Re: G5 power supply problems

[schaffpa]

Thanks for the response John! And for the tip on a reputable repair outfit. 

- Peter 

- Original Message - 
From: "John Carmonne"  
To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com 
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2010 2:50:24 PM 
Subject: Re: G5 power supply problems 


On Oct 25, 2010, at 12:55 PM, schaf...@comcast.net wrote: 

> I have a late G5 2.3 dual-core Power Mac that has run 24/7 since I bought it 
> new in December 2005. The only enhancement it received was a 2nd 250 GB HDD 
> and 4 GB of RAM. A month or 2 ago it died instantly (there was a gunshot like 
> "pop", the screen went black and the power light was out 2 seconds later when 
> I looked, and the ensuing stench made me not try a restart). My meager 
> training screamed "power supply", but that's just my uneducated guess. 
> Googling revealed a fault in my power supply that was covered by Apple until 
> January 2010, and a call to Apple Care resulted in an "I'm sorry" 
> determination of coverage. Apparently the purchase of $7500 of Apple products 
> (w/o Apple Care purchases) in the last 8 years doesn't qualify me for any 
> "special" consideration. OK. My "local" (4 hr return trip) Apple Store was 
> unwilling to let me discuss anything with a "genius" and just wanted me to 
> bring it in. The closest Apple certified repair center (about the same 
> distance) quoted a flat labor fee of $95 and a "new" Apple part cost of 
> $400(!?). A relative Apple tech who works for a WA State university said an 
> exchange from Apple would be $150, so I presume this would be a refurbished 
> unit. 
> 
> My questions to anyone out there are: 
> 1. Has anyone else with the latest 1000 watt power supply had a failure on 
> the G5 PM? 
> 2. If this power supply has failed (seems likely to me), what are the odds 
> that logic board, drives, memory, etc are OK? I used an external FW drive and 
> it works fine w/my G4 PM (saved my bacon!!). 
> 3. Anyone have an opinion, for my purposes, whether I'd be better served by 
> an Apple store or a cooperative 3rd party? 
> 
> I want my beloved child back! Any help/advice from those who know better than 
> I would be MOST appreciated! 8^) 
> 
> TIA 
> 
> - Peter 
> 
> G5 2.3 dual-core, 4 GB RAM, 20" Acer LCD, 250 x2 HDD running SoftRaid 
> (mirror) running Tiger 10.4.11. 
> G4 MDD 1.0 dual "wind tunnel", 320+80+80 HDD running Tiger 10.4.11. 
> 
I and some friends of mine have trusted our heavy lifting to Brian at DT&T 
Service in Fremont CA for a couple of years, They're honest and very fair 
priced plus fast turn around with a warranty. I always get my money's worth and 
extra. 

http://www.dttservice.com/services.html 

John Carmonne 
Yorba Linda USA 
Sent from my MBP 

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Re: Apple inside?

[Joshua Juran]

On Oct 25, 2010, at 4:55 PM, Stephen Conrad wrote:


We have lots of cats left on the list:


[snip]


Cheetah


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X_v10.0

Josh


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Re: G5 not taking keyboard input

[Nestamicky]

On 25/10/10 9:22 PM, Ross wrote:

Have you tried booting with the [Shift] key held down to boot into
safe mode and clear the caches? If not try that, and then restart when
you get to the login screen.

If it still does not work, disconnect all external peripheral cables
and the AC power cord. Open the side door, remove the door and thermal
shield. Look inside, down below the memory slots about one inch up
along the bottom edge of the main logic board, just in front of the
processor intake fans, where you will see the SMU reset switch. It is
a round grey or white momentary contact switch set in a square metal
"can", much like the PRAM switches in older G3 and G4 desktop systems.
Press the SMU switch once, and once only, releasing it immediately.
Wait at least ten seconds before closing the system up, re-connecting
the external peripheral cables and the AC power cable. Try to start
the system from the OS install DVD, and reset the system password.

If that doesn't work, check and, if necessary, change the PRAM
battery. Try booting with the [Command] + [Option] + [P] +[R] keys
held down until you reach the open firmware prompt. Try the usual
NVRAM reset commands, press [Enter/Return] key after each command:

reset-nvram [Enter]
set defaults [Enter]
reset-all [Enter]

The system should restart. Hold down the [C] key as it boots to boot
to the OS install DVD. Try and change the password. If successful, see
if you can log in. As someone else suggested, be sure you are using a
wired keyboard so the keyboard will be recognized and functional when
you reach the Login prompt.

If none of the above works, boot from the ASD CD and run all the
system tests.


No, I've not tried the "Shift key", though I doubt this will respond to 
any key combination. I think there's a greater problem that's keeping it 
from responding to input keys during boot-up. Once it's booted, I can 
see the key input. Of course, that was when it booted to the login 
screen. Now it does not, though it chimes/bongs. Nothing shows up on screen.


Can someone please help as to where I can find download the ASD. I doubt 
that it will work, as I think it simply won't boot off the optical 
drive. But it will be nice to have, once the major issue of it not 
responding to key input during boot-up is solved.


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Re: G5 not taking keyboard input

[Nestamicky]

On 25/10/10 10:57 AM, dc wrote:

At the risk of stating the obvious, the keyboard needs to be a wired
USB keyboard in order for startup shortcut commands to work. Are you
using a wireless keyboard?

It's wired and I've tried a few different ones.

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Re: G5 not taking keyboard input

[Nestamicky]

On 25/10/10 7:25 AM, John Carmonne wrote:

  Did you try all the USB ports? When you had it apart did you hold the CUDA 
switch down for 15 secs? If that doesn't help reseat the processors, then try 
to boot with an ASD DVD.
I tried the back ports and the front port. I did press the reset switch 
on the logic board when I had it opened. Reseating the proc is down the 
road. It's a hassle to remove 'em.


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Re: G5 not taking keyboard input

[Nestamicky]

On 25/10/10 7:26 AM, Kris Tilford wrote:

What keyboard input are you using to attempt to boot the DVD, the "C" or
the "Option" or both? Have you tried the USB ports on the front & the
back for the keyboard? If you've removed the HD, and have the DVD in the
optical drive, then it should default to the DVD to boot. Once the DVD
boots, you can use Startup Disk on the DVD to select the DVD as the
startup disk, and this should write this preference to NVRAM, and then
when you replace the HD it should still boot to the DVD.


I used the "C" key and then later, from your response, used the "Option" 
key. None worked. I can't get the DVD to boot. I'm worried now that I 
may have made things worse from that false start on that SATA channel 
that caused the machine to not boot. After that, it won't boot 
completely, period. And still won't. Any more ideas...


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Re: Apple inside?

[admin]

With Lion king of the jungle, maybe, it's on to OS XI and another  
animal after this! OS X has steadily matured but I sure don't consider  
that 7 or 8 "systems" have been presented.  Tiger seems to be the  
maturing high point of a steady series of incremental improvements and  
tinkering.


