Re: Gig-E and Digital Audio question

[rtowsley]

Google was my friend :-)
Same for both Gig-e & D/A



-Original Message-
From: rtowsley 
To: g3-5-list 
Sent: Wed, Nov 16, 2011 3:27 pm
Subject: Gig-E and Digital Audio question


Does anyone know if the front panel power on / IO boards are the same for these?
I know the power supplies are the same.
Thx
BobT

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Gig-E and Digital Audio question

[rtowsley]

Does anyone know if the front panel power on / IO boards are the same for these?
I know the power supplies are the same.
Thx
BobT

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Re: Upgrade my Quicksilver

[Wayne Stewart]

Yes, that's a MDD CPU

On Nov 16, 12:30 pm, JoeTaxpayer  wrote:
> The eBay Listing I see says QS as you noted, but P/N 820-1452-A which
> looks like an MDD board.
> I added a SATA card to my MDD and am happy I did it. Extra RAM can't
> hurt.

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Re: Weather Widget fix 10.5.8

[JohnCarmonne]

On Nov 16, 2011, at 12:25 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote:

> 
> On Nov 16, 2011, at 12:08 PM, David W. Morris wrote:
> 
>> Can you explain exact step by step for number 4 below?  Also, must step 2 be 
>> compressed to move it to the desktop?
>> 
> 
> No it doesn't. But it is handy to keep it all together in case you need to 
> replace it.
> 
>> Can all of this be done by putting the 10.6 Install DVD into a G4 PowerBook, 
>> or do I need to do these steps on my Intel MacMini and transfer the files 
>> with a USB stick to the G4 PowerBook?
> 
> Do it on the Mini with the USB stick.
> 
> -- 
> Bruce Johnson
> University of Arizona
> College of Pharmacy
> Information Technology Group
> 
> Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs

Since I got Drop Box the USB sticks are collecting dust. It makes these kind of 
transfers effortless:-)


John Carmonne
Yorba Linda CA
92886 USA
MacPro 2.66 Quad Nehalem






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Re: hacking for a slimmer world

[broosg]

I like the SATA drive idea as well.  A couple of weeks ago I found out you can 
have it both ways.  There is a simple cable adapter made that you connect to 
the 68-pin SCSI card and it leads out 4 SATA cables.  I have not found anyone 
who has tried these, but the discussion on this web page indicates it works in 
servers where these folks have tried it.

http://www.dealextreme.com/p/4-in-1-sata-to-scsi-hard-disk-data-cable-1940

The nice thing about this is that you can use a SCSI card that actually runs in 
64 bit PCI mode that was made specifically as a fast HD adapter for the G4s as 
your SATA adapter.  I can find no SATA adapter that is 64 bit PCI, so this 
might just make a faster interface for a SATA drive than the SATA cards out 
there.

Bruce



- Original Message -
From: dc 
To: G-Group 
Sent: Wed, 16 Nov 2011 11:53:11 - (UTC)
Subject: Re: hacking for a slimmer world

On Nov 15, 12:21 pm, Jesse  wrote:
> So what are the best drives and cards for scsi?

I agree with Dan, a SATA PCI card and 10K SATA (Raptor) drive is fast
and reusable in G5, MacPro, and PC machines. I do think SCSI drives
are cheaper right now. There are ATTO UL2x and UL3x cards for under
$25, 15K 36GB drives also around $25. They can also be reused in G5s
and other machines. The advantage of SCSI drives over IDE isn't so
much in the transfer speed as it is in the latency & seek/read/write
times. I don't have specific benchmarks now as I'm onto a MacPro, all
my SCSI machines are in storage (I probably should give them away).
But I've put fast SCSI drives in Macs from a 7200, beige G3, Smurf G3,
PCI G4, AGP G4s, etc. and they have always made noticable real world
speed improvement.

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Re: hacking for a slimmer world

[Bruce Johnson]

On Nov 16, 2011, at 8:24 AM, Bruce Godfrey wrote:

> As for YouTube, I have a question about that -
> How much difference does the video card make in playing Flash stuff?  

Very little. Flash is almost entirely CPU bound. It's faster on your G4 versus 
your G3 because the G4 is faster.

