Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media
"I've also thought of approaching the ADP people. Assistive Development Program. I'd go for burning a cd/dvd with the games and a well done read me about gaming for the blind/vi in general. On 6/20/2015 6:14 PM, dark wrote: Other than your stratogy involving making nets out of bread, which would probably be an incredibly impressive fiet of baking though I'm not sure it'd catch anything, I totally agree, no point limiting this if this is the plan. I will also add that producing an electronic copy will cost zippo, while producing a hard print copy will be comparatively inexpensive too as compared to braille, and it's better for the information to be out there in as many forms as possible. all the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: "Jeremy Brown" To: "gamers" Sent: Saturday, June 20, 2015 10:16 PM Subject: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media Thomas, Hence the subject heading. I think you're right. While we shouldn't limit such an attempt to just blindness awareness organizations, we shouldn't limit the message to just braille either. Eleanor, excellent. That's a good thing to have multiple checks and inputs. Braille folks: While I personally sympathize with your position, if this is a serious effort to expand the audio games market, then it needs to pursue all media we can. As Dark pointed out, adding an electronic copy to a document being produced electronically is zero cost. Though to some of us who do not have low vision sufficient to read large print or play games, the idea might seem ludicrous, I'm sure there are low vision people who probably take advantage of some audio materials. Even if they do not now, there are people with degenerative disorders that might be interested. The point here, in gaining sponsors, pursuing leads, and casting our bread on the waters, is to use as wide a net as possible. We lose nothing by a little pre-planning and outreach now. We might gain a lot. It's all too easy for this sort of effort to flop if people get too territorial or single-minded. Take care, Jeremy -- In the fight between you and the world--back the world! Frank Zapa --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2015.0.5961 / Virus Database: 4365/10062 - Release Date: 06/20/15 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media
Hi Ron, While I like such a sampler disc in principle I can foresee many problems arising from such a disc. One, is compatibility. If someone were to freely redistribute a sampler disc they would have no idea of what version is on the end user's machine thus can't for see any compatibility issues arising from such a sampler. Jim Kitchen's games, just as an example, are all written in VB 6 and require that Winkit be installed on Vista, Windows 7, or Windows 8.x systems prior to being installed and if the end user doesn't know that I can foresee a problem installing and playing those games just because they aren't familiar with what is required to play them. Two, is space and exposure for developers. While a DVD would offer 4 GB of distribution space I can foresee such a disc not covering all there is to offer thus there needs to be a vetting process of what games and demos are offered to the end user. We don't want to offer a number of games from developers x, y, and z and forget about developers a, b, and c. That said, a media disc might be a good idea over all. I know some magazines such as PC World and PC Magazine come with sampler discs with trials for software, games, and that has been very successful in getting demos and trials of new software out there to the mainstream market. Perhaps something similar might work for the audio games community too. Cheers! On 6/21/15, Ron Schamerhorn wrote: > "I've also thought of approaching the ADP people. Assistive Development > Program. I'd go for burning a cd/dvd with the games and a well done > read me about gaming for the blind/vi in general. > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audiogames(wasinfo games game engines)
Hi Dark, Totally agree. Starting off by trying to counter what they may have been told is not the most productive advertising method available. saying, "you probably have been told your computer is just for work but that is a big fat hairy lie," is not the best way at all to get the end user's attention. Something more interesting like, "have you ever wondered about accessible games for the blind and low vision," grabs the end user's attention and is not combative or tries to directly counter what they may have been told about their computer. I never thought I'd say this but the few communications and marketing classes I had in college really might be useful here. A lot of it is not so much what you say but how you say it, and the attitude you want to pass on to the reader. Everything I have ever read says attacking the reader's beliefs, prejudices, or perceived opinions is a bad tactic. There usually are other ways to slay that dragon without attacking it head on. Cheers! On 6/20/15, dark wrote: > Hi Charlse. > > Bare in mind it's not a question of "Saying" anything to anyone, the leaflet > > can't say "well if you've been told your computer is just for work and can't > > do anything interesting that is a big fat lie!" it's just a matter of > recognizing why different distribution methods appeal to different groups > people. > > All the best, > > Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audiogames(wasinfo games game engines)
Hi Tom. The process and tone I'm trying to go for myself in the sample I'm working on is much more, "computers do lots of good stuff, have you ever thought of playing games with them?" type of approach, starting with perhaps what the person has been told, or if the person is not a computer user, starting with the general and working to the specific. I'm not entirely happy with the word order yet but as I said that is why I am trying to be as careful as I can about draughting this thing. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audiogames(wasinfo games game engines)
Hi Dark, Well, it sounds like a good approach. I see where you are going and I'd be happy to review it when you are done with it. Cheers! On 6/21/15, dark wrote: > Hi Tom. > > The process and tone I'm trying to go for myself in the sample I'm working > on is much more, "computers do lots of good stuff, have you ever thought of > > playing games with them?" type of approach, starting with perhaps what the > person has been told, or if the person is not a computer user, starting with > > the general and working to the specific. > > I'm not entirely happy with the word order yet but as I said that is why I > am trying to be as careful as I can about draughting this thing. > > Beware the grue! > > Dark. > > > --- > Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org > If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to > gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. > You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. > All messages are archived and can be searched and read at > http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. > If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, > please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] info AudioGames Game Engine
yes I agree. At 06:18 p.m. 19/06/2015, you wrote: Hi Shaun, Well, I'd say it all depends on the blind organization in question. Certainly they each have their own motives and agendas for doing what they do, and it sounds like based on things Dark has said about the RNIB they precisely have the attitude you describe in your message. However, the same can't be said for all blindness organizations around the world. I of course can't speak to those in your home country, but here in the USA blindness organizations are geared for job and employment training therefore have a business outlook on blindness related matters. They often times don't have interest in games and other entertainment because it is all secondary to getting their clients trained and helped into getting out on their own and getting gainfully employed. Playing games has nothing to do with navigating the job market so doesn't get much attention from organizations. Cheers! On 6/17/15, shaun everiss wrote: > Maybe josh, I have misgivings on blind organisations taking a serious > look at gaming in general over educational card and board though. > Its about all they are interested in. > I had a project I was going to do with schools on a old unused > laptop, but suddenly it fell through. > Then there are those that get games that don't necessarily portray > what the gaming industry is now yet they are marketed as what the > blind play and always play. > In an extreme example if I was told that all blind and disabled > people were poor helpless and stupid I'd probably believe them. > In gaming terms if I was told that board games were all we could ever > play and didn't get the net or other ways or was to scared to look at > other ways I'd probably believe that to. > My point I don't trust some of these organisations, they have their > own agendas and interests. > At least I think they must. > I know there are big game developer conferences but the point is > there are so many potential developers. > The fact with tech and such getting better and better means things > are not as dyre as it once was but even so. > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] info AudioGames Game Engine
hmmm interesting. Sometimes I am able to get a lot done sometimes well. I think its in the family we are all easily distracted. So maybe I have a bit of what you mentioned wouldn't surprise me. At 06:03 p.m. 19/06/2015, you wrote: Hi Shaun, It sounds to me you are describing attention deficit disorder better known as A.D.D. In order to program anything let alone games you have to be able to sit down and spend more time than 30 minutes on it without becoming distracted. If you can't stay focused on a project more than 30 minutes there is no way you will ever get anything productive done. There were days at the height of game development where I sat down and worked for four hours straight without taking a break. Granted that was before my personal health issues came up, but the point here is that programming games and other software requires quite a commitment above and beyond five minutes here and there when a person feels like it. Cheers! On 6/17/15, shaun everiss wrote: > wow been out of touch lately playing ironic renpy gamebooks. > Anyway I agree with everything you have said up to this point. > I tried to program but I never got that far never had the patience to > stick with actual code nore the wish to write programs. > While I can write stories in my head writing it down is impossible I > never can get everything or if I do it its way to short or I forget > and have a mindlock. > Testing and sounds are my strong point though sound recorder and > shoving sfx together is as far as I have needed to go. > I have done some voice scripts but to be honest my hardware is budget > and I have neither the cash or space more importantly space to store > or use the more expensive stuff pluss my environment is just not cut > out for that sort of thing. > I have also the lazyness issue where I tend to comit to stuff then > suddenly get distracted or burn out for no reason what so ever. > Then I stress that if I have something I need to do that I won't get > it in on time etc. > Saying that the stuff I do do I try to do the best I can. > However I have never been able to work for more than 30 minutes at a > time even less and I have to be in a mood to even do things. > This mood can change depending on what the computer is doing or if > something is on my plate to do or if I am completely relaxed. > Sometimes I get to a point where I feel I can string things together > and make something sometimes I get there sometimes I don't. > Eventually though shortly before I am even done reality comes back to > hit me again and I wander what I started and kill it till the next time. > I find it hard to stick to some tasks long term or if something is > to hard or needs concentration over a sertain point I find it easier > to put it off for ever so yeah to be a developer is hard work and as > far as I care you devs are cool an do good things. > I don't know if I will get to that stage I may do some day who knows. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] chess was Re: info AudioGames Game Engine
