Re: Barley Twist

['Curt George' via Legacy Ornamental Mills]

Hello ArkadyThank you.  I will be keeping your Excel file with all my personal 
Legacy files. Your effort is appreciated. I Thank You !
C.A.G.  

On Sunday, February 18, 2018 5:51 AM, Arkady Paka <arkadyp...@gmail.com> 
wrote:
 

 Hello Curtis and all.I try to convert picture into Excel file with adding 
something (yellow).If there are mistakes please check and fix it.
ArkadyUkraine.
2018-02-18 8:07 GMT+02:00 MWF <mwfos...@earthlink.net>:

Curtis,
Thank you.
I appreciate the effort.
Mac

-Original Message-
From: 'Curt George' via Legacy Ornamental Mills 
Sent: Feb 17, 2018 11:37 PM
To: "legacy-ornamental-mills@ googlegroups.com" 
Subject: Re: Barley Twist

Hello MacI will see if I can photo shop it.  When I blow it up (increase the 
size) I can read it.  I agree its hard to read.
More latter.
C.A.G. 

On Saturday, February 17, 2018 11:06 PM, MWF <mwfos...@earthlink.net> wrote:
 

 Curtis,
Thanks for sharing what you have.
Trying to read the attachment/Gear Info Tables you had in your reply is giving 
me a headache.
Do you, or anyone else have a better (darker, more readable) copy of them?
I'm just hoping there is a more readable one out there.
Mac

-Original Message-
From: 'Curt George' via Legacy Ornamental Mills 
Sent: Feb 17, 2018 3:44 PM
To: "legacy-ornamental-mills@ googlegroups.com" 
Subject: Re: Barley Twist

PatrickDon't sweat it ! ;-) step by step...  We are in for a FUN Ride here ! 
Its all part of the Legacy Band Wagon, And its all down hill form here ! ;-p
I hope you have no problems putting your machine together?  If you need any 
help Please let up know.C.A.G. 

On Saturday, February 17, 2018 2:52 PM, Patrick Salter 
<patsalte...@gmail.com> wrote:
 

 Wow, I haven’t even finished putting my legacy together and messages like this 
are already giving me a headache. LOL. Can’t wait to get started. 

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Re: Barley Twist

['Curt George' via Legacy Ornamental Mills]

Hello MacI will see if I can photo shop it.  When I blow it up (increase the 
size) I can read it.  I agree its hard to read.
More latter.
C.A.G. 

On Saturday, February 17, 2018 11:06 PM, MWF <mwfos...@earthlink.net> wrote:
 

 #yiv6732672064 #yiv6732672064 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv6732672064 Curtis,
Thanks for sharing what you have.
Trying to read the attachment/Gear Info Tables you had in your reply is giving 
me a headache.
Do you, or anyone else have a better (darker, more readable) copy of them?
I'm just hoping there is a more readable one out there.
Mac

-Original Message-
From: 'Curt George' via Legacy Ornamental Mills 
Sent: Feb 17, 2018 3:44 PM
To: "legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com" 
Subject: Re: Barley Twist

PatrickDon't sweat it ! ;-) step by step...  We are in for a FUN Ride here ! 
Its all part of the Legacy Band Wagon, And its all down hill form here ! ;-p
I hope you have no problems putting your machine together?  If you need any 
help Please let up know.C.A.G. 

On Saturday, February 17, 2018 2:52 PM, Patrick Salter 
<patsalte...@gmail.com> wrote:
 

 Wow, I haven’t even finished putting my legacy together and messages like this 
are already giving me a headache. LOL. Can’t wait to get started. 

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Re: Barley Twist

[MWF]

Curtis,Thanks for sharing what you have.Trying to read the attachment/Gear Info Tables you had in your reply is giving me a headache.Do you, or anyone else have a better (darker, more readable) copy of them?I'm just hoping there is a more readable one out there.Mac-Original Message-
From: 'Curt George' via Legacy Ornamental Mills <legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Feb 17, 2018 3:44 PM
To: "legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com" <legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: Barley Twist

PatrickDon't sweat it ! ;-) step by step...  We are in for a FUN Ride here ! Its all part of the Legacy Band Wagon, And its all down hill form here ! ;-pI hope you have no problems putting your machine together?  If you need any help Please let up know.C.A.G. On Saturday, February 17, 2018 2:52 PM, Patrick Salter <patsalte...@gmail.com> wrote:   Wow, I haven’t even finished putting my legacy together and messages like this are already giving me a headache. LOL. Can’t wait to get started. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to legacy-ornamental-mills+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.To post to this group, send email to legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com.Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills.For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. 



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Re: Barley Twist

['Curt George' via Legacy Ornamental Mills]

PatrickDon't sweat it ! ;-) step by step...  We are in for a FUN Ride here ! 
Its all part of the Legacy Band Wagon, And its all down hill form here ! ;-p
I hope you have no problems putting your machine together?  If you need any 
help Please let up know.C.A.G. 

On Saturday, February 17, 2018 2:52 PM, Patrick Salter 
 wrote:
 

 Wow, I haven’t even finished putting my legacy together and messages like this 
are already giving me a headache. LOL. Can’t wait to get started. 

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Re: Barley Twist

[Richard Ellis]

Hi Tim
The letter "B" does not mean anything to me and I think it is going to be 
trial and error It is a one start pitch  required.
I have just read an old post on this forum dated 11/29/12 heading-- 
Ain' t life fun when the brain slows down??
Fun with numbers and gear sets
These are what gears I have
240-38 2x
180-120 .25
180-? .5
180-/ ?
Which do you think is "B" gear??
*I copied and pasted the  **Fun with Numbers and the Gear Sets *and since 
then I have larger print and can't seem to change it.
More problems to solve !!
Any way thanks for the quick reply.
Richard


On Saturday, February 17, 2018 at 6:20:19 AM UTC, Tim wrote:
>
> With a little math you can solve this.
>
> Pitch = diameter of router bit X the number of starts.
>
> To get a 1.5" pitch you would need to use the .25 reduction set with the F 
> gear on the leadscrew.  If you don't have the reduction gear you could do a 
> two start twist with a 3" pitch  with the B gear on the leadscrew.
>
> Sent from BlueMail  
> On Feb 16, 2018, at 9:41 PM, Richard Ellis  > wrote:
>>
>> Hi
>>  I am in a muddle my brain won't work.
>> I have a buyer for my Woodchuck and he wants to do a BARLEY TWIST On a 2 
>> inch diam. 4 foot long bit of wood.
>> What tooth gears do I need for 1 1/2 inch cutter. i.e.
>>
>> Spindle gear tooth :A: and :B: ? Driving the next gear   ?? Teeth?
>> Leadscrew Gear teeth.?
>> Hope you can help
>> Thanks
>> Richard  (It's an age thing )
>>
>>

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Re: Barley Twist

[Tim Krause]

With a little math you can solve this.

Pitch = diameter of router bit X the number of starts.

To get a 1.5" pitch you would need to use the .25 reduction set with the F gear 
on the leadscrew.  If you don't have the reduction gear you could do a two 
start twist with a 3" pitch  with the B gear on the leadscrew.

⁣Sent from BlueMail ​

On Feb 16, 2018, 9:41 PM, at 9:41 PM, Richard Ellis  
wrote:
>Hi
> I am in a muddle my brain won't work.
>I have a buyer for my Woodchuck and he wants to do a BARLEY TWIST On a
>2 
>inch diam. 4 foot long bit of wood.
>What tooth gears do I need for 1 1/2 inch cutter. i.e.
>
>Spindle gear tooth :A: and :B: ? Driving the next gear   ?? Teeth?
>Leadscrew Gear teeth.?
>Hope you can help
>Thanks
>Richard  (It's an age thing )
>
>-- 
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>Groups "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
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>https://groups.google.com/group/legacy-ornamental-mills.
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Re: Barley Twist

[Tim Krause]

Single start?