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Re: G5 not taking keyboard input

[Ross]

On Oct 25, 9:14 am, Nestamicky  wrote:
> This machine is the 2 Ghz DP version, 2005.
>
> It will chime and boot to the internal HD.
>
> I lost the password so can't login.
>
> I then try with the install DVD to reset the password.
>
> It will not take any keyboard input combination to reset NVRAM, boot off
> DVD---nothing.
>
> The keyboard works because when I tried some password input it prints on
> screen.
>
> I took the HD out, put it back in and on an SATA channel it did not
> like. It did not boot.
>
> I changed it and it booted but this time without anything on screen. So
> I messed things up, apparently, as it used to boot to login screen before.
>
> So I removed and cleaned the tip of the video card. No luck.
>
> I must also mention that I've removed RAM, battery, etc, to see if it's
> locked with firmware that's preventing the keyboard input at boot, but
> no luck. I think that's the real problem herenot responding to
> keyboard input during boot.
>
> Any help will be appreciated.

Have you tried booting with the [Shift] key held down to boot into
safe mode and clear the caches? If not try that, and then restart when
you get to the login screen.

If it still does not work, disconnect all external peripheral cables
and the AC power cord. Open the side door, remove the door and thermal
shield. Look inside, down below the memory slots about one inch up
along the bottom edge of the main logic board, just in front of the
processor intake fans, where you will see the SMU reset switch. It is
a round grey or white momentary contact switch set in a square metal
"can", much like the PRAM switches in older G3 and G4 desktop systems.
Press the SMU switch once, and once only, releasing it immediately.
Wait at least ten seconds before closing the system up, re-connecting
the external peripheral cables and the AC power cable. Try to start
the system from the OS install DVD, and reset the system password.

If that doesn't work, check and, if necessary, change the PRAM
battery. Try booting with the [Command] + [Option] + [P] +[R] keys
held down until you reach the open firmware prompt. Try the usual
NVRAM reset commands, press [Enter/Return] key after each command:

reset-nvram [Enter]
set defaults [Enter]
reset-all [Enter]

The system should restart. Hold down the [C] key as it boots to boot
to the OS install DVD. Try and change the password. If successful, see
if you can log in. As someone else suggested, be sure you are using a
wired keyboard so the keyboard will be recognized and functional when
you reach the Login prompt.

If none of the above works, boot from the ASD CD and run all the
system tests.

Good luck.

Ross

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Re: Apple inside?

[Paul Stamsen]

Previously, at 8:22  pm + 10/25/10, Charles Davis wrote:
>On Oct 26, 2010, at 12:15 AM, Amanda Ward wrote:
>
>>On Oct 25, 2010, at 4:55 PM, Stephen Conrad wrote:
>>
>>>On Mon, Oct 25, 2010 at 5:10 PM, Tina K.
>>><penguir...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>On 2010/10/25 14:48, Andrew Liu Anderson so eloquently wrote:
>>>
>>>Sorry in advance if this is a bring-down for some folks. It's just time
>>>that our world, Apple fans included, do a little slw-dn,
>>>back-up & re-evaluate our values.
>>>
>>>
>>>Not at all. I'm very happy with my PPC Macs (except for Flash of course) and 
>>>there
>>>isn't a day that goes by that I'm not tempted to upgrade from Leopard to 
>>>Tiger. By
>>>the time I see an Intel Mac, or Hackintosh, the Mac OS will probably be up to
>>>10.9Š iCougar?
>>>
>>>
>>>We have lots of cats left on the list:
>>>
>>>Asian Golden Cat
>>>Fishing Cat
>>>Wildcat (many varieties)
>>>Sand Cat
>>>Geoffroy's Cat
>>>Serval
>>>Caracal
>>>Cheetah
>>>Margay
>>>Iriomote Cat
>>>
>>>Jaguar & Leopard (used)
>>>Black Panther (Panther has been used)
>>>Puma (used)
>>>
>>>Lynx
>>>Bobcat
>>>
>>>Lion (used)
>>>Tiger (used)
>>>
>>>--
>>>Steve Conrad
>>>Henrietta, MO 64036
>>>
>>
>>Let's not forget Tabby and Calico! ;-)
>>
>>Amanda
>>
>And then there are the Black & White "Tuxedo" kitty's  [Black, with white paws 
>&
>shirtfront, white tip on tail]
>
>Chuck D.


 Missed my favorite: The Savannah Cat

 p.
-- 
What I look forward to is continued
immaturity followed by death.  -- Dave Barry

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Re: Apple inside?

[Clark Martin]

On Oct 25, 2010, at 5:24 PM, Doug McNutt wrote:

> 
> It's the last question that makes me do this.  I had an IBM 024 punch in my 
> office that nobody else wanted because it didn't print the letters on the top 
> edge. The 026's did.  It's really fun to check a FORTRAN deck for typos when 
> all you have to look at is the holes.

Which means it ought to be about 4 times as fun to check a COBOL deck for typos.

> 
> But 3 GHz translates to a wavelength of 1/3 of a foot because the foot - a 
> metric unit now that the meter is defined in terms of the speed of light - is 
> the distance that light travels in a nanosecond.  Those clocks you're talking 
> about would be a full cycle out of phase in two inches round trip if you 
> tried that on a memory bus.
> 
> What the manufacturer really means is that you, the designer, give me 
> something slower, a few MHz, on a pin and I'll multiply it up to a 3 GHz 
> clock that stays wholly inside the microprocessor. There we're dealing with 
> much shorter path lengths.
> 
> The time delay in a wave guide is still limited by the speed of light. Bigger 
> and longer doesn't get better.


The time delay in a wave guide is limited by the speed of light.  The time 
delay in a wire is limited by the propagation velocity which is slower, often 
around 2/3 C.

Clark Martin
Redwood City, CA, USA
Macintosh / Internet Consulting

"I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway"

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Re: Apple inside?

[James Therrault]

On Oct 25, 2010, at 6:15 PM, Amanda Ward wrote:


On Oct 25, 2010, at 4:55 PM, Stephen Conrad wrote:

On Mon, Oct 25, 2010 at 5:10 PM, Tina K.   
wrote:

On 2010/10/25 14:48, Andrew Liu Anderson so eloquently wrote:
Sorry in advance if this is a bring-down for some folks. It's just  
time

that our world, Apple fans included, do a little slw-dn,
back-up & re-evaluate our values.

Not at all. I'm very happy with my PPC Macs (except for Flash of  
course) and there isn't a day that goes by that I'm not tempted to  
upgrade from Leopard to Tiger. By the time I see an Intel Mac, or  
Hackintosh, the Mac OS will probably be up to 10.9… iCougar?


We have lots of cats left on the list:

Asian Golden Cat
Fishing Cat
Wildcat (many varieties)
Sand Cat
Geoffroy's Cat
Serval
Caracal
Cheetah
Margay
Iriomote Cat

Jaguar & Leopard (used)
Black Panther (Panther has been used)
Puma (used)

Lynx
Bobcat

Lion (used)
Tiger (used)

--
Steve Conrad
Henrietta, MO 64036


Let's not forget Tabby and Calico! ;-)

Amanda




Or the Seberian!

JT



$13/Month Car Insurance?
Insurance deal just passed now allows you to get car insurance for $13
http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3241/4cc62f2f37d823a4915st03duc

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Re: Apple inside?

[Bruce Johnson]

On Oct 24, 2010, at 7:46 PM, Daniel Stewart wrote:


As an interesting aside I there was also a PPC native version of
Windows NT 4.0   I guess MS was not content to just subject PC users
to NT.




That one was designed to run on CHRP (?) hardware, not Mac hardware;  
they never advanced much beyond the early development systems released  
by Motorola.


--
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs

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Re: Apple inside?

[Wallace Adrian D'Alessio]

Well cats names are a proper considering the imperiousness Of apple
philosophy.