-- 
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs


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Re: hacking for a slimmer world

[Bruce Godfrey]

I have a 15k U320 SCSI drive booting my system now, whereas before I had 
the slower of the two IDE drives in that position.  The computer is 
definitely more responsive now.  Applications open faster and documents 
save faster.  Overall boot up time from being turned on isn't much 
different, but when the computer is on and I am just logging in my 
desktop appears faster.
I do not have a comparison between the SCSI drive and the faster of the 
two IDE drives at the moment.  I am thinking of putting another fast IDE 
drive in here and cloning my old system drive onto it and then swapping 
them.  That would make for a better comparison.


As for YouTube, I have a question about that -
How much difference does the video card make in playing Flash stuff?  I 
used to have a Beige G3 with Panther on it and a Radeon 9200 PCI video 
card.  You could easily watch DVD movies on it, but YouTube was 
sketchy.  This MDD has a 9800 Pro.  YouTube works fine unless it is 
large HD video.  Sharing a desktop in Skype is horrible.That makes 
me wonder if Skype uses the video card at all.  And it makes me wonder 
how much Flash even uses a video card.


Bruce


Nestamicky wrote:

On 15/11/11 8:21 AM, Bruce Godfrey wrote:

dc, do you have any data on how much difference a fast SCSI drive makes
in a MDD or similar G$ Mac?  I just installed one and I have used Disk
Speed Bench X to test the transfer speed.  I find 80MB/sec.  My original
IDE Hitachi Deskstar on the ATA100 bus is only moving about 50MB/sec.
However, another WD drive on the same ATA 100 bus is also moving 
80MB/sec.

I was hoping the 15K U320 SCSI drive would easily beat a good IDE drive,
but that does not appear to be the case.  Is it maybe the kind of test
Disk Speed Bench X performs?
Bruce, I wished you'd seen my thread here on getting the most out of a 
G4. In there I'd proposed using SCSI disks and I think it was pharmacy 
Bruce who pointed out that I won't be getting much out of it.


I think I'm known here as one of the dinosaurs who refuse to buy newer 
and better machines simply, for example, to be able to watch YouTube 
videos. So, I've come to accept that my macs are being "programmed" 
out of some websites and applications, and have stopped trying to 
"deprogram" them. I reckon there will come a time when text edit would 
be the champ on a G4, if I want to stay with OS X.




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Re: Fed up with Google changes on browsers in Tiger

[Applemac G3,G5]

Unnecessary tweaking of browsers is one of the more aggravating ways
that online content providers have of making old computers obsolete.
I'm running a Powermac G5 with 10.5.8 and really have no issues at
this point, but keep in mind that the G5 line of towers logged an
early reliability record which was rather poor for Apple computers.
Not sure if that has improved with time, I'm happy with mine thus
far.  Why not just get rid of Google?

On Nov 16, 1:57 am, a1  wrote:
> I use Panther and Tiger on my G4 and other macs, usually switching
> between Omniweb, Camino and sometimes Opera. I gave up on Firefox and
> 10.4 Fox simply because I dont want to do jumping jacks simply in
> order to watch youtube or facebook videos. I am utterly fed up with
> what Google did to Reader, and now, gchat within gmail and even
> opening gmail messages has gotten flaky, unreliable. I have always
> used webmail and browser apps but I have simply had enough. So, some
> questions, hardware and software.
>
> Hardware: I am either going to radically upgrade the G4 or buy one of
> the G5's I see flooding the market here. Am I really going to have
> great relief upgrading to Leopard on a G5 or is it only a matter of
> time before Google starts messing with the compatibility of browsers
> for Leopard, too? Between Firefox, Google and Apple "sunsetting" their
> products prematurely, simultaneously really, a PPC user seemingly has
> nowhere to turn. Incidentally, would an older IDE hard drive simply
> plug in and work in a G5 for migration purposes?
>
> Software: I really, really need an RSS reader that will remain
> reliable with Tiger. And, I really need an email program I can suck my
> gmail out of Google without bothering anymore with their webmail. I
> tried Thunderbird for a while but disliked the user interface,
> specifically an inability to make the text in panes larger. I have
> never gotten a version of Apple Mail to work with gmail. I want to
> leave browsing to a minimum as at this juncture none of the browsers
> really are pleasant.
>
> My internet days go back to vax machines and Elm mail, running Usenet
> off a shell, and text-only telnet. All this modeming into an ISP using
> my color classic. I was much happier then! I have never been so
> annoyed at online experience as these days. Do people use Terminal for
> email or any way around the suffocation of the upgrade curve?

