Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
1000 words have been added :-) I updated the wiki page (http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?GantryPlasmaMachine) with a system wiring schematic. There is a pdf version and an Eagle (v6.1.0 - won't open in version 5) .sch file. Follow toc link 2.4 Wiring Diagram. I also added our Mesa 7i43 (400k version) firmware files. The only thing missing from the schematic (I believe) is a small circuit that provides noise filtering on the step/dir, and IO lines between the Granites and Mesa cards. As soon as I round up my notes on that I will add it. Tom On Feb 17, 2012, at 7:39 AM, James Louis wrote: Again, a wiring diagram would be worth a thousand words . . . - Original Message - From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Sent: Fri Feb 17 06:24:17 2012 Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions What are they using for breakout boards? I don't see anything from mesa that really fits. ie encoder inputs and step/dir. I see reference in the 7i76 to a switching power supply, is that built onto the board? I suppose 40v would overload it? On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 2:04 PM, Peter C. Wallace p...@mesanet.com wrote: On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 13:28:59 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions How are these customers dealing with a stalled stepper, or is there any limits built in? When you use encoder feedback, stalled step motor detection is automatic (it causes a following error) Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, the disclosure, copying, distribution or use hereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and then delete it immediately. winmail.dat-- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Keep Your Developer Skills Current with LearnDevNow! The most comprehensive online learning library for Microsoft developers is just $99.99! Visual Studio, SharePoint, SQL - plus HTML5, CSS3, MVC3, Metro Style Apps, more. Free future releases when you subscribe now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/learndevnow-d2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
Thanks Tom! - Original Message - From: Tom Easterday tom-...@bgp.nu To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Sent: Tue Feb 21 15:39:43 2012 Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions 1000 words have been added :-) I updated the wiki page (http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?GantryPlasmaMachine) with a system wiring schematic. There is a pdf version and an Eagle (v6.1.0 - won't open in version 5) .sch file. Follow toc link 2.4 Wiring Diagram. I also added our Mesa 7i43 (400k version) firmware files. The only thing missing from the schematic (I believe) is a small circuit that provides noise filtering on the step/dir, and IO lines between the Granites and Mesa cards. As soon as I round up my notes on that I will add it. Tom On Feb 17, 2012, at 7:39 AM, James Louis wrote: Again, a wiring diagram would be worth a thousand words . . . - Original Message - From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Sent: Fri Feb 17 06:24:17 2012 Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions What are they using for breakout boards? I don't see anything from mesa that really fits. ie encoder inputs and step/dir. I see reference in the 7i76 to a switching power supply, is that built onto the board? I suppose 40v would overload it? On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 2:04 PM, Peter C. Wallace p...@mesanet.com wrote: On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 13:28:59 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions How are these customers dealing with a stalled stepper, or is there any limits built in? When you use encoder feedback, stalled step motor detection is automatic (it causes a following error) Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, the disclosure, copying, distribution or use hereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and then delete it immediately. winmail.dat-- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Keep Your Developer Skills Current with LearnDevNow! The most comprehensive online learning library for Microsoft developers is just $99.99! Visual Studio, SharePoint, SQL - plus HTML5, CSS3, MVC3, Metro Style Apps, more. Free future releases when you subscribe now! http://p.sf.net/sfu/learndevnow-d2d ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, the disclosure, copying, distribution or use hereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and then delete it immediately. attachment: winmail.dat
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
What are they using for breakout boards? I don't see anything from mesa that really fits. ie encoder inputs and step/dir. I see reference in the 7i76 to a switching power supply, is that built onto the board? I suppose 40v would overload it? On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 2:04 PM, Peter C. Wallace p...@mesanet.com wrote: On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 13:28:59 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions How are these customers dealing with a stalled stepper, or is there any limits built in? When you use encoder feedback, stalled step motor detection is automatic (it causes a following error) Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
Again, a wiring diagram would be worth a thousand words . . . - Original Message - From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Sent: Fri Feb 17 06:24:17 2012 Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions What are they using for breakout boards? I don't see anything from mesa that really fits. ie encoder inputs and step/dir. I see reference in the 7i76 to a switching power supply, is that built onto the board? I suppose 40v would overload it? On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 2:04 PM, Peter C. Wallace p...@mesanet.com wrote: On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 13:28:59 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions How are these customers dealing with a stalled stepper, or is there any limits built in? When you use encoder feedback, stalled step motor detection is automatic (it causes a following error) Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, the disclosure, copying, distribution or use hereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and then delete it immediately. attachment: winmail.dat-- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
