Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness
Yep, I remember that keyboard too Tom, I think one of my links was similar to that one. I was spoiled in those days because several of my early employers paid for the keyboards with a keypad and function keys for programmers. I use the End key above the arrow keys for Erase EOF and Ctrl-End for the "End Field" function. I actually have occasion to use the tilde / backquote key when coding shell scripts for z/OS and the backslash key for batch script local drive file names when I need to run them on the company laptop, so I do not remap those keys. I also need backslash for escapes in strings when coding awk scripts for z/OS. But I'm weird that way. Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Tom Brennan Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2022 12:46 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness Here's a pic as I remember the 3278 Mod-4 I used: https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://i.redd.it/zhafeucucea11.jpg__;!!Ebr-cpPeAnfNniQ8HSAI-g_K5b7VKg!f9DWwcz3do6F08YJ4m30zzm3p92-P5uLtDY-jRVXh-HY46wIF4l-vndPNuAbr1CqtH63fQ$ Like Peter, I use left-ctrl for Reset because of the old 3278. I modify other keys too though, such as that little back-apostrophe/tilde key that I never use on the mainframe - it becomes my Erase-EOF key, somewhat near where it was on the 3278. For Newline I use my backslash key which is another key I rarely need on the mainframe. My old joke was to look for the really dirty keys on your keyboard - those are the ones you rarely use and can be remapped to something useful. A typical windows program looks for the WM_CHAR message to receive characters from the keyboard. But arrow keys are not considered characters, so the program also needs to look for the WM_KEYDOWN message. My wild guess is that WM_CHAR works and WM_KEYDOWN is failing, but then *none* of your non-character keys would be working so skip that theory. There are Windows "SPY" programs you can use to display messages passed to a particular window. With that you could at least tell if the WM_KEYDOWN arrow messages are getting to HOD at all. But that might be something for the Windows admins to do. On 3/14/2022 6:17 PM, Steve Thompson wrote: > Thank you for that picture. I had totally forgotten that was where the > reset key was. I guess my problem is, even though I am a touch typist, > I screw things up enough with a 3270 device that it is faster for me > to right thumb a reset which is why I set it over there. And it may be > because the left CTRL and/or ALT couldn't be remapped with the 3270 > emulator software I had been running on early Windows software so I > just got used to the right alt. Which I also made large use of SPF-PC > and similar. > > There are fewer and fewer of us that have actually used 3270 devices. > > It will be the client's people. It is their laptop, and their software > they push. And I will get told again, we have 16K users and you are > the only one Yeah, I'm the only one that is a z/VM capacity > planner too. sigh. (why am I posting here, because I also do TSO/ISPF > REXX, SAS, and believe it or not, COBOL). > > Steve Thompson > > On 3/14/22 20:38, Farley, Peter x23353 wrote: >> Re: "That is not where the original reset key was, was it?" >> >> Yes it was, at least on all the "real iron" 3277/8/9 keyboards that I >> remember using. Pictures of a couple of 3278 keyboards that I found: >> >> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://vintagecomputer.ca/ibm-3277-and-3 >> 278-terminals/ibm-3278-keyboard/__;!!Ebr-cpPeAnfNniQ8HSAI-g_K5b7VKg!f >> 9DWwcz3do6F08YJ4m30zzm3p92-P5uLtDY-jRVXh-HY46wIF4l-vndPNuAbr1DUAesxxQ >> $ >> >> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?t=9 >> 365__;!!Ebr-cpPeAnfNniQ8HSAI-g_K5b7VKg!f9DWwcz3do6F08YJ4m30zzm3p92-P5 >> uLtDY-jRVXh-HY46wIF4l-vndPNuAbr1Cy7GwozQ$ >> >> There are lots more around the net. >> >> I also map the Right-Ctrl key to 3270 Enter so I can hit it with my >> right thumb (left thumb for space bar, left pinky for "Reset" on >> Left-Ctrl), and remap keyboard "Enter" to 3270 "New Line", also >> mirroring the original "real iron" keyboards I used. >> >> You have my condolences for your current problem, and the fact that >> it is not just HOD having the issue surely means a Windows problem >> (or upgrade/patch needed for HOD and that other software to catch up >> to the enforced M$ changes). >> >> Good luck, I hope you or your employer's techies figure it out. >> >> Peter >> >> P.S. -- In my employer's PCOMM the "SYS ATTN" function is mapped to >> the Esc key, and PA1/2 are mapped to Alt-Insert and Alt-Home (but not >> on the numeric pad, just to the ones above the cursor keys). YMMV. >> >> -Original Message- >> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On >> Behalf Of Steve Thompson >> Sent: Monday, March 14, 2022 8:12 PM >> To:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU >> Subject: Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness >> >> Ok, I'm going to answer a few
Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness
That has to be it! I just tried scroll-lock on PCOMM (I don't have HOD but they probably share code) and sure enough, it prevents the arrow keys from working. Oddly though, I checked on some other Windows programs like MS-Word and Notepad, and scroll-lock had no effect at all - I could even scroll. Reminds me of the day the right-hand window in my truck refused to open. I had the door panel off and the window motor pulled out when my daughter's boyfriend said, "Hey, your window-lock switch is set". Oops. On 3/14/2022 9:42 PM, Farley, Peter x23353 wrote: Good point Attila! I should have thought of that solution, as I have encountered that exact issue myself more than once but my keyboard (M$ Natural, the older version with all the extra media buttons) actually has a Scroll Lock key and I have accidentally pressed it more than once and wondered WTF? PEBKAC. Checking the Scroll Lock light on my keyboard is the signal that I missed when I have done it to myself, but Steve's keyboard may or may not have one of those if the key itself is not there. In Steve's case, you may have hit the nail on the head - the mapping for Scroll Lock changed unexpectedly and it unintentionally got pressed. Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Attila Fogarasi Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2022 12:13 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness Sounds like the dreaded Windows Scroll lock key. Pressing that will disable the arrow keys until Scroll lock is turned off. Now chances are your keyboard doesn't have a scroll lock key (most modern keyboards have dropped it as it does more harm than good), but Windows still has it internally. You can access it using the On-Screen Keyboard in Windows. Possibly the pushed software has changed keyboard mappings so that some other key that you innocently use has become the Scroll Lock key. Make sure it is off and see if your problem is fixed. PS. this has nothing to do with HOD or anything mainframe :) On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 8:36 AM Steve Thompson wrote: Hi all: A few weeks ago at a client site, they force installed software on end user computers (owned by the client) and since then I've been having odd issues with HOD (Host on Demand - 3270 emulator). Today, arrow keys are not working. And if you get into the keyboard configuration system, you can click on "Search for a key" and it will go to the line where that key is defined so you know what HOD thinks it is for. Well, the arrow keys stopped working. So these are supposedly cursor movement keys. And striking one of them gets no response (in HOD). They do work outside of HOD> Last time this happened it was the right "Alt" key being ignored (which I have defined as . I remap a keyboard to as much as possible emulate a true 3270 keyboard. I rebooted, I reloaded, and didn't make a difference. Someone had me reset the key, and then it started working. No Joy today. Right+ALT is behaving today. But not the arrow keys. This seems to be something going on with Windows. Any ideas of how to cure this thing (NO, I do not have the option of running other than HOD). Regards, Steve Thompson -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness
Here's a pic as I remember the 3278 Mod-4 I used: https://i.redd.it/zhafeucucea11.jpg Like Peter, I use left-ctrl for Reset because of the old 3278. I modify other keys too though, such as that little back-apostrophe/tilde key that I never use on the mainframe - it becomes my Erase-EOF key, somewhat near where it was on the 3278. For Newline I use my backslash key which is another key I rarely need on the mainframe. My old joke was to look for the really dirty keys on your keyboard - those are the ones you rarely use and can be remapped to something useful. A typical windows program looks for the WM_CHAR message to receive characters from the keyboard. But arrow keys are not considered characters, so the program also needs to look for the WM_KEYDOWN message. My wild guess is that WM_CHAR works and WM_KEYDOWN is failing, but then *none* of your non-character keys would be working so skip that theory. There are Windows "SPY" programs you can use to display messages passed to a particular window. With that you could at least tell if the WM_KEYDOWN arrow messages are getting to HOD at all. But that might be something for the Windows admins to do. On 3/14/2022 6:17 PM, Steve Thompson wrote: Thank you for that picture. I had totally forgotten that was where the reset key was. I guess my problem is, even though I am a touch typist, I screw things up enough with a 3270 device that it is faster for me to right thumb a reset which is why I set it over there. And it may be because the left CTRL and/or ALT couldn't be remapped with the 3270 emulator software I had been running on early Windows software so I just got used to the right alt. Which I also made large use of SPF-PC and similar. There are fewer and fewer of us that have actually used 3270 devices. It will be the client's people. It is their laptop, and their software they push. And I will get told again, we have 16K users and you are the only one Yeah, I'm the only one that is a z/VM capacity planner too. sigh. (why am I posting here, because I also do TSO/ISPF REXX, SAS, and believe it or not, COBOL). Steve Thompson On 3/14/22 20:38, Farley, Peter x23353 wrote: Re: "That is not where the original reset key was, was it?" Yes it was, at least on all the "real iron" 3277/8/9 keyboards that I remember using. Pictures of a couple of 3278 keyboards that I found: https://vintagecomputer.ca/ibm-3277-and-3278-terminals/ibm-3278-keyboard/ https://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?t=9365 There are lots more around the net. I also map the Right-Ctrl key to 3270 Enter so I can hit it with my right thumb (left thumb for space bar, left pinky for "Reset" on Left-Ctrl), and remap keyboard "Enter" to 3270 "New Line", also mirroring the original "real iron" keyboards I used. You have my condolences for your current problem, and the fact that it is not just HOD having the issue surely means a Windows problem (or upgrade/patch needed for HOD and that other software to catch up to the enforced M$ changes). Good luck, I hope you or your employer's techies figure it out. Peter P.S. -- In my employer's PCOMM the "SYS ATTN" function is mapped to the Esc key, and PA1/2 are mapped to Alt-Insert and Alt-Home (but not on the numeric pad, just to the ones above the cursor keys). YMMV. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Steve Thompson Sent: Monday, March 14, 2022 8:12 PM To:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness Ok, I'm going to answer a few questions here: 1) I have been doing this with HOD since 2013. Any time something odd happens [wait, HOD, odd, hm], it typically has been some security software doing something incredibly stupid. Such as mangling the Outlook Profile because day ends in "y". 2) with #1 above, you can reboot all you want. Outlook stays broken. You actually have to remove the offending software and build a new profile (how would I know this? 3 guesses and the first 2 don't count). 3) Reboot? That was what finished the install of the pushed software. So yes, a re-reboot was done. Anyone wonder why M/S doesn't create a Windows Z release? Because that would be the z uptime release. Get it, not zero down time, but no up time... Ok. Be that way. Oh, the change to the left control key. Uh no. That is not where the original reset key was, was it? Anyhow, no, because the control key is mapped... never mind. You have to use that one to get PA1, PA2, ATTN Those are pre-mapped. It is starting to look like something in Windows is mangled, because certain other applications that expect one to use the arrow keys, aren't working either. Look, it was Monday right after a time change weekend. I think even the hardware is tired of Congress's meddling. But, it isn't the keyboard, because it is on a KVM switch and it works just fine with my Linux desktop, from which I am doing missives like this with/to
Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness
Good point Attila! I should have thought of that solution, as I have encountered that exact issue myself more than once but my keyboard (M$ Natural, the older version with all the extra media buttons) actually has a Scroll Lock key and I have accidentally pressed it more than once and wondered WTF? PEBKAC. Checking the Scroll Lock light on my keyboard is the signal that I missed when I have done it to myself, but Steve's keyboard may or may not have one of those if the key itself is not there. In Steve's case, you may have hit the nail on the head - the mapping for Scroll Lock changed unexpectedly and it unintentionally got pressed. Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Attila Fogarasi Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2022 12:13 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness Sounds like the dreaded Windows Scroll lock key. Pressing that will disable the arrow keys until Scroll lock is turned off. Now chances are your keyboard doesn't have a scroll lock key (most modern keyboards have dropped it as it does more harm than good), but Windows still has it internally. You can access it using the On-Screen Keyboard in Windows. Possibly the pushed software has changed keyboard mappings so that some other key that you innocently use has become the Scroll Lock key. Make sure it is off and see if your problem is fixed. PS. this has nothing to do with HOD or anything mainframe :) On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 8:36 AM Steve Thompson wrote: > Hi all: > > A few weeks ago at a client site, they force installed software on end > user computers (owned by the client) and since then I've been having > odd issues with HOD (Host on Demand - 3270 emulator). > Today, arrow keys are not working. And if you get into the keyboard > configuration system, you can click on "Search for a key" and it will > go to the line where that key is defined so you know what HOD thinks > it is for. > > Well, the arrow keys stopped working. So these are supposedly cursor > movement keys. And striking one of them gets no response (in HOD). > > They do work outside of HOD> > > Last time this happened it was the right "Alt" key being ignored > (which I have defined as . I remap a keyboard to as much as > possible emulate a true 3270 keyboard. I rebooted, I reloaded, and > didn't make a difference. Someone had me reset the key, and then it > started working. No Joy today. > > Right+ALT is behaving today. But not the arrow keys. > > This seems to be something going on with Windows. > > Any ideas of how to cure this thing (NO, I do not have the option of > running other than HOD). > > Regards, > Steve Thompson -- This message and any attachments are intended only for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If the reader of the message is not the intended recipient or an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail and delete the message and any attachments from your system. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness
Sounds like the dreaded Windows Scroll lock key. Pressing that will disable the arrow keys until Scroll lock is turned off. Now chances are your keyboard doesn't have a scroll lock key (most modern keyboards have dropped it as it does more harm than good), but Windows still has it internally. You can access it using the On-Screen Keyboard in Windows. Possibly the pushed software has changed keyboard mappings so that some other key that you innocently use has become the Scroll Lock key. Make sure it is off and see if your problem is fixed. PS. this has nothing to do with HOD or anything mainframe :) On Tue, Mar 15, 2022 at 8:36 AM Steve Thompson wrote: > Hi all: > > A few weeks ago at a client site, they force installed software > on end user computers (owned by the client) and since then I've > been having odd issues with HOD (Host on Demand - 3270 emulator). > Today, arrow keys are not working. And if you get into the > keyboard configuration system, you can click on "Search