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Re: Weather Widget fix 10.5.8

[Roger Hodge]

Also worked on my G5 with Tiger... :)

Thanks

On Nov 16, 2011, at 3:25 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote:



On Nov 16, 2011, at 12:08 PM, David W. Morris wrote:

Can you explain exact step by step for number 4 below?  Also, must  
step 2 be compressed to move it to the desktop?




No it doesn't. But it is handy to keep it all together in case you  
need to replace it.


Can all of this be done by putting the 10.6 Install DVD into a G4  
PowerBook, or do I need to do these steps on my Intel MacMini and  
transfer the files with a USB stick to the G4 PowerBook?


Do it on the Mini with the USB stick.

--
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs


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Re: Upgrade my Quicksilver

[JoeTaxpayer]

The eBay Listing I see says QS as you noted, but P/N 820-1452-A which
looks like an MDD board.
I added a SATA card to my MDD and am happy I did it. Extra RAM can't
hurt.

On Nov 16, 11:09 am, "Gene Henley"  wrote:
> I am trying to upgrade my Quicksilver 733Mhz.
>  I`m open for most suggestions EXCEPT "Get
>  rid of it and buy a G5." PLEASE!
>  I have Tiger,and 1 gig of memory. I was given
>  a 1 gig QuicksilverCPU,unknown reliability.
>  I have a SATA internal drive which I have
>  been advised will give me a faster computer if
>  an internal SATA card and driveare installed
>  What are opinions about the Highpoint Rocket
>    SATA PCI-Express 2.0X1 controller?
>  An ebay seller advertizes a 1.25 Gig "Quicksilver"
>   CPU without heat sink. I`m confused. I did not know
>   Quicksilver was 1.25 gig cpu spec.
>   capable. Maybe that CPU is actually MDD?
> I`m listening.
>                                    Thanks
> Cheers
>
> Gene

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Re: Weather Widget fix 10.5.8

[Bruce Johnson]

On Nov 16, 2011, at 12:08 PM, David W. Morris wrote:

> Can you explain exact step by step for number 4 below?  Also, must step 2 be 
> compressed to move it to the desktop?
> 

No it doesn't. But it is handy to keep it all together in case you need to 
replace it.

> Can all of this be done by putting the 10.6 Install DVD into a G4 PowerBook, 
> or do I need to do these steps on my Intel MacMini and transfer the files 
> with a USB stick to the G4 PowerBook?

Do it on the Mini with the USB stick.

-- 
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs


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Re: Weather Widget fix 10.5.8

[Kris Tilford]

On Nov 16, 2011, at 12:32 PM, JOHN CARMONNE wrote:


This works like a charm to fix Weather Widget in 10.5.8



WeatherBug Alert is a simple menu bar extra.

Doesn't eat resources or cause problems like some widgets.



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Re: Weather Widget fix 10.5.8

[David W. Morris]

Can you explain exact step by step for number 4 below?  Also, must  
step 2 be compressed to move it to the desktop?


Can all of this be done by putting the 10.6 Install DVD into a G4  
PowerBook, or do I need to do these steps on my Intel MacMini and  
transfer the files with a USB stick to the G4 PowerBook?


Thanks for this tip.

David


On Nov 16, 2011, at 10:32 AM, JOHN CARMONNE wrote:


This works like a charm to fix Weather Widget in  10.5.8


1. Have access to 10.6.x

2. Compress System/Library/WidgetResources, to move to desk top.

3. Replace 10.5 System/Library/WidgetResources with 10.6 System/ 
Library/WidgetResources


4. Also swap weather widgets from 10.5 and 10.6

5. Repair permissions


John Carmonne
Yorba Linda CA 92886
From iMac Core Duo 2.0



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Re: PCI question

[Justin Porterfield]

These are 64bit PCI slots, not PCI-X, there is a huge difference. There was
an early G5 PowerMac that had PCI-X slots but no G4 ever did.


>
> Picture of a G4 MDD showing the PCI-X slots on the left hand side:
>
> http://guide-images.ifixit.**net/igi/YU2gIgVCdH1L3hSa
>
> I believe the Quicksilver motherboards has PCI-X as well:
>
> http://www.recycledgoods.com/**product_images/u/653/s_p_**
> 22951_1__73791_zoom.jpg
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Brielle Bruns
> The Summit Open Source Development Group
> http://www.sosdg.org/ http://www.ahbl.org
>
> --
> You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for
> those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power
> Macs.
> The list FAQ is at 
> http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-**list.shtmland
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> group/g3-5-list 
>

