[Audyssey] braille/large print/other media etc
Danielle, Everyone's input is welcome. My only objection is to the idea of limiting the message. With the possible exception of audio, none of the proposed formats have necessarily been a big expenditure with volunteer help from the community. We have at this moment roughly the following resources: Dark writing the leaflet Eleanor and I offering editing and developer support of various sorts. This also includes Valiant8086 as well though he hasn't spoken publicly on this topic. We have had the offer of two operational braille embossers and about 4,000 pages of braille paper for said embossers. Even if you assume 10 pages/leaflet that's 400 leaflets. No one has volunteered printer capabilities for a large print edition yet, that I remember, but I am sure several of us could contribute. Web site space has been offered by multiple parties for electronic distribution. Scott has offered to investigate getting cheaper audio copies pressed in the U.k. John and some others have volunteered to burn CD's. For an idea that was only a mere suggestion a little over a week ago, that's a lot of progress. We are almost, as you suggested, at the point of needing to really organize. However, as Scott pointed out earlier, we need to thrash out the issues first before we get to that stage. By airing concerns and issues now, by having suggestions that are less workable torn apart now, we save time and wasted effort when it counts. In a community effort like this the opinions, criticisms, and resources of the entire community are important. Personalities might clash, but each challenge to an idea makes it firmer and gives it a better shape. That said, not every idea that every member contributes is always good in the form it's submitted in. Sometimes people misspeak themselves. Sometimes their idea just isn't workable for reasons they haven't considered. Also too, We have to remember that at this point we have only a nebulous plan. No plan survives contact with reality. No doubt portions of it will have to be modified. We're just trying to anticipate those bumps as much as possible. Thanks for your input, don't crawl under a rock. Take care, Jeremy -- In the fight between you and the world--back the world! Frank Zapa --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines)
Hi Dark, Well, production and distribution are two separate things. I can only speak for the production side of it with confidence really. If you or someone else were to record a narrated version of the text remotely, I reckon editing that, gathering a few gameplay clips, sequencing it all together and giving it a quick master would take an afternoon so long as the narrated version was well recorded in the first place. Any decent field recorder could handle it if the narrator is careful about placement and levels. At the end of that process, we'd have an electronic audio version that could be sent to any receptive organizations for them to distribute to interested parties. How well they'd handle that is out of our hands of course, but without a budget, that's probably as good as it's gonna get. In any case, assuming the promo text is non-specific enough to stand the test of time for a few years, it's an extra resource that the community didn't have before, and that can't be a bad thing. Scott On 6/27/15, dark d...@xgam.org wrote: Hi Scot. As I said, it's about alternatives. I fully agree a completely human narrated version with audio gameplay clips and high production values would be pretty dam awesome, however realistically is that possible? especially with the distribution. Formatting in print and braille just takes, well formatting the document with headings and paragraphas, but what your talking here in audio terms is tantamount to a full on audio production. If anyone wants to do this and can arrange the cd burning that is fantastic, but I'm going on what I know to be possible. As regards organizations and hard copies your likely correct, however equally bare in mind in the Uk at least there are organizations dedicated to producing braille material, for example prisons have a brailling service that you can pay for, and while I do not know the rates for a charity such as the audiogames.net game accessibility special interest group, it'd be fairly easy to find out. I'd also suggest people in the Us and other countries look into any brailling services that exist as well. After that we can get an idea of production costs and then see what money is needed and how much people may or may not have to contribute to the project. All the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: Scott Chesworth scottcheswo...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Friday, June 26, 2015 10:27 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Hi Dark, As usual, I respectfully disagree about some of that :) Granted, it would be much much simpler to send electronic content in to a bunch of organizations and let them handle production. The same could be said for the print and Braille versions. Tbh, I've got nothing at all against the idea of trying that first to keep the cost to a minimum. It might work, and then everyone's a winner. However, what I suspect you'll find is that unless you've got a personal connection with someone at each organization or someone there who already digs audio games, it's fairly likely that the electronic copy will get filed away somewhere and not distributed to the people they have contact with beyond an initial run. Before audio paid the bills here, I worked for a few charities, and saw this happen many times. It might not turn out to be practical for the community to produce hard copy, but if there's any way to make it so, I think that hard copy would stand a higher chance of reaching relevant people, because reclaiming cupboard space is often a higher priority than keeping the network drives tidy in many offices nowadays. A cynical view perhaps, but like I said, I've seen it happen enough to believe it. Two thoughts spring to mind about a synth narration. Firstly, we're coming at this as people who use a computer for hours each day. Most of us probably have a favourite synth that we're comfortable with, and most of us have probably reached a point where we naturally tune out the robot voice and just process the words it's churning out. That's not the mindset of people when they're less familiar with computers. Having crunched the numbers in previous jobs that had audio versions of newsletters that were narrated by synths, I can tell you that the response was pretty low and the dissatisfaction was pretty high. I used to work next to a chap who had plenty of people on his books that would prefer to call him every month to find out what was happening rather than listen to the newsletter, because the synth did nothing for them. Synths haven't gotten markedly better since, and our target audience seems likely to be of a similar mindset, so I
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines)