I never said all games were that bad. The quentin games have a good engine I havn't hit it much online. the rs stuff is good to but unlike the quentin engine say with 1000 miles rules for if you are actually stupped and trapped are not inforced so you can still trap even if you are cornered and it takes out the frustration of playing especially when you have a human opponent. I have not played the all in play engine though of late. I still play the old kitchensinc games when I have a few minutes. At 02:37 a.m. 20/06/2015, you wrote: hey shawn I'm the same way. But lately I find playing spoonbill games and rs-games and quenton c's games and some of the GMA-cards-games is a fun and relaxing passtime for me. especially learning chess. lately to practice offensive and defensive strategies I play against another human but I play chess both white and black by myself just to try out different moves. follow me on twitter @joshknnd1982 On 6/17/2015 1:35 AM, shaun everiss wrote: wow been out of touch lately playing ironic renpy gamebooks. Anyway I agree with everything you have said up to this point. I tried to program but I never got that far never had the patience to stick with actual code nore the wish to write programs. While I can write stories in my head writing it down is impossible I never can get everything or if I do it its way to short or I forget and have a mindlock. Testing and sounds are my strong point though sound recorder and shoving sfx together is as far as I have needed to go. I have done some voice scripts but to be honest my hardware is budget and I have neither the cash or space more importantly space to store or use the more expensive stuff pluss my environment is just not cut out for that sort of thing. I have also the lazyness issue where I tend to comit to stuff then suddenly get distracted or burn out for no reason what so ever. Then I stress that if I have something I need to do that I won't get it in on time etc. Saying that the stuff I do do I try to do the best I can. However I have never been able to work for more than 30 minutes at a time even less and I have to be in a mood to even do things. This mood can change depending on what the computer is doing or if something is on my plate to do or if I am completely relaxed. Sometimes I get to a point where I feel I can string things together and make something sometimes I get there sometimes I don't. Eventually though shortly before I am even done reality comes back to hit me again and I wander what I started and kill it till the next time. I find it hard to stick to some tasks long term or if something is to hard or needs concentration over a sertain point I find it easier to put it off for ever so yeah to be a developer is hard work and as far as I care you devs are cool an do good things. I don't know if I will get to that stage I may do some day who knows. At 06:33 p.m. 15/06/2015, you wrote: Hi Mohsin , I can definitely understand where you are coming from because I was where you are now a few years ago. I was a sighted gamer up until my mid teens when I went blind, and when I went to college I had some idea I'd get a degree in computer science and be a computer programmer. My initial idea or dream was to write accessible computer games equivalent to those I had ben exposed to before I lost my sight. Stuff like Quake, Doom, Tomb Raider, Jedi Knight, Soldier of Fortune, etc. I was convinced all I needed to do was learn to program and from their it would be easy. As it turned out it wasn't as simple or as straight forward as I thought. Interesting enough I personally did not find learning programming to be that hard. I know we are all different, some learn things easier than others, but by far learning to develop games was actually easier than other aspects of the process. There are a lot of problems I had not even imagined or considered when I decided to specialize in game programming. Things that were in my opinion much more difficult than the programming required to write a game or accessible product. One issue I see as a problem for audio game developers is advertising. Sure there are a few hundred blind customers on Audyssey and the Audio Games Forum, but the reality is they are just a small minority of the thousands perhaps millions of blind people world wide who are not connected with any audio gaming venue. Let's face it advertising via TV and radio can get extremely expensive. So expensive that it would take incredible financing to market a product that way. News Papers are a cheaper method of advertising games and other products, but there we have the problem of its not an accessible means of communication from an audio game developer to his/her potential blind customers. We can assume the majority of blind people do not read the morning paper and if they do an aid or family member reads it to them meaning that the best we can hope for that a friend or family member brings it to th
Re: [Audyssey] info AudioGames Game Engine
Hi all. I skipped a good chunk of this, so I'm sort of coming in blind, as it were, to the last parts of the debate. First of all, one of the biggest things to hit the internet has been social media. I'm talking Twitter, Facebook, Youtube. We need to advertise there, and we need to stop talking about "games for the blind". That was in quotes. Papa Sangre, Audio Defense, etc. don't market themselves as games for the blind. They market themselves as audiogames. Yes, the distinction is small, but it is tremendously important. Frankly, blindness scares a good chunk of the sighted population. They feel they can't relate to a blind person, so why would they want to play a game for the blind. (Not trying to nag, but that has been my argument about a lot of the entries on audiogames.net. It's more like BlindGames.net.) Anyway, the second part of the contribution I'd like to make is this. It's really easy to want to do everything oneself. It's someone's dream that gets games off the ground. Someone's idea that gets put into all the work. That's why I was so pleased with Aprone and Jason Alan, because they actively wanted community feedback throughout the process of game creation. I can personally point to several examples of suggestions I made that got into both Entombed and Swamp. That kind of flexibility is necessary in a larger project. If there were to be a larger project, there would be conflicts and clashing. The person in charge would have to be able to deal with that, because nobody really has thus far. Also, we now have the technology to minimize equipment differences and environmental difficulties with volunteers recording their voices. So if someone wanted to get a project up in the air, and if someone wanted to get volunteers, it would be less difficult. Please allow me to illustrate. I sent an e-mail, I think, about two years ago to Jean-Leuc Pontico and Jeremy Kaldobsky. I had judged the creations they had made and their level of skill necessary to the project I set forth. I wanted them to make a highly scaled back indie game on similar lines to the Sims franchise. I knew it could be done, because the iPhone app store has many examples of indie life sim games. I gave them possible interfaces. I gave them ideas of variable management. I gave them, in short, a project outline. Neither of the two could take the project at the time, so it didn't get done, what with my very limited programming skills not being up to the challenge. However, let's say that there was a tremendous positive response to my idea on-list. I would immediately set up a request for developers willing to take up the challenge. I would try to figure out what skills they had in common, so as to pull the most people with appropriate skills. I would set up a crowd-funding campaign with similar layout to the Entombed funding campaign I mapped out on that list, if anyone saw that. It would involve multiple funding levels, each with appropriate compensation. Given that the game would be a life simulation, most of what we need would, sound wise, would already be available with a little time and patience. In order to maximize continuity with possible other sound sources, all recording would be done with iPhones. I would help with UI design, the hardest part of most complex projects, so I'm told. I could also step in to help people manage possible difficulties they had in making something work. I would act as that project manager people have said is lacking. When the game was complete, it would be sold, not as a game for the blind but as an audiogame, or maybe simply as a non-graphical game. I would have trailors on Youtube. I'd try to get big name game reviewers (Pewtie pie, Total Biscuit, etc.) to give the thing a chance, thus generating publicity. I'd get as many smaller reviewers as I could to do the same, and I'd post the game on social media accounts as well. I'm not saying the dev team would be able to move to the Bahamas or anything, but I think that we might make something off the thing at least. My point in elaborating so heavily on that potential project is this. It can be done. It's not impossible. Frankly, it's not even that difficult, with some division of labor. I just need people to tell me they're interested in helping and what skills they possess. We hold ourselves back simply by not moving forward. On 6/19/15, Josh K wrote: > yes and my longtime favorites will always be jim kitchen's games, > especially football and baseball. those are my favorites and now with > talking dosbox i can play both versions of his games with ASAP talking > through NVDA! > > follow me on twitter @joshknnd1982 > > On 6/17/2015 2:06 AM, shaun everiss wrote: >> Maybe josh, I have misgivings on blind organisations taking a serious >> look at gaming in general over educational card and board though. >> Its about all they are interested in. >> I had a project I was going to do with schools on a old unused laptop, >> but suddenly it fell throug
Re: [Audyssey] info AudioGames Game Engine