⁣Sent from BlueMail ​

On Feb 16, 2018, 9:41 PM, at 9:41 PM, Richard Ellis  
wrote:
>Hi
> I am in a muddle my brain won't work.
>I have a buyer for my Woodchuck and he wants to do a BARLEY TWIST On a
>2 
>inch diam. 4 foot long bit of wood.
>What tooth gears do I need for 1 1/2 inch cutter. i.e.
>
>Spindle gear tooth :A: and :B: ? Driving the next gear   ?? Teeth?
>Leadscrew Gear teeth.?
>Hope you can help
>Thanks
>Richard  (It's an age thing )
>
>-- 
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>Groups "Legacy Ornamental Mills" group.
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Re: Barley twist on pens

[jwb764]

Well Tim your not as Lazy as I am, I won't bother looking up the tube diameter, 
I will just measure the ones I have.  I am not sure if I am being lazy, or if I 
just don't trust other people when it comes to damaging a tool (Router Bit, Pen 
Tube, or Mandrel)

Jeff Becker


 jwb...@windstream.net wrote: 
 Setting the depth of a pen for a barley twist can be simple, you mount  the 
 tubes on the mandrel with no wood present in the machine, you lower the bit 
 to the tube the raise it a safe amount and set a stop, you will then use that 
 stop as the lowest point to turn the wood.
 
 With you having cad software you can draw the part on the computer and save 
 some time, if you have a z axis up grade
 
 
 Jeff Becker
 
 
 
  Tim Krause artmarb...@comcast.net wrote: 
  Why would I need a sacrificial pen mandrel?  Do you think the pen would be 
  too large of a diameter if you went the full depth of the barley twist bit? 
  I really have not worked out the details which I asked if it had been done. 
  
  -Tim
  
- Original Message - 
From: rookie 
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
Cc: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com 
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 7:44 PM
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens
  
  
I made lots and lots of rope twist pens for my son's Boy Scout Troop as a 
  fundraiser, we sold them at a local Art  Craft fair. The higher priced 
  ones, $30, sold the quickest, these had fancier parts/exotic wood, the 
  regular ones sold for $20.  I like your idea Tim for a barley twist, I've 
  considered it, seems you would need a sacrificial pen mandrel. perhaps 
  brass rod.  
  
On Thursday, April 10, 2014 1:50:56 AM UTC-5, Tim wrote:
  Hey Bill, 
  
  A long time ago you said magnate did not make a small enough barley bit 
  to do pens.  I see a 7557 bit  that has a 3/4 diameter and a cutting depth 
  of 3/32.  That should work for a pen.  Has any one tried a single or a 
  double start barley twist on a pen?
  
  -Tim
  
  
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Re: Barley twist on pens

[Tim Krause]

Why would I need a sacrificial pen mandrel?  Do you think the pen would be too 
large of a diameter if you went the full depth of the barley twist bit? I 
really have not worked out the details which I asked if it had been done. 

-Tim

  - Original Message - 
  From: rookie 
  To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
  Cc: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 7:44 PM
  Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens


  I made lots and lots of rope twist pens for my son's Boy Scout Troop as a 
fundraiser, we sold them at a local Art  Craft fair. The higher priced ones, 
$30, sold the quickest, these had fancier parts/exotic wood, the regular ones 
sold for $20.  I like your idea Tim for a barley twist, I've considered it, 
seems you would need a sacrificial pen mandrel. perhaps brass rod.  

  On Thursday, April 10, 2014 1:50:56 AM UTC-5, Tim wrote:
Hey Bill, 

A long time ago you said magnate did not make a small enough barley bit to 
do pens.  I see a 7557 bit  that has a 3/4 diameter and a cutting depth of 
3/32.  That should work for a pen.  Has any one tried a single or a double 
start barley twist on a pen?

-Tim


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RE: Barley twist on pens

[Bill Bulkeley]

Yea me lol I hand ground the little1/2 rope bit when I chipped it and did a
single start barley

I didn't like it much a single start with the rope bit looked better 

I also did a pineapple pattern too it looked ok. I can't post pics sorry it
was pre fire

But I wanted the 1/2  barley for small spirals not on pens and for smaller
multi start spirals

 

From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
[mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim Krause
Sent: Thursday, 10 April 2014 4:51 PM
To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
Subject: Barley twist on pens

 

Hey Bill, 

 

A long time ago you said magnate did not make a small enough barley bit to
do pens.  I see a 7557 bit  that has a 3/4 diameter and a cutting depth of
3/32.  That should work for a pen.  Has any one tried a single or a double
start barley twist on a pen?

 

-Tim

 

  _  

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Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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Re: Barley twist on pens

[Cole Andrews]

I tried the ropr twist pen and did not like it . Very uncomfortable pen for me.

On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 3:03 AM, Bill Bulkeley bulke...@mmnet.com.au wrote:
 Yea me lol I hand ground the little1/2 rope bit when I chipped it and did a
 single start barley

 I didn't like it much a single start with the rope bit looked better

 I also did a pineapple pattern too it looked ok. I can't post pics sorry it
 was pre fire

 But I wanted the 1/2  barley for small spirals not on pens and for smaller
 multi start spirals



 From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim Krause
 Sent: Thursday, 10 April 2014 4:51 PM
 To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Barley twist on pens



 Hey Bill,



 A long time ago you said magnate did not make a small enough barley bit to
 do pens.  I see a 7557 bit  that has a 3/4 diameter and a cutting depth of
 3/32.  That should work for a pen.  Has any one tried a single or a double
 start barley twist on a pen?



 -Tim



 

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 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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Re: Barley twist on pens

[Tim Krause]

Hi Cole and Bill,

I don't like the looks of the triple roped pen myself.  I think I like the
idea of a double roped so it forms a little bead wrapped around the pen. I
wonder why I don't see more polygon shaped pens with a dash of tear-drop
flutes or super tiny reeds.  Jerry Beal came out with the Pen Wizard three
or so years ago and yet I don't see non-round pens anywhere.  One could
argue the tool costs too much but I see it as pennies for what it can do.
Isn't that why we bought our machines?  Based on dreams and what we can do,
but what we DO in the end is a different story :-)

I once read in a pen makers forum that the twisted pens where not that
successful compared to standard pens.  I never got to see any example of the
pens and that was just a coupe sellers opinions.  I wondered how they where
presented. Here's a little story from my life of selling treenware.

I made 50 units of a product that generally sells for $25 - $30 all day long
using my legacy and not one of them where round.  I sold them for $35 or
more on ebay and they where selling as I produced them.  Now granted I have
a name in the trinket field which helped, but I sold them with the idea that
it's not the shape that you see that any turner makes.  Mine are original,
one of a kind, and limited availability.   So I don't know if it was my
name, the pitch, or simply the fact they where different, but I do know they
left my door with a %100 percent guarantee and none ever came back.

Moral of the story, if you're in the craft field you do have educate the
customer and as I call it, Sell the Story.  It means more cash per unit
but often less sales because the price point is higher.  It beats making
widgets at a quarter a piece, but I'll admit to making widgets to pay the
bills as well.  Those too can be lucrative.

I still wonder if a single or double start Barley pen has ever been made and
how it feels.

-Tim



- Original Message - 
From: Cole Andrews coleandrew...@gmail.com
To: Legacy group legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 12:24 PM
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens


 I tried the ropr twist pen and did not like it . Very uncomfortable pen
for me.

 On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 3:03 AM, Bill Bulkeley bulke...@mmnet.com.au
wrote:
  Yea me lol I hand ground the little1/2 rope bit when I chipped it and
did a
  single start barley
 
  I didn't like it much a single start with the rope bit looked better
 
  I also did a pineapple pattern too it looked ok. I can't post pics sorry
it
  was pre fire
 
  But I wanted the 1/2  barley for small spirals not on pens and for
smaller
  multi start spirals
 
 
 
  From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
  [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim
Krause
  Sent: Thursday, 10 April 2014 4:51 PM
  To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
  Subject: Barley twist on pens
 
 
 
  Hey Bill,
 
 
 
  A long time ago you said magnate did not make a small enough barley bit
to
  do pens.  I see a 7557 bit  that has a 3/4 diameter and a cutting depth
of
  3/32.  That should work for a pen.  Has any one tried a single or a
double
  start barley twist on a pen?
 