Motion seconded. It really doesn't take long to tape a small portion of a game, and about the same amount of time to insert it into an audio file. I think the major difficulty would be making sure everything fits together and that narrators don't have huge amounts of tape hiss in their voices. -- From: Scott Chesworth scottcheswo...@gmail.com Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2015 7:58 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Hi Dark, Well, production and distribution are two separate things. I can only speak for the production side of it with confidence really. If you or someone else were to record a narrated version of the text remotely, I reckon editing that, gathering a few gameplay clips, sequencing it all together and giving it a quick master would take an afternoon so long as the narrated version was well recorded in the first place. Any decent field recorder could handle it if the narrator is careful about placement and levels. At the end of that process, we'd have an electronic audio version that could be sent to any receptive organizations for them to distribute to interested parties. How well they'd handle that is out of our hands of course, but without a budget, that's probably as good as it's gonna get. In any case, assuming the promo text is non-specific enough to stand the test of time for a few years, it's an extra resource that the community didn't have before, and that can't be a bad thing. Scott On 6/27/15, dark d...@xgam.org wrote: Hi Scot. As I said, it's about alternatives. I fully agree a completely human narrated version with audio gameplay clips and high production values would be pretty dam awesome, however realistically is that possible? especially with the distribution. Formatting in print and braille just takes, well formatting the document with headings and paragraphas, but what your talking here in audio terms is tantamount to a full on audio production. If anyone wants to do this and can arrange the cd burning that is fantastic, but I'm going on what I know to be possible. As regards organizations and hard copies your likely correct, however equally bare in mind in the Uk at least there are organizations dedicated to producing braille material, for example prisons have a brailling service that you can pay for, and while I do not know the rates for a charity such as the audiogames.net game accessibility special interest group, it'd be fairly easy to find out. I'd also suggest people in the Us and other countries look into any brailling services that exist as well. After that we can get an idea of production costs and then see what money is needed and how much people may or may not have to contribute to the project. All the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: Scott Chesworth scottcheswo...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Friday, June 26, 2015 10:27 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Hi Dark, As usual, I respectfully disagree about some of that :) Granted, it would be much much simpler to send electronic content in to a bunch of organizations and let them handle production. The same could be said for the print and Braille versions. Tbh, I've got nothing at all against the idea of trying that first to keep the cost to a minimum. It might work, and then everyone's a winner. However, what I suspect you'll find is that unless you've got a personal connection with someone at each organization or someone there who already digs audio games, it's fairly likely that the electronic copy will get filed away somewhere and not distributed to the people they have contact with beyond an initial run. Before audio paid the bills here, I worked for a few charities, and saw this happen many times. It might not turn out to be practical for the community to produce hard copy, but if there's any way to make it so, I think that hard copy would stand a higher chance of reaching relevant people, because reclaiming cupboard space is often a higher priority than keeping the network drives tidy in many offices nowadays. A cynical view perhaps, but like I said, I've seen it happen enough to believe it. Two thoughts spring to mind about a synth narration. Firstly, we're coming at this as people who use a computer for hours each day. Most of us probably have a favourite synth that we're comfortable with, and most of us have probably reached a point where we naturally tune out the robot voice and just process the words it's churning out. That's not the mindset of
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines)
Yep, that's why I pointed out that whoever narrates it would have to go easy on levels. Failing that there's always tools like iZotope RX that do an insanely good job of noise reduction, but better to get it right at the source really. On 6/27/15, john jpcarnemo...@gmail.com wrote: Motion seconded. It really doesn't take long to tape a small portion of a game, and about the same amount of time to insert it into an audio file. I think the major difficulty would be making sure everything fits together and that narrators don't have huge amounts of tape hiss in their voices. -- From: Scott Chesworth scottcheswo...@gmail.com Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2015 7:58 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Hi Dark, Well, production and distribution are two separate things. I can only speak for the production side of it with confidence really. If you or someone else were to record a narrated version of the text remotely, I reckon editing that, gathering a few gameplay clips, sequencing it all together and giving it a quick master would take an afternoon so long as the narrated version was well recorded in the first place. Any decent field recorder could handle it if the narrator is careful about placement and levels. At the end of that process, we'd have an electronic audio version that could be sent to any receptive organizations for them to distribute to interested parties. How well they'd handle that is out of our hands of course, but without a budget, that's probably as good as it's gonna get. In any case, assuming the promo text is non-specific enough to stand the test of time for a few years, it's an extra resource that the community didn't have before, and that can't be a bad thing. Scott On 6/27/15, dark d...@xgam.org wrote: Hi Scot. As I said, it's about alternatives. I fully agree a completely human narrated version with audio gameplay clips and high production values would be pretty dam awesome, however realistically is that possible? especially with the distribution. Formatting in print and braille just takes, well formatting the document with headings and paragraphas, but what your talking here in audio terms is tantamount to a full on audio production. If anyone wants to do this and can arrange the cd burning that is fantastic, but I'm going on what I know to be possible. As regards organizations and hard copies your likely correct, however equally bare in mind in the Uk at least there are organizations dedicated to producing braille material, for example prisons have a brailling service that you can pay for, and while I do not know the rates for a charity such as the audiogames.net game accessibility special interest group, it'd be fairly easy to find out. I'd also suggest people in the Us and other countries look into any brailling services that exist as well. After that we can get an idea of production costs and then see what money is needed and how much people may or may not have to contribute to the project. All the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: Scott Chesworth scottcheswo...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Friday, June 26, 2015 10:27 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Hi Dark, As usual, I respectfully disagree about some of that :) Granted, it would be much much simpler to send electronic content in to a bunch of organizations and let them handle production. The same could be said for the print and Braille versions. Tbh, I've got nothing at all against the idea of trying that first to keep the cost to a minimum. It might work, and then everyone's a winner. However, what I suspect you'll find is that unless you've got a personal connection with someone at each organization or someone there who already digs audio games, it's fairly likely that the electronic copy will get filed away somewhere and not distributed to the people they have contact with beyond an initial run. Before audio paid the bills here, I worked for a few charities, and saw this happen many times. It might not turn out to be practical for the community to produce hard copy, but if there's any way to make it so, I think that hard copy would stand a higher chance of reaching relevant people, because reclaiming cupboard space is often a higher priority than keeping the network drives tidy in many offices nowadays. A cynical view perhaps, but like I said, I've seen it happen enough to believe it. Two thoughts spring to mind about a synth narration. Firstly,
Re: [Audyssey] info AudioGames Game Engine