How about " Simon's Cat "

Check out kitty behavior on youtube.

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Re: Apple inside?

[Jeff Bequette]

On Oct 25, 2010, at 6:55 PM, Stephen Conrad wrote:

 10.9… iCougar?

We have lots of cats left on the list:

Asian Golden Cat
Fishing Cat
Wildcat (many varieties)
Sand Cat
Geoffroy's Cat
Serval
Caracal
Cheetah
Margay
Iriomote Cat

Jaguar & Leopard (used)
Black Panther (Panther has been used)
Puma (used)

Lynx
Bobcat

Lion (used)
Tiger (used)





I think Siamese for the dual core crowd!



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Re: Apple inside?

[Charles Davis]

On Oct 26, 2010, at 12:15 AM, Amanda Ward wrote:


On Oct 25, 2010, at 4:55 PM, Stephen Conrad wrote:

On Mon, Oct 25, 2010 at 5:10 PM, Tina K.   
wrote:

On 2010/10/25 14:48, Andrew Liu Anderson so eloquently wrote:
Sorry in advance if this is a bring-down for some folks. It's just  
time

that our world, Apple fans included, do a little slw-dn,
back-up & re-evaluate our values.

Not at all. I'm very happy with my PPC Macs (except for Flash of  
course) and there isn't a day that goes by that I'm not tempted to  
upgrade from Leopard to Tiger. By the time I see an Intel Mac, or  
Hackintosh, the Mac OS will probably be up to 10.9… iCougar?


We have lots of cats left on the list:

Asian Golden Cat
Fishing Cat
Wildcat (many varieties)
Sand Cat
Geoffroy's Cat
Serval
Caracal
Cheetah
Margay
Iriomote Cat

Jaguar & Leopard (used)
Black Panther (Panther has been used)
Puma (used)

Lynx
Bobcat

Lion (used)
Tiger (used)

--
Steve Conrad
Henrietta, MO 64036


Let's not forget Tabby and Calico! ;-)

Amanda

And then there are the Black & White "Tuxedo" kitty's  [Black, with  
white paws & shirtfront, white tip on tail]


Chuck D.

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Re: Apple inside?

[Doug McNutt]

At 14:19 -0700 10/25/10, Andrew Liu Anderson wrote:
>
>  Also, at 3GHz, you cross-over into the SHF range of micro-wave on radio 
> spectrum. As frequency increases, "Skin Effect" of AC current becomes more 
> dramatic, to where it becomes impossible to use ordinary conductors to carry 
> your clock pulses, data, etc. from one component to the next. You have to 
> start using "Wave Guides", or hollow tubes to transmit information along an 
> information pathway. And the wave guides have to be tuned to the frequency 
> you are using. The long and the short of it is that to keep going up in 
> frequency, we would need to start going back up in size to accommodate wave 
> guides, relays, etc. Soon we'd be seeing room-size computers again... Or at 
> least IBM 360 console size. :-) Anyone remember punch-cards?
***

It's the last question that makes me do this.  I had an IBM 024 punch in my 
office that nobody else wanted because it didn't print the letters on the top 
edge. The 026's did.  It's really fun to check a FORTRAN deck for typos when 
all you have to look at is the holes.

But 3 GHz translates to a wavelength of 1/3 of a foot because the foot - a 
metric unit now that the meter is defined in terms of the speed of light - is 
the distance that light travels in a nanosecond.  Those clocks you're talking 
about would be a full cycle out of phase in two inches round trip if you tried 
that on a memory bus.

What the manufacturer really means is that you, the designer, give me something 
slower, a few MHz, on a pin and I'll multiply it up to a 3 GHz clock that stays 
wholly inside the microprocessor. There we're dealing with much shorter path 
lengths.

The time delay in a wave guide is still limited by the speed of light. Bigger 
and longer doesn't get better.

Homework:

A 3000 mile cross country fiber is being driven at a rate of 3 Gb/sec. How many 
bits are in the pipe waiting to be read out?
-- 

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Re: Apple inside?

[Amanda Ward]

On Oct 25, 2010, at 4:55 PM, Stephen Conrad wrote:


On Mon, Oct 25, 2010 at 5:10 PM, Tina K.  wrote:
On 2010/10/25 14:48, Andrew Liu Anderson so eloquently wrote:
Sorry in advance if this is a bring-down for some folks. It's just  
time

that our world, Apple fans included, do a little slw-dn,
back-up & re-evaluate our values.

Not at all. I'm very happy with my PPC Macs (except for Flash of  
course) and there isn't a day that goes by that I'm not tempted to  
upgrade from Leopard to Tiger. By the time I see an Intel Mac, or  
Hackintosh, the Mac OS will probably be up to 10.9… iCougar?


We have lots of cats left on the list:

Asian Golden Cat
Fishing Cat
Wildcat (many varieties)
Sand Cat
Geoffroy's Cat
Serval
Caracal
Cheetah
Margay
Iriomote Cat

Jaguar & Leopard (used)
Black Panther (Panther has been used)
Puma (used)

Lynx
Bobcat

Lion (used)
Tiger (used)

--
Steve Conrad
Henrietta, MO 64036


Let's not forget Tabby and Calico! ;-)

Amanda

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Re: Latest G4 Shutdown

[Stephen Conrad]

On Mon, Oct 25, 2010 at 6:47 PM, Kris Tilford  wrote:

> On Oct 25, 2010, at 6:26 PM, Stephen Conrad wrote:
>
>  1.0 & 1.1 differ how?
>>
>
> USB 1.0: Released in January 1996.
> Specified data rates of 1.5 Mbit/s (Low-Bandwidth) and 12 Mbit/s
> (Full-Bandwidth). Does not allow for extension cables or pass-through
> monitors (due to timing and power limitations). Few such devices actually
> made it to market.
>
> USB 1.1: Released in September 1998.
> Fixed problems identified in 1.0, mostly relating to hubs. Earliest
> revision to be widely adopted.


Thanks Again!
I learn something new every day



-- 
Steve Conrad
Henrietta, MO 64036

"The time has come for mankind to grow up and leave its cradle behind; to go
forth and claim our place in outer space."
   - Capt. Henry Gloval


(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")
Help Bunny Take Over The World!

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Re: Apple inside?

[Stephen Conrad]

On Mon, Oct 25, 2010 at 5:10 PM, Tina K.  wrote:

> On 2010/10/25 14:48, Andrew Liu Anderson so eloquently wrote:
>
>> Sorry in advance if this is a bring-down for some folks. It's just time
>> that our world, Apple fans included, do a little slw-dn,
>> back-up & re-evaluate our values.
>>
>
> Not at all. I'm very happy with my PPC Macs (except for Flash of course)
> and there isn't a day that goes by that I'm not tempted to upgrade from
> Leopard to Tiger. By the time I see an Intel Mac, or Hackintosh, the Mac OS
> will probably be up to 10.9… iCougar?


We have lots of cats left on the list:

Asian Golden Cat

Fishing Cat

Wildcat (many varieties)

Sand Cat

Geoffroy's Cat

Serval

Caracal

Cheetah

Margay

Iriomote Cat


Jaguar & Leopard (used)

Black Panther (Panther has been used)

Puma (used)


Lynx

Bobcat


Lion (used)

Tiger (used)

-- 
Steve Conrad
Henrietta, MO 64036

"The time has come for mankind to grow up and leave its cradle behind; to go
forth and claim our place in outer space."
   - Capt. Henry Gloval


(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")
Help Bunny Take Over The World!

