude is prevalent among hams, but military and other users of SDR would not agree. An SDR can be implemented by means of software in a personal computer *OR* embedded computing device (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software-defined_radio) Taking the second alternative, Elecraft already has 2 SDRs - the K3 and the KX3. I believe other SDRs are moving toward the embedded processor approach because it does away with obsolescence due to changes in personal computers - note that the early Flex transceivers used Firewire. Try to find a modern laptop that has a firewire interface. I know there are Firewire cards available for desktops, but many SDR users insist on using laptops so things can be "portable". On 5/21/2012 6:27 PM, Sebastian, W4AS wrote: > So if the new Flex doesn't require a top of the line PC to operate and > already has much of the processing power inside, then I would say it's no > longer a software defined transceiver in the traditional sense as we've known > it (as the 3000/5000), and perhaps should be called a software assisted > radio. Did I just coin a new phrase? > > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Joe, without getting into a 'my OS is better than yours' discussion, you will have to tell my Mac Mini that it only has one video output. Since last year, the Mac Mini has a standard HDMI port, as well as a ThunderBolt port (developed by Intel) where you can use an inexpensive adaptor to convert it for VGA, DVI or HDMI. Add 8 gigs of RAM, and this cheap little i5 machine works great! 73 de Sebastian, W4AS On May 21, 2012, at 5:23 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > > Terry, > >> Your second assumption brings up a valid point, but not the intended >> one. Yes, a Mac Mini probably won't work well. > > My point there was the lack of multiple monitor support - Apple is a > closed system and the Mac Mini has only one video output. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Gary, the cheaper 6700 is the 6700R = RECEIVER ONLY. The one for $6999 is the 6700 transceiver. KE4WY Jim -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Gary Gregory Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 5:24 PM To: Peter Wollan Cc: Elecraft Reflector Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? *Peter, Flex 5000 introductory price $3999.00 Flex 6700 introductory price $5999.00 Then there is another 6700 price of $6999.00 Confusing is the best I can say...:-( Gary * On 22 May 2012 05:31, Peter Wollan wrote: > The prices I find on the Flex web site are $5999 and $6999. > > Peter W0LLN > > > On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 2:07 PM, wrote: > > > > And, once again, go to the Flex web site on-line store. Don't > > believe > me. > > In black and white (not a tee shirt), it says the 6500 is $3,999 as > > a pre-order, with a $1,200 deposit required to pre-order. > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email > list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > -- Gary VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile Elecraft Equipment K3 #679, KPA-500 #018 Living the dream!!! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
So if the new Flex doesn't require a top of the line PC to operate and already has much of the processing power inside, then I would say it's no longer a software defined transceiver in the traditional sense as we've known it (as the 3000/5000), and perhaps should be called a software assisted radio. Did I just coin a new phrase? I disagree about SDRs being a danger as a business plan in general. I hope Elecraft comes out with some sort of an SDR transceiver in the near future, and if they do, it should have an open software architecture that could run on any operating system. I believe Flex promised that at some time, but never delivered. This would allow older SDRs to live on, and could entice hardware builders to produce inexpensive transceivers without software or with minimal software. Software authors could then design a logbook for example that actually controls the radio, not just connects to it. The hardware should have a built in web server and wifi with at least ad-hoc networking for connection to the outside world. The smart future Elecraft could design a contraption that would allow plug ins of additional hardware such as transmitters for VHF/UHF, or a big HF contest station could plug in additional transmitters as needed, but with just one main contraption. The receiver(s) in said contraption would receive all bands of course; you just pick where you want to transmit; and where you want to transmit from in the world. An issue that has already become a problem with older electronic equipment, is when you design hardware to use a certain CPU and/or proprietary chips. The manufacturers of these components typically 'end of life' them in just a few years, which becomes a problem in near future manufacturing and parts stocking for repairs. An example is the Kenwood TS-2000 which has been sold for well over a decade. The finals are no longer available, so Kenwood had to design a new finals board sometime ago with new transistors. While the board can be used in