 
 
  -Tim
 
 
 
  
 
  No virus found in this message.
  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
  Version: 2014.0.4355 / Virus Database: 3882/7322 - Release Date:
04/09/14
 
  No virus found in this message.
  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
  Version: 2014.0.4355 / Virus Database: 3882/7322 - Release Date:
04/09/14
 
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Re: Barley twist on pens

[CURTIS GEORGE]

Hello everyone, 
On the Beall web site/ fourm. YoYospin (Jarry) comented a while back, the 
Biggest problem that most owners make, (when using his machine.) is that they 
cut to deep on there details, which makes the pens uncomfortable to hold. 
Perhaps this rope cutting on the pens falls into this category ? 
Now what I think would be neat, would be to cut the pen blanks (rope or 
reed...) and then find a way to build up the finish so that the cut doesn't 
feel funny. 
I mean (Just an idea.) could you turn a pen and then set that turning back into 
a clear epoxy? so that the wood would be inside a clear and smooth finish? 
I know for my self. I like a smooth and thin pen, as well as pencil, I do not 
like the feel of odd shape or edges, in which hurt my fingers after a long use. 
Now Im no expert on this, but even when I see a fine made pen, it will be love 
at first touch or it just will not happen at all for me. So far Ive not made 
any pens that feel like what I want. but...? But who know, perhaps some kind of 
ergo dynamic pen just might be out there for me? but it would be, just my luck 
that I find one that I like, and it would be one of the ugliest pens ever made. 
;-p 
I wish you guys the best of luck on this topic. Hopefully you all can get some 
nice pens turned and then Post the pictures, here. I would love to see them. 
;-) 


C.A.G. 

- Original Message -
Hi Cole and Bill, 

I don't like the looks of the triple roped pen myself. I think I like the 
idea of a double roped so it forms a little bead wrapped around the pen. I 
wonder why I don't see more polygon shaped pens with a dash of tear-drop 
flutes or super tiny reeds. Jerry Beal came out with the Pen Wizard three 
or so years ago and yet I don't see non-round pens anywhere. One could 
argue the tool costs too much but I see it as pennies for what it can do. 
Isn't that why we bought our machines? Based on dreams and what we can do, 
but what we DO in the end is a different story :-) 

I once read in a pen makers forum that the twisted pens where not that 
successful compared to standard pens. I never got to see any example of the 
pens and that was just a coupe sellers opinions. I wondered how they where 
presented. Here's a little story from my life of selling treenware. 

I made 50 units of a product that generally sells for $25 - $30 all day long 
using my legacy and not one of them where round. I sold them for $35 or 
more on ebay and they where selling as I produced them. Now granted I have 
a name in the trinket field which helped, but I sold them with the idea that 
it's not the shape that you see that any turner makes. Mine are original, 
one of a kind, and limited availability. So I don't know if it was my 
name, the pitch, or simply the fact they where different, but I do know they 
left my door with a %100 percent guarantee and none ever came back. 

Moral of the story, if you're in the craft field you do have educate the 
customer and as I call it, Sell the Story. It means more cash per unit 
but often less sales because the price point is higher. It beats making 
widgets at a quarter a piece, but I'll admit to making widgets to pay the 
bills as well. Those too can be lucrative. 

I still wonder if a single or double start Barley pen has ever been made and 
how it feels. 

-Tim 



- Original Message - 
From: Cole Andrews coleandrew...@gmail.com 
To: Legacy group legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 12:24 PM 
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens 


 I tried the ropr twist pen and did not like it . Very uncomfortable pen 
for me. 
 
 On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 3:03 AM, Bill Bulkeley bulke...@mmnet.com.au 
wrote: 
  Yea me lol I hand ground the little1/2 rope bit when I chipped it and 
did a 
  single start barley 
  
  I didn't like it much a single start with the rope bit looked better 
  
  I also did a pineapple pattern too it looked ok. I can't post pics sorry 
it 
  was pre fire 
  
  But I wanted the 1/2  barley for small spirals not on pens and for 
smaller 
  multi start spirals 
  
  
  
  From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
  [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim 
Krause 
  Sent: Thursday, 10 April 2014 4:51 PM 
  To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com 
  Subject: Barley twist on pens 
  
  
  
  Hey Bill, 
  
  
  
  A long time ago you said magnate did not make a small enough barley bit 
to 
  do pens. I see a 7557 bit that has a 3/4 diameter and a cutting depth 
of 
  3/32. That should work for a pen. Has any one tried a single or a 
double 
  start barley twist on a pen? 
  
  
  
  -Tim 
  
  
  
   
  
  No virus found in this message. 
  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
  Version: 2014.0.4355 / Virus Database: 3882/7322 - Release Date: 
04/09/14 
  
  No virus found in this message. 
  Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
  Version: 2014.0.4355 / Virus Database: 3882/7322 - Release Date: 
04/09

RE: Barley twist on pens

[Bill Bulkeley]

You might be on to something curt cut the spiral then fill it with clear 
acrylic then turn it round again that way you can see the spiral but it still 
feels smooth

Bill

 

From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of CURTIS GEORGE
Sent: Friday, 11 April 2014 8:43 AM
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

 

Hello everyone,

On the Beall web site/ fourm. YoYospin (Jarry) comented a while back, the 
Biggest problem that most owners make, (when using his machine.) is that they 
cut to deep on there details, which makes the pens uncomfortable  to hold. 
Perhaps this rope cutting on the pens falls into this category ?

Now what I think would be neat, would be to cut the pen blanks (rope or 
reed...) and then find a way to build up the finish so that the cut doesn't 
feel funny.

I mean (Just an idea.) could you turn a pen and then set that turning back into 
a clear epoxy? so that the wood would be inside a clear and smooth finish?

I know for my self. I like a smooth and thin pen, as well as pencil, I do not 
like the feel of odd shape or edges, in which hurt my fingers after a long use. 
 

Now Im no expert on this, but even when I see a fine made pen, it will be love 
at first touch or it just will not happen at all for me. So far Ive not made 
any pens that feel like what I want. but...? But who know, perhaps some kind of 
ergo dynamic pen just might be out there for me? but it would be, just my luck 
that I find one that I like, and it would be one of the ugliest pens ever made. 
;-p

I wish you guys the best of luck on this topic. Hopefully you all can get some 
nice pens turned and then Post the pictures, here. I would love to see them.  
;-)

 

C.A.G.

  _  

Hi Cole and Bill,

I don't like the looks of the triple roped pen myself.  I think I like the
idea of a double roped so it forms a little bead wrapped around the pen. I
wonder why I don't see more polygon shaped pens with a dash of tear-drop
flutes or super tiny reeds.  Jerry Beal came out with the Pen Wizard three
or so years ago and yet I don't see non-round pens anywhere.  One could
argue the tool costs too much but I see it as pennies for what it can do.
Isn't that why we bought our machines?  Based on dreams and what we can do,
but what we DO in the end is a different story :-)

I once read in a pen makers forum that the twisted pens where not that
successful compared to standard pens.  I never got to see any example of the
pens and that was just a coupe sellers opinions.  I wondered how they where
presented. Here's a little story from my life of selling treenware.

I made 50 units of a product that generally sells for $25 - $30 all day long
using my legacy and not one of them where round.  I sold them for $35 or
more on ebay and they where selling as I produced them.  Now granted I have
a name in the trinket field which helped, but I sold them with the idea that
it's not the shape that you see that any turner makes.  Mine are original,
one of a kind, and limited availability.   So I don't know if it was my
name, the pitch, or simply the fact they where different, but I do know they
left my door with a %100 percent guarantee and none ever came back.

Moral of the story, if you're in the craft field you do have educate the
customer and as I call it, Sell the Story.  It means more cash per unit
but often less sales because the price point is higher.  It beats making
widgets at a quarter a piece, but I'll admit to making widgets to pay the
bills as well.  Those too can be lucrative.

I still wonder if a single or double start Barley pen has ever been made and
how it feels.

-Tim



- Original Message - 
From: Cole Andrews coleandrew...@gmail.com
To: Legacy group legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 12:24 PM
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens


 I tried the ropr twist pen and did not like it . Very uncomfortable pen
for me.

