Re: [IceHorses] Kentucky Icelandic Horse Show
On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 22:34:16 -0600, you wrote: sometimes transitioning a horse from shoes to barefoot takes a long time. And sometimes, it's not possible at all, depending on the horse, where he's ridden, and the conditions he's kept in (for instance, in areas with high, frequent rainfall so the feet are usually very soft and moist). Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk --- Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
RE: [IceHorses] Re: Too Much, Too Soon / Ulcers
Karen, can you recap a little about ulcers... how to tell if your horse has them, symptoms, what to do, etc. I assumed when I agreed to take Tivar that he would have back issues. His symptoms were a sour attitude, and a tendency to buck, although he'd never bucked hard enough to unseat a rider. I thought I'd see what I could do with him. Since I'd had Gracie and Loftur, I knew I had access to a vet who is great with back ailments, using either eastern or western medicine, or a combination of both. I had Tivar's teeth checked immediately, and they kind of needed floating, but not badly - you might say they were due, but not past due. The vet also did acupuncture on him, but where we see immediate and obvious results with Gracie after a session, it was like nothing had changed at all with Tivar...he'd had acupuncture before I was told, but the session here didn't help. His attitude was just as sour a couple of days later (they get at least one day off after acupuncture) as it had been. In fact, the vet told us that his back was amazingly pain-free - she said she rarely saw one as non-reactive on exam as his was. Tivar also had the most dramatic reaction to his nose being handled of any horse I can remember. He has great ground manners in general, but he almost knocked me down the first time I touched his muzzle. He'd do it no matter how gently we tried to approach him, even with some VERY patient handling. When the vet sedated him for the floating, she found the first clue: there were deep and old ulcers on each side of his mouth, right at the inside corners of his lip. Based on the scarring, she guessed that they had been there for many months, maybe longer. We decided since his symptoms were so vague, and that another symptom we immediately noticed was as sensitivity to his sides being touched, to take him next to the massage-acupressure guy who works with the vet a couple of hours away who helped Gracie and Loftur.When his sides were touched, by a human hand or by a stirrup, his reaction was VERY strong. He'd get an extremely pissy expression, refusing to go forward, and he'd even cow-kick up towards the foot in the stirrup. He also made a gesture to bite at the stirrup. I made an appointment with him at the clinic on a day the vet would be in, so he could do the massage and if necessary, call the vet in for a quick assessment for what to do next. So, the second opinion was essentially the same as the dental vet's opinion: his back wasn't bad at all, but everyone could easily see the pissy attitude. The massage guy told me he wasn't the typical horse that he works on, and that he suspected his problem might be internal...and considering that Tivar's symptoms only first appeared after his first 'tolt training experience, and that they would magnify in any subsequent training environment, it suddenly seemed pretty plausible. Also, I'm pretty sure that Tivar's first bucking attempts came after he was ridden in a tight, Icelandic-style saddle that may have even had a damaged tree. When that vet, the one with the wonderful track record with Gracie and Loftur (and who has even been an Olympic team doctor) came over to see Tivar that day (the first time he'd seen him) he offered a couple of suggestions. His first thought was ulcers, since we'd already checked him for the other first-suspects. He told us that he could scope him for a positive diagnosis, but that scopes can't see what's in the deepest reaches, so even a negative scope wouldn't be conclusive. Or, he suggested, we could just save the cost of the scope and treat him with UlcerGard. My good friend is a vet, and after I got home and discussed it with her, she called the makers of UlcerGard. She was happy with the lack of negative side-effects...and she had the foresight to ask how big a horse would the normal dosage treat - and the answer was 1400 pounds. She asked about a 750-ish pound horse, and they advised half a dose. So, I went ahead and treated him, giving him the 3-4 weeks off, only doing some VERY light groundwork with him, and mostly grooming him or taking him for walks on the trail. The results were amazing. His attitude picked up immediately, and he stopped the cow kicking over the stirrups touching him. He was willing to go forward, eager to see the world. It was quite a dramatic change, as I'm sure some of you remember from my updates I regularly posted here during the period. Tivar also had many saddle-fittings over the years and the consensus was that he is best in a treeless saddle. We tried the Barefoot on him and it was fine, but eventually decided to try the Sensation on him. He was equally good in the Sensation. One other really odd thing: when he came to us, he had marked divots behind his withers - one reason I'm sure saddle fitters recommended him use treeless saddles. Just before he was to go to Janice, I noticed that, while the divots were still there, part of his natural
RE: [IceHorses] Kentucky Icelandic Horse Show
