[Flexradio] SSB signals reversed
I am a new user of the SDR-1000 and can only recieve signals on their opposite sideband (i.e. 80M on USB not LSB), can anyone help to correct the problem? Using the latest 1.61 release software. Thanks Steve - G1LMN -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060521/62aef052/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] SSB signals reversed
Hi, Steve. The possible reasons. 1. Opposite IQ signals in cords 2. It is not executed RX Image Reject Calibration 73! SDR1k 1W + Home Made PA Celeron 2.9GHz, Delta44, WinXP Pro SP2 -- Sergey RW3PS mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] I am a new user of the SDR-1000 and can only recieve signals on their opposite sideband (i.e. 80M on USB not LSB), can anyone help to correct the problem? Using the latest 1.61 release software. Thanks Steve - G1LMN ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] Fwd: SSB signals reversed
Thanks Dominik, I am using the Delta 44 so it was an easy matter of swapping the audio in 1 2 plugs as you suggested. Now everything is in the right place frequency and mode wise, I can now get to grips with the rest of the radio. Many thanks for your help. Steve - G1LMN -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060521/467f3238/attachment.html -- next part -- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: SSB signals reversed Date: Sun, 21 May 2006 02:36:41 EDT Size: 1706 Url: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060521/467f3238/attachment.mht ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] More pic's (mostly the new SDR!) from Dayton
Eric - AA4SW has uploaded more photos from Dayton. They can be viewed at: http://www.hamsdr.com/profile.aspx?id=2109 73, Dale WA8SRA ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] Zero IF SDR
From G3PLX: The software that comes with the SDR1000 uses an 11.025kHz intermediate frequency. I understand the reasons for doing it this way, but even before the SDR1000 appeared I was doing software radio with an I.F. of zero. By this I mean that the sine and cosine RF oscillators were set right in the middle of the wanted signal, not offset by 11kHz. This may sound impossible to those who were brought up with analogue RF, but that's because it could never be done with analogue circuitry. With DSP it's actually easier to have the 'IF' frequency down in the audio band than to push it up where you can't hear it. The big advantage of zero IF is that the 22kHz image response problem vanishes. Any slight amplitude or phasing unbalance in the Tayloe sampler just results in an equally-slight amount of in-band distortion. The strongest image-frequency signal you ever need to reject is the wanted signal itself. You don't need to worry about a much stronger unwanted signal 22kHz up the band. When I got the SDR1000 kit (I got a very early one), I used it with this technique, and the results were excellent, except for one thing. It took me a while to trace the problem, but I found it in the end and the cause was a surprise. The problem showed as noise around the centre-frequency of all received signals, but it varied across the bands, and was absent when I unplugged the antenna. It was so bad that it made the receiver unusable on some bands with some antennas. But if I used the SDR1000 to tap-off and demodulate the intermediate-frequency of another receiver, it worked perfectly. The cause was oscillator radiation. The DDS oscillator (right in the middle of the wanted signal) was radiating, intermodulating with all kinds of low-frequency noise sources external to the receiver, and the resulting unwanted products (either side of the oscillator frequency) were re-radiated into the antenna. The effect is well-known to anyone who has ever experimented with home-brew direct-conversion receivers, where it usually shows as a raw power-line buzz in the speaker. It's possible that this effect may well have shown in the early work on SDR and it may have been one reason for offsetting the passband by 11kHz in the present software. The fix is to stop the local oscillator radiation. Screening helps a lot but another way is to add an RF stage, or configure the receiver as a superhet with the Tayloe sampler at the I.F. frequency. My early SDR1000 kit didn't have a pre-amp and I understand the current kits do. The local oscillator radiation is probably considerably lower on the present kits, so the zero-IF technique would probably work a lot better than it does on mine. Has anyone here who is writing his own SDR software tried this on the latest hardware? I can provide more details of the zero-IF technique if required. All the well-known modes can be implemented this way, both for receive and transmit. Maybe the present SDR software could be patched to implement zero-IF, or my own zero-IF software could be run in parallel on another soundcard. Would anyone like to have a go? 73 Peter ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Zero IF SDR
