Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Not to mention that the footprint is considerably smaller on the K3 -- a serious blessing on cramped folding tables of Field Day. In fact the small footprint sealed the deal for me on my K3. My whole house is only 720 square feet and every square inch of desk space is precious in my shack. Those leviathan rigs are impressive but something else would have to go. For its size and weight (and base price), the K3 is truly miraculous. 73 de Eric, KG6MZS On Jun 22, 2012, at 12:56 PM, Bill K9YEQ wrote: Exactly... or take the KX3, even lighter... or take both and share :-) 73, Bill K9YEQ -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Wayne Burdick Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 12:49 PM To: Scott Manthe Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad Another nice thing about the K3 is that you can take it to Field Day. (10 pounds vs. 50 pounds, and 1 amp receive current drain vs. 3 or 4 amps :) 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
My experience is that my K2 and K1 both hear better on CW than my TS2000. Enjoy the K2. I have one I purchased used, but am getting the itch to build my own! 73 Joe -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Happy-But-Very-Sad-tp7557917p7558157.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad (Building a K2)
One of my most enjoyable experiences as a HAM was building K2 #35 back in '99.Go for it! I have a TS2000. I hardly use it... but for 440. Seems like a waste, but it can serve as a backup for any of my equipment. 73, Bill K9YEQ -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of AF6NI Sent: Monday, June 25, 2012 6:24 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad My experience is that my K2 and K1 both hear better on CW than my TS2000. Enjoy the K2. I have one I purchased used, but am getting the itch to build my own! 73 Joe -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Happy-But-Very-Sad-tp7557917p7558157.ht ml Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
One of the members of the Zuni Loop QRP Field Day has brought his K3 for the past two years that I recall. Count was three K2s, one K3, one KX3, an Argonaut V and my K2 that I brought as backup. In the past I would have worried about bringing a personal transceiver worth that much to any location outside of the house, but now I'm thinking otherwise, inasmuch as many DXpeditions feature K3s. Power for this QRP K3 was a 100-Ah battery that took two guys to carry to the 20m tent. 72/73 de Jim - AD6CW On 6/22/2012 10:48 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote: Another nice thing about the K3 is that you can take it to Field Day. (10 pounds vs. 50 pounds, and 1 amp receive current drain vs. 3 or 4 amps :) 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Gentlemen, Please take personal attacks and heated arguments off list. Its Ok to discuss technical features, specs, test data etc, but please keep it civil. If this thread degenerates further I will be forced to close it. 73, Eric Elecraft List Moderator www.elecraft.com _..._ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Where is the data to back up what was said on eham. It was one guy! Mike W0MU W0MU-1 CC Cluster w0mu.net:23 or w0mu-1.dnsdynamic.com Http://www.w0mu.com On 6/22/2012 3:48 PM, Adrian wrote: K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right? Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product. See; http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean amps escape the wrath of the imd police. The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation. A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000 exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere. 73, Scott, N9AA __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
I am very fortunate in that I have both a K3 and an FT 5000 MP. Both radios have their strong points and some weak points. But frankly I have never had a report of either splatter or key clicks from the K3. I run it with an amplifier at which time the K3 output is around 20 to 30 W. When I use it barefoot at 100 W it also seems very clean with no adverse reports. The FT 5000 certainly has a fine main receiver but the secondary receiver is not as good since it does not use the front end roofing filters. That is in contrast to the K3 whose secondary receiver is identical in performance to the main receiver. As for as I know, that is the only radio that offers that feature. Also, the K3 weighs only about 8 pounds as contrasted with 55 pounds for the FT 5000. Obviously, I will not be doing much traveling with the FT 5000. Someone mentioned what they perceived as inferior feel to the vfo on the K3. Again I must dispute that. It feels quite adequate to me. The FT 5000 vfo is very smooth but is also much more complex in its construction. It is also much easier to change the tuning rate on the K3 as compared to the FT 5000 where one must go into the menu system to do that. The K3 requires only a push of a button or two. I really think it is pointless to endlessly argue the finer points of either radio. They will appeal to different folks for different purposes. I think we are very fortunate to have them both available. Of course, Elecraft wins hands down for customer support. No one does that better than Elecraft. Bruce-W8FU -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Robert Vargas Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 7:14 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad Love my K3 as I know I will love my KX3 on order and I love Elecraft customer support and the fact that the owners stand behind their products and are real gentlemen. However, if I had $5K to spend and the difference between a fully loaded K3 and the FT-5000 was around $500-$700, I would blindly go with the FT-5000. The specs are close for me and I have operated the FT-5000 and believe that it also has a great receiver. The difference I believe lies in the construction/workmanship of both radios and I'm reminded about that every time I turn the K3 VFO. I believe that the KX3 pricing is more inline with what you are getting but the K3 is IMHO slightly overpriced for a kit. But, I then have to realize that someone has to pay for the magnificent intellectual work that Wayne and Eric have done in the development of the K3's firmware, and that is worth the money. I really look forward to better construction/workmanship for the K4... Robert, KP4Y From: Scott Manthe scott.man...@gmail.com To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 6:54 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad I said the K3's transmitter was superior to the FT-5000, not perfect. The ARRL review lists the 3rd order TX IMD numbers at -30db for the 5000 and -29 dB for the K3, but those numbers alone don't tell the whole story. Take at look at the ARRL's phase noise numbers and spectral display characteristics for the FT-5000's transmitted signal and compare them to the K3 and then get back to us. To be fair, the K3 tested does seem to have an issue with inferior 9th order IMD numbers, though. These figures were without the FT-5000's processor turned on, which of course, dirties up the 5000's signal quite a bit, unless that feature has been fixed. If it has, many contesters will be tearing up, because that and the key clicks help FT5000 ops get higher scores. Re: your other post, my K3 is rated at 100 watts output, so I'm sure someone running one at 120 watts will notice that the performance does degrade. I find the slightly higher PS voltage an intriguing idea. The FT-5000 is a fine rig, and is fairly clean in class A mode, with the processor turned off, but most people don't run them that way. 73, Scott, N9AA On 6/22/12 5:48 PM, Adrian wrote: K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right? Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product. See; http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean amps escape the wrath of the imd police. The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
I just purchased a late model K2 because a couple friends of mine was bragging how super a receiver the K2 had and after 2 weeks of using my K2 I have found the same thing you have I have been running aYaesu FT 920 for 15 years it my main 6 meter radio I worked 112 countries with here in the midwest can't wait to get a transverter on the K2 to see just how well it going to hear on the vhf/uhf bands with transverters. Good things come in small packages and not a super prices either. Was about to buy a new FTdx 5000 really big buck now I thinking more along the lines of a K3 complete station. All made in the good old USA! 73, Bill, W0WFH __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would be very pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully loaded K3 at about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has the 5000 is on top but the K3 is still very close the 5000 has had many firmware updates that improved it from even the original test numbers that were published by QST and Sherwood. In fact Sherwood tested one of the 5000's that were on the way to CA for repair so really didn't get all the numbers. I have used a Yaesu VL-1000 amp for over 5 years a KW on 6-160m full auto band switching and never a problem of any kind. I enjoy the Elecraft line very much and they make wonderful equipment that few cam matches and I'm looking forward to getting my loaded K2/100 on line soon. I'm now looking at an Elecraft Power/SWR meter to match my tuner I also like things to match but can use the K2 for an exciter for the Quarda if needed. But I really wanted it mostly for a QRP rig and use the 100w for Field Day maybe. 73, Fred/N0AZZ -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Yahoo! Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 4:29 AM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad I just purchased a late model K2 because a couple friends of mine was bragging how super a receiver the K2 had and after 2 weeks of using my K2 I have found the same thing you have I have been running aYaesu FT 920 for 15 years it my main 6 meter radio I worked 112 countries with here in the midwest can't wait to get a transverter on the K2 to see just how well it going to hear on the vhf/uhf bands with transverters. Good things come in small packages and not a super prices either. Was about to buy a new FTdx 5000 really big buck now I thinking more along the lines of a K3 complete station. All made in the good old USA! 73, Bill, W0WFH __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2437/5084 - Release Date: 06/21/12 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
