Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z
> **grin** Anybody interested? > > It could get me my job back! :-) I was dumped together with the IBM boxes (well, not at the same time, to save me from the impact) when my employer was taken over by another company which ran similar applications on OpenVMS. Sadly, they then outsourced the operations to EDS (HP), so I don't think there could be an IBM sale there. But you never know... Ivica
Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z
- Original Message - From: David Boyes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Subject: Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2008 10:24:01 -0400 > > I didn't know that OpenVMS could run on Intel Itaniums, > > but it sounds way cool. > > Yes. It's a relatively recent development (and about 20 > years too late -- we could have been spared Windows > entirely if DEC had bought a clue way back when...*sigh*), > but it's actually fueling a renaissance in VMS usage. VMS > is a nice, tight, secure, easy to manage system, with > decent batch and tape processing capabilities, and > excellent compilers and compatibility with the IBM > extensions for COBOL, a decent CICS replacement, etc, etc. > It's a terrific replacement for small VSE and z/OS shops > who can't get an affordable z system these days. HP > doesn't seem to have such a huge problem with hobbyist use > , either. > So this is a port of OpenVMS itself, and not some other VMS emulator, right? The oil/gas business went nuts over the DEC VAX boxes, running VMS, for number crunch seismic applications, and I've used it beforevery nice interactive system. The editor would automatically create versions of files as you made revisions. so going back to a previous version was very simple. I never saw anything that could come close to that until I got to use Xedit with Update. The other thing about VMS was the quality of the DEC supplied compilers. Fortran was very common, of course, but DEC also put out an excellent, full featured PL/I one as well. And all compiled languages used the same calling conventions and common run time library, so writing apps using different languages was a snap. Somewhere around here I still have the complete set of DEC VMS PL/I documentation. > Now if someone would port REXX to VMS instead of DCL... > hmm. Now that's a useful thought. > That would certainly mark an improvement over DCL, which I though was a bit too difficult to use. DJ > > What's next, Mac under z/VM? :-) > > TOPS-20, of course. If I say "fiat lux", then I expect the > OS to turn the lights on reliably, with a proper Emacs for > editing the universe's config files. Galaxy on Z -- it's > about time we got a decent batch system for Z. > *grin* 8-) > > Actually, if this emulation approach we're using for the > Alpha works out as it appears to be doing, PPC operating > systems like AIX and i5OS would be a logical next step. > Licensing for Mac OSX Server would probably just be a > RPITA to get, even if I could get proper emulation > working.
Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z
On Tue, 9 Sep 2008 10:24:01 -0400 David Boyes said: >> I didn't know that OpenVMS could run on Intel Itaniums, but >> it sounds way cool. >Yes. It's a relatively recent development (and about 20 years too late >-- we could have been spared Windows entirely if DEC had bought a clue >way back when...*sigh*), but it's actually fueling a renaissance in VMS >usage. VMS is a nice, tight, secure, easy to manage system, with decent >batch and tape processing capabilities, and excellent compilers and >compatibility with the IBM extensions for COBOL, a decent CICS >replacement, etc, etc. It's a terrific replacement for small VSE and >z/OS shops who can't get an affordable z system these days. HP doesn't >seem to have such a huge problem with hobbyist use, either. >Now if someone would port REXX to VMS instead of DCL... hmm. Now that's >a useful thought. Regina doesn't have a specific OpenVMS download, but it does claim support http://regina-rexx.sourceforge.net/index.html and the 3.4 change log (from Dec 2007) has - Better VMS support courtesy of Bernard Giroud The 3.0 change log has this entry as part of its restrictions for strict ANSI mode: BIFS not allowed: All VMS F$ functions /ahw
Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z
> I didn't know that OpenVMS could run on Intel Itaniums, but > it sounds way cool. Yes. It's a relatively recent development (and about 20 years too late -- we could have been spared Windows entirely if DEC had bought a clue way back when...*sigh*), but it's actually fueling a renaissance in VMS usage. VMS is a nice, tight, secure, easy to manage system, with decent batch and tape processing capabilities, and excellent compilers and compatibility with the IBM extensions for COBOL, a decent CICS replacement, etc, etc. It's a terrific replacement for small VSE and z/OS shops who can't get an affordable z system these days. HP doesn't seem to have such a huge problem with hobbyist use, either. Now if someone would port REXX to VMS instead of DCL... hmm. Now that's a useful thought. > What's next, Mac under z/VM? :-) TOPS-20, of course. If I say "fiat lux", then I expect the OS to turn the lights on reliably, with a proper Emacs for editing the universe's config files. Galaxy on Z -- it's about time we got a decent batch system for Z. *grin* 8-) Actually, if this emulation approach we're using for the Alpha works out as it appears to be doing, PPC operating systems like AIX and i5OS would be a logical next step. Licensing for Mac OSX Server would probably just be a RPITA to get, even if I could get proper emulation working.
Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z
Someone please correct me and tell me that it is really running as a guest os :) :) :) On Sep 8, 2008, at 5:19 PM, dave wrote: Ditto, what Paul said.:-) I didn't know that OpenVMS could run on Intel Itaniums, but it sounds way cool. DJ What's next, Mac under z/VM? :-) - Original Message - From: Paul Raulerson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Subject: Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 17:36:51 -0500 Holy (!&^#) Batman!! Would you believe I have been moving some of my personal clients (not my day job :) onto OpenVMS on Itaniums because: (1) The clients are purely disgusted with the iSeries world. The thing is now named "i" - no series! Try to explain that to a an irritated customer! (2) The clients don't have budgets big enough to move to an zSeries solution, especially since PSI and Flex seem dead, and IBM is taking its sweet time about coming out with an affordable small system (ala MP3Ks...) (3) HP has a great developer program (4) I an put them on an Itanium, with software, for under $10K. Under $3K if they are okay with used hardware. Alphas are even less, but are *all* used hardware. Wow... Yeah, I'm interested. :) On Sep 8, 2008, at 2:19 PM, David Boyes wrote: Latest interesting step: I’ve gotten a partial boot of OpenVMS in a virtual machine on System z. Some instruction emulation still needs work (the Alpha POP is a little unclear in a few areas), but we have system services initializing and hardware detection is fully functional. *grin* Anybody interested? -- db David Boyes Sine Nomine Associates
Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z
I must admit, when I realized it was just he ES40 emulator (running under Linux?) I was a bit disappointed. I was thinking it was running as a VM guest, like Solaris. I have not been able to get that emulator to run reliably under Intel Linux. (*sigh*) On Sep 8, 2008, at 5:19 PM, dave wrote: Ditto, what Paul said.:-) I didn't know that OpenVMS could run on Intel Itaniums, but it sounds way cool. DJ What's next, Mac under z/VM? :-) - Original Message - From: Paul Raulerson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Subject: Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 17:36:51 -0500 Holy (!&^#) Batman!! Would you believe I have been moving some of my personal clients (not my day job :) onto OpenVMS on Itaniums because: (1) The clients are purely disgusted with the iSeries world. The thing is now named "i" - no series! Try to explain that to a an irritated customer! (2) The clients don't have budgets big enough to move to an zSeries solution, especially since PSI and Flex seem dead, and IBM is taking its sweet time about coming out with an affordable small system (ala MP3Ks...) (3) HP has a great developer program (4) I an put them on an Itanium, with software, for under $10K. Under $3K if they are okay with used hardware. Alphas are even less, but are *all* used hardware. Wow... Yeah, I'm interested. :) On Sep 8, 2008, at 2:19 PM, David Boyes wrote: Latest interesting step: I’ve gotten a partial boot of OpenVMS in a virtual machine on System z. Some instruction emulation still needs work (the Alpha POP is a little unclear in a few areas), but we have system services initializing and hardware detection is fully functional. *grin* Anybody interested? -- db David Boyes Sine Nomine Associates
Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z
