Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
See what I mean? Curtis refuted John's idiotic argument point by point, and HE DIDN'T EVEN HEAR IT. The only thing he can do is repeat the same stupid thing he's already repeated -- and had refuted -- here on FFL dozens of time in the past. You really can't deal with anyone as dumb as this. I repeat my contention -- believing in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect really IS like winning the Trifecta of Idiocy. How does a mind *become* this weak? From: jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2014 1:59 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness Xeno, I have asked Curtis about his support or evidence for disagreeing with the statements in the Kalam Cosmological Argument. But he just gave me a lot of song and dance about his opinions without providing the evidence for his arguments. Can you give us a solid argument with evidence and support why the statements in the KCA have a flaw? Let's take the KCA which states: 1. Everything that begins to exist has a cause; 2. The universe began to exist; Therefore: 3. The universe has a cause. Do you agree with statement 1 or not? If not, please give us your reasons for disagreeing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Logical arguments about ultimates always contain a flaw. You can reverse the form of the argument to support atheism and if you do not see the flaw, it will seem equally valid, that is, that atheism is true. Now there are some atheists who definitely believe there is no god and they can be as fanatical as a fundamentalist religionist. Probably they would have no sense of humour about their condition. But a real atheist simply lacks a particular kind of belief because that belief seems neither reasonable or likely. They basically just do not care. Barry is just testing memes to see what happens when they are activated. We all have memes which are basically little snippets of mental routines our minds use. We trade them with each other, but for the most part these mental stances are just our opinions about the world around us and we tend to be be rather uncritical as to how well they really represent what is real, while at the same time taking them as reality itself. Take the TMO memes. On FFL, meditators and former meditators all at one time believed certain things about experience were at least possible, for example, that if you practice TM, which is not a religion, you will find God. The TMO memes specify that we are in a state of ignorance, not knowing the nature of reality. But were we actually in the state of ignorance, we would not have the capability to correctly evaluate what we were told because we would be using delusional thinking to evaluate ideas such as transcendence, states of consciousness and so forth, so our following this system of thought about reality would essentially be an act of insanity, that is, mental illness. The system defines us as in some way incapacitated in knowing what is real, and then expects us to just jump in, and accept what the system says is real. A discussion of the Kalam argument: Cosmological Kalamity Cosmological Kalamity Home » Library » Modern » Dan Barker » Cosmological Kalamity Dan Barker Daddy, if God made everything, who made God? my daughter Kristi asked me, when she was five years old. View on infidels.orgPreview by Yahoo ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Barry, Have you ever thought that atheism is also a belief-- and an unreasonable one at that? The Kalam Cosmological Argument should dispel any of your doubts.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
John will ignore this post as if it never existed.
The only thing God-fanatics like him CAN do is repeat the same old challenge
and then, no matter what the answer, yell Checkmate, Atheists! Do you begin
to see why I bothered to interject and describe both him and Jim as idiots
earlier.
We've seen this same scenario play itself out dozens of times on FFL, *with the
same idiots*. They do the same thing every time, whenever anyone points out how
idiotic their beliefs in a God are. It's all bluster, then denying that their
arguments have been soundly refuted, then repeating the same arguments again.
Told ya this would happen...
Next he'll try to prove astrology by making a heavy-duty prediction like,
Something bad will happen to someone during the next full moon.
From: anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 20, 2014 6:18 AM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
x exists
x does not exist
I do not know what the phrase 'begins to exist' means, especially in regard to
the universe as a whole. If x were an auto-mobile, perhaps one could say that
when it was partially assembled, it began to exist, but all the components of
that were manufactured prior to that and merely gathered together with welds,
bolts, and glue. And those parts had precursors, ad infinitum (almost) to the
beginning of the universe, before which we have no knowledge, and in fact we
have only induction as to regard the early universe. And induction is logically
invalid.
The link I gave in the previous post did do some analysis why the Kalam
argument is flawed, apparently you did not read it. Here it is again:
Cosmological Kalamity
Cosmological Kalamity
Home » Library » Modern » Dan Barker » Cosmological Kalamity Dan Barker
Daddy, if God made everything, who made God? my daughter Kristi asked me,
when she was five years old.
View on infidels.org Preview by Yahoo
I do not know how the universe began.
I do not know what 'begins to exist' means in this context, can you fill in
some detail?
If this were science, all I would have to do is wait for your demonstration of
the truth of the argument, but as it seems no one knows, I doubt this would be
forthcoming. As Curtis pointed out, proving a negative is impossible. It is a
time waster. In science one simply ignores those who do not show up with
evidence for their claims and thus science ('to know' is the meaning of the
word) only works with people who actively produce results.
For all I know the Kalam argument might be accidentally true, but essentially I
just find it unconvincing. If god is un-caused, then god did not begin to
exist, and if god did not begin to exist, he cannot exist. The word everything
would seem to include what is called god, other wise, the first sentence
includes a false concept. We would have not 'everything that begins to exist
has a cause', and then we would have a number of possible things that were
un-caused. For example, Zeus, the king of the gods, a step higher in divinity
than the other gods, of which perhaps your god is one of those lesser ones.
I can say on the basis of experience, that the universe was re-created this
morning when I woke up. It was recreated again this morning and this evening
when I came out of meditation after a timeless spell (I am not saying what sort
of meditation was happening or not). I am un-caused, and therefore I must not
be beginning to exist, and therefore I am not the universe, but seeing the
universe seemed to emerge from what I am, I must be a creator of some sort. So
if this happens with me, what am I? I must be more than a human form and mind,
being able to contain all this.
Since in my own estimation, I seem to have created the universe, where does
that leave your argument? If the universe has a cause, how do you determine
what that cause is or is not? Simply stating that the universe has a cause does
not reveal the nature of the cause. It could be a quantum fluctuation in a
multi-verse continuum. With multi-verses, maybe some have gods, and some do
not. Maybe some are created by farts in a hyper-cosmic digestive system.
You have also not mentioned the argument that the universe has no cause.
Suppose we say, that in spite of all appearances, the universe has no cause at
all. It was a spontaneous event that had no priors; that would mean that all
the stuff in the universe ultimately had no cause either, the stuff within
would have prior events but ultimately could not be traced back to a primal
cause. Accidental existence. Perhaps we are all part of an unwanted pregnancy.
Curtis is actually much better at this kind of reasoning than I am. I think he
just wanted you to provide a positive example of the stipulation you made,
something he could work with. A philosopher needs an
[FairfieldLife] Ancient Petroglyph on Mars
Were there humanoids living on Mars millions of years ago? http://www.examiner.com/article/mars-and-earth-have-same-ancient-man-rock-engraving-visitors-to-both-planets http://www.examiner.com/article/mars-and-earth-have-same-ancient-man-rock-engraving-visitors-to-both-planets
Re: [FairfieldLife] Ancient Petroglyph on Mars
OK, I was clearly wrong. I figured that no one could *possibly* be more idiotic than to believe in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect all at the same time. My bad. Now John has upped the ante by believing that he sees the faces of aliens on Mars rocks. He must be competing with Nabby to see who can become THE laughingstock of Fairfield Life and the TM movement. FOR THE RECORD, it's *not* the having of such crazy beliefs that offends me. It's the *not knowing* how crazy the shit they're saying is that's worrying. What *happened* to long-term TMers that they don't even perceive this stuff as crazy any more? From: jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com W Sent: Monday, October 20, 2014 8:31 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Ancient Petroglyph on Mars Were there humanoids living on Mars millions of years ago? http://www.examiner.com/article/mars-and-earth-have-same-ancient-man-rock-engraving-visitors-to-both-planets
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Yep, Lenz was fucked up, no doubt about it, but I question that he aligned himself with the 'bad guys'. Despite confusion about it, and longstanding stories, there really are not any 'bad guys' who can produce any results worth noting, in the average person, with a healthy mind. I know there are bad guys out there. I have witnessed them both having 'infected' humans and also in non-human form. But, Lenz did not possess a healthy mind so I believe he was very vulnerable to the influences of bad stuff. Lenz was a shrewd manipulator, and used the power of suggestion brilliantly, but had no more power than the average criminal, in waking state. No particular alliances with any subtle beings - all fear and imagination. Pretty obvious when he talks about it. Building nightmares in people's minds was a specialty of his. Sure, he manipulated others to create fear and uncertainly while simultaneously feeding their ego or feeding their ego first and then flipping that on its lid. He had to do that in order to stay feeling in power and in control and needed and loved as well as feared. It is a complex mix. I have seen it, I have been a part of it. Being an active member of a good old homegrown cult certainly reveals a lot about oneself. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Steve, it is Lenz. Almost like he is channeling him. Lenz famously denigrated and mocked any spiritual or religious belief, save his own, which changed constantly, to keep his dweebs off balance. Barry is more about opposition and confusion, but he is not really clear on why he does it, hasn't come face-to-face with his experiences with Freddie, the public humiliation, the confusion, the turning on others in his spiritual circle. Hasn't looked in his mirror, and seen Freddie staring back, yet. Maybe one of these days. Funny you should say this. I just finished reading the whole book, from beginning to end, the Mark Laxer book chronicling his years with Lenz. It was very, very interesting. It explains a whole lot about bawee and his way of interacting here, even including his jargon and especially his viewpoints and modalities for dealing with others at FFL. But most of all I can more fully understand why bawee is the way he is. It is an interesting book and definitely worth a read, not because it is particularly well written but because it addresses some quintessential aspects of the dangers that seekers can fall victim to when faced with a ruthlessly needy 'teacher'. Take the ingredients of charisma, an accessibility to some form of power through a tapping into seductive forces and entities, a healthy dose of ego and add a group of people whose egos can be cajoled and stroked into submission and it results in an undying loyalty to some teacher who will ultimately exercise a dangerous power and influence over them. There are some spooky similarities between my time with Robin and what Mark describes in his experience with Rama. However, I believe the two men were very different although the manifestation of their dis-ease was similar in some essential ways. Rama became a train wreck long before his suicide/misstep off a dock into deep water. Based on Mark's account, I believe Rama aligned himself intentionally with the bad guys and while it gave him the ability to have unnatural influence over others as well as abilities to see things and do things beyond what I, for example, am capable of it all came with a terrible price. The guy was also a raging narcissist and extremely self indulgent and most likely sociopathic. In reading the book I found myself vacillating between disgust and pity for the man. He was terribly weak in the ways that count. I wonder how the others who were with him fared in later years. Some of those people were with him an awfully long time. Anyway, for those interested enough to check it out it is a few hours read. I find the phenomenon of guru attraction fascinating and, of course, I compare it to my own experience having joined my own brand of cult.
[FairfieldLife] Why do people sound American when they sing in English?
And how to read Shakespeare correctly! 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Why English people sound American when they sing, and other intriguing linguistic theories View on www.telegraph.co.uk http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
You don't read their stuff, but i figured it would make your day to learn that Jim and Ann (both who claim that they are not obsessed with you) have been bragging about having read A WHOLE BOOK about Rama (the same one you told us about) so that they can obsess on you even more while trying to demonize you. You were right, this place is a zoo. Color me not surprised. I guess it gives them something to do other than whack off. :-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : You don't read their stuff, but i figured it would make your day to learn that Jim and Ann (both who claim that they are not obsessed with you) have been bragging about having read A WHOLE BOOK about Rama (the same one you told us about) so that they can obsess on you even more while trying to demonize you. You were right, this place is a zoo. Color me not surprised. I guess it gives them something to do other than whack off. :-) They must have some serious time on their hands. I thought the unified field would give Jim endless pleasure and an ego working beyond the mere concerns of us mortals so he didn't have to get caught up in our tawdry world. Instead it seems that he can't get enough of it! I often used to wonder what Marshy meant when he lectured about how an enlightened mind could only obey the laws of nature. I guess we know now, arguing on the internet must be important work for the unified field It's the modern way I suppose, I just thought that having access to all that infinite wisdom might be a bit more impressive to behold. But that's just my waking state consciousness struggling to understand something way beyond its meagre limits obviously.
[FairfieldLife] Vegetarians have much lower sperm counts
There's always a catch Vegetarians have much lower sperm counts - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/active/mens-health/11172519/Vegetarians-have-much-lower-sperm-counts.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/active/mens-health/11172519/Vegetarians-have-much-lower-sperm-counts.html Vegetarians have much lower sperm counts - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/active/mens-health/11172519/Vegetarians-have-much-lower-sperm-counts.html A diet rich in fruit and vegetables may harm fertility, say researchers at Loma Linda University Medical School View on www.telegraph.co.uk http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/active/mens-health/11172519/Vegetarians-have-much-lower-sperm-counts.html Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: Correction (Billy Graham: America is Just as Wicked...)
Correction. Here below is the corrected pic. Holy shit, I think I am getting old and my mind, hands and legs are failing me. Bear with me folks. https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-oi6BP5yY2y0/VESzlSmsJJI/A5k/AYns4JO0ZWc/s710/epicurus_778.png https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-oi6BP5yY2y0/VESzlSmsJJI/A5k/AYns4JO0ZWc/s710/epicurus_778.png --- blue_bungalow_2@... wrote : https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-kRLZxm3JXkw/VEO_nf_6CcI/A4o/yduhXKVm7A8/s710/epicurus_777.png https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-kRLZxm3JXkw/VEO_nf_6CcI/A4o/yduhXKVm7A8/s710/epicurus_777.png --- fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Curtis, as jr. says, you guys say there is no God. Its not like it is ambiguous. From: curtisdeltablues@... M: But I don't say this. I say I see no reason to believe in one. There is a huge difference between these statements. I am amazed that I cannot communicate this difference effectively because it keeps coming back misstated. --- turquoiseb@... wrote : I keep trying to explain this to you, Curtis. You cannot convey this simple difference to Jim and John BECAUSE THEY'RE IDIOTS WITH BRAINS THE SIZE OF A PEA. :-) Here, let me demonstrate. I shall make a statement about what I actually believe. Then wait to see how long it takes one or both of these idiots to come back claiming that I said the exact opposite: I do not believe that there is any need to either hypothesize the need for a God, or to believe in the existence of one. I do NOT declare that There is no God, because that seems to be obvious. Even those who claim to believe in one can't produce him/her/it. Now, how long will it take before these two mental midgets transform what I said above into me declaring my absolute belief that there is no God and thus demonstrating that atheism is my religion? I admire Curtis his patience at dealing with these mental midgets, but I don't have that level of patience. I'd rather just point out how idiotic their beliefs are, ask them once again to PROVE their beliefs, and then sit back and watch. Unlike Curtis, who seems to think that he can actually communicate to these two numbnuts, I have no such illusions. Within a couple of days (probably less), they'll be back claiming the same things about what I supposedly believe that they always do, which is always 180 degrees opposite from what I actually believe. You really just CAN'T deal rationally with minds this weak. So I've given up trying...
[FairfieldLife] Vatican votes against empathy....
Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving Pope Francis the loser http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving... http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome Final report of Roman Catholic extraordinary synod on the family removes talk of ‘welcoming’ gay people View on www.theguardian.com http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2014 9:47 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : You don't read their stuff, but i figured it would make your day to learn that Jim and Ann (both who claim that they are not obsessed with you) have been bragging about having read A WHOLE BOOK about Rama (the same one you told us about) so that they can obsess on you even more while trying to demonize you. You were right, this place is a zoo. Color me not surprised. I guess it gives them something to do other than whack off. :-) They must have some serious time on their hands. I thought the unified field would give Jim endless pleasure and an ego working beyond the mere concerns of us mortals so he didn't have to get caught up in our tawdry world. Instead it seems that he can't get enough of it! I'm surprised he even needs to read. After all, hasn't he told us many times how he just knows things? I often used to wonder what Marshy meant when he lectured about how an enlightened mind could only obey the laws of nature. I guess we know now, arguing on the internet must be important work for the unified field It's the modern way I suppose, I just thought that having access to all that infinite wisdom might be a bit more impressive to behold. I know. Plus, how much does it really PAY to be obsessed with someone on the Internet? I guess we'd have to ask Judy to get the exact pay scale. :-) But that's just my waking state consciousness struggling to understand something way beyond its meagre limits obviously. Obviously. :-)
[FairfieldLife] Christians 0, Atheists $2,000.000 :-)
While on this forum believers are repeating themselves over and over, pretending that their arguments were never addressed, much less soundly refuted, elsewhere in the News non-believers are taking idiots like them to court and winning big-time. Atheist Wins $2 Million Settlement Over Faith-Based Rehab Program Atheist Wins $2 Million Settlement Over Faith-Based Reha... A California atheist has won a settlement of nearly $2 million after being sent to jail on a parole violation for objections he made about participating in a faith-... View on www.huffingtonpost... Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
From: anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 9:12 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness No, people become insulted. A person saying x might be interpreted by y as an insult, but interpreted by z as a helpful hint. Being insulted is a response. Furthermore, it's a response that in intelligent people is under their control. It's only stupid people who feel so compelled to respond to something that offends them that they claim to have no choice in the matter, or to be noble for having to respond. Now think about someone who claims to be enlightened claiming that he has no choice but to respond. Pretty idiotic, isn't it? What to some might seem a pox on their cherished tradition others might see as a reasonable evaluation of idiotic beliefs, or even championing truth. You can swear at an anvil, and what does it do in response — nothing. You can berate someone in a language they do not speak, and while they might notice you are agitated, in not understanding the words, they will not responds as if it were an insult. So it is all in the interpretation. I have never said what Barry says is wisdom. It is what Barry says, that is all. Exactly. And if you think back on it, ALL that I did that has a few people on this forum going batshit crazy lately is post a few graphics that I found on Google after one 2-second search of Google for atheist funny. That's it. THAT is what they're going crazy over. I'd say that I made my point fairly successfully... People respond in different ways. He clearly knows enough about certain aspects of human nature to elicit the responses he gets on FFL. If I lived where he lived and saw him every day, I probably would have a better idea what he is like, but I tend not to draw conclusions so readily based on what he writes. Wisdom does not come from others, if you want to be wise, you have to mine for it yourself. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Barry is just testing memes to see what happens when they are activated. Wrong, Taxius. Barry is insulting people. Barry is cursing people's beliefs. Barry is denigrating people, distorting who they are, and treating them with incredible disrespect. We are not his guinea pigs. He, rather, has become quite a specimen of craziness and abuse, under the scrutiny, of those he inadvertently attracts, through his antisocial behavior. You are a fool for taking his emotionally unbalanced state, for some sort of wisdom. Grow up, and smell the reality. The TMO memes specify that we are in a state of ignorance, not knowing the nature of reality. But were we actually in the state of ignorance, we would not have the capability to correctly evaluate what we were told because we would be using delusional thinking to evaluate ideas such as transcendence, states of consciousness and so forth, so our following this system of thought about reality would essentially be an act of insanity, that is, mental illness. Yep, absolutely correct. That is why we practice TM, to clear past impressions, so that we can one day see reality, as it is, not as we think it should be. Otherwise, we would remain impaired, as you say - in a state of ignorance. There is no way to follow the knowledge associated with TM, without doing TM. It makes little sense, like reading automobile service manuals, without owning or driving a car. I do not think you understood what I said here. What I said here was in a state of ignorance, you are incapable of knowing whether the TM program, in total, is a scam or not, based on its own philosophy, so saying that it clears past impressions and so forth, is a complete unknown, for in a state of delusion, you cannot come to a correct evaluation of whether the program has any valid reason for being followed. You cannot use the philosophy of the program to determine if what it says is true, that is circular reasoning. You cannot even evaluate the practices, at least initially. Lots of people have been practising TM for 50 years and still seem to be in the dark as to what it is all about. So the fact you found value might just be a random quirk. I myself found value in the program, but I also am aware of many limitations it has, and it has been useful for some, a stepping stone to other things for some, just so-so for others, and a nightmare for a few. There is nothing about enlightenment that is not experienced before starting a spiritual path. If enlightenment seems different from the way you were before engaging spirituality, then the process is not complete. Enlightenment does not add anything to life, it removes a misunderstanding about what has always been happening, what has been the case. During the unpacking of misconceptions, experiences may seem quite unlike what one had previously known.
[FairfieldLife] Meanwhile, back in the home of all knowledge, Mother India...
...people are so highly evolved that the only way to keep them from pissing on public walls is to appeal to their superstition. They have to cover the walls with posters of Hindu gods: Only God Can Stop Public Urination Only God Can Stop Public Urination How ceramic tiles could keep Indians from treating the streets as a urinal View on www.theatlantic.com Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
Go crawl back under your rock, Sal. I am surprised Barry admits to whacking off, all the time. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : You don't read their stuff, but i figured it would make your day to learn that Jim and Ann (both who claim that they are not obsessed with you) have been bragging about having read A WHOLE BOOK about Rama (the same one you told us about) so that they can obsess on you even more while trying to demonize you. You were right, this place is a zoo. Color me not surprised. I guess it gives them something to do other than whack off. :-) They must have some serious time on their hands. I thought the unified field would give Jim endless pleasure and an ego working beyond the mere concerns of us mortals so he didn't have to get caught up in our tawdry world. Instead it seems that he can't get enough of it! I often used to wonder what Marshy meant when he lectured about how an enlightened mind could only obey the laws of nature. I guess we know now, arguing on the internet must be important work for the unified field It's the modern way I suppose, I just thought that having access to all that infinite wisdom might be a bit more impressive to behold. But that's just my waking state consciousness struggling to understand something way beyond its meagre limits obviously.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
Are you now like Richard, creating more than one account for yourself? This doesn't sound like any reporter I've ever heard. I call bullshit on you, you lurking reporter, you! LOL ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : You don't read their stuff, but i figured it would make your day to learn that Jim and Ann (both who claim that they are not obsessed with you) have been bragging about having read A WHOLE BOOK about Rama (the same one you told us about) so that they can obsess on you even more while trying to demonize you. You were right, this place is a zoo. Color me not surprised. I guess it gives them something to do other than whack off. :-)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
Bye, bye, Lenz, Jr. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : See what I mean? Curtis refuted John's idiotic argument point by point, and HE DIDN'T EVEN HEAR IT. The only thing he can do is repeat the same stupid thing he's already repeated -- and had refuted -- here on FFL dozens of time in the past. You really can't deal with anyone as dumb as this. I repeat my contention -- believing in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect really IS like winning the Trifecta of Idiocy. How does a mind *become* this weak? From: jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2014 1:59 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness Xeno, I have asked Curtis about his support or evidence for disagreeing with the statements in the Kalam Cosmological Argument. But he just gave me a lot of song and dance about his opinions without providing the evidence for his arguments. Can you give us a solid argument with evidence and support why the statements in the KCA have a flaw? Let's take the KCA which states: Everything that begins to exist has a cause; The universe began to exist; Therefore: The universe has a cause. Do you agree with statement 1 or not? If not, please give us your reasons for disagreeing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Logical arguments about ultimates always contain a flaw. You can reverse the form of the argument to support atheism and if you do not see the flaw, it will seem equally valid, that is, that atheism is true. Now there are some atheists who definitely believe there is no god and they can be as fanatical as a fundamentalist religionist. Probably they would have no sense of humour about their condition. But a real atheist simply lacks a particular kind of belief because that belief seems neither reasonable or likely. They basically just do not care. Barry is just testing memes to see what happens when they are activated. We all have memes which are basically little snippets of mental routines our minds use. We trade them with each other, but for the most part these mental stances are just our opinions about the world around us and we tend to be be rather uncritical as to how well they really represent what is real, while at the same time taking them as reality itself. Take the TMO memes. On FFL, meditators and former meditators all at one time believed certain things about experience were at least possible, for example, that if you practice TM, which is not a religion, you will find God. The TMO memes specify that we are in a state of ignorance, not knowing the nature of reality. But were we actually in the state of ignorance, we would not have the capability to correctly evaluate what we were told because we would be using delusional thinking to evaluate ideas such as transcendence, states of consciousness and so forth, so our following this system of thought about reality would essentially be an act of insanity, that is, mental illness. The system defines us as in some way incapacitated in knowing what is real, and then expects us to just jump in, and accept what the system says is real. A discussion of the Kalam argument: Cosmological Kalamity http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html Cosmological Kalamity http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html Home » Library » Modern » Dan Barker » Cosmological Kalamity Dan Barker Daddy, if God made everything, who made God? my daughter Kristi asked me, when she was five years old. View on infidels.org http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html Preview by Yahoo ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Barry, Have you ever thought that atheism is also a belief-- and an unreasonable one at that? The Kalam Cosmological Argument should dispel any of your doubts.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Ancient Petroglyph on Mars
Go away, Freddie-lite. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : OK, I was clearly wrong. I figured that no one could *possibly* be more idiotic than to believe in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect all at the same time. My bad. Now John has upped the ante by believing that he sees the faces of aliens on Mars rocks. He must be competing with Nabby to see who can become THE laughingstock of Fairfield Life and the TM movement. FOR THE RECORD, it's *not* the having of such crazy beliefs that offends me. It's the *not knowing* how crazy the shit they're saying is that's worrying. What *happened* to long-term TMers that they don't even perceive this stuff as crazy any more? From: jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com W Sent: Monday, October 20, 2014 8:31 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Ancient Petroglyph on Mars Were there humanoids living on Mars millions of years ago? http://www.examiner.com/article/mars-and-earth-have-same-ancient-man-rock-engraving-visitors-to-both-planets http://www.examiner.com/article/mars-and-earth-have-same-ancient-man-rock-engraving-visitors-to-both-planets
[FairfieldLife] Atheist vs. Theist logic
[FairfieldLife] The seduction of silence
One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God
My personal take jr. is that those who insist actions have no causality, is
that it gives them a free pass for screwing up their life, and then claiming,
But, I couldn't have known!!.
Curtis is a fairly unsuccessful street performer, and Barry has no skills or
money, or relationships. Ever wonder why these two losers denigrate God, and
enlightenment? Because they are the *losers* of the world.
They cannot accept that they have failed, that they deliberately made big
mistakes, and are now responsible for their past actions. Better to blame it
all on a random and chaotic universe. Shrugging their shoulders, and drooling,
they ask each other, Who knew?...
Of course they have no faith, or belief. in the traditions and systems of the
world - They have failed, massively, and in their bitterness, only see a world
inhabited by chumps and losers, like themselves. They are here, simply to
convince the rest of us, of this twisted and negative world view of theirs.
Doing a damned good job, too, poor bastards.
The world is as you are, live unbounded awareness - Maharishi.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote :
Xeno,
Are you saying that the human mind would not be able to fathom the meaning of
begins to exist? If that is so, how is it possible for you to begin and end
a project at work or at home?
But we know that NASA has been able to send the Curiosity rover to Mars which
is a very high technological feat. So, it appears that humans know can
understand the meaning of begins to exist. If not, NASA would not have been
able to send the rover to Mars.
I believe you're avoiding the question by claiming that you don't know what
statement 1 of the KCA means. In other words, you're being disingenuous. Or,
that you're pulling a Curtis on us.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :
x exists x does not exist
I do not know what the phrase 'begins to exist' means, especially in regard to
the universe as a whole. If x were an auto-mobile, perhaps one could say that
when it was partially assembled, it began to exist, but all the components of
that were manufactured prior to that and merely gathered together with welds,
bolts, and glue. And those parts had precursors, ad infinitum (almost) to the
beginning of the universe, before which we have no knowledge, and in fact we
have only induction as to regard the early universe. And induction is logically
invalid.
The link I gave in the previous post did do some analysis why the Kalam
argument is flawed, apparently you did not read it. Here it is again:
Cosmological Kalamity
http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html
Cosmological Kalamity
http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html Home » Library »
Modern » Dan Barker » Cosmological Kalamity Dan Barker Daddy, if God made
everything, who made God? my daughter Kristi asked me, when she was five years
old.
View on infidels.org
http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html
Preview by Yahoo
I do not know how the universe began.
I do not know what 'begins to exist' means in this context, can you fill in
some detail?
If this were science, all I would have to do is wait for your demonstration of
the truth of the argument, but as it seems no one knows, I doubt this would be
forthcoming. As Curtis pointed out, proving a negative is impossible. It is a
time waster. In science one simply ignores those who do not show up with
evidence for their claims and thus science ('to know' is the meaning of the
word) only works with people who actively produce results.
For all I know the Kalam argument might be accidentally true, but essentially
I just find it unconvincing. If god is un-caused, then god did not begin to
exist, and if god did not begin to exist, he cannot exist. The word everything
would seem to include what is called god, other wise, the first sentence
includes a false concept. We would have not 'everything that begins to exist
has a cause', and then we would have a number of possible things that were
un-caused. For example, Zeus, the king of the gods, a step higher in divinity
than the other gods, of which perhaps your god is one of those lesser ones.
I can say on the basis of experience, that the universe was re-created this
morning when I woke up. It was recreated again this morning and this evening
when I came out of meditation after a timeless spell (I am not saying what sort
of meditation was happening or not). I am un-caused, and therefore I must not
be beginning to exist, and therefore I am not the universe, but seeing the
universe seemed to emerge from what I am, I must be a creator of some sort. So
if this happens with me, what am I? I must be more than a human form and mind,
being able to contain all this.
Since in my own estimation, I seem to have created the universe, where does
that leave your
[FairfieldLife] 6 Daily Habits Of The World's Most Successful CEOs
6 Daily Habits Of The World's Most Successful CEOs http://www.businessinsider.com/habits-of-successful-ceos-2014-10 http://www.businessinsider.com/habits-of-successful-ceos-2014-10 6 Daily Habits Of The World's Most Successful CEOs http://www.businessinsider.com/habits-of-successful-ceos-2014-10 If you want to get to the next level, try incorporating these strategies into your daily routine. View on www.businessinsider... http://www.businessinsider.com/habits-of-successful-ceos-2014-10 Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
[FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
Yes, pity all the city-dwellers who have no idea of what quiet is. There is a little church made of log built in the 1850's that still stands by itself amidst trees on a ridge-top that is one of those places of silence that people go visit to listen and hear the silence there. It is a place of pilgrimage for people who do not often know silence otherwise. It is quieting. A place to go. It is called Mars Hill. It is a special place that way, -Buck fleetwood_macncheese One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
Nablusoss, wrt light, for the past month or so I've become so aware of the sunlight, or any light for that matter. But the sunlight is so sublime, almost a living thing. Its silence is definitely a beautiful song. On Monday, October 20, 2014 5:57 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Ancient Petroglyph on Mars
As many rocks are, these are beautiful, John and it's fun to consider about their origins. Thanks for posting. On Monday, October 20, 2014 1:31 AM, jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Were there humanoids living on Mars millions of years ago? http://www.examiner.com/article/mars-and-earth-have-same-ancient-man-rock-engraving-visitors-to-both-planets
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
The ignorant inquisitor.. 'It's not my experience so it does not exist!' Deltablues' technique is the old trick of the materialist's (orthodox) inquisitor, “Tell us, what exactly is your creed?” “Tell us in terms detailed such that we can understand and then the best of sophists of us will argue it out with you trying it point by point. Lot of people have been burned at the stake by uber-intellectualistic people like Deltablues is trying to be here on FFL. -Buck fleetwood_macncheese responding to Turqb: Bye, bye, Lenz, Jr. turquoiseb@... wrote : See what I mean? Curtis refuted John's idiotic argument point by point, and HE DIDN'T EVEN HEAR IT. The only thing he can do is repeat the same stupid thing he's already repeated -- and had refuted -- here on FFL dozens of time in the past. You really can't deal with anyone as dumb as this. I repeat my contention -- believing in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect really IS like winning the Trifecta of Idiocy. How does a mind *become* this weak? From: jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2014 1:59 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness Xeno, I have asked Curtis about his support or evidence for disagreeing with the statements in the Kalam Cosmological Argument. But he just gave me a lot of song and dance about his opinions without providing the evidence for his arguments. Can you give us a solid argument with evidence and support why the statements in the KCA have a flaw? Let's take the KCA which states: Everything that begins to exist has a cause; The universe began to exist; Therefore: The universe has a cause. Do you agree with statement 1 or not? If not, please give us your reasons for disagreeing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Logical arguments about ultimates always contain a flaw. You can reverse the form of the argument to support atheism and if you do not see the flaw, it will seem equally valid, that is, that atheism is true. Now there are some atheists who definitely believe there is no god and they can be as fanatical as a fundamentalist religionist. Probably they would have no sense of humour about their condition. But a real atheist simply lacks a particular kind of belief because that belief seems neither reasonable or likely. They basically just do not care. Barry is just testing memes to see what happens when they are activated. We all have memes which are basically little snippets of mental routines our minds use. We trade them with each other, but for the most part these mental stances are just our opinions about the world around us and we tend to be be rather uncritical as to how well they really represent what is real, while at the same time taking them as reality itself. Take the TMO memes. On FFL, meditators and former meditators all at one time believed certain things about experience were at least possible, for example, that if you practice TM, which is not a religion, you will find God. The TMO memes specify that we are in a state of ignorance, not knowing the nature of reality. But were we actually in the state of ignorance, we would not have the capability to correctly evaluate what we were told because we would be using delusional thinking to evaluate ideas such as transcendence, states of consciousness and so forth, so our following this system of thought about reality would essentially be an act of insanity, that is, mental illness. The system defines us as in some way incapacitated in knowing what is real, and then expects us to just jump in, and accept what the system says is real. A discussion of the Kalam argument: Cosmological Kalamity http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html Cosmological Kalamity http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html Home » Library » Modern » Dan Barker » Cosmological Kalamity Dan Barker Daddy, if God made everything, who made God? my daughter Kristi asked me, when she was five years old. View on infidels.org http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html Preview by Yahoo ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Barry, Have you ever thought that atheism is also a belief-- and an unreasonable one at that? The Kalam Cosmological Argument should dispel any of your doubts.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Vatican votes against empathy....