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Re: G4 monitor power?

[Doug McNutt]

At 14:48 -0700 10/24/10, MarkyB wrote:
>I sold my G4 MDD (epic sad face here) and I am about to set up my old
>G4 B&W. I've never had a use for the monitor power share on the PSU,
>but are there cords to which I can use that with a standard lcd
>screen?
>
>What I am talking about is the PSU has a male connector for its power
>cord, and a female connector for a pass through connection to the old
>CRT studio display if I am not mistaken?
>
>This will be my secondary PC as my ADC 20" is connected to the
>winblows machine and I need to keep it that way.

My G4 Sawtooth has such a configuration. The usage changed sometime after the 
IIFX so that power was simply paralleled with the input connection. My IIFX 
offered switched power for the female socket so that an associated monitor 
would have its power controlled by the Mac. No longer so on the Sawtooth and 
probably not for your B&W either.

The female connector is European style and requires a less than common cable 
with plastic around the male connector that prevents any human contact with the 
pins as it is being plugged in.  Early Apple products came with that kind of 
extension cord for a monitor with a connector on it as opposed to a built-in 
cord.

I suspect that kind of cord can still be found in stores but I have no 
suggestion. I know there's one on my IIFX but it looks as though I'm going to 
need it for some work I promised in January. The CAD on the G4, Vectorworks, 
won't open its own files from the IIFX era.  Sigh.

-- 

--> A fair tax is one that you pay but I don't <--

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Re: Latest G4 Shutdown

[Kris Tilford]

On Oct 25, 2010, at 6:26 PM, Stephen Conrad wrote:


1.0 & 1.1 differ how?


USB 1.0: Released in January 1996.
Specified data rates of 1.5 Mbit/s (Low-Bandwidth) and 12 Mbit/s (Full- 
Bandwidth). Does not allow for extension cables or pass-through  
monitors (due to timing and power limitations). Few such devices  
actually made it to market.


USB 1.1: Released in September 1998.
Fixed problems identified in 1.0, mostly relating to hubs. Earliest  
revision to be widely adopted.


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Re: Interesting Vintage Website

[Bruce Johnson]

On Oct 25, 2010, at 4:10 PM, Clark Martin wrote:

The TRS-80 was an over sized keyboard which connected a video  
monitor and cassette deck, in either case, either generic or their  
own model.  RS later did sell an upgraded model that was an all-in- 
one design with two 5.25 floppies.  on it.


My wife worked for a company that had one of those back in the mid- 
late 80's; she did word processing and spreadsheets on it. Her boss  
also had a Panasonic or Toshiba(?) semi-DOS compatible "laptop" with  
this huge (for the time) 12" plasma display. Really cool.


--
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs

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Re: Latest G4 Shutdown

[Stephen Conrad]

On Mon, Oct 25, 2010 at 6:13 PM, Kris Tilford  wrote:

> On Oct 24, 2010, at 6:55 AM, Stephen Conrad wrote:
>
>  It doesn't happen every day so I am wondering how to narrow this down.
>>
>
>  com.apple.driver.AppleUSBOHCI(2.5.5)@0x49b000
>>
>
> OHCI means it's a USB 1.0 or 1.1 device, not a USB 2.0.
>

Thank You! I just learned something
1.0 & 1.1 differ how?



-- 
Steve Conrad
Henrietta, MO 64036

"The time has come for mankind to grow up and leave its cradle behind; to go
forth and claim our place in outer space."
   - Capt. Henry Gloval


(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")
Help Bunny Take Over The World!

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Re: Interesting Vintage Website

[Clark Martin]

On Oct 25, 2010, at 9:11 AM, Stephen Conrad wrote:

> On Mon, Oct 25, 2010 at 6:09 AM, JoeTaxpayer  wrote:
> I remember the Radio Shack TRS-80, otherwise known as "trash-80".
> Played on it at store but never bought, I used a Commodore 64 at that
> time.
> 
> Lets see, in my life I have used
> 
> Education settings
> 
> 1) Apple ][e at my first HS and in my first college
> 2) TRS-80 at my second HS (in class) but it had an Apple ][e in the library.
>  I forget which TRS-80 model but I remember it was Blue
> 3) This is more complex but here goes. Another college I attended had various
>  Apple computers
>   a) LCII in MY dorm room but others had LCII or comparable computers
>   b) LC models in one computer lab, another lab had an SE/30, a Centris, a
>   Quadra, various II models and I think the odd SE model. This lab 
> had a few
>   PCs too
> 4) Various PCs at my last college
> 5) At an elementary school I did a 1 week stint as a Temp (Janitor) they had 
> an LC
>  with the Apple ][e card in it.

In HS we had two ASR-33 teletypes hooked up via acoustic coupler / modem to an 
HP model 2000E minicomputer.  Somewhere along the line we got real high class 
and got a CRT terminal.  That had a 300 baud acoustic coupler / modem, h, 
fast.  In college I had an 8080 system, a totally custom system I designed and 
built.  


Clark Martin
Redwood City, CA, USA
Macintosh / Internet Consulting

"I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway"

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Re: Latest G4 Shutdown

[Kris Tilford]

On Oct 24, 2010, at 6:55 AM, Stephen Conrad wrote:


It doesn't happen every day so I am wondering how to narrow this down.



com.apple.driver.AppleUSBOHCI(2.5.5)@0x49b000


OHCI means it's a USB 1.0 or 1.1 device, not a USB 2.0.

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Re: Interesting Vintage Website

[Clark Martin]

On Oct 24, 2010, at 11:13 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote:

> 
> On Oct 24, 2010, at 10:52 PM, Richard Gerome wrote:
> 
>> 
>> 
>>   The only computer from Radio Shack that I remember was the "Tandy Apple 
>> Clone" ... Never knew they made others too???
> 
> A whole string...Tandy/Radio Shack were pretty big early players in the 
> Personal Computer market.
> 
> The very first one I ever had access to was a TRS-80 
>  that a room-mate got on loan to help a 
> professor write a BASIC programming manual. 
> 
> We didn't even have a tape deck to store programs on, or a printer to print 
> out the source for the ones we did do. It spent a couple months on our dining 
> room table running a program that displayed a clock on the screen. This had 
> to be around 1979-1980. I didn't get my own computer until '84, a used Apple 
> ][+...used that for four years until I got my first Mac in 1988.


At one time the RS TRS-80 (Trash-80), Commodore Pet and the Apple ][ were big 
three of off-the-shelf personal computing.  They all had comparable abilities, 
built in basic, tape storage and so on.  

The TRS-80 was an over sized keyboard which connected a video monitor and 
cassette deck, in either case, either generic or their own model.  RS later did 
sell an upgraded model that was an all-in-one design with two 5.25 floppies.  
Radio Shack did, IIRC, sell a RS branded IBM pc compatible for a time but gave 
up after a while and started selling other brand pcs.


I got my ][+ in 1981 and moved up to a Mac 512K in 1985 (later upgraded to a 
512Ke and then Plus).  I donated the Apple ][+ after I got the Mac but I still 
have that first Mac.