I would like 2000 per week it would sertainly make life a lot easier grin Right now, a whole lot of little internal life dramas not just for me but the entire family mean we actually are a bit full up cash is the least of those but yeah we all wouldn't mind even more cash. I have just listened to a news article that told of a guy in some large city organisation that earned a lot of cash and stole more because he recond he wasn't being payed his share so yeah everyone seems to want more than they have On 25/06/2015 1:49 a.m., Thomas Ward wrote: Ah, that makes a lot more sense. I'd say $200 per week sounds a lot more like what a blind person on government benefits makes per week on average in most countries. Although, I'm sure we all would like it if we got $2,000 per week. Then, we'd be sitting pretty comfortable. LOL. Cheers! On 6/22/15, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: it was a typo. This keyboard has seen better days. its 200 dollars new zealand ones. This board is used for everything from games to blogs. I used to have an external but one of the systems here got a flat wireless and the user hasn't fixed his, pluss with all the crazyness going on I just havn't got round to get it back. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games(wasinfo games game engines)
Well. It all depends what you started with. That is what you got at school. For me it was braille then a type writer then a computer. Now I believve that its braille on a braille device but it could also be an electronic unit. Typing on a computer is skipped though you can go over to that yourself. The thing is government can only fund 1 solution so you either go full braille or no braille. Each has a cost. Obviously the braille way is more expensive the computer may be a bit cheaper but by the time you get jaws office etc and whatevver hardware well who knows. The disadvantage to this would be for people that do more than office work, ie play windows games and run standard windows programs since on a braille device with specialised os you can't exactly do that On 25/06/2015 12:38 a.m., Thomas Ward wrote: Hi Dark, I have been asking myself those same questions. I understand Charles really really really believes braille is the way to go on this, but as I stated in a prior post it is not going to work for everybody simply because not everyone with a visual impairment reads braille. We have large print users, we have the newly blind, and we have others who for one reason or another simply do not know or can't read braille. For example, I happen to know a guy who is totally blind, and although they tried to teach him braille he can't read braille. The problem is that he has a rare form of Dyslexia where he can't mentally associate sounds with words. Therefore he can't spell nor read because his brain can't process the written word regardless of how it is written. He does a lot via voice dictation and voice output because that is the only way he can communicate via e-mail and other written forms of communication. While that might be a rare case. I merely want to bring up the point that going all gung-ho for braille as the one-size fits all solution isn't the case for everyone. Cheers! On 6/21/15, dark d...@xgam.org wrote: What about people who read large print or use a lense or magnifyer? what about people who are newly blind, have not learnt braille but have a reader? really charlse, I don't see why your objecting to having information out there in multiple formats so strongly. Beware the grue! Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. . --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audiogames(wasinfo games game engines)
I'm not against having it available in multiple formats. However, I am for having braille as the main media type. There is a distinction. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: dark d...@xgam.org To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 21, 2015 9:15 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audiogames(wasinfo games game engines) What about people who read large print or use a lense or magnifyer? what about people who are newly blind, have not learnt braille but have a reader? really charlse, I don't see why your objecting to having information out there in multiple formats so strongly. Beware the grue! Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Friday, June 19, 2015 7:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games(wasinfo games game engines) I would not offer print pamphlets. The selected audience for the information does not read print. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: dark d...@xgam.org To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2015 7:15 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (wasinfo games game engines) Hi jeremy. A sort of general physical publication for various blind organizations might be a good idea in the future, sort of like a physical version of audeasy, but that wasn't the sort of scale I was thinking just as far as getting people on board went. What I was imagining was somethingmore like a general introduction, perhaps twop thousand words at most which just explains what audio games are, what the bennifits of playing them might be, the differences betwene audiogames and text games etc. It might have some examples mentioned but these wouldn't be adverts for any specific developers as much as just shades of doom is a great example of an fps type of thing. i would also not suggest selling it, but having it as a freely available informational leaflet who's production is financed by a number of people in the community, though whether enough funds could be generated to produce sufficient copies would be another question. However if I were a person who didn't know about audiogames I am more likely to pick up a free braille or print leaflet from a table at the next function of blind organization x than pay for something about a subject I've never heard of before. Of course, if it was successful and people liked it, more specific things could be done later, but I don't think we're at that point sinse for most people in places like The Rnib it's just a matter of knowing that accessible computer games exist! let alone advertising anything specific. Beware the Grue! Dark. learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: Jeremy Brown tyr...@gmail.com To: gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Monday, June 15, 2015 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Dark's suggestion of an informational blurb or pamphlet is the place where a number of developers could come together directly. If we formed some sort of organization of our own, that worked with, and/or through the more politically minded organizations, it's possible they might take more notice of us. Also too, defraying cost of printing might be easier if each developer contributed x amount and had x amount of space. It would mean you'd be advertising in some cases with your competition, but, if the real issue is that not enough people know about the market at all, then that might be a way to get info into the community. Audyssey might be a good launch point for such an item, since many developers subscribe. Audyssey has a history of helping blind people connect to game developers, and it's exactly the sort of proactive approach that the political organizations attempt to take. Further, we have developers here from multiple nations, so we could approach visually impaired organizations in multiple countries at once, and show that this is a global phenomenon. If it was sold on the grounds of promoting not only independent visually impaired entrepreneurs, but also the gamers who enjoy their work, it might be able to crack the shell where one or two small developers might not. Just a thought, Jeremy On 6/15/15, gamers-requ...@audyssey.org
Re: [Audyssey] braille chauvinism and the golden rule
