Re: [hlds_linux] Is sv_tags event247 broken after the update?
On 07/11/2013 01:14, Bjorn Wielens wrote: seven HUNDRED valve servers? I'm sorry, but I'm with those kinds of numbers I'm going to re-raise my earlier point about valve actively skimming the bulk of the quickplay traffic for themselves and leaving barely anything for communities. Anything for communities to do what? Seems fairly evident that if Valve servers are full then people either clicked quickplay or joined their servers directly. In neither case were the people specifically interested in joining your server or any other community one. Bearing in mind too that Valve run servers around the world. So there won't be hundreds of them competing with your local server. That said I think it was a pity they switched most (all?) of their servers to Halloween maps because (a) it (mostly) sucks and (b) it doesn't leave any Valve servers for people that don't want to play Halloween maps. But that's the only reason. Equally though, you could say they've helped communities fill servers that serve the other maps but you didn't. I've said it before you cannot make your server special or interesting unless you DON'T want quickplay traffic. (I would argue further that you cannot make it special or interesting at all - but that is debatable perhaps whereas for quickplay it's pretty much self-evident given the rules for adding a server to the pool) There's no point otherwise. Quickplay means I want the game Valve wrote without any crap - and, by definition, this makes all the servers the same. If they aren't the same, as sometimes happens, then quickplay sucks. And really, as I've said before, there's no point competing for this pool of players. You're not going to gain anything doing that. If there are more servers than people then you may as well put your time and effort into something else. If you have an existing community then you can run whatever you like. Valve won't take your players. But it makes no sense to call yourself a community if you don't have a full server of regular players that actually want to play on your server. Nor if your full server is just because quickplay has sent you a bunch of people. 24 quickplay players is not a community. -- Dan ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
In the last half year to a year, all my quickplay servers died to almost 0 players on it. I assume its also because of the fast majority of servers being put in to make money. All my NON quickplay servers are pretty full and even more then it used to be. Now there might be a shift. I dont think i will loose players if they add more non quickplay servers since thats a pool of people that dont use quickplay in the first place. 2013/11/7 Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com Agreed. but if the vast majority of players connect through quickplay and it cuts deeply in to server Ad revenue, which seems likely, then admins will be looking elsewhere and those are the logical places to go. - Original Message - From: DontWannaName! ad...@topnotchclan.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Cc: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 8:02:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support A server can be listed in the browser and still be in quickplay... Sent from my iPhone 5 On Nov 6, 2013, at 3:55 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: I am just saying there will be more because servers who were relying only on ads to fund their servers or generate revenue will surely move into those types of servers. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:51:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support There would be regardless if what valve does. Sincerely, Aaron On Nov 6, 2013 6:50 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Yes and now there will be hundreds more jailbreak, freak fortress and trade servers for you to compete with. Good show indeed. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:40:53 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support I wasn't so sure about this, and honestly doesn't affect me because I run trade servers and jailbreak, but it seems fine. If you join the server, you don't have to download any HTML junk and don't have to watch any ads...but if you like the server, save to favorites and reconnect you see whatever the HTML page is, depending on whether or not the client has HTML enabled. Guys, this is a victory for matchmaking clients who just want to play and not get spammed by the servers they join. I like it. Valve, please roll it out in a way that doesn't break the game and people like me are cool with the change #1. Good show! Sincerely, Aaron On Nov 6, 2013 6:30 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: From what I heard ads needed to be watched for X seconds before being paid. Any communities that were reliant on ads being served to quickplay users would have already shut down by now. This new limitation just seems to serve as an annoyance to perfectly legitimate server owners rather than to kill off all ad supported servers. I hope there will be more people who share my views rather than thinking: oh good Valve is going to shut down more of our competition. On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 4:19 PM, N-Gon ngongamedes...@gmail.com wrote: Oddly enough, a handful of communities have been shut down because of the recent changes. This one will affect a few more. Can't say I'm saddened by this since those communities were cancer to TF2. On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: Can you tell us the reason for this change? Is there no other solution rather than removing functionality from the game? The complaint before was forced ads. Servers cannot resend the MOTD to quickplay players anymore so I don't understand why additional restrictions need to be introduced. HTML motds are superior to text motds even only shown at connection. They look better and they allow you to update the page without rebooting the server. Especially when it comes to TF2 players, no one is going to pay attention to an unformatted wall of text that could contain important rules or links to your website. With these new restrictions both the webpage and the text file needs to be maintained. On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 3:53 PM, Fletcher Dunn fletch...@valvesoftware.comwrote: It's something enforced by the client, and is a function of how they connected to that particular server, not any particular server settings. If they connect via the server browser (or command line, etc) then they will show HTML. -Original Message- From:
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
I'll be shutting down ~20 servers around europe due to this change, as there will be no interest for me to spend resources if I can't even put a nice motd for quickplay users. I think we will just see the valve paid servers in quickplay ;) On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Erik-jan Riemers riem...@binkey.nl wrote: In the last half year to a year, all my quickplay servers died to almost 0 players on it. I assume its also because of the fast majority of servers being put in to make money. All my NON quickplay servers are pretty full and even more then it used to be. Now there might be a shift. I dont think i will loose players if they add more non quickplay servers since thats a pool of people that dont use quickplay in the first place. 2013/11/7 Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com Agreed. but if the vast majority of players connect through quickplay and it cuts deeply in to server Ad revenue, which seems likely, then admins will be looking elsewhere and those are the logical places to go. - Original Message - From: DontWannaName! ad...@topnotchclan.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Cc: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 8:02:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support A server can be listed in the browser and still be in quickplay... Sent from my iPhone 5 On Nov 6, 2013, at 3:55 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: I am just saying there will be more because servers who were relying only on ads to fund their servers or generate revenue will surely move into those types of servers. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:51:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support There would be regardless if what valve does. Sincerely, Aaron On Nov 6, 2013 6:50 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Yes and now there will be hundreds more jailbreak, freak fortress and trade servers for you to compete with. Good show indeed. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:40:53 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support I wasn't so sure about this, and honestly doesn't affect me because I run trade servers and jailbreak, but it seems fine. If you join the server, you don't have to download any HTML junk and don't have to watch any ads...but if you like the server, save to favorites and reconnect you see whatever the HTML page is, depending on whether or not the client has HTML enabled. Guys, this is a victory for matchmaking clients who just want to play and not get spammed by the servers they join. I like it. Valve, please roll it out in a way that doesn't break the game and people like me are cool with the change #1. Good show! Sincerely, Aaron On Nov 6, 2013 6:30 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: From what I heard ads needed to be watched for X seconds before being paid. Any communities that were reliant on ads being served to quickplay users would have already shut down by now. This new limitation just seems to serve as an annoyance to perfectly legitimate server owners rather than to kill off all ad supported servers. I hope there will be more people who share my views rather than thinking: oh good Valve is going to shut down more of our competition. On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 4:19 PM, N-Gon ngongamedes...@gmail.com wrote: Oddly enough, a handful of communities have been shut down because of the recent changes. This one will affect a few more. Can't say I'm saddened by this since those communities were cancer to TF2. On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: Can you tell us the reason for this change? Is there no other solution rather than removing functionality from the game? The complaint before was forced ads. Servers cannot resend the MOTD to quickplay players anymore so I don't understand why additional restrictions need to be introduced. HTML motds are superior to text motds even only shown at connection. They look better and they allow you to update the page without rebooting the server. Especially when it comes to TF2 players, no one is going to pay attention to an unformatted wall of text that could contain important rules or links to your website. With these new restrictions both the
Re: [hlds_linux] Is sv_tags event247 broken after the update?