Ditto, what Paul said.:-) I didn't know that OpenVMS could run on Intel Itaniums, but it sounds way cool. DJ What's next, Mac under z/VM? :-) - Original Message - From: Paul Raulerson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: IBMVM@LISTSERV.UARK.EDU Subject: Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 17:36:51 -0500 > Holy (!&^#) Batman!! > > Would you believe I have been moving some of my personal > clients (not my day job :) onto OpenVMS on Itaniums > because: > > (1) The clients are purely disgusted with the iSeries > world. The thing is now named "i" - no series! Try to > explain that to a > an irritated customer! > > (2) The clients don't have budgets big enough to move to > an zSeries solution, especially since PSI and Flex seem > dead, > and IBM is taking its sweet time about coming out > with an affordable small system (ala MP3Ks...) > > (3) HP has a great developer program > > (4) I an put them on an Itanium, with software, for > under $10K. Under $3K if they are okay with used > hardware. Alphas are even less, but are *all* used > hardware. Wow... > > Yeah, I'm interested. :) > > > > On Sep 8, 2008, at 2:19 PM, David Boyes wrote: > > > Latest interesting step: Ive gotten a partial boot of > > OpenVMS in a virtual machine on System z. Some > > instruction emulation still needs work (the Alpha POP > > is a little unclear in a few areas), but we have > system services initializing and hardware detection is > > fully functional. > > > > *grin* Anybody interested? > > > > -- db > > > > David Boyes > > Sine Nomine Associates > >
Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z
Holy (!&^#) Batman!! Would you believe I have been moving some of my personal clients (not my day job :) onto OpenVMS on Itaniums because: (1) The clients are purely disgusted with the iSeries world. The thing is now named "i" - no series! Try to explain that to a an irritated customer! (2) The clients don't have budgets big enough to move to an zSeries solution, especially since PSI and Flex seem dead, and IBM is taking its sweet time about coming out with an affordable small system (ala MP3Ks...) (3) HP has a great developer program (4) I an put them on an Itanium, with software, for under $10K. Under $3K if they are okay with used hardware. Alphas are even less, but are *all* used hardware. Wow... Yeah, I'm interested. :) On Sep 8, 2008, at 2:19 PM, David Boyes wrote: Latest interesting step: I’ve gotten a partial boot of OpenVMS in a virtual machine on System z. Some instruction emulation still needs work (the Alpha POP is a little unclear in a few areas), but we have system services initializing and hardware detection is fully functional. *grin* Anybody interested? -- db David Boyes Sine Nomine Associates
FW: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z
I realized I just responded to Scott. For the rest of you: From: David Boyes Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 5:06 PM To: 'Scott Rohling' Subject: FW: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z Uh Yeah!! More info please! :-) I've enhanced the ES40 Alpha emulator to run more smoothly on Z (added some instruction optimization for the z9 instruction set, and some lookahead code to try to do a better job of predictive branching on Z (the Alpha does this strangely)). It seems to deal pretty well with OpenVMS 7.x Alpha install CDs up to the point of going multiuser - I think I have something wrong in the stack handler, but I'm making progress. What interests you about it? I'd like to be able to tell the IBM PTBs that someone is really interested. 8-) -- db
Re: Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z
Uh Yeah!! More info please! :-) Sent from my iPhone On Sep 8, 2008, at 1:19 PM, David Boyes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Latest interesting step: I’ve gotten a partial boot of OpenVMS in a virtual machine on System z. Some instruction emulation still needs work (the Alpha POP is a little unclear in a few areas), but we have system services initializing and hardware detection is fully functi onal. *grin* Anybody interested? -- db David Boyes Sine Nomine Associates
Partially Successful: OpenVMS on System z
Latest interesting step: I've gotten a partial boot of OpenVMS in a virtual machine on System z. Some instruction emulation still needs work (the Alpha POP is a little unclear in a few areas), but we have system services initializing and hardware detection is fully functional. *grin* Anybody interested? -- db David Boyes Sine Nomine Associates