Thanks, salyavin, good article. But I think the headline is pretty dumb. If one reads the Pope Francis' quote, it's obvious he's a winner. What the situation says to me is that wherever light is strongest, in this case Pope Francis, there too will the dark be strongest, in this case the bishops. On Monday, October 20, 2014 3:20 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving Pope Francis the loser Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving... Final report of Roman Catholic extraordinary synod on the family removes talk of ‘welcoming’ gay people View on www.theguardian.com Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Vatican votes against empathy....
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Thanks, salyavin, good article. But I think the headline is pretty dumb. If one reads the Pope Francis' quote, it's obvious he's a winner. What the situation says to me is that wherever light is strongest, in this case Pope Francis, there too will the dark be strongest, in this case the bishops. The single candle doesn't herald the dawn then? And my headline sums them up perfectly I think. A lot of people think you need religion to be moral, you don't, what you need is empathy. On Monday, October 20, 2014 3:20 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving Pope Francis the loser http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving... http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome Final report of Roman Catholic extraordinary synod on the family removes talk of ‘welcoming’ gay people View on www.theguardian.com Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
Yes, it is an awesome experience of quiet. The thickness of the silence. It is amazing how deep and seductive it gets. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
[FairfieldLife] Re: 6 Daily Habits Of The World's Most Successful CEOs
I read this earlier, and was happy to see that they meditate. They need it, and we need them to have it! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : 6 Daily Habits Of The World's Most Successful CEOs http://www.businessinsider.com/habits-of-successful-ceos-2014-10 http://www.businessinsider.com/habits-of-successful-ceos-2014-10 6 Daily Habits Of The World's Most Successful CEOs http://www.businessinsider.com/habits-of-successful-ceos-2014-10 If you want to get to the next level, try incorporating these strategies into your daily routine. View on www.businessinsider... http://www.businessinsider.com/habits-of-successful-ceos-2014-10 Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Vatican votes against empathy....
Not your headline, salyavin, The Guardian's, calling Pope Francis a loser. wrt your Subject line, I like that it highlights empathy. But the lack is in many of the bishops, not in the Pope. I think he's a ray of light in the Catholic Church. We'll see if the ray brings along other rays (-: On Monday, October 20, 2014 6:38 AM, Share Long sharelon...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Thanks, salyavin, good article. But I think the headline is pretty dumb. If one reads the Pope Francis' quote, it's obvious he's a winner. What the situation says to me is that wherever light is strongest, in this case Pope Francis, there too will the dark be strongest, in this case the bishops. On Monday, October 20, 2014 3:20 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving Pope Francis the loser Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving... Final report of Roman Catholic extraordinary synod on the family removes talk of ‘welcoming’ gay people View on www.theguardian.com Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
Sounds idyllic. I am considering another structure, here - something outside the fence, on a small rock plateau, overlooking the woods. I found a kit for a 10w x 7d x 9h structure, that will probably work, for under $2k, though I don't want to go to the trouble of putting in a concrete foundation. I have some spare deer cages for growing tomatoes and other plants. I may be able to turn them on their sides, as a metal floor support. For now, the RV is positioned well for wildlife viewing, though it is too big for that, permanently. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : Yes, pity all the city-dwellers who have no idea of what quiet is. There is a little church made of log built in the 1850's that still stands by itself amidst trees on a ridge-top that is one of those places of silence that people go visit to listen and hear the silence there. It is a place of pilgrimage for people who do not often know silence otherwise. It is quieting. A place to go. It is called Mars Hill. It is a special place that way, -Buck fleetwood_macncheese One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
This reminds me of a video I captured recently, of a deer feeding in my meadow, with the sun streaming like an umbrella of light, through the trees, at about 7:30 AM, two days ago. I will have to do a screen shot and show you, but the card is back in the camera at the moment, and I haven't copied it over yet. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, wrt light, for the past month or so I've become so aware of the sunlight, or any light for that matter. But the sunlight is so sublime, almost a living thing. Its silence is definitely a beautiful song. On Monday, October 20, 2014 5:57 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
On 10/19/2014 6:59 PM, jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: I have asked Curtis about his support or evidence for disagreeing with the statements in the Kalam Cosmological Argument. But he just gave me a lot of song and dance about his opinions without providing the evidence for his arguments. Can you give us a solid argument with evidence and support why the statements in the KCA have a flaw? Let's take the KCA which states: 1. Everything that begins to exist has a cause; 2. The universe began to exist; /Therefore/: 3. The universe has a cause. Do you agree with statement 1 or not? If not, please give us your reasons for disagreeing. 1. There was a big bang event. 2. This event has an uncaused cause. 3. Causation is known through consciousness. Notes: /Causality is the relation between an event and a second event in which the second event is a consequence of the first./ /Causation (karma) is the bedrock of the historical Buddha's enlightenment experience. At that moment he knew the law of cause and effect - the law of reciprocity in which every action inevitably leads to a reaction//. There are no chance events./ /He realized that everything happens for a reason, that for every event there is a cause./ Work cited: /Causality: The Central Philosophy of Buddhism/ by David J. Kalupahana University of Hawai'i Press, 1986
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: TM Free Excerpt
Lawson, the good news is that there is now a lot of discussion in FF, including on campus, about mental health. On Oct 5 there was a well attended public meeting on campus about these matters. One person called it history making. Many people in FF have now taken govt training in what's called Mental Health First Aid. There's a waiting list for future classes. The topic that MJ mentions came up in last week's town/gown meeting. There was so much discussion that this week there is a special meeting devoted to just this topic. Really, really good progress. On Sunday, October 19, 2014 1:52 PM, lengli...@cox.net [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Are you suggesting that people on this forum didn't already realize all these things? L ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : A little excerpt from a recent TM Free post: Fairfield residents have been dragging their feet around suicide prevention for years. This is due not only to the American stigma around mental illness. It is also exacerbated by TM official and unofficial doctrine. Just a few of them are: - Maharishi disapproved of Western psychotherapy. - If you saw a psychotherapist, you could be disqualified from attending a TM course. - TM is supposed to make you emotionally healthy, therefore if you report emotional problems, you are making TM look bad. - People with emotional problems have been advised to do more asanas or learn the TM-Sidhis, rather than to seek professional help. - People with emotional problems have been told they are unstressing rather than being advised to seek professional help. - When people have had emotional problems (including hospitalizations and suicides), the TM organization has tended to hide the information or blame the person for being too emotionally unstable to begin with. - People with emotional problems have been misdiagnosed by TMers as being in higher states of consciousness.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
Yes, they are both a piece of work. I think both of them take extreme views, in social settings, because both of them feel to be outsiders, in the world they inhabit. Their position reminds me of that of the most vociferous born again christians, often found proselytizing, while working minimum wage jobs. These are not successful people, Barry and Curtis. Both are white, from upper middle class backgrounds, privileged as American citizens, and each with a college degree. Yet, not a hill of beans, between them. I am not necessarily talking about material possessions, but things like strength of character, foresight, humility, social intelligence, and a simple ability to achieve that which they set out to do. All of this, is lacking in them. So, being emotionally immature, and intellectually lazy, they begin to show their discontent with society, that it hasn't rewarded them for their bad decisions. They profess atheism, and go all out against God, and enlightenment, and any sort of spiritual endeavor that they don't approve of. They see themselves failing by societies norms, and have now taken the position, that, You can't fire me, I quit! But, the argument that only they are right, and the rest of the world, as represented by the other members of this forum, is wrong, is clearly not sane thinking. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : The ignorant inquisitor.. 'It's not my experience so it does not exist!' Deltablues' technique is the old trick of the materialist's (orthodox) inquisitor, “Tell us, what exactly is your creed?” “Tell us in terms detailed such that we can understand and then the best of sophists of us will argue it out with you trying it point by point. Lot of people have been burned at the stake by uber-intellectualistic people like Deltablues is trying to be here on FFL. -Buck fleetwood_macncheese responding to Turqb: Bye, bye, Lenz, Jr. turquoiseb@... wrote : See what I mean? Curtis refuted John's idiotic argument point by point, and HE DIDN'T EVEN HEAR IT. The only thing he can do is repeat the same stupid thing he's already repeated -- and had refuted -- here on FFL dozens of time in the past. You really can't deal with anyone as dumb as this. I repeat my contention -- believing in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect really IS like winning the Trifecta of Idiocy. How does a mind *become* this weak? From: jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2014 1:59 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness Xeno, I have asked Curtis about his support or evidence for disagreeing with the statements in the Kalam Cosmological Argument. But he just gave me a lot of song and dance about his opinions without providing the evidence for his arguments. Can you give us a solid argument with evidence and support why the statements in the KCA have a flaw? Let's take the KCA which states: Everything that begins to exist has a cause; The universe began to exist; Therefore: The universe has a cause. Do you agree with statement 1 or not? If not, please give us your reasons for disagreeing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Logical arguments about ultimates always contain a flaw. You can reverse the form of the argument to support atheism and if you do not see the flaw, it will seem equally valid, that is, that atheism is true. Now there are some atheists who definitely believe there is no god and they can be as fanatical as a fundamentalist religionist. Probably they would have no sense of humour about their condition. But a real atheist simply lacks a particular kind of belief because that belief seems neither reasonable or likely. They basically just do not care. Barry is just testing memes to see what happens when they are activated. We all have memes which are basically little snippets of mental routines our minds use. We trade them with each other, but for the most part these mental stances are just our opinions about the world around us and we tend to be be rather uncritical as to how well they really represent what is real, while at the same time taking them as reality itself. Take the TMO memes. On FFL, meditators and former meditators all at one time believed certain things about experience were at least possible, for example, that if you practice TM, which is not a religion, you will find God. The TMO memes specify that we are in a state of ignorance, not knowing the nature of reality. But were we actually in the state of ignorance, we would not have the capability to correctly evaluate what we were told because we would be using delusional thinking to evaluate ideas such as transcendence, states of consciousness and so forth, so our following this system of thought about reality would essentially be an
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
Fleet, I'd love to see it...ok, now really rushing to Dome! On Monday, October 20, 2014 7:03 AM, fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: This reminds me of a video I captured recently, of a deer feeding in my meadow, with the sun streaming like an umbrella of light, through the trees, at about 7:30 AM, two days ago. I will have to do a screen shot and show you, but the card is back in the camera at the moment, and I haven't copied it over yet. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, wrt light, for the past month or so I've become so aware of the sunlight, or any light for that matter. But the sunlight is so sublime, almost a living thing. Its silence is definitely a beautiful song. On Monday, October 20, 2014 5:57 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Vatican votes against empathy....
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Not your headline, salyavin, The Guardian's, calling Pope Francis a loser. wrt your Subject line, I like that it highlights empathy. But the lack is in many of the bishops, not in the Pope. I think he's a ray of light in the Catholic Church. We'll see if the ray brings along other rays (-: Oh good. But he did lose the vote so that makes him a loser in this case, and being stuck in a hideous organisation like the Catholic church doesn't help him in the slightest as far as I'm concerned (all that guilt and blood drinking). If he wants to fight their bigotry he should leave and campaign for equality from the outside. But being a pope he's probably unlikely to do that, so slow change from within is a better bet. Bring on the rays, the dawn starts with just one if I remember correctly. But it must be weird living philosophically so far back in the middle ages all the time, I can't imagine it. They've got so much catching up to do, I suppose we should be thankful that they are even talking about joining the 21st century. BTW the green figure in the bottom right of the cartoon is a troll. The UK is thinking about quadrupling the jail term for offensive internet trolling making it up to 2 years! Another fine bit of public relations driven law making that's destined to be abused by whoever is in power. On Monday, October 20, 2014 6:38 AM, Share Long sharelong60@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Thanks, salyavin, good article. But I think the headline is pretty dumb. If one reads the Pope Francis' quote, it's obvious he's a winner. What the situation says to me is that wherever light is strongest, in this case Pope Francis, there too will the dark be strongest, in this case the bishops. On Monday, October 20, 2014 3:20 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving Pope Francis the loser http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving... http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome Final report of Roman Catholic extraordinary synod on the family removes talk of ‘welcoming’ gay people View on www.theguardian.com Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
Enjoy the dome! I may have to get up there one of these days, and fly around with y'all. I still have my badge, with my picture, taken in 1980, in a Missouri strawberry field, mid-Winter, looking bleary-eyed, with messy hair. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Fleet, I'd love to see it...ok, now really rushing to Dome! On Monday, October 20, 2014 7:03 AM, fleetwood_macncheese@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: This reminds me of a video I captured recently, of a deer feeding in my meadow, with the sun streaming like an umbrella of light, through the trees, at about 7:30 AM, two days ago. I will have to do a screen shot and show you, but the card is back in the camera at the moment, and I haven't copied it over yet. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, wrt light, for the past month or so I've become so aware of the sunlight, or any light for that matter. But the sunlight is so sublime, almost a living thing. Its silence is definitely a beautiful song. On Monday, October 20, 2014 5:57 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
You don't read their stuff, but i figured it would make your day to learn that Jim and Ann (both who claim that they are not obsessed with you) have been bragging about having read A WHOLE BOOK about Rama (the same one you told us about) so that they can obsess on you even more while trying to demonize you. You were right, this place is a zoo. On 10/20/2014 2:30 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Color me not surprised. I guess it gives them something to do other than whack off. :-) That's why you called our attention to your work with Lenz, right Apparently you has never read Laxer's /Take Me For A Ride/ where you are used as an example by Mark to indicate that you were a True Believer. I assumed this since I posted a long message about the book back in 2003 along with a review of Lenz's two novels, /Surfing the Himalayas/ and /Snowboarding to Nirvana./ Your response was very weak indicated to me that you didn't want to talk about your work for Lenz, so why are you so concerned now? Apparently one of your buttons got pushed. Go figure.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
When I read Laxter's, Take Me For A Ride, Coming Of Age In An Abusive Cult, I was trying to figure out if any of the characters were in fact, Barry, though Mark used pseudonyms. Which one is Barry? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, punditster@... wrote : You don't read their stuff, but i figured it would make your day to learn that Jim and Ann (both who claim that they are not obsessed with you) have been bragging about having read A WHOLE BOOK about Rama (the same one you told us about) so that they can obsess on you even more while trying to demonize you. You were right, this place is a zoo. On 10/20/2014 2:30 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoiseb@... mailto:turquoiseb@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: Color me not surprised. I guess it gives them something to do other than whack off. :-) That's why you called our attention to your work with Lenz, right Apparently you has never read Laxer's Take Me For A Ride where you are used as an example by Mark to indicate that you were a True Believer. I assumed this since I posted a long message about the book back in 2003 along with a review of Lenz's two novels, Surfing the Himalayas and Snowboarding to Nirvana. Your response was very weak indicated to me that you didn't want to talk about your work for Lenz, so why are you so concerned now? Apparently one of your buttons got pushed. Go figure.