 On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 3:03 AM, Bill Bulkeley bulke...@mmnet.com.au
wrote:
  Yea me lol I hand ground the little1/2 rope bit when I chipped it and
did a
  single start barley
 
  I didn't like it much a single start with the rope bit looked better
 
  I also did a pineapple pattern too it looked ok. I can't post pics sorry
it
  was pre fire
 
  But I wanted the 1/2  barley for small spirals not on pens and for
smaller
  multi start spirals
 
 
 
  From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
  [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim
Krause
  Sent: Thursday, 10 April 2014 4:51 PM
  To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
  Subject: Barley twist on pens
 
 
 
  Hey Bill,
 
 
 
  A long time ago you said magnate did not make a small enough barley bit
to
  do pens.  I see a 7557 bit  that has a 3/4 diameter and a cutting depth
of
  3/32.  That should work for a pen.  Has any one tried a single or a
double
  start barley twist on a pen

Re: Barley twist on pens

[Tim Krause]

Very inspiring post.  Reminds me of the work Barry Gross was working with 
(probably still is) that he would place stickers, decals gears etc on the 
central tube and use a clear two part polymer to clear cast the blocks.   This 
would be really something different.  

Regarding large diameter pens, some day you might appreciate them when you hand 
grip is no longer what it use to be :-)  Still a great post Curt. 

Thank You!

-Tim

  - Original Message - 
  From: CURTIS GEORGE 
  To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 3:43 PM
  Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens


  Hello everyone,
  On the Beall web site/ fourm. YoYospin (Jarry) comented a while back, the 
Biggest problem that most owners make, (when using his machine.) is that they 
cut to deep on there details, which makes the pens uncomfortable  to hold. 
Perhaps this rope cutting on the pens falls into this category ?
  Now what I think would be neat, would be to cut the pen blanks (rope or 
reed...) and then find a way to build up the finish so that the cut doesn't 
feel funny.
  I mean (Just an idea.) could you turn a pen and then set that turning back 
into a clear epoxy? so that the wood would be inside a clear and smooth finish?
  I know for my self. I like a smooth and thin pen, as well as pencil, I do not 
like the feel of odd shape or edges, in which hurt my fingers after a long use. 
 
  Now Im no expert on this, but even when I see a fine made pen, it will be 
love at first touch or it just will not happen at all for me. So far Ive not 
made any pens that feel like what I want. but...? But who know, perhaps some 
kind of ergo dynamic pen just might be out there for me? but it would be, just 
my luck that I find one that I like, and it would be one of the ugliest pens 
ever made. ;-p
  I wish you guys the best of luck on this topic. Hopefully you all can get 
some nice pens turned and then Post the pictures, here. I would love to see 
them.  ;-)


  C.A.G.


--
  Hi Cole and Bill,

  I don't like the looks of the triple roped pen myself.  I think I like the
  idea of a double roped so it forms a little bead wrapped around the pen. I
  wonder why I don't see more polygon shaped pens with a dash of tear-drop
  flutes or super tiny reeds.  Jerry Beal came out with the Pen Wizard three
  or so years ago and yet I don't see non-round pens anywhere.  One could
  argue the tool costs too much but I see it as pennies for what it can do.
  Isn't that why we bought our machines?  Based on dreams and what we can do,
  but what we DO in the end is a different story :-)

  I once read in a pen makers forum that the twisted pens where not that
  successful compared to standard pens.  I never got to see any example of the
  pens and that was just a coupe sellers opinions.  I wondered how they where
  presented. Here's a little story from my life of selling treenware.

  I made 50 units of a product that generally sells for $25 - $30 all day long
  using my legacy and not one of them where round.  I sold them for $35 or
  more on ebay and they where selling as I produced them.  Now granted I have
  a name in the trinket field which helped, but I sold them with the idea that
  it's not the shape that you see that any turner makes.  Mine are original,
  one of a kind, and limited availability.   So I don't know if it was my
  name, the pitch, or simply the fact they where different, but I do know they
  left my door with a %100 percent guarantee and none ever came back.

  Moral of the story, if you're in the craft field you do have educate the
  customer and as I call it, Sell the Story.  It means more cash per unit
  but often less sales because the price point is higher.  It beats making
  widgets at a quarter a piece, but I'll admit to making widgets to pay the
  bills as well.  Those too can be lucrative.

  I still wonder if a single or double start Barley pen has ever been made and
  how it feels.

  -Tim



  - Original Message - 
  From: Cole Andrews coleandrew...@gmail.com
  To: Legacy group legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
  Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 12:24 PM
  Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens


   I tried the ropr twist pen and did not like it . Very uncomfortable pen
  for me.
  
   On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 3:03 AM, Bill Bulkeley bulke...@mmnet.com.au
  wrote:
Yea me lol I hand ground the little1/2 rope bit when I chipped it and
  did a
single start barley
   
I didn't like it much a single start with the rope bit looked better
   
I also did a pineapple pattern too it looked ok. I can't post pics sorry
  it
was pre fire
   
But I wanted the 1/2  barley for small spirals not on pens and for
  smaller
multi start spirals
   
   
   
From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
[mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim
  Krause
Sent

Re: Barley twist on pens

[Tim Krause]

I'm not a pen maker :-)  I do have my model 200 sitting around with an
unlimited range of gears available to me.  What I don't have is any of the
templates that came with the machine nor do I know what they look like, nor
the interest to go out to the shop and figure it out, or buy some templates
that are still available from a few supplies left!  I've got to be
challenged before I do anything with wood these days.  There, I said it, I
have not turned for a long time!!!  Spring is coming and I need to get this
behavior turned around!  Like the shoe company says, Just Do It!

The rope and pineapple trick sounds cool.

-Tim




- Original Message - 
From: Bill Bulkeley bulke...@mmnet.com.au
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
 Pens can be made on a 900 why don't you have a go at a few Tim
 Another idea i was going to try but didn't get around to it was to do a
rope
 and a pineapple but only do a very shallow cut and make the patterns with
 just the point of the bit so there are many options to try
 Bill


 -Original Message-
 From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim Krause
 Sent: Friday, 11 April 2014 8:00 AM
 To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

 Hi Cole and Bill,

 I don't like the looks of the triple roped pen myself.  I think I like the
 idea of a double roped so it forms a little bead wrapped around the pen. I
 wonder why I don't see more polygon shaped pens with a dash of tear-drop
 flutes or super tiny reeds.  Jerry Beal came out with the Pen Wizard three
 or so years ago and yet I don't see non-round pens anywhere.  One could
 argue the tool costs too much but I see it as pennies for what it can do.
 Isn't that why we bought our machines?  Based on dreams and what we can
do,
 but what we DO in the end is a different story :-)

 I once read in a pen makers forum that the twisted pens where not that
 successful compared to standard pens.  I never got to see any example of
the
 pens and that was just a coupe sellers opinions.  I wondered how they
where
 presented. Here's a little story from my life of selling treenware.

 I made 50 units of a product that generally sells for $25 - $30 all day
long
 using my legacy and not one of them where round.  I sold them for $35 or
 more on ebay and they where selling as I produced them.  Now granted I
have
 a name in the trinket field which helped, but I sold them with the idea
that
 it's not the shape that you see that any turner makes.  Mine are original,
 one of a kind, and limited availability.   So I don't know if it was my
 name, the pitch, or simply the fact they where different, but I do know
they
 left my door with a %100 percent guarantee and none ever came back.

 Moral of the story, if you're in the craft field you do have educate the
 customer and as I call it, Sell the Story.  It means more cash per unit
 but often less sales because the price point is higher.  It beats making
 widgets at a quarter a piece, but I'll admit to making widgets to pay the
 bills as well.  Those too can be lucrative.

 I still wonder if a single or double start Barley pen has ever been made
and
 how it feels.

 -Tim



 - Original Message -
 From: Cole Andrews coleandrew...@gmail.com
 To: Legacy group legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 12:24 PM
 Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens


  I tried the ropr twist pen and did not like it . Very uncomfortable pen
 for me.
 
  On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 3:03 AM, Bill Bulkeley bulke...@mmnet.com.au
 wrote:
   Yea me lol I hand ground the little1/2 rope bit when I chipped it and
 did a
   single start barley
  
   I didn't like it much a single start with the rope bit looked better
  
   I also did a pineapple pattern too it looked ok. I can't post pics
sorry
 it
   was pre fire
  
   But I wanted the 1/2  barley for small spirals not on pens and for
 smaller
   multi start spirals
  
  
  
   From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
   [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim
 Krause
   Sent: Thursday, 10 April 2014 4:51 PM
   To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
   Subject: Barley twist on pens
  
  
  
   Hey Bill,
  
  
  
   A long time ago you said magnate did not make a small enough barley
bit
 to
   do pens.  I see a 7557 bit  that has a 3/4 diameter and a cutting
depth
 of
   3/32.  That should work for a pen.  Has any one tried a single or a
 double
   start barley twist on a pen?
  
