Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
Hi, Some further followup on this. On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 3:00 PM, Jukka Zitting jukka.zitt...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 1:46 PM, Jukka Zitting jukka.zitt...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 9:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: 2008-08-19 PhotArk S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. I contacted photark-dev@, asking for a status update or a decision to terminate. Luciano is helping the community. Led by Luciano, the PhotArk community is discussion a new direction. I'm looking forward to a summary in their February status report. 2008-11-06 Kato S: Zero activity. R: Terminate. The status of Kato (in relation to Oracle's actions) is being evaluated. Ant is helping the community. It seems like Kato now has a more or less definite statement of non-interest from Oracle, which leaves them discussing how to continue from here. Their next status report is due in March; looking forward to a summary then. 2008-11-19 Stonehenge S: Zero activity. R: Terminate. I contacted stonehenge-dev@, asking them to retire or come up with a plan to revive the project. No mentors visible (6 listed). As discussed, Stonehenge had already been voted to retire. I completed the process. 2009-07-06 VXQuery S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. I contacted vxquery-dev@, asking them to retire or come up with a plan to revive the project. No mentors visible (4 listed). There's some desire for further development, but apparently little energy or interest in community-building. The option of taking the codebase to an external hosting space came up. I suggested graduating into an XMLBeans subproject as an alternative, assuming the XMLBeans PMC is willing to help with the oversight. 2009-11-05 HISE S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. I contacted hise-dev@, asking them to retire or come up with a plan to revive the project. No mentors visible (3 listed). I started the hise-dev@ vote to retire the project based on feedback from the community. BR, Jukka Zitting - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
Jukka Zitting wrote on Mon, Jan 30, 2012 at 17:20:41 +0100: Their next status report is due in March; looking forward to a summary then. They're free to send an out-of-cycle report in February if they want to... /reminder - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
Hi... On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 1:46 PM, Jukka Zitting jukka.zitt...@gmail.comwrote: Hi, What's the status of this effort? I went through all the older-than-year podlings identified by Sam for a quick (i.e. incomplete) review of the project status. See below for my summary (S) and subjective recommendation (R) for each project. Please branch any followup discussion about specific podlings to separate threads. On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 9:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: 2007-09-17 JSPWiki S: Actively discussing leaving the Incubator (http://markmail.org/message/etgsawr7mtjggppt). R: Ask for an exit or graduation plan in next report (if not executed sooner). 2008-01-06 RAT S: Looking to graduate but stuck with (self-inflicted?) bureacracy. R: Push to graduate within Q1. 2008-05-20 Hama S: Active but not too diverse (?) community. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2008-07-08 Empire-db S: Graduating in January. R: Congratulations! 2008-08-19 PhotArk S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. 2008-09-02 Etch S: Too small to graduate yet (http://markmail.org/message/ihkdh4rfunwzkjs7). Martijn is helping them. R: More mentors needed? 2008-09-04 Tashi S: Commit activity by two committers but near-zero public discussion. No active mentors. R: Mentors needed. 2008-09-29 Olio S: Retired. R: RIP. 2008-10-06 VCL S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue? 2008-10-09 Droids S: Somewhat active, still not enough for a TLP. Last report mentions IP clearance issues? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2008-11-06 Kato S: Zero activity. R: Terminate. 2008-11-19 Stonehenge S: Zero activity. R: Terminate. 2009-04-24 Ace S: Graduated. R: Congratulations! 2009-05-27 Wink S: Pretty low but steady activity. Too small to graduate. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2009-07-06 VXQuery S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. 2009-07-17 Wookie S: Somewhat active, not enough for a TLP. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2009-11-05 HISE S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. 2009-11-27 Clerezza S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue? 2010-01-10 Manifold Connector Framework (ManifoldCF) S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue. 2010-02-21 SIS S: Last activity in November ( http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-sis-dev/20.mbox/browser ) R: Retire unless activity picks up in Q1. 2010-03-01 Bean Validation S: Just about to graduate. R: Congratulations! 2010-05-09 Amber S: Somewhat active, not enough for a TLP. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-05-19 Deltacloud S: Graduated. R: Congratulations! 2010-05-21 Zeta Components S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. Looking for a new mentor. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue. 2010-06-24 Nuvem S: Last activity in November ( http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-nuvem-dev/20.mbox/browser ) R: Retire unless activity picks up in Q1. 2010-07-14 Chukwa S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue? 2010-07-22 Lucy S: Active and apparently pretty diverse community. Why not already graduated? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-08-13 NPanday S: Active and apparently pretty diverse community. Why not already graduated? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-09-07 Isis S: Active and apparently pretty diverse community. Why not already graduated? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. Thats all true, the only problem we have is that we didn't get any new committers yet. 2010-09-26 Gora S: Graduating in January. R: Congratulations! 2010-10-03 Kitty S: Last activity in November ( http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-kitty-dev/20.mbox/browser ) R: Retire unless activity picks up in Q1. 2010-11-02 Celix S: Somewhat active, not enough for a TLP. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-11-15 Stanbol S: Fairly active and apparently diverse community. No release yet. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. BR, Jukka Zitting - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