Hmmm geremy interesting viewpoints. On the subject of viewpoint3 so many eating places and shops have no menus in braille I don't even ask. There are other ways to read menus if you so want. I don't think it can be forced for everyone in the world to give a braille menu. If you happen to have a electronic braille device then if you plan ahead of time you can get pdfs of menus and read em. as for getting them live thats another chapter but even so. On 26/06/2015 1:20 p.m., Jeremy Brown wrote: Dear all, First, braille is a format that I use whenever possible. Second, not all visually impaired people do so. Three, the blind community is very quick to complain, loudly, about inaccessibility of governmental documents, business materials, restaurant menus, and other forms of media used by the mainstream world to communicate in written forms. Fourth, unless something changed when I wasn't looking, audio games are not called braille games, games for blind people who read braille, or games that are on computers but would be better in braille format. Fifth, if I as a business person wish to reach the widest circulation and the widest possible market share of a potentially new market, I would be an absolute fool to limit myself to one segment of that market by only submitting materials in one format. Sixth, while some people do not understand it, redundancy of message is never a lost cause. Having large print means that sighted individuals who might donate to kick starter programs, or other ways of providing more funding to accessible gaming, might have access to this material. It is not only blind people who belong to and participate in events that cater to the visually impaired. Im willing to lay odds that for those of you who went blind as children, your sighted parents found out about programs and got you items through programs that you never knew about. Seventh, the amount of sheer chauvinism demonstrated on this point has been amazing. If you wish for equal access to anything, you shouldn't begin your conversation by limiting access for others to materials you wish to be available to anyone, and I repeat anyone, who might have an interest in your community. Finally, and I think this is the most important point of all: whether or not this project does materialize, if it is decided that it is only going to be supported in limited braille or audio only formats, I'm not for one going to support it. It's bad practice, not only from a business standpoint, but from an example setting standpoint. The way to conquer prejudice against blind people is not to display equal and opposite prejudice. Take care, Jeremy --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] baseball
Hi sometime I hit hard it goes for a homerun and sometimes out. The player have the ability to run and there is no queue of reaching in the home plate. secondly if a player out how we score runs? for Mr charles I live in india and baseball is not popular in this country as we know. so why you are saying that we cannot help you? this list is for visually impaired gamers to help and discuss various aspects of games. Thanks I hope you will answer these questions On 6/24/15, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: Without knowing the game you are playing, we cannot help you. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: ishan dhami ishan1dha...@gmail.com To: gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 21, 2015 9:57 PM Subject: [Audyssey] baseball Hello friends! I am playing baseball in these days. I have some doubts first how to change the player's name? second how to run? and lastly if a batter hits or a pitcher hits then is there any substitute player in our team? Thanks Ishan --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2015.0.5961 / Virus Database: 4365/10089 - Release Date: 06/24/15 --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines)
Hi Danielle. Not true. I have plenty of sighted friends who prefer to read than listen to audio. Indeed my brother is a large print user and would not sit down and listen to a synth voice but probably would read a large print pamflet. Again, I don't see what people have against multiple formats, If I could write the thing in everything from babylonic cuniform to sky writing with a plane to morse code I'd be happy to do that to get the information out there. Beware the grue! Dark. - Original Message - From: Danielle Ledet singingmywa...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Friday, June 26, 2015 12:20 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Braille and an audio CD. Simple. Large print readers are covered by an audio option. Done. On 6/24/15, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: Here's what you wrote: Charles I agree. There are those that don't use a computer. The easiest and lest expensive is audio mp3 or cd. I don't think tape decks exist now but that was also an easy way to handle it. I am not sure if anyone really reads braille these days. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Monday, June 22, 2015 3:55 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) I never said I wasn't interested in braille. I know vary well braille is used in school especially its used electronicly and on paper etc. However ever since I graduated to a fully useable laptop I havn't needed to use braille. My part about the books and machines is true enough though this was before the wide use of the electronic systems which in my day I never had. Its a lot different now. Anyway bar theodd book I don't deal with braille daily and with my work of testing various things and gaming braille is seldomn used or needed. I havn't needed to write on it for ages, even the machines I am used to have changed. In my day thoug braille was so heavy I couldn't wait to stop using it. Thats aparently changed a deal since I last used it fully. At 06:23 a.m. 23/06/2015, you wrote: I just responded to a post you sent that said that you don't think that anyone uses braille anymore. In light of that post, this one makes no sense, because you seem to show interest in braille. Which of your posts is accurate in giving your opinion of braille usage? --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Friday, June 19, 2015 3:45 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) that will be nice. your average laser printer costs around 300-400 bucks and 400 will give you a resonable priced unit. I have one that cost around that much with full network functions and with updates to its firmware wireless eprint which tablet users find really good. I also enjoyed the discussion on the canute. Heck if this works I will get one. One thing I have been interested in is a braille display of some tipe and a good braille keyboard to use the computer with so I can keep my braille going. Ever since I started using a computer in 1995 I gradually stopped typing with the old clunky and heavy braille units. aparently from a friend in the industry they are starting with the electronic units with simple functions and graduating to full computers. However I find it faster on a querty I just wish I could read braille on the screen without spending a lot of cash to get one. Even though you can get some cheap units for 2000 dollars I wouldn't use it enough. At 03:02 a.m. 20/06/2015, you wrote: once the braigo braille printer comes out braille embossers should cost no more than $300 or so. check out braigo labs http://www.braigolabs.com/ follow me on twitter @joshknnd1982 On 6/19/2015 8:18 AM, dark wrote: Hi Tom. Buy an embosser? that is way more overkill than I am thinking here. In the Uk at least there are braille transcription services that will spend their time on printing, it's one way that say a local theatre can get braille programs, sinse you are correct that braille embossers are stupidly expensive. I don't have a clear idea on costs, sinse it's not something I've looked into but I don't believe it's that much, particularly as regards reproducing the thing once you've got one printed and then are making copies. As to people who don't have much to do with the blind community, well to be honest I fall into that category marginly myself simply because I don't find blindness events or organizations
[Audyssey] your adventure