The DSP software is already capable of 0 Hz IF, and has been since its earliest version. IIRC the 11025 Hz IF is primarily a consequence of the frequency response of typical soundcards, which start rolling off somewhere in the vicinity of 200-300 Hz. 73 Frank AB2KT Peter Martinez wrote: From G3PLX: The software that comes with the SDR1000 uses an 11.025kHz intermediate frequency. I understand the reasons for doing it this way, but even before the SDR1000 appeared I was doing software radio with an I.F. of zero. By this I mean that the sine and cosine RF oscillators were set right in the middle of the wanted signal, not offset by 11kHz. This may sound impossible to those who were brought up with analogue RF, but that's because it could never be done with analogue circuitry. With DSP it's actually easier to have the 'IF' frequency down in the audio band than to push it up where you can't hear it. The big advantage of zero IF is that the 22kHz image response problem vanishes. Any slight amplitude or phasing unbalance in the Tayloe sampler just results in an equally-slight amount of in-band distortion. The strongest image-frequency signal you ever need to reject is the wanted signal itself. You don't need to worry about a much stronger unwanted signal 22kHz up the band. When I got the SDR1000 kit (I got a very early one), I used it with this technique, and the results were excellent, except for one thing. It took me a while to trace the problem, but I found it in the end and the cause was a surprise. The problem showed as noise around the centre-frequency of all received signals, but it varied across the bands, and was absent when I unplugged the antenna. It was so bad that it made the receiver unusable on some bands with some antennas. But if I used the SDR1000 to tap-off and demodulate the intermediate-frequency of another receiver, it worked perfectly. The cause was oscillator radiation. The DDS oscillator (right in the middle of the wanted signal) was radiating, intermodulating with all kinds of low-frequency noise sources external to the receiver, and the resulting unwanted products (either side of the oscillator frequency) were re-radiated into the antenna. The effect is well-known to anyone who has ever experimented with home-brew direct-conversion receivers, where it usually shows as a raw power-line buzz in the speaker. It's possible that this effect may well have shown in the early work on SDR and it may have been one reason for offsetting the passband by 11kHz in the present software. The fix is to stop the local oscillator radiation. Screening helps a lot but another way is to add an RF stage, or configure the receiver as a superhet with the Tayloe sampler at the I.F. frequency. My early SDR1000 kit didn't have a pre-amp and I understand the current kits do. The local oscillator radiation is probably considerably lower on the present kits, so the zero-IF technique would probably work a lot better than it does on mine. Has anyone here who is writing his own SDR software tried this on the latest hardware? I can provide more details of the zero-IF technique if required. All the well-known modes can be implemented this way, both for receive and transmit. Maybe the present SDR software could be patched to implement zero-IF, or my own zero-IF software could be run in parallel on another soundcard. Would anyone like to have a go? 73 Peter ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Zero IF SDR
Another reason for using IF higher than 0 Hz is the high inherent noise level of typical transistors and opamps at low frequencies (so called 1/f-noise). This and the leakage of the VFO signals made me to move away from the zero-IF in my early switching (and Tayloe) mixer experiments. Fortunately, before spending too much time for re-inventing the wheel came Gerald's famous first article in QSX - and here I am! Now is the time to modify the wheel! 73, Ahti OH2RZ On 21/05/06, Frank Brickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The DSP software is already capable of 0 Hz IF, and has been since its earliest version. IIRC the 11025 Hz IF is primarily a consequence of the frequency response of typical soundcards, which start rolling off somewhere in the vicinity of 200-300 Hz. 73 Frank AB2KT Peter Martinez wrote: From G3PLX: The software that comes with the SDR1000 uses an 11.025kHz intermediate frequency. I understand the reasons for doing it this way, but even before the SDR1000 appeared I was doing software radio with an I.F. of zero. By this I mean that the sine and cosine RF oscillators were set right in the middle of the wanted signal, not offset by 11kHz. This may sound impossible to those who were brought up with analogue RF, but that's because it could never be done with analogue circuitry. With DSP it's actually easier to have the 'IF' frequency down in the audio band than to push it up where you can't hear it. The big advantage of zero IF is that the 22kHz image response problem vanishes. Any slight amplitude or phasing unbalance in the Tayloe sampler just results in an equally-slight amount of in-band distortion. The strongest image-frequency signal you ever need to reject is the wanted signal itself. You don't need to worry about a much stronger unwanted signal 22kHz up the band. When I got the SDR1000 kit (I got a very early one), I used it with this technique, and the results were excellent, except for one thing. It took me a while to trace the problem, but I found it in the end and the cause was a surprise. The problem showed as noise around the centre-frequency of all received signals, but it varied across the bands, and was absent when I unplugged the antenna. It was so bad that it made the receiver unusable on some bands with some antennas. But if I used the SDR1000 to tap-off and demodulate the intermediate-frequency of another receiver, it worked perfectly. The cause was oscillator radiation. The DDS oscillator (right in the middle of the wanted signal) was radiating, intermodulating with all kinds of low-frequency noise sources external to the receiver, and the resulting