Re: [IceHorses] Charm, Another Mounting Lesson
> Charm had another mounting lesson today with the > little kid, after a > brushing session. Alot different than teddy. Lorraine Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[IceHorses] Trail Safety Tips
>From Lili of the gaitedhorse list: I just rolled some up into a little roll (I forget - I think I rolled it around a piece of cardboard) and keep that in my pack. Along with vetwrap, kotex pad (good for wounds), leather strings, hoofpick, leatherman, knife, *extra* little lead rope (climbing rope from REI), snacks, bandaids etc, whistle, bandana (for dust or wounds), sunscreen, lip balm...can't think of what else! Always keep it on my saddle. Oh, and water bottles, of course. Keep my cell phone in my ankle safe (from Susan), along with another knife and hoof pick (easier to get to). I don't usually do this because I hate fanny packs, but it is recommended to keep a water bottle (or camelback) on your person, at least in warm weather. If you get dumped and have to walk a ways (without your horse!), you will still have water. I have my ID (name, license #, insurance info, ICE - "in case of emergency" - phone #, allergy info, etc) engraved on a dog tag that I pin to my shirt. I don't always wear it close to home (big boarding place, well-used trails & they know me & my horse - someone would spot me and/or come looking when my horse came home alone!), but do when trailering away to ride. Also then I braid a tag with Sunny's name & my phone # into his mane. Lili Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] In the silly pasture...
On Apr 23, 2008, at 6:30 PM, Karen Thomas wrote: Hroi... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNUY9gYxYEc Karen Thomas, NC Looks like Hroi found an imaginary friend to play with. Kat
Re: [IceHorses] In the silly pasture...
2008/4/23 Karen Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Hroi... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNUY9gYxYEc Isn't he just the bravest little guy?? He's kinda scared, but he's going in anyway ;)... Wanda
Re: [IceHorses] Princess Buttercup
> Anyone know the Icelandic for buttercup? Soley -- Renee M. in Michigan with her own bay Soley
Re: [IceHorses] Princess Buttercup
On Apr 23, 2008, at 5:16 PM, Karen Thomas wrote: That's what Cary is calling her. Karen Thomas, NC The Princess Bride -- one of my favorite movies. Anyone know the Icelandic for buttercup? Kat
Re: [IceHorses] In the silly pasture...
He is so much fun, what an attitude... your little girl is so Mellow, what an interesting pair they will be! -- PNH Levels 1 & 2 Clinics, Rochester MN http://www.sittinghorse.us The Soul of a Horse ~ has touched my soul, may it touch yours too! ~ thesoulofahorse.com/Pre-Order-Reviews.htm ~
Re: [IceHorses] Princess Buttercup
They are both just darling. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] Slimed by Horse
"shoot, we have a horse that likes to take the top of your head in his mouth and slime you." At Saturday's endurance ride, Abby asked me to hold her horse for a minute. I bent over to pick something up and Meridian dumped a mouthful of chewed up carrots, water-soaked beet pulp and LMF on the top of my head. I stood up abruptly and it ran down my back. I can't describe the "look" this resulted in. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
>i wish they would do it in a long straight line. Speedracking too. > Janice-- Janice, It's my understanding that in Iceland, on the lakes in the REAL icetolts, they do go in a straight line.I still don't like the idea, but I DO think no turning is better. -- Renee M. in Michigan
[IceHorses] In the silly pasture...
Hroi... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNUY9gYxYEc Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] Following mama
In a message dated 4/23/2008 5:38:10 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) He is just like a colt, they are miles away from mom and the fillies are stuck to them. He is very nice, beautiful colt. Sylvia **Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car listings at AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp0030002851)
[IceHorses] Reacting or Responding?
Is Your Horse Reacting or Responding to You? By Clay Wright There is a big difference in what we are accomplishing with the horse depending on whether he is reacting to our approach - or responding to our approach. When the horse is reacting, he is operating from a place of fear and anxiety. When he is responding, he is operating from a place of feel. It is in this place of feel (from you and the horse) where brilliance and wonder begin to occur. I cannot begin to define the word feel. It has a meaning that is unlimited, and I believe there is no end to what is possible. However, I will say that it is the state or level of communication that all master horsemen and women strive to understand to a greater and greater degree. It is our safety; it is peak performance; it is a level of communication that replaces cues and conditioned responses because it rises above the physical limitations of horsemanship; it is imperceptible. Some have said, "We think it and the horse does it." It is very simple, yet so complex. It comes down to our own personal level of awareness to the small details in our relationships with the horse, and all people are capable of increasing their awareness. While all of us may not want to be master horsemen, we do want to be safer, and have a better communication with our horses. And this much is sure, we simply cannot have a communication based on feel with our horses unless they are responding to us. I looked up the definitions of react and response in the dictionary. There are similarities in the two words. However, the word react carries with it a negative connotation, where as the word respond clearly shows a positive feeling. For example, you don't hear doctors say, "The body is reacting to a transplanted heart." If the body is reacting, it is rejecting the heart. If the body is responding, it is accepting the organ. For me, there is a significant difference between the words. I define them as follows: React - is to show a reaction out of fear that is based on a past record or history that has proved to be harmful. Horses will react to what their past experiences with humans have proven to be true for them. They will react to a demanding-controlling approach-the boss mentality. They will react to a feeling of being trapped-not just physically-but mentally as well. Respond - is to show a response to a rhythm or feel. A sense of being in the present moment and responding to a situation without letting our own responses be controlled by emotions such as anger or frustration. If we allow our responses to be controlled by these emotions-we are reacting. Though a response may not always show calmness, it always shows some form of thought or wonder. So a horse could respond from his natural instincts, or he will respond to the feel we are presenting to him. Horses will learn how to respond to us rather than react when we let them do whatever they feel they need to do and then we respond accordingly. We simply redirect their response until our idea becomes their idea. We don't make them wrong, we set it up so that they always have a place to feel content. We hang in there with them and keep them searching; we keep directing and supporting until they can find it. The horse must be allowed to search and find it for himself. How much or how little pressure it takes to get a response in the direction we are trying to go, depends on the horse's past, his personality, and his feelings of self-preservation. But more importantly, it depends on what we are able to offer him. Just make sure the horse is digging his own hole or putting the pressure on himself, don't make it happen-don't force it. Whether or not they are able to come through depends upon our feel and approach, it is our attitude towards them and toward ourselves that will determine the outcome. When the horse is not cooperating, we let him run into his own pressure. For example, he is resisting turning right; let him make the error-don't make him wrong-let him run into a wall. The wall is your supporting rein and leg. (Your outside rein and leg) He ran into his own pressure because you were there to support him. The important thing here is to know where you are going-have a line to follow-eventually the horse will follow the feel of where you are going rather than run in the wall of your aids. When he responds in a positive way, there is no wall-no pressure. Through this approach, the horse will soon begin to respond instead of react. He has a place to begin to operate on a feel. He finds that he can trust you because you are constantly offering him a place to feel content and free. And when he does offer you a good feel, you are accepting it and rewarding him for it. We need to be there for him with a confident feel coming from within ourselves in his times of upsets as well as his times of contentment. These spots where the horse is responding may only come