i'm currently working on making adjustments to my treeless saddle, as stjarni's winter coat is coming in with some white hairs underneath where the free-swing stirrup butterfly piece lies, indicating rubbing or soreness, although he still is never tense there under massage. That sounds really quick for white hairs to come in. Usually, it takes consistent pressure over time for white hairs to come in. You just got that saddle, what 2-3 months ago? And I'm pretty sure you said that you often use the other saddle (Hrimmir?) for lessons, still? And you weigh around 100 pounds? I've used Sensations for three years now, and I weigh almost 140 now - sigh. I still haven't seen any white hairs from any of them. I'd think that white hairs are much more likely to be coming from something that happened months or years ago, considering how little you weigh and how briefly you've had the saddle, and that it's still not the horse's full-time saddle. Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] IceHorses Community for Photos and Videos: http://kickapps.com/icehorses The greatest enemy of the truth very often is not the lie- deliberate, contrived and dishonest -- but the myth -- persistent, persuasive and unrealistic. All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. ~ Arthur Schopenhauer [] Lee Ziegler http://leeziegler.com [] Liz Graves http://lizgraves.com [] Lee's Book Easy Gaited Horses http://tinyurl.com/7vyjo [] IceHorses Map http://www.frappr.com/IceHorses Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/IceHorses/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[IceHorses] Re: Too Much, Too Soon / Ulcers
--- In IceHorses@yahoogroups.com, Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When the vet sedated him for the floating, she found the first clue: there were deep and old ulcers on each side of his mouth, right at the inside corners of his lip. Based on the scarring, she guessed that they had been there for many months, maybe longer. -Wow, any idea on what caused them? If they were on the inside corners of his lip, does that mean that a dropped noseband could have possibly caused it, or caused him more pain? And is this the same Tivar that Janice now has? One other really odd thing: when he came to us, he had marked divots behind his withers - one reason I'm sure saddle fitters recommended him use treeless saddles. Just before he was to go to Janice, I noticed that, while the divots were still there, part of his natural conformation, they had filled in, noticeably in just a couple of months. Karen Thomas -Osp had these divots too. A few months after we switched to Sensations, those divots also filled in. The change was actually pretty dramatic in such a short time. I know those divots on Osp were caused by not being able to find a saddle wide enough for her. The Sensation has resolved that issue. Interestingly though, I had to even remove the knee blocks on my Sensation altogether because she's too wide for me to even use them. I could see indentations from them after the first ride. I don't normally like knee blocks anyway, so it didn't break my heart at all to put them in my tack trunk :-). Dawn Bruin-Slot, northern Michigan Fuzzy Logic Equine
[IceHorses] Re: bitless, hackamores, etc
--- In IceHorses@yahoogroups.com, Laree Shulman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At least I got across the point that most horses will do quitewell without a bit if they are trained well. Laree --That's really cool Laree! I had the opportunity to show the owner of the Tennessee Walker I've been riding how wonderful he goes in a sidepull. They had never ridden him in anything other than a snaffle. The owner was very skeptical in me being able to stop him. I asked him to watch us for a minute, and I asked the sweet big boy to stop. His stop was very soft and responsive, which floored the owner. It was a pretty neat moment. We ride in various sidepulls. Every once in a while, I'll ride in a kimberwick with a slightly ported mouth (solid mouthpiece) if I need to have really fine communication, but most of the horses I've ridden do really well in a sidepull. I haven't personally ridden in a Dr. Cook's bridle, but have seen various people ride in them. I know they do work for some people, but the horses I've seen in them tossed their heads frequently, were very hollow in how they moved, and just didn't seem comfortable at all. It could have been that they were not properly trained with the bridle, not sure. Dawn Bruin-Slot, northern Michigan Fuzzy Logic Equine
RE: [IceHorses] Re: Too Much, Too Soon / Ulcers
-Wow, any idea on what caused them? If they were on the inside corners of his lip, does that mean that a dropped noseband could have possibly caused it, or caused him more pain? No idea. He was away at training when the symptoms first started, so who knows. He was five at the time, and Ann said he came back tolting after just a couple of months. Considering that Tivar is basically built for trot, that's pretty fast. In fact, he still doesn't tolt at age 10, but has started OFFERING Janice some foxtrot/foxwalk of his own accord. Tivar has a lovely, lovely jog too, one that I could ride all day on the trail. If you ask me, he don't need no stinkin' tolt! He's a great horse, just as he is. Off record, I've always grimaced when I've seen the tight nosebands and the horses ridden with their bit rings pulled up to their eyeballs. But can I say with certainly that caused Tivar's mouth ulcers...? No. But, he did tolt in a pretty short time I thank Ann for talking about him on the list a couple of years ago, which brought him to my attention. She could have swept it under the rug, like the stories of many problem Icelandic's I hear about off the list, but she came forward, asking for help. And is this the same Tivar that