Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On 2 February 2011 09:50, W. Kevin Kelley wkkel...@optonline.net wrote: WTOs, WTORs and WTLs have always been restricted to a subset of code- page 037 character set 697. Specifically, the following characters: A through Z 0 through 9 characters + * / , . ( ) ' - = : % ? ; and blank Some additional code-points are not translated to blanks. Here is the complete translate table: x0 x1 x2 x3 x4 x5 x6 x7 x8 x9 xA xB xC xD xE xF - 0x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 4C 6E .. 1x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 2x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 3x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 4x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 4A 4B 4C 4D 4E 4F ..?.(+| 5x | 50 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 5A 5B 5C 5D 5E 5F .!$*);^ 6x | 60 61 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 6B 6C 6D 6E 6F -/.,%_? 7x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 7A 7B 7C 7D 7E 7F ..:#@'= 8x | 40 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 40 40 40 40 40 40 .abcdefghi.. 9x | 40 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 40 40 40 40 40 40 .jklmnopqr.. Ax | 40 40 A2 A3 A4 A5 A6 A7 A8 A9 40 40 40 40 40 40 ..stuvwxyz.. Bx | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 Cx | 40 C1 C2 C3 C4 C5 C6 C7 C8 C9 40 40 40 40 40 40 .ABCDEFGHI.. Dx | 40 D1 D2 D3 D4 D5 D6 D7 D8 D9 40 40 40 40 40 40 .JKLMNOPQR.. Ex | 40 40 E2 E3 E4 E5 E6 E7 E8 E9 40 40 40 40 40 40 ..STUVWXYZ.. Fx | F0 F1 F2 F3 F4 F5 F6 F7 F8 F9 40 40 40 40 40 40 0123456789.. Unfortunately the characters you list don't quite match those in the table, and a few in the table have suffered from ASCII-ism, and not survived correctly into my browser. Notably, the character at position 4A is a cent sign, and that at 5F is a logical NOT sign. This table is otherwise a very close match for IBM CS 101, which adds only the broken vertical bar at 6A, the back quote at 79, and the tilde at A1. Tony H. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On Wed, 2 Feb 2011 07:25:23 -0800, Edward Jaffe edja...@phoenixsoftware.com wrote: This restriction must be for consoles only. I see those other characters in the log. +1+2+3+4+5+6+7- ---+ N 0001000 MVS602011032 08:00:40.32 0090 SEÑORITA D4FFF4DEEFFFFF4FF7FF7FF4FF4444EC6DDC EC 51452602011032008A00A40B329000259699 31 -- Ed, I'll have to go back and check the code as far as SYSLOG. It certainly applies to consoles, including the various printers that we supported as output-only consoles. W. Kevin Kelley -- IBM POK Lab -- z/OS Core Technical Development -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On Tue, 1 Feb 2011 15:50:40 -0500, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) shmuel+ibm- m...@patriot.net wrote: I believe that he is running into a restriction in console processing. -- Correct. WTOs, WTORs and WTLs have always been restricted to a subset of code- page 037 character set 697. Specifically, the following characters: A through Z 0 through 9 characters + * / , . ( ) ' - = : % ? ; and blank Some additional code-points are not translated to blanks. Here is the complete translate table: x0 x1 x2 x3 x4 x5 x6 x7 x8 x9 xA xB xC xD xE xF - 0x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 4C 6E .. 1x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 2x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 3x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 4x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 4A 4B 4C 4D 4E 4F ..¢.(+| 5x | 50 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 5A 5B 5C 5D 5E 5F .!$*);^ 6x | 60 61 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 6B 6C 6D 6E 6F -/.,%_? 7x | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 7A 7B 7C 7D 7E 7F ..:#@'= 8x | 40 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 40 40 40 40 40 40 .abcdefghi.. 9x | 40 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 40 40 40 40 40 40 .jklmnopqr.. Ax | 40 40 A2 A3 A4 A5 A6 A7 A8 A9 40 40 40 40 40 40 ..stuvwxyz.. Bx | 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 40 Cx | 40 C1 C2 C3 C4 C5 C6 C7 C8 C9 40 40 40 40 40 40 .ABCDEFGHI.. Dx | 40 D1 D2 D3 D4 D5 D6 D7 D8 D9 40 40 40 40 40 40 .JKLMNOPQR.. Ex | 40 40 E2 E3 E4 E5 E6 E7 E8 E9 40 40 40 40 40 40 ..STUVWXYZ.. Fx | F0 F1 F2 F3 F4 F5 F6 F7 F8 F9 40 40 40 40 40 40 0123456789.. The restriction is largely historical and due to shortcomings in early print and display hardware. - Early printers (1403) did not support lower-case and other code-points due to the impact printing technology in use at the time. Supporting lower-case and additional codepoints significantly reduced printing speed, even when those codepoints were not being used. At the time, SYSLOG went directly to a printer, not a data set, so the system could be constrained to operate at printer speed. - Early display devices (2260, early 3270) did not support lower-case or other code-points due to the additional circuitry that was required to store the additional character images. Fast read-only memory was very expensive at the time. - Lower-case (and other) English code-points collided with the codepoints used by the Japanese Katakana phonetic alphabet. The first two restrictions have been dealt with by non-impact printing technology and increases in circuit density and are no longer an issue. The third restriction has been handled by incorporating the Katakana character set into the double-byte Kanji character set. Katakana-only display devices have ceased to exist. While we have eased the restriction on the use of lower-case a through z characters in messages, we have not removed the restriction on the use of other code-points, although we have had a proposal to do so. The proposal died due to a lack of formal customer requirements that we fix the problem. W. Kevin Kelley -- IBM POK Lab -- z/OS Core Technical Development -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On 2/2/2011 6:50 AM, W. Kevin Kelley wrote: While we have eased the restriction on the use of lower-case a through z characters in messages, we have not removed the restriction on the use of other code-points, although we have had a proposal to do so. The proposal died due to a lack of formal customer requirements that we fix the problem. This restriction must be for consoles only. I see those other characters in the log. +1+2+3+4+5+6+7+ N 0001000 MVS602011032 08:00:40.32 0090 SEÑORITA D4FFF4DEEFFFFF4FF7FF7FF4FF4444EC6DDCEC 51452602011032008A00A40B32900025969931 -- -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 310-338-0400 x318 edja...@phoenixsoftware.com http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On Wed, 2 Feb 2011 07:25:23 -0800, Edward Jaffe edja...@phoenixsoftware.com wrote: On 2/2/2011 6:50 AM, W. Kevin Kelley wrote: While we have eased the restriction on the use of lower-case a through z characters in messages, we have not removed the restriction on the use of other code-points, although we have had a proposal to do so. The proposal died due to a lack of formal customer requirements that we fix the problem. This restriction must be for consoles only. I see those other characters in the log. Was your WTO issued by a program in supervisor state or key zero? The restriction might not apply to such programs. +1+2+3+4+5+6+- N 0001000 MVS602011032 08:00:40.32 0090 SEÑORITA D4FFF4DEEFFFFF4FF7FF7FF4FF4444EC6DDC EC 51452602011032008A00A40B329000259699 31 - -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
Juan Mautalen wrote: as you may know, Ñ(X'69') is an important character in spanish languaje. We have z/OS 1.9, and i have observed the following odd behaviour: What I see in your post is a Capital N with a small reversed horisontal letter S on top of Capital N. Is that correct? You can put Ñ in datasets and browse/edit them without any problem (from ISPF). You can even have Ñ in RACF database (for instance, in a userid NAME, or INST-DATA). However, when an Ñ happens to be written to SYSLOG, you see it as a blank. In others words, in SYSLOG, Ñ is replaced by blank (X'40'). What are you using to see SYSLOG? SDSF? What if you copy SYSLOG somewhere and you edit the dataset? Do you then see the correct hex characters? Do we have some misconfiguration? Perhaps switching to English? ;-D Tell us if you get any solution. I would really like to see it. Groete / Greetings Elardus Engelbrecht -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On 2/1/2011 7:12 AM, Juan Mautalen wrote: You can put Ñ in datasets and browse/edit them without any problem (from ISPF). You can even have Ñ in RACF database (for instance, in a userid NAME, or INST-DATA). However, when an Ñ happens to be written to SYSLOG, you see it as a blank. In others words, in SYSLOG, Ñ is replaced by blank (X'40'). It works here browsing with (E)JES: N 0001000 MVS602011032 08:00:40.32 0090 SEÑORITA Check your code page settings in your log browser product. (E)JES automatically senses the necessary code page from your 3270 emulator. Other products might not be as sophisticated. -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 310-338-0400 x318 edja...