hi friends! I am encountering a strange bug in the game your adventure. whenever I save the game and restart it i lose everything such as potion and gold coins is this be fixed? Thanks Ishan --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines)
True I had a internal cd writer do that. However I listen to audio cds on my cd players and daisy and mp3 cds on my daisy player and neither has failed yet and I have listened to them constantly. But yeah that is a factor. On 27/06/2015 8:26 a.m., Thomas Ward wrote: Hi, In addition to the issues John mentioned below there would be a lot of wear and tear on the CD burner as well. CD and DVD burners are well known to give up the ghost after heavy use. They are alright for the occasional data, music, and video disc, but pumping out hundreds of discs would put a lot of wear and tear on the burner which means the cost of distributing audio discs would have to take in account maintenance of the person's equipment. Cheers! On 6/26/15, john jpcarnemo...@gmail.com wrote: An audio cd would be surprisingly difficult to make hundreds of copies of. You can probably get the disks for $50 (ish), but you can only burn them one at a time, and each and every one would take at least 10 minutes of active work by the person doing the burning. I'm not saying that it'd be impossible, but that making audio cds as a primary form of distribution for the entire leaflet is probably not our best idea. Further, there'd also be the fact of narration - I know a lot of people who would not want to listen to what is essentially a glorified advertisement done by synthesizer. Therefore, we'd have to have somebody narrate the whole thing (professionally, not some internal mic with background hiss), and then somebody to edit that narration. The idea of an audiogames cd has its own merits - if we wanted, we could put together trailors of a number of different games and distribute them on the cd along with our introduction, but I think that such a project is a bit beyond the scope of what we're currently considering. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. . --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] ok a bit of explination of starship traders
Actually, just for reference, this is a newer version of star trader, which is open source, and released under the gpl. If anyone wants it, and can't find it, let me know, and I'll put my copy up somewhere for download. Star traders itself is a rewrite of the old bbs door game called czarwars, which was one of the many many tradewars clones, though to be fair, I'm fairly certain czarwars was out either slightly before, or around the same time as tradewars, so it's not one that jumped on the tradewars success band wagon. I have registered versions of both czarwars, and seatraders (both by the same person, and interestingly enough, he'd also written a bbs program called autobbs which I also registered, and even wrote a file import utility for which had been posted on his main support board until his laptop crashed back in the early 90s, and the whole project went away. However, this new version is much improved over the startraders code, and a whole lot closer to the original czarwars, though it does seem to have a few more features, and some options czarwars did not. Also, you'll find me on there as Panther, so if you run across some of my starbases, don't feel too bad about being denyed access to my sectors, I'm just trying to build up a nice safe trading route. :) Anyway, just thought I'd help with a bit of history there. On Jun 23, 2015, at 6:28 PM, Darren Harris wrote: Firstly, this game is called the last resort. There are 3 games. I'm playing on game 000. Dark was mentioning about the whole resort worlds thing with regards to before you get into space. Well I've just managed to get into space. Below is a rough description of starshipp traders what it does and what you can do. Like I said, the game is now referred too as the last resort. If we can get a good amount of people to come play on this game then it could certainly be good fun. The Last Resort March 1, 2015: What is The Last Resort and why should I play it? In very obvious ways, TLR is a crude game. While there is a graphical client, it is not necessary to play the game. TLR is free and can be played with a web browser or simply by telnet. Using a web browser is not very immersive; playing via telnet is difficult at first. You find yourself typing '?' a lot for the command menu. TLR's strength is a gameplay balance that provides a platform for strategy like few other games. Understanding it is slow at first, but once understood, there are a relatively small number of mechanisms and objects that can be used in a near-infinite number of ways. A recent predecessor of TLR, Starship Traders, was described by a long-time player like this: First it seems too complicated, then too simple. Then too complicated again. TLR suffers from a lack of human factors engineering and is even more confusing as a result. Nothing is obvious to the first-time player. Even when a new player figures out how to use the radio and ask someone what they should be doing, they are likely to be told to 'Computrade'. Such a simple answer to the mystery posed by such a complicated, abstract universe. Surely that wasn't a satisfactory answer. But we will address that in due time. Suffice it to say, TLR is confusing, text-based, and huge. 'How huge is it?', you might be wondering? The new version of the game supports a universe of up to four million sectors and rooms in size. There are over a million machines and ports, and over a hundred thousand planets and pantries in a a game of that size. It will also support thousands of other players. The typical universe is divided into 1500+ distinct galaxies and hotels, ranging in size from 125 sectors up to 16,000 rooms. Any one of those places might harbor an enemy starship, attack starbases, or maybe an automatic homing device that will attach itself to you as you enter, and start broadcasting your location to the other player that placed it there. But back to the central question: why should you waste your time on this game? First, a simple answer to a simple question. You probably shouldn't play this game. But, who am I to decide? You'll have to make that decision for yourself. Most players quit within a few minutes of logging in. They see no appealing graphics, no music plays, and nothing makes sense to them immediately. They move on to the next shiny thing. The first impression may not be everything, but here it eliminates almost 90% of players. The other 10% starts to play, tentatively. Moving to another sector by typing a sector number, Moving and Trading and with a machine by typing C (for Computrade), testing the various commands in the menu that ? lists. They move, they trade, they build a few milibots, they find an abandoned pantry and lift some stuff out of it. The pantry takes the name of the player, just as several of the machines had. And one MiniBar reported the name of
Re: [Audyssey] audio files (was large print/braille/other media etc)
Jeremy that is actually a thing that could be done. However it would not be good for those with either not the means or smarts to use electronic equipment and there are a few others. Here in new zealand for especially islanders and maoris but also other poor groups of people they may or may not have a computer, or the smarts to use it. Or they may have really old systems that can't take the power etc old net connections the list goes on. My grandpa is one example I have a job for a poor person I need to do later today on their system to fix something. I expect that due to them not being to afford anything things will be bad but what do you do. Ofcause it all depends on the format. I guess what I need to stress is the costs vs what can be achieved. Any technological format, website, cd etc will need something to access it, braille can be read anywhere. You may have to charge for shipping and maybe the paper you use but that is a fair point on the braille front. Ofcause if you have the cds etc I'd go for that but thats because I have been using the pc and cd for a number of years and not braille. On 27/06/2015 8:21 a.m., Jeremy Brown wrote: Dark, All good points. One thing that has been left off this calculation is not burning a CD at all. If we went this route, having an alternative format oculd be as simple as a business card with a web address. Go there, read the leaflet, or have it read to you. Have links to developers who have supported the leaflet and other developers who have good audio game sites. A nicely done site with the leaflet and audio file would avoid a lot of this problem. Course, then we run into domain costs, but there's going to be cost involved somewhere in this process at some point. Right now it's a matter of deciding how much, most efficient use of funds, and how to move forward. Jeremy --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] (no subject)