[FairfieldLife] Panache Desai: New Interview on Buddha at the Gas Pump - 10/20/2014
https://gallery.mailchimp.com/62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5/images/7d6f5fc9-48d2-4cf2-a2a4-7dc581753771.jpg If you are not doing so already, please consider donating a few dollars a month to help offset basic expenses associated with hosting, MailChimp, etc. Of course, larger donations for other expenses are very much appreciated and needed. Donate button on http://batgap.us2.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=761fb4e1bee=16e07f16fe http://batgap.com. Updates from Buddha at the Gas Pump Interviews with Ordinary Spiritually Awakened People New interview posted 10/20/2014: * 254. Panache Desai http://batgap.us2.list-manage2.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=e9ca8c649ce=16e07f16fe 254. Panache Desai By Rick on Oct 19, 2014 01:04 pm Panache Desai is a contemporary thought leader and author whose message of love and acceptance has drawn thousands of people from around the world to his seminars and workshops. Not aligned with any religious or spiritual tradition, he empowers people … http://batgap.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=ff3f44db52e=16e07f16fe Continue reading → The post http://batgap.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=349ed4920ee=16e07f16fe 254. Panache Desai appeared first on http://batgap.us2.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=883c94ca5ee=16e07f16fe Buddha at the Gas Pump. http://batgap.us2.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=8eec1b9068e=16e07f16fe Read in browser » http://batgap.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=adf9003bd0e=16e07f16fe http://batgap.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=519ac2853ae=16e07f16fe Recent Interviews: http://batgap.us2.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=30bc0e5d46e=16e07f16fe 253. Teal Swan http://batgap.us2.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=5b93cd8587e=16e07f16fe 252. Judith Blackstone http://batgap.us2.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=8d1910a826e=16e07f16fe 251. Mirabai Devi http://batgap.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=3588f2dc1fe=16e07f16fe 250. Barbara Marx Hubbard http://batgap.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=3c3cdd0147e=16e07f16fe 249. Mukti Copyright © 2014 Buddha at the Gas Pump, All rights reserved. Regular announcement of new interviews posted at http://batgap.com. Our mailing address is: Buddha at the Gas Pump 1108 South B Street Fairfield, Iowa 52556 http://batgap.us2.list-manage1.com/vcard?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=b0e5d0d53a Add us to your address book http://batgap.us2.list-manage.com/track/open.php?u=62b7e50ba8598f35e2edf91d5id=22b663f3a5e=16e07f16fe
[FairfieldLife] Can you give me a ride from Cedar Rapids airport on Tuesday afternoon?
From: John Allon [mailto:jdal...@yahoo.com] Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2014 3:13 PM Subject: Can you give me a ride from Cedar Rapids airport on Tuesday afternoon? Friends, My apologies for the group e-mail, but I am sending many copies of this message and need a response quickly, so the message has to go out to each of you right away. Greetings from North Carolina. Rosanne and I finished a 1000-mile road trip to Durham on Friday night. I will be flying back to Iowa on Tuesday afternoon Oct 21, I need a ride from Cedar Rapids airport. My flight is scheduled to arrive at 12:45PM. Can you help? If you can't pick me up at 12:45, but you could do so somewhat later, I have 2 other options: 1. If you could arrive a bit later [45 min., 1 hour, etc], I could wait for you at the airport. 2. If you could come later in the afternoon, I can take a flight that arrives at 4:05PM [also could wait extra time for that flight]. Of course I will gladly cover your cost of gas for your car. If you don't have a car but can spare the time to pick me up, you can use my car, and I can arrange for you to get the key from my next door neighbor. If you need some compensation for your time, I can offer something modest, but I would like to avoid paying the $80/$100 (or more) charged by the paid ride services in Fairfield. If you are not free to help but know someone who could, please check with him/her as soon as possible and let me know by early evening today. Best way to reach me is to call 323-908-3239 [not a cell, but it's a number that will reach me (or voice mail) here in NC]. You can also reply via e-mail. Thanks in advance for taking the time to reply. Best regards, John
[FairfieldLife] Re: Why do people sound American when they sing in English?
I am fascinated with English and American accents, especially when each, does the other's. I have found that when English actors do American accents, they are far more successful, than the reverse. My reasoning is that the English are in general better actors, that they take the craft a bit more seriously. I have also read that when an American tries to sound, English, a native of England hears several distinct accents, from different areas of the country, and social strata, whereas 'American' has a more homogenized accent, and may be easier to emulate. The 17th century English accent in the sample, sounded Irish to me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : . And how to read Shakespeare correctly! 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Why English people sound American when they sing, and other intriguing linguistic theories View on www.telegraph.co.uk http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Xeno, Are you saying that the human mind would not be able to fathom the meaning of begins to exist? If that is so, how is it possible for you to begin and end a project at work or at home? But we know that NASA has been able to send the Curiosity rover to Mars which is a very high technological feat. So, it appears that humans know can understand the meaning of begins to exist. If not, NASA would not have been able to send the rover to Mars. I believe you're avoiding the question by claiming that you don't know what statement 1 of the KCA means. In other words, you're being disingenuous. Or, that you're pulling a Curtis on us. Maybe Xeno's perception of time isn't linear, which is entirely possible. Time seems to be a very human construct and for most people time is linear. We describe most things that are on this planet as having a start somehow, somewhere because previous to that start their existence was not in evidence for us. We can only speak and know from our ability to perceive and to know so this ascribing a beginning to something is logical. Frankly, I just think Xeno is dicking around with semantics here. On the other hand it is very possible that there is no such thing as time other than how we define it but the last time I looked most people own a clock or watch of some description and use it to get to where they have to be on time so most, apparently, are willing to agree that time is linear for all intents and earthly purposes. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Xeno, I have asked Curtis about his support or evidence for disagreeing with the statements in the Kalam Cosmological Argument. But he just gave me a lot of song and dance about his opinions without providing the evidence for his arguments. Can you give us a solid argument with evidence and support why the statements in the KCA have a flaw? Let's take the KCA which states: Everything that begins to exist has a cause; The universe began to exist; Therefore: The universe has a cause. Do you agree with statement 1 or not? If not, please give us your reasons for disagreeing.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : See what I mean? Curtis refuted John's idiotic argument point by point, and HE DIDN'T EVEN HEAR IT. The only thing he can do is repeat the same stupid thing he's already repeated -- and had refuted -- here on FFL dozens of time in the past. You really can't deal with anyone as dumb as this. I repeat my contention -- believing in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect really IS like winning the Trifecta of Idiocy. How does a mind *become* this weak? Look deeper, bend over further and use a mirror this time. I think it's still in there.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : You don't read their stuff, but i figured it would make your day to learn that Jim and Ann (both who claim that they are not obsessed with you) have been bragging about having read A WHOLE BOOK about Rama (the same one you told us about) so that they can obsess on you even more while trying to demonize you. You were right, this place is a zoo. Color me not surprised. I guess it gives them something to do other than whack off. :-) Hell no, I was whacking off while I was reading he book.
[FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet. It is very quiet at night where I live. No traffic noise at all. Traffic is responsible for virtually all the noise we hear around us. Check it out sometime and traffic noise when it's been raining is about four times louder.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, wrt light, for the past month or so I've become so aware of the sunlight, or any light for that matter. But the sunlight is so sublime, almost a living thing. Its silence is definitely a beautiful song. Sunlight at this time of year is less direct and has a yellower and oranger hue to it. Autumn sunlight has more color than summer sunlight. I notice it too. There is more than just leaf color and air temperature that distinguishes one time of the year from another. On Monday, October 20, 2014 5:57 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : When I read Laxter's, Take Me For A Ride, Coming Of Age In An Abusive Cult, I was trying to figure out if any of the characters were in fact, Barry, though Mark used pseudonyms. Which one is Barry? bawee has claimed in the intro to his own Road Mind Trip fluff piece that he was not anywhere close to the inner circle around Rama and didn't spend any time directly with him. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, punditster@... wrote : You don't read their stuff, but i figured it would make your day to learn that Jim and Ann (both who claim that they are not obsessed with you) have been bragging about having read A WHOLE BOOK about Rama (the same one you told us about) so that they can obsess on you even more while trying to demonize you. You were right, this place is a zoo. On 10/20/2014 2:30 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoiseb@... mailto:turquoiseb@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: Color me not surprised. I guess it gives them something to do other than whack off. :-) That's why you called our attention to your work with Lenz, right Apparently you has never read Laxer's Take Me For A Ride where you are used as an example by Mark to indicate that you were a True Believer. I assumed this since I posted a long message about the book back in 2003 along with a review of Lenz's two novels, Surfing the Himalayas and Snowboarding to Nirvana. Your response was very weak indicated to me that you didn't want to talk about your work for Lenz, so why are you so concerned now? Apparently one of your buttons got pushed. Go figure.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
You wish to offload the feelings you have in response to what someone says to you, about you, about others, to that someone for blame or revenge? In my experience, whether or not a person is nice or abusive, that person always distorts another person's values and ideas because no two minds are exactly alike. There can be superficial agreement, but if you dig deep enough, understandings, feelings etc., do not line up between two people. You are letting Barry get to you, he tried it with me too, and I took a step back and tried to analyse my response. As Barry does not seem to go about shooting others with firearms or stabbing them with knives, or attempting to ruin others nefariously by financial manipulation it seems possible to come to some accommodation. I found it was possible. I was never able to come to an accommodation with Judy Stein for example, although when I first came on here, she was friendly and Barry was hostile. There are certain affinities but they may be entirely superficial. He likes certain kinds of music. So do I, but we have different tastes. I pursued spirituality from basically an atheist point of view because I knew it was possible, and Barry seems to be in a non-religious space as well. Barry appears to like Curtis, and so do I. This thread, started by Barry, is wonderful for the kind of discussion that it can dredge up because it relates to ultimate questions about what we can know and tends to illuminate responses that give us an inkling of how other view the world. There is a terrible lack of humour in the religious world. The main affinity here is that all ideas are open to discussion here, and no ideas are sacrosanct. Barry would not give me a free ride were he to disagree with me about something. I have never met Barry (and logically therefore he has never met me); we live thousands of miles apart. I have seen a single rather grungy photo of him, apparently shot in Paris, one version in colour and the other in black and white on his linkedin page (you really should get a better shot Barry if you read this). If you really want to see repetitive button pushing behaviour and response you should watch the Jerry Springer show on TV. Marvellous primate studies of human mating behaviour. You cannot get much lower than this. At least here people think from time to time. Now if you think Barry is abusive, bitter, negative, and we suppose this were true, how much space would you allow him to vent his frustrations and give him the opportunity to grow? My first spiritual experiences came at the hands of one John Rosenberg (AKA Werner Erhard). I had no inkling that I was going to have a spiritual experience. He began his course by calling everyone in the room a bunch of god damn ass holes. The purpose was to elicit conditioned responses, and some took the bait. But the idea behind the method was to eventually within the course structure to get people to realise in their own experience how these conditioned responses situate themselves within and how they arise, and how to begin to deal with them. So what Barry does does not bother me, I have been dealing with my own conditioned responses going on half a century so I just do not care that you are seemingly upset. Being enlightened, you should know enough by now to deal with that yourself. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : I wasn't sure before, but you have clarified for me, that you are an enabler, of Barry's abusive behavior. There is nothing remotely helpful, or hinting, at cursing and insulting someone else, distorting their values and ideas. You really need to step back, and do a reality check. Barry is an abusive, bitter, and negative individual. Simply because he has learned to manipulate people for a predictably outraged response, does not mean this is positive, educational, or socially appropriate behavior. Where did you grow up, anyway? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : No, people become insulted. A person saying x might be interpreted by y as an insult, but interpreted by z as a helpful hint. Being insulted is a response. What to some might seem a pox on their cherished tradition others might see as a reasonable evaluation of idiotic beliefs, or even championing truth. You can swear at an anvil, and what does it do in response — nothing. You can berate someone in a language they do not speak, and while they might notice you are agitated, in not understanding the words, they will not responds as if it were an insult. So it is all in the interpretation. I have never said what Barry says is wisdom. It is what Barry says, that is all. People respond in different ways. He clearly knows enough about certain aspects of human nature to elicit the responses he gets on FFL. If I lived where he lived and saw him every day, I probably would have a better idea what he is like,
Re: [FairfieldLife] Vatican votes against empathy....
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Thanks, salyavin, good article. But I think the headline is pretty dumb. If one reads the Pope Francis' quote, it's obvious he's a winner. What the situation says to me is that wherever light is strongest, in this case Pope Francis, there too will the dark be strongest, in this case the bishops. The single candle doesn't herald the dawn then? And my headline sums them up perfectly I think. A lot of people think you need religion to be moral, you don't, what you need is empathy. I think Share meant the headline of the article, not your post 'headline'. On Monday, October 20, 2014 3:20 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving Pope Francis the loser http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving... http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome Final report of Roman Catholic extraordinary synod on the family removes talk of ‘welcoming’ gay people View on www.theguardian.com Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Yes, they are both a piece of work. I think both of them take extreme views, in social settings, because both of them feel to be outsiders, in the world they inhabit. Their position reminds me of that of the most vociferous born again christians, often found proselytizing, while working minimum wage jobs. These are not successful people, Barry and Curtis. Both are white, from upper middle class backgrounds, privileged as American citizens, and each with a college degree. Yet, not a hill of beans, between them. I am not necessarily talking about material possessions, but things like strength of character, foresight, humility, social intelligence, and a simple ability to achieve that which they set out to do. All of this, is lacking in them. So, being emotionally immature, and intellectually lazy, they begin to show their discontent with society, that it hasn't rewarded them for their bad decisions. They profess atheism, and go all out against God, and enlightenment, and any sort of spiritual endeavor that they don't approve of. They see themselves failing by societies norms, and have now taken the position, that, You can't fire me, I quit! But, the argument that only they are right, and the rest of the world, as represented by the other members of this forum, is wrong, is clearly not sane thinking. Not that it matters but I don't put Curtis anywhere in the same ball park as bawee. Although I don't agree with Curtis on some of his stances or his sometimes very acerbic way of communicating these stances I see Curtis as a creative guy, well versed in his passion of blues/music and who cares enough about the planet to be teaching and giving back to young people in a school district that doesn't appear to be a place that is a walk in the park. I also see Curtis as someone who has gotten softer and gentler here over the few short years I have been around. Just my unimportant and random opinion. Curtis is more than capable of a civilized and well thought out response whereas bawee has a chronic case of burr-up-his-ass that appears to be a terminal condition.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
Now if you think Barry is abusive, bitter, negative, and we suppose this were true, how much space would you allow him to vent his frustrations and give him the opportunity to grow? What you seem to forget is that the Turq has been doing his negative routine here for many years without showing any sign of growth. Quite the contrary, his attacts on fellow posters have become more intense after Judy left, and even more so after his traits were tracked back to his crazy guru by -fleetwood. He is showing all the signs of an old, bitter non-meditating man, unflexible and angry.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : You wish to offload the feelings you have in response to what someone says to you, about you, about others, to that someone for blame or revenge? In my experience, whether or not a person is nice or abusive, that person always distorts another person's values and ideas because no two minds are exactly alike. There can be superficial agreement, but if you dig deep enough, understandings, feelings etc., do not line up between two people. You are letting Barry get to you, he tried it with me too, and I took a step back and tried to analyse my response. As Barry does not seem to go about shooting others with firearms or stabbing them with knives, or attempting to ruin others nefariously by financial manipulation it seems possible to come to some accommodation. I found it was possible. I was never able to come to an accommodation with Judy Stein for example, although when I first came on here, she was friendly and Barry was hostile. There are certain affinities but they may be entirely superficial. He likes certain kinds of music. So do I, but we have different tastes. I pursued spirituality from basically an atheist point of view because I knew it was possible, and Barry seems to be in a non-religious space as well. Barry appears to like Curtis, and so do I. This thread, started by Barry, is wonderful for the kind of discussion that it can dredge up because it relates to ultimate questions about what we can know and tends to illuminate responses that give us an inkling of how other view the world. There is a terrible lack of humour in the religious world. The main affinity here is that all ideas are open to discussion here, and no ideas are sacrosanct. Barry would not give me a free ride were he to disagree with me about something. I have never met Barry (and logically therefore he has never met me); we live thousands of miles apart. I have seen a single rather grungy photo of him, apparently shot in Paris, one version in colour and the other in black and white on his linkedin page (you really should get a better shot Barry if you read this). If you really want to see repetitive button pushing behaviour and response you should watch the Jerry Springer show on TV. Marvellous primate studies of human mating behaviour. You cannot get much lower than this. At least here people think from time to time. Now if you think Barry is abusive, bitter, negative, and we suppose this were true, how much space would you allow him to vent his frustrations and give him the opportunity to grow? My first spiritual experiences came at the hands of one John Rosenberg (AKA Werner Erhard). I had no inkling that I was going to have a spiritual experience. He began his course by calling everyone in the room a bunch of god damn ass holes. The purpose was to elicit conditioned responses, and some took the bait. But the idea behind the method was to eventually within the course structure to get people to realise in their own experience how these conditioned responses situate themselves within and how they arise, and how to begin to deal with them. So what Barry does does not bother me, I have been dealing with my own conditioned responses going on half a century so I just do not care that you are seemingly upset. Being enlightened, you should know enough by now to deal with that yourself. From my side, if I want an abusive relationship with either a spouse or a spiritual teacher I'd go and find one on my own. I don't need bawee to provide this button pushing service for me. You're giving this asshat a free ride to spew his anger and frustration and just plain rotten manners all over without holding him responsible like any normal/decent human being. Cut with the dissertations, Xeno, sometimes you just have to realize some very simple facts. You're quite the apologist for him. It makes me think you played this enabling role in your family at some point. Did you have an alcoholic parent because that is a classic situation where this develops.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
Busking and begging for cents on the street-corners while singing the blues wasn't enough to provide him a descent living. The teaching job must have been sent from heaven !
