Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
Geir, Tim, Noel, etc., I've had a reply from the CEO of Punch Telematix, concerning the . He asks if he really has to fill in the bulk_contribution_checklist, given that he personally has no knowledge of the process by which Wonka was developed. (In fact no one who ever worked on Wonka at Acunia is now working for Punch Telematix). He has no objection to making the donation however, and I do know all about the development process at Acunia, having been in charge of the project virtually the whole time (the missing months are covered by Gerrit, who is now working for /k/). I think there are two ways to proceed: either (i) Punch and /k/ answer the questionnaire jointly, or (ii) /k/ makes the contribution and treats Punch as an "other author". Let's see how that goes: Part III : Statement of Origination a) Have you personally written all of the code or other material that you are intending to contribute to this project, and if so, are you an Authorized Contributor for all parts of the contribution? [ ] Yes [ ] No ==> No ==> continue with the rest of Part III b) Have you verified the development history of the code to identify ALL of the authors? Please list the other authors: ==> Acunia is listed alongside the smaller contributors c) Do you have a written agreement with all of the authors that either gives you ownership of the material or otherwise provides you sufficient rights to submit this material to the project on their behalf. Please provide the details of this agreement: ==> We get Punch Telematix to sign such an agreement, along with the others d) Are all of the authors Authorized Contributors for the part of the contribution written/created by each author? ==> No ==> continue with the rest of part III e) Was the code written prior to May 2005 (when the Harmony Project was initiated)? [ ] Yes [ ] No Yes, except for the code developed by /k/ after that date (i) If No, you must provide Authorized Contributor Questionnaires for the authors of the code created after May 2005 such that those authors are classified as Authorized Contributors for the portions of the contribution written by them after May 2005. ==> OK, /k/ needs to become an Authorized Contributor anyhow f) Did any of the authors of the code have access to third party implementations of similar technology while developing the contribution? ==> In a sense everyone has access to Sun's JDK, but at Acunia the Wonka developers were not allowed to look at those sources nor to have them on their machine. We asked outside contributors to do likewise. g) Was the code developed in accordance with a development process which was designed to prevent unauthorized inclusion of third party intellectual property rights into the code? (e.g., does the process require that developers not have concurrent access to third party implementations of similar technology during development?) ==> Yes If "yes", please provide short description of the process, focusing on protections related to third party intellectual property : ==> Blah blah So what's the best way forward? Thanks for your time, Chris -- Chris Gray/k/ Embedded Java Solutions BE0503765045 Embedded & Mobile Java, OSGihttp://www.k-embedded-java.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] +32 3 216 0369 - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
Chris Gray wrote: On Friday 06 October 2006 09:29, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: Who owns the copyright and can therefore make the donation? Copyright in the original Wonka code belonged to Acunia, and hence now belongs to Punch Telematix; there were also a few small contributions from outsiders whom I'm fairly confident I can track down. Copyright in all changes since late 2003 belong to me or to a company called Proveo, who should also be willing to contribute their stuff (I'm writing to them now). Do you require the same docucmentation to be completed by all authors, or is there a distinction between main and subsidiary contributors? There really is no distinction in our process. I could easily be argued that someone who offered a change that was entirely a derivative work (say offering a patch that made a post-decrement a pre-decrement) doesn't need one, but we're really trying to stay out of the situation where we'd have to argue anything with anyone :) geir - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
On Friday 06 October 2006 09:29, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > Who owns the copyright and can therefore make the donation? Copyright in the original Wonka code belonged to Acunia, and hence now belongs to Punch Telematix; there were also a few small contributions from outsiders whom I'm fairly confident I can track down. Copyright in all changes since late 2003 belong to me or to a company called Proveo, who should also be willing to contribute their stuff (I'm writing to them now). Do you require the same docucmentation to be completed by all authors, or is there a distinction between main and subsidiary contributors? Chris -- Chris Gray/k/ Embedded Java Solutions BE0503765045 Embedded & Mobile Java, OSGihttp://www.k-embedded-java.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] +32 3 216 0369 - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