Valve might actually have a big pool of servers around the world so that if crashes occur they get enough feedback automaticly from the servers too.. (besides the ones we send in) 2013/11/7 dan needa...@ntlworld.com On 07/11/2013 01:14, Bjorn Wielens wrote: seven HUNDRED valve servers? I'm sorry, but I'm with those kinds of numbers I'm going to re-raise my earlier point about valve actively skimming the bulk of the quickplay traffic for themselves and leaving barely anything for communities. Anything for communities to do what? Seems fairly evident that if Valve servers are full then people either clicked quickplay or joined their servers directly. In neither case were the people specifically interested in joining your server or any other community one. Bearing in mind too that Valve run servers around the world. So there won't be hundreds of them competing with your local server. That said I think it was a pity they switched most (all?) of their servers to Halloween maps because (a) it (mostly) sucks and (b) it doesn't leave any Valve servers for people that don't want to play Halloween maps. But that's the only reason. Equally though, you could say they've helped communities fill servers that serve the other maps but you didn't. I've said it before you cannot make your server special or interesting unless you DON'T want quickplay traffic. (I would argue further that you cannot make it special or interesting at all - but that is debatable perhaps whereas for quickplay it's pretty much self-evident given the rules for adding a server to the pool) There's no point otherwise. Quickplay means I want the game Valve wrote without any crap - and, by definition, this makes all the servers the same. If they aren't the same, as sometimes happens, then quickplay sucks. And really, as I've said before, there's no point competing for this pool of players. You're not going to gain anything doing that. If there are more servers than people then you may as well put your time and effort into something else. If you have an existing community then you can run whatever you like. Valve won't take your players. But it makes no sense to call yourself a community if you don't have a full server of regular players that actually want to play on your server. Nor if your full server is just because quickplay has sent you a bunch of people. 24 quickplay players is not a community. -- Dan ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Is sv_tags event247 broken after the update?
They should get that anyway as server crash dumps are uploaded to valve automatically via google breakpad. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:46 AM, Erik-jan Riemers riem...@binkey.nl wrote: Valve might actually have a big pool of servers around the world so that if crashes occur they get enough feedback automaticly from the servers too.. (besides the ones we send in) 2013/11/7 dan needa...@ntlworld.com On 07/11/2013 01:14, Bjorn Wielens wrote: seven HUNDRED valve servers? I'm sorry, but I'm with those kinds of numbers I'm going to re-raise my earlier point about valve actively skimming the bulk of the quickplay traffic for themselves and leaving barely anything for communities. Anything for communities to do what? Seems fairly evident that if Valve servers are full then people either clicked quickplay or joined their servers directly. In neither case were the people specifically interested in joining your server or any other community one. Bearing in mind too that Valve run servers around the world. So there won't be hundreds of them competing with your local server. That said I think it was a pity they switched most (all?) of their servers to Halloween maps because (a) it (mostly) sucks and (b) it doesn't leave any Valve servers for people that don't want to play Halloween maps. But that's the only reason. Equally though, you could say they've helped communities fill servers that serve the other maps but you didn't. I've said it before you cannot make your server special or interesting unless you DON'T want quickplay traffic. (I would argue further that you cannot make it special or interesting at all - but that is debatable perhaps whereas for quickplay it's pretty much self-evident given the rules for adding a server to the pool) There's no point otherwise. Quickplay means I want the game Valve wrote without any crap - and, by definition, this makes all the servers the same. If they aren't the same, as sometimes happens, then quickplay sucks. And really, as I've said before, there's no point competing for this pool of players. You're not going to gain anything doing that. If there are more servers than people then you may as well put your time and effort into something else. If you have an existing community then you can run whatever you like. Valve won't take your players. But it makes no sense to call yourself a community if you don't have a full server of regular players that actually want to play on your server. Nor if your full server is just because quickplay has sent you a bunch of people. 24 quickplay players is not a community. -- Dan ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Is sv_tags event247 broken after the update?
Those are not always vanilla, and you cant just ssh or rdp into a community system to check for things (from valve's perspective) 2013/11/7 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com They should get that anyway as server crash dumps are uploaded to valve automatically via google breakpad. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:46 AM, Erik-jan Riemers riem...@binkey.nl wrote: Valve might actually have a big pool of servers around the world so that if crashes occur they get enough feedback automaticly from the servers too.. (besides the ones we send in) 2013/11/7 dan needa...@ntlworld.com On 07/11/2013 01:14, Bjorn Wielens wrote: seven HUNDRED valve servers? I'm sorry, but I'm with those kinds of numbers I'm going to re-raise my earlier point about valve actively skimming the bulk of the quickplay traffic for themselves and leaving barely anything for communities. Anything for communities to do what? Seems fairly evident that if Valve servers are full then people either clicked quickplay or joined their servers directly. In neither case were the people specifically interested in joining your server or any other community one. Bearing in mind too that Valve run servers around the world. So there won't be hundreds of them competing with your local server. That said I think it was a pity they switched most (all?) of their servers to Halloween maps because (a) it (mostly) sucks and (b) it doesn't leave any Valve servers for people that don't want to play Halloween maps. But that's the only reason. Equally though, you could say they've helped communities fill servers that serve the other maps but you didn't. I've said it before you cannot make your server special or interesting unless you DON'T want quickplay traffic. (I would argue further that you cannot make it special or interesting at all - but that is debatable perhaps whereas for quickplay it's pretty much self-evident given the rules for adding a server to the pool) There's no point otherwise. Quickplay means I want the game Valve wrote without any crap - and, by definition, this makes all the servers the same. If they aren't the same, as sometimes happens, then quickplay sucks. And really, as I've said before, there's no point competing for this pool of players. You're not going to gain anything doing that. If there are more servers than people then you may as well put your time and effort into something else. If you have an existing community then you can run whatever you like. Valve won't take your players. But it makes no sense to call yourself a community if you don't have a full server of regular players that actually want to play on your server. Nor if your full server is just because quickplay has sent you a bunch of people. 24 quickplay players is not a community. -- Dan ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Is sv_tags event247 broken after the update?
They said a while back that if there's something like sourcemod in the stack they ignore it entirely. And having their own servers crash doesn't stop them from asking server admins for help/to send in information/dumps. Which is fine, no one likes crashes. But the tons of servers they have are definitely not there to make solving crashes easier. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 10:22 AM, Erik-jan Riemers riem...@binkey.nl wrote: Those are not always vanilla, and you cant just ssh or rdp into a community system to check for things (from valve's perspective) 2013/11/7 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com They should get that anyway as server crash dumps are uploaded to valve automatically via google breakpad. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:46 AM, Erik-jan Riemers riem...@binkey.nl wrote: Valve might actually have a big pool of servers around the world so that if crashes occur they get enough feedback automaticly from the servers too.. (besides the ones we send in) 2013/11/7 dan needa...@ntlworld.com On 07/11/2013 01:14, Bjorn Wielens wrote: seven HUNDRED valve servers? I'm sorry, but I'm with those kinds of numbers I'm going to re-raise my earlier point about valve actively skimming the bulk of the quickplay traffic for themselves and leaving barely anything for communities. Anything for communities to do what? Seems fairly evident that if Valve servers are full then people either clicked quickplay or joined their servers directly. In neither case were the people specifically interested in joining your server or any other community one. Bearing in mind too that Valve run servers around the world. So there won't be hundreds of them competing with your local server. That said I think it was a pity they switched most (all?) of their servers to Halloween maps because (a) it (mostly) sucks and (b) it doesn't leave any Valve servers for people that don't want to play Halloween maps. But that's the only reason. Equally though, you could say they've helped communities fill servers that serve the other maps but you didn't. I've said it before you cannot make your server special or interesting unless you DON'T want quickplay traffic. (I would argue further that you cannot make it special or interesting at all - but that is debatable perhaps whereas for quickplay it's pretty much self-evident given the rules for adding a server to the pool) There's no point otherwise. Quickplay means I want the game Valve wrote without any crap - and, by definition, this makes all the servers the same. If they aren't the same, as sometimes happens, then quickplay sucks. And really, as I've said before, there's no point competing for this pool of players. You're not going to gain anything doing that. If there are more servers than people then you may as well put your time and effort into something else. If you have an existing community then you can run whatever you like. Valve won't take your players. But it makes no sense to call yourself a community if you don't have a full server of regular players that actually want to play on your server. Nor if your full server is just because quickplay has sent you a bunch of people. 24 quickplay players is not a community. -- Dan ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Is sv_tags event247 broken after the update?