@phoenixsoftware.com http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On 2/1/2011 9:03 AM, Elardus Engelbrecht wrote: Juan Mautalen wrote: as you may know, Ñ(X'69') is an important character in spanish languaje. We have z/OS 1.9, and i have observed the following odd behaviour: What I see in your post is a Capital N with a small reversed horisontal letter S on top of Capital N. Is that correct? No. It's a tilde. On my keyboard it's the shift character on the key left of the '1' key. You can put Ñ in datasets and browse/edit them without any problem (from ISPF). You can even have Ñ in RACF database (for instance, in a userid NAME, or INST-DATA). However, when an Ñ happens to be written to SYSLOG, you see it as a blank. In others words, in SYSLOG, Ñ is replaced by blank (X'40'). What are you using to see SYSLOG? SDSF? What if you copy SYSLOG somewhere and you edit the dataset? Do you then see the correct hex characters? Do we have some misconfiguration? Perhaps switching to English? ;-D Or Afrikaans? Tell us if you get any solution. I would really like to see it. Groete / Greetings Elardus Engelbrecht -- Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-393-8716 http://www.trainersfriend.com * To get a good Return on your Investment, first make an investment! + Training your people is an excellent investment * Try our new tool for calculating your Return On Investment for training dollars at http://www.trainersfriend.com/ROI/roi.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
Elardous: What I see in your post is a Capital N with a small reversed horisontal letter S on top of Capital N. Is that correct? Yes, that correct. Its pronounciation is very different from N. For instance, ÑOM in spanish is pronounced as GNOM in english. What are you using to see SYSLOG? SDSF? Yes, i was browsing it via SDSF. I even turned HEX ON, and i saw X'40'. What if you copy SYSLOG somewhere and you edit the dataset? Do you then see the correct hex characters? If SYSLOG is copied elsewhere, we still see a blank. The Ñ has gone... Juan Mautalen -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
Steve Comstock wrote: No. It's a tilde. On my keyboard it's the shift character on the key left of the '1' key. Oh yes, you're right. I now saw that '~' on my little keyboard. Thanks for educating me, I really appreciate it very much! Perhaps switching to English? ;-D Or Afrikaans? Much better! :-D Groete / Greetings Elardus Engelbrecht -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
This might help: http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/isf4cs91/2.15 I didn't see where it says what happens if you don't specify a code page or TRTAB, but I suspect it defaults to CP 037 (US EBCDIC). -jc- -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Juan Mautalen Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 10:10 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display Elardous: What I see in your post is a Capital N with a small reversed horisontal letter S on top of Capital N. Is that correct? Yes, that correct. Its pronounciation is very different from N. For instance, ÑOM in spanish is pronounced as GNOM in english. What are you using to see SYSLOG? SDSF? Yes, i was browsing it via SDSF. I even turned HEX ON, and i saw X'40'. What if you copy SYSLOG somewhere and you edit the dataset? Do you then see the correct hex characters? If SYSLOG is copied elsewhere, we still see a blank. The Ñ has gone... Juan Mautalen -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On 1 February 2011 11:10, Juan Mautalen jgmauta...@yahoo.com.ar wrote: Yes, that correct. Its pronounciation is very different from N. For instance, ÑOM in spanish is pronounced as GNOM in english. GN is a fairly unlikely English representation of Spanish Ñ or ñ. In ordinary English orthography, an initial GN has the G completely silent, and the N unaffected, so an English GNOM would be indistinguishable from an English NOM. The same is true for initial KN. There are exceptions, of course (what would English spelling be without them?), as well as dialectical and historical differences. It's easy to say that Spanish Ñ is the initial sound in English words like NEW, but there are some not so uncommon English dialects in which NEW has no glide and is indistinguishable from NOO. Perhaps one unambiguous way of putting it is to tell the English reader that Ñ is the sound you'd get if you put an ordinary N sound in front of the English word YOU. Regardless, the accent is evidently very important in Spanish, the classic example being feliz año nuevo vs feliz ano nuevo. Tony H. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On 1 February 2011 11:19, Chase, John jch...@ussco.com wrote: This might help: http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/isf4cs91/2.15 I didn't see where it says what happens if you don't specify a code page or TRTAB, but I suspect it defaults to CP 037 (US EBCDIC). CP 037 is an encoding of Character Set 697, and has always had both Ñ and ñ in it. Tony H. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