[IceHorses] Re: Contoured Girths, slipping saddle UPDATE
Hi Everyone WOW thank you for all the advice, I tried what Kaaren suggested about doing the girth up two holes more on either the back or front. What I did notice is when the girth was done up two holes at the back it made the front of the saddle come UP! Which led to it slipping forward more! I tried it today: Holes done up two more on the back made it REALLY bad, the saddle slipped forward with her walking down hill with out me on. Two holes higher in the front a bit better than when they are even. I really like the mohair girth that Susan mentioned and Laree posted a link too, does it dissipate heat better that the sensation girth? I find the sensation girth does cause her to sweat a lot underneath. But she is not clipped yet! Also watched the saddle without the girth done up when she has her head down the saddle tips forward (the back of the saddle comes up at least an inch!) this is with the girth UNDONE hanging free on one side. So I am thinking maybe as Robyn suggested shims? Kaaren you mention one type do you know where to get those in Canada? Maybe Robyn do you have some shims? How will it effect the pressure of the saddle? Also the torsion girth I am thinking of is the Contoured not the Luna. The Luna does not help with a saddle that slips forward or backward. It also mentions on the site that the neoprene is covered with nylon so no neoprene touches the horses now? Maybe the neoprene was an issue and they have changed it? Still if I can use my sensation girth and maybe some shims it might be better. Thank you so much everyone! Zoe and Emmy on Bowen Island in BC
Re: [IceHorses] Maja and Hroi in the pasture - video
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRnTk99TJl4 Woo-hooo! What gait / Maja? Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
[IceHorses] Maja and Hroi in the pasture - video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRnTk99TJl4 Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] Demo Video
There are a lot of horses - all breeds - who manage to do drill teams and demos without being scared. Of all the breeds I've encountered, Icelandic's are the bravest as a general rule. When I see that many Icelandic's going into an arena acting jumpy, something is up. When I rode in drill teams, we had horses of all breeds, including Arabs and TB's at times. I don't think it speaks well for our breed when so many look skittish in a demo. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] Sevin Dust
> > That's just a lot of sevin to turn loose in the environment. Why don't > you just put it on the horse directly -- either as a dust or a spray? > Do your horses have mites? Because that is what sevin is used in > chickens for. Mites aren't gnats (human mites are known as crabs or > cooties -- they crawl, not fly). because I have put so much on the horse directly that he is glowing in the dark :) I want to go at this from the source now... I want to try sevin because I KNOW I have mites from chickens, my Jaspar has ear mites as we speak. Also Tivar responds really well to this anti-goat-lice stuff the vet gave me to put on him in dots, and also the vet told me our most common culicoide here is very similar to lice moreso than most. Just thought I would give it a try. But maybe just getting the paddocks clean and dry with new sand will help. What about diatamatious (sp) earth? Know anything about that?? should I try that first? Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Saddle fit pics
> >> Bless yourheart.<< > > Uh, oh, can't be a good thing... HAHAHA no, not a good thing, but not a bad thing either. Just very very special and shall we say... challenging. We were at the feed store last week and the little counter helper girl said her horse bit her the other day, and my husband sorta laughs and says "shoot, we have a horse that likes to take the top of your head in his mouth and slime you." and she was just bug eyed. She said HE BITES THE TOP OF YOUR HEAD?!?! and we tried to explain and we could tell that she, and others listening, could never get it. he is just very very much a guy who gaits to the beat of his own drummer haha. Like my friend sylvia says... most horses like to look around, but i have never seen a horse that looks around like stonewall. His head jumps around like a hummingbird cause he's trying to see it ALL! and I still laugh about that. The people from jeffers who came to take photos fell madly under his spell. and i swear he showed off for them!! I bent over to pick something up, i had been showing them his trick where i shove a cowboy hat in the back of my pants and walk off and he follows and pulls the hat out and holds it out for me. And when I bent over and there wasnt a hat he tried to grab the waist band of my underwear that was showing and they were just squealing laughing! Only he would try and give somebody a wedgie. Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Saddle fit pics
--- Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>she has a definite stonewall look in her eye...<< What does that mean? >> Bless yourheart.<< Uh, oh, can't be a good thing... Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
Seriously - I wish you (Renee), Wanda, Judy, Janice, Karen etc etc could have seen this show and the way the horses reacted. Mic, I'm an engineer. I've had enough physics, statics, and dynamics classes to kill most people of sheer boredom. The laws of physics apply equally to all masses: plant, animal and mineral. Nothing I could have seen in some flash-in-the-pan show would change the respect I have for the laws of nature. The horses may have escaped serious injury in this one event, but it doesn't change the fact that it was risky, and that the horses could still have long-term damage that may not show up until much later. Karen Thomas, NC
Re: [IceHorses] Sevin Dust
http://highplainsipm.org/HpIPMSearch/Docs/Culicoides-Cattle.pdf On Apr 23, 2008, at 2:52 PM, Janice McDonald wrote: > i just feel we have WAY more bugs this year and WAY less bats and > thats scarey! where the heck are the bats?!?!? I know something was > happening to bees but bats too? Someone posted recently, Anne in > Ohio, about chicken mites. I think I have those too. I am just on > all out mite/lice/gnat global extermination mode... seems to me, > birds are the most fragile physically to toxins. Like canaries and > gases for instance. you can kill your parrot or canary by giving > yourself a home permanent in the bathroom two rooms away, just with > toxic fumes, or cleaning your oven or burning something in a teflon > pan. Seemed if Sevin dust is ok to dump a big blast of it on a > chicken, it would be ok for a horse to stand and lie down in it > sprinkled and disc'd into sand. Doesnt it seem like that?? > > Janice That's just a lot of sevin to turn loose in the environment. Why don't you just put it on the horse directly -- either as a dust or a spray? Do your horses have mites? Because that is what sevin is used in chickens for. Mites aren't gnats (human mites are known as crabs or cooties -- they crawl, not fly). For gnats, a different insecticides are recommended (http://highplainsipm.org/HpIPMSearch/Docs/Culicoides-Cattle.pdf). Lynn Kinsky, Santa Ynez, CA http://www.silcom.com/~lkinsky/ http://www.dslextreme.com/~napha/HighPoint/
Re: [IceHorses] Stepping Pace / Lee Ziegler
In her article "Cure that Pace" she seems to think it is something you should work to change. If you do all those things she suggests in that article, it really does help, and in fact, I did get him to stepping pace more than hard pace thru it. They are very good exercises for any gaited horse. And on the gaited list some have said if i would try and ride him differently etc., I could get him in gait. this really aggravates me because ; 1. it is a wonderful smooth gait, easy on him and easy on me 2. i dont believe you should alter any smooth natural default gait thru any means but those Lee suggests, cavalettis, hill work, long slow distance etc. 3. I just hate it when people get the idea a stepping pace is unacceptable. Almost every breed gaited horse there is is rife with stepping pace and people get the impression their horses are "inferior" if they do it, this is not a good impression for us to present to newbies etc. 4. Some breeds allow stepping pace as an acceptable gait in the showring--- the peruvian paso, spotted saddlehorse etc. I just feel for Jaspar, that i should always be an ambassador for the stepping pace so no more horses like him will ever be dragged behind a tractor to try and get them to not do it. Thats one of my missions. I am the friend of the stepping pace Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Saddle fit pics
> Thank you - she is my prima donna. If she were human, > she would be the prissy cheerleader and some would > probably call her a "mean girl". If the least little > thing bothers her, she will let you know!! She is 1/2 > arab, 1/2 TWH, and has a saddle rack, smooth trot, > easy canter, and a flat out gallop of 22mph! well, now for the bad news... in the photo of her in her boot "Mary Janes" she has a definite stonewall look in her eye... Bless yourheart. Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
