Re: [Goanet] foreigners buying land in Goa

2009-07-14 Thread Romeo Ferns

In response to Kalpana's comments, it is true what she says regarding the 
affects of foreign occupation on the local society and their culture.It will 
definitely give rise to loss of culture and change in idealogy.But there is 
very little anyone can do. The goans themselves have to understand and take 
stock of this situation. We pray that common sense will prevail. 
Godfrey Rasquinha

--- On Wed, 7/15/09, kalpana miss  wrote:

> From: kalpana miss 
> Subject: Re: [Goanet] foreigners buying land in Goa
> To: "Goanet" 
> Date: Wednesday, July 15, 2009, 5:25 AM
> Land buying in any state by
> foreigners has many adverse on the locals at that place. 
> same is true with Goans. It inflated prices making it
> difficult to locals. it is 
> making sea change in the culture. it is making increase in
> crime. disputes in rights 
> and so on. Long term effect may be end of a
> civilisation,culture and  the langauge.
> 
> kalpana 
> 
> 
> 





Re: [Goanet] foreigners buying land in Goa

2009-07-14 Thread kalpana miss
Land buying in any state by foreigners has many adverse on the locals at that 
place. 
same is true with Goans. It inflated prices making it difficult to locals. it 
is 
making sea change in the culture. it is making increase in crime. disputes in 
rights 
and so on. Long term effect may be end of a civilisation,culture and  the 
langauge.

kalpana 




[Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa and all that trash

2009-07-14 Thread Carmen Miranda
Hi Freddy

I am affraid  I have been living in London for over 40 years and I am
neither personally or directly or indirectly affected by the mining in Goa
and I do not have property in Goa.  I am however deeply concerned about the
welbeing of my fellow goans and the land itself which I love and wish to
preserve for future generations.

I care deeply about any brutality against planet Earth I don't care where it
happens. We only have one small planet which we are destroying because of
the greed and supidity of a few people.

I want to have a go and confront the miners in Goa and try to change the
situation, even If I have to do it alone. I don't give up easily!

I was hoping for some help and support from fellow goans around the world, I
will continue to ask for support. Hope one day you will agree that all of us
together perhaps can do something positive for Goa!

Best wishes

Carmen Miranda


[Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa and all that trash

2009-07-14 Thread Freddy Fernandes
In support of 

Message: 4
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 11:50:32 +0100
From: Carmen Miranda http://f5mail.rediff.com/prism/writemail?&mode=mail_to_individual&email=carmita
mira...@gmail.com&els=7109a71762540d2edef038d00a3fae1b> >
Subject: [Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa and all that trash



Hi Carmen,

 

Welcome to the big wide and broadminded world of Goa cybernet where the problems
of Goa and Goans are just daily occurrences, who the blip cares, such things
happen all over the world, why should time be wasted when we know nothing good
will come of it, we have so many other passions and happenings that can be
debated, so why waste our precious time on the problems of Goa and Goans !  

 

To me it looks like you or your people have been affected by mining, I too have
a similar problem and believe me, most people who are not affected care a two
hoot about people who are affected, it's only when problems come right upto the
door step and engulf you, one does not care to bother, what goes on around even
in the neighbourhood. It's your problem, you fight your own battles, and it is
because of this attitude that Goa is rapidly approaching doomsday, and that's
the sad fact about Goa today.

 

Today we have media that highlights practically every aberration caused,
activists and NGO's screaming at the top of their voices but is anyone other
than the affected involved ?  To make matters worse the same filthy corrupt
thrash is elected term after term.   The same people who are very much the cause
of every possible evil in Goa run our Government, how ironic or idiotic can that
be ?

 

Some time back there was a committee that was set up to investigate if there
were any mining activities carried out in and around the wild life sanctuaries
and reserves,  wasn't it a total fiasco when the report was placed before the
honourable  Chief Minister, couple of weeks back stating that there are no such
activities anywhere in Goa.  That's called honour among thieves !

