[Audyssey] Life, The AGRIP Project and Everything
Hello all, For those of you that are not on the AGRIP lists and may not know me, I am the lead developer of AudioQuake and a research student in the area of computer and game accessibility. I am writing to tell you about some recent events that have affected the AGRIP project and my work -- though this email, being sent to gaming lists, is primarily about the AGRIP project, which is overseen by myself and Sabahattin ``Sebby'' Gucukoglu. My hope is that community feedback will once again help us decide where we should be going next. On the 23rd of August, I was hit by a car whilst on a pedestrian crossing on the way home from work. Since then, I have been in hospital for a month, then at home with my parents for a few weeks. Very fortunately, it is expected that I will be able to walk again (though not for a few months) and I did not sustain any head injuries. I'm on the way to being back online now. I'm returning to university tomorrow, to start getting back into my studies. I've been lucky to get hold of a wheelchair-accessible room in hall that I can stay in until I can walk again. This will take some time. So will catching up with my research work. I am not sure where that leaves us at the moment. I am very keen to do all the things I mentioned that we were planning for the AGRIP project just a few weeks before my accident. However, I have no idea of when I'll be able to get back into active development of AudioQuake, at the rate that such plans would require, as my research schedule has now been blown out of the water. It may take months to get back to where I was. This creates a dilemma -- I always wanted (and still do want) AGRIP to become an application of the core research I'm working on right now and that requires that we have an active community of users. But if I'm unable to do the development work to support such users right now, what will happen? I don't want to see people leave due to lack of improvements. But at the same time, I can't personally make those improvements right now. So, I propose that instead of me doing all the development work from now on, I will work only on providing the community with a completed set of documentation on how to do the development themselves. I will finish the manuals that tell you how to get, build and edit the code -- that's the gamecode and the engine, so you can make modifications to either and create new games from what AudioQuake now is. I will also try to give information on how the statistics collection works (maybe I can finish the update of the stats site too, if things go well, but I'm not sure right now). Thanks very much for your input on the survey we carried out recently before my accident. I will publish the results as soon as I can; I hope you now appreciate why there has been such a delay in doing this. The survey told me that people do want to see some things changed, and a lot of you want to make changes yourselves. Level editing was a big part of this, and I fully intend to continue work on that when I can. But for now, I think the best I can do is give you all the information and help you require to make code-based changes (game mods and engine mods). There are some very talented people in the AGRIP community who're learning the hard way and I feel I should concentrate on providing the documentation to make that an easier learning curve for all of you, now that these people (Cara Quinn being the name that leaps off the top of my head, along with Derek London) have forged the way. I would like to know what people in the community think of this -- it seems to me that this is the only way I can allow the project to evolve, as I simply can't afford the time right now to actively develop it myself (certainly not between all the catch-up I have to do, and the physio, etc). If people are interested in developing their own modifications or even versions of the game, then please let me know and I'll do my best to finish the manuals that will give you all the information on how to do it. For your reference, the current one (not entirely complete) can be found at http://docs.agrip.org.uk/ . Thanks for your time in listening to this. I look forward to becoming as involved as I once was in the Accessible Gaming community again in the not-too-distant future :-). best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Big News from the AGRIP Project
On Thu, 2006-07-06 at 09:59 +0200, AudioGames.net wrote: > Great to hear that. I would suggest Doom3 as well. It is relatively new (2-3 > years?), the gameplay isn't that diverse, there's lots of good audio in the > game already (some parts of the game are near complete darkness anyway) and > than it would be the first game to be accessible for the blind AND the deaf > (see http://gamescc.rbkdesign.com/). end-quote That last point has made me stop and think about DooM 3 (despite needing a vast new computer to develop on it). I am concerned that it's not Open Source may mean I can't actually do the stuff I need to -- such as interface to a TTS engine, or allow people to modify it fully, or ensure there are demos for people to try. Additionally, it's not multiplayer-centric, like Quake 3 or Unreal Tournament and that's something I want to make accessible in the future (the collaborative stuff). Also, the map-editing side will be very complex, as opposed to that for Quake 1 and, to some extent, Quake 3. However, it is worth considering. If at a personal level I consider DooM 3, I must also consider Unreal Tournament because my main objections (non-Open Source) hold for that game too, but it is new and it is very nice to develop with. One final caveat about DooM 3 is that, eventually, as with Quake 3, it is expected that it will be Open Sourced, so there is always that... Thanks to everyone who's made suggestions so far. We are a long way off seriously looking at this (end of summer at the earliest, as I want to tidy up AudioQuake and make development on it easier for the community first) so there is lots of scope for future discussion. This new game, whatever it is, will be for you, the community, and I want to ensure it gives you the tools to do what you like with it. best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Big News from the AGRIP Project
