Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
FN, if you come from this side of the Zuari, we pronouce it as zamdan. I checked with my husband too. But then, we are also as disgusting as to pronouce Huin as Fuin? :-) Funny how language gets distorted. best, selma
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Blame it on the Zuari! And this thread seems to be growing into 23 posts strong, and I'm still getting only a little information on wine. FN Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490 On 25 November 2010 13:07, Carvalho elisabeth_...@yahoo.com wrote: FN, if you come from this side of the Zuari, we pronouce it as zamdan. I checked with my husband too. But then, we are also as disgusting as to pronouce Huin as Fuin? :-)
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
FN, my grandmother used to make zamda wine, when we were little. It was very good. Maybe she added wheat to it, I don't know. She then used to serve it for breakfast. Now I know why. It was the perfect breakfast - fruit and fibre :-) best, Selma
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Excuse my ignorance, but what exactly is zamda? FN Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490 On 24 November 2010 13:28, Carvalho elisabeth_...@yahoo.com wrote: FN, my grandmother used to make zamda wine, when we were little. It was very good. Maybe she added wheat to it, I don't know. She then used to serve it for breakfast. Now I know why. It was the perfect breakfast - fruit and fibre :-)
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Fred, I guess it might have been Jambul. I am sure you have seen Jambul or 'Jamblan' during the summer months.http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:India_Goa_Jambul_Fruit.jpg Naguesh Bhatcar sgbhat...@hotmail.com From: fredericknoro...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2010 00:20:21 +0530 To: goanet@lists.goanet.org Subject: Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone? Excuse my ignorance, but what exactly is zamda? FN Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490 On 24 November 2010 13:28, Carvalho elisabeth_...@yahoo.com wrote: FN, my grandmother used to make zamda wine, when we were little. It was very good. Maybe she added wheat to it, I don't know. She then used to serve it for breakfast. Now I know why. It was the perfect breakfast - fruit and fibre :-)
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Oops, I should have guessed. Sorry! Zamblam... as it sometimes gets pronounced in these parts of Goa (Bardez). As kids, my brother and me actually tried making wine from jambhul/zamblam, and, surprise of surprises, it actually worked. Very funny how I got coaxed into writing the query below... Aren (7) is just about learning to read, and fools around on the comp too. Before going to bed, he was yawning in my lap, when he noticed me do a Google search for zambda. Almost reading my mind, he asked, What's zambda, dada? Which convinced me that I needed to send in that query, even at the risk of betraying ignorance. So much for the view that child is the father of man! FN Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490 On 25 November 2010 01:12, Naguesh Bhatcar sgbhat...@hotmail.com wrote: Fred, I guess it might have been Jambul. I am sure you have seen Jambul or 'Jamblan' during the summer months.http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:India_Goa_Jambul_Fruit.jpg
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
JC wrote: I do not support FN's sudden interest in producing alcohol in Goa - unless, like with the Irish Poteen or Potcheen, he intends to use all the Goa newspapers to aid in the fermentation process. I'd specifically recommend the use of the rag also known as the Heraldo - Response: Incase you didn't notice, mine was just a humourous response. But for the record, I think drinking urine, be it cow's or your own (a la Moraji) is injurious to health. There is a reason why it is released by the body. It's because the body deems it unnecessary. And I am seriously opposed to halal meat. And yes, I will never buy it. I wouldn't take it even if it is given away free. It is one thing to kill an animal for consumption, it is quite another thing to let it suffer while it dies. There is a difference. If I could control my urges, I would have become a vegetarian a lot time ago. I tried several times but failed. That doesn't mean, I should continue supporting a practice that is clearly inhumane. We are not living in the 14th century, we are living in the 21st century. This concept that something associated with religion has to be condoned, is facile at best. Lastly, what I do support is FN's or anyone else's interest in wine making. Why not? We don't live in a nanny state or police state or even a state that needs to be morally policed. We are all capable of making up our own minds whether we want a drink or not. A drink that doesn't have urine in it (hopefully). By the way FN's interest in wine-making is not sudden. Last year he did a whole video on it. Maybe my memory is just better. I remember everything that happened - not just last year. Best, selma