  
  
   -Tim
  
  
  
   
  
   No virus found in this message.
   Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
   Version: 2014.0.4355 / Virus Database: 3882/7322 - Release Date:
 04/09/14
  
   No virus found in this message.
   Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
   Version: 2014.0.4355 / Virus Database: 3882/7322 - Release Date:
 04/09/14
  
   --
   You received this message because you are subscribed

Re: Barley twist on pens

[Roger P]

Hi Tim
Time for more education (private joke between Tim and me), what Barry Gross 
demonstrated was decoupage!  This video is a Penn State Industries one, it may 
be Barry doing the commentary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoQ-nuDipUo

Legacy pen demo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoQ-nuDipUo if your interested.
Regards
Euro Roger

From: Tim Krause 
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 12:05 AM
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

Very inspiring post.  Reminds me of the work Barry Gross was working with 
(probably still is) that he would place stickers, decals gears etc on the 
central tube and use a clear two part polymer to clear cast the blocks.   This 
would be really something different.  

Regarding large diameter pens, some day you might appreciate them when you hand 
grip is no longer what it use to be :-)  Still a great post Curt. 

Thank You!

-Tim

  - Original Message - 
  From: CURTIS GEORGE 
  To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 3:43 PM
  Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

  Hello everyone, 
  On the Beall web site/ fourm. YoYospin (Jarry) comented a while back, the 
Biggest problem that most owners make, (when using his machine.) is that they 
cut to deep on there details, which makes the pens uncomfortable  to hold. 
Perhaps this rope cutting on the pens falls into this category ?
  Now what I think would be neat, would be to cut the pen blanks (rope or 
reed...) and then find a way to build up the finish so that the cut doesn't 
feel funny.
  I mean (Just an idea.) could you turn a pen and then set that turning back 
into a clear epoxy? so that the wood would be inside a clear and smooth finish?
  I know for my self. I like a smooth and thin pen, as well as pencil, I do not 
like the feel of odd shape or edges, in which hurt my fingers after a long use. 
 
  Now Im no expert on this, but even when I see a fine made pen, it will be 
love at first touch or it just will not happen at all for me. So far Ive not 
made any pens that feel like what I want. but...? But who know, perhaps some 
kind of ergo dynamic pen just might be out there for me? but it would be, just 
my luck that I find one that I like, and it would be one of the ugliest pens 
ever made. ;-p
  I wish you guys the best of luck on this topic. Hopefully you all can get 
some nice pens turned and then Post the pictures, here. I would love to see 
them.  ;-)

  C.A.G.


--
  Hi Cole and Bill,

  I don't like the looks of the triple roped pen myself.  I think I like the
  idea of a double roped so it forms a little bead wrapped around the pen. I
  wonder why I don't see more polygon shaped pens with a dash of tear-drop
  flutes or super tiny reeds.  Jerry Beal came out with the Pen Wizard three
  or so years ago and yet I don't see non-round pens anywhere.  One could
  argue the tool costs too much but I see it as pennies for what it can do.
  Isn't that why we bought our machines?  Based on dreams and what we can do,
  but what we DO in the end is a different story :-)

  I once read in a pen makers forum that the twisted pens where not that
  successful compared to standard pens.  I never got to see any example of the
  pens and that was just a coupe sellers opinions.  I wondered how they where
  presented. Here's a little story from my life of selling treenware.

  I made 50 units of a product that generally sells for $25 - $30 all day long
  using my legacy and not one of them where round.  I sold them for $35 or
  more on ebay and they where selling as I produced them.  Now granted I have
  a name in the trinket field which helped, but I sold them with the idea that
  it's not the shape that you see that any turner makes.  Mine are original,
  one of a kind, and limited availability.   So I don't know if it was my
  name, the pitch, or simply the fact they where different, but I do know they
  left my door with a %100 percent guarantee and none ever came back.

  Moral of the story, if you're in the craft field you do have educate the
  customer and as I call it, Sell the Story.  It means more cash per unit
  but often less sales because the price point is higher.  It beats making
  widgets at a quarter a piece, but I'll admit to making widgets to pay the
  bills as well.  Those too can be lucrative.

  I still wonder if a single or double start Barley pen has ever been made and
  how it feels.

  -Tim



  - Original Message - 
  From: Cole Andrews coleandrew...@gmail.com
  To: Legacy group legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
  Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 12:24 PM
  Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens


   I tried the ropr twist pen and did not like it . Very uncomfortable pen
  for me.
  
   On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 3:03 AM, Bill Bulkeley bulke...@mmnet.com.au
  wrote:
Yea me lol I hand ground the little1/2 rope bit when I chipped it and
  did

RE: Barley twist on pens

[Bill Bulkeley]

Way to go tim a nice simple pen or 2 might just be the way to ease back in
to the ornamental mill work again
Bill

-Original Message-
From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
[mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim Krause
Sent: Friday, 11 April 2014 9:13 AM
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

I'm not a pen maker :-)  I do have my model 200 sitting around with an
unlimited range of gears available to me.  What I don't have is any of the
templates that came with the machine nor do I know what they look like, nor
the interest to go out to the shop and figure it out, or buy some templates
that are still available from a few supplies left!  I've got to be
challenged before I do anything with wood these days.  There, I said it, I
have not turned for a long time!!!  Spring is coming and I need to get this
behavior turned around!  Like the shoe company says, Just Do It!

The rope and pineapple trick sounds cool.

-Tim




- Original Message -
From: Bill Bulkeley bulke...@mmnet.com.au
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
 Pens can be made on a 900 why don't you have a go at a few Tim Another 
 idea i was going to try but didn't get around to it was to do a
rope
 and a pineapple but only do a very shallow cut and make the patterns 
 with just the point of the bit so there are many options to try Bill


 -Original Message-
 From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim 
 Krause
 Sent: Friday, 11 April 2014 8:00 AM
 To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

 Hi Cole and Bill,

 I don't like the looks of the triple roped pen myself.  I think I like 
 the idea of a double roped so it forms a little bead wrapped around 
 the pen. I wonder why I don't see more polygon shaped pens with a dash 
 of tear-drop flutes or super tiny reeds.  Jerry Beal came out with the 
 Pen Wizard three or so years ago and yet I don't see non-round pens 
 anywhere.  One could argue the tool costs too much but I see it as pennies
for what it can do.
 Isn't that why we bought our machines?  Based on dreams and what we 
 can
do,
 but what we DO in the end is a different story :-)

 I once read in a pen makers forum that the twisted pens where not that 
 successful compared to standard pens.  I never got to see any example 
 of
the
 pens and that was just a coupe sellers opinions.  I wondered how they
where
 presented. Here's a little story from my life of selling treenware.

 I made 50 units of a product that generally sells for $25 - $30 all 
 day
long
 using my legacy and not one of them where round.  I sold them for $35 
 or more on ebay and they where selling as I produced them.  Now 
 granted I
have
 a name in the trinket field which helped, but I sold them with the 
 idea
that
 it's not the shape that you see that any turner makes.  Mine are original,
 one of a kind, and limited availability.   So I don't know if it was my
 name, the pitch, or simply the fact they where different, but I do 
 know
they
 left my door with a %100 percent guarantee and none ever came back.

 Moral of the story, if you're in the craft field you do have educate 
 the customer and as I call it, Sell the Story.  It means more cash 
 per unit but often less sales because the price point is higher.  It 
 beats making widgets at a quarter a piece, but I'll admit to making 
 widgets to pay the bills as well.  Those too can be lucrative.

 I still wonder if a single or double start Barley pen has ever been 
 made
and
 how it feels.

 -Tim



 - Original Message -
 From: Cole Andrews coleandrew...@gmail.com
 To: Legacy group legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
 Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 12:24 PM
 Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens


  I tried the ropr twist pen and did not like it . Very uncomfortable 
  pen
 for me.
 