On Thu, 2006-07-06 at 13:58 +1200, shaun everiss wrote: > I would really like doom1 2 and maybe 3 developped. > I think there is source code on the ftp.idsoftware.com site somewhere. > Ideally I'd like duke nukem, the 3d addition, the last one for dos > that was devellopped or some of the newer additions. end-quote These are good suggestions, and we thought about them when starting with Quake. However, the engines are now very limited and not played much and we'd like to keep the AGRIP project reasonably current with the next game, whatever and whenever that may be. quote > If you still wanted to stay with quake quake2 and quake 3. end-quote Quake 3 is the next logical choice, as it is Open Source and popular (and will be for a while yet; QuakeWorld -- the game AudioQuake is based on -- still is!) I would like to use the Unreal Tournament engine but it's not Open Source and doesn't look like it's ever going to be. That's a shame, because it is a much better environment for developing extensible gamecode than the Quake engines. Cheers muchly for the input! best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Big News from the AGRIP Project
On Thu, 2006-07-06 at 11:10 +0100, Søren Jensen wrote: > It could be really cool, if you can make Doom 3 accessible. This game is > really the best 3D shooter I have seen. If you have a sighted friends there > likes 3D shooter games, you should try the game... end-quote Interesting suggestion; thanks. I am a little concerned about developing on a non Open Source engine because I may need access to it to actually make the accessibility work. I will have to look into this, however. Also, there would need to be a demo version of DooM 3 so that people could try the AGRIP game first. Unfortunately, my computer is not capable of running DooM 3. I guess that if I was to develop this, I would have to raise money to buy a new computer. Thanks for the input, best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Big News from the AGRIP Project
Ari, Thanks for the input. It may interest you to know that you can use the shareware (no cost, downloadable) version of Quake. It can be downloaded and installed by the AudioQuake installer for you as part of the setup process. It's not the whole thing, but it's pretty good nonetheless and will enable you to play all of the AGRIP levels. Hopefully this will negate the potential issues with using other means to get the game. best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
[Audyssey] Big News from the AGRIP Project
uld like to see it applicable to other accessible games too -- it's up to developers of those games to get in touch so we can work out how, closer to the time. I will of course be publicising this on the appropriate developers' lists when the time is right. !!! Improved Development Process There are lots of ways we are starting to improve the process; making more code available for you all, trying new means of supporting users and beginning to document cool stuff like auto-installing modifications and so on. If you feel there are any major omissions or mistakes being made, please let us know. Thanks in advance! !!! The End Once again, a huge thank you to all those that filled in the survey so far, as well as all those who are about to :-). It has helped tremendously to see exactly what we are doing right and wrong and where we should be going next. I'm pleased that I am now able to spend a little more time on the project and really do look forward to seeing these plans come to fruition. Thanks for reading this; I hope that it has allayed any concerns you may have had about what direction we're going in. I also hope it will generate some discussion about things you'd like to see improve and how, now that we seem to be at an appropriate point in the history of the project. I look forward to really getting my teeth into this at the start of August (in the mean time, I'll keep up with the discussion)... best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
[Audyssey] Please Help the AGRIP Project
I would really appreciate it if users of AudioQuake could take about 7-8 minutes of their time to tell us what they think of the project and it's goals as a whole. I have put a (small) set of multiple-choice questions on the web and would appreciate it if you could answer them at your earliest convenience -- your feedback really *will* make a difference to how the project is developed in future. However, we really need as many AudioQuake users as possible to voice their opinions (please don't fill this in if you've not used AudioQuake before). Please visit http://eval.agrip.org.uk/ for more information and to help us out (I've included the time it'll take to read that page in the 7-8 minutes quoted above). If you have any questions, please use the ``contact the author'' link provided on that site. I realise that I've been somewhat inactive lately, due to being very busy on the research side of things. However I am working on the announced project improvements as and when I can. It is great to see the AGRIP mailing lists so active and I am enjoying our continuing (if sometimes slow) work on the development side of things, the new stats infrastructure and other goals on our roadmap. Thanks again for your time, best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
[Audyssey] AGDev-newbies list is up!