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Weather Widget fix 10.5.8

[JOHN CARMONNE]

This works like a charm to fix Weather Widget in  10.5.8


1. Have access to 10.6.x

2. Compress System/Library/WidgetResources, to move to desk top.

3. Replace 10.5 System/Library/WidgetResources with 10.6 System/ 
Library/WidgetResources


4. Also swap weather widgets from 10.5 and 10.6

5. Repair permissions


John Carmonne
Yorba Linda CA 92886
From iMac Core Duo 2.0



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Re: PCI question

[peterhaas]

> Why are the PCI ports on the PowerMac G4s so long? On PCs they are
> about 3 1/2" long but on a PowerMac G4 they are about 5"

The early, low integration PCI cards needed all the space which could be
provided by the original IBM specification for the PC.

Still, even on a late Mac PPC, long cards can be a requirement.

See the Mylex (now LSI Logic) DAC960-series of RAID cards, for example.

Although highly integrated, these have cache RAM, battery backup,
independent SCSI processors for up to four channels and, of course, the
i960 RISC engine, all of which take up space.


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Re: PCI question

[Brielle Bruns]

On 11/16/11 10:41 AM, Brielle Bruns wrote:

No. The long slots in a G4 are NOT PCI-X. The original PCI slot spec
allows for a long version that requires the extra slot length.




Uh, I think your confusing full length cards and regular length cards.
Both of which could be PCI or PCI-X. Card length is not the same as slot
length.

The G4 has PCI-X slots - I have a MDD sitting here, next to me, with a
PCI-X fibre channel card running in 64bit, albeit its the older PCI-X
standard so it only runs 33mhz.

Just confirmed this with Mactracker - there's 4 PCI-X 64bit/33mhz slots.





For future reference, handy chart helping you figure out what kind of 
PCI slot you are looking at:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:PCI_Keying.png

Some background on PCI-X, it was created before PCIe came into 
existence, as a way of giving servers and high end desktops the ability 
to use more high bandwidth needing devices such as fibrechannel cards. 
By default, PCI runs at 32bit/33mhz, which doesn't really have the 
bandwidth necessary to support the kind of performance the card is 
capable of.


The extra slot length adds more bus pins - specifically the ability for 
the card to activate 64bit mode and the extra pins needed to do those 
transfers.


Provided the card supports 32bit operation (which most do, albeit much 
slower speeds), you can take a PCI-X card and put it in a PCI slot and 
it will work.


PCI-X also added the ability to clock the cards higher then 33mhz - both 
on 32bit and 64bit cards.  Towards the mid to end of PCI's lifetime, 
regular PCI slots could have the ability to do 66mhz and higher provided 
the chipset supported it.



Picture of a G4 MDD showing the PCI-X slots on the left hand side:

http://guide-images.ifixit.net/igi/YU2gIgVCdH1L3hSa

I believe the Quicksilver motherboards has PCI-X as well:

http://www.recycledgoods.com/product_images/u/653/s_p_22951_1__73791_zoom.jpg





--
Brielle Bruns
The Summit Open Source Development Group
http://www.sosdg.org/ http://www.ahbl.org

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Re: PCI question

[JohnV]

 I ran into this recently trying to get a ppc G5 MOTU audio card.  
even with a long detailed conversation on teh phone with a MOTu tech  
advisor, we STILL got teh wrong card shipped to me.




PCI-X - its fully backwards compatible with regular PCI, but can  
operate at 64bit and 66mhz or higher depending on chipset  
capabilities.  More common in servers then desktop machines.


Shouldn't be confused with PCIe, which is a completely different  
beast.  :)


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Re: PCI question

[Eric Hall]

According to this from Apple, no G4 has PCI-X: 
http://support.apple.com/kb/ht3082




From: Valter Prahlad 
To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2011 11:45 AM
Subject: Re: PCI question

Il giorno 16-11-2011 18:41, Brielle Bruns ha scritto:

> The G4 has PCI-X slots - I have a MDD sitting here, next to me, with a
> PCI-X fibre channel card running in 64bit, albeit its the older PCI-X
> standard so it only runs 33mhz.
> 
> Just confirmed this with Mactracker - there's 4 PCI-X 64bit/33mhz slots.

Uh... I thought only G5s had PCI-X.

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Re: PCI question

[Brielle Bruns]

On 11/16/11 10:45 AM, Valter Prahlad wrote:

Il giorno 16-11-2011 18:41, Brielle Bruns ha scritto:


The G4 has PCI-X slots - I have a MDD sitting here, next to me, with a
PCI-X fibre channel card running in 64bit, albeit its the older PCI-X
standard so it only runs 33mhz.