  On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 3:03 AM, Bill Bulkeley 
  bulke...@mmnet.com.au
 wrote:
   Yea me lol I hand ground the little1/2 rope bit when I chipped it 
   and
 did a
   single start barley
  
   I didn't like it much a single start with the rope bit looked 
   better
  
   I also did a pineapple pattern too it looked ok. I can't post pics
sorry
 it
   was pre fire
  
   But I wanted the 1/2  barley for small spirals not on pens and 
   for
 smaller
   multi start spirals
  
  
  
   From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
   [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim
 Krause
   Sent: Thursday, 10 April 2014 4:51 PM
   To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
   Subject: Barley twist on pens
  
  
  
   Hey Bill,
  
  
  
   A long time ago you said magnate did not make a small enough 
   barley
bit
 to
   do pens.  I see a 7557 bit  that has a 3/4 diameter and a cutting
depth
 of
   3/32.  That should work for a pen.  Has any one tried a single or 
   a
 double
   start barley twist on a pen

RE: Barley twist on pens

[Bill Bulkeley]

Roger you have 2 short cuts to the same video the legacy one

Bill

 

From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Roger P
Sent: Friday, 11 April 2014 9:13 AM
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

 

Hi Tim

Time for more education (private joke between Tim and me), what Barry Gross 
demonstrated was decoupage!  This video is a Penn State Industries one, it may 
be Barry doing the commentary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoQ-nuDipUo

 

Legacy pen demo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoQ-nuDipUo if your interested.

Regards
Euro Roger

 

From: Tim Krause mailto:artmarb...@comcast.net  

Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 12:05 AM

To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 

Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

 

Very inspiring post.  Reminds me of the work Barry Gross was working with 
(probably still is) that he would place stickers, decals gears etc on the 
central tube and use a clear two part polymer to clear cast the blocks.   This 
would be really something different.  

 

Regarding large diameter pens, some day you might appreciate them when you hand 
grip is no longer what it use to be :-)  Still a great post Curt. 

 

Thank You!

 

-Tim

 

- Original Message - 

From: CURTIS GEORGE mailto:curtgeo...@wowway.com  

To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 

Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 3:43 PM

Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

 

Hello everyone, 

On the Beall web site/ fourm. YoYospin (Jarry) comented a while back, the 
Biggest problem that most owners make, (when using his machine.) is that they 
cut to deep on there details, which makes the pens uncomfortable  to hold. 
Perhaps this rope cutting on the pens falls into this category ?

Now what I think would be neat, would be to cut the pen blanks (rope or 
reed...) and then find a way to build up the finish so that the cut doesn't 
feel funny.

I mean (Just an idea.) could you turn a pen and then set that turning back into 
a clear epoxy? so that the wood would be inside a clear and smooth finish?

I know for my self. I like a smooth and thin pen, as well as pencil, I do not 
like the feel of odd shape or edges, in which hurt my fingers after a long use. 
 

Now Im no expert on this, but even when I see a fine made pen, it will be love 
at first touch or it just will not happen at all for me. So far Ive not made 
any pens that feel like what I want. but...? But who know, perhaps some kind of 
ergo dynamic pen just might be out there for me? but it would be, just my luck 
that I find one that I like, and it would be one of the ugliest pens ever made. 
;-p

I wish you guys the best of luck on this topic. Hopefully you all can get some 
nice pens turned and then Post the pictures, here. I would love to see them.  
;-)

 

C.A.G.


  _  


Hi Cole and Bill,

I don't like the looks of the triple roped pen myself.  I think I like the
idea of a double roped so it forms a little bead wrapped around the pen. I
wonder why I don't see more polygon shaped pens with a dash of tear-drop
flutes or super tiny reeds.  Jerry Beal came out with the Pen Wizard three
or so years ago and yet I don't see non-round pens anywhere.  One could
argue the tool costs too much but I see it as pennies for what it can do.
Isn't that why we bought our machines?  Based on dreams and what we can do,
but what we DO in the end is a different story :-)

I once read in a pen makers forum that the twisted pens where not that
successful compared to standard pens.  I never got to see any example of the
pens and that was just a coupe sellers opinions.  I wondered how they where
presented. Here's a little story from my life of selling treenware.

I made 50 units of a product that generally sells for $25 - $30 all day long
using my legacy and not one of them where round.  I sold them for $35 or
more on ebay and they where selling as I produced them.  Now granted I have
a name in the trinket field which helped, but I sold them with the idea that
it's not the shape that you see that any turner makes.  Mine are original,
one of a kind, and limited availability.   So I don't know if it was my
name, the pitch, or simply the fact they where different, but I do know they
left my door with a %100 percent guarantee and none ever came back.

Moral of the story, if you're in the craft field you do have educate the
customer and as I call it, Sell the Story.  It means more cash per unit
but often less sales because the price point is higher.  It beats making
widgets at a quarter a piece, but I'll admit to making widgets to pay the
bills as well.  Those too can be lucrative.

I still wonder if a single or double start Barley pen has ever been made and
how it feels.

-Tim



- Original Message - 
From: Cole Andrews coleandrew...@gmail.com
To: Legacy group legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 12:24 PM
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

Re: Barley twist on pens

[Roger P]

Sorry folks but blame Microsoft for not copying it properly 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rv1WoQtwVVE

From: Bill Bulkeley 
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 12:34 AM
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
Subject: RE: Barley twist on pens

Roger you have 2 short cuts to the same video the legacy one

Bill

 

From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Roger P
Sent: Friday, 11 April 2014 9:13 AM
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

 

Hi Tim

Time for more education (private joke between Tim and me), what Barry Gross 
demonstrated was decoupage!  This video is a Penn State Industries one, it may 
be Barry doing the commentary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoQ-nuDipUo

 

Legacy pen demo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoQ-nuDipUo if your interested.

Regards
Euro Roger

 

From: Tim Krause 

Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 12:05 AM

To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 

Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

 

Very inspiring post.  Reminds me of the work Barry Gross was working with 
(probably still is) that he would place stickers, decals gears etc on the 
central tube and use a clear two part polymer to clear cast the blocks.   This 
would be really something different.  

 

Regarding large diameter pens, some day you might appreciate them when you hand 
grip is no longer what it use to be :-)  Still a great post Curt. 

 

Thank You!

 

-Tim

 

  - Original Message - 

  From: CURTIS GEORGE 

  To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 

  Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 3:43 PM

  Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

   

  Hello everyone, 

  On the Beall web site/ fourm. YoYospin (Jarry) comented a while back, the 
Biggest problem that most owners make, (when using his machine.) is that they 
cut to deep on there details, which makes the pens uncomfortable  to hold. 
Perhaps this rope cutting on the pens falls into this category ?

  Now what I think would be neat, would be to cut the pen blanks (rope or 
reed...) and then find a way to build up the finish so that the cut doesn't 
feel funny.

  I mean (Just an idea.) could you turn a pen and then set that turning back 
into a clear epoxy? so that the wood would be inside a clear and smooth finish?

  I know for my self. I like a smooth and thin pen, as well as pencil, I do not 
like the feel of odd shape or edges, in which hurt my fingers after a long use. 
 

  Now Im no expert on this, but even when I see a fine made pen, it will be 
love at first touch or it just will not happen at all for me. So far Ive not 
made any pens that feel like what I want. but...? But who know, perhaps some 
kind of ergo dynamic pen just might be out there for me? but it would be, just 
my luck that I find one that I like, and it would be one of the ugliest pens 
ever made. ;-p

  I wish you guys the best of luck on this topic. Hopefully you all can get 
some nice pens turned and then Post the pictures, here. I would love to see 
them.  ;-)

   

  C.A.G.


--

  Hi Cole and Bill,

  I don't like the looks of the triple roped pen myself.  I think I like the
  idea of a double roped so it forms a little bead wrapped around the pen. I
  wonder why I don't see more polygon shaped pens with a dash of tear-drop
  flutes or super tiny reeds.  Jerry Beal came out with the Pen Wizard three
  or so years ago and yet I don't see non-round pens anywhere.  One could
  argue the tool costs too much but I see it as pennies for what it can do.
  Isn't that why we bought our machines?  Based on dreams and what we can do,
  but what we DO in the end is a different story :-)

  I once read in a pen makers forum that the twisted pens where not that
  successful compared to standard pens.  I never got to see any example of the
  pens and that was just a coupe sellers opinions.  I wondered how they where
  presented. Here's a little story from my life of selling treenware.

  I made 50 units of a product that generally sells for $25 - $30 all day long
  using my legacy and not one of them where round.  I sold them for $35 or
  more on ebay and they where selling as I produced them.  Now granted I have
  a name in the trinket field which helped, but I sold them with the idea that
  it's not the shape that you see that any turner makes.  Mine are original,
  one of a kind, and limited availability.   So I don't know if it was my
  name, the pitch, or simply the fact they where different, but I do know they
  left my door with a %100 percent guarantee and none ever came back.