I agree they were the first games I started with back in dos. The others I like are the richard desteno games especially since a lot of them are windows console apps. At 02:40 a.m. 20/06/2015, you wrote: yes and my longtime favorites will always be jim kitchen's games, especially football and baseball. those are my favorites and now with talking dosbox i can play both versions of his games with ASAP talking through NVDA! follow me on twitter @joshknnd1982 On 6/17/2015 2:06 AM, shaun everiss wrote: Maybe josh, I have misgivings on blind organisations taking a serious look at gaming in general over educational card and board though. Its about all they are interested in. I had a project I was going to do with schools on a old unused laptop, but suddenly it fell through. Then there are those that get games that don't necessarily portray what the gaming industry is now yet they are marketed as what the blind play and always play. In an extreme example if I was told that all blind and disabled people were poor helpless and stupid I'd probably believe them. In gaming terms if I was told that board games were all we could ever play and didn't get the net or other ways or was to scared to look at other ways I'd probably believe that to. My point I don't trust some of these organisations, they have their own agendas and interests. At least I think they must. I know there are big game developer conferences but the point is there are so many potential developers. The fact with tech and such getting better and better means things are not as dyre as it once was but even so. At 02:16 a.m. 16/06/2015, you wrote: I think the best way to really get games out there would be to attend the ACB and nfb conventions and bring them to the attention of many many blind people and agencies. follow me on twitter @joshknnd1982 On 6/15/2015 2:33 AM, Thomas Ward wrote: Hi Mohsin , I can definitely understand where you are coming from because I was where you are now a few years ago. I was a sighted gamer up until my mid teens when I went blind, and when I went to college I had some idea I'd get a degree in computer science and be a computer programmer. My initial idea or dream was to write accessible computer games equivalent to those I had ben exposed to before I lost my sight. Stuff like Quake, Doom, Tomb Raider, Jedi Knight, Soldier of Fortune, etc. I was convinced all I needed to do was learn to program and from their it would be easy. As it turned out it wasn't as simple or as straight forward as I thought. Interesting enough I personally did not find learning programming to be that hard. I know we are all different, some learn things easier than others, but by far learning to develop games was actually easier than other aspects of the process. There are a lot of problems I had not even imagined or considered when I decided to specialize in game programming. Things that were in my opinion much more difficult than the programming required to write a game or accessible product. One issue I see as a problem for audio game developers is advertising. Sure there are a few hundred blind customers on Audyssey and the Audio Games Forum, but the reality is they are just a small minority of the thousands perhaps millions of blind people world wide who are not connected with any audio gaming venue. Let's face it advertising via TV and radio can get extremely expensive. So expensive that it would take incredible financing to market a product that way. News Papers are a cheaper method of advertising games and other products, but there we have the problem of its not an accessible means of communication from an audio game developer to his/her potential blind customers. We can assume the majority of blind people do not read the morning paper and if they do an aid or family member reads it to them meaning that the best we can hope for that a friend or family member brings it to the blind persons attention. Regardless of the method and means a developer looks at it is going to cost a lot of money to get the word out about their product, and there does not seem to be a good method to market a product to the blind community at large at this time. Another difficulty is just demographics and age. It is a well known fact that the majority of people with vision problems today are senior citizens who are 60 or older. In other words people who are grandparents who likely have different interests than their grandkids in their teens or early 20's. As a result a young developer might spend years writing a blockbuster equivalent to the latest and greatest mainstream game aimed at his or generation only to discover it has absolutely no market value beyond his generation. The older generation of senior citizens, who make up the majority of the blind and low vision market, aren't interested in that type of game. So while it sounds exciting and fun to create accessible versions of our favorite mainstream game or games it turns out it
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media (was audio games, game engine)
Well tom while true of laptops I do know that desktops in general at least the ones up to 2011 would have the required ports they have only recently gone full usb. There is still a moniter port on my laptop and I know that the new systems I got one from 2011 and the other from 2014 still have paralel ports. But yeah its all usb. there is probably a paralel to usb converter somewhere wouldn't surprise me. I mean there is serial to usb, vga moniter to usb, I know for a fact there is old style vhs tape recorder to usb because I have one. even audio to usb. In short there are as many converters as there are usb ports in a computer. Weather the software is accessable and not in chinese is another thing you can buy bog standard converters for vhs I know for a fact for a few bucks the software is either old or cracked or old and cracked but point is you can buy stuff. There are pro stuff to if you search so there is probably a way. I am not sure how easy it is to wrig up a simple no frills one, but when my power cord on one of our pcs broke my dad was able to hook up a length of headphone wire and a few headphone plugs in place of the broken cord and although it ran a bit hot at the ends it did work. Ofcause this was back just before 2000 and now with everything so secured like the iphone chargers you can't just put any wrigged cord in. An old unit though as long as you were prepaired to configure it who knows. There is probably something like com0com for a paralel port or something. Though a good converter will automatically convert for you. I am not sure about software. Though to be honest if were meaning pamphlets for various things I'd go the electronic rout, I am not sure how to make e braille but its all the rage. Audio mp3 daisy even standard cds. You could still buy braillers to. Finally I know for a fact that some organisations can hire out their units for online transfer of info via mail but you'd still have togo to the physical location to pick it up. I have a few old perkins units which I have not used ever since I got back into computers in 1995 so I have no idea if they work or not. At 03:00 a.m. 20/06/2015, you wrote: Hi John, Thanks. If we were to decide to go forward with this that old embosser and your stock of paper could prove useful. That is considering we can get that old thing going. That could be somewhat problematic these days. I happen to have an old embosser as well, a Braille Blazer circa 1992 or so, but have not been able to use it for several years because I don't have any computers I can hook it up to. Both serial ports and parallel ports are a thing of the past, and while I might be able to use a serial to USB adapter or something I really had no use for the thing until now. I should drag the thing out of storage and see if I can get it working. In any case there is probably a way to rig one of those old embossers to do the job if we had to. So that's at least a start in the right direction. Cheers! On 6/19/15, john wrote: > I have an old embosser (it uses a parallel port!), the software to match, > and more paper than I could even try to shake a stick at. If we wanted to > get serious about making this kind of a pamphlet, I could probably do that > part without to much trouble (I suspect Google would be able to answer all > my questions on how to make the thing go). > I don't have any real contacts within blindness organizations (and know > nothing about shipping outside of the U.S), but I can do the brailing, and > then cheer at the (slightly) greater amount of storage space I've got. > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines)
that will be nice. your average laser printer costs around 300-400 bucks and 400 will give you a resonable priced unit. I have one that cost around that much with full network functions and with updates to its firmware wireless eprint which tablet users find really good. I also enjoyed the discussion on the canute. Heck if this works I will get one. One thing I have been interested in is a braille display of some tipe and a good braille keyboard to use the computer with so I can keep my braille going. Ever since I started using a computer in 1995 I gradually stopped typing with the old clunky and heavy braille units. aparently from a friend in the industry they are starting with the electronic units with simple functions and graduating to full computers. However I find it faster on a querty I just wish I could read braille on the screen without spending a lot of cash to get one. Even though you can get some cheap units for 2000 dollars I wouldn't use it enough. At 03:02 a.m. 20/06/2015, you wrote: once the braigo braille printer comes out braille embossers should cost no more than $300 or so. check out braigo labs http://www.braigolabs.com/ follow me on twitter @joshknnd1982 On 6/19/2015 8:18 AM, dark wrote: Hi Tom. Buy an embosser? that is way more overkill than I am thinking here. In the Uk at least there are braille transcription services that will spend their time on printing, it's one way that say a local theatre can get braille programs, sinse you are correct that braille embossers are stupidly expensive. I don't have a clear idea on costs, sinse it's not something I've looked into but I don't believe it's that much, particularly as regards reproducing the thing once you've got one printed and then are making copies. As to people who don't have much to do with the blind community, well to be honest I fall into that category marginly myself simply because I don't find blindness events or organizations that helpful or that I have much in common with a lot of other blind people, though i still do look at the news letters just in case anything vaguely interesting comes up, and would probably pick up a leaflet on something like games. of course there will be some people who literally don't have anything at all with any blindness organization, but you can't cover everyone! my suggestion of an intro leaflet was just to let more people know who normally might not. Beware the grue! Dark. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines)