older TS-2000s, the price is about half (with installation), of what the radio is worth. Barring a massive failure of the chips inside, I hope my K3s are still functional in 50 years, and myself as well! 73 de Sebastian, W4AS > On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 12:30 PM, wrote: > > Naw, the client that displays the pan and controls the radio appears to be > not too different from, say, Ham Radio Deluxe. Of course you can run lots > of pans at once and increase the computing needed, but the radio part is > all on the ARM chip inside. > > This is an interesting gambit on Flex's part. They absolutely have to get > out from under PSDR, which has been a huge resource drain with no > offsetting revenues. And they were facing obsolescence problems: a new > version of Firewire, USB 3.0, new Windows OS, etc were making them run hard > to stay in the same place with the old designs. OTOH, leaving the old > designs and their installed user base in the dust kinda makes the claim > that the radio can never go out of style sound a bit hollow -- their old > designs are now orphans and that situation will only get worse. An HQ-110 > still performs as it did 50 years ago, but a radio that depended on an > Atari 400 or an Apple 1 would just be junk. That could be the eventual fate > of the existing Flex radios, and this new design makes that point in a > trenchant way. It's a very promising design, a huge upgrade, and a huge > amount of addition by subtraction; but it illustrates the difficulties and > dangers of SDR as a business plan. > > Tony KT0NY __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
The $1,000 Macs are fine machines, too. 73, Scott, N9AA On 5/21/12 6:10 PM, kevinr wrote: > Back in '98 we hooked a very high end Mac to 9 monitors just to see if > we could do it. Worked great and the customer was quite pleased. Those > $10,000 Macs were fine machines. > Kevin. KD5ONS > > > > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Back in '98 we hooked a very high end Mac to 9 monitors just to see if we could do it. Worked great and the customer was quite pleased. Those $10,000 Macs were fine machines. Kevin. KD5ONS On 5/21/2012 3:07 PM, Rick Prather wrote: > Actually you can hook up two monitors to a current mini and in fact if you > use the Thunderbolt port you can hook up at least three! > > Rick > K6LE > > On 5/21/2012, at 2:23 , "Joe Subich, W4TV" wrote: > >> Terry, >> >>> Your second assumption brings up a valid point, but not the intended >>> one. Yes, a Mac Mini probably won't work well. >> My point there was the lack of multiple monitor support - Apple is a >> closed system and the Mac Mini has only one video output. > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Actually you can hook up two monitors to a current mini and in fact if you use the Thunderbolt port you can hook up at least three! Rick K6LE On 5/21/2012, at 2:23 , "Joe Subich, W4TV" wrote: > > Terry, > >> Your second assumption brings up a valid point, but not the intended >> one. Yes, a Mac Mini probably won't work well. > > My point there was the lack of multiple monitor support - Apple is a > closed system and the Mac Mini has only one video output. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
I think it is a very bad idea. While it is certainly common practice to require an additional payment to continue to have access to updated software, if the radio becomes inoperable because the software is not updated, I think that would be totally unacceptable. The thought of a $6700 radio becoming a paperweight is not something I would endorse. I think there needs to be further discussion of exactly what all this means. I also suspect this entire idea may go over like a lead balloon. Bruce-W8FU -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Gary Gregory Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 5:13 PM To: Bill Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? *Bill, You think that's a bad idea? In VK look what happens! ACMA Amateur ANNUAL licence fee: $65.00 Flex annual lic fee: $200.00 Hmmm...To be a licenced Ham in VK with a Flex radio will cost you $265.00 each and every year. For everything else there's Mastercard...Chuckle Regards, Gary * On 22 May 2012 04:21, Bill wrote: > Software annual fee??? Does this mean the radio will cease to operate > unless you continue to update the software? > > Sure hope this idea will not spread! > > Bill W2BLC > -- > IN GOD I TRUST (but, NOT a single politician) > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email > list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > -- Gary VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile Elecraft Equipment K3 #679, KPA-500 #018 Living the dream!!! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
