Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 11:28, Will Merkens wrote: > > >Right now my bets are on the mem=nopentium switch and on heat problems > >-- I've got a 80mm fan that I'll stick in it when I get a chance, and > >I've already put the nopentium switch into lilo. > > >thanks, > > He is correct, 250W is not enough, the problem can stem from the initial power draw >when a system is first turned on, AMD recomends that power supplys handle a least >180W initial draw from the power supply. most 250 ps only have a 135W max pull on >power up of the computer. This was the case back when the first sloted athlons were >being produced. > > There is a guide from AMD on how to find out all this and it's updated for socketed >athlons. > > see amd site for info or read this article > > http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/content_type/white_papers_and_tech_docs/26003.pdf > > > I only install 300w ps these days for any athlon system I build for people. So, I put in the mem=nopentium switch, tried the 80mm fan which turned out to be broken, put in a 50mm fan, and upgraded to a 300W power supply. The machine actually runs a bit hotter now: CPU Fan: 4141 RPM (min = 3000 RPM, div = 2) P/S Fan: 4299 RPM (min = 3000 RPM, div = 2) SYS Temp: +40.2°C (limit = +80°C, hysteresis = +70°C) CPU Temp: +42.2°C (limit = +60°C, hysteresis = +55°C) but it's been up nearly 8 days without any flakiness yet and I'm starting to get my hopes up for a fix. I also converted my spamassassin setup to use spamd/spamc which takes the average load down from .1 to .05. Thanks, everyone. -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
If your bios has a section called "PC Health Status," or something similar, it will show you pretty accurate readings. Then, if you are using GKrellm, for example, you go to Configuration- Builtin-sensors-setup, and adjust your readouts to match what your bios showed. The cpu and motherboard temps on mine are set to 1., and then give the same as my bios, but the voltages are a little different, and might vary depending on your chipset. There is a file (/etc/sensors.conf) which will give you guidance as to the voltage settings- it can be pretty tricky. Robert Crawford On Saturday 02 November 2002 04:51 pm, Olaf Marzocchi wrote: > I have problems with lm_sensors: my box runs pretty well (no crashes since > linux install :-), but sensors gives me 128°C (more than boiling water, for > those using Faranheit) as cpu temp and about 60°C inside the box. > Voltages are wrong too. > > Any idea? > > Olaf > > At 07.13 29/10/2002, you wrote: > >For me it depends on what the box does. I've got a box that runs 150w > >(New VIA EPIA motherboard) and that meats specs for it. For a gammer > >350W is the lower end. My main box runs 300w and rarely ever pushes it > >hard. (In fact never) > > > >James > > kjws.com> for every kind of mail, except spam! :-) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
I have problems with lm_sensors: my box runs pretty well (no crashes since linux install :-), but sensors gives me 128°C (more than boiling water, for those using Faranheit) as cpu temp and about 60°C inside the box. Voltages are wrong too. Any idea? Olaf At 07.13 29/10/2002, you wrote: For me it depends on what the box does. I've got a box that runs 150w (New VIA EPIA motherboard) and that meats specs for it. For a gammer 350W is the lower end. My main box runs 300w and rarely ever pushes it hard. (In fact never) James kjws.com> for every kind of mail, except spam! :-) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
For me it depends on what the box does. I've got a box that runs 150w (New VIA EPIA motherboard) and that meats specs for it. For a gammer 350W is the lower end. My main box runs 300w and rarely ever pushes it hard. (In fact never) James On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 13:40, Jack Coates wrote: > Just ordered a 300W and two cooling fans -- now you're saying 350W? Not > sure that I'm following the justification, unless it's rule of thumb. > > On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 13:10, ET wrote: > > On Monday 28 October 2002 01:53 pm, Robert Crawford wrote: > > > Jack, > > > I looked at your PS specs at that link you gave, and then looked at your > > > system componets you posted. In my opinion, your PS could definitely be > > > problematic. > > I agree,,, jack if you keep smokin that stuff we will demand you share, > > every box "needs" at least 350 watts of a good (tested clean) power supply > > and for a box you need. 450 watts would not be a bad thought, far better > > (in this case) to have and not need than to need and not have. > > > > > > Usually, the main problem is the power available on the 3.3v > > > and 5v rails. This PS is pretty low (15A and 26A) with 150watt combined. If > > > the heat doesn't prove to be the culprit, I would definitely suspect an > > > underpowered PS. On my KT133, I had a 250w PS, and it proved inadequate- > > > had to go to 300w, and I had less peripherals and ram than you do at that > > > time. On mt KT266A DDR, I had to go to a 420W- even 300W wouldn't boot my > > > Shuttle AK31A reliably. Maybe investigate your motherboard on some hardware > > > forums/groups, and get some feedback/info as to how that board behaves- the > > > Shuttle was very picky as to PS issues. > > > Robert C. > > > > > > On Monday 28 October 2002 11:41 am, Jack Coates wrote: > > > > On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 03:45, Gabriel Phoenix wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Power Supply? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Power supplies should be added to the troubleshooting list when > > > > > tracking down gremlins. > > > > > > > > > > Gabriel > > > > > > > > I've read that article too, and have had my share of cheapie power > > > > supplies release their magic smoke... The power supply is a good one, > > > > the 250W version on this page: > > > > http://www.quietpcusa.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&DID=8&Product_ID=2&CATID=2 > > > > > > > > It's conceivable that I did my math wrong and this config needs more > > > > than 250W, but I'm inclined to doubt that since there's only one hard > > > > drive. > > > > > > > > Right now my bets are on the mem=nopentium switch and on heat problems > > > > -- I've got a 80mm fan that I'll stick in it when I get a chance, and > > > > I've already put the nopentium switch into lilo. > > > > > > > > thanks, > > > > > > > > > > > Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? > > Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com > -- > Jack Coates > Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... > > > > > Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? > Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
On 28 Oct 2002, Jack Coates wrote: > Just ordered a 300W and two cooling fans -- now you're saying 350W? Not > sure that I'm following the justification, unless it's rule of thumb. > Besides the excellent AMd guide that someone has mentioned, you might also want to check the pcpowerandcooling.com website. It has a web interface to a power supply guide. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
Just ordered a 300W and two cooling fans -- now you're saying 350W? Not sure that I'm following the justification, unless it's rule of thumb. On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 13:10, ET wrote: > On Monday 28 October 2002 01:53 pm, Robert Crawford wrote: > > Jack, > > I looked at your PS specs at that link you gave, and then looked at your > > system componets you posted. In my opinion, your PS could definitely be > > problematic. > I agree,,, jack if you keep smokin that stuff we will demand you share, > every box "needs" at least 350 watts of a good (tested clean) power supply > and for a box you need. 450 watts would not be a bad thought, far better > (in this case) to have and not need than to need and not have. > > > Usually, the main problem is the power available on the 3.3v > > and 5v rails. This PS is pretty low (15A and 26A) with 150watt combined. If > > the heat doesn't prove to be the culprit, I would definitely suspect an > > underpowered PS. On my KT133, I had a 250w PS, and it proved inadequate- > > had to go to 300w, and I had less peripherals and ram than you do at that > > time. On mt KT266A DDR, I had to go to a 420W- even 300W wouldn't boot my > > Shuttle AK31A reliably. Maybe investigate your motherboard on some hardware > > forums/groups, and get some feedback/info as to how that board behaves- the > > Shuttle was very picky as to PS issues. > > Robert C. > > > > On Monday 28 October 2002 11:41 am, Jack Coates wrote: > > > On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 03:45, Gabriel Phoenix wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Power Supply? > > > > > > > > > > > > > Power supplies should be added to the troubleshooting list when > > > > tracking down gremlins. > > > > > > > > Gabriel > > > > > > I've read that article too, and have had my share of cheapie power > > > supplies release their magic smoke... The power supply is a good one, > > > the 250W version on this page: > > > http://www.quietpcusa.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&DID=8&Product_ID=2&CATID=2 > > > > > > It's conceivable that I did my math wrong and this config needs more > > > than 250W, but I'm inclined to doubt that since there's only one hard > > > drive. > > > > > > Right now my bets are on the mem=nopentium switch and on heat problems > > > -- I've got a 80mm fan that I'll stick in it when I get a chance, and > > > I've already put the nopentium switch into lilo. > > > > > > thanks, > > > > > Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? > Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