On our current machine (the gantry plasma machine) we are using 7i42 buffer cards with a 7i43 card and a custom firmware load from Mesa which has 4 step/dir and 4 single ended encoder inputs. We built a small board that converts the differential signals from our encoders to single-ended inside the electronics cabinet. I also have a small mill on which I used the 7i43 with a 7i47 daughter board. On that one I have three stepper motors (step/dir) and three differential encoder signals wired to it. Tom On Feb 17, 2012, at 7:24 AM, Erik Friesen wrote: What are they using for breakout boards? I don't see anything from mesa that really fits. ie encoder inputs and step/dir. I see reference in the 7i76 to a switching power supply, is that built onto the board? I suppose 40v would overload it? On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 2:04 PM, Peter C. Wallace p...@mesanet.com wrote: On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 13:28:59 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions How are these customers dealing with a stalled stepper, or is there any limits built in? When you use encoder feedback, stalled step motor detection is automatic (it causes a following error) Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
Ok, ok you guilted me into it. ;-) I'll work on that. I do want to document our wiring. Not sure when I will get it done however, but I will work on it. Tom On Feb 17, 2012, at 7:39 AM, James Louis wrote: Again, a wiring diagram would be worth a thousand words . . . - Original Message - From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Sent: Fri Feb 17 06:24:17 2012 Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions What are they using for breakout boards? I don't see anything from mesa that really fits. ie encoder inputs and step/dir. I see reference in the 7i76 to a switching power supply, is that built onto the board? I suppose 40v would overload it? On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 2:04 PM, Peter C. Wallace p...@mesanet.com wrote: On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 13:28:59 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions How are these customers dealing with a stalled stepper, or is there any limits built in? When you use encoder feedback, stalled step motor detection is automatic (it causes a following error) Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, the disclosure, copying, distribution or use hereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and then delete it immediately. winmail.dat-- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
Isolation is about protection of low voltage circuits that cannot handle any spikes outside normal ranges and the voltages inherent with electrical noise in a working system which could easily be up to 1000v or more. It also removes the ground loop that add/subtracts from your signal. Dave Caroline -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
On 16 Feb 2012, at 14:29, Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net wrote: How feasible is it to use the mesa 5i25 in a similar way to the universal stepper controller? IE.. Use hardware step generation + encoder feedback? Just a bare 5i25, or using daughter cards? You ought to be able to do it with a 7i76 and a 7i77 (that's the stepper board _and_ the servo board at the same time. Otherwise you would need a special firmware I think. 25 pins might be a bit few, though there is a second 25 pin header too. The dedicated daughter boards use serial-connected hardware for the extra IO pins with only the stepgens, encoders and pwms wired direct back to the 5i25. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 8:29 AM, Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net wrote: Another ignorant question, why is the industry so inclined to isolated IO? vs single board designed systems where everything is layed out properly. This just gets me, when trying to make a control system look neat, and you have to use a hodge podge of different breakout boards, drivers, etc, with a resultant rats nest of wires. The interface boards are essentially working as fancy fuses, because industrial environments are messy and confusing, with noise, interference, crosstalk, voltage surges and wiring mishaps due to things like technician error or 'conveyor chewed up the main cable harness'. It's easier to replace an interface board than the entire single board integrated controller. In the old days, the PC serial ports always had a socketed 1488/1489 i/o buffer chips on the motherboard; instead of blowing up the entire motherboard, serial port mishaps could be fixed by replacing the chip. Curiously, those chips were designed by Jim Thompson who's around in the sci.electronics.design newsgroup. Since then, they made protection circuits better and/or people stopped doing egregious things with serial ports---but still there's a standing recommendation to use separate PCI cards for serial and parallel ports interfacing to non-computer equipment, because they can be swapped out, unlike the motherboard built-ins. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 08:29:52 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: [Emc-users] More control board questions How feasible is it to use the mesa 5i25 in a similar way to the universal stepper controller? IE.. Use hardware step generation + encoder feedback? Its easy, there are number of our customers doing this with step motors or step/dir driven servos. You just use a configuration with stepgens and encoder counters. Inside HAL the stepgens are set into velocity mode and PID loops are setup to so the PID output sets the step rate of the step motors or step/dir servos, basically emulating a velocity mode servo system. (encoder_count, commanded_pos) -- PID comp -- stepgen_velocity_command -- motor drive -- encoder_count Another ignorant question, why is the industry so inclined to isolated IO? vs single board designed systems where everything is layed out properly. This just gets me, when trying to make a control system look neat, and you have to use a hodge podge of different breakout boards, drivers, etc, with a resultant rats nest of wires. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