Hi, Following up on projects where my recommendation was an unconditional Terminate. On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 1:46 PM, Jukka Zitting jukka.zitt...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 9:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: 2008-08-19 PhotArk S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. I contacted photark-dev@, asking for a status update or a decision to terminate. Luciano is helping the community. 2008-11-06 Kato S: Zero activity. R: Terminate. The status of Kato (in relation to Oracle's actions) is being evaluated. Ant is helping the community. 2008-11-19 Stonehenge S: Zero activity. R: Terminate. I contacted stonehenge-dev@, asking them to retire or come up with a plan to revive the project. No mentors visible (6 listed). 2009-07-06 VXQuery S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. I contacted vxquery-dev@, asking them to retire or come up with a plan to revive the project. No mentors visible (4 listed). 2009-11-05 HISE S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. I contacted hise-dev@, asking them to retire or come up with a plan to revive the project. No mentors visible (3 listed). BR, Jukka Zitting - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Thursday, January 12, 2012 3:00:41 PM Jukka Zitting wrote: The status of Kato (in relation to Oracle's actions) is being evaluated. Ant is helping the community. 2008-11-19 Stonehenge S: Zero activity. R: Terminate. I contacted stonehenge-dev@, asking them to retire or come up with a plan to revive the project. No mentors visible (6 listed). We already had the vote to retire it: http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-general/201106.mbox/%3C1479384.AD1QayfXJR%40dilbert.dankulp.com%3E I've just been to busy to finish up the steps and the other mentors have pretty much disappeared. Any help would be appreciated. -- Daniel Kulp dk...@apache.org - http://dankulp.com/blog Talend Community Coder - http://coders.talend.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
Hi, On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 3:20 PM, Daniel Kulp dk...@apache.org wrote: On Thursday, January 12, 2012 3:00:41 PM Jukka Zitting wrote: I contacted stonehenge-dev@, asking them to retire or come up with a plan to revive the project. No mentors visible (6 listed). We already had the vote to retire it: http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-general/201106.mbox/%3C1479384.AD1QayfXJR%40dilbert.dankulp.com%3E Thanks! I missed that. I've just been to busy to finish up the steps and the other mentors have pretty much disappeared. Any help would be appreciated. No worries. I'll take care of it. BR, Jukka Zitting - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
Just an FYI: I have posted a status update on Etch on general@, hoping it doesn't fall on deaf ears with all the discussions going on: http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-general/201201.mbox/%3ccab63y-dsjkbkeljkhuvkbdlmsjwvfvixo0fnxexofhq1v4m...@mail.gmail.com%3e Martijn On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 1:46 PM, Jukka Zitting jukka.zitt...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, What's the status of this effort? I went through all the older-than-year podlings identified by Sam for a quick (i.e. incomplete) review of the project status. See below for my summary (S) and subjective recommendation (R) for each project. Please branch any followup discussion about specific podlings to separate threads. On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 9:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: 2007-09-17 JSPWiki S: Actively discussing leaving the Incubator (http://markmail.org/message/etgsawr7mtjggppt). R: Ask for an exit or graduation plan in next report (if not executed sooner). 2008-01-06 RAT S: Looking to graduate but stuck with (self-inflicted?) bureacracy. R: Push to graduate within Q1. 2008-05-20 Hama S: Active but not too diverse (?) community. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2008-07-08 Empire-db S: Graduating in January. R: Congratulations! 2008-08-19 PhotArk S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. 2008-09-02 Etch S: Too small to graduate yet (http://markmail.org/message/ihkdh4rfunwzkjs7). Martijn is helping them. R: More mentors needed? 2008-09-04 Tashi S: Commit activity by two committers but near-zero public discussion. No active mentors. R: Mentors needed. 2008-09-29 Olio S: Retired. R: RIP. 2008-10-06 VCL S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue? 2008-10-09 Droids S: Somewhat active, still not enough for a TLP. Last report mentions IP clearance issues? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2008-11-06 Kato S: Zero activity. R: Terminate. 2008-11-19 Stonehenge S: Zero activity. R: Terminate. 2009-04-24 Ace S: Graduated. R: Congratulations! 2009-05-27 Wink S: Pretty low but steady activity. Too small to graduate. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2009-07-06 VXQuery S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. 2009-07-17 Wookie S: Somewhat active, not enough for a TLP. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2009-11-05 HISE S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. 2009-11-27 Clerezza S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue? 2010-01-10 Manifold Connector Framework (ManifoldCF) S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue. 2010-02-21 SIS S: Last activity in November (http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-sis-dev/20.mbox/browser) R: Retire unless activity picks up in Q1. 2010-03-01 Bean Validation S: Just about to graduate. R: Congratulations! 2010-05-09 Amber S: Somewhat active, not enough for a TLP. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-05-19 Deltacloud S: Graduated. R: Congratulations! 2010-05-21 Zeta Components S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. Looking for a new mentor. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue. 2010-06-24 Nuvem S: Last activity in November (http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-nuvem-dev/20.mbox/browser) R: Retire unless activity picks up in Q1. 2010-07-14 Chukwa S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue? 2010-07-22 Lucy S: Active and apparently pretty diverse community. Why not already graduated? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-08-13 NPanday S: Active and apparently pretty diverse community. Why not already graduated? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-09-07 Isis S: Active and apparently pretty diverse community. Why not already graduated? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-09-26 Gora S: Graduating in January. R: Congratulations! 2010-10-03 Kitty S: Last activity in November (http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-kitty-dev/20.mbox/browser) R: Retire unless activity picks up in Q1. 2010-11-02 Celix S: Somewhat active, not enough for a TLP. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-11-15 Stanbol S: Fairly active and apparently diverse community. No release yet. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. BR, Jukka Zitting - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- Become a Wicket expert, learn from the best: http://wicketinaction.com
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