Just confirmed this with Mactracker - there's 4 PCI-X 64bit/33mhz slots.


Uh... I thought only G5s had PCI-X.

Actually my MacTracker (version 5.3) says all G4 MDD have 4 PCI (64-bit 33
MHz) and 1 AGP slots.
Maybe you have a newer version of MacTracker?




If its 64bit, then it has to be PCI-X.  The extra 2 inches of slot size 
are where the extra signals necessary to support the higher speed and 
wider bus transfers come from.  That's part of how they managed to keep 
backwards compatibility with regular PCI.


You may be thinking of PCIe, which is in the late 2005 G5s and Intel 
macs, which is a completely different beast.



I have MacTracker 6.1.

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Re: PCI question

[Valter Prahlad]

Il giorno 16-11-2011 18:41, Brielle Bruns ha scritto:

> The G4 has PCI-X slots - I have a MDD sitting here, next to me, with a
> PCI-X fibre channel card running in 64bit, albeit its the older PCI-X
> standard so it only runs 33mhz.
> 
> Just confirmed this with Mactracker - there's 4 PCI-X 64bit/33mhz slots.

Uh... I thought only G5s had PCI-X.

Actually my MacTracker (version 5.3) says all G4 MDD have 4 PCI (64-bit 33
MHz) and 1 AGP slots.
Maybe you have a newer version of MacTracker?

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Re: PCI question

[Brielle Bruns]

On 11/16/11 10:32 AM, Bruce Johnson wrote:


On Nov 16, 2011, at 10:30 AM, Brielle Bruns wrote:


On 11/16/11 10:22 AM, Alex Barnes wrote:

Why are the PCI ports on the PowerMac G4s so long? On PCs they
are about 3 1/2" long but on a PowerMac G4 they are about 5"




PCI-X - its fully backwards compatible with regular PCI, but can
operate at 64bit and 66mhz or higher depending on chipset
capabilities.  More common in servers then desktop machines.


No. The long slots in a G4 are NOT PCI-X. The original PCI slot spec
allows for a long version that requires the extra slot length.




Uh, I think your confusing full length cards and regular length cards. 
Both of which could be PCI or PCI-X.  Card length is not the same as 
slot length.


The G4 has PCI-X slots - I have a MDD sitting here, next to me, with a 
PCI-X fibre channel card running in 64bit, albeit its the older PCI-X 
standard so it only runs 33mhz.


Just confirmed this with Mactracker - there's 4 PCI-X 64bit/33mhz slots.


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Re: PCI question

[Bruce Johnson]

On Nov 16, 2011, at 10:30 AM, Brielle Bruns wrote:

> On 11/16/11 10:22 AM, Alex Barnes wrote:
>> Why are the PCI ports on the PowerMac G4s so long? On PCs they are about
>> 3 1/2" long but on a PowerMac G4 they are about 5"
>> 
> 
> 
> PCI-X - its fully backwards compatible with regular PCI, but can operate at 
> 64bit and 66mhz or higher depending on chipset capabilities.  More common in 
> servers then desktop machines.

No. The long slots in a G4 are NOT PCI-X. The original PCI slot spec allows for 
a long version that requires the extra slot length. 

-- 
Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs


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Re: PCI question

[Bruce Johnson]

On Nov 16, 2011, at 10:22 AM, Alex Barnes wrote:

> Why are the PCI ports on the PowerMac G4s so long? On PCs they are about 3 
> 1/2" long but on a PowerMac G4 they are about 5"

There are multiple standards for the PCI spec, and some long cards. The slots 
in the Mac fit both, the PC ones don't.

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Re: PCI question

[Brielle Bruns]

On 11/16/11 10:22 AM, Alex Barnes wrote:

Why are the PCI ports on the PowerMac G4s so long? On PCs they are about
3 1/2" long but on a PowerMac G4 they are about 5"




PCI-X - its fully backwards compatible with regular PCI, but can operate 
at 64bit and 66mhz or higher depending on chipset capabilities.  More 
common in servers then desktop machines.



Shouldn't be confused with PCIe, which is a completely different beast.  :)


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Re: PCI question

[Valter Prahlad]

Il giorno 16-11-2011 18:22, Alex Barnes ha scritto:

> Why are the PCI ports on the PowerMac G4s so long? On PCs they are
> about 3 1/2" long but on a PowerMac G4 they are about 5"

I'm no hardware expert, but I think the short ones are 32-bit, and longer
ones are 64-bit.