On Monday 28 October 2002 01:53 pm, Robert Crawford wrote: > Jack, > I looked at your PS specs at that link you gave, and then looked at your > system componets you posted. In my opinion, your PS could definitely be > problematic. I agree,,, jack if you keep smokin that stuff we will demand you share, every box "needs" at least 350 watts of a good (tested clean) power supply and for a box you need. 450 watts would not be a bad thought, far better (in this case) to have and not need than to need and not have. Usually, the main problem is the power available on the 3.3v > and 5v rails. This PS is pretty low (15A and 26A) with 150watt combined. If > the heat doesn't prove to be the culprit, I would definitely suspect an > underpowered PS. On my KT133, I had a 250w PS, and it proved inadequate- > had to go to 300w, and I had less peripherals and ram than you do at that > time. On mt KT266A DDR, I had to go to a 420W- even 300W wouldn't boot my > Shuttle AK31A reliably. Maybe investigate your motherboard on some hardware > forums/groups, and get some feedback/info as to how that board behaves- the > Shuttle was very picky as to PS issues. > Robert C. > > On Monday 28 October 2002 11:41 am, Jack Coates wrote: > > On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 03:45, Gabriel Phoenix wrote: > > > > > > > Power Supply? > > > > > > > > > Power supplies should be added to the troubleshooting list when > > > tracking down gremlins. > > > > > > Gabriel > > > > I've read that article too, and have had my share of cheapie power > > supplies release their magic smoke... The power supply is a good one, > > the 250W version on this page: > > http://www.quietpcusa.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&DID=8&Product_ID=2&CATID=2 > > > > It's conceivable that I did my math wrong and this config needs more > > than 250W, but I'm inclined to doubt that since there's only one hard > > drive. > > > > Right now my bets are on the mem=nopentium switch and on heat problems > > -- I've got a 80mm fan that I'll stick in it when I get a chance, and > > I've already put the nopentium switch into lilo. > > > > thanks, Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
Jack, Just read some stuff on FIC AZ11 groups search. People there are having the same problems you do. One guy fixed it by installing a little heatsink fan on the Northbridge heatsink (most KT133 chipsets do have one, factory installed). I would suggest taking off the case cover, and blowing a desk fan onto the motherboard for a day or two, and see if you experience any more problems. If they go away, you know it's a heat problem- probably the chipset or ram can't handle the 37C. you mentioned. If not, then look at the PS. UI'm betting it's that the Northbridge is getting too hot. Robert C. On Monday 28 October 2002 11:41 am, Jack Coates wrote: > On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 03:45, Gabriel Phoenix wrote: > > > > Power Supply? > > > > > Power supplies should be added to the troubleshooting list when tracking > > down gremlins. > > > > Gabriel > > I've read that article too, and have had my share of cheapie power > supplies release their magic smoke... The power supply is a good one, > the 250W version on this page: > http://www.quietpcusa.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&DID=8&Product_ID=2&CATID=2 > > It's conceivable that I did my math wrong and this config needs more > than 250W, but I'm inclined to doubt that since there's only one hard > drive. > > Right now my bets are on the mem=nopentium switch and on heat problems > -- I've got a 80mm fan that I'll stick in it when I get a chance, and > I've already put the nopentium switch into lilo. > > thanks, Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 03:45, Gabriel Phoenix wrote: > Power Supply? > > Power supplies should be added to the troubleshooting list when tracking > down gremlins. > > Gabriel > >I've read that article too, and have had my share of cheapie power >supplies release their magic smoke... The power supply is a good one, >the 250W version on this page: >http://www.quietpcusa.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&DID=8&Product_ID=2&CATID=2 >It's conceivable that I did my math wrong and this config needs more >than 250W, but I'm inclined to doubt that since there's only one hard >drive. there is the type of ram, the video card, cdrom drives, looking at the system and saying just because I have 1 HD it's allright is false thinking. >Right now my bets are on the mem=nopentium switch and on heat problems >-- I've got a 80mm fan that I'll stick in it when I get a chance, and >I've already put the nopentium switch into lilo. >thanks, He is correct, 250W is not enough, the problem can stem from the initial power draw when a system is first turned on, AMD recomends that power supplys handle a least 180W initial draw from the power supply. most 250 ps only have a 135W max pull on power up of the computer. This was the case back when the first sloted athlons were being produced. There is a guide from AMD on how to find out all this and it's updated for socketed athlons. see amd site for info or read this article http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/content_type/white_papers_and_tech_docs/26003.pdf I only install 300w ps these days for any athlon system I build for people. -- Will Merkens Suite 1103, 505 - 4th Ave S.W. Calgary, AB. Canada Primary E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Backup E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