On 5/21/2012 3:41 PM, wb4...@knology.net wrote: > Copied directly From the Flex web site (using copy/paste not retyped): OK, I finally found it ... there are no links to the new radio prices from the main page. They are not listed under "amateur products". One must select the "on-line store" and they be savvy enough to understand that these new boxes are called the "Signature Series" before finally finding any pricing information on these devices. Interestingly enough on the same site, the "annual maintenance" package mentions updates to the SmartSDR (control) software and tech support. It does not say anything about upgrades to firmware (DSP code). 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/21/2012 3:41 PM, wb4...@knology.net wrote: > Copied directly From the Flex web site (using copy/paste not retyped): > > FLEX-6500 Limited Edition Pre-Order Deposit Only - Total Introductory > Price: $3999 > Your Price: $1,200.00 > > The 6700 receive-only is the $5,999, and the Flex 6700 Rx/Tx is $6,000. > The 6500 (single SCU) is $3,999. Look at the page bottom, last item. > > Or, am I looking at a different Flex Radio Systems on-line store > "Signature Series" page than everyone else? > Terry, WB4JFI > > -Original Message- From: Peter Wollan > Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 3:31 PM > To: wb4...@knology.net > Cc: Joe Subich, W4TV ; Elecraft Reflector > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > > The prices I find on the Flex web site are $5999 and $6999. > > Peter W0LLN > > > On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 2:07 PM, wrote: >> >> And, once again, go to the Flex web site on-line store. Don't believe me. >> In black and white (not a tee shirt), it says the 6500 is $3,999 as a >> pre-order, with a $1,200 deposit required to pre-order. > > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
*Terry, Ah ha!..thanks for the explanation. H...still think it is an expensive way to enjoy the hobby. Whilst lots of folks are talking about technical specs I will just keep on working DX! 73's Gary * On 22 May 2012 05:41, wrote: > Copied directly From the Flex web site (using copy/paste not retyped): > > FLEX-6500 Limited Edition Pre-Order Deposit Only - Total Introductory > Price: > $3999 > Your Price: $1,200.00 > > The 6700 receive-only is the $5,999, and the Flex 6700 Rx/Tx is $6,000. > The > 6500 (single SCU) is $3,999. Look at the page bottom, last item. > > Or, am I looking at a different Flex Radio Systems on-line store "Signature > Series" page than everyone else? > Terry, WB4JFI > > -Original Message- > From: Peter Wollan > Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 3:31 PM > To: wb4...@knology.net > Cc: Joe Subich, W4TV ; Elecraft Reflector > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > > The prices I find on the Flex web site are $5999 and $6999. > > Peter W0LLN > > > On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 2:07 PM, wrote: > > > > And, once again, go to the Flex web site on-line store. Don't believe > me. > > In black and white (not a tee shirt), it says the 6500 is $3,999 as a > > pre-order, with a $1,200 deposit required to pre-order. > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > -- Gary VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile Elecraft Equipment K3 #679, KPA-500 #018 Living the dream!!! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
*Peter, Flex 5000 introductory price $3999.00 Flex 6700 introductory price $5999.00 Then there is another 6700 price of $6999.00 Confusing is the best I can say...:-( Gary * On 22 May 2012 05:31, Peter Wollan wrote: > The prices I find on the Flex web site are $5999 and $6999. > > Peter W0LLN > > > On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 2:07 PM, wrote: > > > > And, once again, go to the Flex web site on-line store. Don't believe > me. > > In black and white (not a tee shirt), it says the 6500 is $3,999 as a > > pre-order, with a $1,200 deposit required to pre-order. > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > -- Gary VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile Elecraft Equipment K3 #679, KPA-500 #018 Living the dream!!! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Terry, > Your second assumption brings up a valid point, but not the intended > one. Yes, a Mac Mini probably won't work well. My point there was the lack of multiple monitor support - Apple is a closed system and the Mac Mini has only one video output. > Not the addition of both signals, as you seem to imply. Think vector > sums of AC voltages, not DC summing as a battery. That is exactly my point. An ADC must be able to handle the absolute largest peak voltage for all signals at the same time. If it can not handle that peak voltage without overflow, the result is IMD that no amount of decimation will correct. > Granted, there may be instantaneous flashes where signals within the > passband combine, but it's not constant like DC voltages, as your > math implies. Than goodness we aren't all on the same frequency and > the same phase. While the chance of every signal adding to the maximum level is small and the duration of any peak is certainly short, it never the less represents a finite probability. It is exactly the reason that HDTV television transmitters and cell phone "base station" transmitters have power amplifiers that are rated for significant peak to average ratios and generally need to run much higher standing currents (much closer to class A than class C) to produce acceptable IMD/distortion/linearity specifications. If the receiver