Since this thread has come back to life, I read through it and have one comment to add: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 20:27, Benson Margulies bimargul...@gmail.com wrote: ... I can see two problems with this view to begin with. One is IP management. The more people participate in a project and the longer they do so, the messier it becomes to track provenance and get ICLAs from all of the contributors. One almost wishes that the ASF could accept ICLAs and code grants for code that is in fact living somewhere else. I'm sure someone will tell me why that idea is nuts. Actually, the ASF doesn't vette *why* an ICLA is being filed. It simply takes it and records it. The serf project[*] requires all committers to sign an ICLA with the ASF before receiving access. This way, should we ever want to move the project to the ASF, we have all commits already covered under an ICLA. While the project would still hit the Incubator, its IP clearance would be done on Day One. Cheers, -g [*] http://code.google.com/p/serf/ ... serf/ASF history at http://s.apache.org/jz - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
Hi, What's the status of this effort? I went through all the older-than-year podlings identified by Sam for a quick (i.e. incomplete) review of the project status. See below for my summary (S) and subjective recommendation (R) for each project. Please branch any followup discussion about specific podlings to separate threads. On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 9:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: 2007-09-17 JSPWiki S: Actively discussing leaving the Incubator (http://markmail.org/message/etgsawr7mtjggppt). R: Ask for an exit or graduation plan in next report (if not executed sooner). 2008-01-06 RAT S: Looking to graduate but stuck with (self-inflicted?) bureacracy. R: Push to graduate within Q1. 2008-05-20 Hama S: Active but not too diverse (?) community. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2008-07-08 Empire-db S: Graduating in January. R: Congratulations! 2008-08-19 PhotArk S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. 2008-09-02 Etch S: Too small to graduate yet (http://markmail.org/message/ihkdh4rfunwzkjs7). Martijn is helping them. R: More mentors needed? 2008-09-04 Tashi S: Commit activity by two committers but near-zero public discussion. No active mentors. R: Mentors needed. 2008-09-29 Olio S: Retired. R: RIP. 2008-10-06 VCL S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue? 2008-10-09 Droids S: Somewhat active, still not enough for a TLP. Last report mentions IP clearance issues? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2008-11-06 Kato S: Zero activity. R: Terminate. 2008-11-19 Stonehenge S: Zero activity. R: Terminate. 2009-04-24 Ace S: Graduated. R: Congratulations! 2009-05-27 Wink S: Pretty low but steady activity. Too small to graduate. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2009-07-06 VXQuery S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. 2009-07-17 Wookie S: Somewhat active, not enough for a TLP. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2009-11-05 HISE S: Zero recent activity. R: Terminate. 2009-11-27 Clerezza S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue? 2010-01-10 Manifold Connector Framework (ManifoldCF) S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue. 2010-02-21 SIS S: Last activity in November (http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-sis-dev/20.mbox/browser) R: Retire unless activity picks up in Q1. 2010-03-01 Bean Validation S: Just about to graduate. R: Congratulations! 2010-05-09 Amber S: Somewhat active, not enough for a TLP. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-05-19 Deltacloud S: Graduated. R: Congratulations! 2010-05-21 Zeta Components S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. Looking for a new mentor. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue. 2010-06-24 Nuvem S: Last activity in November (http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-nuvem-dev/20.mbox/browser) R: Retire unless activity picks up in Q1. 2010-07-14 Chukwa S: Fairly active but not diverse enough community. R: More mentor help needed for the community solve the diversity issue? 2010-07-22 Lucy S: Active and apparently pretty diverse community. Why not already graduated? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-08-13 NPanday S: Active and apparently pretty diverse community. Why not already graduated? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-09-07 Isis S: Active and apparently pretty diverse community. Why not already graduated? R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-09-26 Gora S: Graduating in January. R: Congratulations! 2010-10-03 Kitty S: Last activity in November (http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-kitty-dev/20.mbox/browser) R: Retire unless activity picks up in Q1. 2010-11-02 Celix S: Somewhat active, not enough for a TLP. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. 2010-11-15 Stanbol S: Fairly active and apparently diverse community. No release yet. R: Ask for a graduation plan in next report. BR, Jukka Zitting - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 12:46 PM, Jukka Zitting jukka.zitt...@gmail.com wrote: snip 2008-01-06 RAT S: Looking to graduate but stuck with (self-inflicted?) bureacracy. R: Push to graduate within Q1. Rat is stalled on trademarks Robert - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
Hey Jukka, On Jan 8, 2012, at 4:46 AM, Jukka Zitting wrote: 2010-02-21 SIS S: Last activity in November (http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-sis-dev/20.mbox/browser) R: Retire unless activity picks up in Q1. As a SIS mentor I'd say this is fair, but my personal gut tells me it would be nice to give SIS until end of Q2/Q3. Also I'll echo my call again for contributors (mentors, geospatial enthusiasts, others) and for folks that are interested in having an ALv2 licensed geospatial toolkit to come on over to sis-dev@ or sis-user@ and contribute. Cheers, Chris ++ Chris Mattmann, Ph.D. Senior Computer Scientist NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246 Email: chris.a.mattm...@nasa.gov WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/ ++ Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA ++ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Sun, Jan 8, 2012 at 7:46 AM, Jukka Zitting jukka.zitt...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I went through all the older-than-year podlings identified by Sam for a quick (i.e. incomplete) review of the project status. See below for my summary (S) and subjective recommendation (R) for each project. Excellent work! This is the type of information I would love to see in board reports from the Incubator. For reference, here are the published incubator reports, minus the podling reports: https://whimsy.apache.org/board/minutes/Incubator.html Here are the podling reports for all of the podlings that have yet to (or never managed to) graduate: https://whimsy.apache.org/board/minutes/#podling Here is an up-to-the-minute update on podlings by age (complete with a graph): https://whimsy.apache.org/incubator/podlings/by-age - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 3:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: Looking at the current list of projects, we have many that exceed that number. Far exceed that number. In fact the median age is 416 days and the mean age is 536. Thanks to Gavin installing the necessary prerequisites on people.apache.org, a richer (and live) presentation of this data can be found here: http://people.apache.org/~rubys/incubator-by-age - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Sun, Nov 20, 2011 at 1:47 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 3:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: Looking at the current list of projects, we have many that exceed that number. Far exceed that number. In fact the median age is 416 days and the mean age is 536. Thanks to Gavin installing the necessary prerequisites on people.apache.org, a richer (and live) presentation of this data can be found here: http://people.apache.org/~rubys/incubator-by-age I think there are more tools like this around... i think it makes sense to somehow link them on the incubator website if possible. Right? - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- http://www.grobmeier.de https://www.timeandbill.de - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Fri, Nov 18, 2011 at 8:23 AM, Henri Yandell flame...