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Great fun! I'm enjoying all this. As I tune in to what others say I'm doing, am thinking, or what my motives are, it feels like being an eavesdropper on my own funeral :-) And I'm learning something about myself too. This is like entertainment without tax! (Do you recall times in India when entertainment -- including cinemas -- were heavily taxed? Now we have the plush theatres who place a heavy tax on the citizen through other means, including crony capitalism and the controversial manner in which set up.) Anyway, one of the more entertaining aspects of being online, to me at least, lies in not responding when someone badly wants you to by drawing you into a debate, allegation or innuendo! Btw, I hope this doesn't amount to a response... FN Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Hi Selma, Speaking of halal meat.just as the jewish people of yore spoke of kosher products it was originally to do with healthy meat. Note that the jews abhored the use of swine flesh as they regarded the pig as a dirty animal that would consume any garbage. Included in the kosher list it was taboo to eat any anything that was a bottom -feeder of the oceans and lakes ,as they felt the filth accumulated there.so there went crustaceans like lobster and and shrimp as they were suspect of ingesting dirt to the taboo list. When cows died in the field and people passed this off as good meat , the fact that the blood coagulated and would not flow freely when the cow was slaughtered by cutting the jugular arteryit was a sign of suspect death of the cow from other causes ( diseases) One of the factories we were taken to in our last year of school was a meat-packing plant called Tanganyika Packers on the outskirts. of Dar-es-Salaam ( Tanzania )..which produced the famous corned beef that was exported to many mid -East countries like the U.A.E. states, Bahrain etc. When we saw how the cattle coming down a ramp were electrically shocked into a state of stupor before their throats were cut and the blood allowed to flow,.we , like you , questioned the apparent cruelty of allowing the blood to flowit was explained to us that muslim practice of slaughter required this to verify that the cow was healthyto declare the meat thereof as halal or kosher to be acceptable in the muslim states to where it waw exported. Of course now in western countries we have vet. officers who check the healthy state of the animal prior to slaughter - Original Message - From: Carvalho elisabeth_...@yahoo.com To: goanet@lists.goanet.org Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2010 2:59 AM Subject: Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone? JC wrote: I do not support FN's sudden interest in producing alcohol in Goa - unless, like with the Irish Poteen or Potcheen, he intends to use all the Goa newspapers to aid in the fermentation process. I'd specifically recommend the use of the rag also known as the Heraldo - Response: Incase you didn't notice, mine was just a humourous response. But for the record, I think drinking urine, be it cow's or your own (a la Moraji) is injurious to health. There is a reason why it is released by the body. It's because the body deems it unnecessary. And I am seriously opposed to halal meat. And yes, I will never buy it. I wouldn't take it even if it is given away free. It is one thing to kill an animal for consumption, it is quite another thing to let it suffer while it dies. There is a difference. If I could control my urges, I would have become a vegetarian a lot time ago. I tried several times but failed. That doesn't mean, I should continue supporting a practice that is clearly inhumane. We are not living in the 14th century, we are living in the 21st century. This concept that something associated with religion has to be condoned, is facile at best. Lastly, what I do support is FN's or anyone else's interest in wine making. Why not? We don't live in a nanny state or police state or even a state that needs to be morally policed. We are all capable of making up our own minds whether we want a drink or not. A drink that doesn't have urine in it (hopefully). By the way FN's interest in wine-making is not sudden. Last year he did a whole video on it. Maybe my memory is just better. I remember everything that happened - not just last year. Best, selma
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Please, could someone tell me about wine? I'm dying with all the suspense. Meat, motives, halal, urine theraphy, 100% veg... last year... everything but wine! How many Goenkars does it take to get some info about wine? I'm headed here (as JC would suspect, to further malign the fair name of the Goanese) http://www.winemakingtalk.com/ FN ffbe Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
On 23 November 2010 12:37, Frederick Noronha fredericknoro...@gmail.com wrote: Please, could someone tell me about wine? I'm dying with all the suspense. Meat, motives, halal, urine theraphy, 100% veg... last year...everything but wine! How many Goenkars does it take to get some info about wine? I'm headed here (as JC would suspect, to further malign the fair name of the Goanese) --- Arre FN, The answer is right in your post. Add Urine to wine to get Vinho Branco Add Halal meat to wine to get Muscatel how about that to the one who wants to say Goanese? jc
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
On 23 November 2010 17:37, Frederick Noronha fredericknoro...@gmail.comwrote: Please, could someone tell me about wine? I'm dying with all the suspense. Meat, motives, halal, urine theraphy, 100% veg... last year... everything but wine! How many Goenkars does it take to get some info about wine? I'm headed here (as JC would suspect, to further malign the fair name of the Goanese) http://www.winemakingtalk.com/ FN ffbe Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490 RESPONSE: I have never used wheat in wine making. I suspect it is to add body and a wheat flavour to the wine. It gives the wine a characteristic flavour, it is used perhaps because the grapes or other ingredients are not up to scratch in Goa. Early this year I visited the wine festival in Panjim - all the wines I tasted were pretty awful! -- DEV BOREM KORUM Gabe Menezes.