I agree tom. I may have access to an embosser maybe for email Ofcause I'd have to buy the translation program and extra stuff but who knows. I guuess if I did this as some sort of job I could do that though I'd probably have to charge per ounit initially to get the cost of tuhe units. Saying that I have no actual space on here for anymore electronic doodads at the moment. At 03:09 a.m. 20/06/2015, you wrote: Hi Josh, No thank you. Brailing up hundreds of copies of a pamphlet on a Perkins Brailer is definitely not my idea of spending an after noon . Especially, not when you consider all a person has to do is type up the pamphlet once in Word or some other word processor, translate it to braille, and send it off to the embosser which will emboss as many copies of the pamphlet as needed while the person goes off and watches TV, plays a game, or whatever while the embossing is going on. Why in the world would anyone spend hours manually brailing up hundreds of pages when they could do it much easier using modern technology? Cheers! On 6/19/15, Josh K wrote: > or you could get a refurbished perkins brailler and type them up by hand > or a less expensive option would be make the pamflets with a $5 slate > and stylus. they make great quality braille especially the plastic ones. > > > follow me on twitter @joshknnd1982 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines)
Charles I agree. There are those that don't use a computer. The easiest and lest expensive is audio mp3 or cd. I don't think tape decks exist now but that was also an easy way to handle it. I am not sure if anyone really reads braille these days. I remember I used to get material stapled together news letters etc. However even the old braille books for me are getting the chop over electronic. They are just to heavy and to take a single book to travel is like up to 6 bags, who can be bothered with that. Yes you still can get normal braille but there is a cost in doing that. Pluss just before I finally quit the braille scene all braille paper was changed there are 3 types. 1. the a4 type in most printers. 2. the a3 used in older braille units and the last is the 3 page junket thats used in embossers but who knows what it is now. When I started testing the unified code there was talk of making everything use a4 in fact there was talk of just using standard computer paper for braille. At 05:52 a.m. 20/06/2015, you wrote: I would like to see such advertisements made available to blind people in formats other than electronic for a change. Although they may be few, there are people who prefer to do their own reading. There also may be people who don't use a computer, but would if something gets their interest. What made the computer gain popularity with businesses was a killer application--the Spreadsheet. Once their value was realized, we've never looked back. Gaming could be the killer application for the blind, and you've got to find out about the gaming field from somewhere. Maybe through a friend or something, but nothing beats reading about it unaided in any way, browsing a catalog or advertisement pamphlet at your own pace and leisure. Braille is the way to go. No machine is necessary. Read it yourself, just like anyone else at conventions does. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: "Thomas Ward" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2015 10:24 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Hi Dark, Perhaps, but I think we are running into a communication error since I didn't make my thoughts fully clear in my last post. To begin with a lot of these resellers now offer their catalogs electronically. Either as a download on their website, sometimes e-mailed directly to the customer, or shipped to them on CD. As a result if Auddyssey or Audiogames.net wanted to put an informational advertisement in one of their catalogs they could probably do so without incurring any cost to either the reseller or to themselves since the catalog is already electronic for the most part. Therefore all this talk of embossing pamphlets and so forth could be rendered mute as there might be a less expensive way to get the word out to customers without involving huge startup costs or involving organizations. So that should answer two of your questions. A reseller can or should be able to send out a free pamplet because it is electronic and would be of no cost to them. Merely a few bites of info inside their monthly catalog. Thus there also would be no need to sell it since there is no cost involved for anyone to get the word out. Cheers! On 6/19/15, dark wrote: Hi Tomm. I do believe the cost to get a number of pamflets printed wouldn't be quite so insane, sinse after all in the Uk lots of organizations from theatres to restaurant chains have stuff brailled, heck my bank can deliver a braille bank statement each month if I wish and I doubt they'd be paying too much. It's likely something that needs looking into formally. Distributing through resellers is a good idea, however my concern is why should a company send out a free pamflet? and if the pamflet was not free why would people buy it? I also have noticed myself that a lot of charitable blindness organizations in the Uk at least do have quite a bit of promotional material kicking around both for other services and for commercial products, so I don't think it'd be asking too much for them to have a general informational leaflet available as well, plus of course it's far easier to send free leaflets to say schools for the blind or meeting groups (sinse hay we might not like them but there are potentially people interested in games there), than to get them to buy an informational resource. Then again there is a way to find out, I wonder how many people have bought that actual book on Ios accessible games which phil mentioned? A book is far more information than I was thinkng, but hay if people are interested in buying it then maybe a paid leaflet on audiogames in general wouldn't be such a bad thing. All the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things be
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines)
I know win bt is another one you can use. At 06:34 a.m. 20/06/2015, you wrote: Hi Charles, Fortunately, the braille translation software is the easiest thing to get. As I recall there are some free braille translation applications for Linux which would save the cost of buying something like Duxberry Braille Translator. Plus if I'm not mistaken the Talking Dosbox has Megadots with it which is another low cost solution. So I think software wise it is very doable. The catch is hunting up a similarly low cost braille embosser. Cheers! On 6/19/15, Charles Rivard wrote: > If someone has the software on their PC and a braille embosser, this is > correct. > > --- > Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, > > you! really! are! finished! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] Audiogames leaflet planning
Changing subject line as requested. Jeremy: I'll do my best to fill in my resources/abilities in accordance with the order you mentioned things in your message (or at least roughly according to it, anyway). Writing: I'd be happy to proofread/edit things if needed, though I'm no PHD. I would also note that, especially if we're intending to distribute this in multiple countries, that we should have somebody from the target country read through and make suggestions/corrections to match the local style of writing and spelling. Content: I've really got no clue on this one, mostly due to lack of serious dedicated thought on the subject. Perhaps we should focus first on determining exactly what our goal would be: a definition of audiogames, a description of different types (expecting that the reader already knows what games are), a list of the different games available, etc. Finances: Personally, while I'd rather not spend hundreds of dollars on this, I've got no problem with dropping something in the mid double digits on postage or whatever else is needed. Creation supplies: my embosser prints on only one side of the paper, but (at least when it was last used) seemed to be in pretty good working order. I expect it'd probably be happy to spew out a couple thousand pages if we want it to. I've currently got somewhere close to 2000 pages of paper available, and doubt getting more would be much of a hassle (though it might take a while). We may also want to consider having a large print version available. I believe there may be a monochrome laser printer somewhere around here, and (if its still sold, anyway) I could probably find toner for it. I've no clue what font is usually used for large print, but that printer can spit out 20 pages per minute, and I've got well over 500 pages of 8.5-11 within easy reach. splitting up the work: I feel that it might be beneficial if we were to offer our leaflet to multiple organizations. Thus, it might be a good idea to have each person with brailing resources handle the work for a single organization. We may also want to reword the writing a bit, depending on the organization, its goals and beliefs, etc. Developers: Most of the devs seem to be on this list already, but a direct email to them probably wouldn't go amiss, if we wanted to ask for quotes or something like that. The only group that I've never seen on here is BPC. I'm not quite sure what their status is - maybe somebody else knows? International work: I'm passing the buck... absolutely no clue how best to handle this one. ---original thread--- Dark, If others are game, I'm totally game for trying this. I can't promise that our company can contribute a huge amount to the cost, but we'll do what we can if others are interested. I also can help with the writing/editing of any material: got to put this almost PH.D. in English to use somehow. One issue would be to figure out the best large general categories of play style for audio games to discuss, how to present the information in an ordered fashion, and how to economize the language to reach your goal of 1000 words or so. I think that's a good maximum length and it makes things as stripped down as possible. The next step, as I see it, is first see who of the currently connected developers would be interested in such a project. Find out if others, not connected, would be interested. Work out a central point for collecting funds (if a list member were embossing, I think the majority of the funds would be going for paper and shipping). Find out who would do the embossing since we've had several lines on that. Find out which organizations we would want to talk to, and figure out the best line of attack on each. I'm sure there are organizational, logistical, and administrative details that would have to be worked out all along this chain. I think Thomas' suggestion of talking to resellers is a good idea as well. Further, I know some of us are more familiar with one nation's organizations more so than others. We'd need to decide where and who we would be starting with. While it's easy to think in terms of home country, I've noticed from our own sales and from watching demographics on Alter Aeon and in other venues, that the composition of the audio game community is rapidly expanding, so we might run into the issue of possible translation necessities in future. It's way too early to go there, but it's something worth thinking about. In all honesty, it might be necessary to form some sort of organizational structure and create a separate forum to discuss this, or, at least, agree on a subject heading or name, so that people who are not interested in this line of discussion can avoid it in future:). Take care, Jeremy 　 -- In the fight between you and the world--back the world! Frank Zapa --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audysse