unwanted products (either side of the oscillator frequency) were re-radiated into the antenna. The effect is well-known to anyone who has ever experimented with home-brew direct-conversion receivers, where it usually shows as a raw power-line buzz in the speaker. It's possible that this effect may well have shown in the early work on SDR and it may have been one reason for offsetting the passband by 11kHz in the present software. The fix is to stop the local oscillator radiation. Screening helps a lot but another way is to add an RF stage, or configure the receiver as a superhet with the Tayloe sampler at the I.F. frequency. My early SDR1000 kit didn't have a pre-amp and I understand the current kits do. The local oscillator radiation is probably considerably lower on the present kits, so the zero-IF technique would probably work a lot better than it does on mine. Has anyone here who is writing his own SDR software tried this on the latest hardware? I can provide more details of the zero-IF technique if required. All the well-known modes can be implemented this way, both for receive and transmit. Maybe the present SDR software could be patched to implement zero-IF, or my own zero-IF software could be run in parallel on another soundcard. Would anyone like to have a go? 73 Peter ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Zero IF SDR
Typo correction: ... article in QEX... Ahti OH2RZ On 21/05/06, Ahti Aintila [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Another reason for using IF higher than 0 Hz is the high inherent noise level of typical transistors and opamps at low frequencies (so called 1/f-noise). This and the leakage of the VFO signals made me to move away from the zero-IF in my early switching (and Tayloe) mixer experiments. Fortunately, before spending too much time for re-inventing the wheel came Gerald's famous first article in QSX - and here I am! Now is the time to modify the wheel! 73, Ahti OH2RZ On 21/05/06, Frank Brickle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The DSP software is already capable of 0 Hz IF, and has been since its earliest version. IIRC the 11025 Hz IF is primarily a consequence of the frequency response of typical soundcards, which start rolling off somewhere in the vicinity of 200-300 Hz. 73 Frank AB2KT Peter Martinez wrote: From G3PLX: The software that comes with the SDR1000 uses an 11.025kHz intermediate frequency. I understand the reasons for doing it this way, but even before the SDR1000 appeared I was doing software radio with an I.F. of zero. By this I mean that the sine and cosine RF oscillators were set right in the middle of the wanted signal, not offset by 11kHz. This may sound impossible to those who were brought up with analogue RF, but that's because it could never be done with analogue circuitry. With DSP it's actually easier to have the 'IF' frequency down in the audio band than to push it up where you can't hear it. The big advantage of zero IF is that the 22kHz image response problem vanishes. Any slight amplitude or phasing unbalance in the Tayloe sampler just results in an equally-slight amount of in-band distortion. The strongest image-frequency signal you ever need to reject is the wanted signal itself. You don't need to worry about a much stronger unwanted signal 22kHz up the band. When I got the SDR1000 kit (I got a very early one), I used it with this technique, and the results were excellent, except for one thing. It took me a while to trace the problem, but I found it in the end and the cause was a surprise. The problem showed as noise around the centre-frequency of all received signals, but it varied across the bands, and was absent when I unplugged the antenna. It was so bad that it made the receiver unusable on some bands with some antennas. But if I used the SDR1000 to tap-off and demodulate the intermediate-frequency of another receiver, it worked perfectly. The cause was oscillator radiation. The DDS oscillator (right in the middle of the wanted signal) was radiating, intermodulating with all kinds of low-frequency noise sources external to the receiver, and the resulting unwanted products (either side of the oscillator frequency) were re-radiated into the antenna. The effect is well-known to anyone who has ever experimented with home-brew direct-conversion receivers, where it usually shows as a raw power-line buzz in the speaker. It's possible that this effect may well have shown in the early work on SDR and it may have been one reason for offsetting the passband by 11kHz in the present software. The fix is to stop the local oscillator radiation. Screening helps a lot but another way is to add an RF stage, or configure the receiver as a superhet with the Tayloe sampler at the I.F. frequency. My early SDR1000 kit didn't have a pre-amp and I understand the current kits do. The local oscillator radiation is probably considerably lower on the present kits, so the zero-IF technique would probably work a lot better than it does on mine. Has anyone here who is writing his own SDR software tried this on the latest hardware? I can provide more details of the zero-IF technique if required. All the well-known modes can be implemented this way, both for receive and transmit. Maybe the present SDR software could be patched to implement zero-IF, or my own zero-IF software could be run in parallel on another soundcard. Would anyone like to have a go? 73 Peter ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list
[Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved?