Janice now has? Yes. I got him in March 2006. Janice went through the painful loss of her rehab, Stali (near starvation then rabies) around the first of June. I ended up with healthy, smart Svertla who came from the same home that Stali came from. When Tivar started responding, it seemed natural that I let her take him, because she's done so well with her other problem horses. It was a red-letter day when my friend, Shirley, said:. If Janice likes to work with a challenging horse, we'd better stop working with Tivar now. He was THAT improved after the ulcer treatment that he seemed like a new horse. Don't get me wrong - he still has his memories, and Janice can tell you that. She took him home in November, and the rest is history. He has an owner that adores him, for the wonderful horse that he is.Tivar will never forget...I just wish we knew his whole story. Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.14/999 - Release Date: 9/10/2007 5:43 PM
[IceHorses] Lesson on steep hills
My neighbor and I went out to do some hill work on Sunday. She is a 3 Day Eventer and an instructor. We hit some hills that I have only looked at for the past 7 years. They have always been pretty intimidating to me. They are steep, probably about 55* to 60* incline. Soft sand. We did a less steep and shorter one first, and Sharon had me keep Whisper light in the bridle so she would learn to use her HQ's to drive herself up vs. dragging herself up with her forehand. Going up is easy for me, it's the going down that petrifies me (I am afraid of heights). Same thing, she had me (try) to keep Whisper light in the bridle and do a LOT of half halts going down so gravity did not just take us down and Whisper started using her HQ to go down after several tries. She was definately fighting the bit, tho and just wanted to plummet down! Then we hit the longer/steeper hill. Going up was fine, and Whisper stayed light in front and I could feel her using her rear end to dig in the sand and walk up the hill. We even did several halts going up. Sharon said I was ready to decend the steep hill, and I was hesitant, but she said we could do it, so we did. She had me halt a couple of times, which helped keep Whisper from wanting to plummet down. The first time down the steep one I felt like I had really accomplished something and overcome something I am afraid of. We did this a couple more times, before we came home. I told Sharon I wanted a lesson at the posting trot because that is the gait I will use most for endurance and I want to be a better balanced rider for my horse for the long distances. I will be getting a lunge line lesson Thursday afternoon at the posting trot WITHOUT stirrups. Oh, man, I can already feel my muscles burning! Susan in NV Nevermore Ranch http://users.oasisol.com/nevermore/ Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us. http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7
Re: [IceHorses] Kentucky Icelandic Horse Show
On Mon, Sep 10, 2007 at 10:34:16PM -0600, Wanda Lauscher wrote: Hi Vicka, sometimes transitioning a horse from shoes to barefoot takes a long time. Especially if they've worn shoes for a very long time. Boots may help him while he transittions. *nod* i may end up buying him boots. right now he changes his opinions from moment to moment, and i don't know if he *will* get past the ouchy phase if he doesn't have (limited) exposure to the ouchy bits -- human feet sure don't adapt that way. and they got him past the ouchy phase, and he had only light riding during those times. I also gave him the choice of being ridden or not. If I walked out with a bridle and Hreggur came to meet me, it was a good day and off we went. If he stood in a corner and tried to ignore meI allowed him to be ignored. stjarni is as willing as ever, probably because the ring doesn't hurt and he enjoys the trail anyway. i do let him pick his footing outside, but we've been doing a lot of bushwhacking (i have quite the set of scrapes on my face) and i know it's still not keeping him away from the rocks; that's not really possible in our state forest. Do you have pics of Stjarni's feet? Hreggur had terribly contracted feet and it took a long time for his heels to open up. I have pics somewhere... no, but i can certainly take some if folks would like. --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Kentucky Icelandic Horse Show
On Tue, Sep 11, 2007 at 08:28:22AM +0100, Mic Rushen wrote: On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 22:34:16 -0600, you wrote: sometimes transitioning a horse from shoes to barefoot takes a long time. And sometimes, it's not possible at all, depending on the horse, where he's ridden, and the conditions he's kept in (for instance, in areas with high, frequent rainfall so the feet are usually very soft and moist). we had a six-week drought that ended sunday, but usually it is pretty wet around here. --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] Kentucky Icelandic Horse Show