Chris Gray wrote: On Thursday 05 October 2006 18:38, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: w00t :) Don't get too excited - it wouldn't be the first time that I've got no answer to such a mail. But I'll follow up with a phone call on Monday if no reply by then. Do we need them to make a bulk contribution, or can we handle them as an "other contributor"? I can testify to the provenance of the code, as I was project leader at Acunia from the very beginning. Who owns the copyright and can therefore make the donation? geir - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
On Thursday 05 October 2006 19:06, Tim Ellison wrote: > Apologies for drifting off-topic... > Is there a spec for the shape and behavior of headless SE and embeddable > SE etc.? I have only seen passing references to what they are and how > they act like SE. SFAIK a "headless" SE is simply one for which java.awt.headless has been set true; that tells the JRE to implement image operations in software instead of using the graphical capabilities of the underlying platform. "Embedded SE" seems to refer to a build for PowerPC that Sun demoed at ESC. If it's distributed on the same licence terms as normal JavaSE then it won't be legal to distribute "stripped" versions which only contain the packages needed by the application. (Presumably the same restriction will apply to certified versions of Harmony once these exist). > > [geir] > > I fully expect that over time, this project will have multiple virtual > > machines, as well as multiple builds for classlib to support various > > deployment platforms. > > and potentially configurations, though to tackle ME would require the > ability to subset the behavior of the existing types as well. For CLDC, yes. For CDC it should be possible to just subset the classlib. -- Chris Gray/k/ Embedded Java Solutions BE0503765045 Embedded & Mobile Java, OSGihttp://www.k-embedded-java.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] +32 3 216 0369 - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
On Thursday 05 October 2006 18:38, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > w00t :) Don't get too excited - it wouldn't be the first time that I've got no answer to such a mail. But I'll follow up with a phone call on Monday if no reply by then. Do we need them to make a bulk contribution, or can we handle them as an "other contributor"? I can testify to the provenance of the code, as I was project leader at Acunia from the very beginning. -- Chris Gray/k/ Embedded Java Solutions BE0503765045 Embedded & Mobile Java, OSGihttp://www.k-embedded-java.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] +32 3 216 0369 - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
Apologies for drifting off-topic... Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > Stefano Mazzocchi wrote: >> Chris Gray wrote: >> >> Chris, >> >> I personally think it would be *very* nice to have Wonka and friends >> donated to the Harmony Project, if only as a starting point for a very >> portable and embeddable JVM. >> >> While Harmony is principally aimed at Java Standard Edition, it is not a >> secret that many of us would like to continue on with Java Mobile >> Edition once the standard edition is certified. > > Don't forget that you can have an embeddable SE - it doesn't have to be ME. Is there a spec for the shape and behavior of headless SE and embeddable SE etc.? I have only seen passing references to what they are and how they act like SE. Regards, Tim > I fully expect that over time, this project will have multiple virtual > machines, as well as multiple builds for classlib to support various > deployment platforms. and potentially configurations, though to tackle ME would require the ability to subset the behavior of the existing types as well. Regards, Tim >> I think Wonka could be a great seed in that respect. >> > > +1 > > geir > > - > Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- Tim Ellison ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) IBM Java technology centre, UK. - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
Chris Gray wrote: On Thursday 05 October 2006 18:00, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: Don't forget that you can have an embeddable SE - it doesn't have to be ME. Yes, but a full SE nowadays is pretty big. JavaME CDC is basically a defined subset of SE at the package level, and this is what Wonka aims to support. There is nothing missing in terms of VM functionality (contrast with CLDC). I fully expect that over time, this project will have multiple virtual machines, as well as multiple builds for classlib to support various deployment platforms. Once you can overcome the "no subsetting" restriction, yes. I've written to Punch Telematix about the bulk contribution checklist, I await a reply. w00t :) Cheers, Chris - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
On Thursday 05 October 2006 18:00, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote: > Don't forget that you can have an embeddable SE - it doesn't have to be ME. Yes, but a full SE nowadays is pretty big. JavaME CDC is basically a defined subset of SE at the package level, and this is what Wonka aims to support. There is nothing missing in terms of VM functionality (contrast with CLDC). > I fully expect that over time, this project will have multiple virtual > machines, as well as multiple builds for classlib to support various > deployment platforms. Once you can overcome the "no subsetting" restriction, yes. I've written to Punch Telematix about the bulk contribution checklist, I await a reply. Cheers, Chris -- Chris Gray/k/ Embedded Java Solutions BE0503765045 Embedded & Mobile Java, OSGihttp://www.k-embedded-java.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] +32 3 216 0369 - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