Re: [FairfieldLife] Indian City Becomes First Vegetarian City in the World
As I recall, Rishikesh was the same in '73. No butchering or sale of meat. Not sure about eggs though. On Sunday, October 19, 2014 4:12 PM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: by Sarah Von Alt - Oct 8, 2014 Worldcrunch reports a historic change in Palitana, an Indian city, which has become the first all-vegetarian city in the world. Behind this revolutionary change are monks who went on a hunger strike to pressure the state of Gujarat to outlaw animal slaughter in their city. The hunger strike was successful and the Gujarat government imposed a ban on animal slaughter and outlawed the sale of meat and eggs. Indian City Becomes First Vegetarian City in the World Indian City Becomes First Vegetarian City in the World Animal slaughter and sale of meat and eggs outlawed. View on www.mfablog.org Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: Why do people sound American when they sing in English?
Same is true for a foreigner trying to sing in German. One of the worlds most famous interpreter of Schubert's lieder is an Irishman and it sounds awful in my ears. This is how it should sound, enjoy: Dietrich Fischer Dieskau Der Lindenbaum Die Winterreise https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyxMMg6bxrg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyxMMg6bxrg Dietrich Fischer Dieskau Der Lindenbaum Die Winterreise https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyxMMg6bxrg Dietrich Fischer Dieskau Der Lindenbaum Die Winterreise View on www.youtube.com https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyxMMg6bxrg Preview by Yahoo Schubert: Die Forelle (Fischer-Dieskau, Moore) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF9DrUXowBo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF9DrUXowBo Schubert: Die Forelle (Fischer-Dieskau,... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF9DrUXowBo In answer to a request... Schubert wrote no fewer than five versions of this song, and also based his Trout Quintet, D667 on it. It's a charming mini-drama, ... View on www.youtube.com https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF9DrUXowBo Preview by Yahoo ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : I am fascinated with English and American accents, especially when each, does the other's. I have found that when English actors do American accents, they are far more successful, than the reverse. My reasoning is that the English are in general better actors, that they take the craft a bit more seriously. I have also read that when an American tries to sound, English, a native of England hears several distinct accents, from different areas of the country, and social strata, whereas 'American' has a more homogenized accent, and may be easier to emulate. The 17th century English accent in the sample, sounded Irish to me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : . And how to read Shakespeare correctly! 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Why English people sound American when they sing, and other intriguing linguistic theories View on www.telegraph.co.uk http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Vatican votes against empathy....
salyavin, he actually commented that dissent is good and increased transparency is good. So those are also wins. Just to be really picky wicky (-: You kind of remind me of something my youngest sister said to me back in 2002 when I was leaving MUM campus. She asked why I didn't stay in the TMO and change from there. Now, 12 years later, I think I know why. I needed to become the change I want to see. My guess is Pope Francis is already highly developed and so can change from inside the org. What is the current jail term for trolling? On Monday, October 20, 2014 7:21 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Not your headline, salyavin, The Guardian's, calling Pope Francis a loser. wrt your Subject line, I like that it highlights empathy. But the lack is in many of the bishops, not in the Pope. I think he's a ray of light in the Catholic Church. We'll see if the ray brings along other rays (-: Oh good. But he did lose the vote so that makes him a loser in this case, and being stuck in a hideous organisation like the Catholic church doesn't help him in the slightest as far as I'm concerned (all that guilt and blood drinking). If he wants to fight their bigotry he should leave and campaign for equality from the outside. But being a pope he's probably unlikely to do that, so slow change from within is a better bet. Bring on the rays, the dawn starts with just one if I remember correctly. But it must be weird living philosophically so far back in the middle ages all the time, I can't imagine it. They've got so much catching up to do, I suppose we should be thankful that they are even talking about joining the 21st century. BTW the green figure in the bottom right of the cartoon is a troll. The UK is thinking about quadrupling the jail term for offensive internet trolling making it up to 2 years! Another fine bit of public relations driven law making that's destined to be abused by whoever is in power. On Monday, October 20, 2014 6:38 AM, Share Long sharelong60@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Thanks, salyavin, good article. But I think the headline is pretty dumb. If one reads the Pope Francis' quote, it's obvious he's a winner. What the situation says to me is that wherever light is strongest, in this case Pope Francis, there too will the dark be strongest, in this case the bishops. On Monday, October 20, 2014 3:20 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving Pope Francis the loser Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving... Final report of Roman Catholic extraordinary synod on the family removes talk of ‘welcoming’ gay people View on www.theguardian.comPreview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
I don't know what it means, explain it to me, as you seem to know what it
means. That NASA sent Curiosity to Mars is not logically connected to your
statement that 'it appears that humans know can understand the meaning of
begins to exist. You may have connected it in your mind, but not in the post.
In the link I provided, there are some criticisms of the Kalam argument, but
you have still not read them apparently.
For me some things exist. Other things do not. 'Begins to exist' seems
redundant. How does that work? What are the steps between non-existence and
existence? I have no clue. I suspect you do not either, but I am willing to
hear you out on this. You need to explain your position.
My position is this:
There is an essential value of existence. All things that exist have this
essential value. We can say there are things that do not exist but this is
meaningless as the essential value of existence is missing and therefore there
are no such things. We cannot know of them because they are not.
Curiosity exists and is on Mars. It exists because someone had a thought, and
then manipulated the extant universe to correspond to the thought. Where did
the thought come from? It appeared in someone's brain, how did it arise? There
was (we assume) prior activity in the person's brain before the thought arose.
Was it just a refashioning of previous neural events, or a spontaneous outlier
from out of nowhere? Everything Curiosity is made of was fashioned from
previously existing matter, already part of the currently extant universe.
Basically it is a sophisticated auto-mobile, but all its parts previously
existed in another form so can we really say it came into being, when its
components already had being?
The argument you seem to be proposing does not involve refashioning, so that
was not a good analogy. You need to explain your argument to me. What
specifically does 'begins to exist' mean in your context?
What is the difference in saying 'everything that exists has a cause' compared
to 'everything that begins to exist has a cause'? I tend to prefer 'everything
that exists has no cause'. Everything is just there. That is my position. I am
not sure you have a position, other than you want people to accept the Kalam
argument.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote :
Xeno,
Are you saying that the human mind would not be able to fathom the meaning of
begins to exist? If that is so, how is it possible for you to begin and end
a project at work or at home?
But we know that NASA has been able to send the Curiosity rover to Mars which
is a very high technological feat. So, it appears that humans know can
understand the meaning of begins to exist. If not, NASA would not have been
able to send the rover to Mars.
I believe you're avoiding the question by claiming that you don't know what
statement 1 of the KCA means. In other words, you're being disingenuous. Or,
that you're pulling a Curtis on us.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :
x exists x does not exist
I do not know what the phrase 'begins to exist' means, especially in regard to
the universe as a whole. If x were an auto-mobile, perhaps one could say that
when it was partially assembled, it began to exist, but all the components of
that were manufactured prior to that and merely gathered together with welds,
bolts, and glue. And those parts had precursors, ad infinitum (almost) to the
beginning of the universe, before which we have no knowledge, and in fact we
have only induction as to regard the early universe. And induction is logically
invalid.
The link I gave in the previous post did do some analysis why the Kalam
argument is flawed, apparently you did not read it. Here it is again:
Cosmological Kalamity
http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html
Cosmological Kalamity
http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html Home » Library »
Modern » Dan Barker » Cosmological Kalamity Dan Barker Daddy, if God made
everything, who made God? my daughter Kristi asked me, when she was five years
old.
View on infidels.org
http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html
Preview by Yahoo
I do not know how the universe began.
I do not know what 'begins to exist' means in this context, can you fill in
some detail?
If this were science, all I would have to do is wait for your demonstration of
the truth of the argument, but as it seems no one knows, I doubt this would be
forthcoming. As Curtis pointed out, proving a negative is impossible. It is a
time waster. In science one simply ignores those who do not show up with
evidence for their claims and thus science ('to know' is the meaning of the
word) only works with people who actively produce results.
For all I know the Kalam argument might be accidentally true, but essentially
I just find it unconvincing.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Ancient Petroglyph on Mars
Didn't Johnny Gray or is it Grey, write some book about men being from Mars? Ask him, he's done the research. On Monday, October 20, 2014 4:26 AM, Share Long sharelon...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: As many rocks are, these are beautiful, John and it's fun to consider about their origins. Thanks for posting. On Monday, October 20, 2014 1:31 AM, jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Were there humanoids living on Mars millions of years ago? http://www.examiner.com/article/mars-and-earth-have-same-ancient-man-rock-engraving-visitors-to-both-planets
Re: [FairfieldLife] Vatican votes against empathy....
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : salyavin, he actually commented that dissent is good and increased transparency is good. So those are also wins. Just to be really picky wicky (-: You kind of remind me of something my youngest sister said to me back in 2002 when I was leaving MUM campus. She asked why I didn't stay in the TMO and change from there. Now, 12 years later, I think I know why. I needed to become the change I want to see. My guess is Pope Francis is already highly developed and so can change from inside the org. What is the current jail term for trolling? 6 months, if you are really naughty to someone famous and the subsequent story hits the press. The government like to appear like they are doing something useful even though we've already got harassment and abusive behaviour laws. Inventing new crimes for these reasons never ends well, our anti-terrorism laws are vague enough that the police can arrest you for just about anything and hold you without charge for 36 hours, should they want to. This has been used on environmental protesters and a comedian who was about to give a talk on the arms trade. Hardly the intended targets but handy for the government. What I see here is a new way of controlling free speech about to get put on the statute books without anyone noticing. I believe the term is crisis capitalism, make the most out of something bad and tell everyone it's for their own good. On Monday, October 20, 2014 7:21 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Not your headline, salyavin, The Guardian's, calling Pope Francis a loser. wrt your Subject line, I like that it highlights empathy. But the lack is in many of the bishops, not in the Pope. I think he's a ray of light in the Catholic Church. We'll see if the ray brings along other rays (-: Oh good. But he did lose the vote so that makes him a loser in this case, and being stuck in a hideous organisation like the Catholic church doesn't help him in the slightest as far as I'm concerned (all that guilt and blood drinking). If he wants to fight their bigotry he should leave and campaign for equality from the outside. But being a pope he's probably unlikely to do that, so slow change from within is a better bet. Bring on the rays, the dawn starts with just one if I remember correctly. But it must be weird living philosophically so far back in the middle ages all the time, I can't imagine it. They've got so much catching up to do, I suppose we should be thankful that they are even talking about joining the 21st century. BTW the green figure in the bottom right of the cartoon is a troll. The UK is thinking about quadrupling the jail term for offensive internet trolling making it up to 2 years! Another fine bit of public relations driven law making that's destined to be abused by whoever is in power. On Monday, October 20, 2014 6:38 AM, Share Long sharelong60@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Thanks, salyavin, good article. But I think the headline is pretty dumb. If one reads the Pope Francis' quote, it's obvious he's a winner. What the situation says to me is that wherever light is strongest, in this case Pope Francis, there too will the dark be strongest, in this case the bishops. On Monday, October 20, 2014 3:20 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving Pope Francis the loser http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving... http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/18/catholic-bishops-backtrack-on-gay-welcome Final report of Roman Catholic extraordinary synod on the family removes talk of ‘welcoming’ gay people View on www.theguardian.com Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
God would not make bitter, angry, inflexible curmudgeons if He in is sublime glory did not want it so. Let Thy will be done. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Now if you think Barry is abusive, bitter, negative, and we suppose this were true, how much space would you allow him to vent his frustrations and give him the opportunity to grow? What you seem to forget is that the Turq has been doing his negative routine here for many years without showing any sign of growth. Quite the contrary, his attacts on fellow posters have become more intense after Judy left, and even more so after his traits were tracked back to his crazy guru by -fleetwood. He is showing all the signs of an old, bitter non-meditating man, unflexible and angry.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
Yep, I notice the deeper color of the sun, too. And the radically shortening days! Less than 12 hours of light, now. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, wrt light, for the past month or so I've become so aware of the sunlight, or any light for that matter. But the sunlight is so sublime, almost a living thing. Its silence is definitely a beautiful song. Sunlight at this time of year is less direct and has a yellower and oranger hue to it. Autumn sunlight has more color than summer sunlight. I notice it too. There is more than just leaf color and air temperature that distinguishes one time of the year from another. On Monday, October 20, 2014 5:57 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Why do people sound American when they sing in English?