designer chooses to use AGC to prevent the ADC from overflow, the AGC must have a very fast attack and will suffer from the very issues of "window desensitization" we see with conventional DSP radios when the DSP bandwidth is less than the roofing filter bandwidth. > Once again, go do research on Digital DownConversion, decimation, > SDR, processing gain. I have been ... I'm stuck in Charleston, WV due to car trouble on my way home from Dayton. I've been using the time to reread much of the information on DDC, Decimation, etc. as well as discuss the issues off- line with some of the smartest DSP people out there. Decimation can certainly improve Blocking Dynamic Range beyond that provided by the "number of bits" ... higher sample rates and increased processing can add to the effective dynamic range *IF* the ADC is never permitted to overflow *or* AGC doesn't drop the weakest signals below the composite noise floor. I'm not questioning whether the Flex is interesting technology, I am questioning whether the claimed 150 dB [blocking] dynamic range (no claims about IMD DR) is sufficient to maintain sensitivity to below -140 dBm if the ADC can be expected to see peak signal levels approaching 20 dBm under normal (contest and/or low band) operating conditions. > And, once again, go to the Flex web site on-line store. Don't > believe me. In black and white (not a tee shirt), it says the 6500 is > $3,999 as a pre-order, with a $1,200 deposit required to pre-order. > Click the button yourself. You might like the rig. I'm said I like the concept and $3999 for the 6500 makes it more interesting - I was not able to find that price when I looked at the web site (and downloaded the pdf brochure) before leaving Dayton. I do think there are some significant values in the "dual front end" (6700) radio - like null steering, true duplex operation for "SO2R in a box", and diversity. However, I think the Flex products would make more appropriately priced at $2999/$4999 when compared to other amateur products than even the current $3999/$6999. If I could get the 6700 for $4999 with updates when desired for < $150 and I could be sure that the front end would not fall apart or there wouldn't be a blocking issue with multiple strong signals (or 5V from the local 50KW AM station) the 6700 would be on my short list of "future acquisitions". > Sorry for the off-topic bandwidth. I don't know that issues of DSP and/or receiver performance are off-topic but that's up to Eric. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/21/2012 3:07 PM, wb4...@knology.net wrote: > First of all, I do not use every bell and whistle on my K3, and I don't > have every option available on my K3, even though it's nicely loaded to > me. For example, I do not have the second receiver. So, I do not use my > existing rig to it's "maximum use". Therefore, to extrapolate that I > would need to take advantage of every morsel in the 6700 or 6500 is > apples to oranges. > > Your second assumption brings up a valid point, but not the intended > one. Yes, a Mac Mini probably won't work well. But, not due to a lack of > horsepower. Flex's initial software is for Windows. Yes, I know all > about using Parallels and the other software thing that lets you run > Windows programs on Mac. I have a Macbook here as well as Windows and > Linux. Macs are notoriously expensive for what you get. I bet a > $700-$900 (excluding monitor, since you priced just the Mini) Intel i5 > or i7 and Windows box would work very nice with a Flex 6000 series. Feel > free to yell at Flex for not providing Mac support. > > Joe, your math below ass
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
*Bill, You think that's a bad idea? In VK look what happens! ACMA Amateur ANNUAL licence fee: $65.00 Flex annual lic fee: $200.00 Hmmm...To be a licenced Ham in VK with a Flex radio will cost you $265.00 each and every year. For everything else there's Mastercard...Chuckle Regards, Gary * On 22 May 2012 04:21, Bill wrote: > Software annual fee??? Does this mean the radio will cease to operate > unless you continue to update the software? > > Sure hope this idea will not spread! > > Bill W2BLC > -- > IN GOD I TRUST (but, NOT a single politician) > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > -- Gary VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile Elecraft Equipment K3 #679, KPA-500 #018 Living the dream!!! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Yup, $6999 and $3999. I hadn't scrolled down far enough. Sorry for the confusion. Peter W0LLN On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 2:41 PM, wrote: > Copied directly From the Flex web site (using copy/paste not retyped): > > FLEX-6500 Limited Edition Pre-Order Deposit Only - Total Introductory Price: > $3999 > Your Price: $1,200.00 > > The 6700 receive-only is the $5,999, and the Flex 6700 Rx/Tx is $6,000. The > 6500 (single SCU) is $3,999. Look at the page bottom, last item. > > Or, am I looking at a different Flex Radio Systems on-line store "Signature > Series" page than everyone else? > Terry, WB4JFI > > -Original Message- From: Peter Wollan > Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 3:31 PM > To: wb4...