for a > key" and it will go to the line where that key is defined so you > know what HOD thinks it is for. > > Well, the arrow keys stopped working. So these are supposedly > cursor movement keys. And striking one of them gets no response > (in HOD). > > They do work outside of HOD> > > Last time this happened it was the right "Alt" key being ignored > (which I have defined as . I remap a keyboard to as much > as possible emulate a true 3270 keyboard. I rebooted, I reloaded, > and didn't make a difference. Someone had me reset the key, and > then it started working. No Joy today. > > Right+ALT is behaving today. But not the arrow keys. > > This seems to be something going on with Windows. > > Any ideas of how to cure this thing (NO, I do not have the option > of running other than HOD). > > Regards, > Steve Thompson > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness
Thank you for that picture. I had totally forgotten that was where the reset key was. I guess my problem is, even though I am a touch typist, I screw things up enough with a 3270 device that it is faster for me to right thumb a reset which is why I set it over there. And it may be because the left CTRL and/or ALT couldn't be remapped with the 3270 emulator software I had been running on early Windows software so I just got used to the right alt. Which I also made large use of SPF-PC and similar. There are fewer and fewer of us that have actually used 3270 devices. It will be the client's people. It is their laptop, and their software they push. And I will get told again, we have 16K users and you are the only one Yeah, I'm the only one that is a z/VM capacity planner too. sigh. (why am I posting here, because I also do TSO/ISPF REXX, SAS, and believe it or not, COBOL). Steve Thompson On 3/14/22 20:38, Farley, Peter x23353 wrote: Re: "That is not where the original reset key was, was it?" Yes it was, at least on all the "real iron" 3277/8/9 keyboards that I remember using. Pictures of a couple of 3278 keyboards that I found: https://vintagecomputer.ca/ibm-3277-and-3278-terminals/ibm-3278-keyboard/ https://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?t=9365 There are lots more around the net. I also map the Right-Ctrl key to 3270 Enter so I can hit it with my right thumb (left thumb for space bar, left pinky for "Reset" on Left-Ctrl), and remap keyboard "Enter" to 3270 "New Line", also mirroring the original "real iron" keyboards I used. You have my condolences for your current problem, and the fact that it is not just HOD having the issue surely means a Windows problem (or upgrade/patch needed for HOD and that other software to catch up to the enforced M$ changes). Good luck, I hope you or your employer's techies figure it out. Peter P.S. -- In my employer's PCOMM the "SYS ATTN" function is mapped to the Esc key, and PA1/2 are mapped to Alt-Insert and Alt-Home (but not on the numeric pad, just to the ones above the cursor keys). YMMV. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Steve Thompson Sent: Monday, March 14, 2022 8:12 PM To:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness Ok, I'm going to answer a few questions here: 1) I have been doing this with HOD since 2013. Any time something odd happens [wait, HOD, odd, hm], it typically has been some security software doing something incredibly stupid. Such as mangling the Outlook Profile because day ends in "y". 2) with #1 above, you can reboot all you want. Outlook stays broken. You actually have to remove the offending software and build a new profile (how would I know this? 3 guesses and the first 2 don't count). 3) Reboot? That was what finished the install of the pushed software. So yes, a re-reboot was done. Anyone wonder why M/S doesn't create a Windows Z release? Because that would be the z uptime release. Get it, not zero down time, but no up time... Ok. Be that way. Oh, the change to the left control key. Uh no. That is not where the original reset key was, was it? Anyhow, no, because the control key is mapped... never mind. You have to use that one to get PA1, PA2, ATTN Those are pre-mapped. It is starting to look like something in Windows is mangled, because certain other applications that expect one to use the arrow keys, aren't working either. Look, it was Monday right after a time change weekend. I think even the hardware is tired of Congress's meddling. But, it isn't the keyboard, because it is on a KVM switch and it works just fine with my Linux desktop, from which I am doing missives like this with/to IBM-Main, and other emails. And it worked fine with a non-client Windows laptop Regards, Steve Thompson ps. hope you enjoyed the attempts at humor. On 3/14/22 17:59, Farley, Peter x23353 wrote: Did you try mapping 3270 Reset to the Left-Ctrl key instead? That is the mapping I have used for decades as the 3270 Reset key (PCOMM and Vista). I have never tried to use the Alt keys to map to any 3270 key, as Windows is really funky about use of the Alt key - sometimes it seems to know it is there and other times not so much. It depends a whole lot on which Windows core service HOD uses to read keys. Use the wrong service and Alt-anything may not return anything at all, or if it does then unexpected values. BTDTGTTS from some open-source work I once did providing a Windows keyboard interface in previously linux-only code. HTH Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Steve Thompson Sent: Monday, March 14, 2022 5:37 PM To:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: HOD Keyboard weirdness Hi all: A few weeks ago at a client site, they force installed software on end user computers (owned by the client) and since then I've been having odd issues with HOD (Host on Demand - 3270 emulator).
Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness
Re: "That is not where the original reset key was, was it?" Yes it was, at least on all the "real iron" 3277/8/9 keyboards that I remember using. Pictures of a couple of 3278 keyboards that I found: https://vintagecomputer.ca/ibm-3277-and-3278-terminals/ibm-3278-keyboard/ https://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?t=9365 There are lots more around the net. I also map the Right-Ctrl key to 3270 Enter so I can hit it with my right thumb (left thumb for space bar, left pinky for "Reset" on Left-Ctrl), and remap keyboard "Enter" to 3270 "New Line", also mirroring the original "real iron" keyboards I used. You have my condolences for your current problem, and the fact that it is not just HOD having the issue surely means a Windows problem (or upgrade/patch needed for HOD and that other software to catch up to the enforced M$ changes). Good luck, I hope you or your employer's techies figure it out. Peter P.S. -- In my employer's PCOMM the "SYS ATTN" function is mapped to the Esc key, and PA1/2 are mapped to Alt-Insert and Alt-Home (but not on the numeric pad, just to the ones above the cursor keys). YMMV. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Steve Thompson Sent: Monday, March 14, 2022 8:12 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness Ok, I'm going to answer a few questions here: 1) I have been doing this with HOD since 2013. Any time something odd happens [wait, HOD, odd, hm], it typically has been some security software doing something incredibly stupid. Such as mangling the Outlook Profile because day ends in "y". 2) with #1 above, you can reboot all you want. Outlook stays broken. You actually have to remove the offending software and build a new profile (how would I know this? 3 guesses and the first 2 don't count). 3) Reboot? That was what finished the install of the pushed software. So yes, a re-reboot was done. Anyone wonder why M/S doesn't create a Windows Z release? Because that would be the z uptime release. Get it, not zero down time, but no up time... Ok. Be that way. Oh, the change to the left control key. Uh no. That is not where the original reset key was, was it? Anyhow, no, because the control key is mapped... never mind. You have to use that one to get PA1, PA2, ATTN Those are pre-mapped. It is starting to look like something in Windows is mangled, because certain other applications that expect one to use the arrow keys, aren't working either. Look, it was Monday right after a time change weekend. I think even the hardware is tired of Congress's meddling. But, it isn't the keyboard, because it is on a KVM switch and it works just fine with my Linux desktop, from which I am doing missives like this with/to IBM-Main, and other emails. And it worked fine with a non-client Windows laptop Regards, Steve Thompson ps. hope you enjoyed the attempts at humor. On 3/14/22 17:59, Farley, Peter x23353 wrote: > Did you try mapping 3270 Reset to the Left-Ctrl key instead? That is the > mapping I have used for decades as the 3270 Reset key (PCOMM and Vista). I > have never tried to use the Alt keys to map to any 3270 key, as Windows is > really funky about use of the Alt key - sometimes it seems to know it is > there and other times not so much. It depends a whole lot on which Windows > core service HOD uses to read keys. Use the wrong service and Alt-anything > may not return anything at all, or if it does then unexpected values. > BTDTGTTS from some open-source work I once did providing a Windows keyboard > interface in previously linux-only code. > > HTH > > Peter > > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On > Behalf Of Steve Thompson > Sent: Monday, March 14, 2022 5:37 PM > To:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU > Subject: HOD Keyboard weirdness > > Hi all: > > A few weeks ago at a client site, they force installed software on end > user computers (owned by the client) and since then I've been having > odd issues with HOD (Host on Demand - 3270 emulator). > Today, arrow keys are not working. And if you get into the keyboard > configuration system, you can click on "Search for a key" and it will > go to the line where that key is defined so you know what HOD thinks > it is for. > > Well, the arrow keys stopped working. So these are supposedly cursor > movement keys. And striking one of them gets no response (in HOD). > > They do work outside of HOD> > > Last time this happened it was the right "Alt" key being ignored > (which I have defined as . I remap a keyboard to as much as > possible emulate a true 3270 keyboard. I rebooted, I reloaded, and > didn't make a difference. Someone had me reset the key, and then it > started working. No Joy today. > > Right+ALT is behaving today. But not the arrow keys. > > This seems to be something going on with Windows. > > Any ideas of how to cure this thing (NO, I do not have the option of > running other than
Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness
Ok, I'm going to answer a few questions here: 1) I have been doing this with HOD since 2013. Any time something odd happens [wait, HOD, odd, hm], it typically has been some security software doing something incredibly stupid. Such as mangling the Outlook Profile because day ends in "y". 2) with #1 above, you can reboot all you want. Outlook stays broken. You actually have to remove the offending software and build a new profile (how would I know this? 3 guesses and the first 2 don't count). 3) Reboot? That was what finished the install of the pushed software. So yes, a re-reboot was done. Anyone wonder why M/S doesn't create a Windows Z release? Because that would be the z uptime release. Get it, not zero down time, but no up time... Ok. Be that way. Oh, the change to the left control key. Uh no. That is not where the original reset key was, was it? Anyhow, no, because the control key is mapped... never mind. You have to use that one to get PA1, PA2, ATTN Those are pre-mapped. It is starting to look like something in Windows is mangled, because certain other applications that expect one to use the arrow keys, aren't working either. Look, it was Monday right after a time change weekend. I think even the hardware is tired of Congress's meddling. But, it isn't the keyboard, because it is on a KVM switch and it works just fine with my Linux desktop, from which I am doing missives like this with/to IBM-Main, and other emails. And it worked fine with a non-client Windows laptop Regards, Steve Thompson ps. hope you enjoyed the attempts at humor. On 3/14/22 17:59, Farley, Peter x23353 wrote: Did you try mapping 3270 Reset to the Left-Ctrl key instead? That is the mapping I have used for decades as the 3270 Reset key (PCOMM and Vista). I have never tried to use the Alt keys to map to any 3270 key, as Windows is really funky about use of the Alt key - sometimes it seems to know it is there and other times not so much. It depends a whole lot on which Windows core service HOD uses to read keys. Use the wrong service and Alt-anything may not return anything at all, or if it does then unexpected values. BTDTGTTS from some open-source work I once did providing a Windows keyboard interface in previously linux-only code. HTH Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Steve Thompson Sent: Monday, March 14, 2022 5:37 PM To:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: HOD Keyboard weirdness Hi all: A few weeks ago at a client site, they force installed software on end user computers (owned by the client) and since then I've been having odd issues with HOD (Host on Demand - 3270 emulator). Today, arrow keys are not working. And if you get into the keyboard configuration system, you can click on "Search for a key" and it will go to the line where that key is defined so you know what HOD thinks it is for. Well, the arrow keys stopped working. So these are supposedly cursor movement keys. And striking one of them gets no response (in HOD). They do work outside of HOD> Last time this happened it was the right "Alt" key being ignored (which I have defined as . I remap a keyboard to as much as possible emulate a true 3270 keyboard. I rebooted, I reloaded, and didn't make a difference. Someone had me reset the key, and then it started working. No Joy today. Right+ALT is behaving today. But not the arrow keys. This seems to be something going on with Windows. Any ideas of how to cure this thing (NO, I do not have the option of running other than HOD). Regards, Steve Thompson -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: [MVS-OE] Passwordless login omvs
I wish that IBM could totally replace JCL. Or come up with something better. But, I have a feeling that few, if any, would use it unless it had restart capabilities at least as good as CA-11. Take away CA-11 from product support, and there would be blood running thick in the streets. That's why REXX cannot replace JCL. On Mon, Mar 14, 2022, 12:20 Steve Smith wrote: > re JCL: Someone in the recent past noted that calling JCL a language was a > reach exceeding its grasp. It's certainly not a procedural language; I > just consider it a work order. In any case, MVS has scripting capabilities > (e.g. REXX) if you prefer. > > re client/server: that's what I get for presuming. > > sas > > > On Mon, Mar 14, 2022 at 12:30 AM Paul Gilmartin < > 000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote: > > > On Sun, 13 Mar 2022 22:07:28 -0400, Steve Smith wrote: > > > > >Just reminds me that sh script is disgusting. Brainfrack can't be much > > >worse. Is "done" the end of a do? Shouldn't it be "od"? > > > > > So it's not your favorite language. JCL iisn't mine (Shouldn't an IF > > range end with FI?) Have you any constructive suggestions? > > > > >Anyways, I presume that this applies to the client side, and also I > > presume > > >the OP uses the same client system for two different systems, so how > could > > >this be the problem? > > > > > Different configurations of the two hosts? > > > > -- > > gil > > > > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness
Did you try mapping 3270 Reset to the Left-Ctrl key instead? That is the mapping I have used for decades as the 3270 Reset key (PCOMM and Vista). I have never tried to use the Alt keys to map to any 3270 key, as Windows is really funky about use of the Alt key - sometimes it seems to know it is there and other times not so much. It depends a whole lot on which Windows core service HOD uses to read keys. Use the wrong service and Alt-anything may not return anything at all, or if it does then unexpected values. BTDTGTTS from some open-source work I once did providing a Windows keyboard interface in previously linux-only code. HTH Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Steve Thompson Sent: Monday, March 14, 2022 5:37 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: HOD Keyboard weirdness Hi all: A few weeks ago at a client site, they force installed software on end user computers (owned by the client) and since then I've been having odd issues with HOD (Host on Demand - 3270 emulator). Today, arrow keys are not working. And if you get into the keyboard configuration system, you can click on "Search for a key" and it will go to the line where that key is defined so you know what HOD thinks it is for. Well, the arrow keys stopped working. So these are supposedly cursor movement keys. And striking one of them gets no response (in HOD). They do work outside of HOD> Last time this happened it was the right "Alt" key being ignored (which I have defined as . I remap a keyboard to as much as possible emulate a true 3270 keyboard. I rebooted, I reloaded, and didn't make a difference. Someone had me reset the key, and then it started working. No Joy today. Right+ALT is behaving today. But not the arrow keys. This seems to be something going on with Windows. Any ideas of how to cure this thing (NO, I do not have the option of running other than HOD). Regards, Steve Thompson -- This message and any attachments are intended only for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If the reader of the message is not the intended recipient or an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail and delete the message and any attachments from your system. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: HOD Keyboard weirdness
You tried re-booting, the first choice in solutions to all Windows problems? Charles -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Steve Thompson Sent: Monday, March 14, 2022 2:37 PM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: HOD Keyboard weirdness Hi all: A few weeks ago at a client site, they force installed software on end user computers (owned by the client) and since then I've been having odd issues with HOD (Host on Demand - 3270 emulator). Today, arrow keys are not working. And if you get into the keyboard configuration system, you can click on "Search for a key" and it will go to the line where that key is defined so you know what HOD thinks it is for. Well, the arrow keys stopped working. So these are supposedly cursor movement keys. And striking one of them gets no response (in HOD). They do work outside of HOD> Last time this happened it was the right "Alt" key being ignored (which I have defined as . I remap a keyboard to as much as possible emulate a true 3270 keyboard. I rebooted, I reloaded, and didn't make a difference. Someone had me reset the key, and then it started working. No Joy today. Right+ALT is behaving today. But not the arrow keys. This seems to be something going on with Windows. Any ideas of how to cure this thing (NO, I do not have the option of running other than HOD). Regards, Steve Thompson -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
HOD Keyboard weirdness
Hi all: A few weeks ago at a client site, they force installed software on end user computers (owned by the client) and since then I've been having odd issues with HOD (Host on Demand - 3270 emulator). Today, arrow keys are not working. And if you get into the keyboard configuration system, you can click on "Search for a key" and it will go to the line where that key is defined so you know what HOD thinks it is for. Well, the arrow keys stopped working. So these are supposedly cursor movement keys. And striking one of them gets no response (in HOD). They do work outside of HOD> Last time this happened it was the right "Alt" key being ignored (which I have defined as . I remap a keyboard to as much as possible emulate a true 3270 keyboard. I rebooted, I reloaded, and didn't make a difference. Someone had me reset the key, and then it started working. No Joy today. Right+ALT is behaving today. But not the arrow keys. This seems to be something going on with Windows. Any ideas of how to cure this thing (NO, I do not have the option of running other than HOD). Regards, Steve Thompson -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Custompac override