While your argument is sound for the changes made *today*, it is taking today's changes entirely out of context with the long history of communities getting the shaft out of TF2 in general. For a long while, the *largest* of communities were held together with bubblegum, duct tape, and fake client counts that kept their servers full pretty much 24x7. Valve said to stop it, so most of us did, and our servers died overnight. Servers that had been full for over 12 hours a day, 7 days a week, died. They then announced the quickplay system, and that fixed it, but it was flawed because people kept getting dumped into heavily modded, trolly servers. Some communities run lightly modded servers that enhance gameplay through minimalist mod systems rather than disgusting, overbearing mods, but Valve made the change so that only vanilla servers get quickplay traffic, killing our servers that we had just filled again. We adapted and unmodded a good portion of our machines specifically to have vanilla quickplay traffic, which, through our tasteful, non-ad-filled HTML MOTD, added members at a semi-regular interval to our community, which had shrunk considerably. We followed every rule to the letter, dotted our i's and crossed our t's, but quickplay traffic soon dwindled to nothing because of the giant mass of people putting up servers with fake playercounts and forced ads in order to play. Rather than do anything to try and fix the problem, Valve has just fixed it the same way they always do. Let's screw it up for everyone. Let's have 700+ of our own servers up to take a nice chunk of traffic to begin with, and make it so that every server you join looks exactly the same. We no longer have any way to make our community either noticeable through small non-gameplay-changing member perks like we had originally, we can no longer display our colors through HTML MOTDs, we basically have *ZERO* way of attracting any attention to ourselves to possibly get an occasional member out of quickplay. The point is not that they've done this just now and why are you mad about it it's not a big change, the point is that the cumulative changes to the entire TF2 system over the past 2 years has done some extremely detrimental things to communities in general, and it's getting to the point where TF2 is going to be impossible to maintain, and when it does, there will be too many players that can't find a server, and when they can't find a server, they'll just leave rather than trying to play, and THEN who's gonna buy hats and keys? On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:45 AM, dan needa...@ntlworld.com wrote: On 07/11/2013 01:14, Bjorn Wielens wrote: seven HUNDRED valve servers? I'm sorry, but I'm with those kinds of numbers I'm going to re-raise my earlier point about valve actively skimming the bulk of the quickplay traffic for themselves and leaving barely anything for communities. Anything for communities to do what? Seems fairly evident that if Valve servers are full then people either clicked quickplay or joined their servers directly. In neither case were the people specifically interested in joining your server or any other community one. Bearing in mind too that Valve run servers around the world. So there won't be hundreds of them competing with your local server. That said I think it was a pity they switched most (all?) of their servers to Halloween maps because (a) it (mostly) sucks and (b) it doesn't leave any Valve servers for people that don't want to play Halloween maps. But that's the only reason. Equally though, you could say they've helped communities fill servers that serve the other maps but you didn't. I've said it before you cannot make your server special or interesting unless you DON'T want quickplay traffic. (I would argue further that you cannot make it special or interesting at all - but that is debatable perhaps whereas for quickplay it's pretty much self-evident given the rules for adding a server to the pool) There's no point otherwise. Quickplay means I want the game Valve wrote without any crap - and, by definition, this makes all the servers the same. If they aren't the same, as sometimes happens, then quickplay sucks. And really, as I've said before, there's no point competing for this pool of players. You're not going to gain anything doing that. If there are more servers than people then you may as well put your time and effort into something else. If you have an existing community then you can run whatever you like. Valve won't take your players. But it makes no sense to call yourself a community if you don't have a full server of regular players that actually want to play on your server. Nor if your full server is just because quickplay has sent you a bunch of people. 24 quickplay players is not a community. -- Dan ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please
Re: [hlds_linux] Is sv_tags event247 broken after the update?
Well 4 hightower servers, all empty at the moment. I know where they are.. and i only have sourcemod to do admin work like ban cheaters and such.. cant get any more vanilla ... and i know 1 server has a high rating, but even that doesn't help. 2013/11/7 Rick Dunn r...@vaultf4.com While your argument is sound for the changes made *today*, it is taking today's changes entirely out of context with the long history of communities getting the shaft out of TF2 in general. For a long while, the *largest* of communities were held together with bubblegum, duct tape, and fake client counts that kept their servers full pretty much 24x7. Valve said to stop it, so most of us did, and our servers died overnight. Servers that had been full for over 12 hours a day, 7 days a week, died. They then announced the quickplay system, and that fixed it, but it was flawed because people kept getting dumped into heavily modded, trolly servers. Some communities run lightly modded servers that enhance gameplay through minimalist mod systems rather than disgusting, overbearing mods, but Valve made the change so that only vanilla servers get quickplay traffic, killing our servers that we had just filled again. We adapted and unmodded a good portion of our machines specifically to have vanilla quickplay traffic, which, through our tasteful, non-ad-filled HTML MOTD, added members at a semi-regular interval to our community, which had shrunk considerably. We followed every rule to the letter, dotted our i's and crossed our t's, but quickplay traffic soon dwindled to nothing because of the giant mass of people putting up servers with fake playercounts and forced ads in order to play. Rather than do anything to try and fix the problem, Valve has just fixed it the same way they always do. Let's screw it up for everyone. Let's have 700+ of our own servers up to take a nice chunk of traffic to begin with, and make it so that every server you join looks exactly the same. We no longer have any way to make our community either noticeable through small non-gameplay-changing member perks like we had originally, we can no longer display our colors through HTML MOTDs, we basically have *ZERO* way of attracting any attention to ourselves to possibly get an occasional member out of quickplay. The point is not that they've done this just now and why are you mad about it it's not a big change, the point is that the cumulative changes to the entire TF2 system over the past 2 years has done some extremely detrimental things to communities in general, and it's getting to the point where TF2 is going to be impossible to maintain, and when it does, there will be too many players that can't find a server, and when they can't find a server, they'll just leave rather than trying to play, and THEN who's gonna buy hats and keys? On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:45 AM, dan needa...@ntlworld.com wrote: On 07/11/2013 01:14, Bjorn Wielens wrote: seven HUNDRED valve servers? I'm sorry, but I'm with those kinds of numbers I'm going to re-raise my earlier point about valve actively skimming the bulk of the quickplay traffic for themselves and leaving barely anything for communities. Anything for communities to do what? Seems fairly evident that if Valve servers are full then people either clicked quickplay or joined their servers directly. In neither case were the people specifically interested in joining your server or any other community one. Bearing in mind too that Valve run servers around the world. So there won't be hundreds of them competing with your local server. That said I think it was a pity they switched most (all?) of their servers to Halloween maps because (a) it (mostly) sucks and (b) it doesn't leave any Valve servers for people that don't want to play Halloween maps. But that's the only reason. Equally though, you could say they've helped communities fill servers that serve the other maps but you didn't. I've said it before you cannot make your server special or interesting unless you DON'T want quickplay traffic. (I would argue further that you cannot make it special or interesting at all - but that is debatable perhaps whereas for quickplay it's pretty much self-evident given the rules for adding a server to the pool) There's no point otherwise. Quickplay means I want the game Valve wrote without any crap - and, by definition, this makes all the servers the same. If they aren't the same, as sometimes happens, then quickplay sucks. And really, as I've said before, there's no point competing for this pool of players. You're not going to gain anything doing that. If there are more servers than people then you may as well put your time and effort into something else. If you have an existing community then you can run whatever you like. Valve won't take your players. But it makes no sense to call yourself a
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