On Tue, Sep 11, 2007 at 07:13:23AM -0400, Karen Thomas wrote: i'm currently working on making adjustments to my treeless saddle, as stjarni's winter coat is coming in with some white hairs underneath where the free-swing stirrup butterfly piece lies, indicating rubbing or soreness, although he still is never tense there under massage. That sounds really quick for white hairs to come in. Usually, it takes consistent pressure over time for white hairs to come in. You just got that saddle, what 2-3 months ago? And I'm pretty sure you said that you often use the other saddle (Hrimmir?) for lessons, still? And you weigh around 100 pounds? I've used Sensations for three years now, and I weigh almost 140 now - sigh. oh karen, you are so funny, twisting my facts around to fit your theory. i've had the sensation since last spring (actually i had a trial model first -- about five months now). i haven't used the hrimnir much since then, since the two students it fit have been riding other horses. the five people (incl. me) who still ride him all use the sensation, and weigh between 60# and 140#. (i weigh about 110# right now, having managed to put on a bit.) I'd think that white hairs are much more likely to be coming from something that happened months or years ago, considering how little you weigh and how briefly you've had the saddle, and that it's still not the horse's full-time saddle. kaaren jordan disagrees with you, and as she is my sensation dealer and has been all along, i am following her opinions and advice. stjarni's never had white hairs there before this, despite two changes of coat that i've seen; this is a new thing with this winter coat coming in. --vicka
Re: [IceHorses] The coyote enters the Majan Empire
the donkey security department works great. HOWEVER, the animals disappearing are from my yard, not my pasture, and I cant let curly ray walk around all nite in the yard. For one, the pasture would be unprotected, and also, he would eat my qumquat tree and roses because I smacked him for it once and now for revenge he bites them whenever he can just to show me I am not the boss of him.. Janice-- yipie tie yie yo
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Too Much, Too Soon / Ulcers
On 9/11/07, dawn_atherton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In IceHorses@yahoogroups.com, Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When the vet sedated him for the floating, she found the first clue: there were deep and old ulcers on each side of his mouth, right at the inside corners of his lip. Based on the scarring, she guessed that they had been there for many months, maybe longer. -Wow, any idea on what caused them? If they were on the inside corners of his lip, does that mean that a dropped noseband could have possibly caused it, or caused him more pain? And is this the same Tivar that Janice now has? yes, and I've put him in a bit twice and both times he was so snotty about it, constantly clanking and chewing the rein snaps, flattening his ears, acting pissy, I finally realized what the heck, he behaves as well or better in his sidepull. I know it is a mouth problem and not a nose problem because altho he will freak out if you try and clamp a hand down on his muzzle, he wears his sidepull (or halter) in about the same spot with no issue whatsoever. So I think he has a fear of being held there, some pain memory surely... He doesnt like me running water on his flanks or brushing them but doesnt kick or try to bite at all, just dances a little. But when i first get on him if he is unhappy with the saddle, if the girth is pinching or something he will turn and reach and jab his nose at my foot, or even a couple of times, click his teeth at my toe. Then I get down and readjust. So he is quick to let you know when he hurts. Janice -- yipie tie yie yo
[IceHorses] Re: Too Much, Too Soon / Ulcers
I have a horse that had stomach ulcers. She was depressed looking, she would kick up when we girthed the saddle. So for awhile we had our vet come and give her a B-12 shot, that would pick her up for alittle while, we tryed that a few times, then she lost interest in her grain, she was still really depressed, the herd she was in, started singling her out(she was already low in the herd). So we loaded her up and took her to our equine hospital in NH, and found out sure enough it was stomach ulcers. So treatment began. She is fine now. This was a couple of years ago. We think she got it because she is low in the herd and holds all of her stress in, we think the importing was one of the biggies, and then she was bred when imported, so then she foaled and was taken away from her foal a year later. Some horses just deal with everything differently. Always watch for mood changes in your horse. Getting stomach ulcers also has a big effect on the immune system, because the summer after she was treated, she got summer excema. Krista in Maine www.bricelandics.com
Re: [IceHorses] How Can You Tell
a How about transporting to an event during undiagnosed soreness or lameness? One thing that was a little negative to me when I scribed for the vets at an endurance event was at the end of the endurance ride, when these horses had been ridden hard for 50 miles and were really tired, they would be loaded on a trailer and many faced very long rides home. I know that it is difficult when you have to get to work the next day but I would have preferred to see the horses given a rest period before being loaded and facing a long hard trailer ride. I think if I had to, I would let everyone sleep for awhile and get up in the middle of the night and drive back. -- Laree
Re: [IceHorses] Re: bitless, hackamores, etc
Thanks Everyone - I really appreciate the response. I realized this weekend I had only a vague idea of the differences and often times when riding in the sidepull you get the question - is that a bitless bridle/hackamore/bosal? and it will be nice to be able to give a more educated answer. It seems that when you ride in a sidepull at public riding areas you get questions like that - I know when Sue and I were at the beach we had a lady stop us and ask about it and I meant to get better educated then. People are always surprised that you can ride without a bit and not get killed. :-)) Another funny thing happened on that ride. MY friend from down the street that I ride with has a Percheron/TB cross and she is HUGE - so of course we make quite an unusual pair going down the trail. This weekend was the first time I rode Mura with her. Mura is a Cremello (white to any non-horse person) and her horse is a light gray (white to any non-horse person). When we were riding the horses down the street in our neighborhood to get to the trails a person driving by in a car yelled out the window you really need to let that baby grow up before you ride it They assumed that Mura (age 15) was the other horses baby - we'll probably be reported for horse cruelty! -- Laree