 

I have learnt from personal experience and my advise to you is, do not expect
any help physical or moral support from any one other than those affected, if
you can get your people together and march on even if you are the only person
left walking, do so, let people who are engrossed and enchanted by every thing
else other than the problems of Goa and Goans, live and dwell on the past or
dream of the future, do so too, because after all who the blip cares about Seby,
Venita, Geraldine, you or the people around who suffer due to the atrocities of
the police and our elected politicians backed by the powerful miners and mega
builders who are trying to shred Goa to pieces.

 

These are our battles, we have to fight them and that's the naked truth

 

Freddy Agnelo Fernandes


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Re: [Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa and all that

2009-07-13 Thread Mario Andrew Rodrigues

VENITA COELHO 'Only when the last tree has been cut down; Only when the last 
river has been 
poisoned; Only when the last fish has been caught; Only then will you find that 
money cannot be eaten.' (ENDS) 
COMMENT :  The 40 ants loves to eat paper(money).  The ants,in short,  live on 
dead, one which does not have soul.
 
MARIO GOVEA
When a foreigner invests in another country it is a sign of respect for that 
country, is it not, and a sign of confidence in it as well? Why else would they 
risk their money?
COMMENT : Is it also not true that Human attitude & desires is ALWAYS to have 
something which they do not have. For example, Tired of cold, rain, gloomy 
weather they look for sunshine; Tired of wearing too many clothing to stay 
warm, they come to a place called GOA where they can be naked; cannot own even 
a room appartment with the pounds/dollars/euros/rubbles they have in their own 
country that they then come to buy the villa and even the village(morjem).
Lets  see just one of the DOMESTIC side views :- the 40 thieves have never seen 
pound/dollars/euros/rubbles so they sell LAND which was preserved by our 
grandparents for us  and accumulate these currencies and i) when they fall sick 
they go to the same countries and pay it back for treatment, ii) use  this 
money to send  their children to pursue education to other countries, and their 
children do not return iii)migrate and end up loosing in stocks/recession. 
Silly or wise?
FREDDY 
These are our battles, we have to fight them and that’s the naked truth
COMMENT : Harvest is rich, Labourers are few. 
 
CARMEN MIRANDA
We also need to make sure the miners follow the laws of the country and 
rehabilitate the land they destroyed (that is the law that no one respects).
COMMENT: This gave birth to “ORDINANCE 2009”. THE  LAW OF GOA, FOR THE GOANS, 
CHANGEABLE AS PER WHIMPS AND FANCIES OF THE GOVT, NOT TO SUIT THE 
PUBLIC(PEOPLE, AAM ADMI) , BUT FOR PRIVATE( INDIVIDUALS-KHAAS ADMI)
 
 
 

_
Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync. Check it out!
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t1_allup_explore_012009


[Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa and all that trash....

2009-07-12 Thread Mario Goveia

Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2009 11:50:32 +0100
From: Carmen Miranda 

Rice fields and wells are being destroyed and dried up systematically, forests 
are being cut, precious water tables are being polluted and emptied by the 
irresponsible mining process and I could go on, and on, and on.we are 
witnessing the real destruction of Goa at an INDUSTRIAL scaleand you are 
worried that a few Brits are buying land in Goa? At least that land will not 
fall under the bulldozers of the mining industry, and you might have a few 
trees still standing in Goa if you are lucky! I hope more people buy the land 
to keep it green and look after it.

We also need to make sure the miners follow the laws of the country  and 
rehabilitate the land they destroyed (that is the law that no one respects).

Mario responds:

Carmen,

You are absolutely correct.

The Brits and other foreigners buying houses that the locals cannot afford to 
buy and maintain are surely not interested in destroying either their own 
property or property around them because this will diminish the value of their 
investment if nothing else.  Besides, their investment in hard assets is not 
very easy to run away from, and the sovereign authority, in this case Goa, has 
the ultimate control of the property and thereby the investment.  Finally, the 
infusion of money certainly helps the sellers of the property.