I was just told by someone that Gerald made the comment on Teamspeak last night that the cw latency problem had been solved. Someone is already able to send cw at 60 wpm QSK with no latency and has found a way to do this. Does anyone else know about this and in particular how is this achieved. by a software change or hardware addition. Also does anyone know about the timeline for this improvement to the SDR 1K. Toby W4CAK -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060521/d293d1ed/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Zero IF SDR
From G3PLX: I just checked my two soundcards for the low-frequency roll-off. My new Firebox is 2.4dB down at 1.8Hz and the MP3+ is 1.5dB down at 1.2Hz. And that was done quickly by linking line-out to line-in, so it includes the LF roll-off of the transmit side too. I am quite certain the music business wouldn't touch a soundcard that rolled-off at 200Hz. The LF roll-off is really not a problem for zero-IF anyway. Even if you put the oscillator right in the centre, which theoretically puts a deep narrow null in the passband, I defy anyone to notice it's there on an SSB signal. There are ways to eliminate this null completely, but I really don't think we need to do it. To Ahti: I have never seen 1/f noise in my zero-IF work (I designed such a receiver before I retired, for HF GMDSS working). The local oscillator radiation problem looks just like 1/f noise, but that can be fixed once it is recognised. It's also possible that poor post-mixer design could result in supply-line noise being a problem (this has a 1/f spectrum), but the post-mixer amplifier design of the SDR1000 kit is excellent in this respect. If 1/f noise was present, it would show as a noise peak at the centre of the output spectrum. There is no such peak. If, as Frank says, the SDR1000 software can do zero-IF already, has anyone done any tests with it? What were the results? Were there any problems? Has the local oscillator radiation problem gone now that the RF amplifier is in place? I think it's worth looking at this area again. The 22kHz image problem will be tolerated by SDR1000 fans but this is surely not a proper solution. My GMDSS receiver would not have gained it's approval certificate if the operator had to balance the image rejection each time he changed bands! 73 Peter ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] **replay of Sat night Flex announcement at Dayton**
**replay of Sat night Flex announcement at Dayton** Alan K2WS has a nice recording of last night's presentation at the Dayton 2006 Hamvention. He has graciously agreed to rebroadcast it on a special Flex Teamspeak channel at 21:00z today. That is at 4pm Central and 5pm Eastern time (others adjust as needed). Sign on to Teamspeak and look for the rebroadcast channel. Teamspeak links: --- http://www.goteamspeak.com http://www.flex-radio.com/downloads/Teamspeak_Quickstart_Guide.pdf Alan will spin the recording without comment. The channel is unmoderated. If you need to reach him, please send him a text message at the bottom of the channel or an email. thanks Alan for this opportunity to listen again to Gerald's exciting announcement about the new SDR-blade. 73's de ken n9vv ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] **replay of Sat night Flex announcement at Dayton**
Bad timing here, but I'd like to hear it (for the first time). Any chance of just posting it somewhere? 73, Dale Ken N9VV wrote: **replay of Sat night Flex announcement at Dayton** Alan K2WS has a nice recording of last night's presentation at the Dayton 2006 Hamvention. He has graciously agreed to rebroadcast it on a special Flex Teamspeak channel at 21:00z today. That is at 4pm Central and 5pm Eastern time (others adjust as needed). Sign on to Teamspeak and look for the rebroadcast channel. Teamspeak links: --- http://www.goteamspeak.com http://www.flex-radio.com/downloads/Teamspeak_Quickstart_Guide.pdf Alan will spin the recording without comment. The channel is unmoderated. If you need to reach him, please send him a text message at the bottom of the channel or an email. thanks Alan for this opportunity to listen again to Gerald's exciting announcement about the new SDR-blade. 73's de ken n9vv ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] **replay of Sat night Flex announcement at Dayton**
I've posted an .mp3 of the Flex Saturday evening Dayton session audio @: http://www.tracey.org/wjt/temp/flex-dayton.mp3 Cheers, Bill (kd5tfd) ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved?