Jack, I looked at your PS specs at that link you gave, and then looked at your system componets you posted. In my opinion, your PS could definitely be problematic. Usually, the main problem is the power available on the 3.3v and 5v rails. This PS is pretty low (15A and 26A) with 150watt combined. If the heat doesn't prove to be the culprit, I would definitely suspect an underpowered PS. On my KT133, I had a 250w PS, and it proved inadequate- had to go to 300w, and I had less peripherals and ram than you do at that time. On mt KT266A DDR, I had to go to a 420W- even 300W wouldn't boot my Shuttle AK31A reliably. Maybe investigate your motherboard on some hardware forums/groups, and get some feedback/info as to how that board behaves- the Shuttle was very picky as to PS issues. Robert C. On Monday 28 October 2002 11:41 am, Jack Coates wrote: > On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 03:45, Gabriel Phoenix wrote: > > > > Power Supply? > > > > > Power supplies should be added to the troubleshooting list when tracking > > down gremlins. > > > > Gabriel > > I've read that article too, and have had my share of cheapie power > supplies release their magic smoke... The power supply is a good one, > the 250W version on this page: > http://www.quietpcusa.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&DID=8&Product_ID=2&CATID=2 > > It's conceivable that I did my math wrong and this config needs more > than 250W, but I'm inclined to doubt that since there's only one hard > drive. > > Right now my bets are on the mem=nopentium switch and on heat problems > -- I've got a 80mm fan that I'll stick in it when I get a chance, and > I've already put the nopentium switch into lilo. > > thanks, Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 03:45, Gabriel Phoenix wrote: > Power Supply? > > Power supplies should be added to the troubleshooting list when tracking > down gremlins. > > Gabriel > I've read that article too, and have had my share of cheapie power supplies release their magic smoke... The power supply is a good one, the 250W version on this page: http://www.quietpcusa.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&DID=8&Product_ID=2&CATID=2 It's conceivable that I did my math wrong and this config needs more than 250W, but I'm inclined to doubt that since there's only one hard drive. Right now my bets are on the mem=nopentium switch and on heat problems -- I've got a 80mm fan that I'll stick in it when I get a chance, and I've already put the nopentium switch into lilo. thanks, -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
On Sat, 2002-10-26 at 18:36, Jack Coates wrote: > Hi, > > I have a machine (naturally a fairly important one) which I built and > which is fairly unstable -- give it ten to twenty days, and it will > suffer a video lock up or a disk error that forces a reboot. > > FIC AZ11 with a VIA KT133 chipset. > Athlon 900 MHz > 768MB PC100 RAM > Voodoo3 3000 AGP card > Maxtor 92049U6 (20G 7200 RPM disk), etx3fs on all partitions. > Polaroid CD-RW IDE3212 > (2) Lite-On Communications Inc LNE100TX PCI tulip NICs > > The system runs MDK 9.0 and ran 8.2 before that. I keep an eye on it > with lm_sensors, and it doesn't go over 60C, so I've tentatively ruled > CPU heat out as a cause. I've also run memtest86 several times for runs > of up to 12 hours, with no RAM problems detected. > > today's reboot was caused by a corrupt wtmp that prevented logins. fsck > fixed it. > > At this point, I'm suspecting the motherboard's IDE controller, the hard > disk itself, the video card, the RAM, gremlins :-) I'm just not sure > where to go next in troubleshooting the system, and I don't want to > replace everything one part at a time. > > any ideas for narrowing this down? > -- > Jack Coates > Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Power Supply? "THG continues to receive hundreds of e-mails regarding the causes of sudden and sometimes frequent "crashes" of users' computers and computer systems. As these computer crashes are random and unpredictable, users are losing important data and other critical information as a result. These issues of "stability" can cost hours of use time while the system is continued to be tinkered with in vain in an effort to resolve the issue. When this occurs, ambitious users are inclined to search for the cause in the processor settings, system memory or on the motherboard, since the Front Side Bus, CPU core voltage and GPU of the graphics