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games(wasinfo games game engines)
hmmm that may be a bit hard. At 11:13 a.m. 20/06/2015, you wrote: Looks like that's two of us - only thing left to figure out would be shipping. -- From: "Charles Rivard" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2015 15:19 To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games(wasinfo games game engines) I'm going to get this embosser going again. I just checked with Duxbury. The cost will be zero. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: "Charles Rivard" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2015 1:48 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (wasinfo games game engines) >I have an embosser and Duxbury translation software for it on my laptop. >I've also got about 2,000 sheets of paper. I'll check into the cost of >license renewal for the translation software. > > --- > Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're > finished, you! really! are! finished! > - Original Message - > From: "Thomas Ward" > To: "Gamers Discussion list" > Sent: Friday, June 19, 2015 8:25 AM > Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games > (was info games game engines) > > >> Hi Dark, >> >> Okay, I see what you mean about using a third-party braille >> transcription service, a good idea, but I'm not sure what something >> like that would cost. The only one that comes to mind off the top of >> my head in the USA is American Printing House for the Blind, but as I >> have never transcribed anything through them personally I haven't a >> clue what it would cost to run x number of copies of an informational >> pamphlet off for organizations using APH's services. I'm sure it won't >> cost as high as buying an embosser, software, paper, etc but at the >> same time I could see it costing quite a bit. Unfortunately, braille >> is a very expensive medium so it is likely to be a fairly costly >> investment regardless of what someone does. >> >> I think what might be a better tact as far as information sharing and >> advertising goes is actually create a pamphlet which can be >> redistributed through the various blind resellers. I don't know what >> you have over in the UK and in Europe but here in the USA there are a >> number of well known resellers such as In dependant Living Aids, Maxi >> Aids, Light House, and so forth who are in the business of selling >> blind products such as canes, Olympus recorders, Jaws, you name it. >> Since they are in the business to make money and they have a catalog >> which gets shipped out to a lot of blind customers I'd say that would >> be the ideal way to advertise. Since companies like Independent Living >> Aids, for example, are in the business of making money and are not a >> organization they might be more receptive to sponsoring games and >> other entertainment products that would fall outside the purview of >> organizations. >> >> Cheers! >> >> >> On 6/19/15, dark wrote: >>> Hi Tom. >>> >>> Buy an embosser? that is way more overkill than I am thinking here. >>> In >>> the Uk at least there are braille transcription services that will >>> spend >>> their time on printing, it's one way that say a local theatre can get >>> braille programs, sinse you are correct that braille embossers are >>> stupidly >>> >>> expensive. >>> >>> I don't have a clear idea on costs, sinse it's not something I've looked >>> into but I don't believe it's that much, particularly as regards >>> reproducing >>> >>> the thing once you've got one printed and then are making copies. >>> >>> As to people who don't have much to do with the blind community, well to >>> be >>> >>> honest I fall into that category marginly myself simply because I don't >>> find >>> >>> blindness events or organizations that helpful or that I have much in >>> common >>> >>> with a lot of other blind people, though i still do look at the >>> news >>> letters just in case anything vaguely interesting comes up, and would >>> probably pick up a leaflet on something like games. >>> >>> of course there will be some people who literally don't have anything at >>> all >>> >>> with any blindness organization, but you can't cover everyone! my >>> suggestion >>> >>> of an intro leaflet was just to let more people know who normally might >>> not. >>> >>> Beware the grue! >>> >>> Dark. >>> >>> >>> --- >>> Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org >>> If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to >>> gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. >>> You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >>> http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >>> All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >>> http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. >>> If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the >>> list, >>>
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines)
you're lucky though. I don't have the money to even think of getting an embosser. in fact if it wren't for my mom keeping that old perkins in her basement for 20 some years I wouldn't even have that. without that most I could afford would be a slate and stylus to write braille with. follow me on twitter @joshknnd1982 On 6/20/2015 11:22 AM, Danielle Ledet wrote: I mean I had to jump through hoops to get that embosser. I was really pissed about it. On 6/20/15, Josh K wrote: oh yes i do keep my braille for years. i get my thermoform from future aids the braille superstore. I write pretty quick with the slate and stylus and also the perkins brailler will write on thermoform as well. i use the thermoform for my addressbook and other notes i want to last long. and i have some lightweight standard ink printer paper for just casual brailling like my 8 year old son's spelling words lists during school. I like to use braille to complement the technology I have. follow me on twitter @joshknnd1982 On 6/20/2015 11:03 AM, Danielle Ledet wrote: Dark, that is what I was thinking. Jeremy, you are right but what would it hurt for someone to approach the orgs around convention time. I know NFB state affiliates Braille their own stuff and Im sure ACB does too. Maybe cost could be negotiated with them to do the Brailling. Then, you could reach out to rehab agencies and maybe some folks could leave a pamphlet heare and there at local libraries and health fairs and doctor offices. Just some off the top small thinking. Tom, exactly. Add to that the little sections at the end of the Braille Forum, the Braille Monitor, and the Blind Bargains classifieds. We wouldn't actually know what the cost would be until somebody produced this pamphlet and brailled out a sample and presented to the transcribers woud we? I don't see why it would be such a big deal for these resellers to stick that right in the middle of the Braille catalogs they send out or include it with audio media. It would be like all that extra stuff you get with your bank statement or phone bill or a Valpak coupon. Josh, I will look into this. I had a Juliet Classic in good working order and no telling where my parents put it. Might not even be usable anymore. So I need something and can't afford a heavy-duty printer like Juliet and don't have sponsors anymore. $300 would be doable over time though. Jeez, I never thought to write on thermoform myself. You must keep your Braille for years. Charles, I echo you. Braille Braille, Braille. Bring it back! I feel lost even after all these years being unable to quickly right something down or pick it up and read. Now I lose a lot of info with computers constantly being purposefully fried! Folks just don't understand. Nothing against the folks who love their newfound freedom with modern tech but I feel like they are at war with me personally. Well, folks since I keep having to make unnecessary repair, I'm never gling to ketch up! That should be obvious though. Danielle On 6/20/15, Charles Rivard wrote: If you can use screen magnification software on your PC, I would think that you can also play graphically oriented games, and so would not fall into the market this project is aimed at. If you are not braille literate due to a lack of its importance in your life, and you rely on your audio speech technology, you can use a search engine or Email, and are not a member of the target audience, either. That leaves those who get their information through the use of braille, and who are not aware of the existence of computer games designed for blind people. They may not even have a computer, and the gaming might be what gets them interested. The braille readers who may be cut off from the computer literate should be the focus. Maybe other methods of pamphlet distribution can be available at conventions or other gathering events where there will be a lot of blind and visually impaired people, but I think that braille should be the main media format. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: "Thomas Ward" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Saturday, June 20, 2015 7:08 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Hi Charles, Interesting you brought the subject up of preference for braille over electronic formats because it is one I think directly needs addressed. Main reason I feel it needs to be addressed is we have something of a generational gap here in this country and perhaps around the world. There are undoubtedly older blind people who grew up on braille, were taught to use it for anything and everything, and have a personal preference for braille materials when and where possible. Now, we have many younger blind people, particularly millennials, who favor technology over braille. Some will outright state braille is no longer relevant, and h
Re: [Audyssey] chess was Re: info AudioGames Game Engine