Re: [IceHorses] Lesson on steep hills
Way to go Susan! I can't imagine steep descents and sand. Your horses should get really tough .Going down steep hills has always been a problem for me - until Hunter. He came out of the box as the best downhill horse I've ever been on. He drops his hind quarters, I drop the reins and down we go. And it's quite a benefit on rides. If I can pass before the downhill section, we can really make time. I have no idea who taught him to be so good, but it's almost a religious experience for me sort of feel like shouting Thank you Jesus! When I first started going out with the endurance riders at Creekside, I was riding a very clunky 14.1 h pony. Bev rode over the edge of a nearly vertical trail, followed by Donna on her Paso Fino. As they went over the edge, their helmets disappeared. I said Holy Smoke (paraphrased) and followed them over the brink. That trail still bothers me. We went over the edge once recently and someone had dumped a white plastic garbage bag full of trash. Now that was exciting. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] Re: bitless, hackamores, etc
That's funny Laree. Our grandaughter-in-law was a very successful trainer of hunter ponies before she fully switched to Warmbloods. She says well-meaning people would come up to her at shows and politely suggest that she had outgrown her pony. She's very light and slim, but was beginning to get tall. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] My horse Harley-advice
try her, they do something to piss me off and I send them packing! She is still for sale as far as my husband knows vbg but... In the meantime, since I That is funny. This girl has never had a horse before but claims she has been riding all her life. I will see. Thanks. I could handle 3 horses. I have hardly tried Dagur because of the heat. Pretty soon Lorraine Got a little couch potato? Check out fun summer activities for kids. http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mailp=summer+activities+for+kidscs=bz
Re: [IceHorses] How Can You Tell
You're absolutely right. We always stay overnight and go home the next day. I can't believe the folks who just load up the horses and head off home - unless they live right around the corner. Usually by Sunday morning, half the rigs have pulled out. Our group also leaves on Thursday for a Saturday ride if the horse is going farther (75+ miles) or has a long haul (over 6 hours) so that the horse can rest from the trip. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] Lesson on steep hills
Way to go Susan! I can't imagine steep descents and sand. Does this make sense?- Riding Doppa downhill is really tough for her and me - she doesn't want to get her rear end under her and sit down to go downhill, therefore she also wants to rush because it's hard. I have always felt it's because she is built for the lateral gaits and doesn't have the depth of bend in the rear a more square horse would have. To support that totally anecdotal theory is the fact that riding Mura downhill is much easier (we have a short pretty steep section of our trail) and she trots and racks much easier. -- Laree
Re: [IceHorses] My horse Harley-advice
I will see. Thanks. I could handle 3 horses. I always use the test question - would this horse be better off with me or will this person offer them more in time and attention? Applying that question has always made the decision easier for me - whether it's to keep them or sell them. -- Laree
[IceHorses] Leslie Desmond / CA / Oct 13-14
Is there anyone in Northern California that could provide an arena for Leslie to do a demo? She had one scheduled in Napa, but lost the venue. Thanks! Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Kentucky Icelandic Horse Show
A broken mouthed shanked bit is quite severe Typically the icelandic bit doesn't have a purchase to speak of. I am not sure how much of difference this makes in potential for severity over a shanked bit with a purchase, but I don't doubt that it does make a difference. I'm not saying icelandic bits are good or bad, just an observation. Cheryl Sand Creek Icelandics Icelandic Horses and Icelandic Sheepdogs email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] website: www.toltallyice.com
Re: [IceHorses] Lesson on steep hills
--- Laree Shulman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Does this make sense?- Riding Doppa downhill is really tough for her and me - she doesn't want to get her rear end under her and sit down to go downhill, therefore she also wants to rush because it's hard. It is easier for a horse to go downhill that way - but it is also dangerous because one false move or trip (especially if they are on their forehand) and you will both summersault downhill! That is why I am afraid of them! Find a smaller hill, like I did at first, and get your horse light in the bridle, and take a step and halt, take a step and halt. Do this all the way down. This will keep the horse from rushing and get them on their haunches. I did this on the smaller hill before I tackled the bigger hill. Susan in NV Nevermore Ranch http://users.oasisol.com/nevermore/ Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out. http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=listsid=396545433