Random idea: Could we get a way to send just one image (no HTML, no scripts) in place of the text motd? This could let server ops still show a decent looking motd without any sort of foolery. Could they still put an ad there? Sure. But it won't be a flash player, it would have to be (mostly) static. Thoughts? On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:27 AM, Marco Padovan e...@evcz.tk wrote: I'll be shutting down ~20 servers around europe due to this change, as there will be no interest for me to spend resources if I can't even put a nice motd for quickplay users. I think we will just see the valve paid servers in quickplay ;) On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Erik-jan Riemers riem...@binkey.nl wrote: In the last half year to a year, all my quickplay servers died to almost 0 players on it. I assume its also because of the fast majority of servers being put in to make money. All my NON quickplay servers are pretty full and even more then it used to be. Now there might be a shift. I dont think i will loose players if they add more non quickplay servers since thats a pool of people that dont use quickplay in the first place. 2013/11/7 Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com Agreed. but if the vast majority of players connect through quickplay and it cuts deeply in to server Ad revenue, which seems likely, then admins will be looking elsewhere and those are the logical places to go. - Original Message - From: DontWannaName! ad...@topnotchclan.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Cc: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 8:02:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support A server can be listed in the browser and still be in quickplay... Sent from my iPhone 5 On Nov 6, 2013, at 3:55 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: I am just saying there will be more because servers who were relying only on ads to fund their servers or generate revenue will surely move into those types of servers. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:51:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support There would be regardless if what valve does. Sincerely, Aaron On Nov 6, 2013 6:50 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Yes and now there will be hundreds more jailbreak, freak fortress and trade servers for you to compete with. Good show indeed. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:40:53 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support I wasn't so sure about this, and honestly doesn't affect me because I run trade servers and jailbreak, but it seems fine. If you join the server, you don't have to download any HTML junk and don't have to watch any ads...but if you like the server, save to favorites and reconnect you see whatever the HTML page is, depending on whether or not the client has HTML enabled. Guys, this is a victory for matchmaking clients who just want to play and not get spammed by the servers they join. I like it. Valve, please roll it out in a way that doesn't break the game and people like me are cool with the change #1. Good show! Sincerely, Aaron On Nov 6, 2013 6:30 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: From what I heard ads needed to be watched for X seconds before being paid. Any communities that were reliant on ads being served to quickplay users would have already shut down by now. This new limitation just seems to serve as an annoyance to perfectly legitimate server owners rather than to kill off all ad supported servers. I hope there will be more people who share my views rather than thinking: oh good Valve is going to shut down more of our competition. On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 4:19 PM, N-Gon ngongamedes...@gmail.com wrote: Oddly enough, a handful of communities have been shut down because of the recent changes. This one will affect a few more. Can't say I'm saddened by this since those communities were cancer to TF2. On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: Can you tell us the reason for this change? Is there no other solution rather than removing functionality from the game? The complaint before was forced ads. Servers cannot resend
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
There will in fact be a huge decline in servers this month. Valve and the rest of the community can finally understand why ads play a substantial role in the community. In my opinion, i think it would have been smarter to contact ad networks and ask them to not support those bad servers. But like Dr McKay said on Reddit, if it's not ads then it will be another signs/nighteam popping up. Those serves will give new players a bad perspective on the game. Regardless, I think Valve took the wrong approach to this issue. It's the sense of community that has kept the game alive for all of us. This isn't Dota; not something you play for skill but rather fun. Communities keep that spirit alive and you'll see many communities die because of this update. On the other hand, communities like FirePowered have a big enough community to pay the bills with just donations. But not everyone has that big of a community and ads were the only way to pay the bills. Groups like Lotus and Skial shell out at least a thousand bucks each month for server bills. There is no way they will continue just off donations. I think it's wrong to punish everyone for the mistake of some ad networks allowing the abuse of their network. Pinion, MOTDgd, and myself all force the 20 minute re-review rule. The issue isn't the video ads but rather the ads that spam in background and pop up pages in middle of game. This is in fact a pressing topic but I think it's only fair to both communities and ad networks to not carry the burden of those who abuse the ad system. It would have been smarter to speak to the community than to roll out a game changing update. I'm just sharing my opinion, you are entitled to yours. Regards, Ab On Nov 7, 2013 5:28 AM, Marco Padovan e...@evcz.tk wrote: I'll be shutting down ~20 servers around europe due to this change, as there will be no interest for me to spend resources if I can't even put a nice motd for quickplay users. I think we will just see the valve paid servers in quickplay ;) On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Erik-jan Riemers riem...@binkey.nl wrote: In the last half year to a year, all my quickplay servers died to almost 0 players on it. I assume its also because of the fast majority of servers being put in to make money. All my NON quickplay servers are pretty full and even more then it used to be. Now there might be a shift. I dont think i will loose players if they add more non quickplay servers since thats a pool of people that dont use quickplay in the first place. 2013/11/7 Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com Agreed. but if the vast majority of players connect through quickplay and it cuts deeply in to server Ad revenue, which seems likely, then admins will be looking elsewhere and those are the logical places to go. - Original Message - From: DontWannaName! ad...@topnotchclan.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Cc: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 8:02:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support A server can be listed in the browser and still be in quickplay... Sent from my iPhone 5 On Nov 6, 2013, at 3:55 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: I am just saying there will be more because servers who were relying only on ads to fund their servers or generate revenue will surely move into those types of servers. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:51:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support There would be regardless if what valve does. Sincerely, Aaron On Nov 6, 2013 6:50 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Yes and now there will be hundreds more jailbreak, freak fortress and trade servers for you to compete with. Good show indeed. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:40:53 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support I wasn't so sure about this, and honestly doesn't affect me because I run trade servers and jailbreak, but it seems fine. If you join the server, you don't have to download any HTML junk and don't have to watch any ads...but if you like the server, save to favorites and reconnect you see whatever the HTML page is, depending on whether or not the client has HTML enabled. Guys, this is a victory for matchmaking clients who just want to play and not get spammed by the servers they
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
Think it would have been better if they had made it default for quickplay to really close the MOTD, without any in background running of a site that happens after. Or a addition of a button, that they have a close button to blank the page and exit the MOTD and not been able to re-open it for 20 min, and a background button to keep it in background, (for internet radio etc). From: Marco Padovan e...@evcz.tk To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Thursday, 7 November 2013, 11:27 Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support I'll be shutting down ~20 servers around europe due to this change, as there will be no interest for me to spend resources if I can't even put a nice motd for quickplay users. I think we will just see the valve paid servers in quickplay ;) On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Erik-jan Riemers riem...@binkey.nl wrote: In the last half year to a year, all my quickplay servers died to almost 0 players on it. I assume its also because of the fast majority of servers being put in to make money. All my NON quickplay servers are pretty full and even more then it used to be. Now there might be a shift. I dont think i will loose players if they add more non quickplay servers since thats a pool of people that dont use quickplay in the first place. 2013/11/7 Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com Agreed. but if the vast majority of players connect through quickplay and it cuts deeply in to server Ad revenue, which seems likely, then admins will be looking elsewhere and those are the logical places to go. - Original Message - From: DontWannaName! ad...@topnotchclan.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Cc: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 8:02:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support A server can be listed in the browser and still be in quickplay... Sent from my iPhone 5 On Nov 6, 2013, at 3:55 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: I am just saying there will be more because servers who were relying only on ads to fund their servers or generate revenue will surely move into those types of servers. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:51:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support There would be regardless if what valve does. Sincerely, Aaron On Nov 6, 2013 6:50 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Yes and now there will be hundreds more jailbreak, freak fortress and trade servers for you to compete with. Good show indeed. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:40:53 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support I wasn't so sure about this, and honestly doesn't affect me because I run trade servers and jailbreak, but it seems fine. If you join the server, you don't have to download any HTML junk and don't have to watch any ads...but if you like the server, save to favorites and reconnect you see whatever the HTML page is, depending on whether or not the client has HTML enabled. Guys, this is a victory for matchmaking clients who just want to play and not get spammed by the servers they join. I like it. Valve, please roll it out in a way that doesn't break the game and people like me are cool with the change #1. Good show! Sincerely, Aaron On Nov 6, 2013 6:30 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: From what I heard ads needed to be watched for X seconds before being paid. Any communities that were reliant on ads being served to quickplay users would have already shut down by now. This new limitation just seems to serve as an annoyance to perfectly legitimate server owners rather than to kill off all ad supported servers. I hope there will be more people who share my views rather than thinking: oh good Valve is going to shut down more of our competition. On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 4:19 PM, N-Gon ngongamedes...@gmail.com wrote: Oddly enough, a handful of communities have been shut down because of the recent changes. This one will affect a few more. Can't say I'm saddened by this since those communities were cancer to TF2. On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: Can you tell us the reason for this change? Is there no
Re: [hlds_linux] [hlds] Mandatory TF2 update released
It would be a lot nicer if (item) spells were permanent, but only visible with the appropriate holiday settings. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 12:52 AM, N-Gon ngongamedes...@gmail.com wrote: - Fixed some items and spell attributes showing incorrect expiration times I am not happy about this On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 8:40 PM, Kyle Sanderson kyle.l...@gmail.com wrote: Do you guys have an ETA on the next SteamWorks update? Ban Evasion a pretty big issue for communities. Thanks, Kyle. ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T - Original Message - From: ElitePowered . elitepowe...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Thursday, November 7, 2013 5:45:39 AM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support There will in fact be a huge decline in servers this month. Valve and the rest of the community can finally understand why ads play a substantial role in the community. In my opinion, i think it would have been smarter to contact ad networks and ask them to not support those bad servers. But like Dr McKay said on Reddit, if it's not ads then it will be another signs/nighteam popping up. Those serves will give new players a bad perspective on the game. Regardless, I think Valve took the wrong approach to this issue. It's the sense of community that has kept the game alive for all of us. This isn't Dota; not something you play for skill but rather fun. Communities keep that spirit alive and you'll see many communities die because of this update. On the other hand, communities like FirePowered have a big enough community to pay the bills with just donations. But not everyone has that big of a community and ads were the only way to pay the bills. Groups like Lotus and Skial shell out at least a thousand bucks each month for server bills. There is no way they will continue just off donations. I think it's wrong to punish everyone for the mistake of some ad networks allowing the abuse of their network. Pinion, MOTDgd, and myself all force the 20 minute re-review rule. The issue isn't the video ads but rather the ads that spam in background and pop up pages in middle of game. This is in fact a pressing topic but I think it's only fair to both communities and ad networks to not carry the burden of those who abuse the ad system. It would have been smarter to speak to the community than to roll out a game changing update. I'm just sharing my opinion, you are entitled to yours. Regards, Ab On Nov 7, 2013 5:28 AM, Marco Padovan e...@evcz.tk wrote: I'll be shutting down ~20 servers around europe due to this change, as there will be no interest for me to spend resources if I can't even put a nice motd for quickplay users. I think we will just see the valve paid servers in quickplay ;) On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Erik-jan Riemers riem...@binkey.nl wrote: In the last half year to a year, all my quickplay servers died to almost 0 players on it. I assume its also because of the fast majority of servers being put in to make money. All my NON quickplay servers are pretty full and even more then it used to be. Now there might be a shift. I dont think i will loose players if they add more non quickplay servers since thats a pool of people that dont use quickplay in the first place. 2013/11/7 Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com Agreed. but if the vast majority of players connect through quickplay and it cuts deeply in to server Ad revenue, which seems likely, then admins will be looking elsewhere and those are the logical places to go. - Original Message - From: DontWannaName! ad...@topnotchclan.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Cc: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 8:02:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support A server can be listed in the browser and still be in quickplay... Sent from my iPhone 5 On Nov 6, 2013, at 3:55 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: I am just saying there will be more because servers who were relying only on ads to fund their servers or generate revenue will surely move into those types of servers. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:51:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support There would be regardless if what valve does. Sincerely, Aaron On Nov 6, 2013 6:50 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Yes and now there will be hundreds more jailbreak, freak fortress and trade servers for you to compete with. Good show indeed. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
Fun fact he is tagged as a Scammer: http://steamrep.com/profiles/76561198038128826 -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] Im Auftrag von Todd Pettit Gesendet: Donnerstag, 07. November 2013 21:26 An: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list Betreff: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T - Original Message - From: ElitePowered . elitepowe...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Thursday, November 7, 2013 5:45:39 AM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support There will in fact be a huge decline in servers this month. Valve and the rest of the community can finally understand why ads play a substantial role in the community. In my opinion, i think it would have been smarter to contact ad networks and ask them to not support those bad servers. But like Dr McKay said on Reddit, if it's not ads then it will be another signs/nighteam popping up. Those serves will give new players a bad perspective on the game. Regardless, I think Valve took the wrong approach to this issue. It's the sense of community that has kept the game alive for all of us. This isn't Dota; not something you play for skill but rather fun. Communities keep that spirit alive and you'll see many communities die because of this update. On the other hand, communities like FirePowered have a big enough community to pay the bills with just donations. But not everyone has that big of a community and ads were the only way to pay the bills. Groups like Lotus and Skial shell out at least a thousand bucks each month for server bills. There is no way they will continue just off donations. I think it's wrong to punish everyone for the mistake of some ad networks allowing the abuse of their network. Pinion, MOTDgd, and myself all force the 20 minute re-review rule. The issue isn't the video ads but rather the ads that spam in background and pop up pages in middle of game. This is in fact a pressing topic but I think it's only fair to both communities and ad networks to not carry the burden of those who abuse the ad system. It would have been smarter to speak to the community than to roll out a game changing update. I'm just sharing my opinion, you are entitled to yours. Regards, Ab On Nov 7, 2013 5:28 AM, Marco Padovan e...@evcz.tk wrote: I'll be shutting down ~20 servers around europe due to this change, as there will be no interest for me to spend resources if I can't even put a nice motd for quickplay users. I think we will just see the valve paid servers in quickplay ;) On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Erik-jan Riemers riem...@binkey.nl wrote: In the last half year to a year, all my quickplay servers died to almost 0 players on it. I assume its also because of the fast majority of servers being put in to make money. All my NON quickplay servers are pretty full and even more then it used to be. Now there might be a shift. I dont think i will loose players if they add more non quickplay servers since thats a pool of people that dont use quickplay in the first place. 2013/11/7 Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com Agreed. but if the vast majority of players connect through quickplay and it cuts deeply in to server Ad revenue, which seems likely, then admins will be looking elsewhere and those are the logical places to go. - Original Message - From: DontWannaName! ad...@topnotchclan.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Cc: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 8:02:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support A server can be listed in the browser and still be in quickplay... Sent from my iPhone 5 On Nov 6, 2013, at 3:55 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: I am just saying there will be more because servers who were relying only on ads to fund their servers or generate revenue will surely move into those types of servers. - Original Message - From: Aaron Thompson rmesc...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:51:21 PM Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support There would be regardless if what valve does.