I would debate the comment about the same price. I got my fully loaded used K3/100 for about $1500 less than what i would pay for a FT5000MP and then recently bought a second less than fully loaded K3/100 with the savings for Remoterig twin mode. I am sure the FT5000MP is a schweet top of the line rig and I may end up buying one down the road but for now I am stoked with the K3. I mean my two K3s. Keith AG6AZ Sent from my iPhone please excuse typos On Jun 22, 2012, at 4:54 AM, Fred Smith m...@mo-net.com wrote: Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would be very pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully loaded K3 at about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has the 5000 is on top but the K3 is still very close the 5000 has had many firmware updates that improved it from even the original test numbers that were published by QST and Sherwood. In fact Sherwood tested one of the 5000's that were on the way to CA for repair so really didn't get all the numbers. I have used a Yaesu VL-1000 amp for over 5 years a KW on 6-160m full auto band switching and never a problem of any kind. I enjoy the Elecraft line very much and they make wonderful equipment that few cam matches and I'm looking forward to getting my loaded K2/100 on line soon. I'm now looking at an Elecraft Power/SWR meter to match my tuner I also like things to match but can use the K2 for an exciter for the Quarda if needed. But I really wanted it mostly for a QRP rig and use the 100w for Field Day maybe. 73, Fred/N0AZZ -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Yahoo! Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 4:29 AM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad I just purchased a late model K2 because a couple friends of mine was bragging how super a receiver the K2 had and after 2 weeks of using my K2 I have found the same thing you have I have been running aYaesu FT 920 for 15 years it my main 6 meter radio I worked 112 countries with here in the midwest can't wait to get a transverter on the K2 to see just how well it going to hear on the vhf/uhf bands with transverters. Good things come in small packages and not a super prices either. Was about to buy a new FTdx 5000 really big buck now I thinking more along the lines of a K3 complete station. All made in the good old USA! 73, Bill, W0WFH __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2437/5084 - Release Date: 06/21/12 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Sell the 950 and use the proceeds to get all the additional options for your K2 (or maybe a nice chunk of change to save for a K3). Just don't expect to sell it to many on this list.. :-) I am building my third K2 (I sold the previous ones to pay for other things, not because of the radio) and will be eventually putting all the extras in it. It will become my main station rig. My 756 will then be used for 6 meters or eventually sold. Someday a K3 will find its way into my shack but until then, the K2 will fill my needs just fine. Congrats on your K2. 73, Jason N8XE On 6/21/12, Mike Bellow w2t...@gmail.com wrote: Hi All I recently picked up a used K2 locally here that was out of alignment,had to wait for freq probe that I ordered from Elecraft which arrived very fast,after doing a alignment on the radio,and After I set it up,I was very happy to see it works very well.This is my first Elecraft radio and this one is a #01014 serial number one of the early ones I guess.Now the Sad Part..Today I was listening on 14060 as usual for qrp stations and heard a very very faint station calling CQ Qrp,if I were to tag a rst report on this one I would say 119 no s meter reading at all but I could copy it fine.For comparison I hooked my Brand New 2 months old Yaesu Ft-950 and guess what??? Could not hear anything there but Staticno signal at all.$1400.00 for this radioNow I'm Happy but very sad. W2TI/QRP __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
6 Meters? I have 2 K2s one 10W unit and 1 100W unit. Both are pretty well loaded up. I just bought a 6 and 2 meter Elecraft transverter used. Got them on the bench yesterday and finally working after I corrected a problem I made. Anyway I have used a lot of radios on 6, 2 and beyond for a long time. Also a lot of good IF radios with good transverters. The XV50 and XV144 are about as good as I have seen or used. Yesterday I measured the RX sensitivity on an IFR1200 super S at .1 microvolt and well less than that for a usable signal on CW. That is about -130db. I think I will enjoy using these Elecraft Tvrtrs. They both did rated output easily and can drive external amplifiers. Please do not take my RX measurements as gospel but I am pretty sure they are very close to what I found with this service monitor. Obviously your mileage may vary. So my 756PROIII and 746PRO may not see much 6 or 2 meter use in the future. With the 100W K2 driving the PW1 they may not see much use at all..73 Mike Sanders KOAZ -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net]On Behalf Of Jason Hissong Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 8:39 AM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad Sell the 950 and use the proceeds to get all the additional options for your K2 (or maybe a nice chunk of change to save for a K3). Just don't expect to sell it to many on this list.. :-) I am building my third K2 (I sold the previous ones to pay for other things, not because of the radio) and will be eventually putting all the extras in it. It will become my main station rig. My 756 will then be used for 6 meters or eventually sold. Someday a K3 will find its way into my shack but until then, the K2 will fill my needs just fine. Congrats on your K2. 