Clark Martin
Redwood City, CA, USA
Macintosh / Internet Consulting

"I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway"

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Re: G3 DEAD

[Clark Martin]

On Oct 24, 2010, at 11:45 PM, MichaelP wrote:

> 
> Ive been using a Imac ruby very efficiently as a backup firewire connected to 
> a G4  via statrtup command T
> 
> 
> Except that today power failure left the G3 completely unstartable - no green 
> light no chime - zilch.
> 
> Stage 1  Yes the battery was low-low so I replaced it  -- ZERO effect
> 
> Stage 2 -  Looking for manuals to se if there's an internal reset button


There is, right near the battery.  It's about 3/4" toward the screen face from 
the battery.  

Clark Martin
Redwood City, CA, USA
Macintosh / Internet Consulting

"I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway"

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G4 hd problem

[Baldassare Guzzo]

Hi.  I lost my beloved quicksilver g4 to a ruthless ex wife in a divorce.  
After years, I  was able to scrounge up $100 for a "new" quicksilver g4 (the 
original ipaid like 2700).  It arrived in good shape but had two 128 gb hard 
drives arranged in a raid 0 array.  There is only 15gb or so used but when I 
tried to copy some files onto the g4 it said there was not enough hard drive 
space. But there is 200gb available. Any idea what is going on?  Thanks

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Re: Apple inside?

[Tina K.]

On 2010/10/25 14:48, Andrew Liu Anderson so eloquently wrote:

Sorry in advance if this is a bring-down for some folks. It's just time
that our world, Apple fans included, do a little slw-dn,
back-up & re-evaluate our values.


Not at all. I'm very happy with my PPC Macs (except for Flash of course) 
and there isn't a day that goes by that I'm not tempted to upgrade from 
Leopard to Tiger. By the time I see an Intel Mac, or Hackintosh, the Mac 
OS will probably be up to 10.9… iCougar?


Tina

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Power Mac June 04, 2 GHz G5 DP, 8 GB RAM, GeForce 6800 Ultra DDL 256 MB
PowerBook G4 15" Hi-Res DL-SD, 1.67 GHz G4, Radeon 9700 128 MB DDR

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Re: G5 power supply problems

[John Carmonne]

On Oct 25, 2010, at 12:55 PM, schaf...@comcast.net wrote:

> I have a late G5 2.3 dual-core Power Mac that has run 24/7 since I bought it 
> new in December 2005.  The only enhancement it received was a 2nd 250 GB HDD 
> and 4 GB of RAM.  A month or 2 ago it died instantly (there was a gunshot 
> like "pop", the screen went black and the power light was out 2 seconds later 
> when I looked, and the ensuing stench made me not try a restart).  My meager 
> training screamed "power supply", but that's just my uneducated guess.  
> Googling revealed a fault in my power supply that was covered by Apple until 
> January 2010, and a call to Apple Care resulted in an "I'm sorry" 
> determination of coverage.  Apparently the purchase of $7500 of Apple 
> products (w/o Apple Care purchases) in the last 8 years doesn't qualify me 
> for any "special" consideration.  OK.  My "local" (4 hr return trip) Apple 
> Store was unwilling to let me discuss anything with a "genius" and just 
> wanted me to bring it in.  The closest Apple certified repair center (about 
> the same distance) quoted a flat labor fee of $95 and a "new" Apple part cost 
> of $400(!?).  A relative Apple tech who works for a WA State university said 
> an exchange from Apple would be $150, so I presume this would be a 
> refurbished unit.  
> 
> My questions to anyone out there are:
> 1.  Has anyone else with the latest 1000 watt power supply had a failure on 
> the G5 PM?  
> 2.  If this power supply has failed (seems likely to me), what are the odds 
> that logic board, drives, memory, etc are OK?  I used an external FW drive 
> and it works fine w/my G4 PM (saved my bacon!!).  
> 3.  Anyone have an opinion, for my purposes, whether I'd be better served by 
> an Apple store or a cooperative 3rd party?  
> 
> I want my beloved child back!  Any help/advice from those who know better 
> than I would be MOST appreciated!  8^)
> 
> TIA
> 
>  - Peter
> 
> G5 2.3 dual-core, 4 GB RAM, 20" Acer LCD, 250 x2 HDD running SoftRaid 
> (mirror) running Tiger 10.4.11.
> G4 MDD 1.0 dual "wind tunnel", 320+80+80 HDD running Tiger 10.4.11.  
> 
I and some friends of mine have trusted our heavy lifting to Brian at DT&T 
Service in Fremont CA for a couple of years, They're honest and very fair 
priced plus fast turn around with a warranty. I always get my money's worth and 
extra.

http://www.dttservice.com/services.html

John Carmonne
Yorba Linda USA
Sent from my MBP




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Re: Apple inside?

[Andrew Liu Anderson]

Joshua Juran wrote:

. multiple cores  have gone mainstream as an alternative to 
increasing clock speed.   Whereas a small increase in performance 
costs you a large increase in  power consumption and heat generation, 
a reduction in performance  (maybe 10 or 20%) cuts the heat and power 
in half -- at which point  you can afford a second core, so overall 
performance is increased  (provided you can keep both cores busy). 


  Also, at 3GHz, you cross-over into the SHF range of micro-wave on 
radio spectrum. As frequency increases, "Skin Effect" of AC current 
becomes more dramatic, to where it becomes impossible to use ordinary 
conductors to carry your clock pulses, data, etc. from one component to 
the next. You have to start using "Wave Guides", or hollow tubes to 
transmit information along an information pathway. And the wave guides 
have to be tuned to the frequency you are using. The long and the short 
of it is that to keep going up in frequency, we would need to start 
going back up in size to accommodate wave guides, relays, etc. Soon we'd 
be seeing room-size computers again... Or at least IBM 360 console size. 
:-) Anyone remember punch-cards?


Cheers,
Drew


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Re: Apple inside?

[Andrew Liu Anderson]

Tina K. wrote:


On 2010/10/24 00:35, Brian Christmas so eloquently wrote:


The end of this race is a long way  away yet.



The finish line is constantly being moved, there is no end.

Tina

  Actually, it's more like the carrot in front of the horse's nose. As 
long as the horse is willing to keep chasing the carrot, he'll keep 
pulling the wagon... And the faster he runs, the faster the carrot 
moves. I can understand a beast not being able to figure that out for a 
while. But "Humans" not being able to figure it out, even after decades?


  Think of this: We're all ALPHA-TESTING OS-X! " Unexpectedly Quit. 
Report problem to Apple?" That's an Alpha-Test issue. When a highlighted 
item remains grey instead of turning blue when you return to the column 
where it is active, that's a Beta-Test issue. You can't even report 
that. Apple just wants to know about the Alpha-Test crashes... So... OS 
10.0 isn't even ready to start Beta-Testing yet, and they're already 
getting ready to release 10.7... OS 9 should never be released, it's too 
much of a memory pig. Actually, we're nearly finished Beta-Testing OS 
8.6, except that Apple stopped the process years ago.


  Even top-notch software developers can't work the bugs out of their 
programs before they have to release them, otherwise the next OS, or the 
next chip will obsolete the program & the'll have to start all over 
again... And we just keep chasing that carrot faster & faster, thinking 
they're going to let us catch it someday.


  Sorry in advance if this is a bring-down for some folks. It's just 
time that our world, Apple fans included, do a little 
slw-dn, back-up & re-evaluate our values.


Cheers,
Drew

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Re: IS the world about to change ?