Re: [IceHorses] My horse Harley-advice
On 9/11/07, Lorraine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: try her, they do something to piss me off and I send them packing! She is still for sale as far as my husband knows vbg but... In the meantime, since I That is funny. This girl has never had a horse before but claims she has been riding all her life. This brings up a good question - how do all of you vet a potential buyer for a horse that you have decided to sell? Laree
Re: [IceHorses] Leslie Desmond / CA / Oct 13-14
On 9/11/07, Judy Ryder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there anyone in Northern California that could provide an arena for Leslie to do a demo? She had one scheduled in Napa, but lost the venue. I will check around as there may be a place in Petaluma, not too far from Napa. Ann
Re: [IceHorses] KY Icelandic Show
I was told last year that I had to put a noseband on her Any idea why they would require a noseband? Who insisted on it? Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] My horse Harley-advice
On Tue, Sep 11, 2007 at 12:31:09PM -0400, Laree Shulman wrote: This brings up a good question - how do all of you vet a potential buyer for a horse that you have decided to sell? this might not work for the never-had-a-horse buyer, but for siamese cat rescue we get their vet as a reference and call their office to ask how good they are with keeping their pets up-to-date on routine stuff and dealing with disasters. maybe also ask for references, from the owners of the horses she's been riding...? good luck, --vicka
[IceHorses] Foot Flicking
You will see foot flicking at the competitions, shows, and evaluations of Icelandic Horses, particularly those ridden and trained ISRT (icelandic-style riding and training). This style of riding can give a horse long-term unsoundness issues, possible back and leg problems, which may not outwardly manifest with symptoms until a later time. More info here: http://iceryder.net/flippingtoe.html And Dr. Deb talks about it recently: http://esiforum.mywowbb.com/forum1/83.html Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Hawaii foals / Videos
--- Judy Ryder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Can you watch the videos now? I can but it takes too long to load on my laptop, I have to use my super fast desktop, but I only use that when the sun is up or the generator is on, and most of my emailing is done in the early am with my coffee... If so, did you see my banana trees? They're in the back, behind the big avocado tree, near the fence on the left (sort of behind the horse's butt at the beginning of the video). I will go and watch it. Our Avocados this season are amazingI have picked about 10 different varieties along our road these past 3 months...We have had a lot of Avo sandwiches and Avo everything, it has been a nice luxury. Also you mentioned using body language with a horse, and in this little video, I'm using it to move the horse around: I will go and watch that too..yesterday we were shoeing under a Jacaranda Tree, with 2 horses tied to the treeso I spent a little time moving horses with my body, there was a mare in season and all the Ranch Geldings were in a fuss. Sally gets to go on cattle drives every Saturday for the next few months..she is pretty happy about that. She gets to see old growth native hawaiian forests on these cattle drives which are on the SE slopes of Mauna Loa.its on a cattle ranch that has been there since 1860. We will be bringing a couple of our babies home for a month, so when they are here hopefully I can get some video of them. When we go see them at the ranch they are so happy we are there they stand around us and graze...not much action, but when they are here I will try to get some video with my camera. Skye Fire Island Farms Breeding Quality Icelandic Trail Horses Certified Farrier Services 'Natural Balance' Shoeing and Trimming. Founder, Navicular options for your horse. 808-640-6080
Re: [IceHorses] To train for natural gait
--- Judy Ryder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone know if there are icelandic-style trainers that train for natural gait? Robyn? Skye? Mic? Malin? Kristin? Judy Well good question. The trainer I work with here has taught in Iceland, but she has so many different techniques in her toolbag that to call her an Icelandc trainer only would be incorrect. She does understand they way they train, but she was training horses and people long before she got into Icelandics or ever went to Iceland to help with clinics there. I know I just went out with her on a ride with my gelding that she is training. He was ridden before I got him, and was ridden poorly, so really it is retraining. Anyway, after 6 weeks of being ridden or poneyed 6 days a week, he is finally starting to really get some muscle, he is around 11 I believe and has never been in shape. Anyway, she has not asked or pushed for tolt, she is only allowing him to do what he is naturally able to dohe is beginning to get tolt from him, but only now because he is ready. She does not force him into frame.he did give a foxtrot the other day, she was happy that he was showing a soft gait and did not try to clean it up.She has felt tolt and seen tolt before, as have I , so she is confident that he will tolt more with more work, hills and getting in shape and in balance with the rider..if not she would not force it. I might sell him if he does not give an easy tolt, but probably not, as I would use him to pull a cart, something I have been wanting to do for years now. Skye Fire Island Farms Breeding Quality Icelandic Trail Horses Certified Farrier Services 'Natural Balance' Shoeing and Trimming. Founder, Navicular options for your horse. 808-640-6080