Actually there are at least 4 different kind of PCI slots, and 6 kind of PCI
card "plugs" (combinations of 32- and 64-bit, 3.3 and 5V)
If you look into "PCI" on Wikipedia, you'll easily find out.

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Re: Fed up with Google changes on browsers in Tiger

[Valter Prahlad]

Il giorno 16-11-2011 7:57, a1 ha scritto:

> Hardware: I am either going to radically upgrade the G4 or buy one of
> the G5's I see flooding the market here.
Dollar-wise, I suggest you going to the G5.
I did (from a G4 1.4GHz to a G5 2.7 DP), and I'm happy. Speed more than
doubled. :-)

> Am I really going to have great relief upgrading to Leopard on a G5
Some people dislike Leopard, and still prefer Tiger. Do some research before
upgrade.
Besides, Leopard dropped Classic.

> or is it only a matter of
> time before Google starts messing with the compatibility of browsers
> for Leopard, too?
Obviously, it is. ;-)

Everything in the Universe is decaying... and computers are the fastest.

> Incidentally, would an older IDE hard drive simply
> plug in and work in a G5 for migration purposes?
Nope.
G5s use SATA drives, not IDE.

Simpler way to migrate - IMHO - is thru Firewire Target disk mode, using
Carbon Copy Cloner (or similar).

> And, I really need an email program I can suck my
> gmail out of Google without bothering anymore with their webmail.
I'm still using Outlook Express 5.0.6 (thru Classic).
Thinking about evolving, I tried several mail client, but liked none.
Microsoft Entourage was the one I liked more, thou.

> My internet days go back to vax machines and Elm mail, running Usenet
> off a shell, and text-only telnet. [...]
> I was much happier then!
... maybe because you were young? ;-)

> I have never been so
> annoyed at online experience as these days.
Jokes apart, I agree the constant "evolution" in online technologies and
gizmos is mostly stressing. But I think it's just unavoidable.

I presume our parents felt the same way, when we were young and liked
rock'n'roll. :-D

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PCI question

[Alex Barnes]

Why are the PCI ports on the PowerMac G4s so long? On PCs they are  
about 3 1/2" long but on a PowerMac G4 they are about 5"


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Re: Upgrade my Quicksilver

[Valter Prahlad]

Il giorno 16-11-2011 17:09, Gene Henley ha scritto:

> I am trying to upgrade my Quicksilver 733Mhz.
> I have Tiger,and 1 gig of memory.
I had a very similar G4 (G4 DA 667).

IMHO, 1GB Ram is enough for common use, but it's not if you're using
"heavyweight" apps (Adobe InDesign and Photoshop, and the like), or you like
keeping lots of apps open.
Upgrading to 1,5GB (Quicksilver's max) can somehow improve speed, I think.

> I was given a 1 gig QuicksilverCPU,unknown reliability.
I installed an OWC 1,4GHz CPU upgrade, and it was really worth it, most
tasks improved a lot.
At around 200$ new (I think), it wouldn't be very much dollar-wise, but I
presume you can find a used one.

I think a CPU upgrade is the most speed-effective upgrade you can do.
Second one would be a better graphic card, especially if you're into
videogames (I am :-).
Which graphic card you actually have?

> I have a SATA internal drive which I have
> been advised will give me a faster computer if
> an internal SATA card and driveare installed
IMHO, you won't see much of an improvement, because of the inner limitation
of the PCI bus. 
Perhaps a modern and big IDE drive would give you the same speed
improvement, and in a simpler way.
(a SATA drive would make transition to a future G5 - or better - simpler,
thou)

BTW, there's a simple hack to make drives bigger than 128GB totally usable
in old G4s (in OSX, at least).

> An ebay seller advertizes a 1.25 Gig "Quicksilver"
> CPU without heat sink. I`m confused. I did not know
> Quicksilver was 1.25 gig cpu spec. capable.
AFAIK, QS went up to 1.0 GHz and no more.


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Re: Fed up with Google changes on browsers in Tiger

[Bruce Johnson]

On Nov 15, 2011, at 11:57 PM, a1 wrote:

>  Do people use Terminal for
> email or any way around the suffocation of the upgrade curve?

pine works with OS X and any imap provider, which gmail is...

 as does it's successor alpine 
 There are OS X binaries of all UW 
products there, although you don't need to install pico, it's already present.