@knology.net > Cc: Joe Subich, W4TV ; Elecraft Reflector > > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > > The prices I find on the Flex web site are $5999 and $6999. > > Peter W0LLN > > > On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 2:07 PM, wrote: >> >> >> And, once again, go to the Flex web site on-line store. Don't believe me. >> In black and white (not a tee shirt), it says the 6500 is $3,999 as a >> pre-order, with a $1,200 deposit required to pre-order. > > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Copied directly From the Flex web site (using copy/paste not retyped): FLEX-6500 Limited Edition Pre-Order Deposit Only - Total Introductory Price: $3999 Your Price: $1,200.00 The 6700 receive-only is the $5,999, and the Flex 6700 Rx/Tx is $6,000. The 6500 (single SCU) is $3,999. Look at the page bottom, last item. Or, am I looking at a different Flex Radio Systems on-line store "Signature Series" page than everyone else? Terry, WB4JFI -Original Message- From: Peter Wollan Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 3:31 PM To: wb4...@knology.net Cc: Joe Subich, W4TV ; Elecraft Reflector Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? The prices I find on the Flex web site are $5999 and $6999. Peter W0LLN On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 2:07 PM, wrote: > > And, once again, go to the Flex web site on-line store. Don't believe me. > In black and white (not a tee shirt), it says the 6500 is $3,999 as a > pre-order, with a $1,200 deposit required to pre-order. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
The prices I find on the Flex web site are $5999 and $6999. Peter W0LLN On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 2:07 PM, wrote: > > And, once again, go to the Flex web site on-line store. Don't believe me. > In black and white (not a tee shirt), it says the 6500 is $3,999 as a > pre-order, with a $1,200 deposit required to pre-order. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
First of all, I do not use every bell and whistle on my K3, and I don't have every option available on my K3, even though it's nicely loaded to me. For example, I do not have the second receiver. So, I do not use my existing rig to it's "maximum use". Therefore, to extrapolate that I would need to take advantage of every morsel in the 6700 or 6500 is apples to oranges. Your second assumption brings up a valid point, but not the intended one. Yes, a Mac Mini probably won't work well. But, not due to a lack of horsepower. Flex's initial software is for Windows. Yes, I know all about using Parallels and the other software thing that lets you run Windows programs on Mac. I have a Macbook here as well as Windows and Linux. Macs are notoriously expensive for what you get. I bet a $700-$900 (excluding monitor, since you priced just the Mini) Intel i5 or i7 and Windows box would work very nice with a Flex 6000 series. Feel free to yell at Flex for not providing Mac support. Joe, your math below assumes that every signal is at the same frequency and the same phase in order to just add the levels, otherwise things don't just add up like that. For example, even if two signals (both +50dBm) are on the exact same frequency, but exactly opposite phases, they WILL CANCEL each other out, you will end up with NO dBm. Nada. Not the addition of both signals, as you seem to imply. Think vector sums of AC voltages, not DC summing as a battery. Granted, there may be instantaneous flashes where signals within the passband combine, but it's not constant like DC voltages, as your math implies. Than goodness we aren't all on the same frequency and the same phase. Back to the main point, the new Flex radios DO come with traditional filtering, if you need it. In Europe or near an AM broadcast station, it may be necessary. However, I am sure that the receiver will have significantly better dynamic range than the 96dB implied by a 16-bit RF A/D converter. THAT's the point. 16-bits only gets you 96dB minimum to maximum without "distortion". If there's any more dBs found, even in the harshest test, there is processing gain. And most of the DSP and SDR world seems to believe in processing gain due to decimation. Once again, go do research on Digital DownConversion, decimation, SDR, processing gain. And, once again, go to the Flex web site on-line store. Don't believe me. In black and white (not a tee shirt), it says the 6500 is $3,999 as a pre-order, with a $1,200 deposit required to pre-order. Click the button yourself. You might like the rig. I agree that $200 per year for software support is a bit steep. BTW, I don't think the rig stops working if you don't pay, you just aren't entitled to updates. Oh, wait. My Macbook requires me pay for EVERY OS upgrade, even in-between ones. I had to buy Snow Leopard just to have the right to upgrade from Leopard to Lion. And that's on a dumb Macbook, which costs a lot less that a Flex 6500. Maybe I should shut up now. Reflector, I am done with this. Long live my K3! I have, and will continue to defend my K3 on the Flex reflector just as vigorously. Sorry for the off-topic bandwidth. 