The xenophobia in India against foreign investment ever since Independence 
boggles the mind given all that India needs to do to improve the lot of so many 
poor people.  In my opinion they should be encouraging investments from 
wherever they can get it.

When a foreigner invests in another country it is a sign of respect for that 
country, is it not, and a sign of confidence in it as well?  Why else would 
they risk their money?

Besides, anyone can see that those who have been defacing Goa over the last few 
decades are not foreigners but Goans and other Indians from inside and outside 
Goa.

I did not know the laws in Goa included rehabilitating the land used for mining 
after it has been depleted of ore.  I had made this suggestion several months 
ago and no one in Goa mentioned that it was already the law in Goa.  This is 
what open pit miners are required to do in north America.  If these laws were 
enforced in Goa it would go a long way towards restoring the land over a period 
of time, though it will never be pristine.  But that's the kind of trade off 
that a teeming developing country needs to make.  The goal should be to benefit 
most of the people most of the time.

India wasted 50 years after Independence following the siren song of mindless 
socialism and xenophobia, along with China and Russia whose communism was even 
worse.  Now that they have realized this, it's time to move on and catch up 
with the western economies.

As Caterpillar Tractor Company used to say about business, "There are no easy 
decisions, only intelligent choices."


Re: [Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa and all that trash....

2009-07-12 Thread Gabriel de Figueiredo

Welcome, D. Carmita. 

Recently, there was an e-petition relating to Goa's disappearing natural forest 
cover. I hope those who received that petition signed it. 

Anyhow, one of the issues of denuding forests is the reduction of updrafts, 
which in turn will make the coastline un-bearably hot pre-Monsoon, a fact which 
is currently being touted as being a result of man-made CO2 (greenhouse 
gases).  Greenhouse gases could be having an effect along with changes in the 
Solar system as a whole, but my reasoning is that if there is no updraft due to 
trees in the interior, there will not be any cooling breezes coming inland; and 
if this updraft eventually disappears due to drastic reduction of forest cover 
to give way to industrial development, residential buildings and mining 
industry, I do not have to spell out the end effects in a few years - it will 
go the Sahara way.  I remember reading this warning in the late 60s (advancing 
deserts or something like that), and then again something similar appeared 
recently on New Scientist.

Gabriel.


- Original Message 
From: Carmen Miranda 
To: goanet@lists.goanet.org
Sent: Sunday, 12 July, 2009 8:50:32 PM
Subject: [Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa and all that trash

Fiddle while Rome burns.(meaning to occupy oneself with unimportant
matters and neglect priorities during a crisis.) ...I just joined goanet a
week ago, and I have been amazed at the passion, energy and time spent
discussing who is TRASH and who is not TRASH , when the biggest trash are
our politicians and their policies or lack of them in Goa.  If you all are
such fervent Goenkars, it is about time you find out what is going on in the
interior of Goa 


  

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Re: [Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa and all that trash....

2009-07-12 Thread Roland Francis
Welcome to Goanet Carmen Miranda.

If your name is really Carmen Miranda then you have as much spirit and
passion as the erstwhile world famous Brazilian samba singer of the
same name.

Bring that passion and spirit to Goanet on an ongoing basis. At the
moment we have too few with that talent. Selma you will soon
experience, she outruns the best of the boys. Venita Coelho from Goa,
sometimes. Jane Gillian of Bombay shows promise but unlike you her
energies are misdirected (at Gabriel, Mario and me). Ruby Goes from
Down Under who loves dancing and scotch, not to mention news clippings
from the BBC. Ana Maria de Souza Goswami who was once battleworthy but
now is happy merely to employ cooks, gardeners and houseboys for her
large estate.