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Gotcha! Good one doc. That was very funny! FN On 24 November 2010 00:19, J. Colaco jc cola...@gmail.com wrote: Arre FN, The answer is right in your post. Add Urine to wine to get Vinho Branco Add Halal meat to wine to get Muscatel how about that to the one who wants to say Goanese?
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Since this thread is ostensibly about winemaking, and has been derailed by the adherents and opponents of various isms (kosehrism, halalism, urineism), I suspect that FN threw in the word Goanese to start another controversy and further delay respondents from supplying the knowledge about wineism that he is so suspensefully seeking.:))) Victor From: Frederick Noronha fredericknoro...@gmail.com To: Goa's premiere mailing list, estb. 1994! goanet@lists.goanet.org Sent: Tue, November 23, 2010 12:37:46 PM Subject: Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone? Please, could someone tell me about wine? I'm dying with all the suspense. Meat, motives, halal, urine theraphy, 100% veg... last year... everything but wine! How many Goenkars does it take to get some info about wine? I'm headed here (as JC would suspect, to further malign the fair name of the Goanese) http://www.winemakingtalk.com/ FN ffbe Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
--- On Tue, 11/23/10, Victor Rangel-Ribeiro vrangel...@yahoo.com wrote: Since this thread is ostensibly about winemaking, and has been derailed by the adherents and opponents of various isms (kosehrism, halalism, urineism), I suspect that FN threw in the word Goanese to start another controversy and further delay respondents from supplying the knowledge about wineism that he is so suspensefully seeking.:))) Victor Please clarify if this is wine-making as it relates to: 1. Pre-1961? 2. Atheists or believers? 3. Congress or BJP winemakers? 4. Migrants? 5. Corrupt Goan ministers? 6. The Inquisition? 7. Non-Brahmins in Panjim who did not vote for Parrikar? 8. Anti-nationals? 9. Konkani groups who favor Romi script? 10. Miners and mega-builders destroying Goa? Please note, answers to the questions above does not guarantee a wine recipe will be provided. George
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
As my friend Linken of Chandor (yeah, he spells his name that way, though I don't think it's meant to deliberately insult good ole Abraham) once said, all ism's sooner or later turn into religions and get bad. Including tourism! FN PS: He said something to that effect. This was in 1983, in quite another age, during the time of the CHOGM Retreat, if I recall right. PPS: The http://www.winemakingtalk.com/ guys are as bad as Goanetters! They won't let me post a URL or email address till I'm five posts old there. And how does one discuss wine without a URL? (I don't mean URine!) Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490 On 24 November 2010 10:30, Victor Rangel-Ribeiro vrangel...@yahoo.com wrote: Since this thread is ostensibly about winemaking, and has been derailed by the adherents and opponents of various isms (kosehrism, halalism, urineism), I suspect that FN threw in the word Goanese to start another controversy and further delay respondents from supplying the knowledge about wineism that he is so suspensefully seeking.:)))
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
I'm sorry, I eat my words about the winemakers. They're not as bad. I got a hint of an answer. How reassuring! My faith in humankind has been restored: http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?p=90900#post90900 Posted by: djrockinsteve On: 11-23-2010 11:27 PM Wheat can be added to wine during fermentation to give it a more whiskey like flavor. Common in areas of Wales. Don't recall anyone on here mentioning it. It's just another ingredient used to alter the taste of wine. Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Fred, the wheat is added to the mixture of crushed grapes for clarity of the wine. I am not an expert in wine making but I had tried this from a receipe back in Mumbai, specially when you are making wine from black grapes, the clarity of the wine is the best, when wheat is added...in the end when you filter you see the wheat takes the extra colour. Eddie Verdes - Original Message - From: Frederick Noronha Please, could someone tell me about wine? I'm dying with all the suspense. Meat, motives, halal, urine theraphy, 100% veg... last year... everything but wine!