The closest I can find on this is here: http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/iea2a690/21.6 It lists the code points which are acceptable to the WTO macro and are displayed on consoles. I can't see anything that says that SYSLOG itself has the same restriction. The x'69' code point is not in this list. On Tue, 2011-02-01 at 07:12 -0800, Juan Mautalen wrote: Hi, as you may know, Ñ(X'69') is an important character in spanish languaje. We have z/OS 1.9, and i have observed the following odd behaviour: You can put Ñ in datasets and browse/edit them without any problem (from ISPF). You can even have Ñ in RACF database (for instance, in a userid NAME, or INST-DATA). However, when an Ñ happens to be written to SYSLOG, you see it as a blank. In others words, in SYSLOG, Ñ is replaced by blank (X'40'). Do we have some misconfiguration? Thanks in advance for your help, Juan Mautalen -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- John McKown Maranatha! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
Yes Tony, You make a good point. Our US folks have a habit of saying NEW with no glide, so it ends up as NOO. 'I bought a NOO car today'. Of course it's not left there, as the cold mornings in the US can provide much Morning DOO (DEW with the glide). Mind you it's hard to imagine any US person using FEW without the glide, 'I had a FOO too many drinks'. it's also there in Church, where we sit in our usual seat or PEW, with the glide. Again it would be unthinkable of anyone saying 'well I attended Church today and sat in my usual POO'. Maybe off center in this thread, but still interesting to digest. Colin Pearce -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Tony Harminc Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2011 1:01 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display On 1 February 2011 11:10, Juan Mautalen jgmauta...@yahoo.com.ar wrote: Yes, that correct. Its pronounciation is very different from N. For instance, ÑOM in spanish is pronounced as GNOM in english. GN is a fairly unlikely English representation of Spanish Ñ or ñ. In ordinary English orthography, an initial GN has the G completely silent, and the N unaffected, so an English GNOM would be indistinguishable from an English NOM. The same is true for initial KN. There are exceptions, of course (what would English spelling be without them?), as well as dialectical and historical differences. It's easy to say that Spanish Ñ is the initial sound in English words like NEW, but there are some not so uncommon English dialects in which NEW has no glide and is indistinguishable from NOO. Perhaps one unambiguous way of putting it is to tell the English reader that Ñ is the sound you'd get if you put an ordinary N sound in front of the English word YOU. Regardless, the accent is evidently very important in Spanish, the classic example being feliz año nuevo vs feliz ano nuevo. Tony H. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- This message w/attachments (message) is intended solely for the use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or proprietary. If you are not an intended recipient, please notify the sender, and then please delete and destroy all copies and attachments, and be advised that any review or dissemination of, or the taking of any action in reliance on, the information contained in or attached to this message is prohibited. Unless specifically indicated, this message is not an offer to sell or a solicitation of any investment products or other financial product or service, an official confirmation of any transaction, or an official statement of Sender. Subject to applicable law, Sender may intercept, monitor, review and retain e-communications (EC) traveling through its networks/systems and may produce any such EC to regulators, law enforcement, in litigation and as required by law. The laws of the country of each sender/recipient may impact the handling of EC, and EC may be archived, supervised and produced in countries other than the country in which you are located. This message cannot be guaranteed to be secure or free of errors or viruses. References to Sender are references to any subsidiary of Bank of America Corporation. Securities and Insurance Products: * Are Not FDIC Insured * Are Not Bank Guaranteed * May Lose Value * Are Not a Bank Deposit * Are Not a Condition to Any Banking Service or Activity * Are Not Insured by Any Federal Government Agency. Attachments that are part of this EC may have additional important disclosures and disclaimers, which you should read. This message is subject to terms available at the following link: http://www.bankofamerica.com/emaildisclaimer. By messaging with Sender you consent to the foregoing. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