Of spirited males there is no shortage. There is Mario Goveia of the
US who is the self-appointed voice of truth, peace and reason and an
enduring friend of George Bush. Alfred Tavares of Sweden whose posts
are short but pungent like a Goa sausage. There's Mervyn Lobo a
Canadian compatriot who will tell you of bush planes launched by
coconut tree catapults and that gold as an investment is a good buy
perenially. Valmiki Faleiro who will take you back to a Goa that you
never imagined. Gabriel de Figueiredo who would be Salazar's spokesman
if Salazar was living and too many others whom it would take a lot of
bandwith to do justice to but whom I would allow you to discover for
yourself.

With regards
Roland.

On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 6:50 AM, Carmen Miranda wrote:
> Fiddle while Rome burns.(meaning to occupy oneself with unimportant
> matters and neglect priorities during a crisis.) ...I just joined goanet a
> week ago, and I have been amazed at the passion, energy and time spent
> discussing who is TRASH and who is not TRASH , when the biggest trash are
> our politicians and their policies or lack of them in Goa.


[Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa and all that trash....

2009-07-12 Thread Carmen Miranda
Fiddle while Rome burns.(meaning to occupy oneself with unimportant
matters and neglect priorities during a crisis.) ...I just joined goanet a
week ago, and I have been amazed at the passion, energy and time spent
discussing who is TRASH and who is not TRASH , when the biggest trash are
our politicians and their policies or lack of them in Goa.   If you all are
such fervent Goenkars, it is about time you find out what is going on in the
interior of Goa yes, there is more to Goa, much more than the beaches
that have already been ruined by TRASH tourism... our real problem is
that.somehow every Tom, Dick and Harry seems to want to become a miner now
in Goa including some of the TRASH politicians. As a result, right now there
are 825 concessions (not all yet active) for mining exploration in Goa, not
to mention all the illegal mining that is going on without any control. When
all these concessions become active, nearly 25% of Goa will be under mining
exploration. Some of the concessions are within the boundaries of  Nature
Reserves and Animal Sanctuaries. Rice fields and wells are being destroyed
and dried up systematically, forests are being cut, precious water tables
are being polluted and emptied by the irresponsible mining process and I
could go on, and on, and on.we are witnessing the real destruction of
Goa at an INDUSTRIAL scaleand you are worried that a few Brits are
buying land in Goa? At least that land will not fall under the bulldozers of
the mining industry, and you might have a few trees still standing in Goa if
you are lucky! I hope more people buy the land to keep it green and look
after it.

The impact of mining in Goa, one of the smallest states on India, is
irreversible. There is a desert being created in the hearth of Goa, forested
hills are being desmantled at great speed and village upon village is being
ruined. We need to stop this violence against our people, our land, our
villages, our rivers, our forests and our wildlife - and ultimately violence
agains all Goans.  We also need to make sure the miners follow the laws of
the country  and rehabilitate the land they destroyed (that is the law that
no one respects). Are you willing to take on this cause? We need the support
of every Goan in every corner of the world to support a campaign to control
mining, review and cancell most of the concessions, stop mining in forested
areas,  and rehabilitate the land. If the miners want to keep making money,
they will have to think of investing in a greener industry.

Carmen Miranda


Re: [Goanet] foreigners buying land in Goa

2009-07-12 Thread Gabriel de Figueiredo

Mario,

Given that you and I don't always agree with each other, thanks. 

My gut feeling is that this lady wants all of Goa to herself :-) 

OK. First, she alleged that I must have sold my ancestral property to a white 
so that I could by by property in London. Then, I was called an activist 
batting for the whites. Now apparently I have acquired a gang.  Next, I will 
probably be called an invader who plundered Goa with the said gang.  
Apparently, whatever I say on this forum will be "leading to loss of life and 
limb due to the presence of foreignes in Goa" - wow! What power!  And Jane and 
her cronies represent "all Goans". 