If or when we play a game of chess against each other, I wish you all the worst! (rotten grin). --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: "dark" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2015 11:15 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] chess was Re: info AudioGames Game Engine I do enjoy a traditional style game occasionally, though with the issues I mentioned with chess and space I personally prefer something like Bg nomination whist or pontes backgammon myself. Rs games I do occasionally though generally if I'm going to play with others across the net I prefer to do so with a more social humour based game like cards against humanity. All the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: "Josh K" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Friday, June 19, 2015 3:37 PM Subject: [Audyssey] chess was Re: info AudioGames Game Engine hey shawn I'm the same way. But lately I find playing spoonbill games and rs-games and quenton c's games and some of the GMA-cards-games is a fun and relaxing passtime for me. especially learning chess. lately to practice offensive and defensive strategies I play against another human but I play chess both white and black by myself just to try out different moves. follow me on twitter @joshknnd1982 On 6/17/2015 1:35 AM, shaun everiss wrote: wow been out of touch lately playing ironic renpy gamebooks. Anyway I agree with everything you have said up to this point. I tried to program but I never got that far never had the patience to stick with actual code nore the wish to write programs. While I can write stories in my head writing it down is impossible I never can get everything or if I do it its way to short or I forget and have a mindlock. Testing and sounds are my strong point though sound recorder and shoving sfx together is as far as I have needed to go. I have done some voice scripts but to be honest my hardware is budget and I have neither the cash or space more importantly space to store or use the more expensive stuff pluss my environment is just not cut out for that sort of thing. I have also the lazyness issue where I tend to comit to stuff then suddenly get distracted or burn out for no reason what so ever. Then I stress that if I have something I need to do that I won't get it in on time etc. Saying that the stuff I do do I try to do the best I can. However I have never been able to work for more than 30 minutes at a time even less and I have to be in a mood to even do things. This mood can change depending on what the computer is doing or if something is on my plate to do or if I am completely relaxed. Sometimes I get to a point where I feel I can string things together and make something sometimes I get there sometimes I don't. Eventually though shortly before I am even done reality comes back to hit me again and I wander what I started and kill it till the next time. I find it hard to stick to some tasks long term or if something is to hard or needs concentration over a sertain point I find it easier to put it off for ever so yeah to be a developer is hard work and as far as I care you devs are cool an do good things. I don't know if I will get to that stage I may do some day who knows. At 06:33 p.m. 15/06/2015, you wrote: Hi Mohsin , I can definitely understand where you are coming from because I was where you are now a few years ago. I was a sighted gamer up until my mid teens when I went blind, and when I went to college I had some idea I'd get a degree in computer science and be a computer programmer. My initial idea or dream was to write accessible computer games equivalent to those I had ben exposed to before I lost my sight. Stuff like Quake, Doom, Tomb Raider, Jedi Knight, Soldier of Fortune, etc. I was convinced all I needed to do was learn to program and from their it would be easy. As it turned out it wasn't as simple or as straight forward as I thought. Interesting enough I personally did not find learning programming to be that hard. I know we are all different, some learn things easier than others, but by far learning to develop games was actually easier than other aspects of the process. There are a lot of problems I had not even imagined or considered when I decided to specialize in game programming. Things that were in my opinion much more difficult than the programming required to write a game or accessible product. One issue I see as a problem for audio game developers is advertising. Sure there are a few hundred blind customers on Audyssey and the Audio Games Forum, but the reality is they are just a small minority of the thousands perhaps millions of blind people world wide who are not connected with
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (wasinfo games game engines)
I would not offer print pamphlets. The selected audience for the information does not read print. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: "dark" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2015 7:15 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (wasinfo games game engines) Hi jeremy. A sort of general physical publication for various blind organizations might be a good idea in the future, sort of like a physical version of audeasy, but that wasn't the sort of scale I was thinking just as far as getting people on board went. What I was imagining was somethingmore like a general introduction, perhaps twop thousand words at most which just explains what audio games are, what the bennifits of playing them might be, the differences betwene audiogames and text games etc. It might have some examples mentioned but these wouldn't be adverts for any specific developers as much as just "shades of doom is a great example of an fps" type of thing. i would also not suggest selling it, but having it as a freely available informational leaflet who's production is financed by a number of people in the community, though whether enough funds could be generated to produce sufficient copies would be another question. However if I were a person who didn't know about audiogames I am more likely to pick up a free braille or print leaflet from a table at the next function of blind organization x than pay for something about a subject I've never heard of before. Of course, if it was successful and people liked it, more specific things could be done later, but I don't think we're at that point sinse for most people in places like The Rnib it's just a matter of knowing that accessible computer games exist! let alone advertising anything specific. Beware the Grue! Dark. learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: "Jeremy Brown" To: Sent: Monday, June 15, 2015 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Dark's suggestion of an informational blurb or pamphlet is the place where a number of developers could come together directly. If we formed some sort of organization of our own, that worked with, and/or through the more politically minded organizations, it's possible they might take more notice of us. Also too, defraying cost of printing might be easier if each developer contributed x amount and had x amount of space. It would mean you'd be advertising in some cases with your competition, but, if the real issue is that not enough people know about the market at all, then that might be a way to get info into the community. Audyssey might be a good launch point for such an item, since many developers subscribe. Audyssey has a history of helping blind people connect to game developers, and it's exactly the sort of proactive approach that the political organizations attempt to take. Further, we have developers here from multiple nations, so we could approach visually impaired organizations in multiple countries at once, and show that this is a global phenomenon. If it was sold on the grounds of promoting not only independent visually impaired entrepreneurs, but also the gamers who enjoy their work, it might be able to crack the shell where one or two small developers might not. Just a thought, Jeremy On 6/15/15, gamers-requ...@audyssey.org wrote: Send Gamers mailing list submissions to gamers@audyssey.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to gamers-requ...@audyssey.org You can reach the person managing the list at gamers-ow...@audyssey.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Gamers digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: info AudioGames Game Engine (dark) 2. Re: tips for playing bg chess (dark) 3. Re: tips for playing bg chess (Ron Schamerhorn) 4. Re: info AudioGames Game Engine (Thomas Ward) 5. Re: info AudioGames Game Engine (dark) -- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2015 17:27:27 +0100 From: "dark" To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] info AudioGames Game Engine Message-ID: <310941689A6043FBA74A76411331CCD7@ownere8ba8066c> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Hi Knick. that is an idea, though reselling is also quite a pain to setup as well, particularly sinse in the past when it's been tried with audiogames it hasn't worked out well. All the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to s
Re: [Audyssey] audio games leaflet
John, All good points. One of the things we need to do once we have a draft in hand is then organize how we're going to accomplish the goal. There's parts of this, that like you, I'm not sure exactly how to pursue, but, given the knowledge base we have on list, I think we either have the knowledge somewhere, or have enough people, that if we spread it thin enough we can learn what we need to. A lot of my job with VGA has been learning how to do things that needed to be done that Aaron didn't have time to do because he (cough) does the real work. As to the expenses, agreed, we should try to spread this so that no one individual or company is in for a lot. We want to make this as economical and as high return for the investment as possible. If it seems to succeed in a first run, we can always expand beyond that point. Also too, we'd want to get more supporters as well. A direct email to developers is probably a good place to start. Even if many are connected, they might not read all threads. Take care, Jeremy --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (wasinfo games game engines)
Hi Dark, I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but I was thinking that another way that the pamphlet could be distributed could be to have it read by a human or synthesized voice and then burnt to an audio CD. BFN Jim They said that it couldn't be done, so I didn't do it. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games(wasinfo games game engines)
Hi Jim. That is a very good suggestion Jim, and shouldn't be too hard to arrange either, though distributing the cds could be interesting. All the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: "Jim Kitchen" To: "dark" Sent: Sunday, June 21, 2015 3:50 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games(wasinfo games game engines) Hi Dark, I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but I was thinking that another way that the pamphlet could be distributed could be to have it read by a human or synthesized voice and then burnt to an audio CD. BFN Jim They said that it couldn't be done, so I didn't do it. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games(wasinfo games game engines)
I totally agree with Charles and Josh. I will have to buy my own equipment now including stuff I already had which was disposed of by others. I was admittedly peeved by that statement about playing gamaes on the computer. On 6/21/15, dark wrote: > Hi Jim. > > That is a very good suggestion Jim, and shouldn't be too hard to arrange > either, though distributing the cds could be interesting. > > All the best, > > Dark. > > > There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast > > and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even > the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. > - Original Message - > From: "Jim Kitchen" > To: "dark" > Sent: Sunday, June 21, 2015 3:50 PM > Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio > games(wasinfo games game engines) > > >> >> Hi Dark, >> >> I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but I was thinking that another >> way that the pamphlet could be distributed could be to have it read by a >> human or synthesized voice and then burnt to an audio CD. >> >> BFN >> >> Jim >> >> They said that it couldn't be done, so I didn't do it. >> >> j...@kitchensinc.net >> http://www.kitchensinc.net >> (440) 286-6920 >> Chardon Ohio USA >> --- >> Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org >> If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to >> gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. >> You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >> http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >> All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >> http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. >> If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the >> list, >> please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. >> > > > --- > Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org > If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to > gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. > You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. > All messages are archived and can be searched and read at > http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. > If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, > please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media (was audio games, game engine)