'ello there! Just wanted to let you know that we are now happy with the list and it seems ready for members to sign up. Please visit http://lists.agdev.org/ and sign up to the AGDev-newbies list if you are one of those interested in beginning AG development :-). We look forward to reading you soon! best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] additional lists on audyssey
Done! Thanks for the input so far :-). I would appreciate it if those stepping up to be moderators sign up using this web page (but please do not sign up yet if you don't intend to be a moderator): http://lists.agdev.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/agdev-newbies Given the discussion so far, I am expecting Sean, Raul and Tom. Once you've signed up I'll e-mail you all the moderator password so that you can do your stuff (I will help when I can but spare time tends to be quite sparse at the moment). After that's done and things seem to be working OK, I will send one final e-mail to this list, on a new thread, to say the list is open and where people can sign up. Please, don't sign up yet unless you want to be a mod! If there are any problems, please mail me at my private address and I'll do my best to sort them out. best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] additional lists on audyssey
Regarding moderation of the new ``-newbies'' list... I have bounced Tom's recent mail to AGDev to see what people say about it. I would be happy for anyone here or there to moderate it -- I can easily give out list admin passwords so it's no big deal in that department. I will keep an eye on things when I can but my spare time tends to be sporadic at best so I can't guarantee I'd be suitable as a mod (and I don't know VB/.NET, lol). Anyway, I do think that there are issues I would be able to help with and would, when I have time, but if anyone would like to step up to be a mod on that last, then don't let hosting arrangements be a barrier to you -- I can easily give people the appropriate access if it were to be hosted at AGDev.org. best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] additional lists on audyssey
On Fri, 2006-04-28 at 21:10 -0400, Thomas Ward wrote: > Well, agdev seams to be the apropriate place since the site already has > some initial tootorials etc up there. > There is nothing saying we can not link audyssey to agdev and in a sense > run as one unit. Agdev handling all the developer end, and audyssey for > the end user end of games. end-quote I agree -- have there been any developments (oh dear) on this front since last I posted? If we could get an initial set of moderators together then I can set something up and we can discuss it more on that list when it has been created. bye just now, best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] additional lists on audyssey
On Fri, 2006-04-28 at 18:15 -0600, Raul A. Gallegos wrote: > I also am wondering however if perhaps we really should use the > established agdev network as Richard suggested. end-quote I would have no objection to setting up an extra list for newbies at agdev.org (no cost, uses Mailman). I am probing existing list members for their thoughts at the moment but this list, as it's for newbies, would be separate. We'd need someone to moderate it and some existing wise developers to populate it for the newbies to be assured of good advice (at least at the start). I'm only really experienced with Linux game development and the Quake-related game engines so I'm probably not much help in that department, as most people use Windows and VB/.NET. However, I think it would be appropriate to host the list at AGDev.org and would like to remind everyone that they can all read the wiki, if not write to it, and they are all welcome to mail in with suggestions for other topics and improvements to existing ones. I posted about this earlier but the discussion seems to have become very popular and it may have been lost in the sheer number of messages on this subject that have come through. best regards, P.S. I am in GMT and it's quite late here so I will not be back for at least 12 hours but I'll catch up ASAP later on today. -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Creating a game programming list?