73, Jason N8XE On 6/21/12, Mike Bellow w2t...@gmail.com wrote: Hi All I recently picked up a used K2 locally here that was out of alignment,had to wait for freq probe that I ordered from Elecraft which arrived very fast,after doing a alignment on the radio,and After I set it up,I was very happy to see it works very well.This is my first Elecraft radio and this one is a #01014 serial number one of the early ones I guess.Now the Sad Part..Today I was listening on 14060 as usual for qrp stations and heard a very very faint station calling CQ Qrp,if I were to tag a rst report on this one I would say 119 no s meter reading at all but I could copy it fine.For comparison I hooked my Brand New 2 months old Yaesu Ft-950 and guess what??? Could not hear anything there but Staticno signal at all.$1400.00 for this radioNow I'm Happy but very sad. W2TI/QRP __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1424 / Virus Database: 2433/5086 - Release Date: 06/22/12 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000 exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere. So, yes, the FT-5000 is on top in one RX category and the amount of IMD its transmitter can splatter across the bands, and all for only $700 more. And they throw the key clicks in for free! But that splatter and key clicks are valuable weapons in the contesting arsenal, because ops near an FT-5000 can't work 'em if they can't hear 'em. 73, Scott, N9AA On 6/22/12 7:54 AM, Fred Smith wrote: Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would be very pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully loaded K3 at about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has the 5000 is on top but the K3 is still very close... 73, Fred/N0AZZ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Another nice thing about the K3 is that you can take it to Field Day. (10 pounds vs. 50 pounds, and 1 amp receive current drain vs. 3 or 4 amps :) 73, Wayne N6KR On Jun 22, 2012, at 10:26 AM, Scott Manthe wrote: A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000 exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere. So, yes, the FT-5000 is on top in one RX category and the amount of IMD its transmitter can splatter across the bands, and all for only $700 more. And they throw the key clicks in for free! But that splatter and key clicks are valuable weapons in the contesting arsenal, because ops near an FT-5000 can't work 'em if they can't hear 'em. 73, Scott, N9AA On 6/22/12 7:54 AM, Fred Smith wrote: Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would be very pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully loaded K3 at about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has the 5000 is on top but the K3 is still very close... 73, Fred/N0AZZ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
I love the size. With big hands I thought the smaller footprint might be a negative. It is not! All the knobs are easy to use, buttons easy to push and not push 3 at the same time. What I find is I rarely have to change anything when operating. Other rigs I was always trying to tune this, improve the reception etc. Not with the K3. Mike W0MU W0MU-1 CC Cluster w0mu.net:23 or w0mu-1.dnsdynamic.com Http://www.w0mu.com On 6/22/2012 11:48 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote: Another nice thing about the K3 is that you can take it to Field Day. (10 pounds vs. 50 pounds, and 1 amp receive current drain vs. 3 or 4 amps :) 73, Wayne N6KR On Jun 22, 2012, at 10:26 AM, Scott Manthe wrote: A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000 exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere. So, yes, the FT-5000 is on top in one RX category and the amount of IMD its transmitter can splatter across the bands, and all for only $700 more. And they throw the key clicks in for free! But that splatter and key clicks are valuable weapons in the contesting arsenal, because ops near an FT-5000 can't work 'em if they can't hear 'em. 73, Scott, N9AA On 6/22/12 7:54 AM, Fred Smith wrote: Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would be very pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully loaded K3 at about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has the 5000 is on top but the K3 is still very close... 73, Fred/N0AZZ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Exactly... or take the KX3, even lighter... or take both and share :-) 73, Bill K9YEQ -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Wayne Burdick Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 12:49 PM To: Scott Manthe Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad Another nice thing about the K3 is that you can take it to Field Day. (10 pounds vs. 50 pounds, and 1 amp receive current drain vs. 3 or 4 amps :) 73, Wayne N6KR On Jun 22, 2012, at 10:26 AM, Scott Manthe wrote: A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000 exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere. So, yes, the FT-5000 is on top in one RX category and the amount of IMD its transmitter can splatter across the bands, and all for only $700 more. And they throw the key clicks in for free! But that splatter and key clicks are valuable weapons in the contesting arsenal, because ops near an FT-5000 can't work 'em if they can't hear 'em. 73, Scott, N9AA On 6/22/12 7:54 AM, Fred Smith wrote: Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would be very pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully loaded K3 at about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has the 5000 is on top but the K3 is still very close... 73, Fred/N0AZZ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