It depends on how many cds you wanted to burn. It takes about 20-30 minutes to setup but once you have it all set, you can burn cds taking 10 minutes as long as your drive and processer are fast enough. And if you had the same thing on several units well. However I wouldn't suggest unless you hired a big company doing it all yourself for a large group, while I don't mind burning cds for myself by the time you set em up assuming its not an iso or a perminant project it can take 30 mins to an hour to get fully setup and burning a single disk. Now in that reguard if you had the material which I don't braille would be faster to produce once the files weere set up and all you'd need to do was supply paper every once in a while and then staple it together and send it. Mp3 cds or daisy cds would take just as long to burn though having an electronic braille or audio upload excluding cds fully would take less time probably. However I must confess I enjoy braille to read for a pamphlet, just about everything I get is a download or cd and sometimes I wish to read it but there you go. Its probably easier if you can afford it to produce braille for a large group if you are doing it yourself or from somewhere. Ofcause if you have the resources to produce audio or digital at high speed then I'd go for that or both if you could but it all depends what you have and how fast and for what size of a group. For a small group unless its changed braille may be costly to produce audio not so much. But that may change as I have been out the loop for a number of years On 27/06/2015 6:59 a.m., john wrote: I'd say at least a solid day of sitting at the computer - but I've only burnt a couple audio cds in my life, so somebody who does more of them would know better. I think we're almost certainly out of the realm of hiring somebody though, it'd probably cost thousands, which was exactly what we're trying to avoid by making this a community undertaking. I'd personally say that if we're going to do a cd, it'd probably be a better idea to do it only once we know what kind of reception we're going to get - that's a lot of work for an unknown reward. -- From: Danielle Ledet singingmywa...@gmail.com Sent: Friday, June 26, 2015 13:46 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Well, I find it less than pleasant that our own folks are quick to do away with and shun Braille, like poof be gone, but oh the Gods up above if we don't accommodate those large print readin' gods and goddeses. What would it take for starters a whole afternoon or a few days of one's time to burn them?Then, we'd get an idea of time and have some way to gage cost of hiring a real professional. After all, Newsreel and Pawtracks didn't start out sounding like RCA or Cash Money or NLS studio quality. No one round hear is a stranger to elbow grease and just getting it done especially in the face of challenges and obstacles! Happy to do it!I realize some of us on heare do have check-paying jobs so And some of us have access to and the know-how to record a human reading so that it doesn't sound like a classroom recording or home cassette. Though that's not me. I was just trying to find a solid workable solution without counting out or disrespecting anyone's preferences. The real problem I'm having hear right now is a whole lotta talking and discussion and not enough action. A whole lot of what-ifs and not enough working lets-sees. At this point we have more than enough thrown out all options. Enough with the excuses for this or that! On 6/26/15, john jpcarnemo...@gmail.com wrote: An audio cd would be surprisingly difficult to make hundreds of copies of. You can probably get the disks for $50 (ish), but you can only burn them one at a time, and each and every one would take at least 10 minutes of active work by the person doing the burning. I'm not saying that it'd be impossible, but that making audio cds as a primary form of distribution for the entire leaflet is probably not our best idea. Further, there'd also be the fact of narration - I know a lot of people who would not want to listen to what is essentially a glorified advertisement done by synthesizer. Therefore, we'd have to have somebody narrate the whole thing (professionally, not some internal mic with background hiss), and then somebody to edit that narration. The idea of an audiogames cd has its own merits - if we wanted, we could put together trailors of a number of different games and distribute them on the cd along with our introduction, but I think that such a project is a bit beyond the scope of what we're currently considering. -- From: Danielle Ledet singingmywa...@gmail.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 19:20 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re:
[Audyssey] (no subject)
What is this leaflet for dark. I may be interestted getting a coppy of it or any mag you did. I guess once you got it, the easiest way to smash this debate into the bground is to previde the costs per unit to produce in sertain formats. obviously audio/ documents would have to be hosted so could cost. cds I know are around 20 or so sents I know cases can be up to a dollar for a slim line case a paper envelope would be cheaper. Braille all depends. electronic is small but your basic print copy may cost and I am not sure. I think though in the end you would have to choose what you got it in.I'd ffor example be happy to get audio/html/ digital formats especially if it wasn't local to me. However I guess if a publication was released a lot like some reading material I had a little ago I guess I could go the braille rout so I would have something to look foreward for. On 27/06/2015 7:58 a.m., dark wrote: Hi Danielle. Actually, I am writing the leaflet right now, and hope to have it completed next week, after that we can go from there. All the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: Danielle Ledet singingmywa...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Friday, June 26, 2015 6:46 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Well, I find it less than pleasant that our own folks are quick to do away with and shun Braille, like poof be gone, but oh the Gods up above if we don't accommodate those large print readin' gods and goddeses. What would it take for starters a whole afternoon or a few days of one's time to burn them?Then, we'd get an idea of time and have some way to gage cost of hiring a real professional. After all, Newsreel and Pawtracks didn't start out sounding like RCA or Cash Money or NLS studio quality. No one round hear is a stranger to elbow grease and just getting it done especially in the face of challenges and obstacles! Happy to do it!I realize some of us on heare do have check-paying jobs so And some of us have access to and the know-how to record a human reading so that it doesn't sound like a classroom recording or home cassette. Though that's not me. I was just trying to find a solid workable solution without counting out or disrespecting anyone's preferences. The real problem I'm having hear right now is a whole lotta talking and discussion and not enough action. A whole lot of what-ifs and not enough working lets-sees. At this point we have more than enough thrown out all options. Enough with the excuses for this or that! On 6/26/15, john jpcarnemo...