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : I am fascinated with English and American accents, especially when each, does the other's. I have found that when English actors do American accents, they are far more successful, than the reverse. My reasoning is that the English are in general better actors, that they take the craft a bit more seriously I think we're just better at everything ;-) I know what you mean, the upper class English accent is the easiest to pull off for an American as it's so cartoon-ish anyway. The Americans I know can't say mate so maybe there's a bigger difference in the way we speak than we realise. I have also read that when an American tries to sound, English, a native of England hears several distinct accents, from different areas of the country, and social strata, whereas 'American' has a more homogenized accent, and may be easier to emulate. The 17th century English accent in the sample, sounded Irish to me. The Shakespeare dialect there sounded more reminiscent of the west country, from Devon or Cornwall. But not Irish to me, and Ireland has a big variations in its regions too, I'm sure Share will back me up in that. Compare Galway to Belfast, amazing. England apparently has 44 regional accents. The theory is that they evolved in isolation from each other whereas the US accent evolved after railways had been invented so there was more cross over and connection with other parts of the country and thus only small differences by comparison. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : . And how to read Shakespeare correctly! 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Why English people sound American when they sing, and other intriguing linguistic theories View on www.telegraph.co.uk http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
Ann, here are some more reasons to love how nature works: the leaves of trees take on warmer colors in the autumn, as the air becomes cooler; trees become bare in the winter so that more sunlight can reach us with its warmth; in summer the leaves are plentiful and thus shade us from the sun; and in spring, that gorgeous green helps us detox after a slothful winter. (In Chinese medicine green is the color that helps the liver.) On Monday, October 20, 2014 8:54 AM, awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, wrt light, for the past month or so I've become so aware of the sunlight, or any light for that matter. But the sunlight is so sublime, almost a living thing. Its silence is definitely a beautiful song. Sunlight at this time of year is less direct and has a yellower and oranger hue to it. Autumn sunlight has more color than summer sunlight. I notice it too. There is more than just leaf color and air temperature that distinguishes one time of the year from another. On Monday, October 20, 2014 5:57 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
Yes, but this is merely to foster Barry's image of himself. There were a few contradictory clues to that, in Mark's book. Watch when all of the purges occurred in Lenz's organization, and how those that were left, had to swear absolute fealty to Lenz, with deeper and deeper loyalty, each time the group was purged. Barry made it through all of the purges, and that speaks for itself. Also, Barry was more than likely kicked out of the organization, since that was another Lenz hallmark, when a chump wanted to leave. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : When I read Laxter's, Take Me For A Ride, Coming Of Age In An Abusive Cult, I was trying to figure out if any of the characters were in fact, Barry, though Mark used pseudonyms. Which one is Barry? bawee has claimed in the intro to his own Road Mind Trip fluff piece that he was not anywhere close to the inner circle around Rama and didn't spend any time directly with him. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, punditster@... wrote : You don't read their stuff, but i figured it would make your day to learn that Jim and Ann (both who claim that they are not obsessed with you) have been bragging about having read A WHOLE BOOK about Rama (the same one you told us about) so that they can obsess on you even more while trying to demonize you. You were right, this place is a zoo. On 10/20/2014 2:30 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoiseb@... mailto:turquoiseb@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: Color me not surprised. I guess it gives them something to do other than whack off. :-) That's why you called our attention to your work with Lenz, right Apparently you has never read Laxer's Take Me For A Ride where you are used as an example by Mark to indicate that you were a True Believer. I assumed this since I posted a long message about the book back in 2003 along with a review of Lenz's two novels, Surfing the Himalayas and Snowboarding to Nirvana. Your response was very weak indicated to me that you didn't want to talk about your work for Lenz, so why are you so concerned now? Apparently one of your buttons got pushed. Go figure.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
I think you are on the right track Ann. Particularly nettle-some in a discussion of ultimate origins is time. In current cosmology, time-space did not exist prior to the universe, therefore there was no time before the universe's beginning and it is meaningless to speak of events or anything as 'having been before'. It is really difficult to wrap the mind around a situation like this because it makes no sense in terms of common experience. Maybe it will never make sense. Semantics are important in fashioning an argument, but it is difficult to do this if the basic ideas are really beyond our ability to conceptualise. You have already demonstrated here that you have a clearer grasp of this discussion than jr-esq, though you do not strike me as a philosopher. Arguments in the absence of evidence are difficult. This happens in science sometimes, but there are usually good reasons to suppose something in this way. Tell you what, I will sell you my silver-white unicorn for $320,000 Canadian. Payment before delivery. We all know that unicorns exist because we can think and imagine what they look like. They prefer halters by the way, if you want to ride. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Xeno, Are you saying that the human mind would not be able to fathom the meaning of begins to exist? If that is so, how is it possible for you to begin and end a project at work or at home? But we know that NASA has been able to send the Curiosity rover to Mars which is a very high technological feat. So, it appears that humans know can understand the meaning of begins to exist. If not, NASA would not have been able to send the rover to Mars. I believe you're avoiding the question by claiming that you don't know what statement 1 of the KCA means. In other words, you're being disingenuous. Or, that you're pulling a Curtis on us. Maybe Xeno's perception of time isn't linear, which is entirely possible. Time seems to be a very human construct and for most people time is linear. We describe most things that are on this planet as having a start somehow, somewhere because previous to that start their existence was not in evidence for us. We can only speak and know from our ability to perceive and to know so this ascribing a beginning to something is logical. Frankly, I just think Xeno is dicking around with semantics here. On the other hand it is very possible that there is no such thing as time other than how we define it but the last time I looked most people own a clock or watch of some description and use it to get to where they have to be on time so most, apparently, are willing to agree that time is linear for all intents and earthly purposes. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Xeno, I have asked Curtis about his support or evidence for disagreeing with the statements in the Kalam Cosmological Argument. But he just gave me a lot of song and dance about his opinions without providing the evidence for his arguments. Can you give us a solid argument with evidence and support why the statements in the KCA have a flaw? Let's take the KCA which states: Everything that begins to exist has a cause; The universe began to exist; Therefore: The universe has a cause. Do you agree with statement 1 or not? If not, please give us your reasons for disagreeing.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
Sometimes I like to pretend people can read lips. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote : See what I mean? Curtis refuted John's idiotic argument point by point, and HE DIDN'T EVEN HEAR IT. The only thing he can do is repeat the same stupid thing he's already repeated -- and had refuted -- here on FFL dozens of time in the past. You really can't deal with anyone as dumb as this. I repeat my contention -- believing in astrology, God, and the Maharishi Effect really IS like winning the Trifecta of Idiocy. How does a mind *become* this weak? From: jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2014 1:59 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness Xeno, I have asked Curtis about his support or evidence for disagreeing with the statements in the Kalam Cosmological Argument. But he just gave me a lot of song and dance about his opinions without providing the evidence for his arguments. Can you give us a solid argument with evidence and support why the statements in the KCA have a flaw? Let's take the KCA which states: Everything that begins to exist has a cause; The universe began to exist; Therefore: The universe has a cause. Do you agree with statement 1 or not? If not, please give us your reasons for disagreeing. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : Logical arguments about ultimates always contain a flaw. You can reverse the form of the argument to support atheism and if you do not see the flaw, it will seem equally valid, that is, that atheism is true. Now there are some atheists who definitely believe there is no god and they can be as fanatical as a fundamentalist religionist. Probably they would have no sense of humour about their condition. But a real atheist simply lacks a particular kind of belief because that belief seems neither reasonable or likely. They basically just do not care. Barry is just testing memes to see what happens when they are activated. We all have memes which are basically little snippets of mental routines our minds use. We trade them with each other, but for the most part these mental stances are just our opinions about the world around us and we tend to be be rather uncritical as to how well they really represent what is real, while at the same time taking them as reality itself. Take the TMO memes. On FFL, meditators and former meditators all at one time believed certain things about experience were at least possible, for example, that if you practice TM, which is not a religion, you will find God. The TMO memes specify that we are in a state of ignorance, not knowing the nature of reality. But were we actually in the state of ignorance, we would not have the capability to correctly evaluate what we were told because we would be using delusional thinking to evaluate ideas such as transcendence, states of consciousness and so forth, so our following this system of thought about reality would essentially be an act of insanity, that is, mental illness. The system defines us as in some way incapacitated in knowing what is real, and then expects us to just jump in, and accept what the system says is real. A discussion of the Kalam argument: Cosmological Kalamity http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html Cosmological Kalamity http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html Home » Library » Modern » Dan Barker » Cosmological Kalamity Dan Barker Daddy, if God made everything, who made God? my daughter Kristi asked me, when she was five years old. View on infidels.org http://infidels.org/library/modern/dan_barker/kalamity.html Preview by Yahoo ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Barry, Have you ever thought that atheism is also a belief-- and an unreasonable one at that? The Kalam Cosmological Argument should dispel any of your doubts.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
I agree, Ann. As I mentioned earlier, there is nothing helpful, educational, or socially acceptable in the way Barry acts, and that should be plainly obvious. Pointing it out is a normal response, much as I would comment to my wife and others, were Barry ranting and abusing others, in the supermarket. What Taxius doesn't see, if that this character isn't Barry at all, but a brainwashed analog of the spiritual criminal, Freddie Lenz. Poor Barry hasn't had an original thought in his head, post-Lenz. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : You wish to offload the feelings you have in response to what someone says to you, about you, about others, to that someone for blame or revenge? In my experience, whether or not a person is nice or abusive, that person always distorts another person's values and ideas because no two minds are exactly alike. There can be superficial agreement, but if you dig deep enough, understandings, feelings etc., do not line up between two people. You are letting Barry get to you, he tried it with me too, and I took a step back and tried to analyse my response. As Barry does not seem to go about shooting others with firearms or stabbing them with knives, or attempting to ruin others nefariously by financial manipulation it seems possible to come to some accommodation. I found it was possible. I was never able to come to an accommodation with Judy Stein for example, although when I first came on here, she was friendly and Barry was hostile. There are certain affinities but they may be entirely superficial. He likes certain kinds of music. So do I, but we have different tastes. I pursued spirituality from basically an atheist point of view because I knew it was possible, and Barry seems to be in a non-religious space as well. Barry appears to like Curtis, and so do I. This thread, started by Barry, is wonderful for the kind of discussion that it can dredge up because it relates to ultimate questions about what we can know and tends to illuminate responses that give us an inkling of how other view the world. There is a terrible lack of humour in the religious world. The main affinity here is that all ideas are open to discussion here, and no ideas are sacrosanct. Barry would not give me a free ride were he to disagree with me about something. I have never met Barry (and logically therefore he has never met me); we live thousands of miles apart. I have seen a single rather grungy photo of him, apparently shot in Paris, one version in colour and the other in black and white on his linkedin page (you really should get a better shot Barry if you read this). If you really want to see repetitive button pushing behaviour and response you should watch the Jerry Springer show on TV. Marvellous primate studies of human mating behaviour. You cannot get much lower than this. At least here people think from time to time. Now if you think Barry is abusive, bitter, negative, and we suppose this were true, how much space would you allow him to vent his frustrations and give him the opportunity to grow? My first spiritual experiences came at the hands of one John Rosenberg (AKA Werner Erhard). I had no inkling that I was going to have a spiritual experience. He began his course by calling everyone in the room a bunch of god damn ass holes. The purpose was to elicit conditioned responses, and some took the bait. But the idea behind the method was to eventually within the course structure to get people to realise in their own experience how these conditioned responses situate themselves within and how they arise, and how to begin to deal with them. So what Barry does does not bother me, I have been dealing with my own conditioned responses going on half a century so I just do not care that you are seemingly upset. Being enlightened, you should know enough by now to deal with that yourself. From my side, if I want an abusive relationship with either a spouse or a spiritual teacher I'd go and find one on my own. I don't need bawee to provide this button pushing service for me. You're giving this asshat a free ride to spew his anger and frustration and just plain rotten manners all over without holding him responsible like any normal/decent human being. Cut with the dissertations, Xeno, sometimes you just have to realize some very simple facts. You're quite the apologist for him. It makes me think you played this enabling role in your family at some point. Did you have an alcoholic parent because that is a classic situation where this develops.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
Fleet, I think you and your wife would thoroughly enjoy FF. But be sure to come for First Friday Art Walk any month...hmmm, maybe better wait for April! On Monday, October 20, 2014 7:28 AM, fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Enjoy the dome! I may have to get up there one of these days, and fly around with y'all. I still have my badge, with my picture, taken in 1980, in a Missouri strawberry field, mid-Winter, looking bleary-eyed, with messy hair. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Fleet, I'd love to see it...ok, now really rushing to Dome! On Monday, October 20, 2014 7:03 AM, fleetwood_macncheese@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: This reminds me of a video I captured recently, of a deer feeding in my meadow, with the sun streaming like an umbrella of light, through the trees, at about 7:30 AM, two days ago. I will have to do a screen shot and show you, but the card is back in the camera at the moment, and I haven't copied it over yet. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, wrt light, for the past month or so I've become so aware of the sunlight, or any light for that matter. But the sunlight is so sublime, almost a living thing. Its silence is definitely a beautiful song. On Monday, October 20, 2014 5:57 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Vatican votes against empathy....