well, i mainly call him Walls. And a weird nickname that stuck "Wallsit". He is my wallsit. He does the cutest thing. he likes you to pet him while he eats. The others just ignore me or tense up hoping i will go away if I pet their head while they eat. But Stonewall, he will take two bites, chew chew, reach with his nose with a warm glow look that says ok pet me pet me, and when you pet him, go back to eat two more bites, then wants petting. I wonder if its cause he had to nurse laying down and his mom couldnt reach and nuzzle him? (she was foundered) or maybe because the humans had to go out all hours of the night and help his mother up and down and petted on him a lot while he ate. they put her down as soon as he could eat pellets. It is definitely not a thing the others do. I also call him "beebeets" which means nothing. I realized a long time ago horses dont get words but the feeling and sounds so I talk to them nonsensically while loving on them, saying things like "h me beebeets wallsit..." and he will reach and tap my brow with his lips, then go back to eating. he is truly mine, my heart. I had a crazy brother no one on earth could stand and my mother doted on him, he was her heart. and when anyone would ask her why she gave him such preferential treatment she would say quietly "he is the one who needs me". and thats how I feel about my Walls! But I could change his name to "The Maidens Prayer". Thats an old fiddle tune and I would love to name a horse that... and I could still call him wallsit haha Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Stepping Pace / Lee Ziegler
> The point is--- take for instance altering gait. Most on here don't > believe in altering natural gait and these same ones of US, me too, on > here, believe Lee Zeigler to be the foremost gait expert that ever > lived... yet Lee believed a stepping pace should be cured. That it > was hard on a horse. I'm not sure if what you got from Lee was in a different context, but in her book, she describes how to move a square gait into a stepping pace. Perhaps she meant the pace? or the stepping pace in a very hollow position? Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Following A Feel
> Beautifully put, I learned the "up the pressure" method when I > started out and became increasingly unhappy with the results. Now I > am trying to figure out how to really use feel and timing, and it is > difficult (at least for me) and I backslide a lot. A lot of the time > I come in wondering why things weren't working and then realize that > I was trying to make something happen, instead of setting it up and > letting it happen. Yes, I think it's a hard thing to describe (how to follow a feel), like trying to describe what love is. > "Don't try to move his feet. Leave that to him." > > The first time I read that second quote I thought "well, of course > the horse moves his own feet -- duh", a year later when I was re- > reading True Unity it hit me like a ton of bricks -- I had been > trying to move my horses feet, not getting to his mind and letting > him figure out where his feet needed to be. It's interesting how, in reading that book over and over, you take something different away from it each time. Sometimes the statements mean nothing, and sometimes they mean everything, and the light goes on! >>Of course the realization is just the beginning. But maybe that is the most important part? >>>How the heck do I reach my horses mind? I think this is the ultimate part to work on... maybe lots of down time spent together, maybe lots of groundwork, not in running the horse in a round pen, but the little things, like seeing if you can ask him to put his foot in a certain spot, or on a quarter tossed in the arena... seeing if you can get the two-way communication going... understanding how the horse's body works, and what you have to do to get him to respond correctly... It's a lot to think about. Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Sevin Dust
i just feel we have WAY more bugs this year and WAY less bats and thats scarey! where the heck are the bats?!?!? I know something was happening to bees but bats too? Someone posted recently, Anne in Ohio, about chicken mites. I think I have those too. I am just on all out mite/lice/gnat global extermination mode... seems to me, birds are the most fragile physically to toxins. Like canaries and gases for instance. you can kill your parrot or canary by giving yourself a home permanent in the bathroom two rooms away, just with toxic fumes, or cleaning your oven or burning something in a teflon pan. Seemed if Sevin dust is ok to dump a big blast of it on a chicken, it would be ok for a horse to stand and lie down in it sprinkled and disc'd into sand. Doesnt it seem like that?? Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Following A Feel/Kat
--- Kathleen Douglas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> How the heck do I reach my horses mind? Still working on that part!<< Kat, you would absolutely LOVE, LOVE, LOVE clicker training. It DOES get to your horse's mind and allows you to communicate with them as partners, not as owner/slave! Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [IceHorses] Saddle fit pics
--- Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > whgat kinda horse is Whisper?? in the pic in her > easy boots, it > almost looks like she is wearing mary Janes HAHa > she is very pretty Thank you - she is my prima donna. If she were human, she would be the prissy cheerleader and some would probably call her a "mean girl". If the least little thing bothers her, she will let you know!! She is 1/2 arab, 1/2 TWH, and has a saddle rack, smooth trot, easy canter, and a flat out gallop of 22mph! Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [IceHorses] Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
--- Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> I would like you to explain about the promise wrap tho! what the heck does it do... << It is from TTeam/TTouch. I'm sure Robyn could explain better, but it's supposed to make the horse more aware of it's rear end, give them a feeling of security. It has kept Whisper from bucking on the trail when she gets frustrted and wants to be in front (and this from horse who 6 months ago would NOT go on the trail unless she was behind another horse). >> I like the saddle but gosh they are pricey...<< Sigh - I know. I hav been looking at these saddles for 5 years now, and only because I sold Foxi am I now able to afford one! But, I will always be able to adjust it to every horse, and as each horse changes shape, I will still be able to adjust it for them - AND IT HAS A TREE - which I think is needed for longer rides and I weigh 165lbs. But I will get solid black so I can ride it on everybody with their own colored biothane! Whisper in pink, Andi in turquoise, and Raven in orange. Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [IceHorses] Saddle fit pics
--- Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I went to the site Susan! Its not really treeless, > right? I like the > booties. My Jas can't have anything on his spine... > Did you get a > pink one?? It IS A TREED SADDLE!!! Just adjusts to fit the horse exactly. This might work perfect on Jas, and with extra pads and shims, you could customize it for each and every horse. Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
On 23/04/2008, Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > So I know in my heart, my soul, Lee was wrong about this in my case. > I don't believe icetolting is good for a horse, neither would rushing > thru deep sucky mud or sand or asphalt. If ice tolting never had a > curve maybe it would be a little better. You're right Janice, I have fewer problems with Ice tolts that happen on lakes rather than in these small hockey rinks... Wanda
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
On 23/04/2008, Virginia Tupper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Does he respond to the name Stonewall? I think Virginia is right Janice... You need to name "Wall's" something that will allow him to learn...Stone and Wall...just don't do that for him. Especially horses grow into their names. Wanda
Re: [IceHorses] Sevin Dust