card are often pushed to the limit to achieve maximum performance. This results in the user resetting all of the system parameters to default values - but to no avail. The computer continues to crash, eventually so frequently that it is no longer possible to continue using it." One possible cause of unreliability that is often overlooked by users is the power supply that is installed in their computer. Unless the computer was custom built and the user recently had the power supply upgraded, chances are that it may contain a less-than-capable power supply. Users who stand to fare the worst are those who have purchased their computer from a computer super store and/or discount retailer. These systems are generally fitted with cheaply made, low-cost power supplies, which often can sustain damage even under minimal loads. The power supply is something that many users overlook when they upgrade their PCs. Since upgraded components often require more power, a larger, more capable power supply should be a standard replacement when significant upgrades have been made to a computer. Only the lab test tells the truth - even if the maximum load is specified as 300 watts, the power supply often "gives up the ghost" long before reaching this load. Some manufacturers of power supplies apparently assume that computer users will never need maximum power from their power supply. Full Load and Overload - Power Supply Units Pushed to the Limits http://www6.tomshardware.com/howto/02q4/021021/index.html Power supplies should be added to the troubleshooting list when tracking down gremlins. Gabriel signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
Olaf, Quite correct- the chassis temp can't be lower than the air temps. However, in my case, I have a duct leading outside air directly to the cpu fan, plus two 80mm case fans blowing outside air in, and I removed the top 5.25" bay plastic cover to serve as an exhaust hole. Works great. Since 24C.=75F., my inside case temps and the air blowing onto the cpu is always room temperature (always around 73-75F.). My sensors have always been very accurate, windows or linux. In my opinion, people generally don't pay enough attention to their case air-flow, and it makes a significant difference in the cpu temps also. When I put in my little duct hole and home-made cardboard passage to the cpu fan, my cpu temps dropped 8-9C. After I added the fans and removed the plastic bay cover, my chassis temps never rise more than 2-3C. above room temperature, if that. Robert C. On Sunday 27 October 2002 03:36 pm, Olaf Marzocchi wrote: > The chassis temp. cannot be lower than air temperature: if you get 23-24 > even when outside the air is at 28, you have problems with the sensors! > It's obvious. > > Olaf > > At 19.07 27/10/2002, you wrote: > >40.8C. cpu temp is reasonable, but on my KT133 I've found anything over > >45-46C. tends to give me random weird problems. I run about 39-41C. > > average. If your "average" cpu temps are running over 45C., I would be > > suspicious. Also, even though 37C. seems like it's low for sys temps, I > > would think you have a case air flow problem, as my KT133 never gets > > above 23-24C., even on hot days. The 37C. case air would add at least > > 10-12C. to any card or ram, which might be a concern, especially on a > > video card that ran hot anyway. Of course, the problems may not be heat > > related at all, but it does sound like a good bet, considering what you > > have said, and the fact that they seem random. > > kjws.com> for every kind of mail, except spam! :-) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
The chassis temp. cannot be lower than air temperature: if you get 23-24 even when outside the air is at 28, you have problems with the sensors! It's obvious. Olaf At 19.07 27/10/2002, you wrote: 40.8C. cpu temp is reasonable, but on my KT133 I've found anything over 45-46C. tends to give me random weird problems. I run about 39-41C. average. If your "average" cpu temps are running over 45C., I would be suspicious. Also, even though 37C. seems like it's low for sys temps, I would think you have a case air flow problem, as my KT133 never gets above 23-24C., even on hot days. The 37C. case air would add at least 10-12C. to any card or ram, which might be a concern, especially on a video card that ran hot anyway. Of course, the problems may not be heat related at all, but it does sound like a good bet, considering what you have said, and the fact that they seem random. kjws.com> for every kind of mail, except spam! :-) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