salyavin, again what I notice is that as transparency increases, so too do the attempts to squelch it. But fortunately some of these movements are like giant snowballs rolling down a snowy mountain. Ain't nothing gonna stop them! On Monday, October 20, 2014 9:41 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : salyavin, he actually commented that dissent is good and increased transparency is good. So those are also wins. Just to be really picky wicky (-: You kind of remind me of something my youngest sister said to me back in 2002 when I was leaving MUM campus. She asked why I didn't stay in the TMO and change from there. Now, 12 years later, I think I know why. I needed to become the change I want to see. My guess is Pope Francis is already highly developed and so can change from inside the org. What is the current jail term for trolling? 6 months, if you are really naughty to someone famous and the subsequent story hits the press. The government like to appear like they are doing something useful even though we've already got harassment and abusive behaviour laws. Inventing new crimes for these reasons never ends well, our anti-terrorism laws are vague enough that the police can arrest you for just about anything and hold you without charge for 36 hours, should they want to. This has been used on environmental protesters and a comedian who was about to give a talk on the arms trade. Hardly the intended targets but handy for the government. What I see here is a new way of controlling free speech about to get put on the statute books without anyone noticing. I believe the term is crisis capitalism, make the most out of something bad and tell everyone it's for their own good. On Monday, October 20, 2014 7:21 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Not your headline, salyavin, The Guardian's, calling Pope Francis a loser. wrt your Subject line, I like that it highlights empathy. But the lack is in many of the bishops, not in the Pope. I think he's a ray of light in the Catholic Church. We'll see if the ray brings along other rays (-: Oh good. But he did lose the vote so that makes him a loser in this case, and being stuck in a hideous organisation like the Catholic church doesn't help him in the slightest as far as I'm concerned (all that guilt and blood drinking). If he wants to fight their bigotry he should leave and campaign for equality from the outside. But being a pope he's probably unlikely to do that, so slow change from within is a better bet. Bring on the rays, the dawn starts with just one if I remember correctly. But it must be weird living philosophically so far back in the middle ages all the time, I can't imagine it. They've got so much catching up to do, I suppose we should be thankful that they are even talking about joining the 21st century. BTW the green figure in the bottom right of the cartoon is a troll. The UK is thinking about quadrupling the jail term for offensive internet trolling making it up to 2 years! Another fine bit of public relations driven law making that's destined to be abused by whoever is in power. On Monday, October 20, 2014 6:38 AM, Share Long sharelong60@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Thanks, salyavin, good article. But I think the headline is pretty dumb. If one reads the Pope Francis' quote, it's obvious he's a winner. What the situation says to me is that wherever light is strongest, in this case Pope Francis, there too will the dark be strongest, in this case the bishops. On Monday, October 20, 2014 3:20 AM, salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving Pope Francis the loser Catholic bishops veto gay-friendly statements leaving... Final report of Roman Catholic extraordinary synod on the family removes talk of ‘welcoming’ gay people View on www.theguardian.comPreview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Ann, here are some more reasons to love how nature works: the leaves of trees take on warmer colors in the autumn, as the air becomes cooler; trees become bare in the winter so that more sunlight can reach us with its warmth; in summer the leaves are plentiful and thus shade us from the sun; and in spring, that gorgeous green helps us detox after a slothful winter. (In Chinese medicine green is the color that helps the liver.) It would be nice to think that nature is designed to accommodate us like that, that we are the equivalent of the center of nature's universe. In that way, hopefully without being too egocentric, we can continue to view nature as generous, gentle and nourishing. On Monday, October 20, 2014 8:54 AM, awoelflebater@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, wrt light, for the past month or so I've become so aware of the sunlight, or any light for that matter. But the sunlight is so sublime, almost a living thing. Its silence is definitely a beautiful song. Sunlight at this time of year is less direct and has a yellower and oranger hue to it. Autumn sunlight has more color than summer sunlight. I notice it too. There is more than just leaf color and air temperature that distinguishes one time of the year from another. On Monday, October 20, 2014 5:57 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
No problem, however, God also, in His sublime glory, allows me to see Barry as the bitter, abusive, clueless, angry, broke, unhappy, emotionally stunted, romantically empty, little nobody, that he is! Yes, Praise God! Let Thy Will Be Done! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : God would not make bitter, angry, inflexible curmudgeons if He in is sublime glory did not want it so. Let Thy will be done. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Now if you think Barry is abusive, bitter, negative, and we suppose this were true, how much space would you allow him to vent his frustrations and give him the opportunity to grow? What you seem to forget is that the Turq has been doing his negative routine here for many years without showing any sign of growth. Quite the contrary, his attacts on fellow posters have become more intense after Judy left, and even more so after his traits were tracked back to his crazy guru by -fleetwood. He is showing all the signs of an old, bitter non-meditating man, unflexible and angry.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
Yes, I have not been there, since 1992. I am sure there have been a few changes. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Fleet, I think you and your wife would thoroughly enjoy FF. But be sure to come for First Friday Art Walk any month...hmmm, maybe better wait for April! On Monday, October 20, 2014 7:28 AM, fleetwood_macncheese@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Enjoy the dome! I may have to get up there one of these days, and fly around with y'all. I still have my badge, with my picture, taken in 1980, in a Missouri strawberry field, mid-Winter, looking bleary-eyed, with messy hair. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Fleet, I'd love to see it...ok, now really rushing to Dome! On Monday, October 20, 2014 7:03 AM, fleetwood_macncheese@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: This reminds me of a video I captured recently, of a deer feeding in my meadow, with the sun streaming like an umbrella of light, through the trees, at about 7:30 AM, two days ago. I will have to do a screen shot and show you, but the card is back in the camera at the moment, and I haven't copied it over yet. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, wrt light, for the past month or so I've become so aware of the sunlight, or any light for that matter. But the sunlight is so sublime, almost a living thing. Its silence is definitely a beautiful song. On Monday, October 20, 2014 5:57 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Yes, but this is merely to foster Barry's image of himself. There were a few contradictory clues to that, in Mark's book. Watch when all of the purges occurred in Lenz's organization, and how those that were left, had to swear absolute fealty to Lenz, with deeper and deeper loyalty, each time the group was purged. Barry made it through all of the purges, and that speaks for itself. Also, Barry was more than likely kicked out of the organization, since that was another Lenz hallmark, when a chump wanted to leave. Some interesting excerpts from bawee's little memoir: I never put much serious effort into writing stories about my spiritual experiences for publication. I just wrote them for myself. And of course, being the somewhat ego-centered individual that I am, many of these stories weren't about Rama at all - they were about me. They were about the cool moments that I had experienced while pursuing my own weird pathway to enlightenment. The stories are not about Rama per se. Other, more talented and less egocentric writers will create those books. These are just the stories of a normal, everyday seeker who was fortunate enough to have had some remarkable experiences in the aura of a remarkable teacher. Don't expect revelations or gossip from an insider or member of the 'inner circle.' I wasn't that great a student, and had very few personal interactions with the man. And many of them were in public restrooms. So the stories are mine, but if he was the excellent teacher I believe he was, his teaching should somehow reveal itself in these stories about my life. Because he helped shape that life, and I am grateful to him for his skill and craftsmanship.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
No alcoholics in my immediate family. Sometimes I just like crusty old bastards. I have to shut down now. I have a couple of prescriptions I have to fill at the local hospital. They want to stick some needles in this old body of mine so they can construct a time line to the grave. There was no one in my family like Barry by the way. My best friend, who lives several thousands of miles away, whom I met in what is here called middle school, is a crusty old atheist scientist. He has no conception of spirituality at all and never seems interested in philosophical discussions. So this place, FFL, provides an opportunity for discussion, with its varied and mostly insane clientèle. Perhaps I am a lawyer; every scoundrel deserves a defence; would you deny Barry counsel? Free speech has a hard, sharp edge to it, especially to wimpy, contracted minds unaccustomed to thinking. You do all right though, there is hope for you. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : You wish to offload the feelings you have in response to what someone says to you, about you, about others, to that someone for blame or revenge? In my experience, whether or not a person is nice or abusive, that person always distorts another person's values and ideas because no two minds are exactly alike. There can be superficial agreement, but if you dig deep enough, understandings, feelings etc., do not line up between two people. You are letting Barry get to you, he tried it with me too, and I took a step back and tried to analyse my response. As Barry does not seem to go about shooting others with firearms or stabbing them with knives, or attempting to ruin others nefariously by financial manipulation it seems possible to come to some accommodation. I found it was possible. I was never able to come to an accommodation with Judy Stein for example, although when I first came on here, she was friendly and Barry was hostile. There are certain affinities but they may be entirely superficial. He likes certain kinds of music. So do I, but we have different tastes. I pursued spirituality from basically an atheist point of view because I knew it was possible, and Barry seems to be in a non-religious space as well. Barry appears to like Curtis, and so do I. This thread, started by Barry, is wonderful for the kind of discussion that it can dredge up because it relates to ultimate questions about what we can know and tends to illuminate responses that give us an inkling of how other view the world. There is a terrible lack of humour in the religious world. The main affinity here is that all ideas are open to discussion here, and no ideas are sacrosanct. Barry would not give me a free ride were he to disagree with me about something. I have never met Barry (and logically therefore he has never met me); we live thousands of miles apart. I have seen a single rather grungy photo of him, apparently shot in Paris, one version in colour and the other in black and white on his linkedin page (you really should get a better shot Barry if you read this). If you really want to see repetitive button pushing behaviour and response you should watch the Jerry Springer show on TV. Marvellous primate studies of human mating behaviour. You cannot get much lower than this. At least here people think from time to time. Now if you think Barry is abusive, bitter, negative, and we suppose this were true, how much space would you allow him to vent his frustrations and give him the opportunity to grow? My first spiritual experiences came at the hands of one John Rosenberg (AKA Werner Erhard). I had no inkling that I was going to have a spiritual experience. He began his course by calling everyone in the room a bunch of god damn ass holes. The purpose was to elicit conditioned responses, and some took the bait. But the idea behind the method was to eventually within the course structure to get people to realise in their own experience how these conditioned responses situate themselves within and how they arise, and how to begin to deal with them. So what Barry does does not bother me, I have been dealing with my own conditioned responses going on half a century so I just do not care that you are seemingly upset. Being enlightened, you should know enough by now to deal with that yourself. From my side, if I want an abusive relationship with either a spouse or a spiritual teacher I'd go and find one on my own. I don't need bawee to provide this button pushing service for me. You're giving this asshat a free ride to spew his anger and frustration and just plain rotten manners all over without holding him responsible like any normal/decent human being. Cut with the dissertations, Xeno, sometimes you just have to realize some very simple facts. You're quite the apologist for him. It makes me think you played this
Re: [FairfieldLife] Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
Things have seriously taken a turn for the worse, since then. Perhaps it has slowly dawned on him, how much he was damaged by Lenz, in terms of relating to normal people, in a normal way. Or not.:-o ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Yes, but this is merely to foster Barry's image of himself. There were a few contradictory clues to that, in Mark's book. Watch when all of the purges occurred in Lenz's organization, and how those that were left, had to swear absolute fealty to Lenz, with deeper and deeper loyalty, each time the group was purged. Barry made it through all of the purges, and that speaks for itself. Also, Barry was more than likely kicked out of the organization, since that was another Lenz hallmark, when a chump wanted to leave. Some interesting excerpts from bawee's little memoir: I never put much serious effort into writing stories about my spiritual experiences for publication. I just wrote them for myself. And of course, being the somewhat ego-centered individual that I am, many of these stories weren't about Rama at all - they were about me. They were about the cool moments that I had experienced while pursuing my own weird pathway to enlightenment. The stories are not about Rama per se. Other, more talented and less egocentric writers will create those books. These are just the stories of a normal, everyday seeker who was fortunate enough to have had some remarkable experiences in the aura of a remarkable teacher. Don't expect revelations or gossip from an insider or member of the 'inner circle.' I wasn't that great a student, and had very few personal interactions with the man. And many of them were in public restrooms. So the stories are mine, but if he was the excellent teacher I believe he was, his teaching should somehow reveal itself in these stories about my life. Because he helped shape that life, and I am grateful to him for his skill and craftsmanship.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Thanks for the heads-up, lurking reporter
Things have seriously taken a turn for the worse, since then. Perhaps it has slowly dawned on him, how much he was damaged by Lenz, in terms of relating to normal people, in a normal way. Or not.:-o ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : Yes, but this is merely to foster Barry's image of himself. There were a few contradictory clues to that, in Mark's book. Watch when all of the purges occurred in Lenz's organization, and how those that were left, had to swear absolute fealty to Lenz, with deeper and deeper loyalty, each time the group was purged. Barry made it through all of the purges, and that speaks for itself. Also, Barry was more than likely kicked out of the organization, since that was another Lenz hallmark, when a chump wanted to leave. Some interesting excerpts from bawee's little memoir: I never put much serious effort into writing stories about my spiritual experiences for publication. I just wrote them for myself. And of course, being the somewhat ego-centered individual that I am, many of these stories weren't about Rama at all - they were about me. They were about the cool moments that I had experienced while pursuing my own weird pathway to enlightenment. The stories are not about Rama per se. Other, more talented and less egocentric writers will create those books. These are just the stories of a normal, everyday seeker who was fortunate enough to have had some remarkable experiences in the aura of a remarkable teacher. Don't expect revelations or gossip from an insider or member of the 'inner circle.' I wasn't that great a student, and had very few personal interactions with the man. And many of them were in public restrooms. So the stories are mine, but if he was the excellent teacher I believe he was, his teaching should somehow reveal itself in these stories about my life. Because he helped shape that life, and I am grateful to him for his skill and craftsmanship.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Vegetarians have much lower sperm counts
Which explains why India has such a small population. :-D On 10/20/2014 12:50 AM, salyavin808 wrote: There's always a catch Vegetarians have much lower sperm counts - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/active/mens-health/11172519/Vegetarians-have-much-lower-sperm-counts.html image http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/active/mens-health/11172519/Vegetarians-have-much-lower-sperm-counts.html Vegetarians have much lower sperm counts - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/active/mens-health/11172519/Vegetarians-have-much-lower-sperm-counts.html A diet rich in fruit and vegetables may harm fertility, say researchers at Loma Linda University Medical School View on www.telegraph.co.uk http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/active/mens-health/11172519/Vegetarians-have-much-lower-sperm-counts.html Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
For me, turq is like a wounded bear in a cage. I don't think poking at him with sticks is really gonna improve the situation! Plus, it's really unkind imo. On Monday, October 20, 2014 10:42 AM, anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: No alcoholics in my immediate family. Sometimes I just like crusty old bastards. I have to shut down now. I have a couple of prescriptions I have to fill at the local hospital. They want to stick some needles in this old body of mine so they can construct a time line to the grave. There was no one in my family like Barry by the way. My best friend, who lives several thousands of miles away, whom I met in what is here called middle school, is a crusty old atheist scientist. He has no conception of spirituality at all and never seems interested in philosophical discussions. So this place, FFL, provides an opportunity for discussion, with its varied and mostly insane clientèle. Perhaps I am a lawyer; every scoundrel deserves a defence; would you deny Barry counsel? Free speech has a hard, sharp edge to it, especially to wimpy, contracted minds unaccustomed to thinking. You do all right though, there is hope for you. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : You wish to offload the feelings you have in response to what someone says to you, about you, about others, to that someone for blame or revenge? In my experience, whether or not a person is nice or abusive, that person always distorts another person's values and ideas because no two minds are exactly alike. There can be superficial agreement, but if you dig deep enough, understandings, feelings etc., do not line up between two people. You are letting Barry get to you, he tried it with me too, and I took a step back and tried to analyse my response. As Barry does not seem to go about shooting others with firearms or stabbing them with knives, or attempting to ruin others nefariously by financial manipulation it seems possible to come to some accommodation. I found it was possible. I was never able to come to an accommodation with Judy Stein for example, although when I first came on here, she was friendly and Barry was hostile. There are certain affinities but they may be entirely superficial. He likes certain kinds of music. So do I, but we have different tastes. I pursued spirituality from basically an atheist point of view because I knew it was possible, and Barry seems to be in a non-religious space as well. Barry appears to like Curtis, and so do I. This thread, started by Barry, is wonderful for the kind of discussion that it can dredge up because it relates to ultimate questions about what we can know and tends to illuminate responses that give us an inkling of how other view the world. There is a terrible lack of humour in the religious world. The main affinity here is that all ideas are open to discussion here, and no ideas are sacrosanct. Barry would not give me a free ride were he to disagree with me about something. I have never met Barry (and logically therefore he has never met me); we live thousands of miles apart. I have seen a single rather grungy photo of him, apparently shot in Paris, one version in colour and the other in black and white on his linkedin page (you really should get a better shot Barry if you read this). If you really want to see repetitive button pushing behaviour and response you should watch the Jerry Springer show on TV. Marvellous primate studies of human mating behaviour. You cannot get much lower than this. At least here people think from time to time. Now if you think Barry is abusive, bitter, negative, and we suppose this were true, how much space would you allow him to vent his frustrations and give him the opportunity to grow? My first spiritual experiences came at the hands of one John Rosenberg (AKA Werner Erhard). I had no inkling that I was going to have a spiritual experience. He began his course by calling everyone in the room a bunch of god damn ass holes. The purpose was to elicit conditioned responses, and some took the bait. But the idea behind the method was to eventually within the course structure to get people to realise in their own experience how these conditioned responses situate themselves within and how they arise, and how to begin to deal with them. So what Barry does does not bother me, I have been dealing with my own conditioned responses going on half a century so I just do not care that you are seemingly upset. Being enlightened, you should know enough by now to deal with that yourself. From my side, if I want an abusive relationship with either a spouse or a spiritual teacher I'd go and find one on my own. I don't need bawee to provide this button pushing service for me. You're giving this asshat a free ride to spew his anger and frustration and just plain
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The seduction of silence
Well I read these insights in science and medical articles, so probably pretty straight forward stuff. On Monday, October 20, 2014 10:33 AM, awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Ann, here are some more reasons to love how nature works: the leaves of trees take on warmer colors in the autumn, as the air becomes cooler; trees become bare in the winter so that more sunlight can reach us with its warmth; in summer the leaves are plentiful and thus shade us from the sun; and in spring, that gorgeous green helps us detox after a slothful winter. (In Chinese medicine green is the color that helps the liver.) It would be nice to think that nature is designed to accommodate us like that, that we are the equivalent of the center of nature's universe. In that way, hopefully without being too egocentric, we can continue to view nature as generous, gentle and nourishing. On Monday, October 20, 2014 8:54 AM, awoelflebater@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Nablusoss, wrt light, for the past month or so I've become so aware of the sunlight, or any light for that matter. But the sunlight is so sublime, almost a living thing. Its silence is definitely a beautiful song. Sunlight at this time of year is less direct and has a yellower and oranger hue to it. Autumn sunlight has more color than summer sunlight. I notice it too. There is more than just leaf color and air temperature that distinguishes one time of the year from another. On Monday, October 20, 2014 5:57 AM, nablusoss1008 no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote: I've been having the same experience whenever going to a cabin far from other people for a few days particularily observing silence, no talking or calls. Silence becomes so dominating and thick one can almost touch and certainly see it as small balls of light joyfully floating around. It's tempting to spend longer periods of time in such a manner, perhaps in the Mountains. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : One thing I have noticed in my new neck of the woods, is the silence. No more hum and growl of traffic, the vibration of the freeways. I have several musical instruments, and a lot of music, but the silence is so seductive, I find myself keeping the house as quiet inside, as the outside. Most of the time it is thickly and peacefully silent, here. I had ideas before being here, that now that I have the space, and distance from neighbors, I could listen to songs at concert volume, but I have yet to do so. Far more soothing to hear the quiet.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
More enabling, dude. You are in it, deep. Sometimes I just like crusty old bastards. You forgot to add, when they share the same bitter and empty world view, as I do. As I recall, you took me to task for saying fuck too often, so I doubt it is the crust you like, as much as someone living in a world similar to your own. You are quite passive-aggressive in your fakey-neutral way of writing. I ain't falling for it, either. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : No alcoholics in my immediate family. Sometimes I just like crusty old bastards. I have to shut down now. I have a couple of prescriptions I have to fill at the local hospital. They want to stick some needles in this old body of mine so they can construct a time line to the grave. There was no one in my family like Barry by the way. My best friend, who lives several thousands of miles away, whom I met in what is here called middle school, is a crusty old atheist scientist. He has no conception of spirituality at all and never seems interested in philosophical discussions. So this place, FFL, provides an opportunity for discussion, with its varied and mostly insane clientèle. Perhaps I am a lawyer; every scoundrel deserves a defence; would you deny Barry counsel? Free speech has a hard, sharp edge to it, especially to wimpy, contracted minds unaccustomed to thinking. You do all right though, there is hope for you. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : You wish to offload the feelings you have in response to what someone says to you, about you, about others, to that someone for blame or revenge? In my experience, whether or not a person is nice or abusive, that person always distorts another person's values and ideas because no two minds are exactly alike. There can be superficial agreement, but if you dig deep enough, understandings, feelings etc., do not line up between two people. You are letting Barry get to you, he tried it with me too, and I took a step back and tried to analyse my response. As Barry does not seem to go about shooting others with firearms or stabbing them with knives, or attempting to ruin others nefariously by financial manipulation it seems possible to come to some accommodation. I found it was possible. I was never able to come to an accommodation with Judy Stein for example, although when I first came on here, she was friendly and Barry was hostile. There are certain affinities but they may be entirely superficial. He likes certain kinds of music. So do I, but we have different tastes. I pursued spirituality from basically an atheist point of view because I knew it was possible, and Barry seems to be in a non-religious space as well. Barry appears to like Curtis, and so do I. This thread, started by Barry, is wonderful for the kind of discussion that it can dredge up because it relates to ultimate questions about what we can know and tends to illuminate responses that give us an inkling of how other view the world. There is a terrible lack of humour in the religious world. The main affinity here is that all ideas are open to discussion here, and no ideas are sacrosanct. Barry would not give me a free ride were he to disagree with me about something. I have never met Barry (and logically therefore he has never met me); we live thousands of miles apart. I have seen a single rather grungy photo of him, apparently shot in Paris, one version in colour and the other in black and white on his linkedin page (you really should get a better shot Barry if you read this). If you really want to see repetitive button pushing behaviour and response you should watch the Jerry Springer show on TV. Marvellous primate studies of human mating behaviour. You cannot get much lower than this. At least here people think from time to time. Now if you think Barry is abusive, bitter, negative, and we suppose this were true, how much space would you allow him to vent his frustrations and give him the opportunity to grow? My first spiritual experiences came at the hands of one John Rosenberg (AKA Werner Erhard). I had no inkling that I was going to have a spiritual experience. He began his course by calling everyone in the room a bunch of god damn ass holes. The purpose was to elicit conditioned responses, and some took the bait. But the idea behind the method was to eventually within the course structure to get people to realise in their own experience how these conditioned responses situate themselves within and how they arise, and how to begin to deal with them. So what Barry does does not bother me, I have been dealing with my own conditioned responses going on half a century so I just do not care that you are seemingly upset. Being enlightened, you should know enough by now to deal with that yourself. From my side, if I want an abusive relationship
[FairfieldLife] Re: Why do people sound American when they sing in English?