On Apr 23, 2008, at 10:37 AM, Janice McDonald wrote: > > Where I live may as well be the desert. It is pure sand. so what > happens, is the manure, urine, water spillage etc, seeps down, > apparently causes a layer of moist earth. My plan is to remove the > first six inches of dirt that is more like "soil" than sand, disc it > after that and allow to dry in the sun, then take clean sand from > elsewhere and put on top of the then clean dry earth. I was thinking > of mixing in some sevin after removing the top layer and before adding > the new top layer. From what I've read they need moisture and a blood > host. My lots are so dry, the moisture has to be coming from the > horses themselves, their waste, spillover from water tanks etc.. It > is almost like beach sand. no plants of any kind. dry lots. I read > some articles and it said they reproduce in the moist earth and come > up thru the sand. I've got to get rid of the moist earth. > Janice I forgot you were in Florida. Looking at all the water around your town (http://www.city-data.com/city/Ponce-de-Leon-Florida.html) I expect you have a high water table and the seepage you run into comes from below (when I lived in Hialeah, one hit water about a foot down. Old wooden houses were built on raised blocks, and no one had a basement). Lynn Kinsky, Santa Ynez, CA http://www.silcom.com/~lkinsky/ http://www.dslextreme.com/~napha/HighPoint/
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
i wish they would do it in a long straight line. Speedracking too. Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
i think more icelandic horses oughta be like Tivar if I asked jaspar to jump off a cliff he would get wild eyed and make that marble in the nose sound and JUMP. If I asked Tivar he would say no and if i tried to make him he would dump my a__ , i just somehow suspect he would... haha Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
> > Seriously - I wish you (Renee), Wanda, Judy, Janice, Karen etc etc > could have seen this show and the way the horses reacted. > > As I said, I like to make up my own mind, just as I did with certain > forms of competition riding at the last WC, and I have. I did not see > any problem with the UK IceTolt. Period. If I had seen it, I may have thought the horses were ok with it, I may have thought it fun and exciting... look, there are things some do on here that others are just deadset against that I am ok with. Some are deadset against endurance riding. I have never formally participated in endurance riding, there arent any close to me but one I think... but I used to ride my horse fifty miles at a fast clip two and three days a week and enjoyed the heck out of it, and he seemed to also. he was in great shape, tip top shape, had good legs etc. unfortunately I was doing some irreparable damage to him saddlefit/back-wise, but for now, thats beside the point. The point is--- take for instance altering gait. Most on here don't believe in altering natural gait and these same ones of US, me too, on here, believe Lee Zeigler to be the foremost gait expert that ever lived... yet Lee believed a stepping pace should be cured. That it was hard on a horse. Since then I have come to sorta understand that some if not most of all horses that stepping pace dont do it so smooth as my Jaspar, who can do it effortlessly, endlessly, no jarring, its his gait of choice, very fluid, easy going, smooth etc. why on earth would it be hard on him... why on earth would i try and change it. Well I did try and change it, in the ways that Lee descibed, for two years. I did get a runningwalk out of him now and then, and a nice flatwalk. But any time i let up on it he would revert right back to his gait of choice. So I know in my heart, my soul, Lee was wrong about this in my case. I don't believe icetolting is good for a horse, neither would rushing thru deep sucky mud or sand or asphalt. If ice tolting never had a curve maybe it would be a little better. But I just cant see how a horse can go around a bend at any kinda speed at all without some torque going on. What I would want from you, is that you try and excercise diligence. Like I do at biglick shows. I watch for things, i take pics, I stand around at the hot dog stand and chat and when people say gosh that looks like its hard on a horse, and I say oh it IS!! They sore them, they hurt them, they nail shoes on over golfballs crammed into the frog so each step is agonizing... I just go on and on real cheerful and their faces start looking more and more horrified and then i say well, thanks, nice chatting and stroll away. We could be right, we could be wrong. But for me, I do what I can where I can to help horses in situations where I think they are in situations that arent good for them! and I think just our exposure to all these varying opinions on here make us more aware and more observant, and horses are helped by it more and more lately because of all of us! Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 2:59 PM, Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > He is way more redneck than injun > Does he respond to the name Stonewall? V
Re: [IceHorses] Saddle fit pics
whgat kinda horse is Whisper?? in the pic in her easy boots, it almost looks like she is wearing mary Janes HAHa she is very pretty Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
[IceHorses] Re: Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
>Robyn's suggestion of 1/4" front shim< I use a 1/4" Prolite shim on both my horses placed a bit differently for each & it makes HUGE difference. Maybe Robyn has a spare Balance shim for sale??? Kaaren
[IceHorses] Re: Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
>Longriders Gear Mohair Girth< This is a much better option that the Torsion Luna girth. Some horses do really well with it. Since the forward girth groove person already has a Sensation girth, no harm in playing with the billets as described in my last post. If it works, she doesn't have to buy a new girth..if it doesn't she's no worse off than beofre. Kaaren
Re: [IceHorses] Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
well, i finally made it to your blog Susan! I really enjoyed the videos! I would like you to explain about the promise wrap tho! what the heck does it do... I like the saddle but gosh they are pricey... Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Saddle fit pics
I went to the site Susan! Its not really treeless, right? I like the booties. My Jas can't have anything on his spine... Did you get a pink one?? Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
> > I did! His name was "My Apache Majic" and I changed it to Stonewall > > Rackin Jacksin :) > > > > Why did you change it? We have a thing about civil war names. and Apache Majic was too cutesy for him. It just didnt suit him! He is way more redneck than injun :) Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Following A Feel
On Apr 22, 2008, at 10:04 PM, Judy Ryder wrote: Following A Feel By Brent Graef There's a difference between a horse who is escaping pressure versus a horse who is willingly following a feel. Thanks Judy! Beautifully put, I learned the "up the pressure" method when I started out and became increasingly unhappy with the results. Now I am trying to figure out how to really use feel and timing, and it is difficult (at least for me) and I backslide a lot. A lot of the time I come in wondering why things weren't working and then realize that I was trying to make something happen, instead of setting it up and letting it happen. A couple more great quote from Tom Dorrance: "The thing you are trying to help the horse do is to use his own mind. You are trying to present something and let him figure it out how to get there." and "Don't try to move his feet. Leave that to him." The first time I read that second quote I thought "well, of course the horse moves his own feet -- duh", a year later when I was re- reading True Unity it hit me like a ton of bricks -- I had been trying to move my horses feet, not getting to his mind and letting him figure out where his feet needed to be. Of course the realization is just the beginning. How the heck do I reach my horses mind? Still working on that part! Kat
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 15:31:19 -0400, you wrote: >But I still like ya. : ) Ditto. Just because we sometimes disagree doesn't mean we can't be friends! ; ) Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk --- "Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes"
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
> Seriously - I wish you (Renee), Wanda, Judy, Janice, Karen etc etc could > have seen this show and the way the horses reacted.< Hi Mic, I can appreciate that you are comfortable with icetolts based on your experience at this show, and that you make up your own mind about things -- which I also appreciate. But it really wouldn't change my mind at all to see how the horses reacted at your show. I simply do not believe in riding horses on ice in a skaking rink. Im my mind, as a responsible horse owner and advocate for the Icelandic horse, it's pure foolishness. Period. But I still like ya. : ) -- Renee M. in Michigan
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
On 23/04/2008, Mic Rushen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Seriously - I wish you (Renee), Wanda, Judy, Janice, Karen etc etc > could have seen this show and the way the horses reacted. Oh...I'm not disagreeing with how the horses reacted. Gusti would walk through fire if he thought it would please me. As his guardian though...there are certain things I just won't ask him to do. Wanda