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 12:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 11:41 PM, Noel J. Bergman n...@devtech.com wrote: We are, however, recognizing that we've had growth issues of our own. As David Crossley pointed out, he made mistakes last month related to the Reporting Schedule, and we continue to have issues. The Incubator is almost as big as the rest of the ASF combined. David posted a plot chart reflecting our growth: http://incubator.apache.org/history/ Excellent plot chart. As with most plot charts, the end result is a Rorschach test. I'll tell you what I (personally) see in this chart: a failure to perform garbage collection. My personal perspective is that incubation shouldn't generally take more than a year. That doesn't mean that there won't be exceptions, and in a few rare cases, some that go well beyond that arbitrary time limit, but the point is that those should be the exception rather than the rule. Now that time is freeing up a tiny bit, I need to document a thread from August that would put pressure on projects who haven't done their IP handling. I'm less worried about a podling who haven't graduated after 12 months and more worried about a podling who haven't managed to get their CLAs right within 3 months. We still have far too many podlings who haven't signed off on that (first) part of their incubation. So +1 in sentiment, but a different focus. +1 on the same point Hen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Sun, Nov 20, 2011 at 3:01 PM, Christian Grobmeier grobme...@gmail.comwrote: On Sun, Nov 20, 2011 at 1:47 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 3:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: Looking at the current list of projects, we have many that exceed that number. Far exceed that number. In fact the median age is 416 days and the mean age is 536. Thanks to Gavin installing the necessary prerequisites on people.apache.org, a richer (and live) presentation of this data can be found here: http://people.apache.org/~rubys/incubator-by-age I think there are more tools like this around... i think it makes sense to somehow link them on the incubator website if possible. Right? IDK, should such information be public to that level, or only discussed on the level of the IPMC ? - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- http://www.grobmeier.de https://www.timeandbill.de - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Sun, Nov 20, 2011 at 2:17 PM, Mohammad Nour El-Din nour.moham...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Nov 20, 2011 at 3:01 PM, Christian Grobmeier grobme...@gmail.comwrote: http://people.apache.org/~rubys/incubator-by-age I think there are more tools like this around... i think it makes sense to somehow link them on the incubator website if possible. Right? IDK, should such information be public to that level, or only discussed on the level of the IPMC ? Well, Sams script is already public. In addition - what data show there is so sensitive we can't make it public? - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- http://www.grobmeier.de https://www.timeandbill.de - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein -- http://www.grobmeier.de https://www.timeandbill.de - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 12:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 11:41 PM, Noel J. Bergman n...@devtech.com wrote: We are, however, recognizing that we've had growth issues of our own. As David Crossley pointed out, he made mistakes last month related to the Reporting Schedule, and we continue to have issues. The Incubator is almost as big as the rest of the ASF combined. David posted a plot chart reflecting our growth: http://incubator.apache.org/history/ Excellent plot chart. As with most plot charts, the end result is a Rorschach test. I'll tell you what I (personally) see in this chart: a failure to perform garbage collection. My personal perspective is that incubation shouldn't generally take more than a year. That doesn't mean that there won't be exceptions, and in a few rare cases, some that go well beyond that arbitrary time limit, but the point is that those should be the exception rather than the rule. Looking at the current list of projects, we have many that exceed that number. Far exceed that number. In fact the median age is 416 days and the mean age is 536. People here may disagree with my arbitrary date, and that's OK. But my feeling is that there needs to be an expectation that a podling produces AT THE VERY MINIMUM a credible plan that they are executing on which will lead to graduation at some point. If they fail to produce such a plan, or fail to execute on that plan (within reason), they should be asked to explain themselves. If they fail to do so, the incubation at the ASF should cease. At the moment, the expectation is that the mentors be the ones to take up this task. For whatever reason, that isn't reliably being done. This causes the board to complain periodically. I am of the belief that the first level of culling needs to be performed at the Incubator level. If we need to appoint a set of grim reapers, lets do so, and I will volunteer to be a part of such an effort. Meanwhile, I will personally focus on JSPWiki. If others wish to join me, here is a a current list of projects that have been incubating more than a year: 2007-09-17 JSPWiki 2008-01-06 RAT 2008-05-20 Hama 2008-07-08 Empire-db 2008-08-19 PhotArk 2008-09-02 Etch 2008-09-04 Tashi 2008-09-29 Olio 2008-10-06 VCL 2008-10-09 Droids 2008-11-06 Kato 2008-11-19 Stonehenge 2009-04-24 Ace 2009-05-27 Wink 2009-07-06 VXQuery 2009-07-17 Wookie 2009-11-05 HISE 2009-11-27 Clerezza 2010-01-10 Manifold Connector Framework (ManifoldCF) 2010-02-21 SIS 2010-03-01 Bean Validation 2010-05-09 Amber 2010-05-19 Deltacloud 2010-05-21 Zeta Components 2010-06-24 Nuvem 2010-07-14 Chukwa 2010-07-22 Lucy 2010-08-13 NPanday 2010-09-07 Isis 2010-09-26 Gora 2010-10-03 Kitty 2010-11-02 Celix 2010-11-15 Stanbol - Sam Ruby Maybe I've had been using a high bar with the podlings I mentor/participate. I'll look into graduating couple podlings after I come back from Thanks Giving : Apache PhotArk, Apache Wink. -- Luciano Resende http://people.apache.org/~lresende http://twitter.com/lresende1975 http://lresende.blogspot.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Sun, Nov 20, 2011 at 8:11 AM, Luciano Resende luckbr1...