73, Terry, WB4JFI -Original Message- From: Joe Subich, W4TV Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 1:57 PM To: wb4...@knology.net ; Elecraft Reflector Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > Given the amount of processing done inside the 6000 series, except > for requiring gig-e, I'm not sure that a honking computer is > required. For maximum use, one will probably need a multiple display system - or multiple computers for "radio" plus logger. Not something one can do with a $699 Mac Mini. > BTW, you really need to research DDCs. Previous comments about > signals combining exponentially seems a little off. I think the > military and other users (including Quicksilver, HPSDR, HiQSDR, and > SDR-IQ users) might be slightly surprised by that math. Do the math with multiple S9+20 (-53 dBm) to S9+40 (-33 dBm) signals in a 300 KHz RX passband (or even with *no* front end filter as Flex mentions in their brochure). The effect is two or three volts peak! It's not simply an extra 3 dB for each additional signal. With *measured* broadcast signals in Europe adjacent to and within 40 meters of 0 to +10 dBm on a simple dipole, that's going to be a problem even with the (optional) bandpass filters for each amateur band. Yes, in reasonably quiet locations - without strong local signals - the Flex BDR will be fine. However, if one lives close to an AM "antenna farm" or in a high concentration of active amateurs, the out of band issue can be severe on 160/80/40. The bandpass filters will be necessary, out of band receive will be an issue and contests with their high level of big sign
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 12:30 PM, wrote: > ... I'm not sure that a honking computer is required... === Naw, the client that displays the pan and controls the radio appears to be not too different from, say, Ham Radio Deluxe. Of course you can run lots of pans at once and increase the computing needed, but the radio part is all on the ARM chip inside. This is an interesting gambit on Flex's part. They absolutely have to get out from under PSDR, which has been a huge resource drain with no offsetting revenues. And they were facing obsolescence problems: a new version of Firewire, USB 3.0, new Windows OS, etc were making them run hard to stay in the same place with the old designs. OTOH, leaving the old designs and their installed user base in the dust kinda makes the claim that the radio can never go out of style sound a bit hollow -- their old designs are now orphans and that situation will only get worse. An HQ-110 still performs as it did 50 years ago, but a radio that depended on an Atari 400 or an Apple 1 would just be junk. That could be the eventual fate of the existing Flex radios, and this new design makes that point in a trenchant way. It's a very promising design, a huge upgrade, and a huge amount of addition by subtraction; but it illustrates the difficulties and dangers of SDR as a business plan. Tony KT0NY -- http://www.isb.edu/faculty/facultydir.aspx?ddlFaculty=352 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Software annual fee??? Does this mean the radio will cease to operate unless you continue to update the software? Sure hope this idea will not spread! Bill W2BLC -- IN GOD I TRUST (but, NOT a single politician) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
> Given the amount of processing done inside the 6000 series, except > for requiring gig-e, I'm not sure that a honking computer is > required. For maximum use, one will probably need a multiple display system - or multiple computers for "radio" plus logger. Not something one can do with a $699 Mac Mini. > BTW, you really need to research DDCs. Previous comments about > signals combining exponentially seems a little off. I think the > military and other users (including Quicksilver, HPSDR, HiQSDR, and > SDR-IQ users) might be slightly surprised by that math. Do the math with multiple S9+20 (-53 dBm) to S9+40 (-33 dBm) signals in a 300 KHz RX passband (or even with *no* front end filter as Flex mentions in their brochure). The effect is two or three volts peak! It's not simply an extra 3 dB for each additional signal. With *measured* broadcast signals in Europe adjacent to and within 40 meters of 0 to +10 dBm on a simple dipole, that's going to be a problem even with the (optional) bandpass filters for each amateur band. Yes, in reasonably quiet locations - without strong local signals - the Flex BDR will be fine. However, if one lives close to an AM "antenna farm" or in a high concentration of active amateurs, the out of band issue can be severe on 160/80/40. The bandpass filters will be necessary, out of band receive will be an issue and contests with their high level of big signals may be a problem for everyone with a DDC based receiver. due to ADC overload. > Joe, if you go to the Flex on-line store, you will see the 6500 is > $3,999, which I reported in an earlier email. I did not see that ... and I looked for it. I was told $6K and $7K by a Flex employee (wearing a Flex shirt) at the booth in Dayton. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/21/2012 1:30 PM, wb4...