On Fri, 2006-04-28 at 20:46 -0400, Thomas Ward wrote: > If you are willing to use the agdev server for another list that would > be great. We could have the current agdev list for us developers who are > experienced and have advanced questions etc, and a general list where > everyone can join in and get answers to newby questions. > However, we certainly need a forem for those who have not cut their > teeth on anything, and can't even get DirectSound, DirectInput, and > other APIs going. end-quote There's no technical reason I can think of why I would not be able to make a new list. We would need to ensure that the appropriate moderation was put in place and that enough wise people would be there to advise the newbies and that's more of a decision for the community to make, so please do volunteer and if we get enough interest then I'd be happy to go ahead and create a mailman list. You are all welcome to read the AGDev wiki, even if you're not a current member, by the way. You are also welcome to suggest and submit new content or updates and fixes to existing content. Assuming we set a list up, then once people on the newbies list feel it's appropriate they can move the developers list and get write access to the Wiki as per the current membership process. I am CC'ing this to AGDev-discuss as it is important to keep everyone in the loop and give them the chance to voice their opinions. best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
Re: [Audyssey] Creating a game programming list?
Further to Tom's suggestion of a newbie programming list, I have some thoughts At AGDev.org, we have mailing lists and a wiki (website that is easily editable by its members) that people use to describe their work and host tutorials on the topics they are experts in. Anyone can read this stuff but only members can write to it (though anyone is welcome to mail in with comments, suggestions and additions). Our community is made up of some of the most well-known AG developers and many other enthusiastic members. Our main list is not as high-traffic as this one, but posts tend to be either informative or questions that start interesting threads on a number of issues relating to AG development. I would like to encourage people that are genuinely interested in games development (i.e. working on a project now) to visit www.agdev.org and to consider signing up. If you have already released a game, you can sign up straight away. If not, then you can contact an existing member who will be happy to forward your reasons for wanting to sign up to the mailing list. Once this is done, if the other members have no objections, you can sign up. The reason we do things this way is so that only genuinely interested people sign up. This has, so far, prevented us from having flame-wars, keeps traffic to an acceptable and high-quality level and goes some way to ensuring that the community stays positive and focused. Seems to me that it would make sense for those genuinely motivated about and perhaps already partly involved in AG development to sign up to AGDev -- both our groups happily complement each other. With respect to people very new to game programming that need more general guidance, a newbie list sounds like a good idea. I wonder if we could set up such a list on AGDev.org and invite a few of the main members to help moderate and answer questions in the newbie list. A lot of us are under variable and sometimes excessive workloads, however. For this reason it might be nice to have moderators who are active community members here as well. Seeing as we run mailman, anyone can be assigned access/admin/moderator rights. Maybe we could even start a section for Newbies on the AGDev wiki -- if people are interested in this it could be interesting. I've still not had time to look into Richard of AudioGames' site -- what I have seen is impressive, but seems aimed at grabbing researchers' and mainstream games developers' attention -- but f it already does these things then all three of us (Audyseey, AGDev and G-A.com) should think about getting together and directing people who visit our sites to the most appropriate place for them. Just my thoughts, but I would like to see all the key sites in the AG area pulling in the same direction; it gives a much better impression to the ``outsiders'' we want to invite into our community. It should also mean that each of us keeps to our remit and we aren't all wasting effort trying to be all things to all people. Please let me know what you think :-). best regards, -- Matthew T. Atkinson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gamers mailing list .. Gamers@audyssey.org To unsubscribe send E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can visit http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org to make any subscription changes via the web.