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
On 24 November 2010 10:52, George Pinto georgejpi...@yahoo.com wrote: Please note, answers to the questions above does not guarantee a wine recipe will be provided. George, you are deliberately playing footsie to confuse the issue here. As you probably know, the recipes are already available here: http://indianwine.com/cs/blogs/about_wine/archive/2009/07/31/successful-goan-home-wines-book-review-and-three-wine-recipes.aspx As you would see from the above post (and my treating of Goan wine as a subset of Indian), I am not anti-India per se, but just dislike some aspects of post-1961 colonialism! (That comes from the BC influence via Macau.) Now that my neutrality and independence as a so-called wine info junkie has also been challenged, I would like to endeavour to show that I've been involved in this field since the year of our Lord of 1947. It is not true that I started asking such questions only after Digukaka ascended the seat of power in Panjim. Here are some links that prove this fact: FN: Frederick Noronha’s blog Various themes that interest me… Free Software, Goa, books, developmental issues… Posts Tagged ‘wine’ http://fredericknoronha.wordpress.com/tag/wine/ [Goanet] Seeking information... on wine http://www.mail-archive.com/goanet@lists.goanet.org/msg51347.html Obituary: Edwin Saldanha... (father of Yvette, Kevin, Patsy, Jenny . http://osdir.com/ml/culture.region.india.goa.saligao/2007-08/msg00014.html Wine? From tropical fruits... ? - India Travel Forum | IndiaMike.com http://www.indiamike.com/india/goa-f23/wine-from-tropical-fruits-t10091/ Most importantly: Why Vedanta verdict is just new wine in old bottle http://groups.google.com/group/india-ej/browse_thread/thread/67c8f6978c17f57 I will continue on this point later, once I find the archives of the pre-1994 internet. Goanetters being Goanetters, one of them actually sent me this insulting post, which really questions my credentials. He wrote in from Europa: Fred, I thought you didn't drink. Or are u like Mr Costa? Cheera all the same... What next! FN
[Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Any winemakers out there? Would you care to share some recipes with us? If so, would you know the reason why wheat is added to making wine... mostly in Goa? FN Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Frederick Noronha fredericknoron...@gmail.com asked: Any winemakers out there? Would you care to share some recipes with us? If so, would you know the reason why wheat is added to making wine... mostly in Goa? FN ANSWER: So that the plagiarizing and fact-check-free chaps at the Goa Heraldo would not notice ... or else they will write MASSIVE headlines (again) that Goans = bebde! Et tu, FN? jc
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Wheat is added to quicken the process of fermentation, if I am not mistaken. It quickens the rot.much like our beloved state! Incidentally, add a little feni when adding the caramel for the colour. Or rum (since finding good pure feni is almost impossible these days).-rum's sweetness adds to the wine, I think. ederick Noronha fredericknoron...@gmail.com wrote: Any winemakers out there? Would you care to share some recipes with us? If so, would you know the reason why wheat is added to making wine... mostly in Goa? FN Frederick Noronha :: +91-9822122436 :: +91-832-2409490
[Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Last year, FN defended drinking of cow urine because it was a religious belief. A few days ago, FN defended the slitting of animal throats and draining of blood to create halal meat because it was a religious belief. As long as drinking wine (presumably with wheat in it) is part of the Catholic religious belief, FN will never write anything against it :-) selma -- JC wrote: So that the plagiarizing and fact-check-free chaps at the Goa Heraldo would not notice ... or else they will write MASSIVE headlines (again) that Goans = bebde! Et tu, FN? jc
Re: [Goanet] Winemaking, anyone?
Carvalho elisabeth_...@yahoo.com wrote: Last year, FN defended drinking of cow urine because it was a religious belief. A few days ago, FN defended the slitting of animal throats and draining of blood to create halal meat because it was a religious belief. As long as drinking wine (presumably with wheat in it) is part of the Catholic religious belief, FN will never write anything against it :-) COMMENT: a: Last year was last year. b: Not being an expert on cow's urine, I have no comment on the merits or demerits of consuming it. I however support the right of those who wish to smoke and drink whatever ...as long as no one else is affected. c: The Halal process is the similar to Kosher. Many desis in London (esp) would buy their chicken and lamb from the desi stores in Southall. The meats were cleaned, trimmed of the fat and (most of all) significantly cheaper (often at 40% less) than the meats available at the English butcher-shops on the High Street or at the meat sections of Marks Spencers, Sainsbury or Asda. And yes, the meat in these desi stores was (and I am sure, still is) halal. So I don't know what this sudden awareness of animal rights is all about. What happened ...Never patronised a curry restaurant? What do we think the meat is at these places? d: If one really wishes to discuss animal rights, please tell me you are 100% vegetarian. Hopefully, somebody will take up Plant Rights. e: I do not support FN's sudden interest in producing alcohol in Goa - unless, like with the Irish Poteen or Potcheen, he intends to use all the Goa newspapers to aid in the fermentation process. I'd specifically recommend the use of the rag also known as the Heraldo jc