Cheers, Sent with Thunderbird 31.3.0 portable Hi. I have a USB to parallel cable laying around here somewhere, but no embosser. Lol I'm not sure it works, but I might be willing to part with it if I know I'm sending it to someone who is going to at least use it, assuming it works that is, to print out leaflets for the project being discussed here. Do we have destinations to send all these leaflets to? There's I think an NFB convention coming up pretty soon, July 29 or so. I don't see this happening that soon though, too bad. On 6/19/2015 4:39 PM, shaun everiss wrote: Well tom while true of laptops I do know that desktops in general at least the ones up to 2011 would have the required ports they have only recently gone full usb. There is still a moniter port on my laptop and I know that the new systems I got one from 2011 and the other from 2014 still have paralel ports. But yeah its all usb. there is probably a paralel to usb converter somewhere wouldn't surprise me. I mean there is serial to usb, vga moniter to usb, I know for a fact there is old style vhs tape recorder to usb because I have one. even audio to usb. In short there are as many converters as there are usb ports in a computer. Weather the software is accessable and not in chinese is another thing you can buy bog standard converters for vhs I know for a fact for a few bucks the software is either old or cracked or old and cracked but point is you can buy stuff. There are pro stuff to if you search so there is probably a way. I am not sure how easy it is to wrig up a simple no frills one, but when my power cord on one of our pcs broke my dad was able to hook up a length of headphone wire and a few headphone plugs in place of the broken cord and although it ran a bit hot at the ends it did work. Ofcause this was back just before 2000 and now with everything so secured like the iphone chargers you can't just put any wrigged cord in. An old unit though as long as you were prepaired to configure it who knows. There is probably something like com0com for a paralel port or something. Though a good converter will automatically convert for you. I am not sure about software. Though to be honest if were meaning pamphlets for various things I'd go the electronic rout, I am not sure how to make e braille but its all the rage. Audio mp3 daisy even standard cds. You could still buy braillers to. Finally I know for a fact that some organisations can hire out their units for online transfer of info via mail but you'd still have togo to the physical location to pick it up. I have a few old perkins units which I have not used ever since I got back into computers in 1995 so I have no idea if they work or not. At 03:00 a.m. 20/06/2015, you wrote: Hi John, Thanks. If we were to decide to go forward with this that old embosser and your stock of paper could prove useful. That is considering we can get that old thing going. That could be somewhat problematic these days. I happen to have an old embosser as well, a Braille Blazer circa 1992 or so, but have not been able to use it for several years because I don't have any computers I can hook it up to. Both serial ports and parallel ports are a thing of the past, and while I might be able to use a serial to USB adapter or something I really had no use for the thing until now. I should drag the thing out of storage and see if I can get it working. In any case there is probably a way to rig one of those old embossers to do the job if we had to. So that's at least a start in the right direction. Cheers! On 6/19/15, john wrote: > I have an old embosser (it uses a parallel port!), the software to match, > and more paper than I could even try to shake a stick at. If we wanted to > get serious about making this kind of a pamphlet, I could probably do that > part without to much trouble (I suspect Google would be able to answer all > my questions on how to make the thing go). > I don't have any real contacts within blindness organizations (and know > nothing about shipping outside of the U.S), but I can do the brailing, and > then cheer at the (slightly) greater amount of storage space I've got. > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and
Re: [Audyssey] info AudioGames Game Engine
Hi. Lol is 2200 a typo? Here in the US, you can do a lot with 2200 dollars if you live in the right place. That lasts our 3 person family a whole month though just barely and we have a new four wheel drive truck with a 6 leter v8 gas guzzling engine, a pretty fancy car, a new comfortable home that we own, not rent, and we use natural gas for heat, electricity for cooling and whatnot. Granted, we built the house ourselves, but still. Cheers, Sent with Thunderbird 31.3.0 portable On 6/17/2015 2:09 AM, shaun everiss wrote: And thats another point I can agree on. While I may spend a bit on games and other stuff realisticly if I lost my living at home situation I doubt I could even afford the net now or even a game. I get payed around 2200 dollars a week. take 50 for rent maybe 100 for food and a few other things and I am allready out of cash and rent costs more than 50 dollars so allready I have no cash at all. I myself am not a traveler I would need someone to travel with. At 02:33 a.m. 16/06/2015, you wrote: Hi Josh, I agree that going to blind conventions is probably the best way to market accessible games to the blind community. Unfortunately, we come back to the problem of money. A lot of audio game developers are blind themselves, are probably only getting SSI for income, so do not have a lot of money to spend on airfare, hotel rooms, and everything else required for extensive travel to and from various convention centers. That means while it might be a good way to promote a product the game developer still needs to raise enough cash to actually go to said conventions in the first place. Cheers! On 6/15/15, Josh K wrote: > I think the best way to really get games out there would be to attend > the ACB and nfb conventions and bring them to the attention of many many > blind people and agencies. > > follow me on twitter @joshknnd1982 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media (was audio games, game engine)
Hi Shaun, Interesting. It is my understanding that Windows Vista and above no longer support parallel ports, and here in the USA I have not seen a desktop or laptop PC with a parallel port in quite some time. At least not for the last 8 years or so. I have three laptops and none of them have parallel ports. I have an Averitech 6240 from 2006, a Compaq Presario from 2008, and a Toshiba Satellite from 2011 all with USB only. No serial and no parallel ports. I also have a Del desktop from 2010 which has two serial ports but no parallel ports. So even if a desktop or laptop PC can be found with a parallel port they must be few and far between because the technology has pretty much not been in production for years at least according to my own experience. Cheers! On 6/19/15, shaun everiss wrote: > Well tom while true of laptops I do know that desktops in general at > least the ones up to 2011 would have the required ports they have > only recently gone full usb. > There is still a moniter port on my laptop and I know that the new > systems I got one from 2011 and the other from 2014 still have paralel > ports. > But yeah its all usb. > there is probably a paralel to usb converter somewhere wouldn't surprise > me. > I mean there is serial to usb, vga moniter to usb, I know for a fact > there is old style vhs tape recorder to usb because I have one. > even audio to usb. > In short there are as many converters as there are usb ports in a computer. > Weather the software is accessable and not in chinese is another > thing you can buy bog standard converters for vhs I know for a fact > for a few bucks the software is either old or cracked or old and > cracked but point is you can buy stuff. > There are pro stuff to if you search so there is probably a way. > I am not sure how easy it is to wrig up a simple no frills one, but > when my power cord on one of our pcs broke my dad was able to hook up > a length of headphone wire and a few headphone plugs in place of the > broken cord and although it ran a bit hot at the ends it did work. > Ofcause this was back just before 2000 and now with everything so > secured like the iphone chargers you can't just put any wrigged cord in. > An old unit though as long as you were prepaired to configure it who knows. > There is probably something like com0com for a paralel port or something. > Though a good converter will automatically convert for you. > I am not sure about software. > Though to be honest if were meaning pamphlets for various things I'd > go the electronic rout, I am not sure how to make e braille but its > all the rage. > Audio mp3 daisy even standard cds. > You could still buy braillers to. > Finally I know for a fact that some organisations can hire out their > units for online transfer of info via mail but you'd still have togo > to the physical location to pick it up. > I have a few old perkins units which I have not used ever since I got > back into computers in 1995 so I have no idea if they work or not. > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] info AudioGames Game Engine
Hi Valiant, It must be a typo or Shaun is not talking about U.S. dollars. You are right $2,200 per week would be a lot of money and just one weeks paycheck would be enough to live comfortably for a month let alone getting that on a weekly basis assuming of course the person was living in a relatively low income area. So I'd have to say he was probably meaning to say $220 not $2,200. Cheers! On 6/21/15, valiant8086 wrote: > Hi. > Lol is 2200 a typo? Here in the US, you can do a lot with 2200 dollars > if you live in the right place. That lasts our 3 person family a whole > month though just barely and we have a new four wheel drive truck with a > 6 leter v8 gas guzzling engine, a pretty fancy car, a new comfortable > home that we own, not rent, and we use natural gas for heat, electricity > for cooling and whatnot. Granted, we built the house ourselves, but still. > > > Cheers, Sent with Thunderbird 31.3.0 portable --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media