[Ashgrove]

On Oct 25, 2:13 am, "Wallace Adrian D'Alessio"
 wrote:
>  That department has hundreds of Macs of all ages form the early Aught's to
> present. This department was put into a refurbed historic building and is
> state of the art for 3 years ago when it was completed. It replaces the
> building where the famous pisture was taken. You know the one Bruce. ( The
> rest of you can guess. I get tired of talking about it) .

Pray tell. You can't just be mysterious and allude to famous pictures
and get away with it. Spill.

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Re: Interesting Vintage Website

[Stephen Conrad]

On Mon, Oct 25, 2010 at 6:09 AM, JoeTaxpayer wrote:

> I remember the Radio Shack TRS-80, otherwise known as "trash-80".
> Played on it at store but never bought, I used a Commodore 64 at that
> time.
>

Lets see, in my life I have used

Education settings


1) Apple ][e at my first HS and in my first college

2) TRS-80 at my second HS (in class) but it had an Apple ][e in the library.

 I forget which TRS-80 model but I remember it was Blue

3) This is more complex but here goes. Another college I attended had
various

 Apple computers

  a) LCII in MY dorm room but others had LCII or comparable computers

  b) LC models in one computer lab, another lab had an SE/30, a Centris,
a

  Quadra, various II models and I think the odd SE model. This lab
had a few

  PCs too

4) Various PCs at my last college

5) At an elementary school I did a 1 week stint as a Temp (Janitor) they had
an LC

 with the Apple ][e card in it.


At home I have had:

NOTE: Not sure if the ADAM or C=64 came first


1) An Atari 2600 (I coveted the KB that I saw in a few ads). I never got
said KB

2) An ADAM Home Computer (from my Aunt). I still have it

3) A C=64 (from a friend). 1st one died and was sent in for repair. I still
have #2

 along with my 5.25" floppy drive (I may have more than one)

4) Mac Performa 405 with a StyleWriter II printer. This was for the family
but when

 dad upgraded it went to my room. Yep, I still have it.

5) PowerMac 6100. At first this was Dad's toy but it became the family
computer. It

 stayed with my parents till it died. Sent in for repairs it came back
as something

 else (I forget the model but it was a MB swap)

6) Was gone when this happened but Mom got an Apple IIgs. I covet this
machine!


Now a subset, those that I got on my own (in no particular order)


512K (2)

Plus (6, some have screen issues I am told I can fix by cleaning the MB)

SE

SE FDHD

IIcx

IIsi (2)

IIci (I *Heart* my IIci)

LC

Performa 405  (noted above)

Performa 450

Quadra 605

Quadra 650 MB

PowerMac 5260/100

PowerMac 5400/180 (both these machines are acting up)

PowerMac 8600/200

Blue & White G3 (a Smurf)

Quicksilver (800 MHz running Tiger 10.4.11)

Apple ][e (3, 2 are set up and 1 is gonna be a print spooler)

Apple //c

Franklin Ace 500 (Apple clone, it does not currently work)


And a Sun 3/60

An Atari (I cannot remember which model)


And my PC (in no order)


An HP that takes 8" Floppies

8088

8086

Various PCs (386, 486 and some Pentiums)



My local library is all PCs


>
> On Oct 25, 1:52 am, Richard Gerome  wrote:
> >The only computer from Radio Shack that I remember was the "Tandy
> Apple Clone" ... Never knew they made others too???-Original
> Message-
>
> --
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-- 
Steve Conrad
Henrietta, MO 64036

"The time has come for mankind to grow up and leave its cradle behind; to go
forth and claim our place in outer space."
   - Capt. Henry Gloval


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(='.'=)
(")_(")
Help Bunny Take Over The World!

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Re: Apple inside?

[Daniel Stewart]

As an interesting aside I there was also a PPC native version of
Windows NT 4.0   I guess MS was not content to just subject PC users
to NT.

On Sun, Oct 24, 2010 at 9:07 PM, Bruce Johnson
 wrote:
>
> On Oct 24, 2010, at 7:54 PM, James Therrault wrote:
>
>>
>> AIX was in use on Macs way before the PPC days.  I remember a developer 
>> using it in 1990...
>
>  AIX is IBM's proprietary frankenunix, you're thinking of A/UX, which was 
> Apple's port of System V:
>
>
> --
> Bruce Johnson
>
> "Wherever you go, there you are" B. Banzai,  PhD
>
> --
> You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for 
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> Macs.
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G4 monitor power?

[MarkyB]

I sold my G4 MDD (epic sad face here) and I am about to set up my old
G4 B&W. I've never had a use for the monitor power share on the PSU,
but are there cords to which I can use that with a standard lcd
screen?

What I am talking about is the PSU has a male connector for its power
cord, and a female connector for a pass through connection to the old
CRT studio display if I am not mistaken?

This will be my secondary PC as my ADC 20" is connected to the
winblows machine and I need to keep it that way.

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Re: Apple inside?

[daniel . stewart743]

I know they do but I still do not see how console systems relate to a PPC based 
mobile chip that went nowhere ultimately.  It was not a vanilla Cell chip but 
was based on the same tech.  If I remember correctly it was axed since nobody 
was looking to get into PPC based mobile devices to make it viable.  Given the 
timing of its announcement it seemed like they just completed it to publicly 
snub Apple as odd as that sounds.

Sent on the TELUS Mobility network with BlackBerry

-Original Message-
From: Bruce Johnson 
Sender: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com
Date: Sun, 24 Oct 2010 13:02:07 
To: 
Reply-To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple inside?


On Oct 24, 2010, at 12:07 PM, daniel.stewart...@gmail.com wrote:

> Apple went with Intel in a premature attempt to boost laptop sales  
> which was their second best seller after ipods.  The Cell procssor  
> would have been perfct for laptops which why the made one  
> specifically for that purpose.  I have no idea how an xbox has  
> anything to do with PPC based laptop.

The Xbox now runs on a variant of the Cell CPU. The Playstation 3 runs  
the Cell, too.

-- 
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs

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Latest G4 Shutdown

[Stephen Conrad]

It shut off last night and here is the error report
OK, I see the USB thing but HOW (ie where do I look) do I determine WHICH
USB device is doing this?

com.apple.driver.AppleUSBOHCI(2.5.5)@0x49b000
dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOUSBFamily(2.8.1)@0x467000

And what is this: dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOPCIFamily(1.7)@0x491000

It doesn't happen every day so I am wondering how to narrow this down.
Also, if one of the USB Flash Drives is going bad I want to replace it now
while it still works


Unresolved kernel trap(cpu 0): 0x300 - Data access DAR=0x
PC=0x004A44D0
Latest crash info for cpu 0:
   Exception state (sv=0x37B2FA00)
  PC=0x004A44D0; MSR=0x9030; DAR=0x; DSISR=0x4000;
LR=0x004A4620; R1=0x21C3BCA0; XCP=0x000C (0x300 - Data access)
  Backtrace:
0x004A4620 0x004A48A0 0x002D43D0 0x0003CA1C 0x000A9714
  Kernel loadable modules in backtrace (with dependencies):
 com.apple.driver.AppleUSBOHCI(2.5.5)@0x49b000
dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOUSBFamily(2.8.1)@0x467000
dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOPCIFamily(1.7)@0x491000
Proceeding back via exception chain:
   Exception state (sv=0x37B2FA00)
  previously dumped as "Latest" state. skipping...
   Exception state (sv=0x37AB6C80)
  PC=0x; MSR=0xD030; DAR=0x; DSISR=0x;
LR=0x; R1=0x; XCP=0x (Unknown)