Are there any example wiring diagrams available for this easy closed loop stepper configuration? It sounds interesting. Jim - Original Message - From: Peter C. Wallace p...@mesanet.com To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Sent: Thu Feb 16 08:42:33 2012 Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 08:29:52 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: [Emc-users] More control board questions How feasible is it to use the mesa 5i25 in a similar way to the universal stepper controller? IE.. Use hardware step generation + encoder feedback? Its easy, there are number of our customers doing this with step motors or step/dir driven servos. You just use a configuration with stepgens and encoder counters. Inside HAL the stepgens are set into velocity mode and PID loops are setup to so the PID output sets the step rate of the step motors or step/dir servos, basically emulating a velocity mode servo system. (encoder_count, commanded_pos) -- PID comp -- stepgen_velocity_command -- motor drive -- encoder_count Another ignorant question, why is the industry so inclined to isolated IO? vs single board designed systems where everything is layed out properly. This just gets me, when trying to make a control system look neat, and you have to use a hodge podge of different breakout boards, drivers, etc, with a resultant rats nest of wires. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, the disclosure, copying, distribution or use hereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and then delete it immediately. attachment: winmail.dat-- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, James Louis wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 09:02:26 -0600 From: James Louis james.lo...@gastechnology.org Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions Are there any example wiring diagrams available for this easy closed loop stepper configuration? It sounds interesting. Jim http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?GantryPlasmaMachine includes HAL files I believe - Original Message - From: Peter C. Wallace p...@mesanet.com To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Sent: Thu Feb 16 08:42:33 2012 Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 08:29:52 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: [Emc-users] More control board questions How feasible is it to use the mesa 5i25 in a similar way to the universal stepper controller? IE.. Use hardware step generation + encoder feedback? Its easy, there are number of our customers doing this with step motors or step/dir driven servos. You just use a configuration with stepgens and encoder counters. Inside HAL the stepgens are set into velocity mode and PID loops are setup to so the PID output sets the step rate of the step motors or step/dir servos, basically emulating a velocity mode servo system. (encoder_count, commanded_pos) -- PID comp -- stepgen_velocity_command -- motor drive -- encoder_count Another ignorant question, why is the industry so inclined to isolated IO? vs single board designed systems where everything is layed out properly. This just gets me, when trying to make a control system look neat, and you have to use a hodge podge of different breakout boards, drivers, etc, with a resultant rats nest of wires. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, the disclosure, copying, distribution or use hereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and then delete it immediately. Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
I could not find a wiring diagram of the devices connected to the Mesa 7I43-U-4 card at GantryPlasmaMachine. Config files yes, schematics no. That is otherwise a GREAT wiki page! Thanks! Jim - Original Message - From: Peter C. Wallace p...@mesanet.com To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Sent: Thu Feb 16 09:26:02 2012 Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, James Louis wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 09:02:26 -0600 From: James Louis james.lo...@gastechnology.org Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions Are there any example wiring diagrams available for this easy closed loop stepper configuration? It sounds interesting. Jim http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?GantryPlasmaMachine includes HAL files I believe - Original Message - From: Peter C. Wallace p...@mesanet.com To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Sent: Thu Feb 16 08:42:33 2012 Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 08:29:52 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: [Emc-users] More control board questions How feasible is it to use the mesa 5i25 in a similar way to the universal stepper controller? IE.. Use hardware step generation + encoder feedback? Its easy, there are number of our customers doing this with step motors or step/dir driven servos. You just use a configuration with stepgens and encoder counters. Inside HAL the stepgens are set into velocity mode and PID loops are setup to so the PID output sets the step rate of the step motors or step/dir servos, basically emulating a velocity mode servo system. (encoder_count, commanded_pos) -- PID comp -- stepgen_velocity_command -- motor drive -- encoder_count Another ignorant question, why is the industry so inclined to isolated IO? vs single board designed systems where everything is layed out properly. This just gets me, when trying to make a control system look neat, and you have to use a hodge podge of different breakout boards, drivers, etc, with a resultant rats nest of wires. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, the disclosure, copying, distribution or use hereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and then delete it immediately. Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, the disclosure, copying, distribution or use hereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
James Louis wrote: Are there any example wiring diagrams available for this easy closed loop stepper configuration? Take a standard Universal Stepper Controller, and get it working with drives and motors of your choice. Add encoders, and flip the DIP switch on the board to select the encoder as the position feedback source. One DIP switch for each axis, so you can use it on only selected axes. Probably the only change to EMC would be to make sure the INPUT_SCALE matches the encoder counts * leadscrew pitch. Jon -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