@gmail.com wrote: Maybe I've had been using a high bar with the podlings I mentor/participate. I'll look into graduating couple podlings after I come back from Thanks Giving : Apache PhotArk, Apache Wink. First things first - can you get Wink's copyright status sorted out? It's not signed off on the status page yet to say that we have the rights to host the code. This had better just be a case of no one having updated the right page given that Wink appears to have been making releases. Hen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On 16/11/2011, at 12:36 PM, Sam Ruby wrote: My personal perspective is that incubation shouldn't generally take more than a year. That doesn't mean that there won't be exceptions, and in a few rare cases, some that go well beyond that arbitrary time limit, but the point is that those should be the exception rather than the rule. I agree with that period of time, but would avoid throwing that number around too much as they tend to become unwritten rules. A much better criteria is the other you've mentioned... But my feeling is that there needs to be an expectation that a podling produces AT THE VERY MINIMUM a credible plan that they are executing on which will lead to graduation at some point. If they fail to produce such a plan, or fail to execute on that plan (within reason), they should be asked to explain themselves. If they fail to do so, the incubation at the ASF should cease. For those interested, this was the topic of my talk at ApacheCon this year: http://lanyrd.com/2011/apachecon-north-america/skdqx/ We ask for these in each podling report, but the top 3 things tend to not have enough detail (actions to take), or list the wrong types of things without reasoning. I think we should be asking podlings to have a more complete graduation plan by their 3rd month - even if it has gaps they know they need to fill, or places it may change in future. Cheers, Brett -- Brett Porter br...@apache.org http://brettporter.wordpress.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Nov 20, 2011, at 2:14 PM, Henri Yandell wrote: On Sun, Nov 20, 2011 at 8:11 AM, Luciano Resende luckbr1...@gmail.com wrote: Maybe I've had been using a high bar with the podlings I mentor/participate. I'll look into graduating couple podlings after I come back from Thanks Giving : Apache PhotArk, Apache Wink. First things first - can you get Wink's copyright status sorted out? It's not signed off on the status page yet to say that we have the rights to host the code. This had better just be a case of no one having updated the right page given that Wink appears to have been making releases. Yes, it is… There were initial donations from both IBM and HP. The HP donation was chosen as the initial Wink implementation. I'll verify the grants (though I recall checking them during the initial contribution) and update the status. --kevan - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Fri, Nov 18, 2011 at 9:09 AM, Robert Burrell Donkin robertburrelldon...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Nov 18, 2011 at 6:23 AM, Henri Yandell flame...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 12:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 11:41 PM, Noel J. Bergman n...@devtech.com wrote: We are, however, recognizing that we've had growth issues of our own. As David Crossley pointed out, he made mistakes last month related to the Reporting Schedule, and we continue to have issues. The Incubator is almost as big as the rest of the ASF combined. David posted a plot chart reflecting our growth: http://incubator.apache.org/history/ Excellent plot chart. As with most plot charts, the end result is a Rorschach test. I'll tell you what I (personally) see in this chart: a failure to perform garbage collection. My personal perspective is that incubation shouldn't generally take more than a year. That doesn't mean that there won't be exceptions, and in a few rare cases, some that go well beyond that arbitrary time limit, but the point is that those should be the exception rather than the rule. Sometimes when you turn up the heat and reduce the cooking time, the pies end up being half baked... I agree with that and also with Benson's comments about size and growth often being one of the barriers to graduation. A number of the long term poddlings don't have a very diverse or even three active committers, if theres a threat of expulsion because of that they'll probably just start making any old person a committer just to make up the numbers. ...ant - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Fri, Nov 18, 2011 at 6:23 AM, Henri Yandell flame...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 12:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 11:41 PM, Noel J. Bergman n...@devtech.com wrote: We are, however, recognizing that we've had growth issues of our own. As David Crossley pointed out, he made mistakes last month related to the Reporting Schedule, and we continue to have issues. The Incubator is almost as big as the rest of the ASF combined. David posted a plot chart reflecting our growth: http://incubator.apache.org/history/ Excellent plot chart. As with most plot charts, the end result is a Rorschach test. I'll tell you what I (personally) see in this chart: a failure to perform garbage collection. My personal perspective is that incubation shouldn't generally take more than a year. That doesn't mean that there won't be exceptions, and in a few rare cases, some that go well beyond that arbitrary time limit, but the point is that those should be the exception rather than the rule. Sometimes when you turn up the heat and reduce the cooking time, the pies end up being half baked... I think that it should be possible to reduce mean graduation time for main sequence podlings by tuning the process but worry about moving away from graduation by acclamation and consensus towards a contested system. I think this will happen if we just reduce time and increase the pressure. Now that time is freeing up a tiny bit, I need to document a thread from August that would put pressure on projects who haven't done their IP handling. I'm less worried about a podling who haven't graduated after 12 months and more worried about a podling who haven't managed to get their CLAs right within 3 months. We still have far too many podlings who haven't signed off on that (first) part of their incubation. +1 Defining a more linear process for main sequence podlings would probably make sense and focus efforts towards graduation priorities Robert - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 8:27 PM, Benson Margulies bimargul...@gmail.com wrote: I can see two problems with this view to begin with. One is IP management. The more people participate in a project and the longer they do so, the messier it becomes to track provenance and get ICLAs from all of the contributors. One almost wishes that the ASF could accept ICLAs and code grants for code that is in fact living somewhere else. I'm sure someone will tell me why that idea is nuts. Well, if the code is living somewhere else, that means the code in ASF would be taking up space for possibly no good reason, as people might more habitually go to where the code is living. On the other hand, the ASF could theoretically act as a last line of defense against system failure, community dissolution, sociopolitically-motivated bogus forking, etc., in that if all else fails people can go to Apache to get a stable release of something. I'm sorry...was that a rhetorical question? Don - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 1:40 AM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 8:17 PM, Mohammad Nour El-Din nour.moham...