Although I had said in my last post relating to this thread it would be my 
last, I cannot resist having another go.  "Throughout the British reign of 
India, the wealth of India (diamonds, minerals etc.) were taken back to the 
mother country." - OK, what was taken from Goa to Portugal? This is Goa we're 
talking about - not India of the Rajahs.  Besides, Jane probably doesn't 
realise that tables have been turned - who owns Jaguar and Land Rover? How many 
overseas businesses does Infosys own? 

"Every ruler that invaded India, left their monuments, and forced us to learn 
their language." No wonder Goans of my generation were forced to learn Hindi 
instead of Konkani. I will say no more. 

Gabriel.

- Original Message 
From: Mario Goveia 
To: goanet@lists.goanet.org
Sent: Sunday, 12 July, 2009 5:48:37 AM
Subject: [Goanet] foreigners buying land in Goa


Date: 10 Jul 2009 17:04:32 -
From: "jane gillian rodrigues" 

Dear Goankars,

Since Gabriel and some other Goanetters, are in favour of foreigners buying 
property in Goa, all Goans  will hold him, and his gang, responsible for any 
problems in Goa, leading to loss of life and limb due to the presence of 
foreignes in Goa.

Mario responds:

Hey, Gabriel,

For some reason Jane Gillian is picking on you, re, and seems scared to mention 
my name, even though I am the foremost proponent on Goanet of the obvious 
benefits to Goa and Goans of allowing anyone to invest in hard assets in Goa 
and India in general.


  

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[Goanet] foreigners buying land in Goa

2009-07-11 Thread Mario Goveia

Date: 10 Jul 2009 17:04:32 -
From: "jane gillian rodrigues" 

Dear Goankars,

Since Gabriel and some other Goanetters, are in favour of foreigners buying 
property in Goa, all Goans  will hold him, and his gang, responsible for any 
problems in Goa, leading to loss of life and limb due to the presence of 
foreignes in Goa.

Mario responds:

Hey, Gabriel,

For some reason Jane Gillian is picking on you, re, and seems scared to mention 
my name, even though I am the foremost proponent on Goanet of the obvious 
benefits to Goa and Goans of allowing anyone to invest in hard assets in Goa 
and India in general.

In a previous post, which Jane has perhaps forgotten, she repeated this canard 
of responsibility for problems in Goa, which Jane pretends to be concerned 
about from the safety of far-off Mumbai:-))

Memo to self:  I wonder if Jane Gillian has invested in Goa?

My response was that I would gladly accept responsibility for what foreign 
investors did in Goa as long as Jane Gillian and her gang will accept 
responsibility for the mess that Goans have made and continue to make of Goa on 
a daily basis.

Jane Gillian wrote:

Every ruler that invaded India, left their monuments, and forced us to learn 
their language.  Throughout the British reign of India, the wealth of India 
(diamonds, minerals etc.) were taken back to the mother country. 

Mario responds:

Here we see the peculiar confusion between rulers who CONQUERED and CONTROLLED 
and PLUNDERED Goa and India, and ordinary foreigners who want to invest in a 
sovereign India that now controls itself and would improve the place for the 
benefit of their own investment if nothing else.






[Goanet] foreigners buying land in Goa

2009-07-11 Thread jane gillian rodrigues
Dear Goankars,

Since Gabriel and some other Goanetters, are in favour of foreigners buying 
property in Goa, all Goans  will hold him, and his gang, responsible for any 
problems in Goa, leading to loss of life and limb due to the presence of 
foreignes in Goa.

Every ruler that invaded India, left their monuments, and forced us to learn 
their language.  Throughout the British reign of India, the wealth of India 
(diamonds, minerals etc.)were taken back to the mother country.  
=

>Subject: Re: [Goanet] foreigners buying proerty in Goa
>
>
>Dear Jane,
>
>>Since Gabriel is the ACTIVIST in favour of foreigners buying property in
>Goa, 
>>should every Goan hold him responsible if some problem does take place,
>>in Goa, because of them?
>
>First of all, allow me to express to sogle Goemkar?(not Goankars) on this
>forum, that an activist, accidental or otherwise, I am not and never will




Re: [Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa

2009-07-09 Thread Ashley D'silva
Hello Rina,

People should understand this.