RE: [IceHorses] Alex the African Gray: O/T
How sad. Isn't 31 young for a parrot to die? We had a macaw at Busch Gardens that was 87, and had several 40-60 year olds. There was one cockatoo that the San Diego zoo had that was just over 100 when it died. The smaller parrots-grays and amazons have lived 50-60 years but that is a high-end number. Until fairly recently (12-15 years ago), most parrots were often wild-caught adult imports (age unknown), subjected to a great deal of stress coming into the US and then not adapting well to being a household pet. Add to that, poorly understood dietary requirements, and nonexistent veterinary knowledge. Now, most birds are captive bred and anyone who makes a slight effort can get good info. on proper care, and there are many more vets who specialize in avian care. Parrots should be able to live to a ripe old age now! Cherie
[IceHorses] Re: The coyote enters the Majan Empire
--- In IceHorses@yahoogroups.com, Robyn Schulze [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 9/10/07, Laree Shulman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Also, they said these dogs are raised to do a job and are not cuddly pets to bring indoors. Some of the breeds are not wired to need huge amounts of human interaction and are happier being outside. The herd becomes their social group. I've heard this same thing about them. What do you want a guard dog for? I wonder if your mule (or is it a donkey?) would serve the same purpose. First, my Great Pyrenees is a cuddly pet who lives indoors:) He is not bothered by the heat because he stay in front of the air conditioning vet inside. I really don't think this is a dog for everyone, especially inside, he's like a huge cotton ball, always shedding, we are always cleaning. He loves the company of his people, he likes to get on the couch and eat popcorn like any other dog:) He is just the sweetest dog I have ever met and he does have a job. He protects the house from people who drive by or think they want to come up on the porch to knock on the door. He thinks the house (especially) and the yard are his territory, so anyone who doesn't belong there he will want to chase off, including cats, birds, whatever. He knows which cats belong and they love to rub on him, he is very tolerant. He does allow the people who mow the lawn to be in the yard without much barking, I told him we want them there, but if an unexpected stranger comes to the door, he goes nuts. There have actually been some armed robberies around here lately, I am pretty sure I'm not going to wake up to find an armed robber standing over me. I think the mules do a fine job of keeping dangers out of the pasture. They usually don't like dogs, but seem to have accepted the small herding dog where they are now. I always warn people, I would really feel terrible if my mules killed their dog. Kim
[IceHorses] Re: Alex the African Gray: O/T
--- In IceHorses@yahoogroups.com, Karen Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - so he's probably in the 25-30-ish year range, maybe even older. I was shocked when the avian vet told us that Crackers is the oldest of his clients, and by a good bit. So, I'm pretty comfortable that Alex wasn't close to being an age record-holder, but I'm not sure that we really know how close to average that made him. I've had my African Grey since he was about 3 months old, I finished weaning him. He hatched on mother's day 1990, I know for sure how old he is. He's 17 this year. Sometimes vets like to be negative, but I had one tell me that many of them she saw didn't live past 8 or 9 years old. I went straight to the bird vet in San Diego when I got this bird, so I could find out what he is supposed to eat. Mine has never eaten seed in his life, my vet told me not to feed seed, I feed mine all kinds of people food, meat, eggs, fruit, vegetables, beans, etc. So far so good. I got him used to tasting all kinds of food when he was young, he will at least taste anything, if he figures out that he does not like it, he will shake his head no when I offer it to him. He does have requests sometimes, when I put his food in the other day he said Pasta?, it wasn't, but I went and bought him some, he also sometimes requests Pizza and Want to eat some beans:)If I don't cover him early enough and he gets tired, he will say Want to go to sleep, I can't really even count how many words he says. He loves imitating the cats, they are his friends. I swear sometimes he shares food with them, he drops what he doesn't want so they can get it. These birds are smart. Kim
RE: [IceHorses] My horse Harley-advice
This brings up a good question - how do all of you vet a potential buyer for a horse that you have decided to sell? I'm usually happy with a showing of 8-years of 1040-forms, six references from various members of the clergy, 20-years of vet receipts for all the animals you've owned in that period, a letter of recommendation from all of your grade school teachers, a certificate of approval from your marriage counselor, five years' worth of bank statements, plus a copy of your will showing how you will provide for the horse in the event of your demise...Oh, and my farrier has to know your farrier, and be able to vouch for him. At least that's Cary's version. I don't think I'm QUITE that picky. :) Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.484 / Virus Database: 269.13.2/985 - Release Date: 9/2/2007 4:32 PM
Re: [IceHorses] New Horse!