The base model 5000 sells for $4895 and still has more options plus 200w and a class A transmitter you need to check you specs since all the updates and upgrades were done to this radio. As far as the transmitter it's one of the cleanest made. Key clicks mean nothing to me even though I think that was fixed by Yaesu since the first were released. I'm a SSB/Digital op so CW wasn't in the mix for me. 73, Fred/N0AZZ -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Scott Manthe Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 12:27 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000 exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere. So, yes, the FT-5000 is on top in one RX category and the amount of IMD its transmitter can splatter across the bands, and all for only $700 more. And they throw the key clicks in for free! But that splatter and key clicks are valuable weapons in the contesting arsenal, because ops near an FT-5000 can't work 'em if they can't hear 'em. 73, Scott, N9AA On 6/22/12 7:54 AM, Fred Smith wrote: Bill having owned the FTDX-5000MP for over 2 yrs I'm sure you would be very pleased with it and have quite a few more options than a fully loaded K3 at about the same price and 6m is a dream on it. Performance wise has the 5000 is on top but the K3 is still very close... 73, Fred/N0AZZ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2437/5084 - Release Date: 06/21/12 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right? Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product. See; http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean amps escape the wrath of the imd police. The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation. A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000 exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere. 73, Scott, N9AA __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Also see http://www.mail-archive.com/elecraft@mailman.qth.net/msg70785.html -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Adrian Sent: Saturday, 23 June 2012 7:48 AM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right? Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product. See; http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean amps escape the wrath of the imd police. The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation. A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000 exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere. 73, Scott, N9AA __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
I'm a CW operator so it's not an issue to me personally, but I'm always interested in data. I went to that link and found an opinion not backed by any data. What I do know from personal experience is that ANY rig can make a dirty signal if operated improperly or connected to a poorly designed or operated outboard amp. Also, some rigs ARE better than others, which is why I was disappointed to find just an opinion not substantiated by any data. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right? Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product. See; http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean amps escape the wrath of the imd police. The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
I've never seen a FT5000 for anywhere close to $4900, if you got yours for that let us know where and I'll buy one tomorrow to resell. The cheapest I've seen them sell for is $5300. And yes, as long as you run it in class A and don't turn on the processor, it has a relatively clean transmitter, but then it is a 75 watt radio, not 200. 73, Scott, N9AA On 6/22/12 5:22 PM, Fred Smith wrote: The base model 5000 sells for $4895 and still has more options plus 200w and a class A transmitter you need to check you specs since all the updates and upgrades were done to this radio. As far as the transmitter it's one of the cleanest made. Key clicks mean nothing to me even though I think that was fixed by Yaesu since the first were released. I'm a SSB/Digital op so CW wasn't in the mix for me. 73, Fred/N0AZZ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Adrian wrote: K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Adrian, The K3 is a 12-volt-powered transceiver. When running at 100 W and from a typical DC supply, its transmit 3rd-order IMD is very similar to that of other 12-V radios, as confirmed by multiple test labs. A transceiver with a class-A final or running from much higher supply voltages (15 V is OK, as you mentioned) will have better IMD. But radios with built-in supplies are not suited for portability -- a major design goal of the K3, which is used by more DXpeditions than any other rig. Also, I suspect most splatter comments derive from improper adjustment of the K3 when used with an external