Thanks
Ashley
-Original Message-
From: goanet-boun...@lists.goanet.org
[mailto:goanet-boun...@lists.goanet.org] On Behalf Of Rina Mukherji
Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 9:43 PM
To: goanet@lists.goanet.org
Cc: goanet-ow...@lists.goanet.org
Subject: [Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa

Isn't the sympathy shown by people towards foreigners who have or intending
to buy land in Goa a little misplaced?.
The laws regarding foreigners buying property in any part of India may be
very strict; we ought to understand one cannot equate it with indians
settling down or buying property in the US or Canada. We are bursting at the
seams; US, or most parts of Europe need people, especially migrants.

We are indignant when cheap labour finds its way into India from across the
border. Are these foreigners bringing in some special skills that we are
short of? Or are we getting cheap labour that we need?They are here as
pensioners because life is affordable and cheap; but does that help Goa at
all. If anything, it will send land prices skyrocketing!


Rina  Mukherji

Kolkata



Re: [Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa

2009-07-08 Thread Roland Francis
What ignorance !

Within the boundaries of foreigners coming to Goa (the topic is not
about India), if there is any bursting of the seams it is from the
trash of the rest of India coming to Goa and not from countries
overseas.

Foreigners come to Goa because living is affordable and cheap?
Hey, Indians go to Australia because there are no spots for them in
Indian institutions on account of their average marks. Indians go to
the Gulf because there are jobs and they pay better. Indians emigrate
to western countries for a better quality of life. And who told you
the US and most parts of Europe need people? They do, like a hole in
the head.

Land prices in Goa skyrocket not because of the foreigners alone.
There's lots of black money floating in the country. There's lots of
corruption in India. Two better companions there cannot be. Soon
Mamata Banerjee will have a home in Goa. I'd be surprised if she has
not already got one.

If you have to rail against foreigners, as Marshall Mendonca said,
start with the Russians and the Israelis. They are not stakeholders in
Goa like the Brits are. They conspire to distribute drugs and
prostitution and restrict the movement of Goans in their own land.

Roland.

On Wed, Jul 8, 2009 at 12:13 PM, Rina Mukherji wrote:
> Isn't the sympathy shown by people towards foreigners who have or intending
> to buy land in Goa a little misplaced?.
> The laws regarding foreigners buying property in any part of India may be
> very strict; we ought to understand one cannot equate it with indians
> settling down or buying property in the US or Canada. We are bursting at the
> seams; US, or most parts of Europe need people, especially migrants.
>
> We are indignant when cheap labour finds its way into India from across the
> border. Are these foreigners bringing in some special skills that we are
> short of? Or are we getting cheap labour that we need?    They are here as
> pensioners because life is affordable and cheap; but does that help Goa at
> all. If anything, it will send land prices skyrocketing!
> Rina  Mukherji
> Kolkata


[Goanet] Foreigners buying land in Goa

2009-07-08 Thread Rina Mukherji
Isn't the sympathy shown by people towards foreigners who have or intending
to buy land in Goa a little misplaced?.
The laws regarding foreigners buying property in any part of India may be
very strict; we ought to understand one cannot equate it with indians
settling down or buying property in the US or Canada. We are bursting at the
seams; US, or most parts of Europe need people, especially migrants.

We are indignant when cheap labour finds its way into India from across the
border. Are these foreigners bringing in some special skills that we are
short of? Or are we getting cheap labour that we need?They are here as
pensioners because life is affordable and cheap; but does that help Goa at
all. If anything, it will send land prices skyrocketing!


Rina  Mukherji

Kolkata