Kernel version:
Darwin Kernel Version 8.11.0: Wed Oct 10 18:26:00 PDT 2007;
root:xnu-792.24.17~1/RELEASE_PPC
panic(cpu 0 caller 0x0003): 0x300 - Data access
Latest stack backtrace for cpu 0:
  Backtrace:
 0x000954F8 0x00095A10 0x00026898 0x000A8204 0x000ABB80
Proceeding back via exception chain:
   Exception state (sv=0x37B2FA00)
  PC=0x004A44D0; MSR=0x9030; DAR=0x; DSISR=0x4000;
LR=0x004A4620; R1=0x21C3BCA0; XCP=0x000C (0x300 - Data access)
  Backtrace:
0x004A4620 0x004A48A0 0x002D43D0 0x0003CA1C 0x000A9714
  Kernel loadable modules in backtrace (with dependencies):
 com.apple.driver.AppleUSBOHCI(2.5.5)@0x49b000
dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOUSBFamily(2.8.1)@0x467000
dependency: com.apple.iokit.IOPCIFamily(1.7)@0x491000
   Exception state (sv=0x37AB6C80)
  PC=0x; MSR=0xD030; DAR=0x; DSISR=0x;
LR=0x; R1=0x; XCP=0x (Unknown)

Kernel version:
Darwin Kernel Version 8.11.0: Wed Oct 10 18:26:00 PDT 2007;
root:xnu-792.24.17~1/RELEASE_PPC

-- 
Steve Conrad
Henrietta, MO 64036

"The time has come for mankind to grow up and leave its cradle behind; to go
forth and claim our place in outer space."
   - Capt. Henry Gloval


(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")
Help Bunny Take Over The World!

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Re: IS the world about to change ?

[Bruce Johnson]

On Oct 24, 2010, at 11:13 PM, Wallace Adrian D'Alessio wrote:

The ONLY reason our college has Mac support at ALL is me, and it's  
pure

happenstance that I work where I work, because I had some experience
programming, a teensy bit of database experience and a willingness  
to dive
into terra incognita to port the College's financial and alumni  
databases
from Ingres running on a Mini-Vax to a 'modern' Sybsase 4 system  
running on

a HP/Apollo minicomputer.



Sad. no media,journalism,art,music departments? How mundane !


I work at the College of Pharmacy at the University of Arizona. Those  
others are in the College of Arts and Sciences (a new college that was  
just created by jamming together the College of Liberal Arts and the  
College of Sciences as a money-saving move ).


They do have Macs, but the University has had it's state funding cut  
by 40% per student in the last ten years; and while we get to charge a  
special tuition, as a 'professional' graduate college, plus our  
research dollars, music is largely dependent on state funding.  A lot  
of 'ownership' in those colleges, as in 'yer own yer ownership'.


--
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs

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G5 power supply problems

[schaffpa]

I have a late G5 2.3 dual-core Power Mac that has run 24/7 since I bought it 
new in December 2005. The only enhancement it received was a 2nd 250 GB HDD and 
4 GB of RAM. A month or 2 ago it died instantly (there was a gunshot like 
"pop", the screen went black and the power light was out 2 seconds later when I 
looked, and the ensuing stench made me not try a restart). My meager training 
screamed "power supply", but that's just my uneducated guess. Googling revealed 
a fault in my power supply that was covered by Apple until January 2010, and a 
call to Apple Care resulted in an "I'm sorry" determination of coverage. 
Apparently the purchase of $7500 of Apple products (w/o Apple Care purchases) 
in the last 8 years doesn't qualify me for any "special" consideration. OK. My 
"local" (4 hr return trip) Apple Store was unwilling to let me discuss anything 
with a "genius" and just wanted me to bring it in. The closest Apple certified 
repair center (about the same distance) quoted a flat labor fee of $95 and a 
"new" Apple part cost of $400(!?). A relative Apple tech who works for a WA 
State university said an exchange from Apple would be $150, so I presume this 
would be a refurbished unit. 

My questions to anyone out there are: 
1. Has anyone else with the latest 1000 watt power supply had a failure on the 
G5 PM? 
2. If this power supply has failed (seems likely to me), what are the odds that 
logic board, drives, memory, etc are OK? I used an external FW drive and it 
works fine w/my G4 PM (saved my bacon!!). 
3. Anyone have an opinion, for my purposes, whether I'd be better served by an 
Apple store or a cooperative 3rd party? 

I want my beloved child back! Any help/advice from those who know better than I 
would be MOST appreciated! 8^) 

TIA 

- Peter 

G5 2.3 dual-core, 4 GB RAM, 20" Acer LCD, 250 x2 HDD running SoftRaid (mirror) 
running Tiger 10.4.11. 
G4 MDD 1.0 dual "wind tunnel", 320+80+80 HDD running Tiger 10.4.11. 

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Re: Flash only? WAS:Re: IS the world about to change ?

[Dan]

At 1:12 PM -0400 10/25/2010, John Martz wrote:

On Thu, Oct 21, 2010 at 2:16 PM, JoeTaxpayer wrote:
 > I never say never, but I've been watching this industry for nearly 30

 years, and suspect that until and unless SSD cost drops to a lower X
 of HD, both will be there side by side depending on the platform it
 goes in.


If you're going to discuss SSDs versus HDs then I suggest you also
consider the relatively recent availability of hybrid SSD-HDs.


Yea. sigh.  IMO, a stupid stupid idea.

It is akin to partial-hybrid cars, you know, the gas-powered ones 
with electric assist that get lower gas mileage than many of today's 
modern all-gas cars.  A stop gap for the industry to market to 
unsuspecting consumers, while they screw around instead of just 
putting out real hybrids (electric cars with gas assist) in the first 
place.



At the moment the only one I know of is Seagate's Momentus XT which I
understand to be a 7200 RPM 2.5" drive with the traditional 32MB RAM
cache but also a 4GB SSD. The pertinent difference here is probably
not so much the 4GB of SSD but whatever "dynamic caching" algorithms
Seagate has come up with. (I'm just guessing of course).


Let's think about this.

Instead of
  interface <-> cache <-> HD,
you now have
  interface <-> cache <-> big flash cache organized as a SSD <-> HD.

Think about that.  The firmware and hardware controllers, to drive 
the simpler design, have been in the field for years and are 
thoroughly debugged.  So now they're adding a massive layer of 
complexity...  How many firmware updates will there be? And how will 
your data suffer until they're released?  Oh wait - most of these 
devices don't have user updatable firmware!


Oh, but the performance of SSD!   yea.  heh.  If this is a laptop 
form factor, then you still have the power sucking HD behind things. 
If this is a desktop then what exactly will it do for you that a RAM 
Disk couldn't do better?  What happens when things gak before the 
write-through to the SSD then to the HD is completed?


And then there's the problem of the life span of the flash memory 
(thousands of writes, not millions).   Yea.  Let's take a 
high-quality data retention and high re-write life device, and strap 
a lower-quality brick to its forehead.  Sure the brick is faster. 
But it's still a brick.


heh.

- Dan.
--
- Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth.

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Re: Flash only? WAS:Re: IS the world about to change ?

[John Martz]

On Thu, Oct 21, 2010 at 2:16 PM, JoeTaxpayer  wrote:
> I never say never, but I've been watching this industry for nearly 30
> years, and suspect that until and unless SSD cost drops to a lower X
> of HD, both will be there side by side depending on the platform it
> goes in.