Toby, I'm not certain, but I suspect this was a comment about the SDR-X, not the SDR-1000. I doubt that there is a simple full-QSK solution with the latter given its half-duplex design. Chris - AE6VK -Original Message- From: Toby Pennington [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 12:02 PM To: Flex Cc: Ron Hinton Subject: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved? I was just told by someone that Gerald made the comment on Teamspeak last night that the cw latency problem had been solved. Someone is already able to send cw at 60 wpm QSK with no latency and has found a way to do this. Does anyone else know about this and in particular how is this achieved. by a software change or hardware addition. Also does anyone know about the timeline for this improvement to the SDR 1K. Toby W4CAK -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachment s/20060521/d293d1ed/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved?
I have listened to that part of the recording again today (now on teamspeak) and he clearly said that the current problem and limitation is the SOUNDCARD and not the SDR-1000 hardware. So I guess that means that the HPSDR Janus board is a LIFE SAVER and may mean some super CW performance from the current SDR-1000 hw? bk de ken Christopher T. Day wrote: Toby, I'm not certain, but I suspect this was a comment about the SDR-X, not the SDR-1000. I doubt that there is a simple full-QSK solution with the latter given its half-duplex design. Chris - AE6VK -Original Message- From: Toby Pennington [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 12:02 PM To: Flex Cc: Ron Hinton Subject: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved? I was just told by someone that Gerald made the comment on Teamspeak last night that the cw latency problem had been solved. Someone is already able to send cw at 60 wpm QSK with no latency and has found a way to do this. Does anyone else know about this and in particular how is this achieved. by a software change or hardware addition. Also does anyone know about the timeline for this improvement to the SDR 1K. Toby W4CAK -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachment s/20060521/d293d1ed/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved?
Ok, I misremembered. I'll have to review the recording. Chris - AE6VK -Original Message- From: Ken N9VV [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 8:15 PM To: Christopher T. Day Cc: Toby Pennington; Flex; Ron Hinton Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved? I have listened to that part of the recording again today (now on teamspeak) and he clearly said that the current problem and limitation is the SOUNDCARD and not the SDR-1000 hardware. So I guess that means that the HPSDR Janus board is a LIFE SAVER and may mean some super CW performance from the current SDR-1000 hw? bk de ken Christopher T. Day wrote: Toby, I'm not certain, but I suspect this was a comment about the SDR-X, not the SDR-1000. I doubt that there is a simple full-QSK solution with the latter given its half-duplex design. Chris - AE6VK -Original Message- From: Toby Pennington [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 12:02 PM To: Flex Cc: Ron Hinton Subject: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved? I was just told by someone that Gerald made the comment on Teamspeak last night that the cw latency problem had been solved. Someone is already able to send cw at 60 wpm QSK with no latency and has found a way to do this. Does anyone else know about this and in particular how is this achieved. by a software change or hardware addition. Also does anyone know about the timeline for this improvement to the SDR 1K. Toby W4CAK -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachment s/20060521/d293d1ed/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] **replay of Sat night Flex announcement at Dayton**
Thanks Bill, downloading now... :-) 73, Dale Bill Tracey wrote: I've posted an .mp3 of the Flex Saturday evening Dayton session audio @: http://www.tracey.org/wjt/temp/flex-dayton.mp3 Cheers, Bill (kd5tfd) ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved?