@gmail.com wrote: An audio cd would be surprisingly difficult to make hundreds of copies of. You can probably get the disks for $50 (ish), but you can only burn them one at a time, and each and every one would take at least 10 minutes of active work by the person doing the burning. I'm not saying that it'd be impossible, but that making audio cds as a primary form of distribution for the entire leaflet is probably not our best idea. Further, there'd also be the fact of narration - I know a lot of people who would not want to listen to what is essentially a glorified advertisement done by synthesizer. Therefore, we'd have to have somebody narrate the whole thing (professionally, not some internal mic with background hiss), and then somebody to edit that narration. The idea of an audiogames cd has its own merits - if we wanted, we could put together trailors of a number of different games and distribute them on the cd along with our introduction, but I think that such a project is a bit beyond the scope of what we're currently considering. -- From: Danielle Ledet singingmywa...@gmail.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 19:20 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Braille and an audio CD. Simple. Large print readers are covered by an audio option. Done. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All
Re: [Audyssey] braille chauvinism and the golden rule
Well there shouldn't be a debate really both formats have their merrits. Braille can be read anywhere. Cds/ websites can also be used anywhere. On the flip side cds are portable as well as other electronics but need the equipment to interact with them. Braille is bulky and heavy to carry round but that only happens if you are dealing with sevweral volumes of paper such as large books. In theory your average pamphlet may not be that bad. On 26/06/2015 9:36 p.m., dark wrote: Hi Jeremy. As I said previously, I think for some reason people have confused the idea of diseminating information about audio games in different formats with the Is braille obsolete debate, even though the two matters are entirely, absolutely %100 different issues. While I probably would have been a little less stringent, i do agree with you that peoples cries of Braille braille braille when your effectively trying to reach as wide an audience as humanly possible really isn't a good thing. I will say, that if the leaflet text that I am currently working on is the one which is used, there will certainly be an electronic copy at least sinse I will be glad to desceminate the document wherever, and I will certainly be looking for as many other distribution methods as humanly possible. All the best, DArk. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. . --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines)
Hi Danielle, Yeah, the distro side of things can get pretty complicated pretty quickly. as I just said to Dark though, the production of an audio version is a few hours of work for anyone who has chops in that area. It doesn't have to be a huge involved project if the right people work on it. Sure, I've no doubt that if you want to check out a game you'll just go do it, if you're reading about a new game and that info is coming through a synth it won't matter to you, but that's because you're not the target audience. You're already aware that games exist, you're used to finding new stuff to play and you're already using a computer for entertainment. This is aimed at newbies, people who probably haven't used a computer for much beyond word processing, so the more real-world gaming they can hear and the less computery the presentation is, the more likely they are to believe it's fun. The goal is for them to feel brave enough to fire up their dreaded computer and attempt to tackle something new isn't it. Scott On 6/27/15, Danielle Ledet singingmywa...@gmail.com wrote: Scott I just don't feel it need be that complicated and involved. Aren't games a fun activity and overall experience? I mean no one is losing money and can't pay next months rent, having their reputations ruined, or endangering themselves or their family and/or livelihood or relationships damaged or endangered by playing a few audio games, are they?After all we aren't charging anyone to pick up a Braile flyer or audio CD. Do print if ya want but that to me defeats the purpose of reaching erm targeting the very community who could benefit or might take interest. By no means should it be sloppy but it shouldn't be overly complicated and costly either. Remember, we have only a small number of devs and they aren't making mad profits with a small fraction of the blind population. Which is why I didn't include movie trailers since that doesn't make or break the deal for me. If I wanna play a game or have the possibility of doing so I will whether or not an audio example or walkthrough is offered. Lastly I agree wholeheartedly about the synth though if it were Volcalizer or Eloquence it would be tolerable. Thanks Dark for taking this and getting started. Thanks all for your input and if you prefer I'll crawl back under my given rock. On 6/26/15, john jpcarnemo...@gmail.com wrote: If we were to seriously go after a cd I think I can probably burn four at a time, but even then that'd still take quite a while. -- From: Scott Chesworth scottcheswo...@gmail.com Sent: Friday, June 26, 2015 15:45 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) You're seeing a whole lot of discussion and no action for two reasons: 1. Initial discussions such as these prevent fragmented action, which would be a waste of time and effort, especially for a project that relies on voluntary effort. 2. The discussion keeps getting derailed by people extolling the virtues of this format and griping against the inclusion of that format. It serves no purpose for anybody of course, but it'll carry on regardless, because people are apparently unwilling to accept well written explanations and practical examples of why what they're preaching about serves no purpose. On the audio CD front, even supposing you could inspire a few folks into narrating it, putting together game trailers to make it an engaging listen etc (which your last post was pretty far from doing), production is a big hurdle. Unlike printers, home burners are slow and notoriously dodgy. Beyond the burning and testing of each disk, there's packaging, labeling, and more expensive shipping to consider. The only solution I can vouch for is getting a pressing plant doing the leg work, the price of which depends on the numbers of disks you're pressing. In a nutshell, it's expensive for small runs, but the more you press the cheaper it gets per unit until eventually it breaks about even with the cost of doing it at home minus all the hassle. But, much as I think audio is the ideal format to get people inspired to play audio games, it's more work to produce and more expensive to distribute as hard copy, so I'd say it's a flawed idea to start with that. It's too early to tell whether this will happen or not, but if the discussion actually comes to something being circulated in written form and the community does start to grow as a result, I'd gladly put some hours into an audio version of the info and lean on a few pressing plants where I'm a repeat customer to get the price as low as possible to spread the word in the UK. Other people would need to handle other locations. There'd need to be actual distribution channels in place and evidence that the community is growing for me to go at it for free though. Should
[Audyssey] (no subject)