Stefano Mazzocchi wrote: Chris Gray wrote: Chris, I personally think it would be *very* nice to have Wonka and friends donated to the Harmony Project, if only as a starting point for a very portable and embeddable JVM. While Harmony is principally aimed at Java Standard Edition, it is not a secret that many of us would like to continue on with Java Mobile Edition once the standard edition is certified. Don't forget that you can have an embeddable SE - it doesn't have to be ME. I fully expect that over time, this project will have multiple virtual machines, as well as multiple builds for classlib to support various deployment platforms. I think Wonka could be a great seed in that respect. +1 geir - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
Chris Gray wrote: > Hi Noel, > >> Does this still include the hardware portability layer? Any synergies with >> APR? Does it include the AWT code? > > And here is my reply to Noel's message: > > Hi Noel, > > The code runs on x86, ARM, MIPS, and PowerPC; basically it should run on any > normal 32-bit processor (with or without MMU) for which a GNU toolchain > exists. The OSwald internal RTOS is still there as an API, but we no longer > use it to schedule Java threads within a Linux process, as recent changes to > gclib mean that the __errno_location hack no longer works. On Linux we > currently use o4p to map OSwald threads 1:1 onto pthreads. > > The OSwald API is a kind of alternative to APR. There may be synergies. > > The AWT code is included. It is mainly designed for LCD/touchscreen > environments, either directly on a framebuffer or in a single X window (which > we treat as a "virtual framebuffer"). Chris, I personally think it would be *very* nice to have Wonka and friends donated to the Harmony Project, if only as a starting point for a very portable and embeddable JVM. While Harmony is principally aimed at Java Standard Edition, it is not a secret that many of us would like to continue on with Java Mobile Edition once the standard edition is certified. I think Wonka could be a great seed in that respect. -- Stefano. - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
Hi Noel, > Does this still include the hardware portability layer? Any synergies with > APR? Does it include the AWT code? And here is my reply to Noel's message: Hi Noel, The code runs on x86, ARM, MIPS, and PowerPC; basically it should run on any normal 32-bit processor (with or without MMU) for which a GNU toolchain exists. The OSwald internal RTOS is still there as an API, but we no longer use it to schedule Java threads within a Linux process, as recent changes to gclib mean that the __errno_location hack no longer works. On Linux we currently use o4p to map OSwald threads 1:1 onto pthreads. The OSwald API is a kind of alternative to APR. There may be synergies. The AWT code is included. It is mainly designed for LCD/touchscreen environments, either directly on a framebuffer or in a single X window (which we treat as a "virtual framebuffer"). Best regqrds, Chris -- Chris Gray/k/ Embedded Java Solutions BE0503765045 Embedded & Mobile Java, OSGihttp://www.k-embedded-java.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] +32 3 216 0369 - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Fwd: RE: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
As Noel suggests, I did indeed intend this reply to go to general@incubator.apache.org ... --- Begin Message --- Sounds interesting. Does this still include the hardware portability layer? Any synergies with APR? Does it include the AWT code? --- Noel -Original Message- From: Chris Gray [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 5:09 To: general@incubator.apache.org Cc: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org Subject: Wonka, Mika, and Apache Hello guys, To introduce myself: I'm one of the original developers of the Wonka embedded VM, and my company sells both support for Wonka and our own derivative which we call Mika. Recently we made Mika available under the same BSD-style licence as Wonka. My question is whether Apache would be interested in adopting Wonka/Mika as a project, either within Harmony or as an embedded counterpart thereto. Currently ownership of the code is divided between Punch Telematix, who acquired the assets of my former employer Acunia, and my own company. Punch have no interest in the VM beyond the fact that it is an essential component of a product (the CarCube) which they inherited from Acunia. I believe they would have no objection to granting rights to the AF, beyond the sheer effort of doing so. They can probably be persuaded, but first I'd like to know if there is sufficient interest within the AF. Best regards, Chris -- Chris Gray/k/ Embedded Java Solutions BE0503765045 Embedded & Mobile Java, OSGihttp://www.k-embedded-java.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] +32 3 216 0369 --- End Message --- - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