Judy, You should have done a pre-purchase. She looks off to me. Actually, I love her. Very nice indeed. Nancy
RE: [IceHorses] Alex the African Gray: O/T
Until fairly recently (12-15 years ago), most parrots were often wild-caught adult imports (age unknown), I always heard that most imported were probably young, since mature birds are much harder to catch...Who really knows? Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.15/1002 - Release Date: 9/11/2007 5:46 PM
Re: [IceHorses] My horse Harley-advice
This brings up a good question - how do all of you vet a potential buyer for a horse that you have decided to sell? I made the mistake of selling my Arab to a friend of mine just getting into horses. I went to check on him and it was 101 out and he had no water. I took him back the next day. The girl that came by today had a horse person with her that seemed to know what she was talking about. Lorraine Got a little couch potato? Check out fun summer activities for kids. http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mailp=summer+activities+for+kidscs=bz
Re: [IceHorses] Foxes/Coyotes
On 9/10/07, Nancy Sturm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was hiking up on our mountain once and looked down on the flat farm land below us There were two coyotes pouncing and playing chasing some kind of rodent and two deer grazing calmly quite near them. I know coyotes kill fawns, but the adult deer were not worried at all. Nancy Our neighborhood coyotes were having some sort of celebration last night. They were singing or calling or yipping back and forth most of the night. Haven't heard so many of them in a long time. We're leaving for a horse camping trip tomorrow. I wonder if there will be coyotes up there in the Sierra foothills? Ferne Fedeli
RE: [IceHorses] My horse Harley-advice
At least that's Cary's version. I don't think I'm QUITE that picky. :) Hilarious. It makes me think though. We are riding tomorrow. I can see how she handles him. Lorraine Got a little couch potato? Check out fun summer activities for kids. http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mailp=summer+activities+for+kidscs=bz
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Alex the African Gray: O/T
figures out that he does not like it, he will shake his head no when I offer it to him. He does have requests sometimes, when I put his food in the other day he said Pasta?, it wasn't, but I went and bought him some, he also sometimes requests Pizza and Want to eat some beans:)If I don't cover him early enough and he gets tired, he will say Want to go to sleep, Amazing!! I have only had a couple of lovebirds, so I'm not that familiar with birds, but they seem so smart. Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] New Horse!
We have a new horse! She's bay, lots of chrome, pretty light, and flies! Wow. Great. Can't wait to see him or her in person. LOL. Lorraine Take the Internet to Go: Yahoo!Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news, photos more. http://mobile.yahoo.com/go?refer=1GNXIC
Re: [IceHorses] To train for natural gait
he did give a foxtrot the other day, she was happy that he was showing a soft gait and did not try to clean it up. Does she plan to encourage the fox trot? It's a good thing to do to build on one gait and get it consistently before moving onto another. It builds up different muscles along the way, which can only be good :-) Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
RE: [IceHorses] Re: Alex the African Gray: O/T
Sometimes vets like to be negative, but I had one tell me that many of them she saw didn't live past 8 or 9 years old. I'd bet that's probably true. While they can live a long time, a notable number escape, get injured by other pets, or get infections. And a lot of people try to hand feed but don't know how, and end up burning their crops or something. Mine has never eaten seed in his life, my vet told me not to feed seed, I feed mine all kinds of people food, meat, eggs, fruit, vegetables, beans, etc. Mine get a variety of foods too, and have as long as we've had them. I do feed the specially formulated bird pellets, but have never fed them seeds. I can't really even count how many words he says. He loves imitating the cats, they are his friends. I can't remember everything Smokey says either, since she can recombine words into phrases as she pleases. Smokey can answer, What does a dog say? (Woof.) What does the kitty say? (Meow) What does Crackers say? (wkkk - the happy macaw sound) And I used to ask her What does Mr. Johnny say? Johnny was the old pug we lost recently. For some reason, he always barked in fives, Woo, woo, woo, woo, woof. I thought it cute that she noted that his bark had a different pattern than most dogs. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.15/1002 - Release Date: 9/11/2007 5:46 PM
Re: [IceHorses] Foxes/Coyotes
Boy, so were ours. I feed at 5:00 am, pitch dark, and there was a regular chorus going on out there. Nancy
RE: [IceHorses] Re: Alex the African Gray: O/T
I can't remember everything Smokey says either, since she can recombine words into phrases as she pleases. Smokey can answer, What does a dog say? (Woof.) What does the kitty say? (Meow) What does Crackers say? (wkkk - the happy macaw sound) I should add that sometimes she likes to ask the questions, so we can prove to her that we know the answers too. Karen Karen Thomas Wingate, NC No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.15/1002 - Release Date: 9/11/2007 5:46 PM
Re: [IceHorses] New Horse!
I want one! Does she have a TWIN??? There's a couple different ones: http://www.premierkites.com/pages/windgrdn/animals.htm Judy http://icehorses.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] New Horse!
Thanks Judy, there is a place I drive by everyday that has them, a florest, thank you -- Debbie in MN ~ Please check out how we can all help raise money for Huginn's Hospital Fund ~ http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dgtrq74d_386xtqp ~~~If we all do a little, we will have a lot
Re: [IceHorses] New Horse!
There's a couple different ones: Oh my gosh. The Palomino looks like Harley. Cute Lorraine Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links. http://mobile.yahoo.com/mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC
[IceHorses] KY Icelandic show
Hello Judy, Gudmar was walking around talking to everyone. I actually asked him if I could show without a noseband and he said I don't think so. I then asked several other people (I was not able to talk to one of the judges before the class as they were out in the ring) and they also were under the impression that she had to have a noseband. Gudmar tightened it up and then I loosened it. You could see daylight between her nose and the band. The judges did not say anything about it. Renee ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com
[IceHorses] Elska and Farrier
Coats already??? It is still in the 90s in dry North Carolina. I am jealous. Renee ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com