  Moral of the story, if you're in the craft field you do have educate the
  customer and as I call it, Sell the Story.  It means more cash per unit
  but often less sales because the price point is higher.  It beats making
  widgets at a quarter a piece, but I'll admit to making widgets to pay the
  bills as well

Re: Barley twist on pens

[CURTIS GEORGE]

Thanks Roger. I like that one. 
C.A.G. 

- Original Message -



Sorry folks but blame Microsoft for not copying it properly 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rv1WoQtwVVE 




From: Bill Bulkeley 
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 12:34 AM 
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
Subject: RE: Barley twist on pens 




Roger you have 2 short cuts to the same video the legacy one 

Bill 





From: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Roger P 
Sent: Friday, 11 April 2014 9:13 AM 
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens 






Hi Tim 


Time for more education (private joke between Tim and me), what Barry Gross 
demonstrated was decoupage! This video is a Penn State Industries one, it may 
be Barry doing the commentary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoQ-nuDipUo 







Legacy pen demo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoQ-nuDipUo if your interested. 


Regards 
Euro Roger 






From: Tim Krause 


Sent: Friday, April 11, 2014 12:05 AM 


To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 


Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens 






Very inspiring post. Reminds me of the work Barry Gross was working with 
(probably still is) that he would place stickers, decals gears etc on the 
central tube and use a clear two part polymer to clear cast the blocks. This 
would be really something different. 





Regarding large diameter pens, some day you might appreciate them when you hand 
grip is no longer what it use to be :-) Still a great post Curt. 





Thank You! 





-Tim 







- Original Message - 


From: CURTIS GEORGE 


To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com 


Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 3:43 PM 


Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens 





Hello everyone, 


On the Beall web site/ fourm. YoYospin (Jarry) comented a while back, the 
Biggest problem that most owners make, (when using his machine.) is that they 
cut to deep on there details, which makes the pens uncomfortable to hold. 
Perhaps this rope cutting on the pens falls into this category ? 


Now what I think would be neat, would be to cut the pen blanks (rope or 
reed...) and then find a way to build up the finish so that the cut doesn't 
feel funny. 


I mean (Just an idea.) could you turn a pen and then set that turning back into 
a clear epoxy? so that the wood would be inside a clear and smooth finish? 


I know for my self. I like a smooth and thin pen, as well as pencil, I do not 
like the feel of odd shape or edges, in which hurt my fingers after a long use. 


Now Im no expert on this, but even when I see a fine made pen, it will be love 
at first touch or it just will not happen at all for me. So far Ive not made 
any pens that feel like what I want. but...? But who know, perhaps some kind of 
ergo dynamic pen just might be out there for me? but it would be, just my luck 
that I find one that I like, and it would be one of the ugliest pens ever made. 
;-p 


I wish you guys the best of luck on this topic. Hopefully you all can get some 
nice pens turned and then Post the pictures, here. I would love to see them. 
;-) 





C.A.G. 
- Original Message -


Hi Cole and Bill, 

I don't like the looks of the triple roped pen myself. I think I like the 
idea of a double roped so it forms a little bead wrapped around the pen. I 
wonder why I don't see more polygon shaped pens with a dash of tear-drop 
flutes or super tiny reeds. Jerry Beal came out with the Pen Wizard three 
or so years ago and yet I don't see non-round pens anywhere. One could 
argue the tool costs too much but I see it as pennies for what it can do. 
Isn't that why we bought our machines? Based on dreams and what we can do, 
but what we DO in the end is a different story :-) 

I once read in a pen makers forum that the twisted pens where not that 
successful compared to standard pens. I never got to see any example of the 
pens and that was just a coupe sellers opinions. I wondered how they where 
presented. Here's a little story from my life of selling treenware. 

I made 50 units of a product that generally sells for $25 - $30 all day long 
using my legacy and not one of them where round. I sold them for $35 or 
more on ebay and they where selling as I produced them. Now granted I have 
a name in the trinket field which helped, but I sold them with the idea that 
it's not the shape that you see that any turner makes. Mine are original, 
one of a kind, and limited availability. So I don't know if it was my 
name, the pitch, or simply the fact they where different, but I do know they 
left my door with a %100 percent guarantee and none ever came back. 

Moral of the story, if you're in the craft field you do have educate the 
customer and as I call it, Sell the Story. It means more cash per unit 
but often less sales because the price point is higher. It beats making 
widgets at a quarter a piece, but I'll admit to making widgets to pay the 
bills

Re: Barley twist on pens

[mwfoscue]

Barry,Wow!! That is a very nice looking pen. Appears to be of a spalted wood - maple?The way you have it "displayed" is terrific. The two together compliment each other - the "rack" looks great w/the pen and the pen looks great on the rack. Please share with us the woods you used and how you finished them off (BLO, tung, etc.?)With a holder like that, it doesn't matter if you like the "feel" of the pen - it is a piece of "art" in its own right - does not need to be used as a pen.Thanks for sharing - looking forward to hearing more about your "art piece".Mac -Original Message-
From: Barry Clarke <cla...@silomail.com>
Sent: Apr 10, 2014 7:14 PM
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Barley twist on pens

I’ve made a few rope twist pens ,there fun to make and find them very comfortable to use . This pic is one l made for a friend who along with large hands wanted thicker pen.  On Apr 10, 2014, at 7:05 PM, Tim Krause artmarb...@comcast.net wrote:Very inspiring post. Reminds me of the work Barry Gross was working with (probably still is) that he would place stickers, decals gears etc on the central tube and use a clear two part polymer to clear cast the blocks. This would be really something different.Regarding large diameter pens, some day you might appreciate them when you hand grip is no longer what it use to be :-) Still a great post Curt.Thank You!-Tim- Original Message -From:CURTIS GEORGETo:legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.comSent:Thursday, April 10, 2014 3:43 PMSubject:Re: Barley twist on pensHello everyone,On the Beall web site/ fourm. YoYospin (Jarry) comented a while back, the Biggest problem that most owners make, (when using his machine.) is that they cut to deep on there details, which makes the pens uncomfortable to hold. Perhaps this rope cutting on the pens falls into this category?Now what I think would be neat, would be to cut the pen blanks (rope or reed...) and then find a way to build up the finish so that the cut doesn't feel funny.I mean (Just an idea.) could you turn a pen and then set that turning back into a clear epoxy? so that the wood would be inside a clear and smooth finish?I know for my self. I like a smooth and thin pen, as well as pencil, I do not like the feel of odd shape or edges, in which hurt my fingers after a long use. Now Im no expert on this, but even when I see a fine made pen, it will be love at first touch or it just will not happen at all for me. So far Ive not made any pens that feel like what I want. but...? But who know, perhaps some kind of ergo dynamic pen just might be out there for me? but it would be, just my luck that I find one that I like, and it would be one of the ugliest pens ever made. ;-pI wish you guys the best of luck on this topic. Hopefully you all can get some nice pens turned and then Post the pictures, here. I would love to see them. ;-)C.A.G.Hi Cole and Bill,I don't like the looks of the triple roped pen myself. I think I like theidea of a double roped so it forms a little bead wrapped around the pen. Iwonder why I don't see more polygon shaped pens with a dash of tear-dropflutes or super tiny reeds. Jerry Beal came out with the Pen Wizard threeor so years ago and yet I don't see non-round pens anywhere. One couldargue the tool costs too much but I see it as pennies for what it can do.Isn't that why we bought our machines? Based on dreams and what we can do,but what we DO in the end is a different story :-)I once read in a pen makers forum that the twisted pens where not thatsuccessful compared to standard pens. I never got to see any example of thepens and that was just a coupe sellers opinions. I wondered how they wherepresented. Here's a little story from my life of selling treenware.I made 50 units of a product that generally sells for $25 - $30 all day longusing my legacy and not one of them where round. I sold them for $35 ormore on ebay and they where selling as I produced them. Now granted I havea name in the trinket field which helped, but I sold them with the idea thatit's not the shape that you see that any turner makes. Mine are original,one of a kind, and limited availability.  So I don't know if it was myname, the pitch, or simply the fact they where different, but I do know theyleft my door with a %100 percent guarantee and none ever came back.Moral of the story, if you're in the craft field you do have educate thecustomer and as I call it, "Sell the Story". It means more cash per unitbut often less sales because the price point is higher. It beats makingwidgets at a quarter a piece, but I'll admit to making widgets to pay thebills as well. Those too can be lucrative.I still wonder if a single or double start Barley pen has ever been made andhow it feels.-Tim- Original Message -From: "Cole Andrews" coleandrew...@gmail.comTo: "Legacy group" legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.comSent: Thursda

Re: Barley Twist Origin

[Ron Taylor]

Hi Tim,
I can confirm that barley sugar was a popular candy when I was a child in
the UK, and as far as I know it still is. It also sounds plausible that the
barley twist was derived from this candy, it has brought back a few
memories of my childhood. I loved that stuff!!
Ron T.