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
Unfortunately this will veer even more off-topic, probably, but will Valve ever take action against servers running with gameplay-altering mods remaining in QuickPlay? Preventing HTML MOTDs is obviously an action to make the QuickPlay experience better for players, but it still seems odd that more vanilla servers are disqualified while these kinds of servers remain in because they don't have to advertise tags for their mods, all while Valve wants a standard QuickPlay experience (or so I'm presuming). On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.comwrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux -- thesupremecommander (Steamhttp://steamcommunity.com/id/thesupremecommander ) ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
http://motdgd.com/terms-of-service/ http://ads.elitepowered.com/?page_id=176 Copying another company's ToS and modifying it very slightly isn't very respectable business practice either. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.comwrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
good point. I still in a split on the background running of the page, on one side the bp viewers, radio etc are good but the MOTD background running of advertorials by servers is a mess. From: Valentin G. nextra...@gmail.com To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com Sent: Thursday, 7 November 2013, 0:22 Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support about:blank is no longer valid? On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 12:13 AM, Fletcher Dunn fletch...@valvesoftware.comwrote: That's correct; #2 is a Source engine change. -Original Message- From: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Kyle Sanderson Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2013 3:09 PM To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support Does the latter impact all Source 2k7 games? Thanks, Kyle. On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 4:03 PM, Fletcher Dunn fletch...@valvesoftware.comwrote: We're making two changes to TF HTML MOTD support that server operators should be aware of: 1.) HTML MOTD's will no longer be shown by clients that connect via quickplay. Those clients will show the plaintext message instead. (The file identified by the convar motdfile_text, which defaults to motd_text.txt.) 2.) When sending a URL to the info panel by name, the URL must begin with 'http://' or 'https://'. Note that this change does not affect putting a URL in motd.txt directly, which has always required a protocol prefix in order for the file contents to be interpreted as a URL. ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
There is no point in all this random speculation until Valve tells us why the MOTD was crippled even more. - Is it to stop reloading ads every second in the background? - Is it a step towards removing all ads? - Is this a permanent change, or is it just a quick hack that will it be replaced with a more appropriate solution? Without knowing the real reason it is pointless to keep arguing about how quickplay this or ads vs donations that. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Daniel Barreiro smelly.feet.you.h...@gmail.com wrote: http://motdgd.com/terms-of-service/ http://ads.elitepowered.com/?page_id=176 Copying another company's ToS and modifying it very slightly isn't very respectable business practice either. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
Even without an official statement, it's fairly safe to say that this change was directed toward stopping servers that (a) manipulate the Quickplay system to send themselves unfair amounts of traffic for ad hits, and (b) continually reload ads in the background of clients that join. Dr. McKay www.doctormckay.com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:54 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.comwrote: There is no point in all this random speculation until Valve tells us why the MOTD was crippled even more. - Is it to stop reloading ads every second in the background? - Is it a step towards removing all ads? - Is this a permanent change, or is it just a quick hack that will it be replaced with a more appropriate solution? Without knowing the real reason it is pointless to keep arguing about how quickplay this or ads vs donations that. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Daniel Barreiro smelly.feet.you.h...@gmail.com wrote: http://motdgd.com/terms-of-service/ http://ads.elitepowered.com/?page_id=176 Copying another company's ToS and modifying it very slightly isn't very respectable business practice either. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
Valve, please add an advertisement slot for banner ads in your games while joining servers. I've implemented this in a Sourcemod I've been working on and it seems to be working quite well. Basically if a server has a sv_advertisment_id set it will look up that ID in a mysql database and associate any ad clicks in game to that id. When you join a server, while you're waiting for it to connect (or maps to download, etc) you will see a banner ad while you wait. If the server doesn't have an advertisment_id setup than the game creator will get the click and view. Users have the ability to support the mod and server owners by showing non intrusive advertisements as a setting when they first start up the game. It can be changed in the settings menu at any time. This will give VALVE more money and also give server operators more cash too. Win win. Just an idea... On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:54 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.comwrote: There is no point in all this random speculation until Valve tells us why the MOTD was crippled even more. - Is it to stop reloading ads every second in the background? - Is it a step towards removing all ads? - Is this a permanent change, or is it just a quick hack that will it be replaced with a more appropriate solution? Without knowing the real reason it is pointless to keep arguing about how quickplay this or ads vs donations that. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Daniel Barreiro smelly.feet.you.h...@gmail.com wrote: http://motdgd.com/terms-of-service/ http://ads.elitepowered.com/?page_id=176 Copying another company's ToS and modifying it very slightly isn't very respectable business practice either. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
I don't see how that is safe to say. If it was meant to stop people from using fake players, it won't stop. People were using fake players to get donation money before ads were even a thing. If it was to stop continually reloading ads, this is an extremely blunt and roundabout method. I have a hard time believing Valve would chose to save a few minutes choosing the worst but easiest option. Does everyone here really prefer Valve to kill off a little competition rather than trying to get features back? Whatever happened to the people who cared about their radio/bp/rules plugins? On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 2:57 PM, Doctor McKay mc...@doctormckay.com wrote: Even without an official statement, it's fairly safe to say that this change was directed toward stopping servers that (a) manipulate the Quickplay system to send themselves unfair amounts of traffic for ad hits, and (b) continually reload ads in the background of clients that join. Dr. McKay www.doctormckay.com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:54 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: There is no point in all this random speculation until Valve tells us why the MOTD was crippled even more. - Is it to stop reloading ads every second in the background? - Is it a step towards removing all ads? - Is this a permanent change, or is it just a quick hack that will it be replaced with a more appropriate solution? Without knowing the real reason it is pointless to keep arguing about how quickplay this or ads vs donations that. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Daniel Barreiro smelly.feet.you.h...@gmail.com wrote: http://motdgd.com/terms-of-service/ http://ads.elitepowered.com/?page_id=176 Copying another company's ToS and modifying it very slightly isn't very respectable business practice either. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
I’d wager that it’s to stop people obnoxiously abusing the MOTD and Valve’s own customers, and may be re-evaluated at some future time. Remember that users aren’t just your server’s clients, but they’re Valve’s customers. If you abuse the crap out of hosting, you make Valve look bad too. On 8 Nov 2013, at 9:54 am, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: There is no point in all this random speculation until Valve tells us why the MOTD was crippled even more. - Is it to stop reloading ads every second in the background? - Is it a step towards removing all ads? - Is this a permanent change, or is it just a quick hack that will it be replaced with a more appropriate solution? Without knowing the real reason it is pointless to keep arguing about how quickplay this or ads vs donations that. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Daniel Barreiro smelly.feet.you.h...@gmail.com wrote: http://motdgd.com/terms-of-service/ http://ads.elitepowered.com/?page_id=176 Copying another company's ToS and modifying it very slightly isn't very respectable business practice either. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
It's not a bad idea, but since the Source engine doesn't respond to any clicks while loading the level, users would only have a short window in which they could click the banner. Dr. McKay www.doctormckay.com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 6:02 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.comwrote: Valve, please add an advertisement slot for banner ads in your games while joining servers. I've implemented this in a Sourcemod I've been working on and it seems to be working quite well. Basically if a server has a sv_advertisment_id set it will look up that ID in a mysql database and associate any ad clicks in game to that id. When you join a server, while you're waiting for it to connect (or maps to download, etc) you will see a banner ad while you wait. If the server doesn't have an advertisment_id setup than the game creator will get the click and view. Users have the ability to support the mod and server owners by showing non intrusive advertisements as a setting when they first start up the game. It can be changed in the settings menu at any time. This will give VALVE more money and also give server operators more cash too. Win win. Just an idea... On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:54 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: There is no point in all this random speculation until Valve tells us why the MOTD was crippled even more. - Is it to stop reloading ads every second in the background? - Is it a step towards removing all ads? - Is this a permanent change, or is it just a quick hack that will it be replaced with a more appropriate solution? Without knowing the real reason it is pointless to keep arguing about how quickplay this or ads vs donations that. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Daniel Barreiro smelly.feet.you.h...@gmail.com wrote: http://motdgd.com/terms-of-service/ http://ads.elitepowered.com/?page_id=176 Copying another company's ToS and modifying it very slightly isn't very respectable business practice either. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