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 14:39:37 -0400, you wrote: >And what a different take / experience Heather had (viewing the recent show >in Vermont) than Mic did. It sounds like the show in Vermont was poles apart from the one in the UK - like the difference between a Big Lick competition and a normal horse show. Seriously - I wish you (Renee), Wanda, Judy, Janice, Karen etc etc could have seen this show and the way the horses reacted. As I said, I like to make up my own mind, just as I did with certain forms of competition riding at the last WC, and I have. I did not see any problem with the UK IceTolt. Period. Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk --- "Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes"
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
- Original Message - From: "Judy Ryder" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > I recall one gal several years ago arguing for the icetolts and her horse > not having any problem with it, but a year later was dead lame.< That's another thing. . . Is anyone really going to come forward after riding in these things (or several) and admit their horse is unsound later on??? And what a different take / experience Heather had (viewing the recent show in Vermont) than Mic did. I copy her post from 4/16 here: "I went to the iceshow in VT last month and I have to admit, I was horrified. I went because I just needed to see for myself. I'm not one to get overly upset by things but I felt what I witnessed was cruel. One stallion's legs went out right under him and he fell on his side. The rider got back on and continued. The stallion was clearly shaken and every time he passed that spot where he fell, he slowed right down. Many of the horses did some sliding and were trying hard to step carefully. The arena was also very small but that didn't stop them from trying to show the flying pace. None of the horses were able to do it because they just weren't comfortable. They did an extended trot instead. The trainers riding were all the well known ones that are living here in the states now. I'm sure many of you can figure out who they are. All I can say is, the studs clearly were not enough and these horses were forced to perform in a situation they were NOT comfortable with. I left the show feeling badly with a lot less respect to the riders/trainers. Heather" Now, Jason (Sigrun's American husband) touts himself as an Icelandic farrier having studied in Iceland for awhile to learn just what to do.So. . . he didn't check the horses performing and/or put the icenails on right or something that they were slipping??Or could it be even with icenails horses shouldn't be ridden on ice if at all possible? Why isn't this a no brainer? -- Renee M. in Michigan
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
- Original Message - From: "Skye and Sally ~Fire Island" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > My question is this. > > Has there been studies on horses with metal shoes driving carriges at a > trot on hard asphalt? Days on end for some of them. Hi Skye, I have often wondered that myself. . . They trot a lot and the concussion to their legs has to take a toll. I always feel so sorry for the carriage horses in the bigger cities. . . Gawd, what a life. > > Horses who are ridden across solid rock for endurance, trail rides etc. > (My horses are ridden across solid rock on a daily basis, very hard, solid > and unforgiving rockat least ice gives a little) I think as long as there's nothing on their feet that would "grab" and the horse is allowed to pick his/her speed and gait, you'd be okay. > > Have any studies been done on horses that tolt across ice (for short > perioods of time) Remember, they eat horses in Iceland. There have been studies done on the incidence of Spavin in Icelandic horses, however.Am I suggesting that spavin is caused from the occasional icetolt? No. Just that the breed has not "evolved" to be more resistant to such kinds of injuries. > > And why is it ok for a horse to do icetolt in Iceland , but no other > place? Icetolts started as a late winter gathering when people were likely feeling intense cabin-fever after the long, dark winter and wanting to socialize and have a little friendly competition with their horses.What they had to use were frozen lakes.It was what was available. From a cultural standpoint, I can completely understand how they came to be. Now, of course, it's a tradition and though I don't think they're very nice for the horses, I do respect it's their country and their tradition.However, it makes no sense in this country, to rent a skating rink when we have an abundance of indoor RIDING ARENAS which are large, with good footing MADE FOR RIDING HORSES at our disposal in which to show the horses. But Mic has brought up something that I hadn't thought about before and what I am now thinking is the REAL appeal of holding these events here. . . It's that old favorite curse that usually motivates people: MONEY. In Iceland, Icetolts began and more or less remain an open-air, friendly social event as a pre-curser to the riding season. Outside of Iceland, they've apparently taken on another form: a money maker.Well. . . I guess we will continue to see more of these events here then. Sigh. >Are their joints somehow protected there while on their homeland soil?< No, Judy can direct you to the Spavin studies done on the horses in Iceland. There are scads of horses in Iceland, and if you've read Stan Hirson's blog, http://www.hestakaup.com/, you will read where it's rare to see horses beyond their teens (I noticed this as well): Stan said: . . . In Iceland I have heard people marvel that a horse of 18 is still going. And in one case, a horse that is 23 is still being ridden for round-ups. But the competition stallion is going to be ridden for a few years and then used for breeding. There is always a newer and younger horse coming!" A horse going lame at 10, 12, 15 is not going to be around long to be counted.The Spavin study (at least the one I'm thinking of) was done mostly on horse skeletons. -- Renee M. in Michigan
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
Hi Mic, First of all, I am sorry if I came on too strong. It IS a great thing that you reported what you saw and experienced and I hope no one will ever feel like they can't or shouldn't do that on this list -- even if it isn't something many will agree with. So, please accept my apologies if you felt you needed a flame suit (I hope not!) after my post.I DO want to discuss this further however, because you bring up some great points. So. . . I asked: >>What is the point of running horses on ice when there is perfectly good >>footing available for a show?<< Mic responded: > Well, for us in the UK, it got 1200 people to see Icelandics who otherwise > would not have. . . . So - the spectacle of it got people to come and > watch, people who may well go on to become Icelandic horse owners.< Okay, I can understand how encouraging these kinds of numbers must appear to those who sponsored this event. That IS an awesome turnout, especially when compared to the average 50-60 spectators at a major show. As you said, the "spectacle" of the icetolt was the attraction. It was entertainment When my sisters were in High School, (both of whom are in their 50's now) a big money maker for the athletic boosters was holding a "donkey basketball game" where alumni players played the current team and both rode little donkeys during the game. They had to turn people away at the door because the gymasium would be so packed with spectators -- waaayy more than for any normal game.People loved it -- found it immensely entertaining as the little donkeys would buck, run out from under their riders, and create general chaos and mayhem.. (Thankfully, to my knowledge, these events do no go on anymore.) It was immensely popular, but . . . was it a good promotion for basketball? Did it make people want to buy a donkey? No, probably not in both cases. There is a difference between entertaining people and promoting a breed. To me, the indoor icetolts are not creating a positive image for the breed AND especially those who own the horses (who would purposely run their beloved horse on ice for the sake of entertaining people?) any more than whoever used to supply the donkeys for those barbaric donkey basketball games was promoting donkeys. There's another side to these icetolts. I have read people making statements that somehow, Icelandics are "evolved" to handle themselves better on ice than other horses. This is simply misleading and well, stupid. They speak as if the horses themselves grow their own caulks for the winter or have some sort of different hoof structure which gives them more traction.. Take off those icenails and you will have horses moving like any other Equine over ice -- carefully, slowly, and gingerly! (I'm waiting for someone to rig up a Peter-Pan type harness for the horses and suspend them, they we can say they have more of a propensity towards flying than other equines. . . .) An analogy: Take someone born and