amplifier. Some amplifier manufacturers still insist on instructing users to crank up their radio's power output to maximum when driving the amp, forcing the use of wideband ALC at the radio, and that can indeed result in splatter. But if you adjust the K3's power output as described in the owner's manual (with no more drive than required for full amp power), and do not depend on aggressive ALC action, its signal will be very clean. This allows all of the K3's fast ALC to be achieved *ahead* of the crystal filter, avoiding the wideband ALC splatter characteristic of transceivers designed for crank-it-all-the- way-up mode. Also note that the K3 typically runs at 20-50 W when driving the KPA500 or other amp with similar gain, resulting in excellent third- order IMD. If anyone had a K3 exhibiting IMD worse than specified, we would certainly repair it at no charge. 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Of course, the K3 is NOT rated at the 120 watts he says he was running! He did qualify that by saying that it looked good at the rated 100 watts output. But that's true Ham Sprit. In the old days we watched the final plates turn cherry red and were careful to QRT when the color started shifting to yellow! 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- Also see http://www.mail-archive.com/elecraft@mailman.qth.net/msg70785.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
That's a pretty old posting, Adrian. We long ago restricted max power to 110 W in firmware, and the radio is specified at 100 W. Using the recommended supply voltage (14 V) at the recommended power level (100 W) there should be no difference between the K3 and other nominal-12 V transceivers. Note that the difference between 110 and 100 W is only 0.4 dB, so I suggest sticking with 100 W. 73, Wayne N6KR On Jun 22, 2012, at 3:12 PM, Adrian wrote: Also see http://www.mail-archive.com/elecraft@mailman.qth.net/msg70785.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
I said the K3's transmitter was superior to the FT-5000, not perfect. The ARRL review lists the 3rd order TX IMD numbers at -30db for the 5000 and -29 dB for the K3, but those numbers alone don't tell the whole story. Take at look at the ARRL's phase noise numbers and spectral display characteristics for the FT-5000's transmitted signal and compare them to the K3 and then get back to us. To be fair, the K3 tested does seem to have an issue with inferior 9th order IMD numbers, though. These figures were without the FT-5000's processor turned on, which of course, dirties up the 5000's signal quite a bit, unless that feature has been fixed. If it has, many contesters will be tearing up, because that and the key clicks help FT5000 ops get higher scores. Re: your other post, my K3 is rated at 100 watts output, so I'm sure someone running one at 120 watts will notice that the performance does degrade. I find the slightly higher PS voltage an intriguing idea. The FT-5000 is a fine rig, and is fairly clean in class A mode, with the processor turned off, but most people don't run them that way. 73, Scott, N9AA On 6/22/12 5:48 PM, Adrian wrote: K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right? Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product. See; http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean amps escape the wrath of the imd police. The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Love my K3 as I know I will love my KX3 on order and I love Elecraft customer support and the fact that the owners stand behind their products and are real gentlemen. However, if I had $5K to spend and the difference between a fully loaded K3 and the FT-5000 was around $500-$700, I would blindly go with the FT-5000. The specs are close for me and I have operated the FT-5000 and believe that it also has a great receiver. The difference I believe lies in the construction/workmanship of both radios and I'm reminded about that every time I turn the K3 VFO. I believe that the KX3 pricing is more inline with what you are getting but the K3 is IMHO slightly overpriced for a kit. But, I then have to realize that someone has to pay for the magnificent intellectual work that Wayne and Eric have done in the development of the K3's firmware, and that is worth the money. I really look forward to better construction/workmanship for the K4... Robert, KP4Y From: Scott Manthe scott.man...@gmail.com To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 6:54 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad I said the K3's transmitter was superior to the FT-5000, not perfect. The ARRL review lists the 3rd order TX IMD numbers at -30db for the 5000 and -29 dB for the K3, but those numbers alone don't tell the whole story. Take at look at the ARRL's phase noise numbers and spectral display characteristics for the FT-5000's transmitted signal and compare them to the K3 and then get back to us. To be fair, the K3 tested does seem to have an issue with inferior 9th order IMD numbers, though. These figures were without the FT-5000's processor turned on, which of course, dirties up the 5000's signal quite a bit, unless that feature has been fixed. If it has, many contesters will be tearing up, because that and the key clicks help FT5000 ops get higher scores. Re: your other post, my K3 is rated at 100 watts output, so I'm sure someone running one at 120 watts will notice that the performance does degrade. I find the slightly higher PS voltage an intriguing idea. The FT-5000 is a fine rig, and is fairly clean in class A mode, with the processor turned off, but most people don't run them that way. 73, Scott, N9AA On 6/22/12 5:48 PM, Adrian wrote: K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right? Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product. See; http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean amps escape the wrath of the imd police. The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