I know lots of folks who like to use pine.


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Re: Fed up with Google changes on browsers in Tiger

[Bruce Johnson]

On Nov 16, 2011, at 7:36 AM, Baldassare Guzzo wrote:

>>> 
>>> I have
>>> never gotten a version of Apple Mail to work with gmail.
> 
> 
> What do you mean?  I use Apple Mail to work with gMail and it works very 
> good.  What is it doing or not doing?

Me as well; I've used Gmail with OS X since 10.2 with never an issue.

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Re: Upgrade my Quicksilver

[Jeffrey Engle]

This card will not work in your machine as it is PCI-e. You need a card that is 
PCI.
On Nov 16, 2011, at 8:09 AM, Gene Henley wrote:

> Highpoint Rocket   SATA PCI-Express 2.0X1 controller

Jeffrey Engle
Kamiah, Idaho 83536
macgu...@gmail.com





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Upgrade my Quicksilver

[Gene Henley]

I am trying to upgrade my Quicksilver 733Mhz.
I`m open for most suggestions EXCEPT "Get
rid of it and buy a G5." PLEASE!
I have Tiger,and 1 gig of memory. I was given
a 1 gig QuicksilverCPU,unknown reliability.
I have a SATA internal drive which I have
been advised will give me a faster computer if
an internal SATA card and driveare installed
What are opinions about the Highpoint Rocket 
  SATA PCI-Express 2.0X1 controller?
An ebay seller advertizes a 1.25 Gig "Quicksilver" 
 CPU without heat sink. I`m confused. I did not know 
 Quicksilver was 1.25 gig cpu spec.

 capable. Maybe that CPU is actually MDD?
I`m listening.
  Thanks 
Cheers

Gene


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Re: hacking for a slimmer world

[Stephen E. Bodnar]

On 11/16/11 2:54 AM, dc wrote:

On Nov 15, 9:01 pm, "Stephen E. Bodnar"  wrote:

I'll keep my ears open. We live up on Purtov now and have a pretty
active feeder, but Switgard and Lars will be over in Germany for
Christmas.  If somebody wants to sit in our kitchen drinking hot
buttered rums and counting birds, that's OK too.


I forgot to mention, this is the most random Mac advice I've read i a
long time!



Oopsie, posted to the wrong list! Any bird brains around here doing the 
Christmas bird count this year? We compile the results on a Mac ;-)


Stephen

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Re: Fed up with Google changes on browsers in Tiger

[Baldassare Guzzo]

I have
never gotten a version of Apple Mail to work with gmail.



What do you mean?  I use Apple Mail to work with gMail and it works  
very good.  What is it doing or not doing?


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Re: Fed up with Google changes on browsers in Tiger

[Jesse]

Sent from my iPhone 4





On Nov 16, 2011, at 12:57 AM, a1  wrote:

> I use Panther and Tiger on my G4 and other macs, usually switching
> between Omniweb, Camino and sometimes Opera. I gave up on Firefox and
> 10.4 Fox simply because I dont want to do jumping jacks simply in
> order to watch youtube or facebook videos. I am utterly fed up with
> what Google did to Reader, and now, gchat within gmail and even
> opening gmail messages has gotten flaky, unreliable. I have always
> used webmail and browser apps but I have simply had enough. So, some
> questions, hardware and software.
> 
> Hardware: I am either going to radically upgrade the G4 or buy one of
> the G5's I see flooding the market here. Am I really going to have
> great relief upgrading to Leopard on a G5 or is it only a matter of
> time before Google starts messing with the compatibility of browsers
> for Leopard, too? Between Firefox, Google and Apple "sunsetting" their
> products prematurely, simultaneously really, a PPC user seemingly has
> nowhere to turn. Incidentally, would an older IDE hard drive simply
> plug in and work in a G5 for migration purposes?
> 
> Software: I really, really need an RSS reader that will remain
> reliable with Tiger. And, I really need an email program I can suck my
> gmail out of Google without bothering anymore with their webmail. I
> tried Thunderbird for a while but disliked the user interface,
> specifically an inability to make the text in panes larger.


> I have
> never gotten a version of Apple Mail to work with gmail.