Well it all depends man on what you have I think. As a technology user I'd prefur to have the audio download because I don't have to pay for shipping of cds or braille material. Though I have recieved pamphlets in html and text to. On the other side I guess if I knew what the audio/ braille cost for postage I may actually go for the braille letter so I could keep it because I like that sort of thing. But its what you have. I wouldn't have robotic synths read the audio though a human voice maybe and with audio having reviews of various things yeah if I had to pay for that maybe. Though to be honest for us technos there are so many forums etc we really don't need the pamphlet, even the audyssey mag has sort of outlived its life though thats mostly because we have had so many stretches with it not producing that its no longer the big thing it was. Pluss there are to many indie devs out now. On 27/06/2015 7:56 a.m., dark wrote: Hi John. audio cd in synbth, even though listening to synths isn't my favourite option is what I was thinking, sinse again it's another format and I know there are programs that can easily create mp3 files from standard text. What I'd be tempted to do on the burning issue is burn a few copies, but also distribute the audio file to any organizations who habilitually make audio announcements on cd (such as the local society for the blind where my mum is), and let them handle reproduction. Obviously cds would be harder to produce as you said, but having a few kicking around that could be copied or listened to at conventions would have the same help in distribution methods as anything else. All the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: john jpcarnemo...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Friday, June 26, 2015 6:21 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (wasinfo games game engines) An audio cd would be surprisingly difficult to make hundreds of copies of. You can probably get the disks for $50 (ish), but you can only burn them one at a time, and each and every one would take at least 10 minutes of active work by the person doing the burning. I'm not saying that it'd be impossible, but that making audio cds as a primary form of distribution for the entire leaflet is probably not our best idea. Further, there'd also be the fact of narration - I know a lot of people who would not want to listen to what is essentially a glorified advertisement done by synthesizer. Therefore, we'd have to have somebody narrate the whole thing (professionally, not some internal mic with background hiss), and then somebody to edit that narration. The idea of an audiogames cd has its own merits - if we wanted, we could put together trailors of a number of different games and distribute them on the cd along with our introduction, but I think that such a project is a bit beyond the scope of what we're currently considering. -- From: Danielle Ledet singingmywa...@gmail.com Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2015 19:20 To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: Re: [Audyssey] braille/large print/other media for audio games (was info games game engines) Braille and an audio CD. Simple. Large print readers are covered by an audio option. Done. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. . --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] braille chauvinism and the golden rule
You're missing the point. It's not really about the strengths or weaknesses of each format, it's more that the attitude on display here that one is somehow more valid than the others is a flawed thought process. On 6/26/15, Shaun Everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: Well there shouldn't be a debate really both formats have their merrits. Braille can be read anywhere. Cds/ websites can also be used anywhere. On the flip side cds are portable as well as other electronics but need the equipment to interact with them. Braille is bulky and heavy to carry round but that only happens if you are dealing with sevweral volumes of paper such as large books. In theory your average pamphlet may not be that bad. On 26/06/2015 9:36 p.m., dark wrote: Hi Jeremy. As I said previously, I think for some reason people have confused the idea of diseminating information about audio games in different formats with the Is braille obsolete debate, even though the two matters are entirely, absolutely %100 different issues. While I probably would have been a little less stringent, i do agree with you that peoples cries of Braille braille braille when your effectively trying to reach as wide an audience as humanly possible really isn't a good thing. I will say, that if the leaflet text that I am currently working on is the one which is used, there will certainly be an electronic copy at least sinse I will be glad to desceminate the document wherever, and I will certainly be looking for as many other distribution methods as humanly possible. All the best, DArk. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. . --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] audio files (was large print/braille/other media etc)
I sent this earlier and it has not shown up on the list. So I am resending it. If you get two, that is why. Someone mentioned hosting the audio file on AudioGames and Audyssey. We would also be glad to host it on the 7-128 Software website. It could also be just the print version where the viewer's own screen reader could read the text. As far as burning a few CD's. I would be willing to burn a few CD's for distribution. When we ship CD's, we charge $5.00 for burning, shipping and materials which covers the cost of the CD blanks, printer ink, postage and a little something for my time. I am willing to cover the costs for 20 CD's. Any more than that, and I'd need to charge a little something for it, partially because of the wear and tear on our equipment. As Jeremy said: For an idea that was only a mere suggestion a little over a week ago, that's a lot of progress. Lets keep thrashing things out and make something that will help people who don't know that such things exist, find audiogames to enjoy. Eleanor Robinson 7-128 Software --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] audio files (was large print/braille/other media etc)
Hi Eleanor. I agree with Ron's comment, that is great, hopefully this can all be sorted to get more information out there. All the best, Dark. There is always more to know, more to see, more to learn. The world is vast and wondrous strange and there are more things benieth the stars than even the archmaesters of the citadel can dream. - Original Message - From: Eleanor elea...@7128.com To: gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2015 3:25 AM Subject: [Audyssey] audio files (was large print/braille/other media etc) I sent this earlier and it has not shown up on the list. So I am resending it. If you get two, that is why. Someone mentioned hosting the audio file on AudioGames and Audyssey. We would also be glad to host it on the 7-128 Software website. It could also be just the print version where the viewer's own screen reader could read the text. As far as burning a few CD's. I would be willing to burn a few CD's for distribution. When we ship CD's, we charge $5.00 for burning, shipping and materials which covers the cost of the CD blanks, printer ink, postage and a little something for my time. I am willing to cover the costs for 20 CD's. Any more than that, and I'd need to charge a little something for it, partially because of the wear and tear on our equipment. As Jeremy said: For an idea that was only a mere suggestion a little over a week ago, that's a lot of progress. Lets keep thrashing things out and make something that will help people who don't know that such things exist, find audiogames to enjoy. Eleanor Robinson 7-128 Software --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] audio files (was large print/braille/other media etc)
I'm glad to see the progress and willingness of people to help out in this undertaking. I believe that all formats should be attempted since not everyone has the same access or uses the same method for reading material. And no I'm not saying one is better then another. *grin* I know I haven't said much on this, but have been paying close attention. I'm willing to check out with a few ADP (assistive Devices Program) here in Ontario and ask if they'd aid in distribution. Let's keep it going strong! Ron --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