What I have in mind is my own daughtercard. Encoders would be fed through to the 5i25. I would use a mcp3208 in spi mode to give me 8 analog inputs, assuming the 5i25 can do it. I have been looking at the gecko drives, they are 10x microstepping, which seems overkill. They do have some decent features though. However, my computer can only do 15khz software step generation, which doesn't do well with 10x microstepping and speed. On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 8:55 AM, Andy Pugh bodge...@gmail.com wrote: On 16 Feb 2012, at 14:29, Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net wrote: How feasible is it to use the mesa 5i25 in a similar way to the universal stepper controller? IE.. Use hardware step generation + encoder feedback? Just a bare 5i25, or using daughter cards? You ought to be able to do it with a 7i76 and a 7i77 (that's the stepper board _and_ the servo board at the same time. Otherwise you would need a special firmware I think. 25 pins might be a bit few, though there is a second 25 pin header too. The dedicated daughter boards use serial-connected hardware for the extra IO pins with only the stepgens, encoders and pwms wired direct back to the 5i25. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
How are these customers dealing with a stalled stepper, or is there any limits built in? I know you should never have a stalled stepper, but you still need to plan for it anyway. On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 9:42 AM, Peter C. Wallace p...@mesanet.com wrote: On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 08:29:52 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: [Emc-users] More control board questions How feasible is it to use the mesa 5i25 in a similar way to the universal stepper controller? IE.. Use hardware step generation + encoder feedback? Its easy, there are number of our customers doing this with step motors or step/dir driven servos. You just use a configuration with stepgens and encoder counters. Inside HAL the stepgens are set into velocity mode and PID loops are setup to so the PID output sets the step rate of the step motors or step/dir servos, basically emulating a velocity mode servo system. (encoder_count, commanded_pos) -- PID comp -- stepgen_velocity_command -- motor drive -- encoder_count Another ignorant question, why is the industry so inclined to isolated IO? vs single board designed systems where everything is layed out properly. This just gets me, when trying to make a control system look neat, and you have to use a hodge podge of different breakout boards, drivers, etc, with a resultant rats nest of wires. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
On Thursday, February 16, 2012 01:40:53 PM Erik Friesen did opine: What I have in mind is my own daughtercard. Encoders would be fed through to the 5i25. I would use a mcp3208 in spi mode to give me 8 analog inputs, assuming the 5i25 can do it. I have been looking at the gecko drives, they are 10x microstepping, which seems overkill. They do have some decent features though. However, my computer can only do 15khz software step generation, which doesn't do well with 10x microstepping and speed. The main advantage to the microstepping is two fold, and both come from the same effect, that of smoothing the steps and getting a lower excitation amplitude of the resonances in the motors mechanical vs magnetic characteristics. Remember, you are dealing with a very strong magnet whose instant position is determined by 2 very strong magnetic fields, so the armature is effectively held in position by 2 springs of varying strengths according to the currents programmed for that particular position in the full step envelope You will need less in the way of dampers to control this resonance, and at the same time the motors turn noticeably quieter. At one point 3 or 4 years back I got curious and set the xylotex's for 1/2 step, and you could hear the motors howling in the neighbors back yard, so that experiment was terminated the same day. When I bought the MM542 drivers I'm using now I knew the /64 microstepping they could do was not feasible, not on an atom powered D525MW board, but that /16 might be usable if that was pushing the computer I could always go back to /8 which I was using with the xylotex drivers. The noise reduction was noticeable, there are now some speeds less than 1 rps, where the motors are almost dead silent compared to the other noises from the fans and such, and its a bit odd to see them doing half a rev per second silently. I have not checked to see how far I can push the rapids as I had a previous config setup that ran much faster, but that was also at the expense of long accel times, but there was no real gain in job times so I have not explored the rapids ranges above nominally 16 ipm on my toy yet, better things to do too cold in the shop to spend days fine tuning that sort of thing. On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 8:55 AM, Andy Pugh bodge...@gmail.com wrote: On 16 Feb 2012, at 14:29, Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net wrote: How feasible is it to use the mesa 5i25 in a similar way to the universal stepper controller? IE.. Use hardware step generation + encoder feedback? Just a bare 5i25, or using daughter cards? You ought to be able to do it with a 7i76 and a 7i77 (that's the stepper board _and_ the servo board at the same time. Otherwise you would need a special firmware I think. 25 pins might be a bit few, though there is a second 25 pin header too. The dedicated daughter boards use serial-connected hardware for the extra IO pins with only the stepgens, encoders and pwms wired direct back to the 5i25. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Cheers, Gene -- There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order. -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: http://coyoteden.dyndns-free.com:85/gene The finest eloquence is that which gets things done. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions
On Thu, 16 Feb 2012, Erik Friesen wrote: Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2012 13:28:59 -0500 From: Erik Friesen e...@aercon.net Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Emc-users] More control board questions How are these customers dealing with a stalled stepper, or is there any limits built in? When you use encoder feedback, stalled step motor detection is automatic (it causes a following error) Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- Virtualization Cloud Management Using Capacity Planning Cloud computing makes use of virtualization - but cloud computing also focuses on allowing computing to be delivered as a service. http://www.accelacomm.com/jaw/sfnl/114/51521223/ ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