On Sun, Jun 3, 2012 at 4:03 PM, Tim Krause artmarb...@comcast.net wrote:

 **
 Hi All,

 I often sell the story rather than the actual product so when it comes to
 items with Barley Twists here an interesting story.  The name Barley
 Twist was derived from Barley sugar candy that was twisted up.  Barley
 sugar is a traditional British hard candy.  I don't know if this is true,
 but I saw it on Roy Underhill's Woodwright shop (TV Show) and it sounds
 plausible.  Now go out into your shop and make some sweet twisted barley
 items and tell your friends and clients the story :-).

 -Tim


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RE: Barley Twist Origin

[Roger H Phebey]

Hi All,

The following link will provide additional information or the origins of the
barley sugar twist
http://blog.christiandaviesantiques.co.uk/the-origins-of-the-barley-sugar-tw
ist-582.html 

 

Ron by the way cannot be that old if he remembers barley sugar in the UK!
When I was a child in the 1940s in the very south of England we did not have
such luxuries although I do remember them in the 1950s when my family
returned from a naval posting in Malta.

 

I will also try and check with Stuart Turner, well known turner and master
of the hollow twist what he knows about the early days of spirals etc. He
also has a Model 1200.

Regards

Roger 

 

From: legacy-ornamental-mills+bnccktrtvexcxd5na_-bboeevf...@googlegroups.com
[mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills+bncCKTRtvexCxD5na_-BBoEEvfXEg@googlegroups.c
om] On Behalf Of Tim Krause
Sent: 03 June 2012 22:03
To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
Subject: Barley Twist Origin

 

Hi All,

 

I often sell the story rather than the actual product so when it comes to
items with Barley Twists here an interesting story.  The name Barley
Twist was derived from Barley sugar candy that was twisted up.  Barley
sugar is a traditional British hard candy.  I don't know if this is true,
but I saw it on Roy Underhill's Woodwright shop (TV Show) and it sounds
plausible.  Now go out into your shop and make some sweet twisted barley
items and tell your friends and clients the story :-).  

 

-Tim

 

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RE: Barley Twist Origin

[Roger H Phebey]

Hi guys

Too much partying celebrating Queen Elizabeth II Diamond Jubilee, by the way
look what you missed by going independent and settling on having elected
politians as leaders.

Sorry I digress, I meant to say Stuart Mortimer not Stuart Turner, the
latter are famous for small model steam engines, beautiful works of art.

 

Regards
Roger

 

From: legacy-ornamental-mills+bncclgcmeppahdm4k_-bboedb-...@googlegroups.com
[mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills+bncCLGCmePPAhDm4K_-BBoEDb-e8w@googlegroups.c
om] On Behalf Of Roger H Phebey
Sent: 04 June 2012 00:17
To: legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Barley Twist Origin

 

Hi All,

The following link will provide additional information or the origins of the
barley sugar twist
http://blog.christiandaviesantiques.co.uk/the-origins-of-the-barley-sugar-tw
ist-582.html 

 

Ron by the way cannot be that old if he remembers barley sugar in the UK!
When I was a child in the 1940s in the very south of England we did not have
such luxuries although I do remember them in the 1950s when my family
returned from a naval posting in Malta.

 

I will also try and check with Stuart Turner, well known turner and master
of the hollow twist what he knows about the early days of spirals etc. He
also has a Model 1200.

Regards

Roger 

 

From: legacy-ornamental-mills+bnccktrtvexcxd5na_-bboeevf...@googlegroups.com
[mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills+bncCKTRtvexCxD5na_-BBoEEvfXEg@googlegroups.c
om] On Behalf Of Tim Krause
Sent: 03 June 2012 22:03
To: Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
Subject: Barley Twist Origin

 

Hi All,

 

I often sell the story rather than the actual product so when it comes to
items with Barley Twists here an interesting story.  The name Barley
Twist was derived from Barley sugar candy that was twisted up.  Barley
sugar is a traditional British hard candy.  I don't know if this is true,
but I saw it on Roy Underhill's Woodwright shop (TV Show) and it sounds
plausible.  Now go out into your shop and make some sweet twisted barley
items and tell your friends and clients the story :-).  

 

-Tim

 

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Re: Barley Twist Origin

[Louis Brown]

Perhaps we should distinguish between the origins of the turning and the
origins of its English language name.  If so, then perhaps both are right.

Begat

On Sun, Jun 3, 2012 at 7:21 PM, Roger H Phebey 
r...@woodworkersworkshop.co.uk wrote:

 Hi guys

 Too much partying celebrating Queen Elizabeth II Diamond Jubilee, by the
 way look what you missed by going independent and settling on having
 elected politians as leaders.

 Sorry I digress, I meant to say Stuart Mortimer not Stuart Turner, the
 latter are famous for small model steam engines, beautiful works of art.**
 **

 ** **

 Regards
 Roger

 ** **

 *From:*
 legacy-ornamental-mills+bncclgcmeppahdm4k_-bboedb-...@googlegroups.com[mailto:
 legacy-ornamental-mills+bncclgcmeppahdm4k_-bboedb-...@googlegroups.com] *On
 Behalf Of *Roger H Phebey
 *Sent:* 04 June 2012 00:17
 *To:* legacy-ornamental-mills@googlegroups.com
 *Subject:* RE: Barley Twist Origin

 ** **

 Hi All,

 The following link will provide additional information or the origins of
 the barley sugar twist
 http://blog.christiandaviesantiques.co.uk/the-origins-of-the-barley-sugar-twist-582.html
 

 ** **

 Ron by the way cannot be that old if he remembers barley sugar in the UK!
  When I was a child in the 1940s in the very south of England we did not
 have such luxuries although I do remember them in the 1950s when my family
 returned from a naval posting in Malta.

 ** **

 I will also try and check with Stuart Turner, well known turner and master
 of the hollow twist what he knows about the early days of spirals etc. He
 also has a Model 1200.

 Regards

 Roger 

 ** **

 *From:*
 legacy-ornamental-mills+bnccktrtvexcxd5na_-bboeevf...@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:legacy-ornamental-mills+bnccktrtvexcxd5na_-bboeevf...@googlegroups.com]
 *On Behalf Of *Tim Krause
 *Sent:* 03 June 2012 22:03
 *To:* Legacy-Ornamental-Mills@googlegroups.com
 *Subject:* Barley Twist Origin

 ** **

 Hi All,

  

 I often sell the story rather than the actual product so when it comes to
 items with Barley Twists here an interesting story.  The name Barley
 Twist was derived from Barley sugar candy that was twisted up.  Barley
 sugar is a traditional British hard candy.  I don't know if this is true,
 but I saw it on Roy Underhill's Woodwright shop (TV Show) and it sounds
 plausible.  Now go out into your shop and make some sweet twisted barley
 items and tell your friends and clients the story :-).  

  

 -Tim

  

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Re: Barley twist

[LiLtwisted]

The one on the site you linked to is a one start being held and a two 
start in the machine.  It looks like a 1.5 bit he used.   Have a look  
again and let me know what you would like the look to be.  Either bit 
will work just fine.

Mike
OK

mike wrote:

Hi,
I need to make a 3 dia. barley twist post, is there a formula to
figure out the #of starts, pitch and bit diameter?
I have the 2 and 1 1/2 bit and wasn't sure if these would work or if
I should get a 3 bit.
I would like to do a 2 start like they have on the legacy website the
top picture that somebody is holding. 
http://legacywoodworking.com/technique.cfm?techniqueID=2
I think that is 2
 thanks for your advise,

Mike




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