Plus the idea would have to be usable by other advertising networks should they wish to use that space. I doubt however that such an idea will be used. Infact I'll be surprised if Valve takes onboard anything what we say here unfortunately. Still, it doesn't hurt to voice our thoughts though :P. On 7 November 2013 23:32, Doctor McKay mc...@doctormckay.com wrote: It's not a bad idea, but since the Source engine doesn't respond to any clicks while loading the level, users would only have a short window in which they could click the banner. Dr. McKay www.doctormckay.com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 6:02 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Valve, please add an advertisement slot for banner ads in your games while joining servers. I've implemented this in a Sourcemod I've been working on and it seems to be working quite well. Basically if a server has a sv_advertisment_id set it will look up that ID in a mysql database and associate any ad clicks in game to that id. When you join a server, while you're waiting for it to connect (or maps to download, etc) you will see a banner ad while you wait. If the server doesn't have an advertisment_id setup than the game creator will get the click and view. Users have the ability to support the mod and server owners by showing non intrusive advertisements as a setting when they first start up the game. It can be changed in the settings menu at any time. This will give VALVE more money and also give server operators more cash too. Win win. Just an idea... On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:54 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: There is no point in all this random speculation until Valve tells us why the MOTD was crippled even more. - Is it to stop reloading ads every second in the background? - Is it a step towards removing all ads? - Is this a permanent change, or is it just a quick hack that will it be replaced with a more appropriate solution? Without knowing the real reason it is pointless to keep arguing about how quickplay this or ads vs donations that. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Daniel Barreiro smelly.feet.you.h...@gmail.com wrote: http://motdgd.com/terms-of-service/ http://ads.elitepowered.com/?page_id=176 Copying another company's ToS and modifying it very slightly isn't very respectable business practice either. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit:
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
TF2 is a free video games that makes money off it's hats and such. Other than giving people the ability to make money off their game (outside of the marketplace), why would anyone at Valve consider adding a banner feature? Why would any user of a free video game want to stare at some ad (that does not help in keeping said video game free), when there are thousands of servers that are running fine without shotgunning ads and videos at their users? On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:48 PM, Paul ubyu@gmail.com wrote: Plus the idea would have to be usable by other advertising networks should they wish to use that space. I doubt however that such an idea will be used. Infact I'll be surprised if Valve takes onboard anything what we say here unfortunately. Still, it doesn't hurt to voice our thoughts though :P. On 7 November 2013 23:32, Doctor McKay mc...@doctormckay.com wrote: It's not a bad idea, but since the Source engine doesn't respond to any clicks while loading the level, users would only have a short window in which they could click the banner. Dr. McKay www.doctormckay.com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 6:02 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Valve, please add an advertisement slot for banner ads in your games while joining servers. I've implemented this in a Sourcemod I've been working on and it seems to be working quite well. Basically if a server has a sv_advertisment_id set it will look up that ID in a mysql database and associate any ad clicks in game to that id. When you join a server, while you're waiting for it to connect (or maps to download, etc) you will see a banner ad while you wait. If the server doesn't have an advertisment_id setup than the game creator will get the click and view. Users have the ability to support the mod and server owners by showing non intrusive advertisements as a setting when they first start up the game. It can be changed in the settings menu at any time. This will give VALVE more money and also give server operators more cash too. Win win. Just an idea... On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:54 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: There is no point in all this random speculation until Valve tells us why the MOTD was crippled even more. - Is it to stop reloading ads every second in the background? - Is it a step towards removing all ads? - Is this a permanent change, or is it just a quick hack that will it be replaced with a more appropriate solution? Without knowing the real reason it is pointless to keep arguing about how quickplay this or ads vs donations that. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Daniel Barreiro smelly.feet.you.h...@gmail.com wrote: http://motdgd.com/terms-of-service/ http://ads.elitepowered.com/?page_id=176 Copying another company's ToS and modifying it very slightly isn't very respectable business practice either. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit:
Re: [hlds_linux] An open letter to Valve about MOTDs
IMH(f)O, variety is a big deal. Different server operators, with different tastes, results in different communities, to suit different players tastes. However, some players only like to play stock maps and deal with a pre-defined world-view of what is possible/expected in the behaviour game. QuickPlay helps those players/noobs/whatever find what they want. So, I definately see the value in QuickPlay. I just wish there was more of an equal footing between QuickPlay and non-QuickPlay in the interface. Maybe there should be two equal-size / equally-marketed buttons - Find QuickPlay Game and Find Customized Game or something like that. From a playing perspective, I think servers the enforce something that the player can not close (and have the audio stop when it closes) is a very bad thing. I think the MOTD changes aren't targeting advertising/donation schilling necessarily - so much as that WTF? I can't close this shiz and start playing right now? effect. On a side note, if you are paying $30 for a server that can only host a single TF2 dedicated server instance - you are paying too much! I am using a VPS provider and paying that much - but able to host multiple instances of TF2 (32-player), CS:S and several GoldSrc stufff. Contrary to what I expected, my VPS is working better than any normal dedicated I have ever rented. I also found that VPS's hosted on Virtuozzo or OpenVZ perform better than KVM ones (even with specific resources dedicated to the KVM machine) - again, the opposite of what I expected. ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
I wasn't the one who suggested the idea in the first place, I just merely commented on adding something further to that idea if it were ever to be considered, which I doubt anyway. Please direct your questions to the original person who had the idea of this space. On 7 November 2013 23:54, Gordon Reynolds thisisgordonsem...@gmail.comwrote: TF2 is a free video games that makes money off it's hats and such. Other than giving people the ability to make money off their game (outside of the marketplace), why would anyone at Valve consider adding a banner feature? Why would any user of a free video game want to stare at some ad (that does not help in keeping said video game free), when there are thousands of servers that are running fine without shotgunning ads and videos at their users? On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:48 PM, Paul ubyu@gmail.com wrote: Plus the idea would have to be usable by other advertising networks should they wish to use that space. I doubt however that such an idea will be used. Infact I'll be surprised if Valve takes onboard anything what we say here unfortunately. Still, it doesn't hurt to voice our thoughts though :P. On 7 November 2013 23:32, Doctor McKay mc...@doctormckay.com wrote: It's not a bad idea, but since the Source engine doesn't respond to any clicks while loading the level, users would only have a short window in which they could click the banner. Dr. McKay www.doctormckay.com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 6:02 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Valve, please add an advertisement slot for banner ads in your games while joining servers. I've implemented this in a Sourcemod I've been working on and it seems to be working quite well. Basically if a server has a sv_advertisment_id set it will look up that ID in a mysql database and associate any ad clicks in game to that id. When you join a server, while you're waiting for it to connect (or maps to download, etc) you will see a banner ad while you wait. If the server doesn't have an advertisment_id setup than the game creator will get the click and view. Users have the ability to support the mod and server owners by showing non intrusive advertisements as a setting when they first start up the game. It can be changed in the settings menu at any time. This will give VALVE more money and also give server operators more cash too. Win win. Just an idea... On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:54 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: There is no point in all this random speculation until Valve tells us why the MOTD was crippled even more. - Is it to stop reloading ads every second in the background? - Is it a step towards removing all ads? - Is this a permanent change, or is it just a quick hack that will it be replaced with a more appropriate solution? Without knowing the real reason it is pointless to keep arguing about how quickplay this or ads vs donations that. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Daniel Barreiro smelly.feet.you.h...@gmail.com wrote: http://motdgd.com/terms-of-service/ http://ads.elitepowered.com/?page_id=176 Copying another company's ToS and modifying it very slightly isn't very respectable business practice either. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