If you're going to discuss SSDs versus HDs then I suggest you also
consider the relatively recent availability of hybrid SSD-HDs.

At the moment the only one I know of is Seagate's Momentus XT which I
understand to be a 7200 RPM 2.5" drive with the traditional 32MB RAM
cache but also a 4GB SSD. The pertinent difference here is probably
not so much the 4GB of SSD but whatever "dynamic caching" algorithms
Seagate has come up with. (I'm just guessing of course).

At any rate, in "a lot" of situations you can get closer to SSD
performance in a HD for ~1.7 to 1.9x the cost of a 7200 RPM drive.  I
expect this price point to drop once the other manufacturer's start
selling their "me too" hybrids.

I expect the next step I'll take towards an SSD for my MacBook is
likely to be in this hybrid direction rather than an actual SSD. I'm
still in the waiting and watching phase at the moment.

-irrational john

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Re: G5 not taking keyboard input

[dc]

On Oct 25, 9:14 am, Nestamicky  wrote:

> I think that's the real problem herenot responding to
> keyboard input during boot.

At the risk of stating the obvious, the keyboard needs to be a wired
USB keyboard in order for startup shortcut commands to work. Are you
using a wireless keyboard?

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Re: G5 not taking keyboard input

[John Carmonne]

On Oct 25, 2010, at 6:14 AM, Nestamicky wrote:

> This machine is the 2 Ghz DP version, 2005.
> 
> It will chime and boot to the internal HD.
> 
> I lost the password so can't login.
> 
> I then try with the install DVD to reset the password.
> 
> It will not take any keyboard input combination to reset NVRAM, boot off 
> DVD---nothing.
> 
> The keyboard works because when I tried some password input it prints on 
> screen.
> 
> I took the HD out, put it back in and on an SATA channel it did not like. It 
> did not boot.
> 
> I changed it and it booted but this time without anything on screen. So I 
> messed things up, apparently, as it used to boot to login screen before.
> 
> So I removed and cleaned the tip of the video card. No luck.
> 
> I must also mention that I've removed RAM, battery, etc, to see if it's 
> locked with firmware that's preventing the keyboard input at boot, but no 
> luck. I think that's the real problem herenot responding to keyboard 
> input during boot.
> 
> Any help will be appreciated.
> 
> 
 Did you try all the USB ports? When you had it apart did you hold the CUDA 
switch down for 15 secs? If that doesn't help reseat the processors, then try 
to boot with an ASD DVD.


John Carmonne
Yorba Linda USA
Sent from my MBP




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Re: Max HDD size for G3 Clamshell

[John Carmonne]

On Oct 24, 2010, at 10:22 PM, Richard Gerome wrote:

> Hey John,
>   Can it be done on a Clamshell??? 
> 
> 
All I have for a G3 to try it on is a Wally 300 or a Wally G4 500 I'll give it 
a shot next week. A Clamshell ain't no fun to put a HDD in just to test.
John Carmonne
Yorba Linda USA
Sent from my MBP




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Re: G5 not taking keyboard input

[Mac User #330250]

--  Original message  --
Subject: Re: G5 not taking keyboard input
Date:Montag 25 Oktober 2010N
From:Kris Tilford 
To:  g3-5-list@googlegroups.com

> You are correct, something is very amiss if it won't accept keyboard
> commands such as Cmd-Opt-O-F to reset the NVRAM.

Cmd-Opt-O-F will get you into the Open Firmware command prompt.

Cmd-Opt-N-V will reset the NVRAM.
Cmd-Opt-P-R will zap the PRAM.

Opt held down will show the boot device selection screen.
C held will boot from the CD/DVD drive.


Other than that: Kris said it all.
Try his approach.


BTW, it should not matter at all at which SATA port the HDD is connected. It 
should boot just fine, because –like every BSD– the Mac OS X kernel has no 
difficulty finding the boot/root device. It should even work when booting the 
very same HDD from an external FireWire enclosure.


Cheers,
Andreas  aka  Mac User #330250

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Re: Apple inside?

[James Therrault]

On Oct 24, 2010, at 8:07 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote:



On Oct 24, 2010, at 7:54 PM, James Therrault wrote:



AIX was in use on Macs way before the PPC days.  I remember a  
developer using it in 1990...


 AIX is IBM's proprietary frankenunix, you're thinking of A/UX,  
which was Apple's port of System V:





You're right!  But I've got an excuse...

I'm old!

JT



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If you owe under $729k you probably qualify for Obama's Refi Program
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Re: G5 not taking keyboard input

[Kris Tilford]

What keyboard input are you using to attempt to boot the DVD, the "C"  
or the "Option" or both? Have you tried the USB ports on the front &  
the back for the keyboard? If you've removed the HD, and have the DVD  
in the optical drive, then it should default to the DVD to boot. Once  
the DVD boots, you can use Startup Disk on the DVD to select the DVD  
as the startup disk, and this should write this preference to NVRAM,  
and then when you replace the HD it should still boot to the DVD.


You are correct, something is very amiss if it won't accept keyboard  
commands such as Cmd-Opt-O-F to reset the NVRAM. Since you removed the  
PRAM battery the NVRAM should be reset already, but something isn't  
right. Once you boot the DVD, I'd run Disk Utility on the HD before  
selecting it as the boot drive in Startup Disk.


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G5 not taking keyboard input

[Nestamicky]

This machine is the 2 Ghz DP version, 2005.

It will chime and boot to the internal HD.

I lost the password so can't login.

I then try with the install DVD to reset the password.

It will not take any keyboard input combination to reset NVRAM, boot off 
DVD---nothing.


The keyboard works because when I tried some password input it prints on 
screen.


I took the HD out, put it back in and on an SATA channel it did not 
like. It did not boot.


I changed it and it booted but this time without anything on screen. So 
I messed things up, apparently, as it used to boot to login screen before.


So I removed and cleaned the tip of the video card. No luck.

I must also mention that I've removed RAM, battery, etc, to see if it's 
locked with firmware that's preventing the keyboard input at boot, but 
no luck. I think that's the real problem herenot responding to 
keyboard input during boot.


Any help will be appreciated.

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Re: Interesting Vintage Website

[JoeTaxpayer]

I remember the Radio Shack TRS-80, otherwise known as "trash-80".
Played on it at store but never bought, I used a Commodore 64 at that
time.

On Oct 25, 1:52 am, Richard Gerome  wrote:
>    The only computer from Radio Shack that I remember was the "Tandy Apple 
> Clone" ... Never knew they made others too???-Original Message-

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Re: G3 DEAD

[Tina K.]

On 2010/10/25 00:45, MichaelP so eloquently wrote:


Ive been using a Imac ruby very efficiently as a backup firewire
connected to a G4 via statrtup command T


Please do not hijack a thread by changing the subject line in a reply to 
an existing topic, instead create a new message with a new subject. That 
keeps the messages sorted by topic for those of us that keep our topics 
threaded.


Thank you.

Tina

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iMac 20" USB 2, 1.25 GHz G4, 2 GB RAM, GeForce FX 5200 Ultra 64 MB DDR
Power Mac June 04, 2 GHz G5 DP, 8 GB RAM, GeForce 6800 Ultra DDL 256 MB
PowerBook G4 15" Hi-Res DL-SD, 1.67 GHz G4, Radeon 9700 128 MB DDR

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