raised for upteen generations in northern Canada. I would bet they get to be pretty comfortable driving in the winter time on snowy, slippery roads. But take away their four-wheel drive truck and tire chains and chances are, they will be no more adept at not going in the ditch than a California girl.Now, bring Janice, an upteen generation Southern girl up there and give her a four-wheel drive truck and some tire chains.She'd likely be nervous at first, but soon would find she too, could drive pretty well on snowy, slippery roads. It's all in the apparatus, not the genetics. And being that's the case -- does it prove or showcase anything about the breed to run them in a hockey arena? I don't think so. But, as you brought up, it does increase box office sales because it's like the circus coming to town. It's entertaining to people. It's amusing to people. But is beneficial to the breed? Beyond what I and others think of it from the standpoint of torquing the horse's joints when those icenails grab on: Is this good breed promotion? I personally don't think so, any more than donkey basketball games showcase donkeys well. Icetolts show nothing about the Icelandic horse, only than they have farriers capable of giving them good traction. And taken outside with regular footing, I think people could see and learn a whole lot more about the breed -- even if there's only 50 or 60 of them watching. -- Renee M. in Michigan
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
In a message dated 4/23/2008 10:26:54 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes I have the best name of all. Call her, "She belongs to Sylvia" That would work fine here. Sylvia **Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car listings at AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp0030002851)
Re: [IceHorses] Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
> On 23/04/2008, Robyn Hood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > The string girths aren't made short enough to work > on the long billeted > > saddles like the Sensation etc. I got my mohair string girths from Montana Cinch - I believe it was thru Susan at Saddle-Up Tack. They are dressage cinches and work great on the Sensation. Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [IceHorses] Saddle fit pics
--- Kristen Mikula <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The saddle looks good. < Oh, forgot to add, the company is having some growth issues, so wait time is approx. 12 weeks! But go thru a dealer. The absolute best dealer who will help with fitting and shimming is Carol Brand. Here is her website: http://www.lostjuniperranch.com/ Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [IceHorses] Saddle fit pics
--- Kristen Mikula <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Which model are you demo-ing? << This is the Interntionl. It has the endurance pommel, which will take some getting used to (but makes for a great "oh sh*t" handle), but is more like an English seat with the thigh/knee blocks which are movable. I am used to an english saddle, so this was more for me than the Trailmaster or the Eurolight. >> Is is fairly quick to switch pads for a different horse?<< May 2 minutes total to pull off one set and slap another on! Seriously, once you get the set up for a horse, which can take time and tweaking, it is done. Having said that, you should check for saddle fit every couple of months as the horse changes fitness, and tweak as necessary. I think that's where people run into trouble after a couple of months, is the horse changes shape, but the saddle remains the same. With this saddle, you CAN change the saddle to fit your horse as often as necessary! Susan in NV read my blog to see why I ride my horse in pink: http://desertduty.blogspot.com/ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
Re: [IceHorses] Sevin Dust
> If you put it in your paddock dirt it's only a short matter of time > before you and the horses (and honey bees, fly predators, ladybugs, > etc) are breathing dust laced with sevin > (http://pmep.cce.cornell.edu/facts-slides-self/facts/gen-pubre- > sevin.html). > > And gnats and midges don't propagate in dry dirt anyway -- they need > wetness (http://www.ca.uky.edu/entomology/entfacts/ef632.asp). You > need to move to the desert. > Where I live may as well be the desert. It is pure sand. so what happens, is the manure, urine, water spillage etc, seeps down, apparently causes a layer of moist earth. My plan is to remove the first six inches of dirt that is more like "soil" than sand, disc it after that and allow to dry in the sun, then take clean sand from elsewhere and put on top of the then clean dry earth. I was thinking of mixing in some sevin after removing the top layer and before adding the new top layer. From what I've read they need moisture and a blood host. My lots are so dry, the moisture has to be coming from the horses themselves, their waste, spillover from water tanks etc.. It is almost like beach sand. no plants of any kind. dry lots. I read some articles and it said they reproduce in the moist earth and come up thru the sand. I've got to get rid of the moist earth. Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 2:32 PM, Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I did! His name was "My Apache Majic" and I changed it to Stonewall > Rackin Jacksin :) > Why did you change it? V
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 2:35 PM, Judy Ryder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I took a long time to pick out a name for Charm. Her Icelandic name is Asa > Ro, which means Goddess of Peace and Quiet :-) > Nice!!! V
Re: [IceHorses] Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 12:56 PM, Robyn Hood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Since Gat is low in front do you have any kind of shim in your saddle pad to > bring the front up? I think a lot of horses need a bit of front shimming > with treeless saddles as they spread down in front as you sit on them. Yes, I recently bought a shim because I found my Sensation Dressage pulled down hard across the withers. I've been wondering if the Hybrid would do the same thing, or if it would be a better fit on the wither. V
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
> Naming the babies must be difficultthe personality isn't really > set yet, so how does one decide on a name? > Color? Size? Or just pick a name you like? I took a long time to pick out a name for Charm. Her Icelandic name is Asa Ro, which means Goddess of Peace and Quiet :-) Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
> >and there is stonewall. my only resistant to training > > horse > > Maybe change his name! I did! His name was "My Apache Majic" and I changed it to Stonewall Rackin Jacksin :) Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 11:53 AM, Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Here are just a few icelandic horse names I dont think I would choose > > Abba: troll woman > Áma: troll woman, dark mare > Ambátt: captive woman > Andúð: dislike, aversion > Andvaka: sleeplesness > Angeyja: troll woman > Atla: troll-woman > What's with all these different words for troll woman anyways? I've heard that Eskimos have many different words for snow, which I can understand, but troll women?! V
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 11:26 AM, Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >and there is stonewall. my only resistant to training > horse Maybe change his name! V
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 10:29 AM, Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I bet when he was born > they didn't know if he was gonna stay dun. Or that he was dun. You're probably right Janice--you know, that reminds me that the first time I saw Orri I thought he was black (he was in a dark barn). V
Re: [IceHorses] Names
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 10:21 AM, Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Frostrós: frost rose > > Væna: darling > > Stássa: dashing, fancy mare > > > > > ooh i like these three! She could be called rosie, frosti, Vanna, or Stassa. > Janice > Yeah, I like those too! V
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 10:25 AM, Mic Rushen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 07:01:23 -0400, you wrote: > > > Orri means blackcockOrri isn't black, so would it be a personality > >likeness to one (bird of prey?). > > Maybe he has one? > ; ) Haha!! V
Re: [IceHorses] OT--My dog
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 10:18 AM, Janice McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >the best thing > to do is not use pesticides (or herbicides), especially if you use > well water. just go natural whenever you can! Yes, that's what I do. V
Re: [IceHorses] OT--My dog
On Wed, Apr 23, 2008 at 12:05 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Virginia, they get nice fresh raw meat and that's a trendy item these > days, each mouse meal decreases your dog food bill and you have fewer > mice in your barn. Oh - and I doubt that you are going to stop him from > doing it, anyways - dogs being dogs. I just look away... > Penny > > Thank you! V