Thanks - My bandwidth up here is awful, so youtubes are more trouble than they are worth, but it will be upgraded later today. I'll listen then - ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Same is true for a foreigner trying to sing in German. One of the worlds most famous interpreter of Schubert's lieder is an Irishman and it sounds awful in my ears. This is how it should sound, enjoy: Dietrich Fischer Dieskau Der Lindenbaum Die Winterreise https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyxMMg6bxrg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyxMMg6bxrg Dietrich Fischer Dieskau Der Lindenbaum Die Winterreise https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyxMMg6bxrg Dietrich Fischer Dieskau Der Lindenbaum Die Winterreise View on www.youtube.com https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyxMMg6bxrg Preview by Yahoo Schubert: Die Forelle (Fischer-Dieskau, Moore) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF9DrUXowBo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF9DrUXowBo Schubert: Die Forelle (Fischer-Dieskau,... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF9DrUXowBo In answer to a request... Schubert wrote no fewer than five versions of this song, and also based his Trout Quintet, D667 on it. It's a charming mini-drama, ... View on www.youtube.com https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF9DrUXowBo Preview by Yahoo ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote : I am fascinated with English and American accents, especially when each, does the other's. I have found that when English actors do American accents, they are far more successful, than the reverse. My reasoning is that the English are in general better actors, that they take the craft a bit more seriously. I have also read that when an American tries to sound, English, a native of England hears several distinct accents, from different areas of the country, and social strata, whereas 'American' has a more homogenized accent, and may be easier to emulate. The 17th century English accent in the sample, sounded Irish to me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : . And how to read Shakespeare correctly! 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Why English people sound American when they sing, and other intriguing linguistic theories View on www.telegraph.co.uk http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : I think you are on the right track Ann. Particularly nettle-some in a discussion of ultimate origins is time. In current cosmology, time-space did not exist prior to the universe, therefore there was no time before the universe's beginning and it is meaningless to speak of events or anything as 'having been before'. It is really difficult to wrap the mind around a situation like this because it makes no sense in terms of common experience. Maybe it will never make sense. Semantics are important in fashioning an argument, but it is difficult to do this if the basic ideas are really beyond our ability to conceptualise. You have already demonstrated here that you have a clearer grasp of this discussion than jr-esq, though you do not strike me as a philosopher. Arguments in the absence of evidence are difficult. This happens in science sometimes, but there are usually good reasons to suppose something in this way. Tell you what, I will sell you my silver-white unicorn for $320,000 Canadian. Payment before delivery. We all know that unicorns exist because we can think and imagine what they look like. They prefer halters by the way, if you want to ride. Thank you for your offer. At the current rate of exchange that is about 11 cents on the dollar so I would be doing quite well (you would be losing about 33K on this deal as you are in the US). If I did need a unicorn I would take you up on it and I don't think I'd need to ride it, they are just great enough standing there naked but thank you for the halter tip; I do believe they might take umbrage at a bit in their mouth.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Vegetarians have much lower sperm counts
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Which explains why India has such a small population. :-D Hmmm, I wonder what not eating anything does to your sperm count? On 10/20/2014 12:50 AM, salyavin808 wrote: There's always a catch Vegetarians have much lower sperm counts - Telegraph Vegetarians have much lower sperm counts - Telegraph A diet rich in fruit and vegetables may harm fertility, say researchers at Loma Linda University Medical School View on www.telegraph.co.uk Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Could astrology be correct? The season in which you were born may affect your personality, scientists claim
Babies born in the summer are much more likely to suffer from mood swings when they grow up, while those born in the winter are less likely to become irritable adults, scientists claim. http://shar.es/1mDt8U
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : For me, turq is like a wounded bear in a cage. I don't think poking at him with sticks is really gonna improve the situation! Plus, it's really unkind imo. Interesting analogy Share. But at some point you have to realize bawee is not a bear in a cage but a grown man who chooses every time he decides to make a rude and unwarranted dig and insult at virtually everyone here. He may be wounded (who isn't?) but I am not going to sit around viewing him as a pathetic victim unable to curtail his lousy manners. If he is going to participate here then I'm not going to let him shit all over me. YMMV.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
Share, Barry needs to learn to live with his karma, like the rest of the adults here. That is all it is. If it is uncomfortable for him, so what? We all have our lessons to learn, and the fact that being an asshole is not socially acceptable, carries consequences with it. Yes, we can all feel sorry for Barry, but that is not the same thing as excusing him, or pretending that he isn't here. I enjoy this forum as much as the next person, just to talk about stuff. If someone like Barry wants to show up, and act very inappropriately, I have just as much right to react to him, as anyone else. Please remember, he brought all of this upon himself. The fact that he is clueless, and you feel sorry for him, is irrelevant. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : For me, turq is like a wounded bear in a cage. I don't think poking at him with sticks is really gonna improve the situation! Plus, it's really unkind imo. On Monday, October 20, 2014 10:42 AM, anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: No alcoholics in my immediate family. Sometimes I just like crusty old bastards. I have to shut down now. I have a couple of prescriptions I have to fill at the local hospital. They want to stick some needles in this old body of mine so they can construct a time line to the grave. There was no one in my family like Barry by the way. My best friend, who lives several thousands of miles away, whom I met in what is here called middle school, is a crusty old atheist scientist. He has no conception of spirituality at all and never seems interested in philosophical discussions. So this place, FFL, provides an opportunity for discussion, with its varied and mostly insane clientèle. Perhaps I am a lawyer; every scoundrel deserves a defence; would you deny Barry counsel? Free speech has a hard, sharp edge to it, especially to wimpy, contracted minds unaccustomed to thinking. You do all right though, there is hope for you. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : You wish to offload the feelings you have in response to what someone says to you, about you, about others, to that someone for blame or revenge? In my experience, whether or not a person is nice or abusive, that person always distorts another person's values and ideas because no two minds are exactly alike. There can be superficial agreement, but if you dig deep enough, understandings, feelings etc., do not line up between two people. You are letting Barry get to you, he tried it with me too, and I took a step back and tried to analyse my response. As Barry does not seem to go about shooting others with firearms or stabbing them with knives, or attempting to ruin others nefariously by financial manipulation it seems possible to come to some accommodation. I found it was possible. I was never able to come to an accommodation with Judy Stein for example, although when I first came on here, she was friendly and Barry was hostile. There are certain affinities but they may be entirely superficial. He likes certain kinds of music. So do I, but we have different tastes. I pursued spirituality from basically an atheist point of view because I knew it was possible, and Barry seems to be in a non-religious space as well. Barry appears to like Curtis, and so do I. This thread, started by Barry, is wonderful for the kind of discussion that it can dredge up because it relates to ultimate questions about what we can know and tends to illuminate responses that give us an inkling of how other view the world. There is a terrible lack of humour in the religious world. The main affinity here is that all ideas are open to discussion here, and no ideas are sacrosanct. Barry would not give me a free ride were he to disagree with me about something. I have never met Barry (and logically therefore he has never met me); we live thousands of miles apart. I have seen a single rather grungy photo of him, apparently shot in Paris, one version in colour and the other in black and white on his linkedin page (you really should get a better shot Barry if you read this). If you really want to see repetitive button pushing behaviour and response you should watch the Jerry Springer show on TV. Marvellous primate studies of human mating behaviour. You cannot get much lower than this. At least here people think from time to time. Now if you think Barry is abusive, bitter, negative, and we suppose this were true, how much space would you allow him to vent his frustrations and give him the opportunity to grow? My first spiritual experiences came at the hands of one John Rosenberg (AKA Werner Erhard). I had no inkling that I was going to have a spiritual experience. He began his course by calling everyone in the room a bunch of god damn ass holes. The purpose was to elicit
[FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote : No alcoholics in my immediate family. Sometimes I just like crusty old bastards. I have to shut down now. I have a couple of prescriptions I have to fill at the local hospital. They want to stick some needles in this old body of mine so they can construct a time line to the grave. There was no one in my family like Barry by the way. My best friend, who lives several thousands of miles away, whom I met in what is here called middle school, is a crusty old atheist scientist. He has no conception of spirituality at all and never seems interested in philosophical discussions. So this place, FFL, provides an opportunity for discussion, with its varied and mostly insane clientèle. Perhaps I am a lawyer; every scoundrel deserves a defence; would you deny Barry counsel? Free speech has a hard, sharp edge to it, especially to wimpy, contracted minds unaccustomed to thinking. You do all right though, there is hope for you. Lucky you having an addict-free home. You are in the minority I fear. Good luck at the hospital - I have a visceral fear of the place. I definitely don't want to die in one. Crusty old bastards are fine as far as they go but after a while it gets a little old when they can only continue to sing middle C and then bang on the piano until the keys fall off.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Belief in God is a form of mental illness
Yes, Barry can own his own shit. He is a lousy human being, imo. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : For me, turq is like a wounded bear in a cage. I don't think poking at him with sticks is really gonna improve the situation! Plus, it's really unkind imo. Interesting analogy Share. But at some point you have to realize bawee is not a bear in a cage but a grown man who chooses every time he decides to make a rude and unwarranted dig and insult at virtually everyone here. He may be wounded (who isn't?) but I am not going to sit around viewing him as a pathetic victim unable to curtail his lousy manners. If he is going to participate here then I'm not going to let him shit all over me. YMMV.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Could astrology be correct? The season in which you were born may affect your personality, scientists claim
Bhairitu, wonderful article. Makes a lot of sense about predominant chemicals. Going beyond common sense, summer babies would be Sun in Cancer, thus ruled by the ever changing Moon. Or Sun in its own sign of Leo. Could be a bit hot. On Monday, October 20, 2014 10:57 AM, Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Babies born in the summer are much more likely to suffer from mood swings when they grow up, while those born in the winter are less likely to become irritable adults, scientists claim. http://shar.es/1mDt8U
[FairfieldLife] Re: Could astrology be correct? The season in which you were born may affect your personality, scientists claim
Could be - I am far more emotional than my wife is - She was born in January, and I was born in June. However her sister, born in July, is also quite emotional. Tiny sample size, though. Also, I was born 2 or 3 months premature of my due date (born black, then turned blue for awhile), so I don't know how that affects the astrology. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Babies born in the summer are much more likely to suffer from mood swings when they grow up, while those born in the winter are less likely to become irritable adults, scientists claim. http://shar.es/1mDt8U http://shar.es/1mDt8U
[FairfieldLife] Re: Could astrology be correct? The season in which you were born may affect your personality, scientists claim
LOL, another interesting article dies at the hands of desperate headline writers! You don't really see this as vindication of anything astrological do you? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : Babies born in the summer are much more likely to suffer from mood swings when they grow up, while those born in the winter are less likely to become irritable adults, scientists claim. http://shar.es/1mDt8U http://shar.es/1mDt8U
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Why do people sound American when they sing in English?
I recall how everyone raved at Renee Zellweger's British accent in Bridget Jones Diary but I thought it was horrible. These days though it's possible for American actors to have good foreign accents. I think back in the day that there was more demand for foreign actors to do American accents than for American actors to do foreign accents. But now there are good voice coaches who can make an American sound like they're from across the pond. In some cases this is due to accent reduction courses for Americans wanting to work or teach in other countries. In our computer age a lot of the accent reduction principles have been reduced to a short list to help anyone lose their accent when needed. I became familiar with this trying to help my tantra guru find some accent reduction courses and tutors in the SF Bay Area and they are plentiful here. On 10/20/2014 06:14 AM, fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: I am fascinated with English and American accents, especially when each, does the other's. I have found that when English actors do American accents, they are far more successful, than the reverse. My reasoning is that the English are in general better actors, that they take the craft a bit more seriously. I have also read that when an American tries to sound, English, a native of England hears several distinct accents, from different areas of the country, and social strata, whereas 'American' has a more homogenized accent, and may be easier to emulate. The 17th century English accent in the sample, sounded Irish to me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : . And how to read Shakespeare correctly! 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html image http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html 5 things you never knew about your accent - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Why English people sound American when they sing, and other intriguing linguistic theories View on www.telegraph.co.uk http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturenews/11167569/british-american-accent-facts.html Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Ancient Petroglyph on Mars
I think it is entirely possible that intelligent beings could have lived on Mars millions of years ago and evidence of their existence may still remain there. But it will probably take a country antagonistic to the NASA prime directive of not revealing such to alert earth creatures to this. But remember they wouldn't necessarily resemble us to exist as an intelligent being. That's just human vanity. On 10/19/2014 11:31 PM, jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Were there humanoids living on Mars millions of years ago? http://www.examiner.com/article/mars-and-earth-have-same-ancient-man-rock-engraving-visitors-to-both-planets
[FairfieldLife] Marshy's Picture
Don't know why they put his pic in with no article - just a window into the past here: https://repository.library.georgetown.edu/bitstream/handle/10822/555297/1968-05-09.pdf?sequence=1
[FairfieldLife] Hubble's greatest hits
One of mankind's great achievements, the Hubble space telescope just keeps on giving. Hubble Space Telescope's greatest hits - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/picture-galleries/11174628/Hubble-Space-Telescopes-greatest-hits.html http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/picture-galleries/11174628/Hubble-Space-Telescopes-greatest-hits.html Hubble Space Telescope's greatest hits - Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/picture-galleries/11174628/Hubble-Space-Telescopes-greatest-hits.html A selection of memorable images taken by the Hubble Space Telescope View on www.telegraph.co.uk http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/picture-galleries/11174628/Hubble-Space-Telescopes-greatest-hits.html Preview by Yahoo