@gmail.com wrote: Hi... The idea sounds good in general more specifically that should be clear and documented on the incubator site for future incubating projects. But, IMHO, we should categorize projects mentioned in that list from very old to recent ones and each group of mentors get in touch with their mentored projects and get with some feedback about such plan, so we can be more fair and give people a chance either to do some progress, more specifically for recent incubated projects and even for the older projects to revive if that is possible. Thoughts ? Nobody is proposing immediate expulsion of any PPMC based solely on a metric. On the other hand, it should not be a surprise to mentors that they are responsible for[1] assessment of the Podling status with respect to continuation/exit strategy. Reports for PPMCs that are older than a year should be expected to contain this information. Repeated failure to include such information and/or demonstrate forward progress towards meeting these objectives should cause the Incubator (not the Board!) to take action. I think this is more about pushing ourselves, and less about pushing podlings The Incubator now has a process which works okay for many podlings. The challenge now is to focus more effort on those cases where the process isn't working. Metrics are useful in discovering and highlighting sub-populations. Robert - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Wed, 16 Nov 2011, Sam Ruby wrote: Meanwhile, I will personally focus on JSPWiki. If others wish to join me, here is a a current list of projects that have been incubating more than a year: I've been meaning to try to help out with JSPWiki for a while, but I've not yet had the time. If there's going to be more than one of us though, then hopefully the work involved will be something I can commit to Currently the JSPWiki mentors are listed as: * snoopdave - Dave Johnson * clr - Craig Russell * henning - Henning Schmiedehausen * rubys - Sam Ruby Are any of the others currently active and able to help? (My hunch from having spoken to a few jspwiki community members is that we need to have another go at helping them understand the apache way, then give a deadline, but I've not looked in detail to be sure) Nick - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 12:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 11:41 PM, Noel J. Bergman n...@devtech.com wrote: We are, however, recognizing that we've had growth issues of our own. As David Crossley pointed out, he made mistakes last month related to the Reporting Schedule, and we continue to have issues. The Incubator is almost as big as the rest of the ASF combined. David posted a plot chart reflecting our growth: http://incubator.apache.org/history/ Excellent plot chart. As with most plot charts, the end result is a Rorschach test. I'll tell you what I (personally) see in this chart: a failure to perform garbage collection. My personal perspective is that incubation shouldn't generally take more than a year. That doesn't mean that there won't be exceptions, and in a few rare cases, some that go well beyond that arbitrary time limit, but the point is that those should be the exception rather than the rule. Now that time is freeing up a tiny bit, I need to document a thread from August that would put pressure on projects who haven't done their IP handling. I'm less worried about a podling who haven't graduated after 12 months and more worried about a podling who haven't managed to get their CLAs right within 3 months. We still have far too many podlings who haven't signed off on that (first) part of their incubation. So +1 in sentiment, but a different focus. Hen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 11:41 PM, Noel J. Bergman n...@devtech.com wrote: We are, however, recognizing that we've had growth issues of our own. As David Crossley pointed out, he made mistakes last month related to the Reporting Schedule, and we continue to have issues. The Incubator is almost as big as the rest of the ASF combined. David posted a plot chart reflecting our growth: http://incubator.apache.org/history/ Excellent plot chart. As with most plot charts, the end result is a Rorschach test. I'll tell you what I (personally) see in this chart: a failure to perform garbage collection. My personal perspective is that incubation shouldn't generally take more than a year. That doesn't mean that there won't be exceptions, and in a few rare cases, some that go well beyond that arbitrary time limit, but the point is that those should be the exception rather than the rule. Looking at the current list of projects, we have many that exceed that number. Far exceed that number. In fact the median age is 416 days and the mean age is 536. People here may disagree with my arbitrary date, and that's OK. But my feeling is that there needs to be an expectation that a podling produces AT THE VERY MINIMUM a credible plan that they are executing on which will lead to graduation at some point. If they fail to produce such a plan, or fail to execute on that plan (within reason), they should be asked to explain themselves. If they fail to do so, the incubation at the ASF should cease. At the moment, the expectation is that the mentors be the ones to take up this task. For whatever reason, that isn't reliably being done. This causes the board to complain periodically. I am of the belief that the first level of culling needs to be performed at the Incubator level. If we need to appoint a set of grim reapers, lets do so, and I will volunteer to be a part of such an effort. Meanwhile, I will personally focus on JSPWiki. If others wish to join me, here is a a current list of projects that have been incubating more than a year: 2007-09-17 JSPWiki 2008-01-06 RAT 2008-05-20 Hama 2008-07-08 Empire-db 2008-08-19 PhotArk 2008-09-02 Etch 2008-09-04 Tashi 2008-09-29 Olio 2008-10-06 VCL 2008-10-09 Droids 2008-11-06 Kato 2008-11-19 Stonehenge 2009-04-24 Ace 2009-05-27 Wink 2009-07-06 VXQuery 2009-07-17 Wookie 2009-11-05 HISE 2009-11-27 Clerezza 2010-01-10 Manifold Connector Framework (ManifoldCF) 2010-02-21 SIS 2010-03-01 Bean Validation 2010-05-09 Amber 2010-05-19 Deltacloud 2010-05-21 Zeta Components 2010-06-24 Nuvem 2010-07-14 Chukwa 2010-07-22 Lucy 2010-08-13 NPanday 2010-09-07 Isis 2010-09-26 Gora 2010-10-03 Kitty 2010-11-02 Celix 2010-11-15 Stanbol - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 9:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 11:41 PM, Noel J. Bergman n...