You read one bad review on Eham and make that kind of statement.. .Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 pro I have K3 # 758, now over 4 yrs old, and have run it at 100 watts (as recommended) barefoot, into a Alpha 76 PA @ 50 watts and now into a Elecraft KPA 500 with 25-30 watts. After more than 5500 qsos over the 4 yrs, ragchewing, chasing dx and contesting, I have had the following numbers of bad audio, splattering or key clicks reports, 0 , zero, nata, none, zlich. IMHO, to make a statement like that (without any documentation) is reckless and unwarranted. I have heard many reports from owners and others, about the FT5000 re: key clicks, splattering, etc, but certainly would not go on the Yeasu reflector and spread such stuff around. NF8J Paul -Original Message- From: Adrian Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 5:48 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right? http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean amps escape the wrath of the imd police. The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation. A fully-loaded K3 is about $4900, and that assumes 8 pole filters in all slots in both receivers. A fully loaded FT-5000 is $5600. The FT-5000 exceeds the K3's receiver performance in one category, and trails the K3 in every other RX performance category. The K3 also has a superior transmitter, as evidenced by the IMD numbers in ARRL test results and elsewhere. 73, Scott, N9AA __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Robert: I could not agree with you more I own all brands of equipment and all have their positive and negative aspects in one way or another. I'm currently on 6 different radio reflectors and try to keep up to date with all new models and specs for them just something I enjoy doing. There is one thing that Elecraft does that stands well above all others and that is service and support and some of the best documentation for their kits of any I have ever seen. I as have said I am a proud owner of a K2 and plan on buying other products as well. Discussions on radios have raged for over 75 yrs I guess and will continue far after I'm gone. Anyone up for a SDR receiver discussion? 8-) 73' Fred/N0AZZ -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Robert Vargas Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 6:14 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad Love my K3 as I know I will love my KX3 on order and I love Elecraft customer support and the fact that the owners stand behind their products and are real gentlemen. However, if I had $5K to spend and the difference between a fully loaded K3 and the FT-5000 was around $500-$700, I would blindly go with the FT-5000. The specs are close for me and I have operated the FT-5000 and believe that it also has a great receiver. The difference I believe lies in the construction/workmanship of both radios and I'm reminded about that every time I turn the K3 VFO. I believe that the KX3 pricing is more inline with what you are getting but the K3 is IMHO slightly overpriced for a kit. But, I then have to realize that someone has to pay for the magnificent intellectual work that Wayne and Eric have done in the development of the K3's firmware, and that is worth the money. I really look forward to better construction/workmanship for the K4... Robert, KP4Y From: Scott Manthe scott.man...@gmail.com To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 6:54 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad I said the K3's transmitter was superior to the FT-5000, not perfect. The ARRL review lists the 3rd order TX IMD numbers at -30db for the 5000 and -29 dB for the K3, but those numbers alone don't tell the whole story. Take at look at the ARRL's phase noise numbers and spectral display characteristics for the FT-5000's transmitted signal and compare them to the K3 and then get back to us. To be fair, the K3 tested does seem to have an issue with inferior 9th order IMD numbers, though. These figures were without the FT-5000's processor turned on, which of course, dirties up the 5000's signal quite a bit, unless that feature has been fixed. If it has, many contesters will be tearing up, because that and the key clicks help FT5000 ops get higher scores. Re: your other post, my K3 is rated at 100 watts output, so I'm sure someone running one at 120 watts will notice that the performance does degrade. I find the slightly higher PS voltage an intriguing idea. The FT-5000 is a fine rig, and is fairly clean in class A mode, with the processor turned off, but most people don't run them that way. 73, Scott, N9AA On 6/22/12 5:48 PM, Adrian wrote: K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Your kidding right? Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 product. See; http://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/index.php/topic,75182.0.html Those of us with K3's running 15v PS with heavy cable inputs, driving clean amps escape the wrath of the imd police. The 5000 is way better esp in class A operation. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2437/5087 - Release Date: 06/22/12 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Wayne: Excellent point that is the main reason that I chose my Elecraft portability and 12v operation and a replacement for my QRP rig an IC-703 Plus In addition to in the shack with my microHAM microKEYER for running JT65HF. I do use Class A mode with my 5000 to drive a Yaesu VL-1000 amp 1kw 6-160m with 45w of drive. The 5000 is not a plug and play radio it has a learning curve and one of the first is the audio setup which takes time and differs with mic's and your voice using the 3 band eq. There are many who never quite learn to do this correctly. 73, Fred/N0AZZ -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Wayne Burdick Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 5:42 PM To: Adrian Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad Adrian wrote: K3 a superior transmitter in imd product results? Adrian, The K3 is a 12-volt-powered transceiver. When running at 100 W and from a typical DC supply, its transmit 3rd-order IMD is very similar to that of other 12-V radios, as confirmed by multiple test labs. A transceiver with a class-A final or running from much higher supply voltages (15 V is OK, as you mentioned) will have better IMD. But radios with built-in supplies are not suited for portability -- a major design goal of the K3, which is used by more DXpeditions than any other rig. Also, I suspect most splatter comments derive from improper adjustment of the K3 when used with an external amplifier. Some amplifier manufacturers still insist on instructing users to crank up their radio's power output to maximum when driving the amp, forcing the use of wideband ALC at the radio, and that can indeed result in splatter. But if you adjust the K3's power output as described in the owner's manual (with no more drive than required for full amp power), and do not depend on aggressive ALC action, its signal will be very clean. This allows all of the K3's fast ALC to be achieved *ahead* of the crystal filter, avoiding the wideband ALC splatter characteristic of transceivers designed for crank-it-all-the- way-up mode. Also note that the K3 typically runs at 20-50 W when driving the KPA500 or other amp with similar gain, resulting in excellent third- order IMD. If anyone had a K3 exhibiting IMD worse than specified, we would certainly repair it at no charge. 73, Wayne N6KR __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2437/5087 - Release Date: 06/22/12 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
Despite the 120w reference, the poster refers to power levels at 100w and lower in both his comparisons. My experience was exactly the same. My post was refering to the 5000 - K3 comparison. On 22/06/2012 22:51, Wayne Burdick wrote: That's a pretty old posting, Adrian. We long ago restricted max power to 110 W in firmware, and the radio is specified at 100 W. Using the recommended supply voltage (14 V) at the recommended power level (100 W) there should be no difference between the K3 and other nominal-12 V transceivers. Note that the difference between 110 and 100 W is only 0.4 dB, so I suggest sticking with 100 W. 73, Wayne N6KR On Jun 22, 2012, at 3:12 PM, Adrian wrote: Also see http://www.mail-archive.com/elecraft@mailman.qth.net/msg70785.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Happy But Very Sad
On 22/06/2012 23:47, Paul VanOveren wrote: You read one bad review on Eham and make that kind of statement. Who said I read one review?That wasnt a review, it was a comment. I read hundreds of comments and have heard many on-air reports, and have gone through the process myself that the usual k3 setup IMD3 results around the -26 to -27 dB mark at 13.8v in with standard supplied power cable. . .Out in the real world the K3 has a bad rep for splatter and imd3 pro I have K3 # 758, now over 4 yrs old, and have run it at 100 watts (as recommended) barefoot, into a Alpha 76 PA @ 50 watts and now into a Elecraft KPA 500 with 25-30 watts. After more than 5500 qsos over the 4 yrs, ragchewing, chasing dx and contesting, I have had the following numbers of bad audio, splattering or key clicks reports, 0 , zero, nata, none, zlich. Thats what I would expect, so what? The 100w numbers needed to get better, and do with 15v in with a custom heavy cable. We did that, not because it was good fun, but from necessity. IMHO, to make a statement like that (without any documentation) is reckless and unwarranted. I have heard many reports from owners and others, about the FT5000 re: key clicks, splattering, etc, but certainly would not go on the Yeasu reflector and spread such stuff around. I documented it for you here. You try to compare your Alpha 76 low drive level situation to those driving 3-500z pairs @ 100w ? It's a different deal. The guys out there should try googling a bit and check out the amplifier forums. I stand by what I said, and said it to provide help to the K3 owners out there that like to improve their imd3. From someone that has first hand gone through the process. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