Small games (<50mb), all redistributables checked for and installed as needed by the setup program. If we have somebody whose competent with making installers (not me!), then this should be a breeze. -- From: "Thomas Ward" Sent: Sunday, June 21, 2015 6:00 To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media Hi Ron, While I like such a sampler disc in principle I can foresee many problems arising from such a disc. One, is compatibility. If someone were to freely redistribute a sampler disc they would have no idea of what version is on the end user's machine thus can't for see any compatibility issues arising from such a sampler. Jim Kitchen's games, just as an example, are all written in VB 6 and require that Winkit be installed on Vista, Windows 7, or Windows 8.x systems prior to being installed and if the end user doesn't know that I can foresee a problem installing and playing those games just because they aren't familiar with what is required to play them. Two, is space and exposure for developers. While a DVD would offer 4 GB of distribution space I can foresee such a disc not covering all there is to offer thus there needs to be a vetting process of what games and demos are offered to the end user. We don't want to offer a number of games from developers x, y, and z and forget about developers a, b, and c. That said, a media disc might be a good idea over all. I know some magazines such as PC World and PC Magazine come with sampler discs with trials for software, games, and that has been very successful in getting demos and trials of new software out there to the mainstream market. Perhaps something similar might work for the audio games community too. Cheers! On 6/21/15, Ron Schamerhorn wrote: > "I've also thought of approaching the ADP people. Assistive Development > Program. I'd go for burning a cd/dvd with the games and a well done > read me about gaming for the blind/vi in general. > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media (was audio games, game engine)
I believe the ports are supported, but good luck finding something with said ports that's not 10 years old, as you said. -- From: "Thomas Ward" Sent: Sunday, June 21, 2015 18:13 To: "Gamers Discussion list" Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media (was audio games,game engine) Hi Shaun, Interesting. It is my understanding that Windows Vista and above no longer support parallel ports, and here in the USA I have not seen a desktop or laptop PC with a parallel port in quite some time. At least not for the last 8 years or so. I have three laptops and none of them have parallel ports. I have an Averitech 6240 from 2006, a Compaq Presario from 2008, and a Toshiba Satellite from 2011 all with USB only. No serial and no parallel ports. I also have a Del desktop from 2010 which has two serial ports but no parallel ports. So even if a desktop or laptop PC can be found with a parallel port they must be few and far between because the technology has pretty much not been in production for years at least according to my own experience. Cheers! On 6/19/15, shaun everiss wrote: > Well tom while true of laptops I do know that desktops in general at > least the ones up to 2011 would have the required ports they have > only recently gone full usb. > There is still a moniter port on my laptop and I know that the new > systems I got one from 2011 and the other from 2014 still have paralel > ports. > But yeah its all usb. > there is probably a paralel to usb converter somewhere wouldn't surprise > me. > I mean there is serial to usb, vga moniter to usb, I know for a fact > there is old style vhs tape recorder to usb because I have one. > even audio to usb. > In short there are as many converters as there are usb ports in a > computer. > Weather the software is accessable and not in chinese is another > thing you can buy bog standard converters for vhs I know for a fact > for a few bucks the software is either old or cracked or old and > cracked but point is you can buy stuff. > There are pro stuff to if you search so there is probably a way. > I am not sure how easy it is to wrig up a simple no frills one, but > when my power cord on one of our pcs broke my dad was able to hook up > a length of headphone wire and a few headphone plugs in place of the > broken cord and although it ran a bit hot at the ends it did work. > Ofcause this was back just before 2000 and now with everything so > secured like the iphone chargers you can't just put any wrigged cord in. > An old unit though as long as you were prepaired to configure it who > knows. > There is probably something like com0com for a paralel port or something. > Though a good converter will automatically convert for you. > I am not sure about software. > Though to be honest if were meaning pamphlets for various things I'd > go the electronic rout, I am not sure how to make e braille but its > all the rage. > Audio mp3 daisy even standard cds. > You could still buy braillers to. > Finally I know for a fact that some organisations can hire out their > units for online transfer of info via mail but you'd still have togo > to the physical location to pick it up. > I have a few old perkins units which I have not used ever since I got > back into computers in 1995 so I have no idea if they work or not. > --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media (was audio games, game engine)
Hu. that's odd because I have a desktop I bought 5 years ago with the necessary parallel ports and a serial or two as well. That is what my JC used. The newer laptops I bought in the last couple years don't though. And I have a Dell Precision notebook from 2007 with the ports too. Sean, let me know if you decide to part with one of those Perkins Braillers; preferably one that works. I guess this makes me look into the newer braile printers now just to see what they ae using to connect. Danielle P.S. Glad we have a start and someone to Braile out a first draft. On 6/21/15, john wrote: > I believe the ports are supported, but good luck finding something with said > > ports that's not 10 years old, as you said. > > -- > From: "Thomas Ward" > Sent: Sunday, June 21, 2015 18:13 > To: "Gamers Discussion list" > Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media (was audio > games,game engine) > > Hi Shaun, > > Interesting. It is my understanding that Windows Vista and above no > longer support parallel ports, and here in the USA I have not seen a > desktop or laptop PC with a parallel port in quite some time. At least > not for the last 8 years or so. > > I have three laptops and none of them have parallel ports. I have an > Averitech 6240 from 2006, a Compaq Presario from 2008, and a Toshiba > Satellite from 2011 all with USB only. No serial and no parallel > ports. I also have a Del desktop from 2010 which has two serial ports > but no parallel ports. So even if a desktop or laptop PC can be found > with a parallel port they must be few and far between because the > technology has pretty much not been in production for years at least > according to my own experience. > > Cheers! > > > On 6/19/15, shaun everiss wrote: >> Well tom while true of laptops I do know that desktops in general at >> least the ones up to 2011 would have the required ports they have >> only recently gone full usb. >> There is still a moniter port on my laptop and I know that the new >> systems I got one from 2011 and the other from 2014 still have paralel >> ports. >> But yeah its all usb. >> there is probably a paralel to usb converter somewhere wouldn't surprise >> me. >> I mean there is serial to usb, vga moniter to usb, I know for a fact >> there is old style vhs tape recorder to usb because I have one. >> even audio to usb. >> In short there are as many converters as there are usb ports in a >> computer. >> Weather the software is accessable and not in chinese is another >> thing you can buy bog standard converters for vhs I know for a fact >> for a few bucks the software is either old or cracked or old and >> cracked but point is you can buy stuff. >> There are pro stuff to if you search so there is probably a way. >> I am not sure how easy it is to wrig up a simple no frills one, but >> when my power cord on one of our pcs broke my dad was able to hook up >> a length of headphone wire and a few headphone plugs in place of the >> broken cord and although it ran a bit hot at the ends it did work. >> Ofcause this was back just before 2000 and now with everything so >> secured like the iphone chargers you can't just put any wrigged cord in. >> An old unit though as long as you were prepaired to configure it who >> knows. >> There is probably something like com0com for a paralel port or something. >> Though a good converter will automatically convert for you. >> I am not sure about software. >> Though to be honest if were meaning pamphlets for various things I'd >> go the electronic rout, I am not sure how to make e braille but its >> all the rage. >> Audio mp3 daisy even standard cds. >> You could still buy braillers to. >> Finally I know for a fact that some organisations can hire out their >> units for online transfer of info via mail but you'd still have togo >> to the physical location to pick it up. >> I have a few old perkins units which I have not used ever since I got >> back into computers in 1995 so I have no idea if they work or not. >> > > --- > Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org > If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to > gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. > You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. > All messages are archived and can be searched and read at > http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. > If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, > please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. > > > --- > Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org > If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to > gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. > You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. > All messages are archived and can be searched and read at > http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. > If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audiogames(wasinfo games game engines)
Hi Dark, Yeah, I guess that packaging and postage could get expensive, but I was thinking that they could be passed out at conventions, meetings, organizations etc. And you know I think that just about everyone can play an audio CD. And allot of people can make copies of them. BFN - Original Message - Hi Jim. That is a very good suggestion Jim, and shouldn't be too hard to arrange either, though distributing the cds could be interesting. All the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: "Jim Kitchen" To: "dark" Sent: Sunday, June 21, 2015 3:50 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games(wasinfo games game engines) Hi Dark, I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but I was thinking that another way that the pamphlet could be distributed could be to have it read by a human or synthesized voice and then burnt to an audio CD. BFN Jim They said that it couldn't be done, so I didn't do it. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Jim Check my web site for my 36 free games. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