40.8C. cpu temp is reasonable, but on my KT133 I've found anything over 45-46C. tends to give me random weird problems. I run about 39-41C. average. If your "average" cpu temps are running over 45C., I would be suspicious. Also, even though 37C. seems like it's low for sys temps, I would think you have a case air flow problem, as my KT133 never gets above 23-24C., even on hot days. The 37C. case air would add at least 10-12C. to any card or ram, which might be a concern, especially on a video card that ran hot anyway. Of course, the problems may not be heat related at all, but it does sound like a good bet, considering what you have said, and the fact that they seem random. On Sunday 27 October 2002 11:27 am, Jack Coates wrote: > I didn't mean to imply that 60C is normal operating temperature, but > rather the highest observed peak: > > SYS Temp: +37.6°C (limit = +80°C, hysteresis = +70°C) > CPU Temp: +40.8°C (limit = +60°C, hysteresis = +55°C) > > On Sun, 2002-10-27 at 06:38, Robert Crawford wrote: > > Jack, > > I've got experience with KT133 and KT266A, AMD athlons. I've researched > > it for about 2 years, and the consensus is overwhelmingly that what AMD > > says about cpu temps is wrong in practical terms. As my own experience > > (and that of many others) shows conclusively, anything over 45C. is going > > to cause problems. Most AMD users who are knowlegable will not tolerate > > anything over 45C. This is the number one cause of random odd problems > > with AMD systems. If your cpu is really running at 60C., you have a > > major, major heat problem. I would immediately do something about cooling > > both the case air with a ducting modification, better case fans, and a > > better heatsink/fan for the cpu. Robert Crawford > > > > On Saturday 26 October 2002 06:36 pm, Jack Coates wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > > > I have a machine (naturally a fairly important one) which I built and > > > which is fairly unstable -- give it ten to twenty days, and it will > > > suffer a video lock up or a disk error that forces a reboot. > > > > > > FIC AZ11 with a VIA KT133 chipset. > > > Athlon 900 MHz > > > 768MB PC100 RAM > > > Voodoo3 3000 AGP card > > > Maxtor 92049U6 (20G 7200 RPM disk), etx3fs on all partitions. > > > Polaroid CD-RW IDE3212 > > > (2) Lite-On Communications Inc LNE100TX PCI tulip NICs > > > > > > The system runs MDK 9.0 and ran 8.2 before that. I keep an eye on it > > > with lm_sensors, and it doesn't go over 60C, so I've tentatively ruled > > > CPU heat out as a cause. I've also run memtest86 several times for runs > > > of up to 12 hours, with no RAM problems detected. > > > > > > today's reboot was caused by a corrupt wtmp that prevented logins. fsck > > > fixed it. > > > > > > At this point, I'm suspecting the motherboard's IDE controller, the > > > hard disk itself, the video card, the RAM, gremlins :-) I'm just not > > > sure where to go next in troubleshooting the system, and I don't want > > > to replace everything one part at a time. > > > > > > any ideas for narrowing this down? > > > > > > > > > > Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? > > Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
I didn't mean to imply that 60C is normal operating temperature, but rather the highest observed peak: SYS Temp: +37.6°C (limit = +80°C, hysteresis = +70°C) CPU Temp: +40.8°C (limit = +60°C, hysteresis = +55°C) On Sun, 2002-10-27 at 06:38, Robert Crawford wrote: > Jack, > I've got experience with KT133 and KT266A, AMD athlons. I've researched it for > about 2 years, and the consensus is overwhelmingly that what AMD says about > cpu temps is wrong in practical terms. As my own experience (and that of many > others) shows conclusively, anything over 45C. is going to cause problems. > Most AMD users who are knowlegable will not tolerate anything over 45C. This > is the number one cause of random odd problems with AMD systems. If your cpu > is really running at 60C., you have a major, major heat problem. I would > immediately do something about cooling both the case air with a ducting > modification, better case fans, and a better heatsink/fan for the cpu. > Robert Crawford > > On Saturday 26 October 2002 06:36 pm, Jack Coates wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I have a machine (naturally a fairly important one) which I built and > > which is fairly unstable -- give it ten to twenty days, and it will > > suffer a video lock up or a disk error that forces a reboot. > > > > FIC AZ11 with a VIA KT133 chipset. > > Athlon 900 MHz > > 768MB PC100 RAM > > Voodoo3 3000 AGP card > > Maxtor 92049U6 (20G 7200 RPM disk), etx3fs on all partitions. > > Polaroid CD-RW IDE3212 > > (2) Lite-On Communications Inc LNE100TX PCI tulip NICs > > > > The system runs MDK 9.0 and ran 8.2 before that. I keep an eye on it > > with lm_sensors, and it doesn't go over 60C, so I've tentatively ruled > > CPU heat out as a cause. I've also run memtest86 several times for runs > > of up to 12 hours, with no RAM problems detected. > > > > today's reboot was caused by a corrupt wtmp that prevented logins. fsck > > fixed it. > > > > At this point, I'm suspecting the motherboard's IDE controller, the hard > > disk itself, the video card, the RAM, gremlins :-) I'm just not sure > > where to go next in troubleshooting the system, and I don't want to > > replace everything one part at a time. > > > > any ideas for narrowing this down? > > > > > Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? > Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