@devtech.com wrote: Excellent plot chart. As with most plot charts, the end result is a Rorschach test. I'll tell you what I (personally) see in this chart: a failure to perform garbage collection. My personal perspective is that incubation shouldn't generally take more than a year. That doesn't mean that there won't be exceptions, and in a few rare cases, some that go well beyond that arbitrary time limit, but the point is that those should be the exception rather than the rule. Looking at the current list of projects, we have many that exceed that number. Far exceed that number. In fact the median age is 416 days and the mean age is 536. People here may disagree with my arbitrary date, and that's OK. But my feeling is that there needs to be an expectation that a podling produces AT THE VERY MINIMUM a credible plan that they are executing on which will lead to graduation at some point. If they fail to produce such a plan, or fail to execute on that plan (within reason), they should be asked to explain themselves. If they fail to do so, the incubation at the ASF should cease. +1 At the moment, the expectation is that the mentors be the ones to take up this task. For whatever reason, that isn't reliably being done. This causes the board to complain periodically. I am of the belief that the first level of culling needs to be performed at the Incubator level. If we need to appoint a set of grim reapers, lets do so, and I will volunteer to be a part of such an effort. +1 I observe several podlings and sometimes I have the feeling that Mentors are not very active. In addition I welcome such a grim reaper committee. I would suggest a semi automatic process for projects who fail to report (as suggested today). One of the mentors should explain why the report has failed. Meanwhile, I will personally focus on JSPWiki. If others wish to join me, here is a a current list of projects that have been incubating more than a year: On the report is Stonehenge mentioned for garbage collection. I spoke to Zeta people today, I still get responses there. Discussion is, how things can be improved. I would leave them there and let's hope, situation is fixed soon. Deltacloud has graduated and can be put off from your list. Rat is discussing graduation and should be moved from the list too. On the other projects I can't tell much. Therefore I am for +1 to start retiring discussion on JSPWiki and Stonehenge Cheers 2007-09-17 JSPWiki 2008-01-06 RAT 2008-05-20 Hama 2008-07-08 Empire-db 2008-08-19 PhotArk 2008-09-02 Etch 2008-09-04 Tashi 2008-09-29 Olio 2008-10-06 VCL 2008-10-09 Droids 2008-11-06 Kato 2008-11-19 Stonehenge 2009-04-24 Ace 2009-05-27 Wink 2009-07-06 VXQuery 2009-07-17 Wookie 2009-11-05 HISE 2009-11-27 Clerezza 2010-01-10 Manifold Connector Framework (ManifoldCF) 2010-02-21 SIS 2010-03-01 Bean Validation 2010-05-09 Amber 2010-05-19 Deltacloud 2010-05-21 Zeta Components 2010-06-24 Nuvem 2010-07-14 Chukwa 2010-07-22 Lucy 2010-08-13 NPanday 2010-09-07 Isis 2010-09-26 Gora 2010-10-03 Kitty 2010-11-02 Celix 2010-11-15 Stanbol - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- http://www.grobmeier.de - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Wednesday, November 16, 2011 9:48:02 PM Christian Grobmeier wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 9:36 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: Meanwhile, I will personally focus on JSPWiki. If others wish to join me, here is a a current list of projects that have been incubating more than a year: On the report is Stonehenge mentioned for garbage collection. I spoke to Zeta people today, I still get responses there. Discussion is, how things can be improved. I would leave them there and let's hope, situation is fixed soon. Deltacloud has graduated and can be put off from your list. Rat is discussing graduation and should be moved from the list too. On the other projects I can't tell much. Therefore I am for +1 to start retiring discussion on JSPWiki and Stonehenge We've already voted to retire Stonehenge. The mentors have been too busy with other things to finish the final cleanup. As one of the mentors, I'll take the blame for that. :-( -- Daniel Kulp dk...@apache.org http://dankulp.com/blog Talend - http://www.talend.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Christian Grobmeier grobme...@gmail.com wrote: Deltacloud has graduated and can be put off from your list. Rat is discussing graduation and should be moved from the list too. The master list from which I drew the data can be found here: http://incubator.apache.org/projects/ The script I used is attached to this message - Sam Ruby incubator.rb Description: application/ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 9:57 PM, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Christian Grobmeier grobme...@gmail.com wrote: Deltacloud has graduated and can be put off from your list. Rat is discussing graduation and should be moved from the list too. The master list from which I drew the data can be found here: http://incubator.apache.org/projects/ The script I used is attached to this message The script is fine. Deltacloud has not started graduation yet (just the vote is done). And I follow the rat-dev list, therefore I can say there is efford in graduation direction Cheers - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- http://www.grobmeier.de - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On 16 November 2011 20:57, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Christian Grobmeier grobme...@gmail.com wrote: Deltacloud has graduated and can be put off from your list. Rat is discussing graduation and should be moved from the list too. The master list from which I drew the data can be found here: http://incubator.apache.org/projects/ By the way, that page is now generated from an XML file which may be easier to parse: http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml with DTD http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.dtd The original versions are also in SVN at : https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/site-author The script I used is attached to this message - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
I have been working to get Empire-DB to graduate, and I expect to have a vote in front of general@ quite soon. On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 5:17 PM, sebb seb...@gmail.com wrote: On 16 November 2011 20:57, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Christian Grobmeier grobme...@gmail.com wrote: Deltacloud has graduated and can be put off from your list. Rat is discussing graduation and should be moved from the list too. The master list from which I drew the data can be found here: http://incubator.apache.org/projects/ By the way, that page is now generated from an XML file which may be easier to parse: http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml with DTD http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.dtd The original versions are also in SVN at : https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/site-author The script I used is attached to this message - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