Volvo how could you do this now i have to shut down 30 servers. I guess i'll only be drinking one bottle of dom perrion with my dinner tongiht fuck u. What if people liked ads why don't u think abot the end user volvo get your business plan together i'm going back to combat arms fuck u On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:54 PM, Gordon Reynolds thisisgordonsem...@gmail.com wrote: TF2 is a free video games that makes money off it's hats and such. Other than giving people the ability to make money off their game (outside of the marketplace), why would anyone at Valve consider adding a banner feature? Why would any user of a free video game want to stare at some ad (that does not help in keeping said video game free), when there are thousands of servers that are running fine without shotgunning ads and videos at their users? On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:48 PM, Paul ubyu@gmail.com wrote: Plus the idea would have to be usable by other advertising networks should they wish to use that space. I doubt however that such an idea will be used. Infact I'll be surprised if Valve takes onboard anything what we say here unfortunately. Still, it doesn't hurt to voice our thoughts though :P. On 7 November 2013 23:32, Doctor McKay mc...@doctormckay.com wrote: It's not a bad idea, but since the Source engine doesn't respond to any clicks while loading the level, users would only have a short window in which they could click the banner. Dr. McKay www.doctormckay.com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 6:02 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Valve, please add an advertisement slot for banner ads in your games while joining servers. I've implemented this in a Sourcemod I've been working on and it seems to be working quite well. Basically if a server has a sv_advertisment_id set it will look up that ID in a mysql database and associate any ad clicks in game to that id. When you join a server, while you're waiting for it to connect (or maps to download, etc) you will see a banner ad while you wait. If the server doesn't have an advertisment_id setup than the game creator will get the click and view. Users have the ability to support the mod and server owners by showing non intrusive advertisements as a setting when they first start up the game. It can be changed in the settings menu at any time. This will give VALVE more money and also give server operators more cash too. Win win. Just an idea... On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 5:54 PM, Robert Paulson thepauls...@gmail.com wrote: There is no point in all this random speculation until Valve tells us why the MOTD was crippled even more. - Is it to stop reloading ads every second in the background? - Is it a step towards removing all ads? - Is this a permanent change, or is it just a quick hack that will it be replaced with a more appropriate solution? Without knowing the real reason it is pointless to keep arguing about how quickplay this or ads vs donations that. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Daniel Barreiro smelly.feet.you.h...@gmail.com wrote: http://motdgd.com/terms-of-service/ http://ads.elitepowered.com/?page_id=176 Copying another company's ToS and modifying it very slightly isn't very respectable business practice either. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Guardian Cipher guardiancip...@gmail.com wrote: Isn't it illegal to advertise clients on your website that aren't actually your clients? http://servers.elitepowered.com/ I highly doubt you have Valve as a client. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:11 PM, 1nsane 1nsane...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with this. If not for him we wouldn't be having this issue now. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Todd Pettit pettit.t...@gmail.com wrote: Ab, this whole thing is pretty much directly YOUR FAULT! You brazenly ran fake clients on 100+ servers (again) to spoof quickplay into sending you players. The update before last had a change specifically made to ban YOUR servers. The simpler solution would to of banned you and your kin from steam forever. You are not fooling anyone. Everyone knows you as a complete scammer. -T ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux ___ To unsubscribe, edit
Re: [hlds_linux] An open letter to Valve about MOTDs
Please, no abbreviated swearing! And what would be the benefit to the end-user for having two buttons for play now? You'd have to educate the user on what Find Customized Game means. Even with the context of this email I'm not sure what you'd want this button to do. On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 4:00 PM, Weasel's Lair wea...@weaselslair.comwrote: IMH(f)O, variety is a big deal. Different server operators, with different tastes, results in different communities, to suit different players tastes. However, some players only like to play stock maps and deal with a pre-defined world-view of what is possible/expected in the behaviour game. QuickPlay helps those players/noobs/whatever find what they want. So, I definately see the value in QuickPlay. I just wish there was more of an equal footing between QuickPlay and non-QuickPlay in the interface. Maybe there should be two equal-size / equally-marketed buttons - Find QuickPlay Game and Find Customized Game or something like that. From a playing perspective, I think servers the enforce something that the player can not close (and have the audio stop when it closes) is a very bad thing. I think the MOTD changes aren't targeting advertising/donation schilling necessarily - so much as that WTF? I can't close this shiz and start playing right now? effect. On a side note, if you are paying $30 for a server that can only host a single TF2 dedicated server instance - you are paying too much! I am using a VPS provider and paying that much - but able to host multiple instances of TF2 (32-player), CS:S and several GoldSrc stufff. Contrary to what I expected, my VPS is working better than any normal dedicated I have ever rented. I also found that VPS's hosted on Virtuozzo or OpenVZ perform better than KVM ones (even with specific resources dedicated to the KVM machine) - again, the opposite of what I expected. ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux -- - Gordon Reynolds ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
Re: [hlds_linux] Is sv_tags event247 broken after the update?
On 07/11/2013 17:08, Rick Dunn wrote: While your argument is sound for the changes made *today*, it is taking today's changes entirely out of context with the long history of communities getting the shaft out of TF2 in general. For a long while, the *largest* of communities were held together with bubblegum, duct tape, and fake client counts that kept their servers full pretty much 24x7. Valve said to stop it, so most of us did, and our servers died overnight. Well no, most of us didn't do anything in the first place to have to stop anything. So if you did have to stop faking clients and your servers are now empty that's wonderful news. I can't say it enough though - 24 quickplay players is not a community. If your servers are empty then you don't have a community. Think of the quickplay experience from the point of view of the client. He clicks a game type and expects to join a server to play TF2. He doesn't know or care about who owns the server. Usually on every other quickplay server there's a kid with 'admin' somewhere in his name and a guy with 'Gaben' - both pretending they are in charge of the server or Valve. If you want to be in charge of a quickplay server, you may as well copy them, because no one cares that you own a quickplay server. Ideally, imo, there should be a standard config valve have for this, with network settings and all, that makes them more or less the same as Valve's servers. For sure, there's some wiggle room and debate here about things like SMAC, but it should just be a pool of servers and it would remove some of the issues about joining a server where the admin has unfortunately asked the community what his network settings should be or cut and paste some from the web. If you're running a quickplay server you're doing it to add to a pool of servers. The only real distinction between them is the latency from a particular client and Valve's idea that they try to match newer players with newer and so on (that I think is perhaps a flawed idea because humans learn from imitation and 24 new players have no one to imitate) Now you have to ask why anyone would care if their quickplay server was empty? There's only one issue here :Are there enough servers? - i.e are all the people who click quickplay joining a server in a reasonable amount of time and is that server close enough to give them a low ping? Once the answer to that question is yes there really is absolutely no point running a quickplay server or fretting about it being empty if you are. There's certainly no point acting as though your server should have people rather than Valve's or anyone else's. If you were running a business and no one came to your shop it would make sense to think what can I change to make my shop more attractive? - but you cannot do this with quickplay. So, the first and most obvious step if you want to build a community is Don't enable quickplay It makes absolute sense for Valve to run lots of quickplay servers for 2 reasons (a) They cover places and people that otherwise wouldn't have good servers. (b) There's no great attraction in running quickplay if you're running a server to satisfy some other unstated motive that quickplay cannot sate. If you want to build a community - a set of people who, for whatever reason, connect to your server in preference to anyone else's then you'll need to work at it. Just like people who create a 6v6 or highlander TF2 team have to work at arranging matches, joining lobbies, scrims and competitions and getting everyone to turn up. Now that's comp play - but building a community of pub players from scratch requires the same level of effort, if not more. You need to configure a server that has the traits that a particular set of the community want and then network amongst TF2 players to find people to come and play on your server. And then perhaps hope, the mere presence of regular players is enough to attract a few random pub players too. People that are running hundreds of servers, all generic, lowest common denominator don't have communities either. It's like, if someone is moaning that changing his IP address means everyone quits and plays on another server then he doesn't have a community. If your non-quickplay servers are no different or special from every other server out there and if a player is just going to shrug and pick another server if your server is full, you ban him or you stop running them, then you don't have a community. These admins are basically thinking I wish I was in control of quickplay - they want a bunch of generic servers that people join and which they hope will generate them an income. They aren't interested in building a community. Thing is, you can see how trivial it is to copy them. Assuming your pockets are deep enough any buffoon can run lots of TF2 server instances. So the more buffoons that take that approach, the more empty servers there will be.
Re: [hlds_linux] Coming soon: changes to TF HTML MOTD support
On 07/11/2013 23:13, Robert Paulson wrote: I don't see how that is safe to say. I've donned my cycle helmet just in case. You think that will be enough? Does everyone here really prefer Valve to kill off a little competition rather than trying to get features back? Whatever happened to the people who cared about their radio/bp/rules plugins? It's only quickplay. No one sane is going to click quickplay and hope they randomly land on a radio enabled server if they want or appreciate the feature. click 'capture the flag' Oh not a radio server click 'capture the flag' Oh not a radio server click 'capture the flag' Oh not a radio server click 'capture the flag' Oh not a radio server click 'capture the flag' 'type !radio to enable radio' Yes! !radio Admin : That won't work now Damn you valve! That's really not happening is it? It's easy enough to type rules in text (although I'd probably expect anyone with prescriptive rules about, say, what language you have to speak or where you can stand and so on would probably be best sticking to non-quickplay traffic in any case) -- Dan ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