[IceHorses] Brent Graef's Clinic Schedule
Brent Graef will be in many states in the upcoming months, including NC, TX, CA, OH, OR, GA, MD, WI, MI, IL, IA, ID, FL, NY: http://www.brentgraef.com/schedule.php Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
[IceHorses] Respect
Respect By Brent Graef I would like to offer that to gain a horse's respect, you must first show HIM respect. I think the best way to do that is to try to see things from the horse's perspective. How does the horse perceive that which we are offering to him? Are we asking things of our horses in a polite way or a demanding way? Are we clear in our requests? Can we make our requests so softly that people don't recognize them? Most of us haven't found out how to really channel our energy. It isn't about standing up taller and puffing our chest out... We must learn how to REALLY channel our energy to either draw or drive... or both at the same time. We always hear "Your horse must respect you" "You've gotta get his respect" And the way we generally go about it isn't really garnering respect, but more we are intimidating him. To get a horse's respect, some people try to "show him we're the alpha". That's really just another way of saying show him who's boss, by golly!" Some folks just push the horse around until they give in. Like the bully in elementary school that took the smaller kids' candy or milk money. No respect there, just the knowledge that trouble would come if he didn't shell out his milk money. Try to be even-keeled... don't be losing your temper or yelling at your horse. Be clear in your requests... find a way to make sure you're not blocking them with your energy when you are asking them to do something. Be fair... Be consistent... Have clear boundaries... Show them respect, love, appreciation... it will all come back to you. Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Sevin Dust
On Apr 23, 2008, at 9:13 AM, Janice McDonald wrote: > I am attacking gnats in a full out assault by land sea and air! I am > going to remove about the first six inches of dirt from paddocks and > replacing it with clean sand. I was thinking before doing the sand, I > could disc in sevin dust. Does anyone know if it would be toxic to > horses? It is not toxic to chickens > Janice If you put it in your paddock dirt it's only a short matter of time before you and the horses (and honey bees, fly predators, ladybugs, etc) are breathing dust laced with sevin (http://pmep.cce.cornell.edu/facts-slides-self/facts/gen-pubre- sevin.html). And gnats and midges don't propagate in dry dirt anyway -- they need wetness (http://www.ca.uky.edu/entomology/entfacts/ef632.asp). You need to move to the desert. Lynn Kinsky, Santa Ynez, CA ranch: http://www.silcom.com/~lkinsky/
RE: [IceHorses] Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
Hi Wanda, I do have them made but with the elastic length you can't make them shorter than 90 cm which is too long. Robyn
Re: [IceHorses] Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
On 23/04/2008, Robyn Hood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The string girths aren't made short enough to work on the long billeted > saddles like the Sensation etc. Hi Robyn: Weren't you getting them custom made? Perhaps they could be made short enough for the Sensations? Wanda
[IceHorses] Sevin Dust
I am attacking gnats in a full out assault by land sea and air! I am going to remove about the first six inches of dirt from paddocks and replacing it with clean sand. I was thinking before doing the sand, I could disc in sevin dust. Does anyone know if it would be toxic to horses? It is not toxic to chickens Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names / Skessa
> >What color is she?!?!? That is the coolest pic Mic! > > Well, she's supposed to be a grey... she is "the color of the earth" haha Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
RE: [IceHorses] Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
Hi >>My favorite girth is one of those mohair string girths from Robyn. The string girths aren't made short enough to work on the long billeted saddles like the Sensation etc. Robyn
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
>>And why is it ok for a horse to do icetolt in Iceland , but no other >>place? Are their joints somehow protected there while on their homeland >>soil? No, the joints are not protected in Iceland. Why is it OK in Iceland and no other place? They can do what they want in their country with their horses. I think the discussion is that the icetolt can be potentially damaging to long-term soundness for the horses, so why would an owner take the chance? My horses are not disposable, so I wouldn't do it. Remember there is not a lot of "cause and effect" in regard to the horses in Iceland as the horses have been expendable and disposable. There is not a lot of reason to look for ways to fix or prevent problems. The horses have been fighting the bit for years and years, but no one has attempted to do anything about it or connect it to problems with the bit or heavy contact. The incidence of spavin is very high in Iceland. Could it be icetolts? The children in the Blue Lagoon did not connect the acts that they performed with the resultant pregnancy and birth of a child. Think about logic and cause and effect. Do we really need a study? It would be nice, but who would study it and who would pay for it. The icetolt in Britain would be a good place to start. Every horse at the icetolt could have had a baseline of radiographs taken, along with video of their movement, with thermographic recordings. And then followed up at specific intervals over the course of the next few years. But in the meantime, we do have basic knowledge that has resulted from experience, logic, and cause and effect. >From Adams Lameness: "Studs in shoes create a wrenching effect (torque) every time the horse lands which can cause immediate or longer-term joint damage. This force can often result in the swollen legs". Now, my own personal example is recent knee surgery. The original tear of the meniscus happened a year and a half ago, doing aerobics on carpeting at the church. I heard it tear / pop. But I've been able to walk and use it over the past year and a half. But it wasn't right, it would be uncomfortable, and at times when moving wrong, it made it worse. I recall one gal several years ago arguing for the icetolts and her horse not having any problem with it, but a year later was dead lame. Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
RE: [IceHorses] Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
Hi Virginia, . >>Our Gat has a forward girth groove and is built downhill with a bit of a swayed back. Since Gat is low in front do you have any kind of shim in your saddle pad to bring the front up? I think a lot of horses need a bit of front shimming with treeless saddles as they spread down in front as you sit on them. Even just a 1/4" makes a big difference in where you are sitting, how the saddle stays in place and on the seat of the rider and feel through the rider's back. Robyn
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names / Skessa
On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 10:08:14 -0500, you wrote: >What color is she?!?!? That is the coolest pic Mic! Well, she's supposed to be a grey... Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk --- "Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes"
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 09:07:49 -0600, you wrote: >I've had horses slip here during a particularly icy spell one winter. >Specifically Elska was sore for a few days. Did she have studs on though? Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk --- "Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes"
RE: [IceHorses] Re:Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
Hi Kaaren >>>Sometimes using the self centering billets in a different way on the Sensation girth can help. You can try tightening the rear billet one-2holes more then the front billet and if that doesn't make a difference, try the reverse. That is one of the advantages of the self-centering girths, that you have so much more choice in the billet holes. I really like them as well. Robyn
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
One of the worse horses I've seen was named "Heathen". We knew an especially hot Arab named Hellation. Nancy
RE: [IceHorses] Re: Following A Feel