Sounds interesting. Does this still include the hardware portability layer? Any synergies with APR? Does it include the AWT code? --- Noel -Original Message- From: Chris Gray [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 5:09 To: general@incubator.apache.org Cc: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org Subject: Wonka, Mika, and Apache Hello guys, To introduce myself: I'm one of the original developers of the Wonka embedded VM, and my company sells both support for Wonka and our own derivative which we call Mika. Recently we made Mika available under the same BSD-style licence as Wonka. My question is whether Apache would be interested in adopting Wonka/Mika as a project, either within Harmony or as an embedded counterpart thereto. Currently ownership of the code is divided between Punch Telematix, who acquired the assets of my former employer Acunia, and my own company. Punch have no interest in the VM beyond the fact that it is an essential component of a product (the CarCube) which they inherited from Acunia. I believe they would have no objection to granting rights to the AF, beyond the sheer effort of doing so. They can probably be persuaded, but first I'd like to know if there is sufficient interest within the AF. Best regards, Chris -- Chris Gray/k/ Embedded Java Solutions BE0503765045 Embedded & Mobile Java, OSGihttp://www.k-embedded-java.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] +32 3 216 0369 - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
great interest Chris -- let's get the wheels moving. Regards, Tim Chris Gray wrote: > Hello guys, > > To introduce myself: I'm one of the original developers of the Wonka embedded > VM, and my company sells both support for Wonka and our own derivative which > we call Mika. Recently we made Mika available under the same BSD-style > licence as Wonka. > > My question is whether Apache would be interested in adopting Wonka/Mika as a > project, either within Harmony or as an embedded counterpart thereto. > Currently ownership of the code is divided between Punch Telematix, who > acquired the assets of my former employer Acunia, and my own company. Punch > have no interest in the VM beyond the fact that it is an essential component > of a product (the CarCube) which they inherited from Acunia. I believe they > would have no objection to granting rights to the AF, beyond the sheer effort > of doing so. They can probably be persuaded, but first I'd like to know if > there is sufficient interest within the AF. > > Best regards, > > Chris > -- Tim Ellison ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) IBM Java technology centre, UK. - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wonka, Mika, and Apache
There certainly is interest in Apache Harmony, as this is very much aligned to what we've already been doing for the past year and a few months. geir On Sep 27, 2006, at 5:09 AM, Chris Gray wrote: Hello guys, To introduce myself: I'm one of the original developers of the Wonka embedded VM, and my company sells both support for Wonka and our own derivative which we call Mika. Recently we made Mika available under the same BSD-style licence as Wonka. My question is whether Apache would be interested in adopting Wonka/ Mika as a project, either within Harmony or as an embedded counterpart thereto. Currently ownership of the code is divided between Punch Telematix, who acquired the assets of my former employer Acunia, and my own company. Punch have no interest in the VM beyond the fact that it is an essential component of a product (the CarCube) which they inherited from Acunia. I believe they would have no objection to granting rights to the AF, beyond the sheer effort of doing so. They can probably be persuaded, but first I'd like to know if there is sufficient interest within the AF. Best regards, Chris -- Chris Gray/k/ Embedded Java Solutions BE0503765045 Embedded & Mobile Java, OSGihttp://www.k-embedded-java.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] +32 3 216 0369 - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Wonka, Mika, and Apache
Hello guys, To introduce myself: I'm one of the original developers of the Wonka embedded VM, and my company sells both support for Wonka and our own derivative which we call Mika. Recently we made Mika available under the same BSD-style licence as Wonka. My question is whether Apache would be interested in adopting Wonka/Mika as a project, either within Harmony or as an embedded counterpart thereto. Currently ownership of the code is divided between Punch Telematix, who acquired the assets of my former employer Acunia, and my own company. Punch have no interest in the VM beyond the fact that it is an essential component of a product (the CarCube) which they inherited from Acunia. I believe they would have no objection to granting rights to the AF, beyond the sheer effort of doing so. They can probably be persuaded, but first I'd like to know if there is sufficient interest within the AF. Best regards, Chris -- Chris Gray/k/ Embedded Java Solutions BE0503765045 Embedded & Mobile Java, OSGihttp://www.k-embedded-java.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] +32 3 216 0369 - Terms of use : http://incubator.apache.org/harmony/mailing.html To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