On Sat, 2002-10-26 at 16:31, Rolf Pedersen wrote: > Jack Coates wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I have a machine (naturally a fairly important one) which I built and > > which is fairly unstable -- give it ten to twenty days, and it will > > suffer a video lock up or a disk error that forces a reboot. > > > > FIC AZ11 with a VIA KT133 chipset. > > Athlon 900 MHz > > 768MB PC100 RAM > > Voodoo3 3000 AGP card > > Maxtor 92049U6 (20G 7200 RPM disk), etx3fs on all partitions. > > Polaroid CD-RW IDE3212 > > (2) Lite-On Communications Inc LNE100TX PCI tulip NICs > > > Do you pass the mem=nopentium kernel command in grub/menu.lst or > lilo.conf? Just in case you didn't know, there is a kernel bug that can > cause corrupting/locking misuse of agp memory on machines with athlons > and agp vid cards. > > I did not know that -- I'll give it a shot. thanks, -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
Jack, I've got experience with KT133 and KT266A, AMD athlons. I've researched it for about 2 years, and the consensus is overwhelmingly that what AMD says about cpu temps is wrong in practical terms. As my own experience (and that of many others) shows conclusively, anything over 45C. is going to cause problems. Most AMD users who are knowlegable will not tolerate anything over 45C. This is the number one cause of random odd problems with AMD systems. If your cpu is really running at 60C., you have a major, major heat problem. I would immediately do something about cooling both the case air with a ducting modification, better case fans, and a better heatsink/fan for the cpu. Robert Crawford On Saturday 26 October 2002 06:36 pm, Jack Coates wrote: > Hi, > > I have a machine (naturally a fairly important one) which I built and > which is fairly unstable -- give it ten to twenty days, and it will > suffer a video lock up or a disk error that forces a reboot. > > FIC AZ11 with a VIA KT133 chipset. > Athlon 900 MHz > 768MB PC100 RAM > Voodoo3 3000 AGP card > Maxtor 92049U6 (20G 7200 RPM disk), etx3fs on all partitions. > Polaroid CD-RW IDE3212 > (2) Lite-On Communications Inc LNE100TX PCI tulip NICs > > The system runs MDK 9.0 and ran 8.2 before that. I keep an eye on it > with lm_sensors, and it doesn't go over 60C, so I've tentatively ruled > CPU heat out as a cause. I've also run memtest86 several times for runs > of up to 12 hours, with no RAM problems detected. > > today's reboot was caused by a corrupt wtmp that prevented logins. fsck > fixed it. > > At this point, I'm suspecting the motherboard's IDE controller, the hard > disk itself, the video card, the RAM, gremlins :-) I'm just not sure > where to go next in troubleshooting the system, and I don't want to > replace everything one part at a time. > > any ideas for narrowing this down? Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
Jack Coates wrote: Hi, I have a machine (naturally a fairly important one) which I built and which is fairly unstable -- give it ten to twenty days, and it will suffer a video lock up or a disk error that forces a reboot. FIC AZ11 with a VIA KT133 chipset. Athlon 900 MHz 768MB PC100 RAM Voodoo3 3000 AGP card Maxtor 92049U6 (20G 7200 RPM disk), etx3fs on all partitions. Polaroid CD-RW IDE3212 (2) Lite-On Communications Inc LNE100TX PCI tulip NICs Do you pass the mem=nopentium kernel command in grub/menu.lst or lilo.conf? Just in case you didn't know, there is a kernel bug that can cause corrupting/locking misuse of agp memory on machines with athlons and agp vid cards. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
[expert] hardware troubleshooting questions
Hi, I have a machine (naturally a fairly important one) which I built and which is fairly unstable -- give it ten to twenty days, and it will suffer a video lock up or a disk error that forces a reboot. FIC AZ11 with a VIA KT133 chipset. Athlon 900 MHz 768MB PC100 RAM Voodoo3 3000 AGP card Maxtor 92049U6 (20G 7200 RPM disk), etx3fs on all partitions. Polaroid CD-RW IDE3212 (2) Lite-On Communications Inc LNE100TX PCI tulip NICs The system runs MDK 9.0 and ran 8.2 before that. I keep an eye on it with lm_sensors, and it doesn't go over 60C, so I've tentatively ruled CPU heat out as a cause. I've also run memtest86 several times for runs of up to 12 hours, with no RAM problems detected. today's reboot was caused by a corrupt wtmp that prevented logins. fsck fixed it. At this point, I'm suspecting the motherboard's IDE controller, the hard disk itself, the video card, the RAM, gremlins :-) I'm just not sure where to go next in troubleshooting the system, and I don't want to replace everything one part at a time. any ideas for narrowing this down? -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