Hi Dorothy, >>>That makes sense, and I have experienced it with KLokkur. Upping the pressure works sometimes, but other times it is counter productive. The reflex is for animals to give to release rather than pressure. The opposition reflex is triggered when you apply pressure, just as our reflex is to pull or push when we feel sudden pressure, when you slowly release the pressure (feels like you are just melting in the muscle that was tight) the animals (this works with dogs as well) cannot help but release as well. I am pretty convinced that is the missing piece to what many people are taught about pressure because as you slowly release the animal will respond with what is described as 'a try'. I don't think that most of the people describing this realize what they are doing because it is so subtle that unless you feel it you won't know you are 'doing' anything. I think one of the biggest problems with 'upping' pressure is that you increase stress and as stress increases there is a hormone called ACTH which blocks learning. The horse may do it but the next time you bring the horse out to work you can't just start where you ended but sometimes actually go right back to the beginning. This means the horse is not really learning. Robyn
RE: [IceHorses] Leadership
Hi Judy >>Learn to read your horse, learn to listen to him. If you want to be his leader, be a good, solid and caring leader instead of a dictator. >>I would suggest that most folks stop working so hard to be the "alpha" and try more to be a good "partner" and friend for the horse. Most folks seem to have the idea that the "alpha" has to be the one to make ALL the decisions I would so agree with what Brent has to say, I have heard myself say the same things many times. If you are really a partner, then sometimes you do what you want and sometimes the horse gets to make choices. Robyn Hood
Re: [IceHorses] Demo Video
>>> it is not easy to ride in a demo Yes, good that they went slowly. There were many other horse breeds in the demo without fighting the bit, so I'm not sure that we can apply riding in an arena with a crowd as the reason for it. It's the same fighting the bit that we see in other icelandic-style riding situations, whether it is evaluation, competition, group riding, or solo riding. Judy http://iceryder.net http://clickryder.com
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
My favorites so far are: Kubbur: stump, fatso Kólfur: spear, sheath of a horse Bjálfi: fur, bastard Vepja: peewit Buska: promiscuous tramp woman Björg: help janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
oh wait, I missed the K's. Some of the good ones are K's, here ya go: Kaktus: cactus Kaldi: cold breeze Kálfur: calf Kali: cold wind Kalsi: cold weather Kapall: horse Kargur: stubborn horse Keyptur: one who has been bought Kíli: wedge Kjangi: hunchback Kjáni: fool Klampur: block of wood Klaufi: bungler Klossi: lump Klumpur: lump Korgur: coffee grounds Kóti: scoundrel Kraki: bean stalk Kvasi: tired, breathless Kvæsir: shy one, one who hisses Kölski: devil, satan Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
On 4/23/08, Nancy Sturm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I know i KNOW for a F-A-C-T horses become their names. > > Bev had a horse in recently for training. His name was Nitro. He lived up > to every bit of the name. I swear! what is UP with that!! One of the worse horses I've seen was named "Heathen". Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names / Skessa
What color is she?!?!? That is the coolest pic Mic! Janice-- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] Re: Names
I know i KNOW for a F-A-C-T horses become their names. Bev had a horse in recently for training. His name was Nitro. He lived up to every bit of the name. Nancy
Re: [IceHorses] Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
> I am having the trouble with my Sensation and the sensation girth. If > the saddle is placed in the correct postition the billets are much > further back then where the girth naturally goes. I use this girth from Long Riders and really like it - it really keeps my Sensation in place http://www.longridersgear.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=79_28&products_id=493 Laree in NC Doppa & Mura Simon, Sadie and Sam (the "S" gang) "Yet when all the books have been read and reread, it boils down to the horse, his human companion, and what goes on between them." - William Farley
Re: [IceHorses] OT--My dog
> I would worry about what the mouse ate...before being eaten by your > dog. My friend Linda had a dog...who ate a mouse, the mouse has eaten > rat poison and Linda's dog almost died. That would be one of my > concerns. > Raven >Yes, that worries me too, except I don't know where the mouse would >get the poison because the mice are in back pasture. I suppose they >could find their way to someones house but I just can't tie my dog up >for that possibility--this is the first time in her life she's been >able to run free when we go for walks and the joy in her face and body >is a thrill to watch. >V The dogs usually have to eat quite a few poisoned mice/rats in order to die from secondary toxicity - I have never seen one affected that way although I have treated many who just marched up to the bait boxes and snacked away. Not all of those survive. My dogs hunt and eat all the varmints and birds around here. I don't mind about the varmints but I do wish they would leave the birds alone. I keep them on interceptor which kills a nice variety of intestinal parasites as well as heartworm. Look at it this way, Virginia, they get nice fresh raw meat and that's a trendy item these days, each mouse meal decreases your dog food bill and you have fewer mice in your barn. Oh - and I doubt that you are going to stop him from doing it, anyways - dogs being dogs. I just look away... Penny
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
On 23/04/2008, Mic Rushen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Does anyone actually KNOW, for certain, of any horse, anywhere, that > has ever suffered serious or permanent injury from being ridden on ice > with correctly fitted studs? I've had horses slip here during a particularly icy spell one winter. Specifically Elska was sore for a few days. I'm sorry, I just wouldn't consider slapping on studs and going for a ride in those circumstances. And I don't know anyone around here that would. It just isn't done. I've got two race horse trainers living right next to me and they train in all kinds of weather, everything except ice. Wanda
[IceHorses] Re:Contoured Girths, slipping saddle
>Forward girth lines< I have Iceys, one of whom has a forward girth line. The Torsion Luna girth did not make one bit of difference & Lalli hated it. It made my Sensation very laterally unstable as well. Tried the very $$$ County crescent girth with the same results. Sometimes using the self centering billets in a different way on the Sensation girth can help. You can try tightening the rear billet one-2holes more then the front billet and if that doesn't make a difference, try the reverse. I do the former with my guy & it allows the saddle to stay where it needs to on him. Kaaren
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 09:13:26 -0500, you wrote: >he just goes >full bore, leaves flying whooo h having a blast... and its up to >ME to protect him from his own stupidity. I have a couple like that too - I wouldn't even think about riding them on any dodgy surface. The thinking horses are a lot more fun! (and a lot safer too) Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk --- "Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes"
Re: [IceHorses] Baldur
> WOW You lucky pair! I could be really envious, he's such a super > horse. I saw him several years ago in Iceland, and we tried to get a > group of breeders together in the UK to buy him when he was for sale > but couldn't manage it. i think a photo is in order! Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
Re: [IceHorses] IceTolt in Britain
On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 08:06:12 -0600, you wrote: >Okay...so drive back there and find him, and see how he's moving today. Well, I spoke to his owner Laura and she says he's absolutely fine, no problem whatsoever (she was rather surprised at my concern..) - and quite honestly, why shouldn't he be? One hind foot slid, what, maybe 3 inches? My horses have done that on the road before now, plenty of times. I think maybe people forget that horses strain tendons/damage joints/break legs/etc etc etc ridden on perfect footing or even unridden the field. Unless we wrap them in cotton wool and keep them in a padded stall all the time, nasty things can happen anywhere (and if we kept them in that padded stall they would die of boredom anyhow!). Does anyone actually KNOW, for certain, of any horse, anywhere, that has ever suffered serious or permanent injury from being ridden on ice with correctly fitted studs? Mic Mic (Michelle) Rushen --- Solva Icelandic Horses and DeMeulenkamp Sweet Itch Rugs: www.solva-icelandics.co.uk --- "Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes"
Re: [IceHorses] Baldur
> I guess I got a little giddy after riding Baldur earlier. Not sure if you > are aware but Sally and I are his owners now. He is my riding horse, and is > teaching me lots about riding, what a nice mellow guy. Did you have to have baldur shipped in?? I wish you could take photos of the lava flowing into the sea... Janice -- even good horses have bad days sometimes.