@knology.net wrote: > Joe, if you go to the Flex on-line store, you will see the 6500 is > $3,999, which I reported in an earlier email. Yes, that does NOT include > the computer or the software "fee". Given the amount of processing done > inside the 6000 series, except for requiring gig-e, I'm not sure that a > honking computer is required. > > BTW, you really need to research DDCs. Previous comments about signals > combining exponentially seems a little off. I think the military and > other users (including Quicksilver, HPSDR, HiQSDR, and SDR-IQ users) > might be slightly surprised by that math. > >> From a K3 lover, and not necessarily a Flex lover, but in the interest of > "balance". > 73 > Terry, WB4JFI > > > -----Original Message----- From: Joe Subich, W4TV > Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 1:03 PM > To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > > >> Flex is releasing the new 6500 and 6700 radios. Again, mockups and not >> operational at Dayton. Price on 6500 is $3900 and 6700 around $7k > > Where did you see $3900 for the Flex 6500? I was told $5995 for the > "single front end" radio and $7999 for the dual front end radio. That > doesn't include a high end computer with multiple displays and a $200 > per year software license fee. > > 73, > > ... Joe, W4TV > > > On 5/21/2012 11:37 AM, Dave wrote: >> They had brochures on the 3000 but no radio on display. Looks like >> same size >> and form as the Icom 7600. >> >> Kenwood had a mockup of the new TS-990. Back connections were covered and >> not visible. Front display was showing a photo and was not a working >> radio. >> According to Kenwood the hardware design is just about finished but >> firmware >> has a long way to go. They are hoping for FCC cert in August and shipping >> around November. (They didn't say what year!) Price is between $5k and >> $10k. >> >> Flex is releasing the new 6500 and 6700 radios. Again, mockups and not >> operational at Dayton. Price on 6500 is $3900 and 6700 around $7k >> >> Dave >> wo2x >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Mike Rodgers >> Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 11:25 AM >> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net >> Subject: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? >> >> Did anyone see or turn knobs on the proposed FTDX-3000? >> Did Kenwood have the rumored new >> Hf rig? >> >> Thanks >> Mike R >> >> Play me some fiddle, but no stinkin' violin! >> >> Amateur/Ham Radio KE5GBC >> HF& Echolink mobile >> __ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:Elecr
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Joe, if you go to the Flex on-line store, you will see the 6500 is $3,999, which I reported in an earlier email. Yes, that does NOT include the computer or the software "fee". Given the amount of processing done inside the 6000 series, except for requiring gig-e, I'm not sure that a honking computer is required. BTW, you really need to research DDCs. Previous comments about signals combining exponentially seems a little off. I think the military and other users (including Quicksilver, HPSDR, HiQSDR, and SDR-IQ users) might be slightly surprised by that math. >From a K3 lover, and not necessarily a Flex lover, but in the interest of "balance". 73 Terry, WB4JFI -Original Message- From: Joe Subich, W4TV Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 1:03 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > Flex is releasing the new 6500 and 6700 radios. Again, mockups and not > operational at Dayton. Price on 6500 is $3900 and 6700 around $7k Where did you see $3900 for the Flex 6500? I was told $5995 for the "single front end" radio and $7999 for the dual front end radio. That doesn't include a high end computer with multiple displays and a $200 per year software license fee. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/21/2012 11:37 AM, Dave wrote: > They had brochures on the 3000 but no radio on display. Looks like same > size > and form as the Icom 7600. > > Kenwood had a mockup of the new TS-990. Back connections were covered and > not visible. Front display was showing a photo and was not a working > radio. > According to Kenwood the hardware design is just about finished but > firmware > has a long way to go. They are hoping for FCC cert in August and shipping > around November. (They didn't say what year!) Price is between $5k and > $10k. > > Flex is releasing the new 6500 and 6700 radios. Again, mockups and not > operational at Dayton. Price on 6500 is $3900 and 6700 around $7k > > Dave > wo2x > > > -Original Message- > From: Mike Rodgers > Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 11:25 AM > To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > Subject: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > > Did anyone see or turn knobs on the proposed FTDX-3000? > Did Kenwood have the rumored new > Hf rig? > > Thanks > Mike R > > Play me some fiddle, but no stinkin' violin! > > Amateur/Ham Radio KE5GBC > HF& Echolink mobile > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