I have. It works pretty good actually, better than hotmail and apples mail


> I want to
> leave browsing to a minimum as at this juncture none of the browsers
> really are pleasant.
> 
> My internet days go back to vax machines and Elm mail, running Usenet
> off a shell, and text-only telnet. All this modeming into an ISP using
> my color classic. I was much happier then! I have never been so
> annoyed at online experience as these days. Do people use Terminal for
> email or any way around the suffocation of the upgrade curve?
> 
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> Macs.
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Re: hacking for a slimmer world

[Nestamicky]

On 11/11/11 12:43 PM, peterh...@cruzio.com wrote:

Perhaps my perspective is different, or perhaps distorted by a space-time
continuum.
..or perhaps you're being asked to put forward evidence of what you're 
saying; hardware or "cheat sheet"


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Re: hacking for a slimmer world

[Nestamicky]

On 15/11/11 8:21 AM, Bruce Godfrey wrote:

dc, do you have any data on how much difference a fast SCSI drive makes
in a MDD or similar G$ Mac?  I just installed one and I have used Disk
Speed Bench X to test the transfer speed.  I find 80MB/sec.  My original
IDE Hitachi Deskstar on the ATA100 bus is only moving about 50MB/sec.
However, another WD drive on the same ATA 100 bus is also moving 80MB/sec.
I was hoping the 15K U320 SCSI drive would easily beat a good IDE drive,
but that does not appear to be the case.  Is it maybe the kind of test
Disk Speed Bench X performs?
Bruce, I wished you'd seen my thread here on getting the most out of a 
G4. In there I'd proposed using SCSI disks and I think it was pharmacy 
Bruce who pointed out that I won't be getting much out of it.


I think I'm known here as one of the dinosaurs who refuse to buy newer 
and better machines simply, for example, to be able to watch YouTube 
videos. So, I've come to accept that my macs are being "programmed" out 
of some websites and applications, and have stopped trying to 
"deprogram" them. I reckon there will come a time when text edit would 
be the champ on a G4, if I want to stay with OS X.


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Re: Fed up with Google changes on browsers in Tiger

[Geke]

I’m using Apple Mail with gmail without problems since a long time
already.

I’m also using browser mail for gmail (in Camino, Firefox on a G4, and
Ten4Fox on a G3 ibook) but I have set the account to "basic html".
Some time ago, there was some havoc with Google posting a message to
upgrade my browser, and me being unable to go back to basic html as
default, but that phase has passed.

Maybe you’d be happier with an (older) intel Mac mini, instead of a
G5? At least as a second station, for watching videos and stuff?

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Re: hacking for a slimmer world

[dc]

On Nov 15, 9:01 pm, "Stephen E. Bodnar"  wrote:
> I'll keep my ears open. We live up on Purtov now and have a pretty
> active feeder, but Switgard and Lars will be over in Germany for
> Christmas.  If somebody wants to sit in our kitchen drinking hot
> buttered rums and counting birds, that's OK too.

I forgot to mention, this is the most random Mac advice I've read i a
long time!

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Re: hacking for a slimmer world

[dc]

On Nov 15, 12:21 pm, Jesse  wrote:
> So what are the best drives and cards for scsi?

I agree with Dan, a SATA PCI card and 10K SATA (Raptor) drive is fast
and reusable in G5, MacPro, and PC machines. I do think SCSI drives
are cheaper right now. There are ATTO UL2x and UL3x cards for under
$25, 15K 36GB drives also around $25. They can also be reused in G5s
and other machines. The advantage of SCSI drives over IDE isn't so
much in the transfer speed as it is in the latency & seek/read/write
times. I don't have specific benchmarks now as I'm onto a MacPro, all
my SCSI machines are in storage (I probably should give them away).
But I've put fast SCSI drives in Macs from a 7200, beige G3, Smurf G3,
PCI G4, AGP G4s, etc. and they have always made noticable real world
speed improvement.

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Re: Fed up with Google changes on browsers in Tiger

[Tina K.]

On 2011/11/15 23:57, a1 so eloquently wrote:

I am utterly fed up with
what Google did to Reader,
(snip)
Software: I really, really need an RSS reader that will remain
reliable with Tiger.


I use Google Reader to Synch NetNewsWire MP & PB and avoid the changes Google made 
to Reader, I don't even know what changed since I'm not using it on a browser. I 
would suggest that route for you but I think you'll need 10.5 Leopard to run a 
version of NetNewsWire that supports Reader.


Other RSS apps have talked about adding Reader synch but I don't know if any of 
them ever actually did. But it might be worth browsing macupdate.com to see the 
offerings.



Tina

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