I submitted a job issuing a WTOR message containing both uppercase (Ñ) and lowercase (ñ), and then asked the operator how message looked liked in the real console. He told me that he did not see any Ñ nor ñ. So, my conclusion is that this is not an SDSF problem. Right? --- El mar 1-feb-11, Chase, John jch...@ussco.com escribió: De: Chase, John jch...@ussco.com Asunto: Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display Para: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Fecha: martes, 1 de febrero de 2011, 14:19 This might help: http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/isf4cs91/2.15 I didn't see where it says what happens if you don't specify a code page or TRTAB, but I suspect it defaults to CP 037 (US EBCDIC). -jc- -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Juan Mautalen Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 10:10 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display Elardous: What I see in your post is a Capital N with a small reversed horisontal letter S on top of Capital N. Is that correct? Yes, that correct. Its pronounciation is very different from N. For instance, ÑOM in spanish is pronounced as GNOM in english. What are you using to see SYSLOG? SDSF? Yes, i was browsing it via SDSF. I even turned HEX ON, and i saw X'40'. What if you copy SYSLOG somewhere and you edit the dataset? Do you then see the correct hex characters? If SYSLOG is copied elsewhere, we still see a blank. The Ñ has gone... Juan Mautalen -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
I beleive that is the explanation, John. Thanks you, and also to the other contributors of the thread. Juan Mautalen --- El mar 1-feb-11, John McKown joa...@swbell.net escribió: De: John McKown joa...@swbell.net Asunto: Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display Para: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Fecha: martes, 1 de febrero de 2011, 15:20 The closest I can find on this is here: http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/iea2a690/21.6 It lists the code points which are acceptable to the WTO macro and are displayed on consoles. I can't see anything that says that SYSLOG itself has the same restriction. The x'69' code point is not in this list. On Tue, 2011-02-01 at 07:12 -0800, Juan Mautalen wrote: Hi, as you may know, Ñ(X'69') is an important character in spanish languaje. We have z/OS 1.9, and i have observed the following odd behaviour: You can put Ñ in datasets and browse/edit them without any problem (from ISPF). You can even have Ñ in RACF database (for instance, in a userid NAME, or INST-DATA). However, when an Ñ happens to be written to SYSLOG, you see it as a blank. In others words, in SYSLOG, Ñ is replaced by blank (X'40'). Do we have some misconfiguration? Thanks in advance for your help, Juan Mautalen -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- John McKown Maranatha! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
This can be one of the most confusing things to troubleshoot. You really have to think carefully and clearly. One says I have a hex xx in my dataset and it is displaying incorrectly as a 'y'. There are so many places it could be going wrong. The z/OS component could be using the wrong (from your point of view) CCSID. Or the character could be right on z/OS but your emulator is translating it to the wrong (from your point of view) ASCII character. Or the ASCII character could be right from your point of view, but your Windows (or Mac or Linux) code page could be such that the right ASCII character displays as the wrong graphic. BTW, the standalone character '~' is a tilde. The little thing on top of a Spanish Ñ or ñ (hope those come through correctly) is properly called an enye (EN-yay). It's shorthand for a double n -- it's a little n parked on top of the main n. Señor is shorthand for what was once properly spelled Sennor. Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Steve Comstock Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 8:08 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display On 2/1/2011 9:03 AM, Elardus Engelbrecht wrote: Juan Mautalen wrote: as you may know, Ñ(X'69') is an important character in spanish languaje. We have z/OS 1.9, and i have observed the following odd behaviour: What I see in your post is a Capital N with a small reversed horisontal letter S on top of Capital N. Is that correct? No. It's a tilde. On my keyboard it's the shift character on the key left of the '1' key. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
feliz año nuevo vs feliz ano nuevo BIG difference g Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Tony Harminc Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 9:01 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On Tue, 1 Feb 2011 10:16:10 -0600, Elardus Engelbrecht elardus.engelbre...@sita.co.za wrote: Perhaps switching to English? ;-D Or Afrikaans? Much better! :-D But that may have similar problems, nê? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