And if you gotta have QSK, when the new software comes out, just buy another SDR-1000 receiver and you can run full duplex.:) Mike - AA8K Ken N9VV wrote: I have listened to that part of the recording again today (now on teamspeak) and he clearly said that the current problem and limitation is the SOUNDCARD and not the SDR-1000 hardware. So I guess that means that the HPSDR Janus board is a LIFE SAVER and may mean some super CW performance from the current SDR-1000 hw? bk de ken Christopher T. Day wrote: Toby, I'm not certain, but I suspect this was a comment about the SDR-X, not the SDR-1000. I doubt that there is a simple full-QSK solution with the latter given its half-duplex design. Chris - AE6VK ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Zero IF SDR
Peter, You are right about the 22 kHz image in transmission. That is why I am reluctant to transmit without checking (and adjusting) the attenuation on the used frequency. With the preamplifier board the leakage of the sampling signal still can be detected by my other receivers. In practice it is no problem on the usual noisy bands. That is true also with the 1/f-noise, if you are running with the gains now used in the SDR-1000. In my earlier experiments with zero-IF I tried to maximize the dynamic range without any preamplifier. Then the 1/f-noise determines your weak signal performance. The maximum signal will be about 4 Vpp at the 200 ohm level that the QSD sees and can handle. This makes about 0 dBm at the antenna connector. Just for an explanation, this experiment was made for a commercial instrumentation project handling about 20 kHz bandwidth. If you have a SoftRock receiver available, you may tune across the 0 Hz IF. With the present high gain opamp you hardly can see anything special. Try to set the gain to 0 dB, then you possibly will find a difference. Measure the signals before the sound card. 73, Ahti OH2RZ On 21/05/06, Peter Martinez [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From G3PLX: I just checked my two soundcards for the low-frequency roll-off. My new Firebox is 2.4dB down at 1.8Hz and the MP3+ is 1.5dB down at 1.2Hz. And that was done quickly by linking line-out to line-in, so it includes the LF roll-off of the transmit side too. I am quite certain the music business wouldn't touch a soundcard that rolled-off at 200Hz. The LF roll-off is really not a problem for zero-IF anyway. Even if you put the oscillator right in the centre, which theoretically puts a deep narrow null in the passband, I defy anyone to notice it's there on an SSB signal. There are ways to eliminate this null completely, but I really don't think we need to do it. To Ahti: I have never seen 1/f noise in my zero-IF work (I designed such a receiver before I retired, for HF GMDSS working). The local oscillator radiation problem looks just like 1/f noise, but that can be fixed once it is recognised. It's also possible that poor post-mixer design could result in supply-line noise being a problem (this has a 1/f spectrum), but the post-mixer amplifier design of the SDR1000 kit is excellent in this respect. If 1/f noise was present, it would show as a noise peak at the centre of the output spectrum. There is no such peak. If, as Frank says, the SDR1000 software can do zero-IF already, has anyone done any tests with it? What were the results? Were there any problems? Has the local oscillator radiation problem gone now that the RF amplifier is in place? I think it's worth looking at this area again. The 22kHz image problem will be tolerated by SDR1000 fans but this is surely not a proper solution. My GMDSS receiver would not have gained it's approval certificate if the operator had to balance the image rejection each time he changed bands! 73 Peter ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved?