Hello James, When you do a CustomPac software update, there are two critical jobs for you to run: VERIFY and RECATDS. These two jobs are described in your Installing Your Order book. See there for instructions. Since you are using an existing master catalog for your V2.4 data sets, you'll need to make sure you are using indirect cataloging so that the new volume can share that master catalog. In the VERIFY job, you'll need to specify the volumes you used on V2.4 in the P2IMAP, and the symbol you want to use for it. For instance, this is what my P2IMAP looks like: C90ES1 SD110 ** ZC112 ZD110 Then, the VERIFY job will understand how to "match" up the data sets and won't recatalog something you need, because it can be reused. If you have moved your SYS1.PARMLIB data set in your incoming V2.4 ServerPac, you'll need to resolve that somehow (moving the volume to the location that your master catalog is referencing, or renaming the data set so it doesn't clash.) Once you have everything to your satisfaction in VERIFY, then your run RECATDS. Thanks, Marna WALLE z/OS System Install and Upgrade -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: [MVS-OE] Passwordless login omvs
re JCL: Someone in the recent past noted that calling JCL a language was a reach exceeding its grasp. It's certainly not a procedural language; I just consider it a work order. In any case, MVS has scripting capabilities (e.g. REXX) if you prefer. re client/server: that's what I get for presuming. sas On Mon, Mar 14, 2022 at 12:30 AM Paul Gilmartin < 000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote: > On Sun, 13 Mar 2022 22:07:28 -0400, Steve Smith wrote: > > >Just reminds me that sh script is disgusting. Brainfrack can't be much > >worse. Is "done" the end of a do? Shouldn't it be "od"? > > > So it's not your favorite language. JCL iisn't mine (Shouldn't an IF > range end with FI?) Have you any constructive suggestions? > > >Anyways, I presume that this applies to the client side, and also I > presume > >the OP uses the same client system for two different systems, so how could > >this be the problem? > > > Different configurations of the two hosts? > > -- > gil > > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: [MVS-OE] Passwordless login omvs
On Mon, 14 Mar 2022 14:03:22 +, Seymour J Metz wrote: >I believe that the are languages that use inverted keywords to end blocks, >leading to the infamous "comment bletch! tnemmoc". Personally, I prefer "end" >or "endif", optionally with a label, > What idiot designing JCL's "IF" chose not to require that label fields on "ELSE" and "ENDIF" match that on the corresponding "IF" for nesting validation‽ > ... to terminate everything but comments, for which I like the PL/I syntax > "/* foo */", although line comments have their uses. > Perhaps the worst is ALGOL 60's "end" ";", leading compiler implementers to provide a "Delimiter in comment" warning. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: [MVS-OE] Passwordless login omvs
I believe that the are languages that use inverted keywords to end blocks,
leading to the infamous "comment bletch! tnemmoc". Personally, I prefer "end"
or "endif", optionally with a label, to terminate everything but comments, for
which I like the PL/I syntax "/* foo */", although line comments have their
uses.
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of
Steve Smith [sasd...@gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2022 10:07 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [MVS-OE] Passwordless login omvs
Just reminds me that sh script is disgusting. Brainfrack can't be much
worse. Is "done" the end of a do? Shouldn't it be "od"?
Anyways, I presume that this applies to the client side, and also I presume
the OP uses the same client system for two different systems, so how could
this be the problem?
I would like to see complete set up instructions for ssh/sshd, like JES2
provides for its (ridiculous) notify to email. Maybe it's better that one
learns all the parts, and learns how to put them together. So be it, but I
can hardly find ssh mentioned anywhere in either CS or USS libraries.
sas
On Sun, Mar 13, 2022 at 5:40 PM Paul Gilmartin <
000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> On Mar 13, 2022, at 08:07:33, Jake Anderson
> wrote:
> >
> > I was able to copy it
> > We have two environment LPAR1 and LPAR2
> >
> > Certificate based SSH login is successful on LPAR2 but for LPAR1 It asks
> > for password.
> >
> Ssh requires, but does not diagnose clearly, that no directory
> in the path from root to ~/.ssh be writable by other than the
> .ssh owner lest a (fe)malefactor modify the permissions.
>
> This POSIX shell script reports any weaknesses:
> #! /bin/sh
>
> # Doc: Verify that strangers can't modify path to "'".
>
> _UNIX03=YES export _UNIX03
> ${1+cd "$1"} || exit 103 # Defauot is PWD.
> echo " Testing: $( ls -ld "$( pwd -P . )" )" >&2
> while :; do
> P=$( pwd -P . ) || exit 104
> L=$( ls -ld "$P" )
> # # echo " Testing: $L" >&2
> case "$L" in
> w* | ?w* )
> echo "!!! writable !!!: $L" >&2
> exit 1;;
> esac
> [ "x/" = "x$P" ] && exit 0
> cd -P .. || exit 102
> done
>
> --
> gil
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>
--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