Sam Ruby wrote: Noel J. Bergman wrote: We are, however, recognizing that we've had growth issues of our own. As David Crossley pointed out, he made mistakes last month related to the Reporting Schedule, and we continue to have issues. The Incubator is almost as big as the rest of the ASF combined. David posted a plot chart reflecting our growth: http://incubator.apache.org/history/ Excellent plot chart. As with most plot charts, the end result is a Rorschach test. I'll tell you what I (personally) see in this chart: a failure to perform garbage collection. That is one of the main reasons that i made it. As i said in its recent announcement, this is not sustainable to have 60 projects in the incubator at once. Clutch has also been attempting to show where more attention is needed: http://incubator.apache.org/clutch.html Look for anything coloured vermilion-red (as explained there). Especially these columns: B: elapsedDays H: statusAge Some time ago we tried a process whereby the whole Incubator would help to get projects who were stuck to get over their hurdles. http://s.apache.org/graduation-appeal [appeal] Help Us Graduate! I still think that the idea should be useful, but we obviously need the graduation-plan-or-retire approach too. -David - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 12:20 AM, Benson Margulies bimargul...@gmail.comwrote: I have been working to get Empire-DB to graduate, and I expect to have a vote in front of general@ quite soon. Same with Bean Validation the vote on the dev list is already done and next steps will be taken soon. I take the blame for the delay. On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 5:17 PM, sebb seb...@gmail.com wrote: On 16 November 2011 20:57, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Christian Grobmeier grobme...@gmail.com wrote: Deltacloud has graduated and can be put off from your list. Rat is discussing graduation and should be moved from the list too. The master list from which I drew the data can be found here: http://incubator.apache.org/projects/ By the way, that page is now generated from an XML file which may be easier to parse: http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml with DTD http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.dtd The original versions are also in SVN at : https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/site-author The script I used is attached to this message - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
Hi... The idea sounds good in general more specifically that should be clear and documented on the incubator site for future incubating projects. But, IMHO, we should categorize projects mentioned in that list from very old to recent ones and each group of mentors get in touch with their mentored projects and get with some feedback about such plan, so we can be more fair and give people a chance either to do some progress, more specifically for recent incubated projects and even for the older projects to revive if that is possible. Thoughts ? On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 3:12 AM, Mohammad Nour El-Din nour.moham...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 12:20 AM, Benson Margulies bimargul...@gmail.comwrote: I have been working to get Empire-DB to graduate, and I expect to have a vote in front of general@ quite soon. Same with Bean Validation the vote on the dev list is already done and next steps will be taken soon. I take the blame for the delay. On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 5:17 PM, sebb seb...@gmail.com wrote: On 16 November 2011 20:57, Sam Ruby ru...@intertwingly.net wrote: On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Christian Grobmeier grobme...@gmail.com wrote: Deltacloud has graduated and can be put off from your list. Rat is discussing graduation and should be moved from the list too. The master list from which I drew the data can be found here: http://incubator.apache.org/projects/ By the way, that page is now generated from an XML file which may be easier to parse: http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml with DTD http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.dtd The original versions are also in SVN at : https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/site-author The script I used is attached to this message - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein -- Thanks - Mohammad Nour Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving - Albert Einstein
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
While I agree that it's important to confront the current inventory, I think that the situation at hand is as much a matter of what goes into the incubator as what comes out. In my limited experience, size and growth are a big barrier to graduation. If a project is chugging along exhibiting good Apache process, but not quite achieving the necessary size, it poses a dilemma. No one wants to exile them to the outer darkness, and no one wants to graduate them, either. Perhaps one implication of this is that the bar for entry with respect to community size and diversity should be higher. In the modern world of (ahem) github, no one needs Apache infrastructure to run an open source project. A small group of people have any number of choices for free and open hosting. They can come to the incubator when and if they get are big enough to have a strong likelihood of success. I can see two problems with this view to begin with. One is IP management. The more people participate in a project and the longer they do so, the messier it becomes to track provenance and get ICLAs from all of the contributors. One almost wishes that the ASF could accept ICLAs and code grants for code that is in fact living somewhere else. I'm sure someone will tell me why that idea is nuts. The second is that growth is not cured by a minimum size. We want to see a podling do a good job of accepting new contributors. Even if a group of 27 people shows up on a proposal and commit their brains out, a year later there may still be 27 of them. I think that a solution here might be for such projects to be graduated but to have a requirement of a PMC member, or even PMC chair, who is an iPMC member and who thus can provide an extra level of detailed supervision. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: Actively retiring projects (was: Incubator Board Report November 2011)
On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 8:17 PM, Mohammad Nour El-Din nour.moham...@gmail.com wrote: Hi... The idea sounds good in general more specifically that should be clear and documented on the incubator site for future incubating projects. But, IMHO, we should categorize projects mentioned in that list from very old to recent ones and each group of mentors get in touch with their mentored projects and get with some feedback about such plan, so we can be more fair and give people a chance either to do some progress, more specifically for recent incubated projects and even for the older projects to revive if that is possible. Thoughts ? Nobody is proposing immediate expulsion of any PPMC based solely on a metric. On the other hand, it should not be a surprise to mentors that they are responsible for[1] assessment of the Podling status with respect to continuation/exit strategy. Reports for PPMCs that are older than a year should be expected to contain this information. Repeated failure to include such information and/or demonstrate forward progress towards meeting these objectives should cause the Incubator (not the Board!) to take action. - Sam Ruby [1] http://incubator.apache.org/incubation/Roles_and_Responsibilities.html#Mentor - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