I seem to remember mention of a solution found right there at Dayton - some tweak to the soundcard config, perhaps, resulting in successful semi-breakin capability at speeds around 60wpm, but not full QSK. I guess we need Bob or Gerald to spell out the details. Pete -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ken N9VV Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 11:15 PM To: Christopher T. Day Cc: Ron Hinton; Flex Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved? I have listened to that part of the recording again today (now on teamspeak) and he clearly said that the current problem and limitation is the SOUNDCARD and not the SDR-1000 hardware. So I guess that means that the HPSDR Janus board is a LIFE SAVER and may mean some super CW performance from the current SDR-1000 hw? bk de ken Christopher T. Day wrote: Toby, I'm not certain, but I suspect this was a comment about the SDR-X, not the SDR-1000. I doubt that there is a simple full-QSK solution with the latter given its half-duplex design. Chris - AE6VK -Original Message- From: Toby Pennington [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 12:02 PM To: Flex Cc: Ron Hinton Subject: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved? I was just told by someone that Gerald made the comment on Teamspeak last night that the cw latency problem had been solved. Someone is already able to send cw at 60 wpm QSK with no latency and has found a way to do this. Does anyone else know about this and in particular how is this achieved. by a software change or hardware addition. Also does anyone know about the timeline for this improvement to the SDR 1K. Toby W4CAK -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachme nt s/20060521/d293d1ed/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Zero IF SDR
At 09:41 AM 5/21/2006, Peter Martinez wrote: From G3PLX: The software that comes with the SDR1000 uses an 11.025kHz intermediate frequency. I understand the reasons for doing it this way, but even before the SDR1000 appeared I was doing software radio with an I.F. of zero. By this I mean that the sine and cosine RF oscillators were set right in the middle of the wanted signal, not offset by 11kHz. This may sound impossible to those who were brought up with analogue RF, but that's because it could never be done with analogue circuitry. With DSP it's actually easier to have the 'IF' frequency down in the audio band than to push it up where you can't hear it. snip There's actually several things pushing towards choosing an IF near fs/4.. whether doing I/Q or single channel sampling: 1) most sampling systems (particularly sound cards with AC coupling) have poor response at DC. 2) most sampling systems have significant clock noise at the sample rate (which aliases to DC) and at half the clock rate. Putting the signal at fs/4 puts it squarely between the noise contributions at zero and fs/2. Doing I/Q (with any IF) helps with effectively doubling the sample rate (so that the signal of interest is a smaller fraction of the sampling bandwidth, which helps with filtering.. the filters can be less steep) However I/Q sampling comes at a cost of having to deal with balance. When talking about I/Q balance we need to realize that it's not just two numbers (phase and amplitude) although that's a reasonable approximation in the middle of the passband. But, as you get closer to the analog passband edges (i.e. buffer amp upper frequency rolloff, and low frequency AC coupling) then the odds of the slopes exactly matching are less (mostly because the analog filter components, coupling capacitors and resistors and the like) tend not to be exactly the same (particularly over temperature). So, to do a good job of image cancellation, etc., you need to measure the imbalance at every frequency and apply the inverse filter. Or, equivalently, measure the impulse response and deconvolve it with the incoming signal. (the single step balance fix in the current PowerSDR is basically a zero order time domain filter) Has anyone here who is writing his own SDR software tried this on the latest hardware? I can provide more details of the zero-IF technique if required. All the well-known modes can be implemented this way, both for receive and transmit. Maybe the present SDR software could be patched to implement zero-IF, or my own zero-IF software could be run in parallel on another soundcard. Would anyone like to have a go? Another advantage of running at an IF instead zero-IF is that once you've dealt with the frequency conversion in the signal processing domain, you can move the IF around a bit without too much trouble. That way, your LO can go in discrete steps, even if your tuned frequency is continuous. The fine tuning is in the signal processing. That way you can adjust the DDS frequency to put spurs where the signal isn't. 73 Peter ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com James Lux, P.E. Spacecraft Radio Frequency Subsystems Group Flight Communications Systems Section Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Mail Stop 161-213 4800 Oak Grove Drive Pasadena CA 91109 tel: (818)354-2075 fax: (818)393-6875 ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] **replay of Sat night Flex announcement at Dayton**
At 01:08 PM 5/21/2006, Ken N9VV wrote: **replay of Sat night Flex announcement at Dayton** Alan K2WS has a nice recording of last night's presentation at the Dayton 2006 Hamvention. He has graciously agreed to rebroadcast it on a special Flex Teamspeak channel at 21:00z today. That is at 4pm Central and 5pm Eastern time (others adjust as needed). Sign on to Teamspeak and look for the rebroadcast channel. And is there a text version of the announcement? Not on the flex-radio.com website, at least as of early this morning. James Lux, P.E. Spacecraft Radio Frequency Subsystems Group Flight Communications Systems Section Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Mail Stop 161-213 4800 Oak Grove Drive Pasadena CA 91109 tel: (818)354-2075 fax: (818)393-6875 ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved?