> Flex is releasing the new 6500 and 6700 radios. Again, mockups and not > operational at Dayton. Price on 6500 is $3900 and 6700 around $7k Where did you see $3900 for the Flex 6500? I was told $5995 for the "single front end" radio and $7999 for the dual front end radio. That doesn't include a high end computer with multiple displays and a $200 per year software license fee. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 5/21/2012 11:37 AM, Dave wrote: > They had brochures on the 3000 but no radio on display. Looks like same size > and form as the Icom 7600. > > Kenwood had a mockup of the new TS-990. Back connections were covered and > not visible. Front display was showing a photo and was not a working radio. > According to Kenwood the hardware design is just about finished but firmware > has a long way to go. They are hoping for FCC cert in August and shipping > around November. (They didn't say what year!) Price is between $5k and $10k. > > Flex is releasing the new 6500 and 6700 radios. Again, mockups and not > operational at Dayton. Price on 6500 is $3900 and 6700 around $7k > > Dave > wo2x > > > -Original Message- > From: Mike Rodgers > Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 11:25 AM > To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > Subject: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > > Did anyone see or turn knobs on the proposed FTDX-3000? > Did Kenwood have the rumored new > Hf rig? > > Thanks > Mike R > > Play me some fiddle, but no stinkin' violin! > > Amateur/Ham Radio KE5GBC > HF& Echolink mobile > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Thanks Jim, Guess I missed it. Good to see new HF radios coming out. Competition is good for the consumer! Dave wo2x -Original Message- From: Jim Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 11:44 AM Cc: Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? Yaesu did have an FT-3000 under glass on the same side where the hats are given out. The scope appeared more real time (faster) verses the 5000 and 9000. Nice looking rig. Hopefully it will perform well. Single receiver. KE4WY Jim __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
I saw the Kenwood TS-990. It is a big, big radio, with over 140 buttons and knobs, but it looks a bit like a piece of A/V equipment. It'd be interesting to see exactly how much empty space is inside. I passed by the Yaesu booth on the way to the Elecraft booth and saw the FT-3000. Nice looking rig, but has no second receiver, so whats the point? 73, Scott, N9AA On 5/21/12 11:25 AM, Mike Rodgers wrote: > Did anyone see or turn knobs on the proposed FTDX-3000? > Did Kenwood have the rumored new > Hf rig? > > Thanks > Mike R > > Play me some fiddle, but no stinkin' violin! > > Amateur/Ham Radio KE5GBC > HF& Echolink mobile > > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
Yaesu did have an FT-3000 under glass on the same side where the hats are given out. The scope appeared more real time (faster) verses the 5000 and 9000. Nice looking rig. Hopefully it will perform well. Single receiver. KE4WY Jim Sent from my Ipod On May 21, 2012, at 11:37 AM, Dave wrote: > They had brochures on the 3000 but no radio on display. Looks like same size > and form as the Icom 7600. > > Kenwood had a mockup of the new TS-990. Back connections were covered and > not visible. Front display was showing a photo and was not a working radio. > According to Kenwood the hardware design is just about finished but firmware > has a long way to go. They are hoping for FCC cert in August and shipping > around November. (They didn't say what year!) Price is between $5k and $10k. > > Flex is releasing the new 6500 and 6700 radios. Again, mockups and not > operational at Dayton. Price on 6500 is $3900 and 6700 around $7k > > Dave > wo2x > > > -Original Message- > From: Mike Rodgers > Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 11:25 AM > To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net > Subject: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? > > Did anyone see or turn knobs on the proposed FTDX-3000? > Did Kenwood have the rumored new > Hf rig? > > Thanks > Mike R > > Play me some fiddle, but no stinkin' violin! > > Amateur/Ham Radio KE5GBC > HF & Echolink mobile > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs?
They had brochures on the 3000 but no radio on display. Looks like same size and form as the Icom 7600. Kenwood had a mockup of the new TS-990. Back connections were covered and not visible. Front display was showing a photo and was not a working radio. According to Kenwood the hardware design is just about finished but firmware has a long way to go. They are hoping for FCC cert in August and shipping around November. (They didn't say what year!) Price is between $5k and $10k. Flex is releasing the new 6500 and 6700 radios. Again, mockups and not operational at Dayton. Price on 6500 is $3900 and 6700 around $7k Dave wo2x -Original Message- From: Mike Rodgers Sent: Monday, May 21, 2012 11:25 AM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] [OT] Dayton- new hf rigs? Did anyone see or turn knobs on the proposed FTDX-3000? Did Kenwood have the rumored new Hf rig? Thanks Mike R Play me some fiddle, but no stinkin' violin! Amateur/Ham Radio KE5GBC HF & Echolink mobile __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