if you see SYSLOG with sdsf look his codepage 2011/2/1 Juan Mautalen jgmauta...@yahoo.com.ar Hi, as you may know, Ñ(X'69') is an important character in spanish languaje. We have z/OS 1.9, and i have observed the following odd behaviour: You can put Ñ in datasets and browse/edit them without any problem (from ISPF). You can even have Ñ in RACF database (for instance, in a userid NAME, or INST-DATA). However, when an Ñ happens to be written to SYSLOG, you see it as a blank. In others words, in SYSLOG, Ñ is replaced by blank (X'40'). Do we have some misconfiguration? Thanks in advance for your help, Juan Mautalen -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On 1 February 2011 14:20, Charles Mills charl...@mcn.org wrote: feliz año nuevo vs feliz ano nuevo BIG difference g And in French, porc salé vs porc sale. It's interesting that Google Translate correctly makes the difference between those two in French, but translates both the accented and unaccented Spanish the same. Maybe the unaccented one is just too far-fetched, or even offensive. Tony H. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
My Google xlate gives both translations for ano. Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Tony Harminc Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 1:05 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display On 1 February 2011 14:20, Charles Mills charl...@mcn.org wrote: feliz año nuevo vs feliz ano nuevo BIG difference g And in French, porc salé vs porc sale. It's interesting that Google Translate correctly makes the difference between those two in French, but translates both the accented and unaccented Spanish the same. Maybe the unaccented one is just too far-fetched, or even offensive. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
On 1 February 2011 16:17, Charles Mills charl...@mcn.org wrote: My Google xlate gives both translations for ano. Well, I meant the entire phrase. I think feliz ano nuevo taken exactly is just too improbable. Whereas both porc salé and porc sale are quite reasonable, though with vastly different meanings. Tony H. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
Juan, Are you saying the byte for the x'69' is actually being written into the syslog as x'40', or just that it displays as a blank when you view it? For SDSF, you might want to take a look at http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/infocenter/zos/v1r12/topic/com.ibm.zos.r12.isfa500/isffr.htm#isffr which talks about code pages for SDSF. There are code pages used for SDSF, for ISPF, for your terminal emulator, and for printing. I think a code page mismatch is a likely explanation. Regards, --Roger On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 1:48 PM, Raúl Fernández raulf...@gmail.com wrote: if you see SYSLOG with sdsf look his codepage 2011/2/1 Juan Mautalen jgmauta...@yahoo.com.ar Hi, as you may know, Ñ(X'69') is an important character in spanish languaje. We have z/OS 1.9, and i have observed the following odd behaviour: You can put Ñ in datasets and browse/edit them without any problem (from ISPF). You can even have Ñ in RACF database (for instance, in a userid NAME, or INST-DATA). However, when an Ñ happens to be written to SYSLOG, you see it as a blank. In others words, in SYSLOG, Ñ is replaced by blank (X'40'). Do we have some misconfiguration? Thanks in advance for your help, Juan Mautalen -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
Sorry. I was viewing this in Gmail and didn't realize there were deleted messages in the thread before I posted. On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 2:55 PM, Roger Bolan rogerbo...@gmail.com wrote: Juan, Are you saying the byte for the x'69' is actually being written into the syslog as x'40', or just that it displays as a blank when you view it? For SDSF, you might want to take a look at http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/infocenter/zos/v1r12/topic/com.ibm.zos.r12.isfa500/isffr.htm#isffr which talks about code pages for SDSF. There are code pages used for SDSF, for ISPF, for your terminal emulator, and for printing. I think a code page mismatch is a likely explanation. Regards, --Roger On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 1:48 PM, Raúl Fernández raulf...@gmail.com wrote: if you see SYSLOG with sdsf look his codepage 2011/2/1 Juan Mautalen jgmauta...@yahoo.com.ar Hi, as you may know, Ñ(X'69') is an important character in spanish languaje. We have z/OS 1.9, and i have observed the following odd behaviour: You can put Ñ in datasets and browse/edit them without any problem (from ISPF). You can even have Ñ in RACF database (for instance, in a userid NAME, or INST-DATA). However, when an Ñ happens to be written to SYSLOG, you see it as a blank. In others words, in SYSLOG, Ñ is replaced by blank (X'40'). Do we have some misconfiguration? Thanks in advance for your help, Juan Mautalen -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Ñ(X'69') character and SYSLOG display
In listserv%201102011003314607.0...@bama.ua.edu, on 02/01/2011 at 10:03 AM, Elardus Engelbrecht elardus.engelbre...@sita.co.za said: What I see in your post is a Capital N with a small reversed horisontal letter S on top of Capital N. Is that correct? Yes, the Eña in an N with a Tilde, and he has charset=iso-8859-1 specified in his MIME header fields. I believe that he is running into a restriction in console processing. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