At 03:22 PM 5/21/2006, Mike Naruta wrote: And if you gotta have QSK, when the new software comes out, just buy another SDR-1000 receiver and you can run full duplex.:) That is a fairly straightforward approach to the full duplex need. And, it pushes the cost onto just those who want the capability (you could clearly use a 1Watt version for the receiver side, too). However, it should be pointed out that there is no inherent reason why the existing SDR1000 hardware and a PC cannot do microsecond scale QSK (depending on how fast the relays are, more than anything). It's mostly a matter of spending the (huge) amount of work involved in making a full duplex windows audio application that interacts with the hardware. Considering the amount of work involved in doing the latter, and the limited software development resources available, it's probably not a good investment of those resources. Personally, I'd rather see a push to a better separation between DSP and user interface in the Windows environment (as in running as separate tasks/processes), which would be of more general applicability than high performance QSK. For example, having a control and audio interface that was sufficiently decoupled from the PowerSDR UI would allow third party digital modes software to work without things like VAC, the use of dual sound cards, or serial port emulators. That was one of the high priority things discussed a year or so ago, but which has languished as other issues have been attacked. Jim ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved?
At 08:15 PM 5/21/2006, Ken N9VV wrote: I have listened to that part of the recording again today (now on teamspeak) and he clearly said that the current problem and limitation is the SOUNDCARD and not the SDR-1000 hardware. This is incorrect. Many, many high performance gaming applications run on the Windows platform and achieve sub=millisecond timing. There are also realtime conferencing type applications that run in the Windows environment with full duplex audio processing. For that matter, successfully playing high rate streaming video/audio requires careful alignment of the streams. It's more a matter of the huge software development effort required to do this within the Windows framework. Devoting a work-year of effort ($100K-250K) to learning to effectively work in the Windows environment may be a reasonable matter to a game developer expecting million unit sales or to a high end video conferencing application developer. However, that scale of labor is not generally available to the folks at Flex. I would imagine that, by and large, the PowerSDR development folk are not Windows multimedia extension devotees, nor do they wish to devote their lives to such an activity. In fact, PowerSDR depends on portaudio to encapsulate and hide most of the mm ickyness, and it would appear that the portaudio developers aren't interested in this either. Or, if some ham who also happens to be a game developer gets interested, we could be in luck. So I guess that means that the HPSDR Janus board is a LIFE SAVER and may mean some super CW performance from the current SDR-1000 hw? bk de ken or, just buy a second SDR as a receiver. Jim ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] CW Latency Problem Solved?
Is the Firefox card on the approved lost to enable warranty guarantees? Or are you talking about the Firebox Firewire which is approved? Toby - Original Message - From: Mel Whitten [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Toby Pennington [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 7:03 PM Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved? HI Tony I was there when the annoucement was made. Seems they (not sure besides Eric who found this out) were able to remove the latency in the Firefox Soundcard by make some adjustment the card has available. I dont own the card, but that is all they did becuase Bob N4HY says the latency problem had already been confirmed was caused by the sound card, not the PC/sdr console. So if you have a Firefox card (evidently this is the only card that this adjustment can be made on) then this may be the answer. You may want to get more info on this to confirm what I am saying. :-) Mel k0pfx -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060521/c459d4e8/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved?
I wish some of brain - o's could solve the monitor latency problem. - Original Message - From: Christopher T. Day To: Toby Pennington ; Flex Cc: Ron Hinton Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 4:42 PM Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved? Toby, I'm not certain, but I suspect this was a comment about the SDR-X, not the SDR-1000. I doubt that there is a simple full-QSK solution with the latter given its half-duplex design. Chris - AE6VK -Original Message- From: Toby Pennington [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2006 12:02 PM To: Flex Cc: Ron Hinton Subject: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved? I was just told by someone that Gerald made the comment on Teamspeak last night that the cw latency problem had been solved. Someone is already able to send cw at 60 wpm QSK with no latency and has found a way to do this. Does anyone else know about this and in particular how is this achieved. by a software change or hardware addition. Also does anyone know about the timeline for this improvement to the SDR 1K. Toby W4CAK -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachment s/20060521/d293d1ed/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.392 / Virus Database: 268.6.1/344 - Release Date: 5/19/2006 -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060521/90899f18/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Cw Latency Problem Solved?
Jimmy Jones wrote: I wish some of brain - o's could solve the monitor latency problem. Well, according to Science Today magazine this week, some string theorists are speculating that time travel may actually be feasible. With that solved the monitor latency problem won't be far behind. Till then, unfortunately, the only other solution is ESP. 73 Frank AB2KT ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
